The Power of Community and Connection

We weren’t meant to carry everything alone.

In this episode, Michael and Shannon talk about the role of community and connection in the process of unloading — and why who you surround yourself with matters more than most people realize.

After learning how to recognize the weight, sit with it, and begin to share it, the next step is finding the right people to walk with you.

Because healing doesn’t happen in isolation.

It happens in connection.

Transcript

SPEAKER_01 0:00

I'd like to welcome everybody back to the Unloaded Podcast. This is Michael Seahorn. Shannon Moru. And we hope everybody's been doing well and having a good time out there at whatever they're doing. Shannon, how are you? I'm doing well. Okay, good. Hard to believe this is uh episode eight. Here we are already. Episode eight, man. Eight weeks of um content, eight good episodes. So hopefully uh for any new listener out there, hopefully if you went back and listened to some of the uh other podcasting and kind of get caught up.

SPEAKER_00 0:32

I mean good subjective, right? We're hoping they're good episodes. We're we are kind of beginners at this. We're hoping they improve over time. We'll we'll get to good.

SPEAKER_01 0:41

Yeah, no, I I think it's I think it's awesome, and uh Shannon is correct. We are new at the podcasting thing, and it's as as organic as you possibly get. So there is that, man. So this week uh on episode eight, we want to talk a little bit about um the community and connection as it relates to um the podcast unloaded. So um carrying the weight, unloading the weight, sitting with the weight, and some of the things that Shannon and I have gone through over the last seven episodes. So this should hopefully round out the more connective piece on the mental health community as a whole. Would you agree?

SPEAKER_00 1:22

Oh yeah, yeah.

SPEAKER_01 1:23

Okay. So one of the one of the things uh that I think about um especially when we talk about the community and uh connection, is there's a little bit of I won't even say a little bit, sometimes there is a myth out there about self-reliance, right?

SPEAKER_00 1:43

I'm gonna even like let's not call it a myth. I mean, there's a lot there. We the way we raise our children, the way we expect most individuals to operate in society, please be able to dress yourself, feed yourself, get yourself where you need to go. Please be largely responsible for yourself. We we don't want to have to take care of abled-body individuals who have the capacity to take care of themselves. And so let's just begin with that, you know, more real understanding that yeah, self-reliance is what we um strive for.

SPEAKER_01 2:26

Okay, we're kind of I don't want to use the word, but I don't know a different word that would really explain it in my in my head is we're kind of bred for that in a way, as we're brought up, as you said, whether that's through the mother-father relationship or the school relationship education, even the religious sector as well, right?

SPEAKER_00 2:47

I mean, I'm gonna sorry, back it up way up just biology, mammals in general, you know. I mean, there's a lot of you know, the um animals that are more prey, you know, that when they're born, they can walk within a few minutes, they can run within a day or two, you know. Like, hey, if it your survival is dependent upon you being able to care for yourself, run away, hide, protect yourself, and it's not much different for us, also mammals. You know, most of us are expected, you know. We we have to kind of make our way through this life. We gotta earn our income, we gotta be able to pay for our own things, we gotta mostly take care of ourselves and uh you know our households.

SPEAKER_01 3:32

Yeah, and I mean if you look back at uh whichever episode it was, I want to say it was episode five when we talked about how you and I met. Yeah, prior to my seeking professional help in the mental health world, that's pretty much what I was doing. I was trying to be self-reliant and try to self-fix myself, which we all know now was a complete failure. So thank you.

SPEAKER_00 3:56

That transitions from just the basic self-reliance of you know the the physical care, you know, food, sleep, water, all the shelter, safety, all that, but more now look leaning into more, you know, the psychological realm, emotional, mental, you know, that's where um social connection is so important.

SPEAKER_01 4:24

Yeah, and if if I may, it looking back now over the last 11 years, uh, in my personal self-help journey, if you will, the first large portion of my life being quote unquote in the self-reliant journey, it taught me a lot of things that just didn't work and some things that did work. So it was definitely a good way to look back and self-analyze, if you will, some of the things that I thought about trying to cope with whatever that weight was that I was dealing with or feeling, even though at the time, like we've talked about, I didn't even know that I was that's what I was doing. I didn't know I was looking at and sitting with the weight, right?

SPEAKER_00 5:10

Yeah, only in hindsight now you can see correct.

