Life's Bumps And Bruises
Life’s Bumps and Bruises is a mental health podcast that keeps things real. Hosted by husband and wife Luke and Joanne Lee Tet — one with lived experience as a mum and HR professional, the other a registered counsellor — the show is a safe, relatable space to explore anxiety, overwhelm, parenting struggles, emotional wellbeing, and life’s messier moments. This podcast isn't about perfection, fixes, or fluff — it’s about honest conversations that normalise the struggles many people carry in silence.
We tackle the subjects that we all experience and not always discuss. Our purpose is to make people feel as though they are not alone and have practical solutions to life’s difficult moments.
Life's Bumps And Bruises
Episode 3 – Perfectionism, Self-Doubt & the Stories We Tell Ourselves
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Episode 3 - 🧠 Ever felt like you had to nail something perfectly on the very first try… or else?
In this episode of Life’s Bumps and Bruises, Joel Sheldon opens up about the pressure he’s been putting on himself to make the podcast “perfect” from day one — and the spiral of self-doubt that comes with it. Luke Lee Tet listens, challenges, and helps unpack why chasing flawlessness can leave us stuck, stressed, and second-guessing.
From dishwasher disasters and Bali knock-off Crocs to the deeper work of self-worth and validation, this is an honest (and often hilarious) look at the messy middle of starting something new — and why we need to give ourselves permission to be imperfect.
🎙 This episode is for you if you’re into:
• Understanding how perfectionism and self-doubt feed each other
• Letting go of the need to “get it right” straight away
• Practical tools to question the stories you tell yourself
• Banter, real talk, and the kind of laughs you don’t plan for
💬 Got thoughts or want to share your own story? We’d love to hear from you. Reach out anytime: 📬 lifesbumpsbruises@gmail.com 📲 Instagram: @lifesbumpsandbruises 📘 Facebook: Life’s Bumps and Bruises
🎧 New episodes drop every Tuesday — let’s normalise the conversation, one real chat at a time.
Credits:
The Inspiration by Keys of Moon | https://soundcloud.com/keysofmoon
Attribution 4.0 International (CC BY 4.0)
https://creativecommons.org/licenses/by/4.0/
Music promoted by https://www.chosic.com/free-music/all/
Lifeful defense, bruises, and machine pressure. Should be technically carefully. Each week we do real life anxiety and family stuff. It feels like we have to use things and bruises. Luke, welcome again. Jolie, how are you, mate? I'm a bit more nervous this time. Why is it? Because people are listening. I felt like um when we did like the I'll call it the three episode ones, which I'll touch on later, but now it's like people messaging saying it's good, and now I'm like, it really feels like the record buttons have been pushed and I feel a bit edgy. Yeah. I think it'd be alright, man. Excited, but so we've got three episodes now, or two and the teaser out on Spotify. The feedback's it's been it's been great, actually.
SPEAKER_00It has been good. I think we've both been getting some feedback from people that have listened in, and um it's been pretty positive. So thank you, everybody who has been listening. It's been um it's it's great to know that uh some of the things that we're talking about are hitting home and that are important for you.
SPEAKER_02And um, yeah, whether you've messaged me or Luke directly or dropped a comment on the socials, we see you. Um so yeah, actually, my cousin reached out to me. There's a link there, which I didn't know this, but um shout out to Ted Sheldon, who is one of our listeners, who actually is my cousin, as I mentioned. Um, but yeah, there's a link. What's the link?
SPEAKER_00Oh, the link between Yeah. Uh so I worked at a school that he attended.
SPEAKER_02Yeah, it's a small world, isn't it? Yes, very small world. Uh I've got another quick shout out to your wife, Joe, actually.
SPEAKER_00Oh yeah, here we go.
SPEAKER_02Um you were telling me the other day that she was listening to, I don't know, one of the episodes, and she was laughing her head off in the other room. Yes. And at the same time I messaged you and said, Well, we're in the bedroom listening to it, and my wife Tamika fell asleep.
SPEAKER_00So sorry we bored you that much, Tamika?
SPEAKER_02Uh well, I mean, uh, she's as you know, and it's been yeah, well discussed, she's heavily pregnant, so I think she was pretty tired. We'll give her a pass for that one. Um, and I just wanted to confuse uh clear up something for Joe. So she mentioned that we have three episode ones, and that there's I just wanted to clear it up. So that there's a teaser episode one, there's the player profile episode one, uh, where you get to know us, and then there's a real episode one. So I'm not sure what all the confusion's about. HR, mate. HR. Yeah. So I don't do numbers, man. Is this episode four or episode one point four? Something like that. Yep. Got it. So uh look, this is this is one of my uh now become one of my favourite times of the week. Uh I uh I really love doing this with you. I I must be one of the few blokes in Australia whose favourite day is a Tuesday.
SPEAKER_00Yeah, um I enjoy them too, to be honest with you. It's um it's good to have a conversation outside of a counselling space too, like this. Because it's you know, every time you're within a counselling, coaching or kinesiology or whatever it is that we do in terms of support, um it's good to be able to have um a conversation where it's not really um it's not gonna change everything all at once. And there's so much writing on every word you say. Um but you can still talk about the important things without you know having that um that moment where it's like, oh it's gotta be about that particular person. It's kind of about us, which is great.
SPEAKER_02Uh I actually had an interesting moment this morning. You talk about you never know who you can help, and you know, once you get the story out there, what's gonna come back, you've just got to sort of have open arms. But I was playing PS5 this morning with the the PS5 controller has, I guess, a microphone and an output in it, um, so that you can banter with people as you play. And self-indulgently, I had the podcast on in the background because I just like to listen to how it flows and whatever else. And about 10 minutes into it, some American guy just pipes up and goes, What is it that you're listening to? That's that's really cool. And I said, Well, it's actually me. Um, so Joel likes the sound of his own voice. I think Joanne Joan got that one right, actually. Stop it. Um, but I actually uh I got a video of it, so I might post that to our socials because I think it's um it's fascinating how when you put things out there where it can land at times. Now, Luke, we um we've got our usual segments today that we will go through. It'll be a typical episode, so this is now episode four. I did touch on something the other week which I did want to tell this quick story. Um I told you I stuffed up the dishwasher.
