Sitting With The Weight

Not every burden can be unloaded immediately.

Sometimes the work begins by simply sitting with it.

In this episode, Michael and Shannon talk about the uncomfortable space between awareness and release — the moments when we recognize the weight we’re carrying but haven’t yet figured out what to do with it.

They explore the discipline of patience, the importance of reflection, and why rushing to “fix” everything can sometimes make things worse.

Because growth doesn’t always happen through action.

Sometimes it begins in stillness.

Transcript

SPEAKER_00 0:01

I'd like to welcome all of our listeners back to Unloaded the Podcast. And I believe this is episode lucky number seven.

SPEAKER_01 0:09

Here it is.

SPEAKER_00 0:10

This is Michael Seahorn. Shannon Mora. And we are so grateful to have all of you here with us today. Had a good good episode last week, episode six. Make sure you go back and check that if you haven't done so already. This week we're going to talk about how we sit with the weight, what that might look like, feel like, all the good things that go involved in that.

SPEAKER_01 0:35

It's an interesting thing we're doing here because initially we started talking about how we often avoid even showing that we're carrying so much weight. We're just in silence, just trying to uh tough out the weight. And then more recently in our previous episode, more unloading the weight, you know, kind of the the opposite. And here now we're kind of, you know, a little both. You know, sitting with the weight, but maybe in a more healthy manner. It's uh you'll you'll see through this episode, it'll become more clear kind of what we're doing here.

SPEAKER_00 1:18

Yeah, I think I mentioned it in the episode six is when I was in Las Vegas. I was sitting with my own weight and I was unloading that alone by myself on how I how I do that. I have I have a shirt. I have an interesting t-shirt. I think you might have seen I think I've worn it here once. It says, I fix shit. That's what I do. You remember that shirt? Ironically, that's what we all do as humans at some level. We fix things, right? We'd like to fix things. I'm sure there are some people out there that are like, nope, Mike, I don't like to fix anything, and I respect that a lot. But in this world, in the in the world of sitting with weight, unloading weight, how to unload it, and all the things that go involved in that, there are some times you're not gonna fix everything.

SPEAKER_01 2:12

Sometimes um we we just allow for whoop, okay, that happened. Yep, nope, that is in a way irreparable. Okay, yep, and doesn't mean that it cannot um be transformed or moved through, or you know, even result in great good on in its new form. I mean, everything's energy and it continues to change form, and that which was maybe broken in one form then becomes another.

SPEAKER_00 2:46

I'll give you a great example. Last episode, episode six, uh we had a little break, something broke. Uh I'm gonna go out on this limb and uh be completely open and honest with our with our listeners. Is Shan and I came in as we normally did, sat down, and for those of you who don't know, I'm the IT guy. That's what I went to school for. Love IT kind of a you know thing that I do. So I'm in charge of the laptop and the rec all the equipment. That's that's my thing while we are recording. Well, no excuses, but I had an extremely long two weeks, had a very quick turnaround on a show, had a one day back in the office, four days down in Vegas, uh a lengthy family thing over the weekend, right into recording. Yeah. And I forgot to hit one stupid button. Out of many buttons you have to attend to every time, right? There was one damn button I didn't click and didn't dawn on me until the recording was over. I had to look at Shannon and tell him, Hey man, I effed up. Yeah, I effed up, dude. And what happened was we didn't get to hear Shannon because I forgot to put his input into the system. So all you heard was my pie hole, and we didn't get a chance to listen to Shannon.

SPEAKER_01 4:07

So you could actually barely hear me. Your mic was picking up me very softly, very softly, yeah. And so, I mean, it might be salvageable someday. But we because so we ended up redoing uh the episode, and uh yeah, and it's which the the previous one, if you just listened to it, and man, there it's so interesting to record an episode all of a sudden, uh damn it, we we have to redo that. And Mike was cool, he it was it was interesting just seeing how he was working through that. He's he he started like I am very frustrated right now. He he immediately just named the emotion he was experiencing, and he was just kind of breathing through it, and he's like, Okay, it is what it is. We're man, we're gonna have to redo episode six. And man, there was some because this is so organic, this is so we just do this very unscripted, it's quite raw how we do this. And um he there, of course, redoing the episode, it it came out very different, it would every time, and there was some pretty great parts in that first episode, which no one's really gonna hear because my Mike wasn't really on. Um that then in the step the second when in the redo we tried to kind of recapture, but it it just didn't come out the same, and so and it, you know, and I was like, ah, you know, kind of wrestling with my part in that, and and Mike was just pretty reassuring. He's like, Man, it's it's okay, man. This this stuff happens, you know, it's I deal with shit like this all the time, you know. What do you and just it is it was a good learning experience for us, and uh just kind of interesting for us to be tested in that way.

