Olive Leaves and Ancestral Wisdom with Josephine Musco

Josephine Musco holds two patents, runs a biodynamic winery, and has spent more than a decade sounding the alarm on something hiding in plain sight in most of our kitchens. She joins Almost Forever hosts Renee and Melanie for a wide-ranging conversation about getting back to basics — why longevity isn't a pill or a once-a-year reset but a daily practice, how her family's ancestral wisdom shaped her career, and the surprisingly simple swaps that can lower your everyday exposure to microplastics. Equal parts entrepreneur and storyteller, Josephine makes the case that some of the most powerful longevity tools are the ones we've overlooked.

In our Mailbag: what VO2 max actually is and how to raise it, how to weigh your social life against the risks of alcohol, whether the viral sitting-rising test deserves the hype, and which sweetener is actually the healthiest.

Myth or Method: Dry scooping — is downing your pre-workout, protein, or creatine without water a shortcut, or a genuinely bad idea?

 Chapters:
0:00 "Longevity is not one thing. It's not a pill — longevity is every day."
0:42 Myth or Method: Is dry scooping dangerous, or does it actually work?
7:07 Meet Josephine Musco — two patents, olive leaf science, and an ancestral throughline
7:53 The longevity hill she'll die on: it's every day, not a once-a-year reset
9:18 The one kind of stress she's actively removing from her life
11:24 Right out of college: how she got the USDA to back her research
13:49 The olive leaf patent — honoring her father's belief that nature holds our remedies
16:14 Stumbling into the microplastics problem hiding in your tea and coffee
17:14 Why antioxidants may be the most underused longevity tool
18:07 The story behind her teas — and the kids' tea her daughter designed
20:31 What's really inside a teabag, and the plastic-free strip she invented
25:57 The everyday microplastic swaps that matter most
28:32 The one nobody talks about: pads, tampons, and absorption
30:10 Voting with your dollars to drive real change
31:01 The skincare "secret" that's really about how you eat
31:49 The wellness and longevity trends she says to skip
35:33 From non-drinker to biodynamic winery owner
40:19 What she's most excited about: the return to basics
43:50 Mailbag: What is VO2 max, and how do I actually improve it?
46:08 Mailbag: How should I weigh my social life against alcohol's risks?
49:00 Mailbag: How seriously should I take the sitting-rising test?
51:00 Mailbag: Agave, honey, monk fruit — what's the healthiest sweetener?
54:07 A sweet surprise: where you'll find her tea strips next

Guest Bio: Josephine Musco is an entrepreneur and holder of two patents rooted in her family's ancestral wisdom — including a patented process for stabilizing the antioxidants in olive leaves, inspired by her father's belief that nature holds our remedies. Drawing on that work, she created a line of plastic-free tea strips designed to deliver those compounds without the microplastics found in conventional teabags. She is also the owner of a Demeter-certified biodynamic winery in California's Bay Area, and a passionate educator on reducing everyday microplastic and nanoplastic exposure.

A note on Prolon’s tea bags: Our filter tea bags are made from a mixture of natural wood pulp and abaca plant fiber material, oxygen-bleached (no chemicals are used to treat/sanitize the filter bag), free from plastics and plasticizers, FDA-, USDA- and NOP-approved, as well as bio-degradable and compostable.

Have a longevity question? DM us @prolon on Instagram and you might make it into our mailbag!

Learn more about Prolon's 5-Day Fasting Mimicking Diet and longevity lifestyle products  at prolonlife.com. 

Almost Forever is brought to you by Prolon, powered by L-Nutra, the longevity technology company. This podcast is for entertainment purposes only and is not intended as medical advice, diagnosis, treatment, or a substitute for professional healthcare services. Always consult a qualified healthcare provider before making changes to your diet, exercise, supplement, or health routine. Guest views are their own and may not reflect those of Prolon or its parent company L-Nutra. 

Transcript

SPEAKER_00 0:00

Longevity is not one thing, it's not a bill, it's not something you do once a a year or like you know all of these people like they go, oh, you know, new year, new me, and then no, longevity is every day.

SPEAKER_02 0:17

Welcome to the Almost Forever podcast. My name is Renee Fitton. I am Melanie Murphy Richter. And we are longevity dietitians. We meet to explore the newest trends and the oldest ways in longevity, healthy aging, health span, and everything in between.

SPEAKER_01 0:33

We are hoping to give you science-backed and tangible, easy to grab ways to live your best life for as long as possible. We also do a little segment called Myth or Method. Yes. Would you like to dive into today's? Okay. You're giving it to me, right? Um Renee usually shoots them over to me, but I'm gonna give this one to Renee today. Okay. TikTok is blowing up. Dry scooping.

SPEAKER_02 0:59

Oh yeah.

SPEAKER_01 0:59

What is it? Is it dangerous? And is it a myth or method?

SPEAKER_02 1:05

Okay, so uh dry scooping is essentially the uh it's kind of what it sounds like. It is the use of primarily pre-workout powder without any water, just like going in. Dry.

SPEAKER_01 1:17

God bless. Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 1:19

Yeah, that's what it is.

SPEAKER_01 1:21

If you're just listening to the audio, I have lots of faces happening. That sounds terrible. Why? Like for what reason?

SPEAKER_02 1:27

So, okay, so the logic that is being touted as the reason why somebody would do this, and this is specifically true for pre-workout, because let me also just add that people are also now doing this with like protein powder and creatine and other powders just going in dry. But this really started with pre-workout, and there was some, I don't want to call it logic because it's not, but it there was some moderate level of methodology towards her digestion. Right, right, yes, what the science says. Um so caffeine is absorbed much quicker and will hit you faster from when it is absorbed in your mouth. Interesting. Okay. And so, and they've actually found this. They did research with like people uh chewing caffeinated gum, and they found that it was it just really quickly was absorbed. Uh and so the logic is you just dry scoop this pre-workout that is really high in caffeine into your mouth, you're gonna get that caffeine faster. Whether or not that is true in practice, what we actually see with people that are doing this, especially with the pre-workout, is that they are getting cardiac arrhythmias because they're just it's too fast. It's too fast, too much. And that's not that's not how they're meant to be used. I mean, there's already so much caffeine and so so much in those pre-workouts. You don't need it faster than that. But yeah, I mean, you you gotta kind of trust the way that the the people who are making this pre-workout designed it to be made, and on the back, it literally says like mix with water, right? Um so so on top of that, uh, we're also seeing that people who are doing this have essentially they're burning their esophagus.

SPEAKER_01 3:16

I mean, I think that it's kind of crazy we have to explain this to people. I'm sorry. Is this not crazy?

