Why MSPs Need Community-Led Growth Now | Ken Patterson

MSPs don’t grow by selling more—they grow by becoming better. Ken “KP” Patterson breaks down why community-led enablement is the real driver behind scalable MSP success.

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Transcript

SPEAKER_00 0:03

Welcome to Talk Tech with Rob Scott.

SPEAKER_01 0:07

Hello, everybody. Welcome to the show. I'm your host, Rob Scott, and today I have my good friend KP from Total with me. KP, welcome to the show. Thanks for having me, brother. So you have been burning the candle on both ends. I know. I have. Long week for you. But tell us what the experience has been for Total this week.

SPEAKER_02 0:30

It's been pretty good. You know, uh, it's always, you know, me, especially being a community guy. Um, I just love being able to see people that it maybe I don't see all the time, right? And some of these events are are very focused on, you know, this is a ConnectWise event. So only the people that use ConnectWise are at this event. You have the DatoCon event. It's only the people that are with Faseya now and DadoCon. So it's nice to be able to get out and see folks that maybe don't go to every show, but they're at this specific show. So get to see some people that maybe I don't see all the time, um, as well as the regulars like yourself, who I see quite a bit on the road. Um, it's been pretty good. I feel like sometimes these shows that are this size, you feel like you don't see everyone. And you have this people that have been at this show that I don't I just saw walk into the airport for the first time the whole entire trip, right? Because it's so spread out, everybody's so concentrated and focused and trying to do their thing. Um, so I think I do tend to lean more towards the smaller, more intimate, but at the same time, then who knows who you're missing that don't make it to those ones. But it's been a pretty good show. Um, lots of great conversations. Uh, you know, it's the end of the year, so everybody's getting wrapped up for the holidays and uh saying, hey, this might be the last last one before the year starts off. But it's been pretty good.

SPEAKER_01 1:47

Awesome. And and so overall 2025, first, how many shows did you do? Your that not not total, but just KP. How many, how many trade show events have you managed for total this year? Oof.

SPEAKER_02 2:02

Um, that's a good question. I'd have to say close to 50 if I yeah, you know, I don't think this is 47 for me. Somewhere in that range. Um it's been a variation of, you know, we did some of our own roadshows. Um, we did some of the smaller shows um that are in the space. And then, of course, there's the the Staples, PAX8 Beyond, Dattlecon, IT Nation, uh, Right A Boom. So there's those ones that kind of plug in, and then we just did some sprinklings of some shows in between there and trying some things out. Yeah, it's been a interestingly long year.

SPEAKER_01 2:35

Yes, I had a lot of fun. I feel the same way. Uh, for those of uh that might be listening that aren't familiar with Total, why don't you give the audience uh a high-level view of what Total does and what makes you guys unique?

SPEAKER_02 2:50

Yeah, absolutely. Uh is that we're supposed to talk about our secret sauce. Oh, yeah. We don't, you and I have that conversation about secret sauce, but anyway, um, yeah, so Total is a cybersecurity platform. So basically, what it does is it allows the MSPs to have a space where instead of having to go this tool sprawl-filled community that we have where there's just tools everywhere, they have one place to choose their solution. And then also, because we have seven solutions spread across this, our platform, they have the availability to understand we have customers that don't need all of that. And we allow them to do that. But the cool thing is it's one agent. So once they have the agent, they have the ability to use whatever they want through our solution. So it allows them if they have because you know customers that just need the remote protection, SASI, uh, sort of replace VPN, which we all know has been getting completely destroyed lately. Um, so having that, they can just pick SASE and they can choose that and have that for that that they have more complex solutions that they need. They can use our MXDR solution, um, they can get into our SIM. There's lots of tools. And then at the end of the day, these all tie together for the complete package of solution, the total solution. See, see what I did there? Yeah. Uh the total solution that allows you to basically cover all your bases and basic, and then at the end of the day, you'll be able to tie this all into our GRC solution that we now have for your governance, risk, and compliance. And the cool thing is that our tools are already doing all that work, so we have a sim, it's bringing that data in. Well, now that data can automatically be put into your GRC and actually check those boxes off that you normally would have to do manually.

SPEAKER_01 4:31

That's really cool. So single agent multi-service modular you can add on to it, but you don't need a new agent. And when you get it fully deployed and working and get your sim collecting data, now you can go straight to a GRC solution and start and start offering uh compliance management for customers. Yep. That's a really neat stack. So tell me a little bit more about uh your origin story. Where did you grow up? How did you wind up? How long is this route? You're the last guess. So we go.

