Making Life No Harder Than It Needs To Be with Peter Miller

In this episode, Registered Psychologist Peter Miller talks us through his personal experiences as someone who was struggling with Borderline Personality Disorder, the challenges people can face with this diagnosis, and the hope that receiving treatment can give.

You can find Peter at both Nordic Psychology and Red Cedar Psychology, Assessment & Communication Remote Services. Peter also writes and records music, as music has been a big part of his identity and coping over the years, and his challenges with BPD are reflected in some of his songs. Check out his Spotify through the link here.

Peter's Bios:

Red Cedar Psychology, Assessment & Communication Remote Services

Peter is passionate about helping others develop a deeper understanding of life’s challenges and providing effective treatments for recurring pain and emotional distress. He specializes in treating Borderline Personality Disorder (BPD) and is trained and certified in EMDR. With a compassionate, evidence-based approach, Peter supports clients in achieving stability, confidence, and skillfulness through tailored treatment plans.

With extensive experience working one-on-one with adults and couples, Peter integrates elements of Cognitive Behavioral Therapy (CBT) and Dialectical Behavior Therapy (DBT) into his practice. His approach emphasizes self-reflection, skill development, and emotional intelligence to foster lasting change.

Peter understands the guilt and shame that often accompany mental health struggles. He believes that learning cultivates compassion, which in turn allows for personal growth and adjustment to life’s experiences. He encourages clients to build self-awareness and resilience through the application of essential skills.​

Peter earned his Master’s Degree in Counselling Psychology from the University of Calgary in 2008. He has been studying psychology since 1997, practicing as a mental health professional since 2009, and became a Registered Psychologist in Alberta in 2012. Through years of study and hands-on experience, he has gained a profound understanding of the internal and external factors influencing mental health.

Peter recognizes that many contributing factors to mental health challenges often go unnoticed, misunderstood, or mismanaged, leading to persistent difficulties. His deep understanding of these complexities enables him to provide insightful, effective support to those in need.

Nordic Psychology, Inc

I know how tough it can feel to be stuck in patterns that don’t serve you, especially when it comes to managing intense emotions or navigating connection with others. Sometimes it can feel like no matter how hard you try, the same struggles keep showing up — in your thoughts, your relationships, or how you respond when things get hard. My goal is to help you understand these patterns, where they come from, and how to gently start changing them.

I bring both professional experience and lived experience to my work. I understand what it’s like to struggle, to feel uncertain, and to want something different. That’s why I approach therapy with honesty, empathy, and a genuine belief that growth and change is possible for everyone. I work with adults experiencing emotional dysregulation, relationship difficulties, trauma, and borderline personality disorder. In our sessions, I aim to create a space where you can be fully yourself — no judgement, just real conversation and practical support. I don’t pretend to have it all figured out either; I’m human too, and I believe that authenticity helps build the kind of connection that makes therapy meaningful. When you’re ready to start understanding yourself in a new way and making sense of what’s

Transcript

SPEAKER_00 0:04

Welcome to the Inner Solutions Podcast. I'm your host, Jessica Heil. I own and operate Inner Solutions, a private practice clinic located in Calgary, Canada. Inner Solutions seeks to understand and help our clients by providing empirically supported treatments and evidence-based practices with compassion and expertise. This podcast will provide you with information regarding complex psychological conditions as well as treatments that are available. He works out of a private practice called Nordic Psychology, which is located in Okatoks, Alberta, as well as Red Cedar Psychology Assessment and Communication Remote Services located in Hinton, Alberta. Peter specializes with borderline personality disorder, trauma, depression, and anxiety. And what makes Peter especially unique as a psychologist is that he has experience not only in treating BPD, but he also has lived experience of it of having BPD himself and overcoming the struggles that come with having borderline personality disorder. So I'm really excited to have Peter today on the show. Welcome, Peter.

SPEAKER_01 1:27

Thank you. Yeah, you bet. Happy to be here.

SPEAKER_00 1:31

So happy to have you. Let's dive right in. I'm curious about hearing more about how you learned about BPD. And I know that we, as I've already introduced you, it's your it's relevant to your own experience. I would really just love to hear more about your journey and your story. How did you first learn about BPD and how did you know that it was something that you were experiencing?