SPEAKER_02 3:22

I actually am going to give some benefit of the doubt because unfortunately, this is the the the world that we live in now. Like they're like, listen to social media and you want to trust the people who are telling you these things and they're like, I've I've never felt better in my workout, you know? I I actually haven't seen this. This never came across my desk until it came across my desk just recently for the podcast. And I was like, whoa, this is just I I don't get it. But I also, you know, oh, think about all the other crazy things that we're seeing. But I also want to just add one more note here because when we talk about things like dry scooping creatine or dry scooping protein powder, those are not high caffeinated, right? So then the question is, what's the purpose of dry scooping those? And there is not really one.

SPEAKER_01 4:09

Protein does not get absorbed in the mouth at all. So there's no point in doing this. Like literally, it it needs the the hydrochloric acid, the very acidic nature of our stomach to break down. There's no point in doing it this way with protein powder, I imagine. And the only thing that your mouth does to fats is is just melt it. So it's not, it's not actually being absorbed, just melts, melts fat in your mouth, which helps to prepare it for the stomach.

SPEAKER_02 4:31

But again, it it doesn't, we don't even know if it really works because all of that is based off of mechanistic findings. So yeah, we know that this decaffeinated gum increases absorption, but like no studies have been done. Well, the the final thing that I want to note, and this becomes now true for protein, creatine, and pre-workout, is that you put dry powder in your mouth. Like everybody, I think anybody who has like done the saltine cracker challenge or whatever, like it's like, oh my god.

SPEAKER_03 5:04

Where does it go?

SPEAKER_02 5:06

You can aspirate that powder down the wrong pipe, and that also is problematic in a big way, um, and can cause pneumonia and things like that too. So I mean, if I don't do it too often, if I have not convinced you by this point, I I mean I give up. Um, because this is this to me, this is without a doubt a myth.

SPEAKER_01 5:28

And please stay away. Yeah, great. Also, man, caffeine's already jolty enough with with water swallowed normally.

SPEAKER_02 5:37

So the recommendation was like if people with specifically with relation to pre-workout really wanted to try and get a little bit more caffeine in their oral mucosa, aka in your mouth, right? What you can do is you can mix it with water as it is intended, and then just swish it in your mouth.

SPEAKER_01 5:56

Hold it sublingually underneath your tongue for a couple seconds. Yeah, it's absolutely a weird thing. With water though. Yes, not dry. The answer is this is a myth. Dry scooping is a myth. Um, but we're we had such a um wonderful conversation with Josephine Musco. She's on our our show, not only talking about microplastics, nanoplastics, but also all sorts of um basic but seemingly novel concepts that really get us back to our longevity roots. She also has an incredible ancestral lineage that she's paying homage to with all of her incredible work.

SPEAKER_02 6:26

Yeah, she just kept coming with more and more things that that she's done. Okay, and and as an entrepreneur, I was impressed.

SPEAKER_01 6:33

So don't stop a woman with with a mission and a drive. We will we will move mountains. And I'm very excited to see what she has to what's what's upcoming for her. So thank you for uh to Josephine for being on our show, and uh we're very excited for you to to tune in. Check it out. Welcome to the Almost Forever podcast. We are very lucky to have Josephine Musco here with us today. She is a very interesting person, holds two patents, but she also, I think one of my favorite parts is that you tie all of this in with your ancestral wisdom. Um your patents are on uh helping to justify, if you will, your grandfather's work in olive leaf biocompounds. You do so much work in on uh teaching us about microplastics and the impact of microplastics on our body and health. And we're really happy to have you. Welcome, Josephine.

SPEAKER_00 7:22

Thank you so much for having me. I know you have uh the option to have a lot of interesting guests, so I'm very honored to be here. Thank you.

SPEAKER_02 7:29

We are very much on the top of the list. So we are we're excited to dig in and explore a little bit more about what you're passionate about. And that takes me to our favorite first question, which we ask as what is the hill that you will die on in terms of longevity? What does that mean? Is what is something that you feel like everybody needs to know that they don't yet know or maybe aren't giving enough credit to.

SPEAKER_00 7:52

I think one of the main things and I've always like stood up by is that longevity is not one thing, it's not a pill, it's not something you do once a year, or like you know, all of these people like they go, oh, you know, new year, new me. And then no, longevity is every day. It's every second of your life. It's how you wake up, is how you go to sleep, is how you prioritize your food, your water. Um so that's something that people need to really be more mindful of. You can have all the pills you want, and you can have all the treatments you want, which by the way, I don't do any. Um very minimalistic. But if you don't live a healthy life, as in you're not eating whole foods, you're not drinking proper water, and there's I'm I'm a water snob. And if you don't have a um healthy environment you're in, like, and I'm talking about emotionally and spiritually, um, there's one thing called stress, and you can be doing all the modalities of longevity you want in the world that are available to you. And if you are in a constant state of stress, it's like dumping everything. Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 9:01

Um it all adds up. It all adds up, and I mean, it is an everyday challenge for for most of us to make sure that we're staying on top of that. Is there one thing that has really stood out for you, maybe personally, that has felt especially important?

SPEAKER_00 9:18

Right now, I'm really prioritizing not having any stress in my life because it I've felt the most sensitive to like if I'm in stress, I cannot operate. Yeah. And that's like obviously there's good stress and there's bad stress, and I'm talking about the bad stress and that I've been eradicating it from my life. Anybody or anything that breaks me stress, I just take it out of my life. That I mean, that's tough to do, too.

SPEAKER_01 9:44

Your top tips. Tell us what are you how are you doing that? We all need to do it. Do you have any do you have any tips for us? And just to clarify, by the way, good stress meaning like exercise. Um, you know, good stress, sometimes fasting can fall into that category. But what bad stress meaning what for you? People.

SPEAKER_00 10:02

Usually it's people bad energy. Bad energy, people around you. If you have, you know, a you know, a partner that's stressing you, uh, you know, any family member, a friend that's bringing you, like there are friends that drain you. Just like there are friends that replenish you and really uplift you. There are friends that do the opposite. And uh and I think that our partners are the most important people in our lives. And the way they perceive us, the way they treat us every day, really reflect on our daily life and our professional life and our success.

SPEAKER_02 10:37

I think that's so important because we talk a lot about community and longevity, right? And how important community is. And so I think there there could be this drive for people to just take what they get, like the people that are around them, they're like, well, it's better than than nothing. But the it's just as important that you're finding the people that are giving you that positive fuel.

SPEAKER_01 10:59

Or or relationships that you've had for a long time and you're like, well, they've just been a friend of mine forever. You know, that's a Yeah, we we grow. Sometimes we grow out of people. It's a conversation for another time. But I have a question for you. Yeah. On on this topic-ish, can you tell us what how did you get how did you how were you able to get into the USDA with these patents with this information? Tell us a little bit about that story.