SPEAKER_01 5:13

We can see that looking backwards. Now, definitely over the last 10 years, I have mixed in both. Obviously, with you in the community world, seeking that professional help, uh, group therapy, I did a stint and anger management, that's for a different story, different day. And just I did some other things too along that journey, right? For the community portion. Um and as I look back at the totality of that, for me, I think that the most experienced practitioners, if you will, the ones that are really dedicated to their self-healing journey, self-reliance for the most experienced ones is difficult at best. Yeah, best, right? Yeah. And they still mix in the community and the professional side of the mental health world too. They're not solely just no 100% self-reliant, right?

SPEAKER_00 6:12

No, yeah. It I've often witnessed the deeper um practitioners get into their professional practice, it also requires a deepening of their personal practice.

SPEAKER_01 6:25

Yeah, I mean, if you if you look at any deep practitioner, regardless of whatever it is, it could be yo, it could be yoga, it could be Buddhism, Christianity, it doesn't matter what the label is per se. Even in those circumstances, you will always see quote unquote like the teacher, the master, the counselor, the psychologist, the psychiatrist, whatever the nomenclature is, right? There's always that one individual that is still giving back through the teaching method. Right? And I don't know what goes on on the other side. I I I have my own opinion, I've done some research on it, but even the quote unquote teachers and masters per se, they have people they talk to. So it's it to me, it's a continuum.

SPEAKER_00 7:12

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 7:12

Right.

SPEAKER_00 7:13

And to really grasp something to really understand is to bring a full circle, to then teach, to there, there's such a greater understanding when we are attempting to relay that body of knowledge to others, to see it increases our own understanding.

SPEAKER_01 7:33

And when when we talk about community, and I don't want to predicate this one way or the other, I just want our listening audience to know again that your community, it's a very broad stroke, and that community could mean a lot of different things from a lot of different people, right? It could be the community of your family, it could be the community of your uh religious choice or organization, could be a uh mental health organization, counseling. I mean, there it's almost infinity on options out there when we're talking community, right?

SPEAKER_00 8:05

A lot of my clients these days, their greatest community is through online gaming. You know, they'll put their headsets on, they look forward to meeting every evening. They you know, they're involved involved together in some big campaign, they know each other's strengths and weaknesses, they're working together, they yeah, that's there's a big community through online gaming.

SPEAKER_01 8:26

You know, my you know, I have obviously I have some children, five to be exact, and uh four out of the five are are pretty versed in the IT computer world, and they're a lot of them are gamers. And it's funny you said that because my two boys met a couple of their friends through an online gaming, just like Shannon was talking about, and in that online gaming community, 2015. Well, it won't be 20, so my good. So we're talking the better part of 10 years, they're still friends. I've met them. Uh one lives here in Nevada now, and uh one came all the way up from SoCal to both of my son's weddings, and so that connection they had 10 years ago as kids through that online gaming has now turned into a a lifelong friend. So it is it is pretty neat that that's uh that that's going on, you know. Well, through that, what do you think, Shannon? What do you think when when we talk about what what would like healthy support look like? Because I know we've talked about it for the last seven episodes. We've we've hit it in bits and pieces here and there, but if we encapsulated what does healthy support look like?

SPEAKER_00 9:46

Um healthy support, if I am perceiving for myself that I'm mostly supported in a healthy way, I I feel pretty sustainable. Like I can just kinda keep on marching, you know. It's you know, day after day, week after week, month after month, just like okay, you know, da da da da da. And there's gonna be challenges, there's going to be things come up to figure out, and you know, um, but overall, it's just a um the ability to, you know, you kind of hit cruise control. That's not the best analogy, but you know, that cruising altitude, you're at 35,000 feet and all systems go. You're you're doing fine. The aircraft is just moving along, and uh no worries, really. I mean, little, you know, you gotta, you know, dodge a little stuff here and there, but overall, like, huh, things are um bearable. And um as we've kind of referenced in previous episodes, uh, for us to be able to, oh, finally recognize for ourselves that uh-oh, I'm maybe not supported in ways that I'm I could actually really use to be supported right now is when it starts feeling more unbearable. You know, that proverbial check engine light blinks on suddenly. We we're not sure that we have enough fuel to make it or enough, you know, uh-oh, that something's I uh there there's that pebble in my shoe and it's driving me nuts and I can't keep on keeping on. I got to um I I don't know if I'm gonna make it. And that's you know, that's a big indicator, hopefully when we can oh uh finally allow for that for ourselves to um yeah, it's time to look for some support. Yeah, how and I I'll let you go from there and all the different ways we can look for support.

