Philipp K - Transformation

In this episode, I’m joined by Phil.

Phil is a businessman, spiritual teacher, author, and podcaster. What interested me about this conversation was how difficult it became to separate where business ended and spirituality began. We live in a culture that often treats those things as opposites. One focused on money, success, ambition and growth. The other focused on meaning, presence and consciousness. Phil has spent decades moving between both worlds and what emerged was a conversation about human nature more than anything else.

We spoke about success, leadership, meditation, community, relationships and the strange tendency human beings have to hand responsibility for their lives to somebody else. A therapist. A spiritual teacher. A politician. A religion. A podcast host. Somebody who can tell us what to think, what to do and how to live. Underneath all of that seemed to sit the same question. Why is uncertainty so uncomfortable for us that we would rather surrender our own authority than face it?

One of the most interesting parts of the conversation was around certainty. Phil shared stories from years of working with successful business owners and entrepreneurs and how easy it can be for somebody to become highly competent in one area of life and slowly begin believing they are competent in every area of life. Not just business but relationships, health, spirituality and human behaviour itself. It made me think about how often growth stops the moment we become convinced we have arrived.

The conversation also moved into spirituality and the people who occupy those spaces. What happens when somebody starts with genuine wisdom and genuine intentions but slowly becomes trapped by power, status or admiration? How does somebody go from helping people to believing they are above them? How does curiosity become certainty? How does a teacher stop being a student?

What I enjoyed most about Phil was his willingness to stay inside the questions rather than rush toward answers. He spoke from observation rather than authority and from experience rather than performance. By the end of the conversation it felt less like we had been discussing business or spirituality and more like we had been exploring the same thing from different angles. The human tendency to search outside ourselves for something that ultimately has to be found within ourselves.

The statement Phil leaves for the next guest is this:
A little bit of light can erase a lot of darkness.

It’s You. Oh Fuck. It’s ME. In Session with a Psychotherapist
Hosted by Chad Taylor. Author of It’s You. Oh Fuck. It’s ME

No tips.
No fixing.
Just real conversations.

Phillip can be found at: https://holisticcircle.org/

GROUPS/COURSES: PATREON

WEBSITE

INSTAGRAM 

BOOK SALES: SHOPIFY

Transcript

SPEAKER_01 0:00

I'm Chad Taylor, psychotherapist, author of It's You, Oh Fuck, It's Me. No tips, no fixing, just real conversations. So today I've got Phil here. So Phil, who the fuck are you?

SPEAKER_00 0:15

Uh well, I'm an old dude, that's for sure. But uh I heard it's an audio podcast, so that's good. People don't have to see, they just have to listen. And that's a plus.

SPEAKER_01 0:29

So tell us a bit about yeah, what brought you on here to the podcast, what marked you up, what do you love? What don't you love? Give us a bit of art.

SPEAKER_00 0:40

Uh I didn't know that you had like a five-hour recording going on here, but uh, thanks for asking me. Well, first of all, because we met when you came to my podcast, and I was so thankful they invited me back. So that's cool because I I do spiritual podcasting and uh and it was a great episode, so thanks so much. And uh, you know, what lights me up are right now, you know, we all have phases in our life, and I very much believe one should try to live each and every face to the fullest of the possibility. And right now I would call my face being a husband and a father, and I'm trying to do this as good as I can. I had other moments in my life, but that's now my main priority.

SPEAKER_01 1:20

Okay. And what do you do? Just kind of give you a bit of place to plug your podcast or who do you work with? What do you do? What's your movement?

SPEAKER_00 1:30

Yeah, I stole this line, so it's not mine, but it's easier to say the things I don't do than to list the things I do. And actually, it's true, you know, I'm uh I like a schizophrenic person. Well, I shouldn't say that to you, but uh usually I can pull off the line. But I I'm a businessman for more than um for more than 30 years now. I am uh also a spiritual teacher for almost the same time. I had my first um studio when I had like 18 and a half, where I was starting to teach meditation. So another 35 years I do that as well. I produce a lot of stuff, I run companies. Uh it's not unusual for me to start two, three new businesses a year, and I write books about spirituality, that's why I'm here today. And this is just scratching the surface.

SPEAKER_01 2:20

Okay. So there's a lot of things, a businessman and a spiritual teacher. Most people probably wonder how that even goes together.