SPEAKER_00 11:24

I met um one person from the USDA and she was an amazing support. She took me on like a protege, basically, and she was like, okay, listen, if you want to get the creative agreement, which is when the government gets right out of college, by the way. Right out of college. She's if you want to get the creator agreement, which is when the government actually finances your studies. They they support you, they give you like some type of um financial support. Um, you need to do a lot of research to convince this massive board that comes from DC like several times a year to Berkeley. And they look at all of these proposals and then they decide who they want to grant uh to get the grants to. And um I was like, okay. And of course, I'm a total nerd. I'm like a complete nerd. So I went went to work, and when it was time to do the meeting, uh, I came prepared, and I convinced them that there is value in what I wanted to study, and they gave me the creator agreement, and um I worked very hard. Yeah, I was working six days a week, eight to like four or five. I didn't even take a lunch break uh because I was a young young and hungry. But but you know, there's all these other there's a lot of companies that try to work with the USDA, and there's a lot of big, big fish that's trying to work with the USDA. So uh I had to fight very hard to keep my financing going, to keep my project open. Um a lot of people wanted to shut it down at certain times, and like, oh whatever, this girl, we can just shut her. I was like, no, no, no. So every time they tried to shut it down, I just came with more information and more proof that this should keep going. And um eventually I um got the patent, and the scientists that were working with me, one of them specifically, wrote me a letter that I still have, I sh I actually should frame it, thanking me because he's been a scientist for over 20 years. This was his first patent. So thanking me for including him on my patent, which was massive. And uh yeah, I think like, you know, consistency, perseverance, not giving up, uh, knowing that you can do it and putting in the work is it gets you anywhere. It gets you what you need far.

SPEAKER_02 13:36

Yes. Showing up gets you very far.

SPEAKER_04 13:38

Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 13:38

I I would love to hear a little bit more about what you did study and what the what the patent was for. Can you share a little bit more about you know what what all this work too? Yeah, yeah.

SPEAKER_00 13:49

Yeah, so my first patent was on the uh olive leaves. So my father believed that all human beings' ailments remedies are found within Mother Nature. I grew up with this, like I agree, just engraved in my in my head, in my everyday. And olive leaves, and the olive tree specifically had a very special place for him, but olive leaves were something that he used a lot. So he would like boil them and clean our wounds or give it to my grandma to regulate her blood sugar. Uh and it was it was this thing that he always believed in. So I was like, okay, uh, he passed away before I could graduate uh with my master's, so I was like, okay, I'm gonna do something to honor his life, and that that's kind of what sparked my whole pursuit of the of the USDA and getting this uh study going. And so I went and studied uh, I think there are 72 varietals of olive trees. I studied them all to see which one tastes the best because some of them taste very bad. Um then um what time of the year was the best to harvest the leaf where there is the highest phenolic activity in there, and which was actually the best time to get those leaves, which is pruning and harvesting, which is when there is the most bio waste from the egg. And then I took those leaves, so the the best trees at the best time, at the best time of the day. Because there are there are times of the day where there is higher antioxidants in the yes. And um then I took those and I ran them through a process, that's the patented process, to stimulate the production of antioxidants in those leaves, to even make them higher antioxidants after you had picked them off of the tree. Yes. So we stimulate the production of antioxidant, hydroxyrosol, and then we stabilize those antioxidants. So because antioxidants deplete very fast with air, you know, light, whatever, all that, all the environmental uh conditions deplete them fast. So we wanted to stabilize them so when the ant consumer gets them, they truly have the antioxidant capacity that we are claiming they do. And so I was able to do that. That is the patented process. And what I came up with was a bright green powder, super similar to matcha green tea, like the but it doesn't have any of the caffeine, it doesn't have any of the lead, because we know that matcha has um my gosh, I've had two matches today. Well have one. Have one. It's okay. One is okay, but you know, we can another another. We will. Um, and so that was my first pattern. A beautiful bright green powder. I wanted to bring that powder to people. And I'm like, how do I deliver this powder to people without losing the integrity? Yeah, you know. So I went and looked at the K cups and I was like, oh my god, plastic and with the heat. So I started now, I started zeroing in to micro plastics. That's I'm talking 12 years ago. I started zeroing in onto microplastics, and I'm like, whoa, all of these delivery methods that are bringing us coffee and tea are loading the bodies with micro-nanoplastics. I bought tea bags, I studied them, I bought everything. Um and so I needed to invent something that was not done before. Unsatisfied with the results, with the options before you.

SPEAKER_02 16:59

Yeah. You know, you've brought up a lot about the phenolic compounds and the antioxidants. Can you share a little bit just for our listeners, like, why is this so important that we are being mindful about our antioxidant intake? What is it important for?

SPEAKER_00 17:14

It is like the most underused anti-aging uh longevity thing we can we can put in our body. They are free radical scavengers. So they go in. Free radicals happen from toxins from daily daily use and you know, we're wearing taking it. You can't really get away from them all the time. Eating creates free radicals in your body. Um energy production, just like creating when you go out, when you go to the gym and you work out, you're gonna have free radicals. Yeah. So antioxidants attach to free radicals and they help the body get rid of them. So they don't create um aging, cellular aging, premature cellular aging, inflammation. Um and so they're they're great to keep us young on the microcellular level.

SPEAKER_01 17:56

Please tell us the story behind your teas, too, because I I feel like you have a lot of um familial stories that have blended into the to the creations that you've um brought to the market. Can you tell us a little bit more about this?

SPEAKER_00 18:07

Well, I mean, uh except from the olive leaf, um, there is the kids' tea. This one is very dear to my heart because this one, my daughter created it, and she actually drew the pouch. This is all her art. When she was seven, by the way, she gets very mad at me if I say that she do it. She had I have to sweat as I was seven and she was like, When she was younger than she is now, her skills have improved since. Although I think it's the cutest thing. It's got great colors balance. So this pouch is actually fully compostable, and she kept it intentionally mostly white because she said not all the kids like specific colors, so the kids can color it themselves and make it their own with their own preferred colors. Um, it's made with butterfly pea flour, and butterfly pea is a nervous system regulator, so it's great for kids. It's sweetened with monk fruit, so there's no sugar spike, and it's strawberry lemonade. So it's made not only for the kids to enjoy their tea, but also to replace the juice box because juice boxes like they're so small. Yeah, it's almost like a third of that juice box is sugar. So this is supposed to go in their usable water bottle and gives them that, you know, juice box alternative that's actually good for them, and it's a nervous them regulator. And the other thing is that if you put lemon in it, it changes in color. So it's blue naturally. Oh, that's so fun. It becomes purple and pink, and we add a little bit of fixed in there. There's a little glitter in there. Amazing.

