Ex-SBS Operator - “Excellence is discipline.” H-Hour Icebreaker with Dean Stott MBE

This 20‑minute icebreaker with Dean Stott MBE warms you up for the full H‑Hour conversation in Episode 289. Patron‑submitted questions go straight for the deep end: lizards and BBC war‑crime allegations, SAS/SBS selection myths, resilience in chaos, jungle weapon safety, and whether “good enough” is ever actually good enough. It’s short, sharp and a bit spicy, and it rolls directly into the main episode – so let your app autoplay into #289 for the full sit‑rep on Dean’s life after Tier 1.

You can follow Dean on Instagram, X, LinkedIn, and via deanstott.com. To submit your own questions for future icebreakers and get early access to guest lists and live Q&As, support H‑Hour on Patreon at patreon.com/hkpodcasts.

Transcript

SPEAKER_01 0:00

Hello, welcome back to Heych Hour. This is the icebreaker with Dean Stott. If you are new to Hey Hour and you're here because Dean has brought you here, you want to see another podcast, another interview here, what Dean has been up to recently and not so recently, uh then be aware this icebreaker is a 20-minute short. Basically, I'm gonna be uh asking Dean questions, which have been submitted by Hey Ch Hour patrons specifically for Dean in advance of this podcast. It's gonna roll straight into a second episode with Dean, which will be a full podcast. So sit tight for this 20 minutes, it's gonna be good fun and a good lead into the full podcast. But make sure when this uh icebreaker ends, you let the uh podcast out or YouTube roll straight into the next episode and get the full the full H hour chat with uh Mr. Deanstar MB. Mr. Dean Star MB these days. Welcome it, it's great to have you physically in the studio this time.

SPEAKER_00 0:51

I know, yeah, because I think our first podcast we're trying to remember when it was, it was during COVID, so our first podcast was actually virtual as well.

SPEAKER_01 0:59

So yeah, yeah, yeah, and what strange times they were, and they have gotten stranger since.

SPEAKER_00 1:05

For some for some, you know, I think you know, yeah, COVID was COVID was good for us. We took advantage of that and moved moved to the US during that period.

SPEAKER_01 1:13

So lots of change, lots of change, lots of change, positive change from Luxembourg. But before we get into all of that, I'm I need to hit you with these questions, otherwise the patrons will kill me. Right, and there's loads of questions for you. I'm probably not gonna get in through them all in this 20 minutes. We will roll them over into the full podcast. Uh let's have a look at this. So first question is I did warn you off air that some of these can be a bit comparable. Close to the book. Right. First question from Coke. Uh you called, I'm just quoting. You called SAS SBS veterans who alleged war crimes by the I told you, mate, alleged war crimes by their units to be to the BBC as lizards. White allegations include murder civilians. Fucking hell. Straight in the deep end.

SPEAKER_00 2:01

Okay, apparently I quoted him as lizards.

SPEAKER_01 2:03

Apparently so. Exact quote extract from a quote he put on my gonna be mixed up with someone else.

SPEAKER_00 2:11

Yeah, we're bending that. I mean, but they are who uh who are lizards? Yeah, yeah, yeah.

SPEAKER_01 2:20

We're gonna fucking bend that out. Okay.

SPEAKER_00 2:24

Oh, I I know what he's referencing. No, I I think I know what he's referencing. Yeah, there wasn't me that did a BBC one, so no, what it was J Cal87 was on the Sean Ryan podcast. Yeah, yeah, no. So Sean J Cal 87 did a Sean Ryan podcast, and later on, Sean Ryan uh did a short. Um, but where they carefully edited, he was basically out in the SES community that uh they should be defending someone like J Cal and actually was basically disrespecting the SES and the Tier 1 community. And so I put a uh a comment on it. I said, uh be mindful and disrespectful to the tier one community, and and and straight and Sean Ryan didn't respond. He he put he just tagged in J Cal, wanting a little bit of help because you know he's obviously out of his depth uh and then stopped following me that day. So I just outed someone.

SPEAKER_01 3:16

Oh Sean did.

SPEAKER_00 3:17

Yeah, I sean did. So I just outed someone who was disrespecting the UK tier one community and he didn't like it.

SPEAKER_01 3:23

Did you use the word lizards?

SPEAKER_00 3:25

No, I think lizards, I think lizards was probably used in in the original post podcast with Jay and Sean. So that makes sense. Yeah, when you mentioned Sean Ryan, it all clicked. Right, yeah, got it.

SPEAKER_01 3:36

Okay, right, got it. Thanks for the clarification. This sorry, because I had seen that, I wasn't sure.

SPEAKER_00 3:40

No, no, no.