SPEAKER_01 1:52

Well, it was uh it's been kind of a long story. I'll try to encapsulate it as much as I can. So I went through everything that was required uh to become a psychologist, uh, all the required schooling in Alberta and uh registration requirements. And uh, you know, I thought I learned a lot along the way about, you know, psych things psychological. But I I ended up kind of discovering after getting registered and working in a clinic and working with uh certain people who understood the disorder like more elaborately and and getting to know them and them getting to know, you know, like to kind of see some of my habits and patterns. Yeah, it was kind of brought to my attention, like, hey, I think you know, you you have some of these these traits, and you know, they're showing up like this and they're showing up like that. And I was like, and I was like kind of thinking, like, I was a bit, I think I was kind of uh arrogant about like my, you know, how what I thought I knew about psychology, and like I would have detected that, you know, by the time I finished being uh going through all that schooling and getting registered and jumping through all those hoops, doing all those assignments and everything, whatnot. But no, like I I uh this this person that I knew, it was a colleague, talked to me and you know, like was very forthright, brought it to my attention in a caring way. And then I I got this book about it because I was like, no way, like this can't be real, right? Like I got this book called Um Overcoming Borderline Personality Disorder, A Family Guide for Healing and Change. It was from Valerie Poore, who's the author, and I read it just like front to back, like in a in a day or two. And I just like my mind was blown. I was like, oh my, like, like I can see like the dysregulation, I can see the you know how it affects my my thinking patterns, how I get stuck in these different uh thought distortions so easily, and uh like how it's contributed to all this unnecessary drama and relationship problems and you know um impulsivity and other things that made life like way harder than it needed to be, right? And I was shocked and I was also like at the same time feeling like a profound sense of compassion like for myself. I was like, you didn't know this like all this time, and like you know, it's I can see also when I read that book, like how genetic it is, because I could see it in some of my siblings too. And I I was like, they, you know, they have it even, I think they may they may have it worse than I do. So I read that book and um and then I really took a deep dive into like learning as much as I could because it just seemed it took on this whole new relevance um for me, like personally and like in my work. I was like, you know, if I'm gonna be able to try and be a psychologist, like I need to try and be as healthy as I can and not be getting, you know, thrown off by this condition that can really wreak havoc. And you know, I really started bringing it into my my practice in ways because I, you know, I started kind of seeing it here and there more and more as I was meeting with people as well. And and um I was realizing how common it was like in in the population, or at least how common traits could be, or how common it could be in relationships that aren't working well, right? And uh and so it just came, you know, really I started saying things like, you know, it's we don't know what we don't know. And that's really a tragedy. So we need to, you know, uh if if we could be more informed and like as early as as possible about some of these things, I started getting really critical about society too, and kind of frustrated that we don't learn these things very, very much, like in I guess our upbringing, our schooling, our our parents don't know what they don't know, and then they end up passing down uh unintentionally, I think, like bad habits, right? And in communication, and they don't know how to work with emotion either. And so it just seemed like the whole thing started to seem like just a big tragedy, right? Right. Because uh, and that we could, you know, we could try and do something about it if you know, if we try to reduce the amount of mental health ignorance and maybe like advocate it for more mental health education in in in however like we could put it into the educational systems. Like uh I I'm I think I've been starting to see over the years that there's like little glimmers of hope, like they might have uh like little sessions here and there, or have speakers, or I I think there was where I used to live, there was they had this thing called Move Your Mood in the elementary school. Like they were trying to integrate it a little bit, but I I guess like in my view, it's still like not even close to enough. And so because uh I totally agree with you.