SPEAKER_01 19:38

That's please. That's please. That's so much fun. I I always we we talk a lot about we I just mentioned that um our producer and I both have uh sons that are around the one-year mark, and we talk a lot about um how food and and consuming food should also be enjoyable and fun and playful. So that's that makes me happy.

SPEAKER_02 19:57

That makes me very happy. We can also can be playful.

SPEAKER_00 20:02

So heck yeah. It's not just for kids. Don't give them this tea because they're gonna be so calm and relaxed. They're gonna be so hooked and they're gonna want to, mommy, give me the tea. Again, it happens with all my girlfriends. I give them one tea and then they're like, they're gonna buy the tea. I'm like, well, that's the point. Yeah, exactly.

SPEAKER_03 20:18

You should be giving one free bag to everybody and then you'll That's what I do. Hook them in, hook them in. Get them when they're young, as they say.

SPEAKER_01 20:25

So should we should we pour our this incredible tea, which is it comes in strips.

SPEAKER_00 20:30

So they're they it it kind of looks a little bit like so. I touched a little bit on the delivery methods that were available on the market when I came up with my powder and they were all loaded with plastic, and they load our bodies with plastic because what happens is so tea bags, if if we look at a teabag, you know when you were little, have did you ever make like these paper uh boats and put them in water? Sure, no, no. No paper planes, yeah. No, but the paper boats, when you put them in water, what happens? They disintegrates, right? They disintegrate. So what tea bags are made from paper per se, but if you put a paper in water, and especially hot boiling water, it will disintegrate. So tea companies have to layer those tea bags with some plastic, some PLAs, some a little, a little cocktail of toxins and chemicals uh to make it bright white. There's bleach, there's epiclaridrine, there's all kinds of stuff in your tea bag. And when you put it in hot boiling water, all of these toxins will release. But you're drinking plastic and RT for a long time.

SPEAKER_01 21:30

So willingly willingly.

SPEAKER_00 21:32

Dang. Exactly. Unknowingly. Yeah. Willingly but unknowingly. So I invented the tea strip and it's made from the ground leaves, like like we talked about the the leaves, the other leaves, and it dissolves completely in water. So you have you don't have a carrier, you don't have any toxins. There's nothing that's not meant to be in our body that's going in your cup.

SPEAKER_02 21:52

Yeah. Do you get additional antioxidants with this because of the strip itself?

SPEAKER_00 22:00

Yeah, you are taking the whole leaf. So you're taking the fiber, which is a prebiotic, which is great. Yeah, it's also in a pressed form.

SPEAKER_01 22:06

It almost looks like um please open one. Yeah. Oh my gosh. Smell this. Oh, it smells like fairies. Mmm. That is good. Let me smell this. Smells like olive oil. Yeah.

SPEAKER_03 22:20

Literally smells. It's very earthy.

SPEAKER_01 22:22

This one is pure olive leaf. Okay, so they come in these strips. Right. Individualized uh by little these paper, I'm assuming. Yeah, parchment paper, yeah.

SPEAKER_03 22:33

And then our Oh twins. Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 22:36

We might need a little smooth.

SPEAKER_02 22:38

Whenever we get them. I I I would love to talk a little bit more about, you know, w what you have seen with people who have potentially switched from their typical usage of teabags. Have has there been any noticeable change or improvements, or what are you seeing?

SPEAKER_00 22:55

Right now we are starting to do studies on switching these people's teabags to tea strips, but you know, you need a certain amount of time before you can see the longitudinal stuff. Yeah, and also you have to make sure they're not changing any other habits. It's it's a very complex thing. The joy of nutrition research. Yes. So you girls know. Yeah. Um there what I see is people when they see it, they're like super shocked. Yeah. Like, what? Like they don't, they can't, they're like, how did how did have we been drinking tea out of a teabag our whole life? So when I bring this product to people, when they actually see it, when there is visibility on the product, it gives them like a huge aha moment. And a lot of people just become loyal customers for life. Like we have a lot of subscribe subscription uh customers, and they really like it. They like the experience, they like the fact. We have a lot of the active people, like hikers, bikers, campers. So easy to throw it in the bag. They don't want and they don't want to carry a soggy tea bag in their pocket.

SPEAKER_01 23:56

Yeah, leave no trace when you're on the on the trail. Um tell me, do you have to usually when I've drunk tea before, there's a s what we call seeping where you have to let it sit for a while. Do you have that as similar things? Just ready to go.

SPEAKER_00 24:08

Yeah. And within seconds, and you will have the same cheers. Would you like to have some of that? I am enjoying a guys' experience with somehow.

SPEAKER_01 24:18

Oh, it's delicious. It smells, by the way, if you're not in this studio, but it smells heavenly indeed. Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 24:24

And mine truly tastes like almost candy-esque. It's so good. Like I would have this for dessert. Hold on.

SPEAKER_00 24:31

That's actually the most popular one in the office. Like all everybody at works. That's my favorite one, so.

SPEAKER_02 24:41

Yeah. Well, I think mine has polyphenols in it too. Yes, yeah. From the bright blue flower. Okay, this is like you could drink this all day. Yeah. What's the caffeine like in these?

SPEAKER_00 24:53

There's no caffeine.

SPEAKER_02 24:54

No caffeine. No, these are naturally caffeine-free. Which is very important for me because I I know I just said that I had two matches, but I really try and limit my caffeine.

SPEAKER_00 25:04

Like after the two matches.

SPEAKER_02 25:06

After the two match, huge matches. We had to prepare for you, and I was up all night. I was like, tell me everything about Josephine.

SPEAKER_01 25:14

Yes. So I'm curious. You you so you started down this while we sip our tea and ha enjoy this incredible conversation. I'm just curious. You you kind of stumbled into, it seems like the nanoplastic, microplastic epidemic that we're in. Um this is a big I think we we we were kind of speaking about this not long ago that it's gonna happen. Like you can't be completely without it's just the way that our world is. It's not having any is really hard to do. Do you have any tangible advice outside of making like obviously better swaps for things that we have access to that you would suggest for people to minimize or reduce their risk of um nano and microplastic exposure?