SPEAKER_02 5:10

Um, I mean, I I yeah, I didn't uh I didn't have your typical route like most people did. Uh, you know, I was a project kid. Um, I thought that uh I learned early the wrong way. I learned that you scam your way through life, right? You know, that's just what you do. You do everything it takes to get by. So, you know, I wasn't going to college, I wasn't, I faked my way through high school to the point where I was literally telling the people at school that I was doing one job, but I really was doing another just so I could get paid more doing the job. And I was doing this for a while, and I was actually my wife who pushed me in another direction and said, This job's going newer. I was working at a Ford dealership at the time, and my wife just said, Oh, by the way, we're going to your new school. I'm not even lying. She, my wife, enrolled me in school without telling me, and I went back to school just randomly. So I flipped everything upside down, I went back to school. And even when I went back to school, I was like, What am I, you know, what am I learning here? Like, I'm I was pulling stuff down, I was getting electronics, and then I went to a computer class and started picking up computer stuff. So everybody else knew computers. My whole, even my younger brother knew what a computer was before me, and everybody knew it. And then uh I got this job at Fidelity Investments of Hall Places one day a week, intern, and all of a sudden the lights clicked on, and I just started realizing I understood this stuff and learned it very quick and picked it up fast and started to really like just everything started, it was a beautiful mind moment. It was crazy how much it clicked. And I started to learn Microsoft before they started taking off. So before uh Microsoft took Novell out with Small Business Server and all that stuff, I was reloading Windows 95 machines before they were around. And in fact, Fidelity had a rule if we find a Windows 95 machine in your office, you're fired. That's how early on it was. They didn't want any of that stuff on their network, they were all Novell. I had four Windows 95 machines on my desk practicing, playing around with it. So when I got out of uh my experience in Fidelity, um, I got picked up by an IT company that where we were that my wife happened to be friends with. My wife just plugs into everything, apparently. Um, and I ended up talking to these guys, and I didn't really know a lot about the business still. I knew about the technology and I was starting to get it. And I went to this place to make a long story short, because it's already getting long. Um, I ended up getting in that place as an in just a basic intern starting out. In six months, I was service manager, and in a year I was in a partner. So it's just this weird, crazy amount of things that happened. Microsoft tried to hire me, and then these guys got nervous, so they made me a partner, and it was just crazy how fast it all happened. But I just understood the technology, I couldn't not understand it. And I was doing things with Microsoft before Microsoft started to take off, where I was moving, I moved our whole entire company from Novella to Microsoft without them knowing. And then one day one of the owners came up to me and said, Hey, uh, did you do something with the network? And I thought I was gonna be in trouble, and it turns out he's like, No, everything's faster. So I switched everything over because we were they we also had a development side of the business doing Fox Pro, so it worked better on Microsoft. Um, so I did that. I've been I was in the MSP space for a while. We I actually, um, after I became a partner of that company, we went from being an IT provider to the it was the beginning of the MSP side of things. We started to do MSP like things, we blew up, we started to get things done very well, um, and then we sold. And then I just liked it so much that I wanted to go help other MSPs. So I went to a team logic IT in Massachusetts, and I grew them to be the largest team logic IT in the in the country. And we just had great success. And I really wanted to keep doing that. It was just one. So I was talking to Pax 8 quite a bit, and PAX8 was like, why don't you just come work for us? And we were back and forth for for a while, some funny stories around that. And um, John Street flew to Massachusetts, and me, John Street, and Nick Hetty had a conversation, and I don't know, I was five minutes into the conversation. John Street got up to get breakfast, and Nick Hetty looked at me and I'm like, I'm in. He's like, he didn't even say anything yet. I'm like, I'm in. So I joined PAX 8, as you know, and uh PAX 8, my time at PAX 8, I built their community. I did a lot of the educational stuff. So when I started there, we had 3,000 partners. When I left, we had 12,000. So in that four-year span, uh, we really blew it up well. And then I wanted to do it again. I just uh PAX 8 was getting really large as they are now, still growing and getting so large. And I wanted to just do it again. So I broke away. Um, I had a small stint at another company that you know and helped them get more eyeballs on them, and it just wasn't working out as far as keeping me there. So um, total, funny enough, tried to get me the minute I left the other uh PAX 8. They just weren't ready, and we both knew it, so we just stayed in touch, and then they finally reached out and just said, Hey, I think we're ready now. And they the the 50 million that they got didn't hurt either. Um, and they wanted to invest in community and really invest in community. I think you know I'm I'm not that I I really do believe in this almost in a corny way. I believe in community so much I just can't represent companies that don't have that full community feel.