SPEAKER_00 2:30

Uh, you know, I'm also a vinegar producer. I'm also, I'm also, I'm also I've been many things and I opened many different businesses. I think my speciality is startup stuff. I come up with brand new ideas, I lift them up and then I sell them off. So it's very creative. So I don't think it's so far away from spirituality in a way. But um I I also study traditional medicine. I have a degree in that, or I got a couple of other degrees and stuff. So, you know, I did a lot of different things. I usually do different things at the same time, and that's how I feel the most relaxed. If I just do one thing at a time, I go a bit crazy. But if I do three things at any given day, I'm quite calm.

SPEAKER_01 3:15

I think most people listening to these podcasts will probably think the same thing. And in in today's world, we like to label it right, that somebody's got ADHD, but I also think it's pretty normal for a lot of us to be doing multiple things. It's a bit like when I read a book. I don't just generally read a book start to finish, I read a book or a chapter, and then I'll go on to something else of the same theme. And I so I could have three audio books going and four normal books going at any given time. And I think for me, that cluster learning or that, you know, the the um professional name for it is cluster learning, but the way I learn is a lot easier when there is multiple things going on.

SPEAKER_00 3:59

To tell you the truth, I mean I'm 53 years old, and when I started my my career, I opened my first company with the money that I earned with 18 years, and that's already like I made enough money to build my first company. People, it was very unusual to do two or three things at the same time. But now you're absolutely right. I'm just a regular Joe right now. Um, back when I was quite an attraction, but today it's just like people are because people have a job, and maybe they're you know, I have so many employees, for example, they have a regular job with me, and then they teach uh capoeira twice a week or something like that, or work as a skiing instructor on the weekend, or play in a band, and then they have a block, and then they have this. It's just really interesting, and uh, I think it's super cool, and I always try to support it if I can. Uh, I like it when people do uh different things and have different talents and can live them.

SPEAKER_01 4:55

Well, it's expanding our consciousness, right? That's what I'm getting when you're saying that. It's expanding our consciousness if we're doing multiple things. If I used to be a plumber and I was pretty good at it, and I had a good business, but I was also always doing something else. I was always building a house or renovating or doing something, working on a car or racing a car. Like I couldn't just do one thing, and I like that about myself, and my partner probably hates it.

SPEAKER_00 5:23

Uh yeah, well, I'm lucky there at this moment, but um, yeah, you know, it I have no other choice, but I'm a little bit envy people who just you know have a much more steady setting, and I I you know it's it's just my way and I can't do it any different, so no reason to think about it. But yeah, I'm a little bit jealous to people who go steady and just do one thing and so on and so forth. But it's just you know, we always think that the other guy's grass is greener, and uh that's all there is, and uh I'm happy with the way I live my life and I can't do it differently. But I in some sh in some you know dark moment I can dream of somebody else's life, can't I?

SPEAKER_01 6:02

So if people want to look you up, where can they find you? Where's the best place to find you?

SPEAKER_00 6:07

Absolutely best place to find me. I don't know if you're sharing any links, but it's um my website is connected to the podcast and some services I give, and the book is there, and it's holisticcircle.org. Uh, I don't know if you share links, but that's a good place to start. And I do some spiritual consulting as well if people need it. Um that's that's something I've always been doing, and um I will keep doing it. I don't push it, it's not like a major business thing at all. But uh if people think that they need some help um to find their path in spirituality, and I've been, as I said, more than 30 years around. So I'm I like to help calling it spiritual chaperone. So this is just giving a little bit of a nudge here there, or just listen to people what they're actually looking for in spirituality, and then maybe I can have an idea or so where they can maybe find what they're looking for.

SPEAKER_01 6:58

Yeah, of course I share links. So the links will be in the show notes for anybody out there. So, what I do on these podcasts, the last guest generally leaves something for the next guest to question statement. I think I warned you about that. So the last guest was actually me. Every fourth episode, I do one on my own. And the question I left, and it flows really well into what we're talking about here, is why do we prefer the certainty of misery to the misery of uncertainty? That's a Bruce Perry point.

SPEAKER_00 7:33

Well, I guess as you know, I mean you're an expert here in this field. There's always so and so many people who just will go across the mountain and see what's else there, why other people need that that the community need the safety. Uh, and I think it's embedded in us. We're animals by the end of the day, but we are social animals. But on the other hand, we're also hunters and gatherers. So I think we have this multi-multi-layer, at least it's the spiritual explanation to that, that um, that we are half animal and half divine. And with some people, one or the other is maybe more predominant. And I guess if the animal side is more predominant, then you want to stay in your share, you want to stay with the people, and even if it means suffering, and most likely every community has elements of suffering because you have to cut down your individuality. And I actually do think a lot about that question: how much you're willing to give to be part of a community that protects you, that gives you food security, or whatever emotional security or whatever it is, and you know your children are safe growing up in that community, but you have maybe some king there or some boss there or whatnot. And even if you're the king, then you have the responsibility of make sure that everybody is safe. So everybody has to a little bit suffer in such a community, but they get a lot back. On the other hand, if you're the guy who just says, No, I'm gonna go over the mountain all by myself, take all the dangers, take the adventure, then um I think is that some kind of answer.