SPEAKER_00 25:57

They are like top offenders, which is when plastic interacts with heat. Yes. So you're talking about um cooking utensils and to-go food containers. And those, by the way, are plastic. The plastic is black. Those are made from recycled uh electronics. So they're these on top of plastic, they also have a lot of heavy metals. So I would stay away from uh plastic, especially the black uh cooking utensils and to go uh food boxes. The second one I would get rid of is the to-go cups, like your Starbucks. So, you know, take bring your ceramic mug or your stainless steel mug. Um cutting boards obviously are a big one. But I would also really emphasize those pods that people put in their dishwasher because those are, you know, this is like a plastic pod, and that plastic is going nowhere but on your plates and utensils, and you're basically ingesting it back. Then we go to toothbrushes. Toothbrushes are made from plastic. So I would move to like bamboo or board bristles, bed sheets. So, you know, when we sleep, we're supposed to rejuvenate and replenish. And when we are surrounded with toxins, so if your bed sheets are polyester, if the stuffing of your pillow is polyester, the duvet stuffing, your mattress, um, you know, the mattress is is much more hard, but what I do is I get an organic cotton topper with uh downfill, so like feather. And I like to use organic cotton for my sheets. I like them white too. And um or or linen, organic linen. So that's really important. I don't like carpets. Carpets are a big offender because every time you step on them, you're you're really the friction is causing those microplastics, nanoplastics to fly in the air and you're inhaling them. Um also uh off-gasses too, right?

SPEAKER_01 27:48

When you first get a piece of furniture or rugs and then you open it up out of the plastics, there's it does what we call, isn't it called off-gassing where you it releases into the air, which is why you should keep your doors and windows open when you first get something delivered to your house.

SPEAKER_00 28:01

That's why it's important to buy from like artisans, smaller businesses, people who are doing things by hand, who care about the quality of what they're putting in.

SPEAKER_02 28:12

I mean, I think that thankfully now because there's a lot of talk about wow, we are really we the the environmental load of microplastics out there right now is just outrageous. And so I'm hearing more and more companies coming out with product that is microplastic free.

SPEAKER_00 28:31

So there's also another one that's very important is the pads and tampons. And those are those have been coming under fire first. Yes, those are close to our most like sensible parts and the absorption is super high there. So it's very important for all the girls to be mindful of that and switch to organic cotton ones and you know, make sure it's organic. Like email the companies and ask them questions.

SPEAKER_01 28:56

Yes, and especially when you have um, you know, your vaginal canal is actually an is incredibly absorbent. I mean, you you can anything you put in your body that way is going to be absorbed even faster, like by tenfold. Don't quote me on that, but it's a lot. Um so yeah, that's an that's an important message for sure.

SPEAKER_02 29:16

Well, it it does kind of bring up uh a couple questions for me. One being, what can we do to really like make a change? And I think so much of the microplastics are coming from environmental waste out there, like all of the plastic that we just are producing and using all of the time.

SPEAKER_00 29:36

At the end of the day, like that's policy regulation that we have to answer your question, also, it's very important for people to be aware. Like, you yes, you cannot, and this is not about like fear monitoring or whatever, whatever. This is about being conscious, taking choices, preventing bioaccumulation. So the things we have control of, let's take control of them. Let us not allow these microplastics to be in our life if we can take them out of our life. Like simple, very simple, easy daily habits, daily items that we can just swap.

SPEAKER_01 30:09

It's gonna, it's gonna take a long time to parse through all the places in your daily life. But I do think that it is important to know one of the I find it empowering as a dietitian. I teach people this all the time too, that we vote with our dollars. You know, you but companies will eventually respond if the masses stop buying a certain type of food or demanding something different. Yes, it's a longer road, and yes, it should come from the top down, but we shouldn't feel powerless. And I think that that's a really important message that there are ways that we can vote with our dollars and start cleaning out slowly but surely. Yes, it's gonna take some time. Um, but eventually we'll get into our makeups, we'll get into the cleaning supplies, we'll get into all these things that we can do. Yeah, makeup is another big one.

SPEAKER_04 30:52

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 30:53

Skin care. Yeah, yes, and we we're putting so much females, especially. How many hundreds of chemicals a day on our skin?

SPEAKER_00 31:01

I don't I don't use I don't use skincare. I don't I don't put creams on my skin. With skin like that? That's how you the secret. Yes, please. How you eat.

SPEAKER_02 31:08

Oh yeah.

SPEAKER_00 31:09

Heavy, I don't eat any carbs. I'm not trying to start my day with carbs. I avoid sugar like my life depends on it. Heavy protein, uh, heavy fiber. Um, I eat the rainbow like you mentioned before. And like material diet, you know, I eat lentils. I'm not, I'm not like scared of carbs, but I always make it a point to start my day with protein.

SPEAKER_02 31:31

Okay, well, I I would like to ask you a little bit more about you, you're you're quite vocal about things that you're like, this is really good, but you're also vocal about the things that are not so good. So, what are some of the wellness or longevity tips that are out there right now that you would tell people to skip?

SPEAKER_00 31:49

Ooh, I'm gonna get attacked on this one. Um, listen, I am a minimalist. Okay, I I like doing things that work, but I do one or two things that work, and I'm not like here taking poly supplementation 100 pills a day because that's just expensive pee. Again, to to go back to the to the question, it's very important overall to be very mindful when you are shopping for longevity products, to go to reputable sources, buy from companies who are doing the research, who are doing their third-party testing, who are able to give you when you email them, they're able to respond to you, they're able to give you CFAs, they're able to, you know, answer your questions and not just jump on the trend and buy anything that's on the market, especially those face masks. This is very, really close to your face, and they can really be detrimental to your looks.

SPEAKER_01 32:44

One of the things that I tell um people who work with me is the do you are you familiar with the environmental working group? The Skin Deep app? Yeah, yeah. So I I if you're listening to this, do you do you use that at all for Yeah, I love it. Okay. The Environmental Working Group skin Skin Deep app is a uh a website that you can visit and you can put in any of your cosmetic brands, your cleaning brands, anything that you are wanting to see and it and it rates it based on its toxic level on a variety of different um toxic profiles. So I love using that. You know, if I'm researching a new mascara or a new face wash, like how what is the toxic level? And if and they'll give you suggestions on ones that are that are better for you. So I feel like that kind of takes a lot of the And now they're also doing it with food, too.

SPEAKER_02 33:29

So you can scan food properties. Environmental working group is? Yeah. Oh amazing. Amazing. So I mean th they were doing that like quite some time ago, too. So their clean 15, or is is that what it is? They're top 12 cosmetics.

SPEAKER_00 33:44

No. Foods. Foods. Foods. So there's the dirty 30 and there's dirty 10 or whatever out of something. Yeah, dirty. Dirty dozen. Dirty dozen. Dirty dozen. Dirty dozen and uh yeah. So they're like your blueberries. Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 33:58

Right. Right? The things that if you are going to invest in organic food, those are the ones that you should.

SPEAKER_01 34:04

Prioritize them. And usually usually berries are the one of the harder ones because you can't peel them, right? I mean if you have if as avocados. Exactly. You can peel back the part that's been um, you know, uh connected to connect is not the right thing.

SPEAKER_00 34:19

And by the way, fruits and vegetables are another thing, especially when they're growing um like in bushes or, you know, soil level with microplastics. Um because the soil is so contaminated. And there's other reasons to eat fruits and vegetables in season too, right? And so, I mean, because we're meant to.