SPEAKER_00 6:00

Yeah, so what I mean is you you can't fix everything. I couldn't fix it. Yeah, and I couldn't take an I could not take a chance that I could fix it and then ultimately not be able to repair the file, right? Yeah, so we opted to just sit with it, deal with it, re-record it, and move on. Yeah. And I think that's what Shannon is saying earlier is that in the mental health side of things, yes, there are things that we cannot fix, but you can definitely have a redo and you can talk about it, and you can have a new outlook on it, and you can have a new, you know, maybe you maybe you you make a right-hand turn this time instead of making a left-hand turn and you try something new, right? And I think that's what the power in mental health is, is that there's not just one freaking thing. No, there's so many, it's not linear, in my opinion. It's the complete polar opposite of linear. It is such a broad, wide stroke, you know what I mean? And how how do you how do people generally live with unresolved things? Well, from my personal experiences, the very first thing I had to change was how I received things and how I perceived things. Because until I changed that, it was very difficult for me. Um, and Shannon will have Shannon's got 10 years of stories to tell you. Where it was my way or the highway, man. And and I I can look back and confidently say that's not me anymore, but that's the way I was. If I was doing A, if I was on a certain health kick, that was the only way. Every other way was wrong, right? Shannon will tell you, that's just the way I was early on. It was I was just very if I was gonna go up a mountain, by golly, I'm doing it in a hundred and I'm not taking a break. I'm looking straight up and I'm not stopping, right?

SPEAKER_01 8:06

And what's wrong with all you people just going 90%?

SPEAKER_00 8:09

Uh right, like very linear, right? Your way. It was my way, it was the only way, and if anybody was it I I have to laugh right now, dude, because when I say this, it sounds so stupid. But when with that thought, in the moment, I really believed that that was the only way, dude. Like, yeah, everyone else is an idiot. Yeah, why aren't you doing it like I'm doing it, right? It's not my way anymore. Why isn't everyone like me? Pretty freaking crazy to think that way, but that's the way it was. So now I'm able to look at things for what they are, and there's a great philosopher, and I I'm uh a little disappointed, I can't remember which one it is, but there's a great philosopher that says that you know 90% of our issue is the way we perceive things. Oh, yeah, and it's 10% of how it actually is, yeah. Right? So living with unresolved things for me personally starts with just being able to look at it for what it is, not to make it worse, and to try to mentally think through whatever that is, just like last episode, episode six. I sat with it for a moment and I just made a decision. We're just gonna record it. It is what it is, let's move on. Is it gonna be the same? No, because we're we're organic, we're not reading off of a script. Right. I think a lot of things in life could be that way, right? You you said something you shouldn't have said. Well, sit with it. Right? Sit with it, and you gotta allow yourself uh some grace, if you will, to I've done it. I've I've done it in staff where I've allowed a little bit of an emotion to leak out in a way that was not okay with me as a vice president. I've sat with it, came back the next week during our staff, and I've openly apologized in staff as the vice president that hey last week I said X, I felt that that was not appropriate, and I just want everybody to know that I apologize.

SPEAKER_01 10:32

Yeah, yeah, that's great modeling, man. Like I am human, we're all human, we make mistakes. It's actually quite common as human beings. We are very fallible, right? We're very error prone. We and that's okay, right? And yes, we want to continue uh to the whole quote unquote deer best, and you know, just work toward uh what we're working toward in so many different ways. And uh along the way, that's that's how we get there is mess that up, okay. Let's try it again this way instead, you know. I mean, that is how we learn through the experiences, through the failures, and to have thank you for that word, Michael Grace. It is okay. And that some people get pretty cringy when I when even in session, I'm like, man, it's it's okay, you know, but it's not okay. I I understand there's a lot of emotion, you really regret that. And okay, you know, it's can we be okay with it not being okay, even at least for now, you know, and uh it is and just slowly gently trying to maybe move our perceptions a little bit to that thing in the past which just fills us with angst, which we feel so effing bad about to uh process it, uh you know, just begin to look at it a little more, maybe in some different ways, and gradually over time like okay, I gain a little more acceptance for well there it is. You know, and here we are now and uh just easing it.