SPEAKER_00Yeah, jeez.
SPEAKER_02About a day and a half after the whole I care disaster, which is now available to be listened to on Spotify. So I I thought I'd quickly tell you that before we get into the normal show. So for some reason I decided to clean my crocs in the dishwasher. And I've actually done this before, uh, and it works pretty well. I've done it with hats mainly, I haven't done it with crocs, but um, as opposed to being in a tumble washing machine where things can get ruined, it just sort of works. So I um they were a bit dirty, that you know, had some grass stains, so I squirted a bunch of dishwashing liquid on top of them and popped them into the dishwasher. Um, I turn it on, and 10 minutes go by, and bubbles start to s come out the front of the dishwasher. So I thought, well, when life throws gives you lemons, make lemonade. So rather than turn off the dishwasher, I just grabbed a mop and I just started mopping the dishwasher. And then the dishwasher shuts down and I get this blinking water tap message. And I've got a Bosch dishwasher, and that typically indicates a problem uh that with the water supply or the water tap connection. So it can either be insufficient water pressure, incorrect water tap connection, water supply issues, or faulty water inlet valve. And I'm like, well, which one is it? So I start making my way down the list and I'm pulling out the valves and I'm turning it on and off and I'm cleaning out inside of it. And my dishwasher doesn't have a small screen to indicate the actual problems, it just has these flashing lights. So eventually I determine and narrow it down and determine that it could be this E15 error code. And the E15 error code on a Bosch dishwasher indicates that there is water trapped in the lower base of the appliance. And I thought, well, that is 100% going to be it, being that what I've just done. So I've got this integrated dishwasher, so I take off the door, I unscrew it from the inside, I remove the kicker panel, I dry all the insides and I refit everything. And in order to do this, this isn't just a regular Phillips head screw, um, it's a weird star-shaped thing. And I look it up and it's an M4x9 screw with a T20 torx driver. Now, imagine if your dad asked you to go to the shed and bring you an M4x9 screw with a T20 torx driver. You'd be like, mate, I'd be likely to bring you back a stapler.
SPEAKER_00Yeah, more than likely bring back a left-handed hammer.
SPEAKER_02Um, so I go to my shed and it turns out I've got that, so I find it. So I take it all off and I piece it back together and I refit the door as best I can. Um, and just like the cupboard, it sort of fouls on the kicker and it doesn't quite close. I'm like, oh, here we go again. And um so I'm like, oh no, I think it can work. And as I'm doing it, I chip the base of the door, which is two-pack painted against the kicker. And I go, oh no. Now, did I mention this as 11:30 at night?
SPEAKER_00No.
SPEAKER_02So I fix it, the little flick that comes off, I was able to glue it back on and tape it, so it's just a hairline cracks, not a big, not a big deal. And I was actually really proud of myself because I fixed a genuine E15 error that you know required disassembling, and it was a completely different feeling to the I care saga because I don't know, I felt like with the I care stuff, I could have I should have been really knowing how to fix that, and that was well within my capabilities. Whereas this one, you know, I had to go to YouTube and follow instructions, and YouTube is your best friend with these things. If there's a problem, someone's dealt with this before and someone's probably uploaded a video. So 11:30 at night, I you know probably saved $300 for a call-out repair man for a dishwasher guy to come out, and I fixed it myself, so I felt really accomplished. Same thing, it was me stuffing something up, but this one I felt really good about as opposed to the last one. Um, and then one final thing. So, did I mention that the crocs are knockoff crocs from barley? No, you did not. So these are $10 Australian crocs each. So for $20 crocs that I was trying to clean that came from Bali, it almost cost me $400.
SPEAKER_00Huh.
unknownWow.
SPEAKER_00Wow, Jolly, seriously, buddy. Put the tools down. Put the tools down. Come on, mate.
SPEAKER_02Uh, should we get into the first segment? Let's do it. Alright, so segment is unpack that. We covered that last week where I pose a story or a scenario, and Luke, you break it down. Uh, I don't need to go through it anymore. I think hopefully now people know what this is all about. So uh this one is about I don't know, self-doubt, perfectionism, and anxiety in starting something new. So I want you to unpack this one. I've got a few questions for you at the end. So, yeah, I wanted to bring this up. It's been sitting with me for the last couple of weeks, actually, and it's self-doubt, and it's in regards to the podcast. And not just uh, I hope this episode sounds good, it's a little bit deeper than that. So I've been feeling this pressure, like this urgency to get this podcast right straight away, and I know that we are just starting out, and I've been noticing parts of me that really want to rush through this and um you know compete with the established shows. And I'm looking at all these big name podcasts with the fancy setups and the huge followings, and and I'm like, well, God, why aren't we there yet? Which is ridiculous because we uploaded what eight days ago, whatever it might be. Um, and but that's the headspace I've been in, and it's like I can't let this thing breathe because I want to skip the messy beginning and fast forward to being Polish successful and respected. So, what happens for me is I typically overwork. So even this morning, I toyed with our Instagram bio on the toilet for 25 minutes, trying to get the perfect combination. And when I got one that was perfectly right, I was eight characters too long, and I'm like, what am I doing here? Just leave it. But I can you know I put hours into rundown sheets and notes and thinking if I prep enough that I can control the outcome, and then you and I get into conversation that typically happens every week, and the show naturally goes along like over an hour, and I start stressing that people are gonna tune out or get bored or stop listening. And I even had one friend of mine listen to it saying, Oh, is there a way that on Spotify that you can listen to this like a little bit faster? You know, and I'm like, Oh, is that is that because they don't like it or they just want to rush through it? And I know that when I get a bit nervous, like I probably am now, I talk too fast and you probably talk a little bit too slow because you're calm and measured. So don't people gonna calm. I don't know about that one, but people are gonna push and pull these dials up and down. And and I guess underneath of it all is this anxiety that you know, if I'm not constantly refining and fixing and perfecting, then I'm not good enough and the show's not gonna be good enough. So um, and at the same time I'm worried that uh you know I've got this fear that what if this show is too much? And so I've got this double-edged fear of what if no one listens, but also well, what if they do, and now they know everything. So I know at the end of the day this show is meant to be about honesty and realness, and yeah, I'd be lying if I said this stuff wasn't swirling in my head. So that's where I'm at this week. I wanted to bring that into this space where you can unpack it a bit. So I guess the questions I've got is especially when people are starting something from scratch, have you ever felt the pressure to get something perfect right from the start? And how did you work through that feeling? And then the second question is like what advice would you give someone dealing with self-doubt and perfectionism when they're starting something new? Over to you, pro. Well, I'm pro, wow.