SPEAKER_01 34:36

Because that's when the sun is right for us to absorb certain nutrients and it is the cheapest and most nutritious way to consume fruits and vegetables if you're consuming them in season. The reason for that is that you don't have to cart them from a different country, pick them before ripeness, have them travel all the way to you. Also, when they're grown in in in season, they're more nutrient dense anyway. So And get them from the farmer's market. Exactly. And you and they're going to be cheaper, naturally going to be cheaper that way. Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 35:07

Okay. I would love to shift gears a little bit because on top of creating your tea strips, you're an entrepreneur in many ways, including a winery, is that right? That is correct. Which is so so tell us a little bit about that. And also, I mean, just from what I understand, you you're not a big drinker yourself. So I'm curious how somebody who's a non-drinker ends up fine creating a a winery.

SPEAKER_00 35:33

It was this piece of land that's like 23 acres of beautiful land with these old brig buildings, and we fell in love with it. Where is it? It's in the Bay Area, it's in Livermore. And I was like, oh yeah, we're just gonna build a house here. So plot the land. Turns out the vineyards were 70 years old. Urlem vineyards, transported from like Germany and France and whatever. So like the most beautiful grapes, and they're dry farmed. Dry farm means the grape has to work extra hard to create the the vine has to work extra hard to create the grapes. So the grape is very high in minerals. The flavor um profile is just insanely good.

SPEAKER_01 36:12

Would Chardonnay fall into that category of grape that needs like dry, dry harvesting?

SPEAKER_00 36:17

No, you can dry, you can dry farm any of them. Anything it's just called dry farming. And and it's dry because you're not hydrant. You don't water it, yeah. It only takes what it takes from like, you know, the rain. Unless it's about to like literally die. And also the hormosis that happens from that, it creates a lot of like high phenolic comp like a lot of antioxidants in in the grapes, which which end up in your wine. A friend of mine came from Napa, she her name is Camille Benita. She's she makes 98 point wines in Napa. She's one of the top wine winemakers. She came and she mentored me for two harvests. And then I brought a biodynamic farmer from France to mentor me on how to do biodynamic farming and start the whole biodynamic processes on the land. And now we are demeter certified biodynamic vineyard and winery.

SPEAKER_01 37:09

Wow. Um You're living a dream of mine. I would I would love to own a winery and do bio.

SPEAKER_02 37:16

And also just like it's look, it sounds like it looks beautiful. Like it just sounds without even drinking the wine, like I just want to walk around.

SPEAKER_00 37:22

It's wild. It's super it's a it's a natural sanctuary. So there is there's uh uh turkeys, there's quails, there's uh deer. And we uh we have my daughter, she has her ducks and chickens and goats, and we have big dogs, so it's like my little utopia. It's a place where you go and you just recharge. Well, it sounds it sounds incredible.

SPEAKER_02 37:44

And as somebody who does enjoy a glass of wine or two, I I I'm so curious to see what it tastes like. Is that it when you compare your wine as the way that you are making it with the dry harvesting and everything, how how would you say that it compares to other wines out there?

SPEAKER_00 38:00

Well, I'm gonna add something. My winery is super small, it's 2,000 bottles a year, and everything is done by hand. I don't add any sulfites. Everything is aged in oak barrels that I source from different forests in France to complement the flavor profile of the wine. So the the wine is super deep and it's very mineral and it's just very easy to drink. It really does sound like a utopia. So I I'm I'm on board. Yes, I'm on board too. I'm there. But honestly, like the one of the main reasons why I decided to keep the wine thing going is because I had the option to lease it to the local wineries, which they they do um conventional farming. And that was a tribute to my grandfather who did the uh regenerative farming, you know, as and I saw him do that. And um I just wanted to do my part of preserving this little piece of land and not making it be another contaminated uh glyphosate, whatever uh uh you know, piece of our earth.

SPEAKER_02 38:58

So are you trying to maybe spread the word to get more people to kind of join on board?

SPEAKER_00 39:04

It's very hard. It's extremely difficult, especially in the wine world, because nobody wants to it's a harder way and you don't have as much yield. Like I have less than half of what people who are doing conventional farming get. Right. And you know, farmers mostly are older and it's like a generational thing, so they're stuck in their ways. So I'm trying very hard. Uh it's it's a very slow progress. Uh we tried to do something with Erwan where we wanted them to do like a whole biodynamic section, but anyways, it's uh, you know, I only have uh 24 hours in a day.

SPEAKER_01 39:39

Yeah, and you're doing a lot. I also just really I want to take a moment to I it it's so wonderful to see everything that you've touched, it seems, in your career so far has had a tie to your lineage, and I just really love that. That's all you have your grandmother, you have your father, you have your your grandmother too, I think is um used to do some of these um didn't she used to do some uh fruit strips, right? When you were young, kind of it's it's beautiful. I love it. Tying back.

SPEAKER_02 40:08

Yeah. Um so so looking ahead, what are you most excited for in the world of health and wellness and longevity? What do you think is coming that you are excited about?

SPEAKER_00 40:19

Yeah, I'm seeing more and more talk about going back to basics. I'm seeing more uh like you know, Dr. Mike Hyman's been talking, uh Josh Axe has been talking, Dr. uh David Sinclair has been talking about it. And you see more people like telling you to eat whole foods, go back to basics, Mediterranean diet, get good sleep, build muscle. So I'm really excited about this like whole hype uh of like oversupplementation and all the unnecessary stuff and going back to like let's just do the simple things first and see how that works out for us. And unless it's broken, don't fix it, right? So if we can just fix ourselves with food and and lifestyle, uh that's one thing I'm really, really excited about. And I love how much social media have helped spread information and like awareness on things that otherwise would be just just used and a status quo, like the teabag. Um it, you know, there's so many people. I've you know, I've known that 12 years ago. I have to like, for the record, for 12 years, I've I've been aware of this, but I didn't have a voice strong enough to, because you know, I was a young college girl, yeah, to to to to bring that to the world. But you you know, you hear Dr. Huberman talking about it, you hear a lot of people. So it's really refreshing to see more truth coming to the surface and less hype. And you know, obviously the hype is still going, but at least we have a platform to educate people and like bring awareness, like just don't fall for the hype, and this is the truth, and this is the reality, and just it's certainly a blessing and a curse, you know.

SPEAKER_02 41:58

Social media is is challenging, but I was just telling Melanie about this woman that I met at the airport uh just a couple of weeks ago, and I was I was sitting with her, she was probably in her 60s or so, and she was just telling me about how she's really just dove into this longevity journey and how she's uncovered that HRT is something that she wanted to start doing, and you know, all these things that that really just opened her eyes. And I was like, So how did you how did you get into this? Like where where were you inspired by? And she said, social media, and it really just slapped me in the face. I was like, okay, it's not all bad. This is bringing people the information where they're at. And then it's really just about making sure that we're all being mindful about how we how we filter that information.