SPEAKER_00 12:25

Yeah, so yes, we can't fix everything, quote unquote, and it's okay to live with unresolved things, but you have to be aware that when you sit with those things ultimately the outcome is completely up to you. It is your choice. It's the one thing I love about being a human being is the power of choice. You know, you can choose whichever path you want, you can choose however you want to deal with things, and I I think sometimes in today's modern day and time we forget that it is a choice, we have a choice, right? I have a choice to if I want to freak out, I have a choice uh to to apologize. That's I have a choice in that, right? And just like my example during staff is is you know, I sat with it for a week, I felt that it was something I needed to to write, and I needed to put out that hey, as the vice president of this company, I I have to apologize because it was not okay in my opinion. Doesn't matter what anyone else's opinion is, it's when I do things, I put a lot of thought and I put a lot of energy into trying to make sure that I stay in a a place of neutrality in a way to try my best to look at both sides, right?

SPEAKER_01 13:50

Yeah, and much easier said than done. Here we are sitting here, cool, calm, and collect, just having a conversation. Sure. And let's apply this to a real world example. Busy day, busy week, we're running late to have to pick up our kid for somewhere, we're we're backing out really quick in the parking lot, all of a sudden crash, just oops, back into another parked car. Ah, right? Like you're already late, your kid's waiting for you. Now you have this little accident, now you get like, uh, you know, like, and wait, you mean in that moment we can just choose to be cool and all neutral and not let it affect us? Of course not, because emotion is so powerful. We've all, as human beings, experienced how overwhelming emotion can be. The anger, the fear, whatever it is, it can be overwhelming and put us our prefrontal cortex very quickly begins to shut down, and we uh just be you know, like ah, kind of lose control of how we would prefer to be behaving. We are not behaving optimally, we're we're full of emotion. And yet, with that awareness, even just listening to this now, even just talking about this now, it's all going deep into the psyche, down there in the subconscious, like just even with this awareness, like, oh okay, I just effed up, and now I'm gonna have to deal with this. And punching the car more is not gonna do any good or help anyone here. How can I just pause, feel my feet on the ground, take a breath? Just look into the sky for a moment. Okay, now how like and that's what Michael is talking about choice. It is a developed skill, and yeah, just even understanding the skill and being able to begin practicing the skill will in time bring greater and greater ability to deal with those tough situations.

SPEAKER_00 15:54

Yeah, and I'm not making light of um people's circumstances in in the world of chaos that we live in, but I will tell you from my own experience in this journey is that you can get to a place where maybe maybe now 70% of the time, maybe maybe 50%. Let's go 50% that's awesome.

SPEAKER_01 16:16

If you're even if the halfway mark, yeah, let's just talk 50%.

SPEAKER_00 16:20

If if 50% of the time you can just take one great big deep breath, fill your body with fresh oxygen, let it out nice and slow, repeat that one more time. All right, do it twice and go, okay. Yes, this sucks. But how can I you you can either let it affect you or you can't, and and I do believe through a a a process, like Shannon said, a very long process, because I I I feel like I I'm in that process now, is I can choose sometimes to not allow my emotion to just override my brain.

SPEAKER_01 17:05

Yeah, right, as much as it would have before. Because this is a large continuum, you know, from one side just losing our shit, freaking the F out, and over time, you know, just gradually, okay, maybe not losing our shit quite as bad, maybe not freaking out as much, and then you keep moving down toward that 50% mark, like, okay, still being quite upset, but being able to bite our tongue a little, not not say that thing that later we would have regretted, you know, and then you through years of practice keep moving it down to like, oh yep, I'm still very feeling very like what just happened, losing that episode. Yeah, you know, like I'm still feeling very frustrated in this moment, and okay, I'm just gonna become present, slow down, take a breath or two, and okay, well, here we are. It is what it is. How how can we that even though I'm feeling frustrated, of course, that's okay that I'm feeling frustrated, and I am choosing to deal with this in a more appropriate manner, in a way that's ultimately more beneficial to myself than if I was more highly activated.