SPEAKER_01 3:41

All right, next question, then. Hopefully these get easier on the BBC show, SAS survival secrets. Ex-soldier Johnny said one of the secrets of getting into the SAS is being a good soldier. Ben Griffin's SAS said passing selection is straightforward. He said that on HR on his first interview with me. Uh, given most paras and marines fail, are they not good soldiers? Why do most fail?

SPEAKER_00 4:06

Um, you know, a lot of people say it's face fits, and and that's not the case as well, because I've seen some very ugly Tier 1 operators go through. So that's clearly not sometimes. Maybe, maybe sometimes. Um, I think a lot of guys, it's it's all about the individual. You know, selection's very different. A lot of people, you know, tier, you know, parachute regiment, Royal Marines, all these, those those sort of selection processes, those trainings are basically, and probably the most famous one, tier two one, is like buds. Everyone sees Navy Two. See them run around the beach with the uh with the boat above their heads. And what they're trying to teach what they're trying to get from you on those selection processes, those tier two ones, is is working as a team. It's cohesion. Because as soon as you work as a team, you know, you you you can uh selection gets a lot a lot easier for them. SES and SPS selection is completely different from that. You know, you have to be self-motivated. There's actually the DS don't even shout over here. So a lot of guys actually don't like it because they're not getting any feedback from the instructors. So a lot of these guys that are failing, and why is this one failing and what this one isn't? Is a lot of them are just self-analysing. Um, and that's the problem. That's the problem. That's the big difference between what they're used to in the Royal Marines and the paras of where they've come through from, where you're running around in groups and the DS are shouting at you for either good reasons or bad reasons, to then just silence. Um, and so a lot of them don't like that, and they don't like that feedback. And also, and I got this uh there was a gent uh um uh uh uh Rich Devini. Rich Davini wrote a book called Attributes. He was a SEAL team six uh training officer, and he said, Look, we had these guys coming through, and on paper, they were rock stars, they were the top of their class, you know, they they stood out all the time on operations, they were great. But then when they went on their uh their selection process, now they're alongside other like-minded individuals who are also equally as good, if not better, they're no longer at the front of the class and they're in the middle of the class or the bottom third. And how do they deal with that situation change? And so there are a lot of things, and so what they did to SEAL team six is they changed their selection process and focused on the attributes.

SPEAKER_01 6:19

Yeah, it's uh interesting differences, isn't it, between the different selection processes around the world? Um, which you've had actually a further insight in with the Netflix show, yeah. Anyway, right, next uh next question. You said this is Coke again, he's a he's like a forensic analyst on comments online, mate and stuff, right?

SPEAKER_00 6:39

He's a stalker, yeah.

SPEAKER_01 6:40

Yeah, you said uh your you said on the Jocko podcast your commando reccue unit had a hundred percent pass rate on SF selection. Yeah, how even the New Zealand SAS don't have a hundred pass rate for UKSF, even without even without including failure by injuries.

SPEAKER_00 6:56

Yes. So I was uh and that that's that's a true comment from Koch. Um I was uh in 5.9 recce troop, uh 5.9 commando reccupural engineers, and so we're quite a small unit within Brigade Reconnaissance Force. So if any of our guys wanted to go on selection, and I'm I'm I'm referencing the time pre-Afghan. So pre-Afghan, when it was quite quiet, there wasn't really any operations going on. If we had a guy going on selection, we would be able to let that guy, we had about two or three guys go and take a full six months off, and they would have a full six months off to train for selection. They would go up to the hills, they would get themselves physically prepared, they would do their map reading, and if they need to do, you know, they didn't need to sweep off any infantry skills because they already had that. And so literally we gave them as much as possible for when they went on selection, and so we had a hundred percent pass rate, and it's purely because there was time available post-9-11. That all changed completely as we know, and no one had anyone, no one had any downtime after that, you know, because you're either on pre-deployment on tour or you're doing something else. So yeah, this was a this was true, but it was a period pre pre-9-11 where we had flexibility to let them go for six months prior to selection and training.

SPEAKER_01 8:14

Yeah, that's good. There's a contrast there with the with the bigger units like Power Edge. We put a load of people at selection, but also there's less of an app, which is weird actually, because a bigger unit, you think they've got they can release more people as well. So a smaller unit, not being able to release more people for training. When when our guys would go for training, training for selection, it'd be squeeze it in your weekend sunny gym. Yeah, yeah. So and if you're like based in Colchester or Dover or Allershot, you drive in four or five hours on a Friday to get to Brecon or get to some mountain somewhere to do your training on the weekend, then you get in back to unit and get it was uh yeah uh yeah, there's advantages to that.

SPEAKER_00 8:53

Yeah, and and we were based as well, uh we were based in North Devon, and so you know, fitness-wise, it's for the Matt reading and for the navigating and being able to understand the routes, yeah, you need to go to Brecon. But actually, for the fitness, we had a North Devon coastal path, which was brutal, brutal. Yeah, brutal.