SPEAKER_00 42:44

Yeah, filtering your algorithm, which is very hard.

unknown 42:47

Totally.

SPEAKER_00 42:48

It's it's not hard for us because we are in that field. Like, you know, engineers know what they're doing, right? Attorneys know what they're doing, we know what we're doing in that world. But when people who don't know what they're doing get all of this information, that's one of the top questions I get asked all the time. Is like, like, give me a list. What do I do? You know, people are it's bringing also a little bit of confusion. So yeah.

SPEAKER_01 43:10

It sure is, especially in nutrition. Man, we get that all the time. I mean, that's the reason why we did this podcast was we're like, let's try and bring accurate, easy, science-backed information to people where they are. Yeah. We're trying.

SPEAKER_02 43:23

I know. We're trying amazing. I'm looking at our producer because I have a feeling that we have to go to our mailbag.

SPEAKER_01 43:31

Yes. So, Josephine, every episode we invite our listeners to send us questions that we they want answered live. Um, so we picked our top, what is it? I think we have three in here.

SPEAKER_02 43:43

We have five here. I mean So so I mean, I think we rapid fire these ones a little bit. Um, some of them you can pass and s and pass them back our way. And some of them you can be like, oh me, me, me. And we'll we'll split them then. Okay. Yay. Um okay, so um Question number one is why do I keep hearing about VO2 Max? How do I know what mine is and what should I do about it? I'm happy to talk about it. I love you guys. I think that's gonna be a huge question, Renee. Okay. Um, really quickly, so VO2 Max is essentially the efficiency at which your body can utilize the oxygen that we we so desperately need. The better we can use it, uh, the better we perform in a lot of ways. We of course our body really needs oxygen. Uh, we we I think we all know that. You don't have to be a scientist to know that. But the reason why it's become so prevalent, especially in social media, and we're hearing it a lot, is because it's so closely tied to longevity. The higher your VO2 max, time and time again, we see it in a lot of studies now, you also see a uh uh equivalent increase in longevity and uh reduction in risk of all-cause mortality. So, how do you improve your VO2 max? Exercise? So that's the big one. That is the big one, and and specifically, it's not just any exercise, it is especially the very high intensity exercise that you have to hit up. Hit hit training. Yes. One of the biggest ones, and I think we're hearing about it a lot a lot now, is Norwegian 4x4, and that's because it is very powerful at optimizing your VO2 max. And it's like it's really hard, but it's you can do it in like under 45 minutes because you're doing four minutes of the highest intensity exercise that you can do, where you're going like over 90% of your max heart rate, essentially. Yeah, it's tough. It's tough. But you're only doing it for four minutes and then you take a three-minute break. Which probably feels like a lifetime. Oh, your four minutes is like always part of my epigenetic protocol. Is you there we go. Norwegian four by four. It works, guys. It works. Is it is it comfortable? No. But the good thing is is like you're maybe doing it you know twice a week.

SPEAKER_00 46:03

But also when you do something uncomfortable, it it grows. Exactly. Well, you need to be able to do that.

SPEAKER_02 46:08

Were we just talking about neuroplasticity and all that wonderful stuff that improves as you do these things that are hard? So anyway, um, yes, it's important. Uh you can totally improve your VO2 max just through intense, high intensity exercise. And uh, it is very strongly correlated with longevity. Love it. Did I answer all the questions? That was a great answer.

SPEAKER_01 46:29

I love it. Okay. Fabulous. Wait a minute. Wait a tank that one. I you go.

SPEAKER_02 46:33

I'll answer it if it's Okay, okay. Um when I get together with my friends, we like to have a drink or two. Hi, we were just talking about this. It doesn't matter if it's just the girls or girls plus the husbands or girls plus husbands and the kids, if it it's just part of our get togethers. I know all studies say alcohol is bad for women in any quantity, but how should I think about my social life versus my health?

SPEAKER_00 46:56

The one thing I can do is I always, when I go in somewhere, when we go to a place, I always tip the bartender and I tell him, Whenever I ask for a drink, you give me a soda water with like a lime in it. Just make it look fancy though, it looks like a drink. So nobody really suspects that I'm not drinking. Yeah. Um, so you can do that.

SPEAKER_02 47:13

And also, you know, you can have just one. And that is kind of the But it is, it is it is a toxin.

SPEAKER_00 47:20

There's no safe levels of drinking. And coming from the person who makes wine. Yeah. I'm just telling you, there's no safe levels of drinking.

SPEAKER_01 47:27

But if we're going to moderate, we could try by just having the wine.

SPEAKER_02 47:31

But I do, I do love your your tip of just like when you can just kind of don't have to make a big deal about drinking things.

SPEAKER_01 47:41

We're also we're also living in a really wonderful time now, especially uh the past five years, where I think the the dry being dry and not drinking alcohol is a huge it's a very cool thing. It's enormous now, yeah. And it is easier to do with friends. So maybe, maybe if it's something that you're interested in trying, you clearly you're asking the question, so you're curious about it. Get your friends and family to do it for a month together as a crew. And so make it a challenge, yeah. See what see what comes of it.

SPEAKER_02 48:07

And what I so I actually was sober for eight months, and I found that after the first month was tough, second month was a little bit easier. Then once I got to month three, it was like you figure out your no problem. Yeah. It's also just about like giving it a fair chance.

SPEAKER_01 48:23

Yeah.

unknown 48:24

Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 48:24

Although I didn't last the past eight months, but still.

SPEAKER_01 48:27

Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 48:27

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 48:28

That's all I gotta say. I love, I love a glass of wine.

SPEAKER_02 48:30

Okay. How seriously should I take the sitting rising test? I can do it, but what does that actually mean? I can take it if you guys want. Okay, well, first maybe we should talk about what the sitting rising test is. I can't do it because I'm in a dress, but um, essentially, you have to be able to, from standing, make your way into cross-legged, no hands. You can't even like put your hands on your knees, hands on the floor, nothing, not even an elbow, and then come back up the same way, right? And so every time I try to demonstrate.

SPEAKER_01 49:02

Yes, please do it. I'm in heels.

SPEAKER_02 49:04

Our burden says no. Fine. Fine. Um so every time you use one of those pieces of your body to help leverage you up or down, you lose a point and you have a total of 10 points. So uh essentially, you obviously want the most points when you've gone up and down. Now, what the the reason why this is important in longevity is because they have found, and interestingly, this is primarily just one group of researchers out of uh Brazil, actually, that have found that the people that can do this, especially over the age of 40, up and down easily with the highest number of points left, have better expected longevity. So, what I do think is really important to note though about this is that you shouldn't just be training to do this. That one thing. Yeah. That's it that's not going to make you live longer. But it is, you know, if if researchers or doctors want to kind of get a sense of where you're at in terms of your strength, your mobility, your flexibility. It's like a litmus test almost. Yeah. This test gives us a lot of insight really quickly into all of those things that do play into longevity.