SPEAKER_01 9:07

Yeah, and even I guess even on a personal note, why do we stay in shitty relationships or in shitty jobs? Or, and I know that isn't your story or my story, but the majority of people seem to stay. It's almost like, and I've shared this a lot on this podcast, and I share it a lot with my clients. If we eavesdrop on the majority of conversations going on in the world out there, cafe, shopping centre, it doesn't really matter where it is. Most people are telling a story where they're the victim, and somebody else is the villain, it's either their job, their partner, their mother, their sister. Why do we what what what do you think the drive is to to live in these conversations? There's a big one at the moment with obviously worldwide, right? With oil and Trump and Iran, and I don't get too philosophical on this podcast, but like it's I heard someone say yesterday, because I'm coming over your way, my partner's family live in Switzerland and Spain. And in September again, we come over once a year or once every two years or one and a half years, and someone said, Oh, are you worried you won't make it? Or I heard they're gonna stop flying planes in the end of July, there'll be no jet fuel. And it's this I just I don't watch the TV, I don't watch that shit, but I think the majority of people around me that I see, we love that stuff and we love the misery that it gives us. What do you think that's about? What do you reckon's going on for people there?

SPEAKER_00 10:36

There are a couple of inappropriate things I would have to say on that. And uh, you know, uh the fun thing is let's talk about business because I know a little bit about something about that. And there are like tons and tons of books that are actually full libraries written about or to be a great manager, a great leader and team leader. And uh, there's a couple of ideas in schools, but ultimately, you know, there's an idea what makes a good leader a good business leader. And fun fact is, I'm old enough for each and every do not case, I can name a business leader that I know very well or did consulting for, or I really know the person that is doing everything wrong and is super successful. And especially when in terms of personal leadership, I know very abusive, horrible bosses. I wouldn't work for that guy, not even 20 seconds. And he got good teams and loyal teams, and and it always blows my mind as like, how can you work for this person? It's abusive, it's telling you horrible things, it's shouting at you. Why on earth would you stay with this person? I don't I don't get it. And the people love to work for this, this, this, this uh individual. And I'm like, I don't get it. But then sometimes it came to my mind because the fun fact is, I also know do a lot that don't work out in the other way around. Like I know a really nice boss, and he's a great guy, and he makes a barbecue with his worker, and he cares for his worker, and he's actually such a great boss. I mean, seriously, and people keep quitting on him. And I'm like, how on earth is that possible? But here use this guy who is like a horrible monster, and people love working for him, and here's this nice guy, and people just keep quitting. And in some moment in my life, in my darkest hour, I thought, you know, just people like to hate their boss because they can go home and say, oh, he's such an ass or whatever. And then, you know, people like to hate their boss. I mean, it's just one of my theories. It's of course nonsense in a way, and in a way, maybe not. So it's really interesting that um we have this element of suffering, we have this element in us, and uh it seems to bring happiness to a lot of people to suffer a little bit, even if I don't truly understand it. So I can't help you there, but you're the expert for the brain. I'm just observing realities.