SPEAKER_01 10:22

So, what does it mean to be a community-focused company? Like if you're looking at company A and company B, what is and company A is a community-focused company and company B is not, what are the characteristics of Company A that you look for?

SPEAKER_02 10:40

Yeah, so I mean, in its simplest terms, companies that think that their customers are their community, not a fit. For me. And listen, they all have their reasons, they're all, you know, they all have their so I'm not putting it down, but if you really want to be community focused, your customers are not your community until you make it so. And the thing about community is community is not just about belonging to something, community is about belonging to something that makes belonging matter. And that's the difference. When you get those people that are your customers or partners, whatever you want to call them, if you get them stark, raving fans of what you do and they totally believe in what you do, that's community. Like what PAX8, what we did at PAX8 was incredible. Those people, if someone said something bad about PAX8 on social media, they get ripped apart by all the partners. It was just that tight because we were truly trying to educate and enable them, and they got that. So they wanted to be able to build us up and make that work too. And it's the same at total. You know, our CEO truly believes in community, he wants to protect and help these MSPs help protect themselves and the customers that they serve. And for me, that's the buy-in for it because you have to truly believe what community really is. Because unfortunately, a lot of companies throw the word community around like it's candy now, right? It's just like everybody's community, you're a manager, you're a community manager. When I broke into this space, there wasn't a single job title called community. I created that when I went to PACS8 director of community, it was the first time that that was used because I meant it to be about what real community is. Unfortunately, sometimes that term doesn't get completely understood. I feel like it's gotten a lot better now. There are some great companies out there that have some great people diving into community and trying to make it about the actual MSPs and what they do to help them. So it's getting better. But I really think we can do so much more to make this more about them and not about us as the vendors.

SPEAKER_01 12:42

Wow, that was amazing. Uh, very well said. Um, in terms of this director of community role that you've created, and I've had several guests on my show that are in community roles, and uh, I talked to a consultant who said to me, Rob, you don't need to hire any consultants. You need to find the best community manager you can find. You want to be a billionaire when you sell Manger, get the best community manager you can find. Why has that now, since you're the pioneer of this, you're the OG, why do you think that is now the advice that uh experts are giving to guys like me?

SPEAKER_02 13:22

Well, I mean, it's pretty straightforward. If you if you make your customers better, they make you better. And it's a very simple formula. I mean, Datto started this way back in the Rob Ray and Datto really started this way back in the day. It was one of the things that lured me to Rob when he was at level platforms. But then going to Datto and taking a really solid solution that Austin had, but and then directing it from a community standpoint, it changed, it really did change things. So if you can make your customers better, they're gonna buy better, they're gonna buy more. It's a natural progression. It's not my whole thing is I hate the term sales. We all have to do it, we understand that, but why is it that we have to sell for what we do, especially what MSPs do? They need to be more like a doctor, they need to be more prescriptive. And the problem is, myself included, when I came into MSP space, I was a techie. I just wanted to fix stuff. And we don't know about operations, sales, you know, marketing, finance, all the things that we're supposed to know about. And then somehow we're supposed to snap overnight and become experts and all that. Well, if you're if you're a vendor in the space and you have that experience, why not educate and enable your MSPs, your partners, on how to do that better and do it for free? Why do you have to charge them for it? Why do we have to build these crazy things? If you do that for free for your people, you're gonna make them better. And it's been proven people that went to those educational events that I created back in the day, 30, 60, 90, 120 days out, they were doing more. And by the way, you can still educate them on your product because I guarantee you your sales folks are doing the best they can, but they're not telling them everything that you do all the time. We've we found it every time I go to events someone go, Ken, I didn't know you guys did that. Yes, I understand that. But when you're educating them, enabling to get to that point, and they know how to do it, it just makes everything better. So, of course, it seems smart to me that people should start making that advice because if you have someone out there that's for the people and understands their flight and what they're going through and their struggles, but then in turn educates and enables them and plugs them in, whether it helps your company or not, it helps your company.

SPEAKER_01 15:35

Yeah, I think that there's a prevailing wisdom, whether you refer to it as success or community or a combination, helping your customers win is the magic. Right. Doesn't matter if they do it with your tools or not your tools. If your customer comes to you and says, Hey, can I need this and that and you solve it for them, that's a win for everyone. Yep, I agree. And that was the biggest thing I learned when I transitioned from traditional legal services to SaaS. Right. I remember being on the phone with a guy who's been in MSP, runs a trade group, runs his own MSP, was a client of Scott and Scott. Yes. And he's getting on Monster, he's got his agreements, and back then we were, you know, giving people homework for onboarding. We don't do that anymore. But he had his homework and he was late on his own work, so I was calling him. I was like, I just wanted to let you know we're waiting on you to go to the next level to complete your onboarding. And uh he said, Yeah, I'm really sorry, and it dawned on me like this guy paid me in advance. I had his money. And I'm calling him to help him, not because I need money, not because the ball's in my court and he'll be mad at me if I don't call him, but because as a SaaS business, it doesn't matter about fall. Right. He either wins or he loses. And if he wins, I win, and if he loses, I lose. And that was the biggest mindset shift from being the managing partner of a traditional legal service to launching a cloud-based.