SPEAKER_00 50:19

And I'm gonna add something to this the this person who's asking this question is squats is the best thing you can do. So if you if you are looking for longevity and things, you know, that help you, just do a few squats in the morning. So don't worry about that test. Just roll your clothes.

SPEAKER_02 50:37

I I agree with that statement. Like, I mean, it really like I said, the test is like I I get it. It's a trend. Isn't that a trend? But and and it does, we do know, yes, it is correlated, but it's not something that you should be doing every day.

SPEAKER_01 50:50

Well it's looking at agility and flexibility and you know, all of the and yeah. So there's there's something to be said about it. But I do agree. We had we had Jen Jennifer Cohen on, and she had a very similar sentiment about uh squats, just doing them a couple times a day. Yeah, we did squats, right? We did squats. We continue to do squats.

SPEAKER_02 51:07

Shall I continue? Yes, you read. You read out. I'm having fun reading, I know. Um okay. I use agave in most of my recipes instead of sugar and honey because I heard it has a lower glycemic index, but I'm gaining weight. What is the healthiest sweetener to use?

SPEAKER_03 51:23

Eek.

SPEAKER_01 51:25

You want to take it? I I would say it's the opposite. I would say that you it you're better, better well, sugar not so much. Honey is a little bit better, maple syrup's a little bit better, but you could also go with monk fruits because they agave is not a low glycemic.

SPEAKER_00 51:40

And try try to see what sweetener works best for you. But I I vote for dates.

SPEAKER_01 51:45

Yeah. We remember you love dates. Dates are incredible. I would also say that not everything needs to be sweetened. I would I would play with maybe reducing the amount of sweetener you need at all. I mean, our taste buds do change the more we consume. And fructose is the m sweet test of all of the sugar um types. So if you're eating that often, it could make your taste buds more um attuned to that type of more and more and more. So you'll need more eventually.

SPEAKER_02 52:14

So I would say that's that's the problem with like I know you called out monk fruit and stevia. Yeah, yeah. Which by the way, I do. I do like them because they're very you know non-nutritive, right? Meaning aka like no calorie. But they are super, super sweet. So now they get your your taste buds used to additional sweetness, and so you're always hunting for that high, essentially. So, I mean, what is the best?

SPEAKER_01 52:38

Let's answer this question. Which one is the best? I mean, we s we already said dates, date which is not on the list. Um I also think um honey and maple syrup have their own um uh constitute uh antioxidant profile as well. I think they also have some uh allergy fighting compact honeyness. Um If it's local. Yes, if it's local honey to your region, your specific region. But yeah, sugar, not so much. I I am not a big fan of agave. I say nix the agave, sorry.

SPEAKER_02 53:08

Yeah, it it's kind of uh Save it for Pascal if you think. I mean it it's really good marketing on the agave front, like oh, it's lower glycemic. It is. It is, that is true. But uh that's not the only thing that's going on here. And I guess what I would just like I would like to finish it out with is that all of the sweeteners have a maybe a pro, like a reason why you may select it over another one. And so I think the question is, what are you looking for? What what do you need it for? You know, I I would answer this question differently for somebody with type 2 diabetes than I would for you know you.

SPEAKER_01 53:44

So uh th those it's just different. And play play with fruits. I mean, if you're if like let's just say if you're starting your day with oatmeal instead of using agave, you could use banana. That too. Say it louder for the people in the back.

SPEAKER_02 53:58

All right. So it I guess before we close this out, Josephine, is there anything that you feel like our audience should hear? Yeah. Let's hear it.

SPEAKER_00 54:07

Oh, like Xerti strips are hitting the Target shelves. Yes. Yay. Oh, Target. Yes. So we will be at Target, and I'm very excited to be and you know to be bringing, and it's gonna be a surprise because I'm not gonna say what it is, but it's gonna be a really cool surprise. I'm excited to be bringing uh the uh healthy, uh clean solution to the tea drinkers, to their favorite Target stores at a Target friendly price. So very excited um about that.

SPEAKER_01 54:39

Did you give us the date? Did I miss the date?

SPEAKER_00 54:40

May 8th to 10th. So, you know, with Target because it's such a big uh corporation, they can give you like a right hey. We'll take it. That's coming up.

SPEAKER_01 54:51

We can all have our butter, our blue butterfly tea and our olive leaf. Amazing. Thank you so much for joining us, Josephine. Of course, of course. We are so grateful for you coming on. Thanks for joining us. Oh, what an incredible episode. That was so fun. We have we have so many takeaways, you guys. Number one, watch your tea bags. Who would have thought? I mean, it it is honestly, I I don't know that I would have thought. I mean, I I it's such a it seems I think that's the thing about microplastic nanoplastic conversation is that there's so many little tiny ways that we're accumulating them in mass amounts in our daily life. And we don't know, we don't realize, we're not cognizantly aware. So I'm very grateful to have the cognizant awareness now to be like, oh no, I'm not doing that anymore.

SPEAKER_02 55:37

The good news is that we also got a lot of uh, you know, takeaways of what we can do, uh, ways to limit microplastics in our everyday, but also ways to optimize our health and our longevity. We talked about alcohol intake and how that might play into health and wellness and longevity. What else did we cover? Man, I feel like we did so much.

SPEAKER_01 56:00

Oh, we did such a fun. Our our guest, Josephine, told us so much about the um olive leaf extracts and and how important polyphenols and all of that can be for our health, which I really appreciate as a get health dietitian who deals a lot with fungal overgrowths. I do use this, so I'm very excited to have a new um a new uh product to share with my patients. But we absolutely will be going to your winery, Josephine, if you're still listening. Can't wait to show up on your doorstep. I'm gonna I'm gonna buy some like w muddy rain boots and I'm gonna show up flavoring. Ready to rock. Yes. Um thank you so much for tuning in to Almost Forever. Uh we will be sharing all of Josephine's information and um how to get in touch with her in our show notes. I think she was hopefully gonna share that beautiful paper of what to sub and what what to use instead, which I'm very excited about personally. Um and if you liked this episode, if you found it interesting and exciting, please share, like, follow, share it with a friend and uh conversation.

SPEAKER_02 56:56

Great review.

SPEAKER_01 56:57

All of these are the first. One day we're gonna get all of these down. It's not today. We're so grateful you tuned in. Uh show back soon. Show back soon. See you soon.