The Sex Therapist Advice Everyone Needs to Hear - with Audrey Casey

This week on Shake the Ground, Nathalie is joined by sex therapist Audrey Casey to explore one of the subjects we’re often taught to avoid, but one that affects so many of us. 

From body image and confidence to intimacy, communication and the shame that can surround sex, this conversation goes far beyond the bedroom. Audrey shares why so many people struggle to talk openly about sex, the biggest misconceptions she sees in her work, and how building confidence starts with understanding yourself. 

Whether you’re single, dating or in a long-term relationship, this episode is packed with honest conversations, practical advice and reassuring reminders that you’re far from alone. 

Follow Audrey here: 
https://www.instagram.com/activationwithaudrey

Follow Nathalie here: 
https://www.instagram.com/nathalielennon_ 

Subscribe to our YouTube here: 
https://www.youtube.com/@shakethegroundpodcast 

Visit Audrey's Website: https://www.sextherapysolutions.ie/about 

Transcript

SPEAKER_01 0:14

Welcome back to Stay to the Ground. The podcast is here to remind you that the life, self, relationship, and personality you want is all within reading. I'm your host, Natalie Lennon, and every week we're diving into the stories of people who dared to do things differently, who chose the path left taken, trusted themselves, and basically took the ground. I hope that this podcast helps you to build confidence and self-belief, ensuring you never settle for a life less than what you dream of. So if you ever felt stuck, scared, or like you're playing small, get ready to shake the ground. Today we're talking about something I think nearly everyone struggles with at some point. Confidence, shame, awkwardness, and communication when it comes to sex and intimacy. You might remember we had one episode on this topic previously when I hosted the dating games, and it was one of our most popular episodes, so I know you're going to love the conversation we are about to have. Audrey Casey is an accredited psychotherapist and sex and intimacy coach. Audrey creates a safe space for her clients where they can talk openly about sexual concerns or difficulties and help them work through anything that may be holding them back from the intimacy and love they desire. She also supports survivors of sexual trauma to rediscover their own path towards sexual healing and fulfillment. I am so excited for this conversation. Audrey, welcome to Shake the Ground.

SPEAKER_00 1:37

Thank you so much for having me. I love your intro. Thank you so much.

SPEAKER_01 1:40

I hope I got everything correct there.

SPEAKER_00 1:42

Totally got everything correct. Brilliant.

SPEAKER_01 1:45

So let's start with just that. Can you tell us a little bit more about how you got into being a sex therapist and about your work?

SPEAKER_00 1:53

Sure. So I started out as a social care worker and I was working in a homeless charity for many years. Um and when I was working with homelessness, one of the main causes of homelessness is relationship breakdown. And what I found was that I was working with a lot of people who were struggling in relationships and I was providing therapist without providing therapy without being a therapist. So I was like, oh, like I really need to go and look into this. So I did uh um a counselling course and counselling and psychotherapy for four years, and then I went on and done my master's in cognitive behavior therapy, and I was working with people, and again, these relationship issues kept coming up and intimacy issues, and I just didn't feel equipped. I was like, I don't know how to really support people with sexual issues. Like I could help them with communication, I could help them with you know figuring out what was going wrong and and like healing, but when it came to like intimacy, I felt like okay, I need to do more training. Yeah, and at the time in Ireland there wasn't many courses available, there was a lot of um kind of theoretical but not like practical hand, not actually hands-on, but like um so I I found one in the States that was um very much, you know, you know, giving like practical solutions, real solution-based, solution-focused, um, coaching people with uh intimacy issues. And it was run by a lady called uh Dr. Patty Britton, and she was just really um, she wrote a book on coaching and she was just really um very charismatic and very um, I suppose, you know, what's the right way to say she was very passionate about the cause. Okay. And I just really um admired her for that. And I did the course then over two years, um, over and back to the States. And you went over and back to marketing. I went over and back. Yeah. That just shows how passionate you were about yeah, I just loved it, and you know, you got to be in class and we got to um, you know, uh role play with um people who would come in and you know, different people with different issues and that were willing to talk about them for us, and you know, it was just wonderful. It was just it was just a really hands-on without being hands-on course. Sex therapy is is talk therapy, yeah, you know, um, so it was fantastic, and then I, you know, uh got the certificate in um sex coaching and I started my practice, Sex Therapy Solutions, in 2018, and yeah, I've been doing it ever since.