SPEAKER_01 12:08

And I and I think intuitively as human beings at some level if you're on a self-help journey or you have s you know, if you've reached out, searched for or participating in um good mental health counseling, or you've seeked some type of help. I think intuitively as human beings, we should honestly know for ourselves in a way what may not be healthy in the support role, or what is more support in a good way, right? Like for me, I mentioned the anger management class. It was a four-week class, I think I participated twice, and I don't know if you remember the story or not. I I didn't feel that that class was appropriate for me. I gave it an opportunity. I I didn't like it, I didn't like the people that were in there, I didn't like the energy about it, so I withdrew myself out of that comparatively to going through a 12-week group therapy course, which I again I fought tooth and nail to even show up day one, but ended up going all 12 sessions and learned a ton of good information and and it was very healthy for me. So I think I think somehow in our in our human minds and our human heart and our human feeling, you should know if you're go try something, or even it could be your group of friends, it could be your family, it could be whoever you're talking to that's supporting you. You know, if if if you're just not feeling it, then that's probably a good indicator, like Shannon said, your check engine light. That's a good indicator. Well, take a step back. Take a breath and go, hey, is this really healthy for me right now?

SPEAKER_00 13:51

Great, that's it. Thank you. Just the little pause, the step back, just our breath. Just you know, we instinctually we're very we recognize when we're thirsty, oh man, I need water, hunger, we we're we're fatigued, we're not sleeping well enough. We we recognize a lot of things when we are in deficit. Not too far off from that, we can also, if we allow for ourselves to recognize, you know, emotionally, God, we're just more, you know, just shorter fuse, more, you know, more irritable, just more feeling more emotional, um or depressed, disengaging, you know, like allow that to just like thirst or hunger or fit physical fatigue. There's the mental emotional fatigue or you know, indicator that okay, let me let me let's look at this.

SPEAKER_01 14:52

That's good. And I, you know, we we talked a little bit about the the individual self-reliance portion, and what I'm getting ready to say kind of ties this together is through the mental health journey that I've been on, both professional and non-professional, I'll get to that a little bit later, or maybe in another episode, through connection, i.e. being around other people, whether it was my group setting or even just sitting one-on-one with you, Shannon, it really took me off of feeling like I was on the island by myself in the middle of fucking nowhere. And through those connections and hearing the other people around me going through maybe not exactly the same, but definitely similar circumstances and feeling in similar ways. It really that connection definitely pulls you out of that. I'm all alone, nobody knows what's what I'm feeling.

SPEAKER_00 15:51

There it is. That what you just said on the island by myself in the middle of effing nowhere, man. And it's who you we experience that. Even sometimes laying in bed beside our spouse or significant others, sometimes we can feel so alone. And even in you know, in a crowded household, or you know, for those of us, you know, when we live by ourselves or who live by ourselves currently, you know, there's at work, a workplace full of coworkers, and still just in our minds, in our emotions, feeling so um disconnected, like no one's really seeing me or knowing what I'm going through. And and that again is a big sign for ourselves. When you know, um we don't want to feel that alone.

SPEAKER_01 16:45

No, and I and I do believe, and and I've because I've been there, it's you the mind is such a powerful thing, it's the way that the creator created it, and it's so powerful, but it's also powerful on both sides of the coin, uh, in the negative context and in the positive context, which I've experienced, we've all experienced that you know there's a duality there, right? And I think going from feeling like I'm just on an island by myself, not a single person in the world knows how I feel. I hate everybody because that's that's where I came from, right? We went through that in episode five. That's where I came from. I came from that I ever I hated the whole world, nobody knows what I'm going through. To man, I'm not wow, I'm not the only effed up dude on the planet. Like there's a lot of guys like me, or a lot of gals like me. It's not it's not gender-based, right?

SPEAKER_00 17:35

We're all human, man. We all have similar experiences around that.

SPEAKER_01 17:41

And in that, listening and participating through shared experiences helped me personally. Yeah. Listening to the struggles of other people, listening to the struggles that you've had and of I've had, and that the things that we've shared back and forth in our sessions. It really does help tremendously to snap you out of that I'm all alone in my head, or I'm all alone in life, to I'm not alone. There is people out there. There are, sorry, bad English, there are people out there. And I can get through this because you're seeing and hearing other people getting through it. You know what I mean? You're just not the you're just not the only one, man. You're not. There's millions of us on the planet.

SPEAKER_00 18:29

And the dynamic that is created between one human being and another human being when they begin to communicate, when they begin to allow for that shared interaction, it's you're just talking about the mind. We can start to think about something and think about it more and start to overthink it, and it's pretty soon we're just all wrapped up in our head around this really stuff, this distressing thoughts, and it's just like, ah. And then when we actually finally allow ourselves opportunity to speak to someone else about them, and we hear ourselves just say it out loud, it sounds ridiculous. Just saying it out loud. No, you're right. Oh, wait a sec. Uh, never mind. Yeah, yeah. Go ahead. No, yeah, just the power to speaking to it really, really um it, but you can't do it as much talking to your dog or your houseplant or the wall or something. You know, it's truly being heard, having someone else understand what you're talking about. That's the power in connection.