SPEAKER_00 18:14

And and through those processes, which uh we'll talk about in great, great detail um as we continue recording these episodes, is through that you're gonna build this amazing thing called resilience. Ah, yes. Right? I'll give and I'll give you another example. So I was at a show two weekends ago, I was at a show, and a trade show. Um a gun show. Trade show gun show, yep. And uh stayed at a local um casino hotel, and um Friday was loaded in, Saturday was the first day of the show. So Saturday morning we get up, and uh I'm I gotta get up early, I'm gonna I gotta go out to the parking lot. My truck was parked in the parking lot, had to get a couple things out of that, and then I was gonna walk across the street to the show, which is at our convention center. Well, it's it's it's like 0 6 30. It's it's it's a beautiful time of the morning here in northern Nevada. I'm walking out in the parking lot. A lot of the the the cars are gone because all of the locals have gone home. And as I'm walking out to my truck, I immediately see this huge red lens sitting on the ground under the bumper of my car. Okay. Now, at first I I took them, I I stopped in my steps, and then I thought, oh, wait a minute. For those of you who've never seen my truck, and you probably won't, it's it's okay, all right. But it took me a minute to go, oh crap, that's not mine, because I have a tinted headlight cover. So I walk out, and obviously somebody in the night backed up and just annihilated their car. My truck is fine, it's got a 800-pound steel bumper on the front, so it had a scratch. But the reason I tell that story is because if you rewound that clock 10 years ago, I would have freaked F out. And Shannon would have heard about it in my next session, and I would not have been calm, cool, and collective. I would have been raging that somebody had the audacity to run into my truck regardless of the damage, and then just roll out and not leave a note or anything. Instead, I laughed out loud in the parking lot. I took a picture of it and sent it to a couple people in my family, and I was like, I guess my bumper works. Nice, right? What a different way of dealing with that. Right? I I can't do anything, there's no car around. Right. The only thing that they left was this huge portion of their, I'm assuming, was their tail light.

SPEAKER_01 20:45

I got a little scratched in that fantasy bumper of yours. No big deal. And yet, years ago, when you were quite quite pent up over other things, the audacity of some of an idiot to hit and run your your vehicle, and what yeah, you you would have been pretty pretty angry about that. And through the years, you've you've really uh made a lot of progress at dealing with a lot of these little situations in a different way.

SPEAKER_00 21:18

Right? And that that's the resilience that we're talking about. It's no different from callusing your hands. If you work out without gloves or if you're a baseball player, golf player, it doesn't matter what you do. You we build these calluses on our hands through repetitiveness. Whatever the repetitiveness is, whether it's playing guitar, same thing, right? On on the fingertips, man. Yeah. You build those calluses and at some point you can play. You don't feel nothing. You just you know go through the thing. So through that resilience, you're building that resilience, and then I believe it helps you in not just. Avoiding it. Now, when I walked out in the parking lot, I could have made a right hand turn and just avoided it all and just went right to the show. Right. I'm not even going to deal with that right now. I don't have the time or the space. I don't I'm not mentally prepared to deal with this. I'm just going to turn around and go back in the motel and or or casino and go back to my room. That's a choice. Right? So I think through resilience, you're building something so you don't quote unquote avoid things because through the resiliency and the callosene, if you will, you're better prepared to deal with these things. Was it important? No, it didn't do anything to my truck, bro. It scratched it. Now, would I have had a different approach if that was, let's say, my old you know, BMW M6? Possibly. Yeah. Right? You're talking about a hundred thousand dollar, $120,000 sports car. Probably would have had a different reaction. However, through the building of resiliency, I do believe in my own personal life, it has better equipped me to deal with things a little less emotionally in charged, if you will.

SPEAKER_01 23:13

And like any of these things that develop us building the resiliency, building the calluses, there's there's pretty much only one way through, and that's through the exposure, through playing the guitar, through doing the pull-ups or whatever, you know. It we're not gonna div generally develop the ability to huh, you know, have things not affect us as much, or being able to better deal with things without dealing with things. You just kinda that's probably the hardest thing, is staying, like facing things. Because there is a great tendency when shit starts to uh, you know, trigger us to nope, we're out. We you we we avoid, we um disengage, we'll go numb out, whatever it is, we it's it's quite remarkable how good so many of us are at avoiding the those highly uncomfortable situations um rather than staying in it, facing it, developing that resiliency that will serve us much better in the future.

SPEAKER_00 24:28

Which is I was an absolute magician at yeah.

SPEAKER_01 24:34

Right? Uh-huh.

SPEAKER_00 24:36

I was an absolute magician at avoiding and ignoring and not dealing with. But what I will tell our audience is that it will catch up at some point, okay? And I don't want anybody on this listening side of the house to think that I'm some guy behind this microphone and I just have it all figured out, or I haven't gone through things. Because I'm gonna tell you right now that I have another man on the other side of this table that will tell you I have been through an enormous amount of things in my lifetime. Yeah, enormous amount of things, and it is a broad spectrum. Yeah, and through all of that, that's where Shannon is talking about building resiliency because through those things, that's what's allowed me to create some calluses along my journey because I have somebody to sit down with for an hour every week, every other week, once a month, whatever it is your flavor is, and to unload my weight and to get his perspective, and sometimes that perspective will not line up with what you want to hear, and that's where the power is at. The power is in just listening to someone else's opinion from the outside that knows you, giving you a different perspective. Hey man, I love that you charge a mountain at 100 miles an hour, but have you ever thought stop, turn around and look at the view? Because you told me that one time. I did. Shannon told me that. Mike, just stop, turn around. Okay, say you went 2,000 feet. Well, take a look at because the view at 2,000, big different than 6,000 or 4,000, right? So you can build those calluses and you can build some resiliency, man, but have some grace for yourself, have some grace for the process, and just slow down and take a take a gander, man. Take a look at where you where you've come. I don't care if you're one day. If you're one day into your journey, man, that's one day into your journey.

unknown 26:43

Yeah, yeah.