SPEAKER_00Uh I you said a lot there. Um I typically do. Yeah. I'm not sure. I guess you is it both or is it one? But are you uh would you suggest that you're a perfectionist or would you suggest that you feel like you're not good enough? Because the two are different.
SPEAKER_02It could be both, but uh immediate answer is I don't know. I just know that if it's not what I consider to be my best work, then I don't want to stamp my name to it and I feel like I can be judged over little things. Including there's a little note in the show notes, which I think I showed you, where we wanted to credit the music we use for the intro, and I'd sent you a message that said, Hey, I'd just use this. And if you look in the show notes right now in Spotify, it says, Hey, I'd just use this, and then a list of the credits, and it really fucking annoys me. Oh, is it really a hundred percent? Look it up right now. Episode one, two, and three, or whatever it is, or episode two and three just says, I'd use this, and then you've literally copied and pasted the text message that I sent you or the email.
SPEAKER_00Yeah, really. Uh I don't remember that one, but uh I will fix that for no problems. I will solve it.
SPEAKER_02Not for me, it's for our listeners.
SPEAKER_00Okay, for you and our listeners. I appreciate that. Um, okay, so um I I'm wondering, like, when you think about the podcast, this podcast, is it really um how could you not be good enough?
SPEAKER_02I don't know. I I'm sorry, I I was just stumbling that. I don't I don't know.
SPEAKER_00So so really when we if it was an external thing, then we would have an answer straight away. Boom, this is what it is, this is what's happening. Uh but you know, when we are looking at it from an internal thing, then it becomes uh an issue because we're feeding ourselves a story. So if it's an internal story, you have control over that story. Right? The difficult part is um when we don't question the story, we just keep telling ourselves the same thing over and over again without ever sitting there going, well, um is this true or am I making it true? I think that that um that that doesn't really get enough credit, that that question. Uh when we look at it um I like this one. There's a really good one for uh perfectionism or for um feeling like I'm not good enough, but it really works for almost everything. So and I learned this from this um uh this woman, her name's Carolee. Uh I did um my placement with her uh and we had this uh young person come in who was just losing her nana, right? Just going off, and uh we're trying to calm her down, and she pops in and she says, Well, it's really simple. If your best friend came to you with this problem, what advice would you give him? And I loved it. Oh, I loved it because this kid had nothing, and then the the the young person sitting there and they're like, I don't know. We'll play it out, what would you say? And then they came up with all these solutions to the problem, and it's like, well, here it is. Well then pick one, right? It doesn't matter which one, just pick one, pick the one that feels the most right to you right now. And uh I love that. So currently, if you're listening to this, I pinch that, I'm sorry, but uh it works so well. Um I like that one, and I think that uh when we have feelings of not being good enough or not um feeling like we're stuck or feeling like we have to be perfect for other people or for ourselves, then we need to ask ourselves that question if my best friend came to me with this problem, what advice would I give them? And I'm telling you, you will get a response. The difficult part that I found with most people is they get a response and then they try and talk themselves out of the response and uh and then they go looking for a different thing. So, oh no, that's that can't be right because it's so simplistic or whatever. I was like, Well, actually, what if it is? And you're not willing to accept it. Literally have this conversation, I reckon, daily with people um uh around love, right? And around um being able to give love, but also to receive love. I think that that um that's probably the most hardest part is receiving love. How do I receive love? And it's the same thing with advice. I can give it, that's real easy. Anyone can give advice, right? For starters, most advice is gonna come from that other person's perspective and their life experiences and a whole bunch of other things, right? That's not necessarily gonna come from yours, and then you don't actually know if that's gonna be in your best interest because of the so many different moving parts in your life. But if we look at um uh listening to ourselves and our own advice, right, it's way more powerful. And then being able to receive that advice is I think um it's it's a key factor in a lot of mental health issues, it's a key factor in a lot of um challenges we experience in our life.
SPEAKER_02I feel like if I posed that question to my friends, they would say, Joe, I don't give a shit in regards to the podcast. Like, how can I make this great? How can I make this better? And I think a part of me is forcing people to care about something that I care in. Like that's what I'm battling with. It was like, hey guys, look what we're doing, we're being vulnerable, we're trying to help people, it's good content, we have a laugh, there's some funny stories, we take the piss out of each other. And at the moment, I'm like, uh yeah, but no one gives a shit. And then I but I totally get we've been operating for two and a half episodes.
SPEAKER_00But regardless, that's still that that's a different problem now. We're now we're talking about validation. Ah, so now we've moved beyond perfectionism, really, and perf I guess I'm trying to be validated by being perfect.
SPEAKER_02If I produce and you know, artwork's a good example, the more amazing of something that I produce and design and you know help co-create, then I don't know, the better perceived what was the word, value and better validation. Yeah, better I'll be better validated and higher perceived value to I don't know, friends, family, the general public, if I nail it, and if I don't, I'll fall short.