SPEAKER_01 13:09

I'm the expert in my own life, that's about it. And openly say that to people, I am not the expert in their lives, and that's why I studied psychotherapy over psychology. We didn't do much about the brain at all in psychotherapy, we did more about the holistic nature of energy systems and a lot of Rudolf Steiner and a lot of Eckhart Kohl and a lot of uh Arnold Mindel process work. There wasn't much in the brain in what I did, and it really was that the process work model or process-oriented psychology I studied under is really about allowing the person opposite me. I don't even like to use the word client, right? Because it that there gives a level of uh the dominance of mind, which truth be known, I'm a client. I I see someone once a week myself, and then I'm part of a group on a Wednesday night for an hour and a half that somebody else facilitates. So I I'm not the expert I'm in is my life, and I think that's what I've written through the book, right? I don't give five tips to tell somebody how to change their lives. I don't say sign up to my 10-week course, it's ten thousand dollars, and by the end of it, you're gonna go off into the sunset and you're not gonna have any problems because this is a lifelong journey. There's been times in my life where I think I've I have enjoyed suffering because it's exactly like that quote. It's felt more normal for me to suffer than it has not to suffer. What you said then before about the bosses, it does lie into a bit, I think, of that attachment style and that attachment theory, and I'm sure you know a little bit about that with spirituality, but why does the let's just use the stereotypical guy, why does the guy who cheats on his partners and he's arrogant, he never makes time for them, and he why do women flock to that man? Yet the nice guy, we'll call it the stereotypical, why do nice guys come last? Why does the nice guy because I also think there's a level in this of how we how we see ourselves in the world? If I'm the nice guy and I'm doing everything to please my partner, for her, there's a level of that of I think an energetic level, not a not a conscious level, because there's a conscious level what we think would be a conscious level, I'm mindful of how I say that, we would think that the person would love somebody that was the nice guy, that made time for them, that did all these things, but there's a bit of a I suppose we'd call it an ick, an ick feeling that this guy's trying too hard. And then the person over here who in a way doesn't give a fuck. He's doing his life and and he's making his way through life. And whether this is relationship, business, as a parent, it doesn't really matter what it is. When you were talking about that story, for me it would be why is this boss trying so hard to be nice? Like what is it? What is it about him that's trying to be so and some people are just nice people, I get it. But the problem is sometimes the nicer we are, and Gabor Mate talks a lot about this. Sometimes the nicer we are, the less of ourselves we put in the room. In other words, we become a chameleon to what's going on around us, so we feel loved at a deeper level. I don't want you to leave my business, so I'll look after you and cook your barbecue and I'll do this and I'll do that, because I'm fearful that you leave. And then that energy we put in the world ends up becoming true.

SPEAKER_00 16:41

And also imagine a lot of people would imagine if a boss is very aggressive, is very pushy, they think he will ultimately be more successful. Also, it could be an element that these people appreciate this aggression because they would imagine that he will, you know, his business will grow and business be successful because we value roofness a lot. And these days, when we value billionaires and have posters of billionaires and all of that stuff, uh, we just we just put everything under a commercial element. And um, yeah, I guess the other thing about relationship, it's a world phenomenon. I mean, everybody of us who has friends who are, you know, the nice guys, they literally can last. But then on the other hand, it's also to the church for the right people because I've seen this very early on. You know, some people like to be the leader in a relationship and some people like to follow. And uh, and I've seen actually, I know one super dominant, super successful woman that is uh makes tons of money and you know he she really got the boots on. And in the end, she she married a mechanic who is just literally afraid to speak up. But it works for them in the dynamic, you know, she likes to be the boss and she likes to have someone around. So it everything is out there, but in spiritual terms, maybe that's something more interesting. Um, I I love I call it like feeding the dragon when people are into that negative spiral and then they're in the self-hurt moment. And this is definitely something that has a lot to do with spirituality because a lot of these people who find themselves in a position, they either go to someone like you or to therapy, or they end up in spirituality, or they end up in some church. I mean, that's like the regular thing, right? If you're out of balance in your life and you see that you're not doing good to yourself, either you go to therapy or you go to some, you know, Bali meditation, whatever, or you end up end up or you know, in some in some hopefully good spiritual community and hopefully not even more abusive spiritual community. But um, so that's definitely part of my business, having people in all those meditation workshops and things I'm running that are searching to find a way out of this um self-harm. I guess that's part of our business one way or the other, right?