SPEAKER_01 4:14

Ever since 2018. And people's reaction when you say you're a sex therapist. We were talking about this a little bit earlier. How do you find people react to that?

SPEAKER_00 4:23

So like it's it's often like quite sensational. It's like, oh my god, you know. Um, and you know, they want to hear, you know, all the juicy stuff and um, you know, any kind of funny stories I might have, or uh so I, you know, I I suppose I'll I might, you know, change some details and give you know something that might have come up that was funny, but a lot of the work is actually um quite therapeutic, like it's it's a lot focused on dysfunction and it's a lot focused on you know supporting people who've gone through um you know who are survivors of sexual assault. Yes. So um it's a lot of healing and um it's a lot of intimacy work um for people who are struggling and it's a lot of you know exactly what we're going to talk about today is a lot of um image-based stuff and lack of confidence or desire discrepancies. So like it's it's very deep emotional work that requires you to be very vulnerable. Yeah. So it's intense.

SPEAKER_01 5:15

I imagine it's so hard for people to open up. I mean, I've gone to therapy myself for healing in my own body image issues, but uh like I imagine when it comes to healing within like sexual trauma or the area of sex itself, it must be so hard to be that vulnerable. And that's part of why I'm so excited to have this conversation with you today because even when you walked in to to Amplify here today, everyone's reaction to having a sex therapy is like, oh my god, you know, and there is a bit of a a stigma and a not an eggshell kind of around the topic, but somewhat maybe.

SPEAKER_00 5:49

Somewhat, I suppose it I you know, it it it creates, I suppose, um some nervousness for people, you know. And sometimes that comes across but excitement. But excitement. Sometimes it comes across as excitement, and sometimes it comes across as kind of no, I'll be getting side-eyes and like, are you trying to analyze me or do you know what I like sexually that I'm not even sure what I like sexually like and if I can write, which I absolutely can't. And um, so some people are are very defensive or withdrawn, you know, when they find out, and other people are like, you know, you know, I have this problem and you need to help me. Yeah. So it's yeah, it's it's interesting always.

SPEAKER_01 6:22

So if we were to break down, I suppose, what shows up most in your work, like the main issues. Could you dive into that a little bit?

SPEAKER_00 6:29

Sure. So the main issues at the moment for me are um males presenting with porn-induced erectile dysfunction. Okay. Yeah. So that's kind of the main issue that I see. The other, I suppose, main issue would be um couples who are struggling because of a desire discrepancy. Okay. So a lot of people don't know this, but like um you can Google it because it's gonna sound like it's not true, but it is, um, that for men, like their their brain checks in on their testosterone levels every 25 minutes to an hour. Okay. So their brain will check in to check in, like to see are their testosterone levels after dropping, or to keep them at a like you know, balanced, regulated, high state. Okay. But for women, we only get that same check-in when we're ovulating.

SPEAKER_01 7:12

I was like, do not say once a month.

SPEAKER_00 7:14

You are joking. So, like once a month while we're ovulating for like two or three days, our brain will do the same thing.

SPEAKER_01 7:20

How have I never heard this before?

SPEAKER_00 7:22

So it's really healthy and normal for a man to want to masturbate every day, up to three, sometimes five times a day, right?

SPEAKER_01 7:28

No, there's so many men listen to this and they're gonna send this clip to their partner and go, see, it's fine.

SPEAKER_00 7:33

See, see, it's so normal. Yeah, but it is actually so like sometimes when I have couples in front of me and I will say, Look, it's so healthy and normal for him to need to or want to masturbate every day because like his testosterone levels are his testosterone levels are constantly checking in, topping up child gen. Yeah, you don't have you're never gonna have that same, you know, hormonal like equivalency. Um, so unless you want to have sex with him every single day, you can't control whether or not he, you know, wants to engage in solo sex because that's a personal thing and that he should be able to do that. Um, but then the issue of porn often comes up, yeah, you know, and you know, the role that they want that to play in the relationship or not, and how that affects both of them and whether it's going to create a problem down the line, because I'm not anti-porn, but I am anti-only porn used during solo sex because that will create problems in terms of being able to maintain then an erection without a screen in front of you.