SPEAKER_00But to to be honest and mean this with respect, go for it. How does somebody else's opinion of you and what you do outweigh the value you put on yourself and what you do? Yeah, I don't think it outweighs. Well, it doesn't in this conversation, because you're sitting there going, I need validation from all these external factors without looking at going, okay, well, how do I validate myself? And generally, when we look at things, there's a hierarchy. And we'll talk about this, I reckon this will come up multiple times because it's uh it fits with so many things. There is a hierarchy for value, right? In terms of internal value. So uh I I've had clients before that have listed other things that they value ahead of the things that they think they should.
SPEAKER_02Yeah, you told me that we mentioned that last week, didn't we? My car, my friends, my family, whatever, but not themselves. Is that what it was?
SPEAKER_00Yeah, so then validation is the same. How do I validate myself? How do I value myself enough to say, okay, well, this is um the thing that's most important to me. And you know what? This was actually a really great conversation. We recorded, we put it out there for people to connect with, and it will connect with the people that it connects with. It won't connect with everybody, and that's not the point. Can't and and I've said this to you before. Did you swear? No, no, I didn't. What did you say? I was about to say can't. Um, you said can't.
SPEAKER_02But you said the plural of can't, which is can't. It came across like you just swore at me. I absolutely did not swear. That's an explicit rated podcast. You can do that here. I would actually um I would own that if I did. Um last week you said, well, it's the only thing, and I said one of the only things we'll go back and check the transcript. I 100% said what I said. We're gonna go back and check this transcript. I think you just swore at me.
SPEAKER_00I didn't mean to.
SPEAKER_02Okay. You know you hurt my feelings.
SPEAKER_00Yeah, well, now you just threw my train of thought. So stop being a little bitch. Yeah, well, um, yeah, I can't even remember what I was saying now. Uh yeah, good one. Good one, John. What I'm buddy. You'll get it, you'll get it back. Yeah, at some point. Just sit with it. Yeah, it's not coming.
SPEAKER_02Do you want to move on?
SPEAKER_00Yeah.
SPEAKER_02Okay. Hey, this is life bumps and bruises. There's uh there's very real-time evidence of some bumps and bruises.
SPEAKER_00Here's one thing I would say. Tell me. Right? Oh, you remembered it. No. About what just happened. The difficult part is when we're uh listening to people, we jump in too quick. Right? And then the gold is lost in what that person was about to say. And it happens so often. Don't be afraid to resist the three-order test your skill. Just because you know some stuff doesn't mean you should be sharing it. Right? Uh and it's the same thing like um with the podcast, right? If I tell every single Tom, Dick, and Harry what I'm doing before I do it, they're gonna give me their reason why I shouldn't do it. Well, you know what, I actually don't care. That's your opinion. That's cool, and I respect your opinion and I love this one the smile and not. Yeah, yeah, thank you so much. Yeah, big smile, my face, yeah, bro. No worries. And and walk away, right? Because they're not living my experience, and uh, just because their fear is to public speak or something like that, they're not gonna do it. That's their choice, that's not mine. Um, and that's the difference in value. Do I value what I'm saying? Yes, because I've seen the outcomes that it brings to people. Does that mean it's going to land for every single person out there? And no. And I'm okay with that. I'm okay with that. Maybe you're not, but I'm okay with that. You know what I mean? Yeah. So so realistically, you can be as perfect as you like, it's not gonna matter.
SPEAKER_02That's true. Do you know as you were saying that it's you're talking about where you butt in and you come up with a question. Well, what was the quote used? There's something about thrill, seek the thrill. Yeah, resist the thrill to test your skill. Right. So you'll be talking and I'll be like, oh, I've got a really comment or a question that I want to jump in. And so I just sort of jump in and then I can come across a bit rude. But if I sit on it for so long, then what I'm gonna be doing is trying to remember my question or my comment as you're talking, and then that two things happen. Either A, I forget what I was gonna say, which is probably okay now that I think about it, or um Oh forgotten. Yeah, see, there you go. I've just forgotten what I was gonna say. Or oh, I've had brain frog. Frog. Yeah, that's what you said last week.
SPEAKER_00Yeah, good on you. So, what about this? Yeah, just so that everybody can understand what's going on here, right? Joel has a laptop on his lap. Joel could have written down what he wanted to say, and then re come back to it. Hey, I want to circle back to what you were saying before, and then you say whatever it is you want to say. I get that you're buttoning because uh it may have come across really interesting. Um but I I think um sometimes we we need to listen with the intent of listening, not listen with the intent of um waiting for my turn to speak because you said something that sparked an interest in me. Um and I know we're getting off topic, but ultimately that's um that's important to understand. Uh and it's uh coaching, counseling 101, right? Listen, listen, listen, listen. Don't talk. The more you talk, the more gets lost. You know, when you um learned this about um so the Chinese have the the Chinese uh traditional Chinese medicine has this um process, it's called uh the five elements. All right, they're really cool. If you want to check them out, they're really um amazing and they connect really well with everybody. Now, when the discussion was had and they say this about the Tao as well, when they when they um when they talk about those types of things, they say the more I explain it, the more gets lost. Right? And I feel like that that generally happens a lot when we're with people, the more gets lost, the more you don't listen. The more you interrupt, the more that gets lost. The connection goes. And you know you felt it before with somebody else, it's done the exact same thing, where they've interrupted you, you're not finished, and then they and then you lose your train of thought, and you're like, I had something really cool that I wanted to say, uh, that would have landed really well with that person, or would have landed really well in the conversation, and it's gone purely because they didn't resist the thrill to test their skill. Can I talk now?
SPEAKER_02I do think that's gotta end up in the principal's office, mate. Do you think that's got a bit to do with the fast-paced social media world that we live in where everything's gotta be uh an instant impact that we're we don't allow ourselves as much time to absorb everything because we're all go go go? Oh look, jolly jolly. Uh-oh.