SPEAKER_02 17:10

Right, and they're always gonna remember when you help them. They're always gonna remember that. That's that stark raving fan of what you do. It's like, wait, you're gonna help me even though it has nothing to do with your solution, or well, yeah, of course I'm gonna help you. I'm gonna make you better. So, I mean, I used to always say from an MSP perspective, as MSPs, they should do the same thing for their customers. Stop selling them tech, stop, be prescriptive, help them. But if your MSP got better because you used EOS, that's awesome, right? Because EOS is amazing. We can do a whole show on EOS. But if your MSP got better by that, why are you not talking to your customers about that that are having trouble with their efficiencies and not and struggling? First of all, you're gonna game change their business, but when you do that, they're gonna say, wait, this has nothing to do with your tech. This has nothing to do, this is just sound advice that you're giving me. Now you've got that connection because you're actually helping them do something beyond the tech.

SPEAKER_01 18:07

It's interesting. You know, we had a guest on the show a little while ago who's acquiring businesses. You know, he's got a really well-funded MSP that he sold, and now they want him to go out and roll up a bunch of things. And one of the things that he says they're buying is EOS integrators.

SPEAKER_02 18:23

Yes. EOS is is was instrumental in my in, you know, my thing. I thought I was the best, you know, you always think it we're the best boss in the world. We could possibly be wrong. And then you find out you're not as efficient, your people aren't as happy as you think they are, you got them in wrong seats. And my integrator literally said to me, We're gonna take you on board, you're gonna lose two people. And I'm like, No, I'm not. What are you talking about? Yeah. Four months in, two people out. And when it happened, they knew it. The the people who were being let go actually knew that it was coming. And then I started, I had to start waking up and saying, Oh my, like, I'm not as plugged into this as I think I am, right? And being able to let go of the things that they let help you let go and do all the things you do, yeah, it's a it's a game changer.

SPEAKER_01 19:07

So I guess just pause right there for a second because I want to give everyone this opportunity. If you're not familiar with EOS, it's based on the book called Traction. And if you haven't read the book Traction, I highly recommend it. But it's evolved and grown into something that you know most uh successful businesses are running a variation of it, gives you some playbooks for meetings for accountability. We have our executive leadership meetings every Wednesday. Then we drop into our uh uh team meetings, and by the end of the day on Wednesday, everybody's on the same page, 100% aligned, fully informed. Everybody gets to hear it from the horse's mouth on whatever it is that's going on. Role ambiguity goes away, um, accountability increases, problem solving increases, and uh as your business grows, what I saw is as Mondra was smaller, it wasn't a problem. I could talk to everybody every day or once a week. As Mondra started getting bigger, like things I would say would get twisted, and and I'd you come back to me, I'd be like, well, why is it? And so misunderstandings, communication execution becomes enabled by an operating system, and that's what entrepreneur operating system is what EOS stands for. It's based on the book called Traction.

SPEAKER_02 20:30

There's a few different ones too. There's traction and there's patterns, which I'm not affiliated. I wish I was, I wish I was getting some checks from that, but I'm not. Yeah, there's Patterson as well. There's a couple different ones that you variations of EOS, but it's traction is the most popular.

SPEAKER_01 20:42

Yeah, yeah. And and in in SaaS Academy, they've created a SaaS version of EOS. Slightly different terminology, but where we have our ROCs we call OKRs, and they're OKRs around you know, SaaS metrics. Uh, but it's been a huge uh a huge thing for us, something we're you know, early in our journey on, but um uh we're getting really good feedback from our team and our executives about how well things are working, how problems are getting solved, right, how new issues are being uh raised in a productive and and and non-uh threatening way. Right. And uh it's been a really amazing thing. So you're the OG. So what happens next for KP? What are you looking forward to personally for 2026?