SPEAKER_01 19:45

Yeah, and it's it's crazy that what Shannon was just saying is when your mind goes completely off the rails, your perception changes. In my opinion. Yeah. Your perception is changing because your your mind is going a hundred miles an hour to the right, you're trying to go to the left, and you're struggling in between these two things. So your perception starts to change that whatever it is that you're dealing with in your mind, or even in reality, that perception is magnified by like a thousand. With the emotions. Correct.

SPEAKER_00 20:21

Because then it's gonna, the mind, the emotions are gonna go, what, what? And then they're gonna come online and suddenly we're we're feeling scared or angry, and it just it starts blowing everything out, and none of it's even real other than within our thoughts and feelings. But until we can get them out here into the physical reality in conversation with another, oh, then we can start actually seeing them really for what they are.

SPEAKER_01 20:46

Right. And then Shannon can correct me if I'm wrong, because again, this isn't counseling or professional mental health advice. We're just having a conversation. It the when I think about that, it's almost like when when you're going through that in your head, your perceptions changing. I know for myself, I used to start going deeper inside, and I would start withdrawing more from my family, from my surroundings. I I wasn't present at all because I I was so twisted and tied up in what Shannon is talking about. Because now your mind is not in a thousand different places, it's in ten thousand different places, right? So going back to what we just talked about, being on that island by yourself, but then if you wrap that into the community aspect and you're like, hey, I I got a session next week, I'm gonna go talk to person A, whoever that person is, and when you say it out loud and you you see the person sitting across from you, and they're like, Man, you're okay, man, you're good. Have you thought about this or have you thought about that? And sometimes that's all it takes. You and I've been there, you know, where I'm I'm struggling with something and I'm like, Shit, man, this and that's. He's like, Yeah, you're good. Did you think about it in this context? And sometimes just that question alone snaps you right back into the modern day and time and the and you're in the present moment.

SPEAKER_00 22:13

That's it. Yep.

SPEAKER_01 22:14

And you're like, oh just wasted six days torturing myself.

SPEAKER_00 22:19

Torturing myself.

SPEAKER_01 22:20

And in reality, wow, I I I just let that thing go crazy.

SPEAKER_00 22:27

That's the mind. Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 22:29

So I really believe that that really encapsulates what we were talking about in the beginning of this episode is it's okay to be self-reliant at a certain level, mix that in with the community aspect, whatever the community means to somebody. So when and if you're going through those things, bounce that off of somebody, man.

SPEAKER_00 22:49

There was a lot of years in my life. Um well before I became a psychotherapist, um, just kind of going through my own stuff. I'd when I was living in the mountains, um, me and a group of friends, we would go mountain biking regularly. We had a bunch of great trails, just up in the woods, just super fun on our bikes, you know, mountain biking. And it was just a good ride and you know, being physically tired and stuff. But then at the end of the ride, just even loading the bikes back up and you know, just chilling for a few minutes by the trucks and you know, just uh the a little conversation, a few uh little remarks, you know, and just to connect and to let a little off our chest, you know, or just just to be seen a little, to be heard a little. Sometimes that's enough.

SPEAKER_01 23:43

Well you said something pretty pretty important there in your last sentence. It's being seen. Sometimes as humans, we just need to be seen. We need to be heard for sure, but sometimes we just need to be seen, you know. I I try to make it a practice now in my personal life is when I'm out and about and I am coming across a stranger or we're crossing paths, or walking next to each other, or someone's coming in or coming out of a building, whatever the case may be, I really try to make an effort just to say hi to people with a little bit of a smile. And Shannon will tell you, I'm not a smiley guy. I'm just that's just not who I am. I don't run around just with a smile placid on my face. But when I do smile at somebody and I say, Hey, how are you doing? or hi, it's genuine. I mean it, right? It's not fake. And it's amazing to me. Like this morning, I was I had a meeting this morning uh with a couple of employees, and we were having breakfast together. And as I was leaving, I had to park around the block because Lord knows everywhere around here is full of traffic now. So as I was walking back to the my vehicle, uh an olderly gentleman was coming towards me. And I, if anybody knows me, I there's no way on God's green earth I won't look at somebody. It's just not in my repertoire. I'm gonna look at them in their eyes, we're gonna make contact, eye contact, we know each other's there. As I was doing that, he the older gentleman looked up at me and he said, Oh, good morning. But it was in a weird accent. I I couldn't place it at first, sounded European for sure. And I said, Hey, good morning, how are you doing? And he just he literally stopped. And I was like, that's weird, right? So they created a little bit of space just because that's my normal thing, and I kind of turned to the side and I said, Oh, I said, Hey, I just you know, how you doing? He's like, You know what, I'm doing pretty good, man. He goes, I appreciate you asking.