SPEAKER_00 6:42

It's it's interesting, hey. Like it's um yeah, there's still so much room to improve, and yet it has improved drastically from the time that we would have graduated. Yeah, it's funny, Peter. I I think you and I graduated just about around the same time. I think you were 2008, I was 2010. And I remember distinctively in grad school that the way that we were taught about BBD is just it's so different than how I know that the condition actually like is now. Like how I look at it, that at the time of uh graduate studies, a lot of it was taught around BBD as this like loud thing. They they talked about BBD as being manipulative, like all these really like things that are number one, are awful to call people, right? Like manipulative, especially if that's not actually what's going on. And also that there's like a stereotype of borderline personality disorder that certainly used to be present in how uh like graduates were taught about BPD, and they missed this wide variety of other ways that BPD could be could be conceptualized. And so so many people ended up not being diagnosed or misdiagnosed. And so I think about you when you're talking about how like you went through uh graduate school and you started practicing as a psychologist, and it was only after all that that you even had the awareness of, like, oh, like this could be BPD. And I think that's so representative of how borderline personality disorder used to be talked about. I I think it's changing. I hope it's changing. I like to think that, but I think we still have a long way to go.

SPEAKER_01 8:15

Mm-hmm. No, I think it's a heavily stigmatized um disorder. And I guess the way it's uh portrayed and when people do internet searches, they can see some really ugly negative things. And uh it can, yeah, you can be really demonized, which is but um, you know, I I I I weighed that out in the how I wanted to represent myself. And I, you know, I think, you know, like love and compassion is more important than kind of like worrying about how a label could affect me. Uh, I think, you know, that's what people really want is to be able to experience uh love in their lives, and uh they really get robbed of that, like severely robbed of being able to experience love and connection and uh not because they want it to be gone or want that to be uh taken from them, but because of these things that they don't know about how to um help themselves. And um, yeah, like I started to see how my partner would be trying to help, but it would be it would be making it hurt more, right? And um and then I could also see how that translated into episodes of like whatever, extreme defensiveness and anger and other passive aggressive, just all the toxic things that people do in relationships, right? And and uh once I realized if oh, if all I need to do is, you know, I can if I can understand how to work with emotions and we can like we can work together and how to like talk about these things and like uh you know support each other's emotional uh experience, you know, the odds of being like rational and work things out and problem solve goes up like just by huge margins, right? So true I mean it's it's not the only aspect of of treating BPD, but it was it sure was a big piece for me.

SPEAKER_00 10:00

Yeah, I I think everything that you said there is just absolutely true. And and and that's the thing too, is that the more that people are able to learn about BPD and what what helps, what they're going to realize is that it's actually it's it is pretty treatable. And and that's the cool thing about it is that it is what we talked about prior to starting to record today, that I'll just um let our listeners kind of in on because it is gonna pertain to this conversation, is we're chatting about the similarities and differences in terms of how you and I might go about treating BBD because we both specialize in it. And but I think one thing that we'll both probably agree on would be that oftentimes there's a what we call like a skill um, like DBT would call it a skill deficit. I don't love that word, but it's uh like where we're kind of lacking in certain skills. And if we're able to teach those skills, then generally people are gonna do a lot better. And there's a lot more to BBD than just the skill piece. But I I'm hearing that a little bit in what you're talking about of either teaching yourself the skills or your loved ones the skills. And when they know what to do different, then generally speaking, there's a lot more regulation that will be present. So what would you say are some of those skill areas that really made a difference in your functioning?