SPEAKER_00Oh maybe. Maybe this one will be a difficult one to swallow for some people. And I'm not maybe it's got nothing to do with that, but maybe it is that we become self-centered as a society, in general. But you know, the the more that we have to uh survive in the spaces that we're in, the more we're going to be self-centered for that. Uh and and that's I think a really difficult thing to understand. It doesn't mean you're selfish, right? It's more a self-centeredness where the only thing that matters is what I'm thinking and what I'm saying and what I'm doing, which is really interesting. But I I'd that's my take on that. Social media is just an extension of what we do and who we are becoming. Are we fake a lot on social media? 100%. Yes. But um but that's what we want to put out to the world. That's like perfectionism, right? For you, that's what you want to put out to the world because you want to be good at something. But that presupposes that you're not good. That's not true. That's what you tell yourself, but that ain't true. That's not true. You're good at so many other things, right? And we can list we could list heaps of those things. You could do it yourself, whether you choose to believe that or not. But ultimately, uh I I think the stories we tell ourselves and the way we portray ourselves externally is what impacts the connections that we have. And then, because it impacts the connections we have, because we are we are beings that need tribes, right? And when our tribe kind of pushes us out, um, which has literally happened to me recently in Site Sport, uh which is really cool because it led to something really amazing for me. Um sliding doors moment. No, uh to be honest with you, I I wanted to make that decision, I couldn't. And then it happened for me, which was excellent.
SPEAKER_02That's a weird way to say you got fired. No, I didn't get fired. I've been relocated to a different area of my life. Uh uh, you know what?
SPEAKER_00Based on that, you're bringing up a lot of stuff for me here, Jolly. Yeah, I'm a very good counselor. Shut up. Um I think the most difficult part about decisions is when you've already made the decision, but now you have to find a way to live with it. And that's what happened for me. I'd already made that decision, but I wasn't at a point where I could live with it. So I know we're getting off topic, but uh but again, that's the way we portray ourselves, you know? The story I was telling myself. I'm not ready yet. Well, yeah, I was. Why didn't I make that choice? Because of lots of different factors that were external for me. All of the factors that were involved in my choice to live with the decision I had already made internally was all about external factors, and I put my value below them. What I wanted for myself, what I want to experience, what I want to do below them. So uh, yeah, it's uh I think that that's really what it comes down to. You've already made your choice, you already made your decision how you can live with it. I know we kind of got off topic there, but but this whole show's on topic.
SPEAKER_02That's okay. We'll see where it leads. All right, we might move on to segment number two, which I've called rewind. So that's where we go back to last week's episode and unpack something that stuck with us or came up in our DMs, which you are more than welcome to fire into us. Um we've got the lifespumpsbruises at gmail.com and we are on both Instagram and Facebook under the same name. So this time we're going to go back to last week's episode, which was Joel versus IKEA. And the topic, Luke, I want you to expand on is that's interesting. You said that's interesting between the 25-minute mark and the 26-minute mark, give or take. Yeah. Uh, and you said all these different questions start coming through our head, right? When sometimes we need to just go, and this is my go-to, right? That's interesting. So, my question to you is why do you think it's important to respond with curiosity instead of judgment? And how does that interesting help with that? Why are you big on that's interesting?
SPEAKER_00Uh, there was a client that came in here one day that said something about um giving somebody three seconds. Uh trying to remember the context, but I can't really remember it. But either way, it doesn't matter. Um, they were talking about maybe they saw somebody talk about three-second rule by allowing somebody to have three seconds. I think that we should have three seconds for ourselves before we respond to things, otherwise we look like we're reacting. So uh I like that's interesting because it gives me that three seconds, right? To to and and whether you understand it uh consciously or subconsciously, you're giving yourself time to catch up, and in that way you're able to find a uh a response rather than a reaction. Does that make sense to you?
SPEAKER_01Yeah.
SPEAKER_00So that's interesting, it's a really good one for me. Um, what was the other part of your question?
SPEAKER_02Uh, why do you think is important to respond with curiosity instead of judgment? And how does that interesting help with that? That was the question, yeah.
SPEAKER_00Yeah, okay. So if we don't if we don't use curiosity, okay, then what generally happens is we can we we we take a stance on something that may not even matter. How many times have we seen an argument come out of a nothing conversation just purely because somebody was holding a stance instead of saying, hmm, that's interesting, tell me more. Right? Tell me more. I want to know more, right? So that way, one, you're giving yourself time to pull pull the information together, two, you're learning more about that other person you're with, and three, you're going to be able to probably learn something new if you give yourself an opportunity to. But how often we don't do that?
SPEAKER_02I think that's really now that I think about that in my own life, that is so true when your partner or significant other will say something and you'll snap back an answer because you're busy and rush, and then they don't like your tone, so they'll snap back something to you, and you're 100% correct. All of a sudden you're in this argument, like, how the fuck did this start?
SPEAKER_00Um I do the same thing with with uh uh when when people come to me with problems, right? Uh and generally they'll come to you with a problem, but it's not the problem, it's just a problem. Oh, yeah, it's generally a superficial one, right? Uh, that they think is the overarching issue, but it's hardly ever. It's more than likely just a superficial one, then then you've got the underlying cause of the problem. So then when you say to somebody, that's interesting, tell me more about that, um, then they dig deeper, and there's generally a few different layers that they can go through. Um, but then just like you did today, perfectionism, then not enough, then validation.
SPEAKER_02Ah, you've spoken to me with the thing's not always the thing. So it's like you come in, you talk about the thing, you're like, if that's bullshit, that's bullshit, that's bullshit, that's bullshit. Okay, you've dropped your there it is. That's the thing. That's that's really good.
SPEAKER_00None of it's really bullshit, but it yeah, you know what I mean, though, right?
SPEAKER_02Like it's the tangent until you really get into the crux of what we mean.