SPEAKER_01 8:22

Okay, now I feel like if I've there may be some men listening to this that go, okay, solo sex, she doesn't want to have sex every day. I obviously every 25 minutes they might not need to have sex every 25 minutes.

SPEAKER_00 8:36

Yeah, no, chemically they're just checking in.

SPEAKER_01 8:40

Oh god. But no, so every day he may want it a lot more. Yes. Um, so you are not anti-porn, but you're you how phrase that again? For solo sex, you don't think it should be used all of the time. So if you're using porn, you need to make sure that you're also able to use your imagination. So I suppose, yeah, that's my question. What else can they use? I feel like there's a man listening, go, well, what else am I supposed to do?

SPEAKER_00 9:04

So so make sure that you can like, you know, oscillate between using porn, using your imagination, like listening to something, but not always having a visual, be able to see it in your mind because you know, during sex, if if there's any performative issues or if your brain is like scanning for the screen that it usually has when you're having solar sex, that you need to be able to go to your mind or you need to be able to focus on your partner because you can't scroll your partner on to like a more sexy scene, right? You have to be able to stay in your body. So if you use your imagination and you don't have you know anything in front of you, you're just in your mind and you're able to stay with something or you know focus on on imagining something, you'll be able to maintain your action. But if you always need the screen, your brain is always looking for it. Okay. And then you can't stay in your body.

SPEAKER_01 9:50

Yeah. Does that make sense? That makes a lot of sense. Yeah, I guess I have a few questions on this popping to mind. When you're saying, you know, use your imagination more. Let's say we have men listening, and now this whole episode is not going to be directed at men and the discrepancy there, but we're just on that for now. And they are struggling to use porn less. And they're hearing now it is important to try and use their imagination more, focus on thoughts of their partner, like you said, a sound. How can they make that change to using it less? Because I imagine it is quite addictive and they will um, you know, get there quicker with porn. So, how can they kind of retract from that and use their imagination more?

SPEAKER_00 10:32

So that's a really good question because it's exactly like that's that's I suppose the work when when someone comes and says to me, you know, I'm struggling with um intimacy and intercourse. The first question I'll ask them is, can you maintain an erection when you're having solo sex, watching like what and what are you using? So often they'll say that they're using porn. And if there's no uh struggle with maintaining an erection during porn, there's actually no issue. The issue is the porn, you know. Yeah. So it's not that there's anything physically wrong, it's that they can maintain the erection with porn, they just can't transfer it over to intercourse because you know yourself it's much, much slower, it's more sensual, you have to focus on your partner, you're not able to scroll on the screen. Yeah. So what I'm saying to them then is that once they recognize that okay, it is porn causing this issue, you have to ask them now how can you how are we going to break this up? Because my my recommendation is that you know, if you use porn on a Tuesday, on Wednesday you're using your imagination. Okay. And Thursday you're using porn and Friday, you're using your imagination. Yeah. So you have to constantly swap it over and you have to keep like an eye on because otherwise you're always going to have problems when it comes to intimacy in the bedroom with a partner. And like what's more important to you, your solo sex life or being able to share it. And every time you use porn, you're reinforcing that neural pathway that strengthens the link of this is how I orgasm, this is how I, you know, get turned on, this is how I stay aroused. So the more that you can reinforce the other neural pathway of I can also imagine my partner, I can also imagine what it feels like to be touched, I can also be centrally in my body without, you know, having and and unfortunately, porn can be very extreme. Yeah, of course. But you know, and it's very much from the male gaze. Yeah. And it's so I always say to people that like you know, if if you wanted to learn to drive a car, would you watch Fast and Furious to learn how to drive a car? Because that's the same as if you want to learn how to have sex, right? Don't watch porn to learn how to have sex. Because you're going to get the most extreme aversion and it's not actually how sex should be, because it's not for the woman.