SPEAKER_01 11:10

Well, one of the big ones was uh knowing what emotional validation was all about. And I mean, I talk about that a lot in my practice with people, even and I think it applies to everybody, like even if you're not struggling with intense emotions. I mean, I like how I I heard once that people with BPD are like super feelers. They have like they feel their emotions. And uh Marsha Lena had said third, like we're like third-degree burn victims, right? So just extra sensitive. And so uh like when we feel anything good or or or otherwise, like it's just extra, right? Plus, plus, plus. So you need something that will work well to try and bring it down to something that the a level that would be kind of make sense for whatever's going on. It doesn't have to be an eight out of ten, you know, it'd probably make more sense to be a five out of ten for whatever the emotion is in that moment. So emotional validation, I guess, was a like uh I I I really got on that way because I noticed how much it helped. Um, like if you know I could hear someone say, you know, uh it's understandable that you could feel that way, you know, if if that's how that's where your mind is at, and those that's how you're perceiving things, and that's how you're you know, that's how you're making making sense of this situation. I I it's I get it. Like just to hear something like that, like really uh could bring it down like a few notches. And I guess you know, you gotta be careful to be genuine about it. You don't wanna like emotional validation, you don't want to be like robotic or just be like you're just parroting words to just to try and make the emotions easier. Like there needs to be a level of uh authenticity and being genuine about it too. I think people can notice the difference, but even in couples communication, like whether or not BPD is relevant, I I I think that applies generally. So that's probably the the biggest the biggest one. I mean, I really got into uh learning about mindfulness as well and learning how to get untangled from all the you know the thoughts, trying to get off the thought train from one thought jumping to another to another, and um getting confused about uh thoughts and facts and emotions and facts and just really understanding how mindfulness helps with emotional reasoning so that you're not getting stuck on emotional reasoning. So I started practicing mindfulness like every day. I mean, I was I was dedicated like for a good time. I was like, I'm gonna I'm gonna meditate, I'm gonna do like, I'm gonna watch my breath, and I'm gonna, I'm just gonna practice noticing what's showing up in my thoughts and my feelings. I'm gonna put words to it, and then I'm gonna keep coming back to my breath. So mindfulness was a big one, emotional validation was probably the runner-up, and then uh yeah, and other skills about like interpersonal effectiveness. I mean, uh I dear man and give fast, those were you know on the radar as well. But I mean, the biggest one for me, I think, was just trying to keep the emotions regulated so that I could just make I could be less impulsive and make better decisions with whatever was happening in life.

SPEAKER_00 14:10

Awesome. Yeah, and just for anyone who's listening, Dear Man Give and Fast are DBT interpersonal skills. You can just actually do a quick Google search of those skills and you'll see that they're acronyms. Uh, they're easy to learn, they're not as easy to apply. They they take time and and practice, but the uh the acronyms themselves are pretty self-explanatory and can make a massive difference in people's lives when it comes to how they're going to show up interpersonally for people.

SPEAKER_01 14:35

And like lately, I I mean I last year I learned all about uh EMDR, and I've been that's been woven into my understanding of things now too. And I've kind of become a believer that people who struggle with PPD often experience the those tragedies in their relationships, which are often traumatic because of how escalated things can get. They are there's often uh attachment wounds and early loss with like uh caregivers. And so like trauma is an essential aspect to this too, and uh because it can it can add so much emotional load, extra emotional load. Like if trauma, if some current situation resembles some old situation, it can bring in all this I call it a tsunami of emotion. You could have like five or six different, you know, like similar incidents in your history get your memory bank gets triggered, and then the emotions connected to those come crashing in. Um, so it makes it even harder to regulate in those moments, and it probably makes it harder for partners to be and other family to be supportive, because it just seems like the emotion just keeps coming and coming and coming, right? So family members can be really frustrated by how hard it is to be supportive, and it can seem like it could look like it's just like a person is wanting to get attention, right? And I think that's how people with BPD are often characterized. They're just you're it's overly dramatic, you're just trying to get attention, and um, you know, you're trying to manipulate people. So, but I think what they're trying to do is like they're trying to they're trying to get to a base, they're trying to like not be stuck in all of this this emotional storm. And they're trying to, they're trying to use whatever they can do, like whatever words might work, whatever, what do you know, anything to try and get to f out of uh like chaos internally.

SPEAKER_00 16:24

Exactly. I think about your analogy, the emotional burn victim that Marshall Linahan speaks about. And it's like you're so you've been through this fire, you're in a hospital bed screaming because you're in such pain and nobody's listening. It's like people are walking by and like not offering adequate help, you're not getting medication for the burns, they're just kind of looking at you and and just not doing anything. And like, of course, if somebody's in that type of suffering, they're going to escalate because their needs aren't getting met. Like that's just normal human responses. And because people who have a neurotypical brain, who have a di a different uh emotional center of the brain that's more regulated, they don't understand that this like emotions are like sometimes they are physically painful when they are that intense. And so they're looking at the person saying, like, well, why are you reacting like this? Like, why are you making such a big thing out of this? And not understanding that they are actually in this level of pain. So yeah, like for anybody, if they're in that type of pain, they're going to escalate. That's just typical.