SPEAKER_01 9:11

Okay, great. So uh next question from Coke. In the documentary, uh uh SAS The Real Story, John Macalese, who sort of mid-70s to early 90s, says how they'd shoot targets with live rounds next to each other's heads. According to online info, polit politicians, royal family would be next to the targets when live rounds were shot during demonstrations. Chris Fett's ex SEAL team six said this was stupid. Dumb. He said it's dumb. Do you think it's dumb? Uh did you do anything similar with pool? Uh uh. Uh or have you experienced anything like that since yeah.

SPEAKER_00 9:46

So what when you go on selection, everything is live rounds. Everything from there is live rounds. And the reason for that is when you're firing a live round, you'll give it you have to give it your focus, your 100% attention. You know that you know this shot is a lethal one. If you're firing blank rounds or simulated, you know, you we didn't have really simulated in them days. It was either blank or live. But um if you're firing blank rounds, you know that's not a lethal shot. I mean you you know you you probably move in your head where you shouldn't be. And so it's to instill how important and how dangerous it is. And so from selection, when we go to the jungle, we always do live rounds. And then as uh Macalesee said, yeah, we do live rounds on counter-terrorism as well, because there's no room, room for error. Yes, it's dangerous, but you know it's dangerous, but you've been tested on selection on your weapon safety. One of the biggest, going back to the original question, one of the biggest failures on selection is is weapon safety. Um, and so yeah, if you're going in there with with blank ammunition, you're not being serious, and you don't care if you, you know, it doesn't really matter if you hit that target or don't. If you're going in with live and there's live cat live actual people in the room, and as the most famous one, you referenced Charles and Diana when they went in. And I think actually, if I remember reading rightly, they actually shin uh singed her hair. One of the rounds got so close to her hair it it singed it. So, but but that that's how that's you know, you you you train for real, and so we you can't train for real if you're doing blanks. The only the only times we don't use blanks in the in SF, we do now we have like the simulated paint, is more when we're offshore doing the oil rigs just purely because of uh because of safety.

SPEAKER_01 11:28

Yeah, it's a good point about the weapon safety, and it's one of the like the jungle springs to mind. And uh to caveat, I've never done selection, I've never been in the jungle selection, but I've yeah, I've done the jungle from a training perspective, and and on so where selection is concerned and that jungle phase, one of I think one of the one of the reasons that is so difficult. Obviously, it's a fucking demanding environment, yeah. But also I think it's because the standards are so high. The standards are so high, not just about your tactics and how you operate as a team and and your situational awareness, whatever. It's when you're at your at your the edge of your physical and mental limits, yeah. What's your weapon safety like because in the jungle with anything being so close, it has to be on point.

unknown 12:13

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 12:14

We have a day in the jungle actually. You talk about situation awareness, it's probably one of the hardest days. It's famous throughout selection in the jungle, it's called the IA Day, it's immediate action day. And from the moment you set off on that patrol, you have live contact drills all day, all day. You go into the ERV, you resump, and then you just keep going all day. Um and they're just testing you on your on your weapon, uh, your weapon handing drills. And then on the very last one is a man down drill as well. I mean, you're running up this knoll. But again, with the reason for live firing, that situation awareness when you're in the jungle, like you said, you may not even be able to see where your person is. So if you can't see that person, you know, you're not you're not gonna and you can't see the target when you don't shoot, you know. Very different if you're using blanks, people might just be doing it for the noise, and so yeah, that's why we do it.

SPEAKER_01 13:01

Uh okay, question from David. Uh uh, a lifetime spent operating in chaos. What's the one thing people get wrong about resilience?

SPEAKER_00 13:12

About resilience. Um, you know, uh, yeah, a life of chaos. You know, that wasn't even in the military either. That's prior to the military. So I actually always feel like you know, resilience. I was actually guest speaking at um commander training center, rural marines, just before I moved to America. And they're like, we got pulled aside by you know the commanding officer and a couple of the training team that I knew, and they're like, Dean, how do we how do we train resilience with these guys? And I said, Look, we're we're in a different, excuse me, we're in a different world from when you and I were growing up. You know, we used to play outside all the time. You weren't allowed in unless it was literally, you know, grade five, you know, thunderstorms and and things like that. And and and so resilience was already been instilled to us as a young age. Um, and so I always think that resilience is prior to you joining the military. You know, the military then will make you more resilient, you know. But uh, you know, I get a lot of questions, is it nature or nurture? And I and I think it's an element, uh, an element of both. But nowadays, and I'm not taking anyway from the younger generation because these guys are just as tough, but they're probably some of them are less resilient when they come to the to the campgates. Um, but you know, I always say one of my phrases, you can't be experienced without experiences, and so everyone's very different. You know, how does that person react in a certain sit certain situation compared to that person? You know, you hear the fight, flight, and freeze. You know, I'm at my most calm in chaos. Um, I actually I get more upset when I'm back in the Western world and people are arguing or beeping their horn. That that gets me. Uh, whereas other people it wouldn't even bother them. But something like, you know, uh Libya or Sudan or Afghan might be it might be an issue for them.