SPEAKER_02 21:31

I'm just looking to it, I'm looking forward to the growth side of things, you know, getting these the MSPs um in general just to a better place. And it's so hard. I mean, imagine being an industry where it changes so fast all the time, and people are giving you advice that's maybe not all correct. You know, there's the folks out there that say, do this or you're done. You know, it's it's so it's such a crazy industry. And so for me, it's getting Reaching and getting to more MSPs to help them get better and be better and understand that look, if you're not ready for some of the security stuff that's going on, cool, but make sure you have the right security, you know, you have security in place that's at least protecting your cell, your business first and then your customers' businesses, right? That's important. And it goes the same for AI. If you're not ready to jump into AI, that's okay, but you should be doing something with it. You should be learning and understanding how it works. Don't just bury your head in the sand. We all do that. We get stuck in the weeds and we're like, nope, I'm focusing here. I can't get it that. And then don't do the opposite. Don't go all in and throw everything into it without having a better understanding of it. So I think next year's gonna be, it's it's like anything else. We have all this awesome technology, but it's gonna be scary because there's a lot of security issues that happen with this as well. So just do your due diligence. Talk to the folks that are doing the things that it's working for them and get what works for you. Don't listen to all the so-called experts that are telling you that if you're not doing it their way, it's wrong because there's so many different ways to do what we do. As long as you're doing it ethically and securely, and you know you're doing it in that way, the right that you're doing the right things, I think it'll be fine. But I think things are gonna be accelerated again in the next year for all of this. And I don't know if it's possible, but I'm just waiting for the next keyword beyond AI. Because what all we're hearing is the word AI, and we understand it, it's been around for a while. It is kind of cool that AI is the first thing that the end users started using before us. That's a kind of a cool different flip. That's a whole different flip because they're already in there buried in it. And you would think, you know, we would think that's cool because if they were doing backup before we were selling backups back in the day, so easy so much easier to sell. Yeah. This is a little different because they're getting so involved in it that now you have to think about how you're gonna secure it. And that's a whole different thing. I think next year everything's gonna be about identity and data. Because now it's everywhere. And if you're pulling your stuff into these AI apps and it's not secure and it's not safe, what's someone gonna do with your identity and your data? Bad thing. It's gonna be a crazy time, but it's also gonna be a fun time. I think we're just gonna try to educate and keep people on the right track.

SPEAKER_01 24:16

One of the things that I admire most about you as a Gen X guy is that you I see you all the time hugging Gen Z people, hugging millennial people. You have the ability to connect with people of all ages. Doesn't matter if male, female, you have a way of just loving everyone and and and bringing the whole community up. As you um lead in your organization at Total, um, what are some of the things that you're doing to be effective as a leader in this world where we grew up a different way? Let's just be honest, right? Sweet. And I know Paige has been on my show. She's in her 20s, you have you know different age people on your team. Yeah. How do you lead this uh multi-generational sort of workforce with different views, priorities, and perceptions? How do you do it so well?

SPEAKER_02 25:12

Well, I don't know if the jury's still out if I'm doing it well, but um for me, it's it's the same thing that causes me to be able to connect with people in general. It's just be genuine. You know, if I'm not faking it and I don't have to think about what I'm gonna say and how I'm gonna say it, it may it flow easier. And I think that comes across when you're talking to people. If you're just genuinely trying to help and be nice to folks, I think everything else falls into place. And I try to teach that to these kids too, my just like I would my own kids. Be yourself, be genuine. There's no flaw in that. Yes, can you can you change can you change it up a little to be more professional in certain settings? Sure. I can reel myself in to be, you know, I'm a Boston guy, so you know sometimes I I can be a little gruff, so I have to reel that in sometimes a little bit. But at the same time, I'm never going to change who I am or be different for a group of people, whatever group it may be. And I feel like that that comes across. If people think, oh, this person genuinely gets my point of view and genuinely, you know, gets where I'm coming from, whether he agrees or not, I think that's that's where we have to start getting better at as a society as a whole, because we see this. You know, right now we're in a shutdown because you know, two political parties can't make a decision, they're both getting paid, but everybody else is you know affected by that. And I don't care what side you're on, none of that crap, right? The bottom line is why is it that uh two groups of people can't get together and make a decision? Right? I because I think that there's no genuineness on either side. Right. And for us here, that's what it has to be. If you're genuine, you're real. You're gonna you're gonna affect, you know, of course, not everybody likes me. I'm not everybody's cup of tea, but for the most part, I think 90% of the folks can relate to just being genuine, just being real. And I think that's where it comes, that's what works and comes across.

SPEAKER_01 27:00

Ladies and gentlemen, the OG of community, the first director of community in the channel, my good buddy KP. Thank you for being appreciated. Thanks for having me.

SPEAKER_00 27:10

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