SPEAKER_01 17:30

Right. So it's the inherent sensitivity in the genetics that you, you know, you can inherit that. Uh like I don't think I don't think the uh it's a level playing field when you're talking about um like brain, each person's brain. We inherit certain certain things, and um that needs to be kind of acknowledged and understood. So because people I think people really think like, you know, it's a brain is a brain. But yeah, we have the same parts, but they don't we don't we didn't inherit the way they operate the same way. Uh it it can be more challenging to live in a certain body. I like to bring that forward as well. Because people can be really hard on themselves. They're like, you know, I should just be able to do I shouldn't have this, you know, like I'm whatever, I'm 35 or whatever age, like uh the age equals maturity myth. You know, these these these ideas, false ideas that they should have these skills or they should be able to function in just like everybody else when they inherited things that were different and they needed to have a certain understanding and set of skills to be able to live in a functional way in in the body that they received. So I yeah, I always try to build in like that whenever I see it. Because I I think people they got conditioned to believe a lot of this, I call it maybe mental health mythology, is what I call it.

SPEAKER_00 18:47

Yeah, say more about that. What do you think of some of that mental health mythology?

SPEAKER_01 18:50

Well, age equals maturity is uh a big one, I guess. Um probably, you know, my emotional experience should be no different than somebody else's. Mine shouldn't I, you know, like I sometimes I compare it to riding uh uh surfing a wave. Like I should, you know, I shouldn't have to surf a bigger wave than somebody else. My my emotional experience should be the same intensity, right, as other people.

SPEAKER_00 19:14

And yet they're not, exactly. Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 19:16

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 19:17

Yeah. So but these waves are just some people's waves are naturally bigger and like longer and like all sorts of things, right? Like more choppy than other people's. And and that's just genetics, is back to that brain structure, that brain neurobiology. And it's it makes a a huge difference in the ability for people to regulate and function.

SPEAKER_01 19:37

I think another one is people just think expression of certain emotions is is bad. So to express frustration, to express uh other whatever uh uh feelings that other than joy and happiness, right? Yes. Uh like I think people kind of get into that. I could I call it like toxic positive positivity. Like, you know, if you're not just happy and smiling and just gracious and having gratitude all the time, then you know, you're just you're not a good person. If you're if you're expressing some of the uh other things that aren't the same vibe, then you're not. I think our people honestly believe that they get ashamed of having feelings.

SPEAKER_00 20:17

And I think because they look at some of their their peers or other family members or whoever it might be who perhaps have just more biologically regulated emotions and they don't see those same waves. Like some people just seem like they're they're quite emotionally stable, I'll say, that we're they're they're they're just experiencing such small waves throughout the day, generally, that it just looks like they don't experience other emotions. And of course they do, but those emotions are just they're small enough that it's not causing behavioral change. And so other people don't necessarily see it. Whereas when somebody has biologically bigger emotions than the average person, because those emotions are more intense, they're more likely to be seen by others. And then, yes, they get judged for having uh like all the things that you said, right? Like being too dramatic, having too big reactions, et cetera, et cetera. And then they learn how to start to judge themselves because they get invalidated for their emotions, and then they internalize that invalidation and start to have that as their own inner narrative.

SPEAKER_01 21:13

Yeah. So when people try and help in ways that aren't helpful, right? Um aka invalidation. You know, like I mean, it it's partially true, I guess, what they're trying to get across. Like, yes, the emotions are too amplified. Uh, there is the it is too much intensity for the situation. Like, so that part's right. But I mean, the way they try and get the emotion to settle isn't helpful at all. And so, yeah, then people take they do internalize that. Like, I must be just bad. It just becomes this this uh revolving thought and feeling of shame. I I must be bad for being me. Which that that doesn't go anywhere good. It's just this perpetual shame feeling that can build up. And you know, you know, sometimes I say like, no wonder people, no wonder someone with BPD could start. To feel suicidal. Like, no wonder. Like, all this emotion that doesn't have anywhere to go, like, it's not being processed, it's not being it does, it's not moving through the system. And then all this like false um sense of self being you're bad because of this, um, what's going on here. And it seems like just perpetual rejection. People don't, they're rejecting me as I am. The way I ex the way I feel, the way I um, the things that come out of my mouth, right? Like it's all wrong, right? I'm thinking whatever I'm thinking is wrong, whatever I'm feeling is wrong. And I people get to the point I'm just gonna check out. Like I'm just gonna right, I'm just gonna start whatever using, or I'm just gonna like, I'm just gonna end it all like to me it makes perfect sense, like that a person could get there eventually. I'm not saying like I condone it at all.