SPEAKER_01 15:01

Yeah what you mean. Um, okay, question two. Uh you talk you talk a lot about excellence. This is from David again. So uh he's saying, be honest, Dean. Is there ever a point where good enough good enough is actually good enough as opposed to perfect or excellent? Or does that phrase good enough make you uncomfortable?

SPEAKER_00 15:23

I think uh no, no, good enough is is good. You know, for me is as long as you're comfortable with good enough, you know. I'm a very competitive individual, you know. I it good enough for me is can you look at yourself in the mirror and say, right, I gave my 100%? And if it was just good enough, then that's fine, and you you can live without it. But if you didn't achieve what you wanted to achieve, you know, for example, I've recently just had a boxing match in Montana at the age of 49. You know, my training was very different from the per the guy I ended up fighting was 30, 31 years old, 18 years my youth, still in the special forces. And so good enough is good enough is uh yeah, it was a draw, good enough is you know, I got defeated, but I'm 18 years older. No, good enough for me was I beat him and I'm 18 years is older. So it's up to you as individuals. No, for me, my good enough might be very different from someone else's good enough.

SPEAKER_01 16:17

Um he must be a broken man. Sorry? He must be a broken man.

SPEAKER_00 16:23

The video will be out soon. I think they're editing the video purely because the guy's still serving. Yeah. Oh yeah. So um it depends if you're happy with good enough. Um but for me, it's all about how can I get those extra extra percents? What how can I get those extra those extra few inches? And so through that has to come through excellence. And excellence is is actually discipline. That's what it is. That's the big difference between everything. You know, good enough and excellent is is discipline. Yeah, yeah.

SPEAKER_01 16:51

All right, last question. Um, if a young veteran asks you how to find purpose after service, what's the one piece of advice you'd want them to hear?

SPEAKER_00 17:01

Um, don't think it ends when you leave the military. The military, I think, is you know, what now looking back, I've been out now 15 years. I did 16 years and I've been out 15, so I've almost now matched as well.

SPEAKER_01 17:16

Yeah, yeah, okay.

SPEAKER_00 17:17

And I I just think no, the the military is a is a platform, it gives you the tools that you need for when you then go on later. Yeah, you know, yes, when you're in the military, there there is purpose. You feel like you're serving your country, and then some of the operations you're doing is great, but that doesn't end there. And a lot of people think it ends there and their identity ends there. I actually did more stuff as a civilian than I did when I was in. And so there is always purpose. It's just what you what drives you. Some people, you know, they do their full 22 and like, I'm done. I'm just gonna now I'm gonna be a tree surgeon and and retire in in northern Scotland. Where others are like, no, I I I enjoyed that. I want I still want to give back. How can I give back? You know, we see a lot of veterans doing a lot in the philanthropic space. You know, they may see that as a way of of giving back, but don't feel like just because your career is over and you're out of the military, that's the end of you um serving purpose. That's not not correct at all. You've got the tools, the military's giving you that, and then you can go on and now do it at a wider scale, really. You have more options, really, what you want to do when you leave, probably limited when you are in the military.

SPEAKER_01 18:22

Yeah, yeah, I totally agree. I totally agree. Um, okay, we're gonna call it there. Question for you. Could I, for the H hour patrons, yes, could I at some point in the near future, next few weeks, get you for half an hour on a Zoom call for private QA with them? Is that right? Yeah, I'd love to. I often say to them, guests who've been on private QA call. I normally put a poll out and say, Who would you like for previous guests? I don't need to do that in this case. Get Dean, get Dean on for a private QA. Yeah, love to. If that's all right with you, half an hour.

SPEAKER_00 18:51

Yeah, I'm in California, so it'll be about 8 a.m. or 9 a.m. for you guys here, whatever works.

SPEAKER_01 18:56

Whatever classics, right? You know, in the UK. So I'm good with that.

SPEAKER_00 19:00

Well, yeah, it's it's 10, I think it's 10:30 at night back home in California.

SPEAKER_01 19:04

Uh, right, cool. So thanks for watching Icebreaker. Don't forget it's gonna roll into the full podcast. If you want to see the list of future guests and submit questions for future guests for H hour, become a patron of the podcast. The link is in the blurb. Um and that's it. Catch you on the full podcast with Dean. Let's take a pause. I need a little boys' room, mate. Yeah, yeah.