SPEAKER_01 18:59

Definitely, and I'm surprised at how things flow when I wrote this. I become a therapist through my own shit, and then I wrote this book, and I didn't really know where this book was going. But since then the podcast has flowed on, and now I've just started a weekly or possibly multiple weekly for different people group, and I've almost calling it the the gym for the psyche. In other words, we spend so much money on gym memberships and all these things. I'm trying to put together a movement, an online community, an online group that isn't about lining my pockets, that is really about almost of trying to price it at the cost of a gym membership where we can come every week and we can have a Zoom with a a group of people and this community, because I think more than ever, we need to turn the fucking TV off for an hour and a half and come to a group, whether it's with your meditation class, whether it's let's let's all do something good for ourselves that fills our cup because I think we've lost a lot of that since we've stepped away from organized religion, and I understand why with how it dropped the ball, really, I suppose I'd call it, or it it sort of it went a certain way. But I think we do we have lost that connection to community, we have lost that place where we go, and we're purely dedicated like for me, it's when I go to therapy. There's an hour of my life I've dedicated that I turn up there and that shows the universe, and I'm not doing it because I'm trying to get brownie points for the next lifetime. That's not what it's about, it's not because I want to go to some eternal place in the next lifetime, it's not an insurance policy for me. It's when I dedicate an hour or an hour and a half, then when I go to my group on a Wednesday night, when I dedicate that, I think the universe sees that I am setting aside time that's purely about connecting with other people and connecting on a more spiritual nature to get closer to whatever that is out there. You said we're half animal and we're half divine. Well, I think in the world now we talk about and we act as if we're 99.9% animal, and most of us forget that we're divine. So I I think what's come out of this book and this podcast and this movement is now for me. I wondered where it was going because I'm definitely not an author. Well, I am, but I'm not, if that makes sense. There won't be, I don't think there'll be a second book. I put everything in that first book. I condensed it, I I put everything that I I think I wanted to give the world into that first book. So who knows, there might be another book one day, but it doesn't, it's not like I'm gonna write 22 books and try and be make money on Amazon KDP. That's not what this is about. So I think it's good to quickly hear you talk about that stuff.

SPEAKER_00 21:55

Right. And and also I've noticed it's the same thing all over again because if you're looking I make uh 120 videos a year with with spiritual leaders. So uh I don't know everything there is to know in the world, but you know I I know something, and it's really interesting who makes money and who don't make money in the world of spirituality. And you see exactly the same pattern I just described. You have some very strong, pushy, opinionated leaders that are running over people, I'd say to some extent or the others, and they're doing very well commercially. And you have some soft, lovely leaders who want to help people deal with their own mess, not giving them clear instructions, not you know, exploiting their money or whatever. They want to help them help themselves, and they're usually totally broke because it's uh it's for a lot of people not what they're looking for. So we are back to the same story that people really appreciate guidance, or I think people like if somebody else takes responsibility. That is something that I've learned over the years. People really like to blame someone if it goes wrong. The boss told me to do it like this, of course it broke, it's not my mistake. Or, you know, a religion told me to do like this, or or a president said to do it like this. I've really noticed that a lot of people like the comfort of having someone else to blame for the decision they made or the situation they're in, or whatever. Or, you know, this meditation teacher said, you know, chump like this. So, you know, he's guilty. That's a big factor. And I'm trying to think a lot how to overcome this, what can be done to create a community that uh actually does not need a strong leadership or doesn't need anybody to blame, where everybody takes part of that responsibility, but uh looking out there in the world, and actually there's some great books written about hippie communities and how they all fell apart, or most of them, or almost all of them fell apart. And I had a couple of guests on my show that actually been part of these communities in California and this and that, and they talked very openly how that usually all falls apart at one uh level or the other. And it's really, really interesting to see that are this situation we talked at the beginning from the village that most people choose to be in a village, even if it's not the most comfortable, and just very few people choose to go out there and face the dangers. So it is definitely an ongoing battle that I guess the spiritual world would wish that people would be more trying to look in the mirror, you know, do the work and take responsibility for their action, where the real world experiences that people very much like uh to have someone else to blame.

SPEAKER_01 24:55

And someone else to do the work for them too. Exactly what you just said. I went and seen a psychologist and it didn't work. I went to the council and it didn't work. And I understand there's good and bad in everything, but the mind makes it so. If we go in thinking we're gonna get something from the spiritual teacher, if I come to one of your courses or one of your meditations and I walk in there thinking, Why do I need to go to this guy? I know all this stuff. Why why am I doing this? What then straight away I'm gonna come out of there thinking you wish it. Even if everybody else in that room had an amazing experience, I will come away from it with criticizing and and and that was it happened to me a bit. And we're gonna this is virtually flowing into the topping of my book anyway. But I suppose where I'm going with that is it's that personal responsibility that most of us don't want to take. I watch a lot of stuff, I'm just watching the Wild Wild Country documentary again on Bagwan or Osho or whatever we want to call him, right? Which was a pretty big movement. Like when you look at some of the celebrities and stuff that went to him and just trying to see there what went wrong and where it went wrong. And my mentor says to me, Today's rooster is tomorrow's feather duster. And I think when we get to the top of the food chain where we think nobody can teach us and we become unteachable, I think that is the biggest fear that I ever have. And so I really try and humble myself, and that's why I pay to go to therapy once a week to see somebody. Because otherwise and what I first started to do, I noticed I'd go in there and and he and as I'm taking my issues to him or whatever you want to call it, as he's responding, I'm thinking, Oh, if I if I was the therapist and somebody brought that to me, I probably would have said this. So it was almost like for a period of time and only about a week or two, I was going in there and my egocentricity wanted me to be the smartest person in the room. Where now when I walk in there, I almost do a bit of a meditation on the way in where it's like, you know nothing, which I do, really. How much do I know? Fuck all. And I have to go in here for an hour and be teachable. And I think that's one of the biggest things we have in the world. I know, I know. Like I gave my book to a few close friends and family, and that was kind of for the people that aren't ready, which is most of us, it was oh yeah, I read it and it didn't really teach me anything I didn't know about myself. Okay, well when I read it, even though I wrote it, I think fuck, I need to practice this more. Wow, I'm not doing that very well. So there's I think not all of us are ready to change.