SPEAKER_00 22:50

I'm just saying it is so understandable.

SPEAKER_01 22:53

Like anybody in a certain I think humans can tolerate a certain threshold of pain and then and then they just can't take it anymore.

SPEAKER_00 22:59

Yeah, and each of those experiences where they are told, whether it's explicitly or implicitly, that they're bad, they're wrong, something about them isn't right, then we're just adding to that big pile of trauma, right? Because each of those is going to be uh just, yeah, like more and more experiences of feeling like something is wrong with me. And um, and trauma is a word that I think in in therapy we we kind of throw it around a little bit. When I think about trauma, it would be anything that has had a significant impact on the way that somebody views themselves, the world, or others, and has created that lasting impact where their current functioning is being influenced by the things that have happened in the past. So for people with BPD, oftentimes traumas are like certainly we could be like objective traumas, like things that everyone would think about. It could be assaults, abuse, uh, war, car accidents, those types of things. But there's also different versions of trauma, which is that pervasively like being told that you're wrong, you're bad, that something is, you're, you're being, you're being too much. Over time, that's going to contribute to the sense of a trauma on the brain, which is why, Peter, when you're saying that it's so important to be able to look at what's happening with a person in their past when it comes to BPD and look at how do we reprocess some of that stuff. Like I agree with you. I think it is vital that we do that work. Yes, people with BPD need to would benefit from learning skills so that they can regulate, but regulation itself is not enough. We have to go back and treat those past traumas.

SPEAKER_01 24:30

Yes. No, the both are applicable. Uh the skill, like knowing yourself, understanding actually what's going on, getting some skills to help yourself. I think like what why trauma is so important, like trauma treatment and knowing about it, is um because even even if you learn skills and you can help yourself, it becomes like a really a chore. If you have all this extra emotion that keeps getting dumped into the present. Yes. So like I sometimes I say it's like, you know, if you even if you learn about it and you get skilled, it's like you're still like you're walking uphill. It's you're just like you're always walking uphill, like, and that gets exhausting, right? So I mean what you want to do is so you're walking on level ground. So it's like, okay, life is difficult, it comes with challenges, but it doesn't have to be like so much harder than it needs to be. So the skills help with uh taking responsibility for what you inherited and the trauma, if you can diffuse some of those those big ones and reduce that emotional, I I just call it emotional dumping or into the present, that just makes it more doable. And when you when you feel like you know, you can you can do this thing, this life, uh, you'd have like sort of a sense of, you know, it's gonna be okay, and you have a sort of more of a sense of confidence, and you know, I can get through this. And that that's that's what people are often lacking with the BPD. It's like it's too much. I can't, it's too much. It's always too hard. And uh again, I think anybody faced with this, if you walk in those shoes, you eventually you're gonna want to give up because it's just too damn hard, right?

SPEAKER_00 26:05

Like absolutely because it try and it truly is. It is exhausting to have to live like that day by day for sometimes it's months and even years, years where people are experiencing that just pervasively. So, yeah, like getting to a point where they're just wanting to escape the pain makes perfect sense.

SPEAKER_01 26:22

And escape the discouragement too of Yeah, right?

SPEAKER_00 26:26

All of it. Like the pain, the discouragement, all of it. It it makes perfect sense. And I think so important to say though, for anyone who's listening, remembering BBD is treatable. So what Peter's talking about here in terms of the skills plus the trauma work, it's hard to do that work, but it is so, so, so worth it because at the end of that journey, you will get to a point where a lot of that emotionality will just be different. And not to say that those emotions won't ever be there. I think with having that biological predisposition to having bigger emotions, yes, sometimes bigger emotions can show up. But if you know the skills to be able to bring them back down, have those waves be shorter and a little bit less intense, and then also having processed that trauma so that you're not carrying that, those skeletons from your past into the current moment, all of that makes life a lot more livable. So, Peter, I've I've got one more question for you. I wonder if you could tell us what is it like now being someone who had experienced BPD when you were younger and now being in this place of of it just being different, of I I'm going to it would it be fair to say like recovered to BPD.