SPEAKER_00Yeah, yeah. That's where you're at. That's what you're willing to accept as the problem, but it's not necessarily their problem. Um, and so uh if we look at this and we say, okay, we use you as an example of what you discussed today, perfectionism, not good enough validation. Yeah, your validation has caused you to feel like you're not good enough. So then I move into perfectionism because if I'm perfect, people will tell me that I'm great. And so then all of a sudden, now we've learned so much out of our just allowing you to speak, right? So that's where curiosity is so cool because we get so much more than the than the uh the superficial jargon that most people talk about. It's it's no different to when we we go to a party and you meet somebody new or something like that, and you're chatting away. First thing everybody asks is what do you do? Yeah, they don't ever ask who you are. So um Oh, that's a topic for another day. Yeah.
SPEAKER_02What do you what do you do? That is the standard. Well, again, we're gonna talk about that probably next week about identity. But that is why is that the first question? Yeah, what you know, hey okay, good things, mate. So what do you do with yourself? Because it's the safest option, yeah.
SPEAKER_00Which is the same thing as when somebody comes to you with a problem, it's the safest option.
SPEAKER_02I got told once to a better question rather than I hey, what do you do for work? Is um what keeps you busy? Do you like that one?
SPEAKER_00Yeah, yeah. Uh I like things like um uh what are you into? Um what is it that you um what is it that excites you? Stuff like another sort of a that's a question I would get away with, but most people wouldn't have the courage to to ask. Um so tell me what's been happening for you lately is another really good one because we're not just talking about the thing I'm doing. I'm actually I personally am actually curious. What's been happening, mate? You know, and then generally then I have to resist the thrill to test my skill, right? Because then I will then go, my mind goes straight into oh, so you're experiencing this problem. I can already see it, just no Luke, no Luke, don't talk, don't talk. Um and and it fires off a whole different thing because um I learned early on, and took me a bit to and uh to learn this, and I tripped over it quite a few times, that um sometimes, and this is why I have this sometimes you have to resist it through a test skill because not everybody wants to be therapised, right? Is that a word? I don't know, but I just made it up. Like it, get around it. We'll trademark that one. Um and uh sometimes they just want to talk and it's okay.
SPEAKER_02Let them talk now. I thought as you're talking of like that quote, was it resist the thrill to test your skill? Yeah, I thought I'm gonna caption that and snip that up and put it in social media, and then and then you came up with some people don't want to be therapised. I thought that's gonna be the quote of me. Because you and I have this this text war that goes on when we call each other fuckheads, and I thought, he's not I don't ever do that. No, well, whatever. But story for another day with point of the whiteboard, and um, and you're very dominant and very good at winning and convincing people to do what you want them. And I thought, yeah, but you know what? I still run the social media account. Um, yeah, like brain frog. Yeah. Um good, we've relaxed into this episode, which is good. Want to move on to segment three? This is Luke's toolkit, something you can actually use. So, Luke, last week you gave listeners practical strategies they can try in real life. Uh, I think it was the swaying of side to side and being sued like we're a baby basically. Um, and not just talking about a problem, but helping people build coping tools where we can keep it simple, actionable, and real. What have you got for us this week on Luke's toolkit?
SPEAKER_00Well, okay, so um, yeah, I don't know. So I think that get around it. Uh I think that when we talk about some of the things that uh we've discussed here today, I think that one major thing that doesn't do get done enough for people, I'm the same, nobody's any different, uh, because we just hopping from one thing to the next, is we never really question ourselves at all. Right. And so a a good way of going about that might be to uh say if I do this thing, what will it give me? If I do this thing, how will I feel? How will that make me feel? Right? I think that that's that's important because we're feeling beings, we're not just thinking beings, and but our emotions will generally take over everything anyway. So what I feel most uh connected to, what makes me feel the most, um whatever makes me feel better, whatever makes me feel happiest, I'm going to do. Right? And it'll always trump the the thoughts. And I think that there's been a really big push on in the past around controlling emotions through thinking. I'm not a big fan of that. You're allowed to feel, you're supposed to feel, feel, please feel, um safely. Um, but I think um uh questioning yourself and asking yourself, you know, if I do this thing, how will it make me feel? If um uh if I do this thing, what will it give me? Uh so let's use your situation, what we discussed today. If I if I um and we kind of did it, but in a different way, didn't do it the same way as we would normally do it. But uh if uh if I'm perfect, how will that make me feel? Right? And then what would you say? If I if I am perfect, how would that make me feel? Yeah, if what I did now is perfect, how will that make you feel? Valuable. Valuable. And if you felt valuable for the rest of your life, how would that make you feel? Content. There you go. So now we're at a feeling of contentment, right? We've gone on a couple layers only. I would feel valuable and I'll feel contentment. So realistically, what we're really looking for out of perfection is to feel valuable and to feel content, right? Cool. Do I need perfection to feel those two things? No, you don't. You're just using perfection as a vehicle to feel those things.
SPEAKER_02So that's the questioning of, I guess, that value system.
SPEAKER_00Yeah. Right? And then it changes the belief system that I have to feel I have to feel that I'm perfect to feel valuable. Which we all know isn't something that is uh attainable because once you start to feel like you are perfect, you then there's always the next thing that I need to be perfect at. Or I need to be even better than what I was before. Yeah, yeah, yeah.
SPEAKER_02Often say that with wealth, don't you? You know, once you get to a million dollars, for example, some people go I don't know, I wouldn't know. No, I know, but I'm I'm just using it as an example. People would become millionaires and then just go, well, now I've got to get to 10. Like you constantly want to move up in class, I guess. Like it's it'd be never-ending. You're constantly chasing, you never actually accept where you are and be okay with it. It's um you're very convincing, Luca. I would follow you to the ends of the earth. Convincing. As you were doing that, I'm like, I've got a question. I'm like, you just told me I've got a laptop, so I start banging to my keyboard, writing down questions. Gee, I hope I hope this stuff you teach us is right because I try to do everything, and I'm gonna come back to you even spoke before when we're talking about the podcast and me putting myself out there and being vulnerable and they saying, yep, people are probably gonna come into my life a little bit and understand a little bit what I'm about. I thought about the Richard Branson quote that you told me. What's the worst that can happen and can I handle it? And I'm like, what's the worst that can happen? Like, are they gonna find out I'm an okay handyman and you know that I piss off my wife from time to time and I'm a little bit inappropriate, and maybe I butt in and sometimes I'm arrogant or brash or whatever it might be. And I'm like, oh fucking, I'm okay with it. So I want to thank you for that. Like uh, you really do help me, which I believe you are going to help other people as well. And even if it's just uh that episode was complete shit, but that two minutes was gold, I think that's okay.