SPEAKER_00 27:40

There's an interesting thing. Um uh just a couple, just two or three days ago, I had a podcast and a very wise man who's 70 years old, so he's even longer. And he also started around 15, like me, with meditation. So he's got a couple of years' seniority on me. And he always talks about and when he has a new student teaching meditation, and the students come to him and say, You know, sorry, but I really don't learn anything, nothing is going on, you know, it's a complete waste of time. And he said, Why don't you go and ask your wife? And and then she says, like, it's changed so much, he's a different man. And this is definitely part of the the story in a way, because this is always my my major podcast question. I think I'm asking almost every podcast if this what you do, you would implement in the world, how the world would change, or have you become a better husband with what you do, have you become a better father? How has it manifested in life? And that's exactly what you say, because I somehow noticed because I work a lot uh with very successful business people um who are like really crazy successful, and uh and you see this really happening that there is a moment into a success story where you have to choose to go hard left or you have to choose to go hard right, and one leads to humbleness and hopefully some kind of gratitude and happiness, and at the end of the rainbow, something I call content, or it's the yacht and it's the super yacht and it is the more, and the more and the the younger wife, and even younger wife, and more younger and crazy younger. And you you just it's so predictable, and it's funny because when I work with these super successful people, I'm kind of like inside me for fun, make a little bet. Can I guess if this person is gonna go left or right? And I usually get it wrong just to tell you it's just something going on with a person's brain. And sometimes I have the theory if they come from an old family, they're gonna go right because they have generations of knowledge, and it doesn't happen every time. I think you know they're really educated, they went for Oxford or this or that. So they must have their, you know, the structure to go to the right side and it doesn't happen. Then the guy comes from the middle of nowhere and he's a new rich with a gold chain, and then he's like, you know what, no, and he goes, goes on. So there is no rule for it, which I think very funny, but I've seen it over and over in my life that um that with very successful people, they either have the possibility to become humble and thankful, and as you said, I know nothing and keep being curious and and find this peace and happiness, and most likely hold the family together, most likely hold maybe the marriage together, and just be a guy that does maybe good or philanthropic or whatnot, or you just go in very odd places.

SPEAKER_01 30:48

Yeah, and I normally ask people what landed from my book, but we don't even really need to do that today because we've already straight into the conversation. And I've got a question as well. I'm watching this documentary again. Why why does why does a spiritual teacher, and this isn't you, I'm not asking this at you, but why do why would somebody like Bagwin, who seemed like he had such a gift and such an amazing man at some point, how do then do we go to need 97 Rolls Royces and have a five million dollar diamond watch? What do you think happens? And I suppose I'm asking this, not that I'm ever gonna be that sort of celebrity or anything, but I always wonder, like I I have a wait list now of three to six months, and so I have a lot of people waiting for me. Like where I'm going is how does somebody go from, say somebody like me who's really passionate about making a difference and and wanting to um wake people up, I guess, and wake myself up in the process, because it's about me as well. What do you think? How does it go from that altruistic movement to then needing 97 Rolls Royces and a $5 million diamond watch, like and then getting guns and all the craziness that went on there, or somebody like David Koresh, who a lot of these cult so-called cult leaders, right? If you look at their early life, they had a real fucking gift. They were really in tune, like you said then, like they were really in tune. They almost were gonna become Jesus if they turn right, or become this crazy cult leader and having sex with children if they turn left. Like, what do you think it is? What do you think it is that happens to people?