SPEAKER_01 27:33

I think I still carry a few traits, but I th I don't think that I meet the criteria for full disorder at this point. Um so I basically I I I realized that it was a thing when I was about 35. I'm 50 now. And um, so I mean I've been working on it for a number of years. And uh I mean the person who helped me I understand it was a thing for me also said, you know, this isn't treated really quickly. It take it took a long, it took a number of years for it to get to this point, right? So like to rec to recondition your your your mind and and the way you work with feeling is gonna take some time. So that was a bit of something to embrace as well. I mean, I still think it's hopeful because there is a way through it. So uh, anyways, like I I worked on it pretty hard, really hard in the beginning, and then um not so much, I guess, as years went on. But I I was able to, and I there were there were setbacks, and you you don't, and that's another like with BPD, I don't think you just get over it. Like it isn't just on and off, right? Like you the it's like you're you have it and then you try and I like reduce the time between uh episodes, I guess, right? Like so and and hopefully the episodes get smaller and smaller and smaller and smaller, like the more you learn about how to manage it and the more the people around you can be supportive, it gets smaller and smaller and smaller until basically it it's barely visible at all. And yeah, the more you can do to on both of those fronts for skill development and trauma work, I think the more likely you are to see sort of the light at the at the end of the tunnel where it's like, yeah, you know, these things can still they can crop up sometimes, but like with both of my understanding combined with, you know, the people that that know and love me, we can we can work through these things pretty efficiently. So they don't have to like they don't have to ruin a whole day or a whole weekend, or it doesn't have to, it's not something you have to stew about for weeks, whatever happened, right? Like you can just keep working on it and get to a point where your functioning improves. Like uh I used to have panic attacks, I used to have pretty bad pressed mood, and uh the relationship struggles, like it's all gone down over over time. And maybe it's partially attributable to age as well, but I mean I I really did put in the work. So I th and uh I mean the people that know and care about me, they they put in the work too, especially uh my partner. And it made it, it did, it does make a huge difference. And she's she's been amazing support. So I always like to say, like, if you have a family member who is struggling, like please like put in a bit of time and like crack a book, you know, on this subject. Um, it'll increase your compassion, hopefully, for the person, and it'll also uh inform you to a level where things can just go a lot better. You can turn so many potentially negative moments into you know uh ones that don't have to be that way, they're positive or just neutral moments, right? So there's I guess I'm just saying yes, they're hope, and I'm hoping I hope that I can be an example for that. That it it it is possible to do this thing and you can still feel a sense of um dignity. You don't have all all isn't lost because you're you're dealing with this thing. Like it's not easy to like work it all out, but it is totally doable.

SPEAKER_00 30:49

Yeah, it is totally doable. And yeah, I and I think, yeah, you're living proof of it for sure, right? I mean, you're here today speaking about this. You have a very successful career as a psychologist. You're helping lots of other people with borderline personality disorder, as well as a variety of other things that they that people might be experiencing. So you are 100% living proof. So yeah, for folks listening out there, just know it's yes, it's it's hard work, it's really tough. There's dark days for sure, and there's so much hope in it because life truly can be better than what it was like prior to starting treatment.

SPEAKER_01 31:24

Absolutely. Amen.

SPEAKER_00 31:26

Yeah, right. Yeah. I think that's a perfect place for us to be able to stop for today. So, Peter, thank thank you so much. Like, and truly, I mean it from the bottom of my heart. I think not only thank you for coming on the podcast, I I always just appreciate everybody's time when they do this, but for you especially, it's pretty vulnerable to come on and talk about your own experiences. And I just have so much gratitude for that because I think that listeners out there are going to find this as a breath of fresh air, just hearing about somebody who's actually experiencing it and also living this life worth living, as DBT would say, right? Like having figured out a way forward so that life can be manageable and and it's a good life, right? Like I think it's just um, yeah, a lot of gratitude for you coming on and sharing your personal experiences.

SPEAKER_01 32:09

Thanks, Jess. Appreciate it. Happy to come on and have the conversation.

SPEAKER_00 32:17

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