SPEAKER_00 26:44

Right?

SPEAKER_01 26:45

Yeah. And and many do kind of comprehend it more as being a lifetime journey that every single human being, from the day we're born to the day we die, is all very different journeys. I think what you're referring to more is, you know, maybe more intentionality or even just awareness of a of it, because we're being developed in different ways. Some ways we're aware of, others not so much, some ways we're more intentional about, others not as much, and really kind of just like with increased awareness and increased intentionality about who we want to be, what uh direction we want our journey to go, which you have really, really experienced and describe. You you should uh, you listeners out there, you don't have the advantage I do in this moment, just uh even see that that little bit of emotion in Michael's eyes from describing being such a magician at avoiding all those things that used to trigger him, that used to like ah, just fill him with that great angst that he would just stuff inside and not let anybody see. And then he was brave enough. He he dared to finally begin this process, this journey, and how transformative that has been for him through these years to now bring him to present day where he's able to share that journey with others.

SPEAKER_00 28:12

Yeah, thank you for that. It's been great. Um, it's been a great, great journey, and it's gonna continue to be a great journey because that's what I choose. You know, and Shannon has his own journey and he's grown from an intern. Let's not forget when I met him, he was an intern. Yeah, right. So we we've both we have both been on a long journey, and I think when we sat down to talk about starting this unloaded podcast, it is in its rawest form is that we just want to help people, man. Yeah, and that's it. That's it. Just want to help people. Give you guys and gals just a preview of what what you could theoretically have in your own journey. Go out there and find someone that that you can have a relationship with, that you uh bond with and that you can uh do life with and and see what happens. Yeah, right?

SPEAKER_01 29:01

Yeah, that's it. It has so served us, it has been such a gift that uh we we just want to share it. We just you know, it's man, a lot of people don't know about this, a lot of people are afraid of this, a lot of people avoid this. Let's let's demystify it a bit, let's kinda just clue it in a little, what what happens on the other side of that door, and uh kind of it's may maybe encourage some, you know. Maybe it's it's it's worth a try.

SPEAKER_00 29:33

That's it, man. That's all we can that's all we can ask for. It's that's all I ask for. Yeah. You know, give given an opportunity. Well, like always, uh, we've run out of time. And I appreciate the time we've had today to talk about this uh with Shannon. Uh, like always, if you're if you're there and you need some help, please, please seek the help that you need. Do some quick Googling, reach out to someone in your local area. Um, one day down the road, we you know, you might be able to uh email us or send us, you know, some some questions or comments. And you know, if Shannon knows of uh any professional help, I'm sure we can always uh send send somebody a quick link or send somebody a quick, hey, this is a great spot to go look for some help if you're needing some help in the in the in the arena of mental health help.

SPEAKER_01 30:21

So yeah, yeah. And I am just going to provide the gentle reminder um this podcast is not a substitute for professional mental health treatment, it's just purely a conversation, it's not designed to cure or prevent any illness or disorder. Um all users are responsible for their own decisions about seeking clinical help. And yes, as Michael just said, please. I I know it can be scary, I know, and it it can be very much worth it to just uh be brave enough to reach out. And if that first person or second or even third person um for whatever reason can't quite get call you back, you know, just kind of remain persistent, you know. You'll there's plenty out there, you'll you'll find a good fit, you know. It's that is uh probably often the biggest and most difficult first step is even just beginning.

SPEAKER_00 31:22

Just beginning. Take your first step in your journey of health. Yeah. That's all I can ask.

SPEAKER_01 31:26

Yeah, I think you'll have a little momentum, and um, yeah, it's it can be transformative.

SPEAKER_00 31:31

100%. Well, I appreciate, and I know Shannon appreciates each and every one of our listeners. And um we wouldn't be doing this, I suppose, if if we didn't hope somebody was listening to us, right? So um with that being said, I hope everybody has a great week. Um, this is Michael Seahorn.

SPEAKER_01 31:49

And Shannon Morrow.

SPEAKER_00 31:50

And we wish you the very best of the best week that you can have, and we'll catch you on the next episode.