SPEAKER_01 12:38

It's quite sad because I hear what you're saying, I agree with you completely, but the reality of that happening is is I there's no percentages on this, I'm sure, but it has to be very slim because of the access that teenage boys have to very, very slim.

SPEAKER_00 12:52

And you know, this is going to be very controversial what I say, but um there is a site called Make Love Not Porn, and unfortunately it's subscription-based. Okay. But when my son, who's 12 now, gets to the correct age, I will be paying paying for that subscription for him because I would much prefer for him to be watching People Make Love than watching the porn that's on Pornhub.

SPEAKER_01 13:14

This is incredible. I've never heard of this website before, and it's so inspirational to hear a mother say that and like some people are like, What?

SPEAKER_00 13:23

You're gonna give him a porn, like but I actually will.

SPEAKER_01 13:26

I think you're dead right though, because otherwise he's just gonna find a way into it himself and a site that is going to lead to much more problems down the line in his relationships with women.

SPEAKER_00 13:35

And I I like I'm not under any illusions that he's not also going to look at porn hub or you know, other sites that are um but I want him to see I want him to see the contrast of what's real and what's fake and to know the fake one and to know what the fake one will do in terms of you know not helping him connect to a partner and being able to see what you know real connecting sex can be.

SPEAKER_01 13:54

And for anyone listening that might be struggling with, say, a porn addiction, do you think that that website could be a step in the right direction?

SPEAKER_00 14:02

I think it's I think anyone who's struggling with porn addiction or dependency, I think they really need to talk to somebody. It doesn't have to be me, um, it can be anyone, but they really need to talk to somebody so that they're getting some support on how they can mix it up. And a lot of people who are using porn, it often becomes this emotional crutch where you know, I feeling stressed, oh, I'll go home and I'll just watch some porn at night. Check everywhere. I'll check out, yeah. And you know, especially for men who you know are socialized to not talk about their feelings. Yeah. You know, that you know, you're supposed to be strong, you know, cop on, keep it together, you know, get on with it. All of that that unfortunately is still present, you know, that is their way that they find relief and check out. So when it becomes, you know, this emotional crutch, it's much harder then to substitute it for something when there's nothing. You know, they they need to find something that is like something much more healthy in terms of a coping mechanism than always using porn. And I'm not I'm not saying stop masturbating, I'm saying, you know, just make sure that you're able to watch porn in a healthy way that's not causing you any damage in terms of having a healthy relationship or connection.

SPEAKER_01 15:05

Audrey, I love this conversation so much, and we're only at the beginning, like I haven't even looked at questions, I don't know where I am in regards to the questions I had for you, but I just feel like this is going to help so many people and couples. So I suppose taking a step from that then, because obviously porn was going to be a big uh centre of the conversation today and the problems that it causes. Sure. When it comes to the standards that that can set or that it men may expect, um, I'm not saying women don't look at porn as well or look at it as much or have the same issues that men do with it. Um, just typically men may have more of that issue. So let's take it from that perspective first. Um, that men may have a standard that's set really high for the bedroom, and if they feel like they're not getting that, um, or the woman feels like they're not living up to this standard because he is seeing that on porn all the time. How do you work around that?

SPEAKER_00 15:58

So I suppose I I dive into what he's really trying to get, what he's really trying to get, or what what you know he's really looking for out of the experience, because if it's connection, you know, then um he's never going to get that from the sex that he's watching on porn. Okay. Because the sex on porn is never about connection, it's it's only about you know the man orgasming, yeah, or you know, what the man has to do to orgasm or what he's going to do with the with the partner to orgasm. Um so I'm I'm always trying to figure out like what's the goal? You know, are you trying to connect? Are you trying to figure out your your sensuality, your sexuality, are you trying to express yourself sexually? What is your sexual identity and how do you express your sexuality through your identity? Or have you just learned that this is how you're meant to be from watching porn and this is what a man does during porn? And like, does it feel good when your partner is not actually connecting to you, or you don't know if it's good for her, or you're not doing anything that pleases her and it's just for you, and she's leaving feeling co you know, totally dissatisfied because I've never seen you know, um, you know, um porn on on a on a site that like a very popular site where the woman is asked, is this good for you?