SPEAKER_00 32:25

I think I know this pretty well, to be quite honest, actually. Uh, first of all, I have from my own experience, as I said, I started my first meditation center with the money I earned with 18 and a half, and I had a lot of people coming, it was quite successful meditation center, and these people, of course, are much older. They were your age, and but I was 18 and a half, and you know, these people started me for asking me for life advice. I was just a meditation teacher, obviously good because I started so young. But um, these were grown-up people, and they started to ask me about marriage advice or God knows what, and it could have really screwed up in my mind. So I think I can really see myself in that moment if I would have bit into it, if I would have thought, like, oh, I'm so bloody smart. These people asking me, I'm so young, and they're so old. Uh, it definitely could have screwed me up and most probably had nice Royce Royce on the private plane right now. But uh obviously something saved me and uh let me realize, oh, that's totally wrong, and I have to change my approach and the way I present myself because you know who am I to give this kind of uh life advice when I just started my life on my own. So this is a choice, but let me go back to the business people because this is really funny and I like it a lot because I've seen it over and over again. I'm smiling when I'm telling it, but actually it's bloody tragic. So I've no, as I said, I do sometimes consulting from quite successful people, and uh it's real, real fun that I know a couple of people, like this one guy has an engineering company, super successful, and he's a nice guy, super educated guy, no question, in his field. Now, that's important. Super educated in his field. So, and he makes money and more money and crazy money and lunatic money, and all of a sudden he he feels like he knows everything there is to know. And you can ask him about health advice, and he will stop all conversation. He will stop a doctor giving talking about health advice, and like, no, no, you know, I'm I'm I'm this big businessman, I make millions of dollars. I know more than you because how much money you make? You know, you know, I know 10,000, what is that? I make a million. I know more than you because I make more money than you. And these people really lose it. And I've seen it not once, twice, I've seen it many, many times. That they sit in and they know about all about climate change and they know all about international polity because they know some important people. They just look or they hire themselves, let's say, a fitness instructor, and then they're making fun about their fitness advice because she makes a couple of thousand maybe a year, and I make the million. So, what these person is supposed to tell me. And they're just so screwed up in their brain, and um, and I'm I'm always kind of smile listening to these conversations, but uh, I'm a little bit impressed by myself being still able to smile, but but in a way, it's totally insane. So that's I I've seen it so many times, you know, that that I really can relate to the story that you about the Royce Royce and all of it. When people worship you, when you start to bite into, when you basically like a drug dealer, you should never use the drugs, you should just sell them. And if you like a spiritual leader and start to bite into this, that you're so gifted, and maybe you are, but if you start to bite into it, you're gone with the wind, and there's no turning back, that's for sure.

SPEAKER_01 36:05

It's an interesting philosophy, isn't it? And I'm mindful that I try to keep this podcast pretty, pretty. I could talk to you, like you opened up and said, How long have you got? I didn't know this podcast was five hours, and I feel like this now, and what's come out of this for me selfishly is with me trying to get these these groups off the ground, you'll have an email from me after this. So it's amazing sometimes when you come on here and it's more about me. We're pressing record for the rest of the world just to hear our conversation, right? And I think that is that is the that is how I love the connection of the universe. That it's like I sit there and I think if I woke up tomorrow and I won five million dollars, or if I become super wealthy, what would I do? And there is I I love drag racing, I love the thrill of going fast, so I definitely think I would, but then I'm lazy, right? I don't want to spend all the time in the garage. So I think I'd probably find a drag racing team where I could say, Hey guys, I'll give you $500,000 a year, but I want to be the driver, or I'll give you a million dollars a year and I want to be the driver, I'll just turn up with my helmet. I don't need to have the stuff, but the five million dollar watches and the Rolls Royces don't really interest me. It's more I definitely think I would spend money on excitement and a thrill. And I guess it's just interesting to see that the majority of people, like you just said then, it's all about what have I got? Like how do people perceive me with the five million dollar watch and the 97 Rolls Royces? And I'm sharing about that because I'm fascinated by these things. That how do we go from A to B and then end up becoming ruining so many lives in the way? What is that about? But I suppose what I want to leave is that I am I I want to be a bit of column A and a bit of column B. I I don't want people to disrespect me and think they can not pay and turn up to see me. Whereas people don't if people disrespect I think respect for others is the number one quality that I like to develop in myself and develop in others. In other words, if you if I say to you we're starting at eight o'clock, which is Australian time, I want to be ready at eight o'clock to press record. Or if I can't make it, as soon as I know I can't make it, I send you an email and I say, Hey Philip, sorry, I'm not gonna be able to make it. Sorry to inconvenience you, can we reschedule? So I think we've lost a lot of, and I notice this in the podcast world, where a lot of people just don't show up, right? So you've for me, a lot of the time with worldwide guests, it's odd hours, like it's 11:30 the other night. I was meant to have on at night, and just didn't turn up, no email, didn't respond to my messages. And then two days later it was like, I really sorry about the other night. Would you like to rebook? And no, like actually, sorry, didn't even say really sorry, just said there was a mix up the other night. Would you like to rebook?