SPEAKER_00 25:42

That's it.

SPEAKER_01 25:43

And he goes, I want you to have a good day, man. And he just turned around and walked away. Yeah, I he was it was like he was so taken back that I added in that little extra of not just hey or hide or you know what us dudes, we just head nodded each other like a bunch of gorillas, right? Did you do that? Hey, hey, and you just keep going.

SPEAKER_00 26:02

Dude, you're lucky to get that these days, man. So many people. I I walk around town here regularly, walk down to the post office and stuff, and I'm gonna say the majority of folks uh avert uh contact. They don't, you know, they keep their head down, look away, don't want to make eye contact, you know, and occasionally there's plenty of us who still recognize the value. And I don't want to try to insinuate that those who choose to, you know, whatever. Maybe they there's some very valid reasons why they need to just stay in their space right now and not allow for other people's energies. That's understandable. Yeah, and um, but yeah, what you're describing is just there's there's a bunch of ancient quotes about this and stuff, but when we meet eyes, when to be able to look into another's eyes, and it's it's as if just for that brief instant, kind of almost making contact, you know. I mean seeing, you know, like soul to soul, the spirit in me acknowledges the spirit in you, like, hey man, we uh huh one human being to another. Like I hello and that's uh you know, it's just that feeling of connection. You know, when we look up at the night sky and see thousands and thousands of beautiful little points of light up there, look at that beautiful Milky Way, look at that beautiful galaxy. Oh yeah, that galaxy is billions of stars, and but I I can only really see the galaxy, but it is it is that connectedness that I think we're very aware of on deeper levels, but the mind likes to trick us, uh help help us forget sometimes when we do start feeling so alone and we forget how connected we actually are, and so just that brief contact, that glance, that nod, that acknowledgement of human being to human being can be enough. Oh yeah, we're we're all in this together, we're not alone.

SPEAKER_01 28:08

We're not, and I don't disagree with Shannon's assessment is that we live in a precarious time right now, and I'm not even gonna get into that. All I'm saying is I try to just make a little bit of an effort just to say hi to people, and it and sometimes it's uncomfortable for me too. I don't I'm not gonna sit here and try to say I'm some kind of a special individual, but I'm just making a little more effort these days because I want to put out some positive energy in this in this trying time that we're all living in. And if a simple hello and a simple hey, how are you doing is is something that helps somebody through the day, man, that's a huge win on such a small band.

SPEAKER_00 28:41

Dude, huge win, and not just you. I'm noticing this more and more. It seems like we are becoming more kind with one another. I I'm that is the hope. You're you're doing that, I'm doing that. I'm noticing a lot of people just, yeah, these are trying times. This it's it's more important now to just that mutual respect, civility, like let's hey, we're we're all in this together, man. But let's let's take care of each other.

SPEAKER_01 29:04

That's all we gotta do. Yeah. Well, this this episode's gonna wind down pretty quick here, but I do want to say to our listening audience that speaking of the community, Shannon and I uh both agree that at some point here in the near future, uh, we're gonna try to get some special guests to come on our podcast, um, some other um mental health professionals uh in whatever their disciplines are. Um, we are gonna have some um specific ladies and and uh women, if you will, that are in the mental health world to come on and give them uh give us their perspective in the mental health world as it results uh to ladies out there because we don't want to single anyone out, and Shannon and I are here to try to make this as wholesome for everybody in the human world that we live in.

SPEAKER_00 29:55

Yeah, this could easily get a little too bro specific. Right, and that's not our intention. We want to keep a good balance.

SPEAKER_01 30:03

Yeah, and we can't do that uh as much as Shannon and I would love to, we can't do that by ourselves. So we are going to be inviting some pretty special guests uh on our podcast. So make sure you guys are on and gals are on the lookout for that. Um I'll I'll try to make sure in the description when we get to that point, in the description of the podcast, I'll make sure that it's in that first line or two, just so our listening audience will know. You can find it. You can and you can search it and take a look at it. Well, as always, it's been a great episode. Um spending some time again with Shannon and our listening audience. And uh I hope and wish all the best for everybody that's listening. And I just want to thank you again for listening to our podcast Unloaded. And this is Michael Seahorn, Shannon Moreau. And we'll catch you on the next episode.