SPEAKER_00Yeah, yeah. I think um, thank you for saying that, Jolly. I think um uh I don't know, I think when we we get lost in it all, don't we? Really. Get lost in it all. Everything. You think about what you're just saying before about you know, you know, might be brash, might be arrogant, whatever. Ultimately, you can be whoever you want. That's a choice. Be whoever you want. You will attract what you're being to you. Are you okay with that?
SPEAKER_02Just on the brash and arrogance, sorry. I don't believe that I am that anymore. I believe I have been that in my 20s, and I but I believe that is how I have been perceived, whether or not it's still current or it was in the past, and you know what you know, what you're being judged on as 22 is not who you are at 39, right? But I still carry those comments and remarks in my head with me, and it's possible that just like your cells regenerate every whatever it is seven years, that I'm a completely different person now than I was when I was 22, which always makes it interesting, and you would know this from sports when you run into someone that you played sport against for me, cricket, for you, baseball or softball, that you played against 20 years ago when you're in your late teens or early 20s, and to be honest, you're probably an arsehole because you're a competitor and a winner, or you want to be those things anyway, and you're like, please don't judge me for the person I am on the field as when you see me out in the bar because they're not the same person.
SPEAKER_00Yeah, I also feel like sometimes the environment brings that out in you. Uh what do you mean by that? So, like uh I had this similar experience. I I blew my knee out and I wasn't able to play for a long time, and then uh and I started to study and work on myself um because like what you're saying, um had a a problem with uh that whole competitiveness and then how I was perceived. And um the I actually felt that way about my wife's um parents. They knew what I was like when I was younger, but then when Joanne and I started dating, we um I felt like that was the way it was. And so then I had to sort of do some work on that with them uh and then allow them in. So then when um so then everything was okay. So I wasn't able to play. A friend of mine um talks me into coaching again, right? And I'm like, oh I don't know, man. It's like, yeah, come on, come back and coach, it'd be really cool. So we coach. And I felt myself becoming the person I was before I did all that work inside that. Right. Now the the time that I had spent in that space just came back because it was like, but this is how I know how to win. But there were so many different ways to do that. And I I went back there straight away. And then it happened again. And it was just like, oh, this is a lesson that I hadn't learned yet. Right? Because outside of that space, I'm not that. I'm not. And my closest friends would would know that about me. The ones that are sitting there going, well, nah, Luke, you like that all the time. That's because you only see me in that environment.
SPEAKER_02Yeah, yeah. Yeah.
SPEAKER_00So um, and that's okay. Believe what you like, it's alright. Um, and I'm not trying to sway anybody, but it's more like I need to be more aware of who I'm being in an environment. Right. And so um, if I don't question myself around that, uh, what do I want to give when I'm coaching? Who do I want to be when I'm coaching, then I will continue to make those same mistakes. Um again, we all need to question ourselves. Um Yeah. I know I kind of got off topic again. Jesus. This is this podcast, you're bringing it out of me, mate.
SPEAKER_02Well, you scared the shit out of me before because I was fiddling with the mic and you were giving me these death stares like you're gonna stuff the audio. Yeah. And I I bet you it came up. I bet you it came up. That's okay. We're imperfect.
SPEAKER_00Uh oh, we're imperfect now, yeah. But at the start, we're working on perfection.
SPEAKER_02Fuck. Geez, you make a lot of good points.
SPEAKER_00Get around it. Anyway.
SPEAKER_02Well, yeah, I can't control everything that happens here, but I feel like reworking text things I can just rework until they are perfect. But I'm okay with this coming across as um, I shouldn't keep saying imperfect because there's another podcast called the Imperfect, so I don't want to sort of encroach on their territory. Speaking of off topic, I um I told you I was researching other mental health podcasts to see who our, I don't know, SWOT analysis type thing, who our competitors are, whatever. And uh there's like one other all-male hosted mental health podcast. Now, I joked earlier that I'm a good counselor, I'm not a counsellor, I'm just a dude, you're the counselor. Um, I've got the lived experience and you bring the expertise. But there is um there's one other podcast called The Imperfects, which is great, by the way. I'm happy to give that, like they are awesome. Um, run by Hugh Van Kalenberg, hosted by Ryan Shelton, and also co-hosted with his brother. Uh I think his name's Ryan, but I'm gonna get that might be wrong. Um, and then outside of that, every other podcast was hosted by women. So we might be already the number two all-male hosted mental health podcast out there. So we might just start saying that until someone tells us I was.
SPEAKER_00That's um why is that? I don't you know, uh, I think it might actually come back to the old saying, little boys should be seen and not heard.
SPEAKER_01Oh yeah.
SPEAKER_00I don't know. Um men handle things differently anyway. Um we try and squash feelings, don't we? I mean, we don't really talk much about them until it boils over, but uh I don't know, maybe I don't know. We we go off and do different things. We're more physical. Yeah. Uh I don't know.
SPEAKER_02But I I think you've hit the nail on the head somewhat, is that the stigma around it is that men typically aren't as good as talking about the shit that I'm talking about and the feelings, the anxiety, the emotions that boil up. And even if they are, they certainly aren't going 20 steps ahead of that and producing a podcast and putting it out to the world that now gets listened to people in America that I've now worked out. Like that, you know, I I sort of get that and understand it, but that probably means that there's a niche there absolutely for us to be heard by those very people because again, I reckon I'm a reasonable judge of what is interesting, and I think well, that's what we're giving people. It's interesting, it's relatable, and yeah, I'm gonna fucking uh you know tell people about how I've butchered things and we're gonna swear at each other and we're gonna, you know. I think every week I say I will cut that out. And we haven't cut out shit.