SPEAKER_00 38:59

You you're lucky you got a message, my friend, at all. It's a new development, and it's very funny, just to quick to tell you last year I did a lot of podcasting and I charged some kind of money, 60 bucks or whatever, to people to show up. And it was great because the money went straight to a booking agency. I didn't see a penny, but you know, they did the emails back and forward, it takes a lot of time. They took the 60 bucks, end of story, and almost everybody showed up. Uh, this year I said, no, I don't need that agency. I do it for free the whole year, and I do those couple of emails myself. And this year, so many people don't show up. So obviously, because it's for free, people are like come, they don't come, whatever. That's the only explanation I can come up with. So I'm kind of starting to be angry saying, like, you know, at least I had a booking agency, didn't have to make the emails. People pay 60 bucks and they come. Or last just last month, I had seven no shows, and that's a lot of time, me getting prepared, setting up my stuff, being ready, and or not going to a friend's party because uh or friends' concert in that case, uh, because I had a at a recording, so I stayed home and be ready, and then people just don't come, no message, nothing, and you get real angry because you know I I podcast for fun, I podcast for pleasure. There's no money in it for me, and there never will be. But uh I like to have these conversations, and I think on the long run it's a good thing that I'm doing, but um yeah, so I don't know what I'll be doing next year, asking again 60 bucks to just people to show up or continue working for free and being angry, to just sit there and wait.

SPEAKER_01 40:44

Yeah, and I think for anyone out there maybe thinking, why the fuck am I bothering listening to this? If you can hear something like that about and thinking I'm not a podcaster, think about when you let someone down, when you plan coffee and you just don't show up, or if you plan coffee at 9 a.m. and then you message them at quarter past saying, Hey, sorry, I'm running late, I'll be there in 15 minutes. And they could have done something else with half an hour of their life. I think if we look at the actual event and then make it about us, which is what my book's about, then life changes. If we look at the event and think, oh fuck, I'm just gonna switch off or I'm gonna daydream through this because Phil and Chad are talking about podcasting and I don't do it, it's the principle. It's the principle of respect. And yeah, so for me, I'm the same. If somebody books a session with me and they don't show up, they get a reminder that I pay for, cost me $350 a year to put their phone number in, and then they get a reminder two days before that the old like the doctor's one that says you have an appointment with Chad Taylor on this time, write yes or no, or reply Y or N. It's one letter, right? We don't even have to write the word. And if they can't be bothered to do that, and then they just don't show, they get charged because it's respect, and I think that's what I want to leave. It comes back down to self-respect and respect for others. So, what are you gonna leave us with? One question, sentence, a statement. What are you gonna leave for the next guest? Not teaching, more just something I can hit them with at the start.

SPEAKER_00 42:14

Well, well, of course, sad that we had no time to talk a bit about a book, but anybody out there, just quick let me say that anybody who has children right now and cares about spirituality, I wrote this book uh about spiritual parenting. It's not a parent guide, it really is ideas. Uh, I like spirituality. I want I was thinking, what can I do to give my daughter a start into the spiritual world? Maybe yes, maybe no. And I wrote a book that pretty much looks at parents, looks at the situation, looks at phones and all of it. And if anybody out there thinks they need this information, uh please go to my website and have a look. It might be that so that's just a bit of a commercial for uh for has to happen, my friend. So now you want me to ask a question for your next guest to leave um to leave a question.

SPEAKER_01 43:00

A question, a statement, anything. It could be something out of your book. Could be just something short and concise.

SPEAKER_00 43:08

Absolutely. Well, out of my book, there's one sentence I repeat, I think, like six or seven times, but I don't think you can use it for your podcast. But um, it's uh it's just I I like to say this over and over again, especially to young parents, uh young parents that are a you know, the smallest amount of light can you know erase a lot of darkness. That's always uh I say over and over again to just make people realize that even if they do a little good, it just goes a long way. So that's just a and but that's not for your for your podcast.

SPEAKER_01 43:45

That's perfect. A little bit of light can erase a lot of darkness. All right, we're gonna leave it there.