SPEAKER_01 17:07

That's so true.

SPEAKER_00 17:08

Never, like never so true. Never just not about that, it's just not about that, you know. It's about the money shot, it's about how you know hard the man is, or it's about you know how big her breasts are.

SPEAKER_01 17:19

Oh, don't talk to me about it, I can't live up to that.

SPEAKER_00 17:21

The thing is, okay, that like the the the pressure that the man might put on the woman to you know be like a porn star, then he's also putting himself under pressure to also be like the man in the video and be as big or last as long and that's also not realistic.

SPEAKER_01 17:38

There's a a point I never thought of because I'm a woman and I never saw that viewpoint. Yes. And that really does open up my eyes to another another side of it.

SPEAKER_00 17:47

So I would always say, like to somebody who's like, oh, you know, she's not as adventurous as what I'd be used to watching, and I'd say, and are you, you know, are you the exact same as the men? Are you so she's watching it? Is she going to get the man that's in the she is that who you are? Is that who you can be? So you know you can do everything that the porn man can. And then there's kind of silence. Yeah. But to be fair, to be fair, like most men do want connection. Okay. Most men do want really connected, like fun, um, sensual, um, you know, real, real decent, like quality, high quality intimacy, and they're not, they recognise like that the porn is not real. Um, so I think to be fair to men, they they're actually not looking for you know, they they can see that the porn is just uh from the male scales to make the morgasm. Yeah, but that like real intimacy is has so is so layered and is like so much more fulfilling.

SPEAKER_01 18:40

Yeah, I love that. Um, and I have one more question before I move on to my actual question. Sure. Um you mentioned desire discrepancy and how that potentially stems from or does stem from the um I suppose the what's the word, like what's going on in his mind where every 25 minutes there's a testosterone check, and for us it's just during those two or three days of ovulation. Is that what can is that what actually causes this discard the desire discrepancy?

SPEAKER_00 19:06

So I there's so many things that that cause it. Um and I think for women, um absolutely like we don't have the same level of testosterone, so that's a that's a major factor.

SPEAKER_01 19:19

Physiological, that's the word I like.

SPEAKER_00 19:20

Physiologically, yes, we don't have the same the same level of the the sex hormone, but I think it's more than that. I think that the pressure to you know be a certain way and life is so life is so about like being productive and you know it's just it's so hard then. It's it's all about you know um what you're doing or how much you've done. And people get home in the evening and they're so tired and they're scrolling on their screen and they're not connecting in the same way. And I just think the pressure on women to feel like they need to be a certain way that it just becomes like a chore. So like desired is just lower anyway. And in order to be turned on, like you have to turn off from life, so it's like you have to be turned off to turn to turn on, okay? That's powerful, and turning off actually takes like real practice. You have to get good at turning off to get turned on, right? That makes sense here, it makes so much sense, surprisingly. So, you know, it's really it's really hard when you're busy and you're going and you know you're at your job, or you feel you have to get to the gym, or you're you know, making sure you're meal prepping for the next day, or like all the jobs that you have to do, and then what happens is intimacy becomes another job because it's like, oh, I have to make sure now, uh and then like your your desire for it or your like your natural passion for it, like just starts to drop because it starts to become like a chore, just another list. Yeah, and people just check out, and the re the the way they check out is they scroll, they scroll and they are like it just goes to show you what social media is doing to us in every aspect of our life.

SPEAKER_01 20:57

It's not just socially, it's not just friendships, it's intimacy as well.

SPEAKER_00 21:00

It's intimacy as well. And the UK do uh like a kind of a sex survey every 10 years, and what they're finding year on every decade is that like the the sex that couples and long-term relationships are have is getting lower and lower and lower. The the what the sex the sex that like couples are having in in intimate relationships that like long-term couples as time goes on as time goes on, it's getting lower and lower because there's so many more distractions.