SPEAKER_00No, haven't cut nothing.
SPEAKER_02No. All right, we're gonna move on to the last segment. What's our runtime, Luke?
SPEAKER_00I think we're sitting at about 48 minutes exactly.
SPEAKER_02Beautiful. So we did trim it down. So you can listen to this on 1.5 and knock it out in 32 minutes. So, Luke, uh, this is one of my favourite segments. What three things made you happy this week? A small wins check-in. Uh, this is a segment where we reflect um on the little things, the moments that might otherwise get lost in the chaos of life, whether or not that's a good coffee or an unexpected laugh or a rare sleep-in, acknowledging these small wins, can hopefully help shift our focus from what's going uh wrong to what's going right. Luke, what are the three things that made you happy this week?
SPEAKER_00I don't want to put them in an order, but I will say one of them is the freedom to be able to do this podcast. Um I am very grateful for everybody who has reached out already and said that they enjoyed it because our um our views are actually growing every day, which is great. Um so thank you everybody for the feedback. Uh another thing that I'm very grateful for is um uh the people that I'm studying with at the moment. Uh is that the mind body kinesiology? The mind body medicine kinesiology. Yeah, uh they uh continually offer new insights in the way we can look at different things or come from different walks of life, which is really cool, spread across the country. And uh they they just offer a different way of looking at things, um which I enjoy. And lastly, um I mean it, but I'm gonna make a bit of a joke. Right? I do mean this one. Um but Joanne, I do value you, uh and I do respect everything you do for me to be able to do the things I do. I'm very grateful for that. Um when we did this last time, uh Joe's like, what about your bloody wife? Oh Joe, I thought it goes without saying, I tell you every day, no, you don't alright. Um so uh there's your five seconds of fame, Joe. I do I do uh respect you and I am very grateful for all the time you take um up to look after our family and all that sort of stuff to give me the freedom to do the work I do and and to to do this podcast and a whole bunch of other things that I'm into. So thank you very much, Joanne. Yeah, that's awesome. What about you, Jolly?
SPEAKER_02Uh yeah, my three uh so number one, again, in no particular order, is we launched the podcast on Apple and Spotify, which was a you know pivotal moment. This podcast is actually being heard by people, and there was a fair bit of groundwork and chaos that you know led into that with uh we had corrupted files, and can we talk about who we butchered them with? It was yeah, let's just say it, audacity issues. So it took a lot of hard work and then setting up the social media and then you know trying to promote it, but we're um we're out there now, and I think we've broken the back of it in terms of templates and whatever else. So I um and the feedback's been really good, like not overwhelming, not underwhelming, just whelming right in the middle. You remember that? You remember that quote? Can you ever just be whelmed? So that's um that's been awesome. Number two, I played golf this week, always liked playing golf. Um, you know, five hours outside and get the um the steps in at Keringle Golf Club where I'm a member. So that's um that was great. And number three is simply this hour recording with you is genuinely my favourite time of the week. Um, and I think I touched on earlier, but uh there wouldn't be too many people where Tuesday morning is the favourite time of the week. So they're my three things. And I got a sneaky fourth that happened um that happened on the walk this morning. I I'll post on the socials as well. But I uh was walking my dog Sasha just uh I did what you tell me to do. I'm like, what does my body need? Well, my back's sore, I'm just gonna go for a walk. So I did that and I looked up and there were I think they were cock or two, someone will probably tell me they were wrong, but they were in like this beautiful cutout in this tree perched like 20 metres high. It was it was really cool. So just that was simple. Beautiful, yeah. Nice, easy win. I reckon we're done.
SPEAKER_00I think we are too, man.
SPEAKER_02All right, so uh that's basically it for us this week. Uh, if you've got a question, a small win, or a topic that you want us to unpack, feel free to send us a message. Again, it's lifesbumpsbruises at gmail.com. There's no and in that one on Instagram at life's bumps and bruises, Facebook by the same name. I'm gonna post during the week. I'd love people to come back to us and start to share their little wins or the three things that made them happy. Again, we're only gonna be a community if people can sort of message in and we can get this thing rolling, um, or else you're gonna hear about some other story that I did at home this week. Uh, and yeah, that's what I would like to do.
SPEAKER_00That's part part of the entertainment though. Yeah. I think um what I'd really love is is for people to just send through some topics that they want us to cover to discuss. Um, it can be anonymous as well. We don't have to share anybody's names, it's just more about uh how do we get out some of the things that you guys are interested in so we can discuss it and get different opinions. Maybe they're the same opinions, who knows? But um you know, just get it out there and have a discussion.
SPEAKER_02I we uh we actually haven't had anyone do that yet. We're probably getting close. I'll just put a call.
SPEAKER_00I got five from Joanne, remember?
SPEAKER_02Yeah, yeah. But I'm gonna put a call to ARM, someone that's not directly related to us. The first person that DMs us or puts a Facebook comment or emails us at any of those things, we will read out that topic live on air no matter what it is, and we will talk about it. How much airtime it gets, well, that's dependent on the how interesting the question is and the topic is. Um I thought we could sign off by saying, Luke, I'll see you next Tuesday.
SPEAKER_00Oh, jeep. Well, no, thank you. Thank you, Joel. You're welcome. Um yeah, that um just I was clear, I never said that, but okay. Yeah, no, no. Point the kid at point your finger at the fat kid. That's it. Yeah, thank you so much.
SPEAKER_02Is that how you see yourself? Let's not get into that. That's how I that's how most people take me around. Yeah, well, yeah.
SPEAKER_00Either way, thank you, Jolly. I really appreciate it. I hope everybody's enjoyed this um this uh episode and the ones that come. Thank you.
SPEAKER_02See you next Tuesday.