SPEAKER_01 21:21

And when you say it's getting lower and lower, I know this is probably very hard for you to put a number on, but can you give us any sort of numbers in terms of like how often typical couples have sex at different stages of their life? Do you know do you know what I'm getting at?

SPEAKER_00 21:36

I do, of course, yeah, yeah. So like I suppose everyone will know that like at the start it's amazing. Honeymoon phase. Yeah, honeymoon phase, it like is gonna be like this forever. Yeah, it's like every chance you get, yeah, you know, and and that is amazing. Um, and then you know, naturally as the relationship progresses, it becomes weekly, and that's fine, everyone's happy with that. Um, and then you know, as it as you know, the Relationship matures and you know maybe they get more you know connected and comfortable, it might go to fortnightly, and it usually stays around there until kids enter the pitcher. Okay, and then it takes a massive nose.

SPEAKER_01 22:13

Like it's just yeah, so that's really interesting. So at the beginning, every chance you get every chance over time, it's often weekly, and then it can go to fortnightly, and that is typical, there's always exceptions. Of course. After children, I feel like that's a whole other podcast in itself. That's a whole other podcast. You could talk about that for ages. Yeah, I might I think I'll save that and maybe maybe we'll speak about it in the future because I do, I suppose it's not a stage I'm at yet, but I can't say it's something I haven't thought about. Do you know I'm I always think God after kids that must be a tough area and partly because of body image uh changes for the woman, yeah, which is an area that I've struggled with in the past, and I've spoken about that on podcasts before and mentioned it here. Um, and look, I think this is a nice segue into speaking about body image and those problems. So be it for maybe women who are listening that have had children or just anyone at any age, men as well, that are struggling with body image and feeling like they don't provide enough in terms of their aesthetics to get things going in the bedroom. How would you help people through that?

SPEAKER_00 23:20

So, again, like the question I would ask is you know, how do you want to express your sexuality? You know, have you a sense of who you are sexually and how do you express that? And like often when I ask that question to people, they're like, uh, like they don't they they they haven't ever asked themselves that.

SPEAKER_01 23:38

It is a total one to answer, but like I'm sure everyone listening, like myself, is here now asking I'm asking myself that question.

SPEAKER_00 23:46

Yeah, so it is, it's something you really need to sit with and think like who am I sexually and do I know you know the things that really turn me on and how do I want to express that? And how do I feel comfortable expressing that? And am I stuck in a place where unless I look a certain way, I don't feel that that's accessible to me, that I can't express myself in the way that I feel I can be sexual unless you know I meet all these conditions. And who has set these conditions? Who has decided you only deserve to receive pleasure and enjoy intimacy if uh you are a certain size or you you know look a certain way, like like and like if if that's a story you're telling yourself, then you know you're uh not allowing yourself to really you know experience the joy of connecting with yourself and others, yeah, and how amazing that can be.

SPEAKER_01 24:36

So really it's working through that.

SPEAKER_00 24:40

So you can't use that you can't hate your way into healing. Yeah. So any kind of self-judgment, any kind of self-criticism, you're never getting closer to a place where you can enjoy you know, intimacy or connection with a partner, or you can enjoy your own body, yeah, or you can feel safe in it without judgment. Like you just can't hate your way into self-acceptance, it's never gonna work. So you have to get to a place where you're like, Who am I and how do I want to express myself and you know, how do I want to be in this body? And I'll often meet clients who will say to me, Um, I'm sick of hating myself. I'm so sick of hating myself. And I will know if they're ready to change because I'll say, Okay, you know, let's work through how you can actually create a practice of self-care and self-love and self-value. And some of them will be like, Oh, like, oh, what do I have to look in the mirror and say I love myself? And I'm like, no, no, you don't. But they're already on the fence, they're already like cringing at the thought of being kind and loving themselves. So I know they're at the stage where they want to want to, yeah, but they're not there. They're just not ready. Yeah, okay. Whereas the clients are ready, are like, absolutely tell me how I can separate myself now, not with all these conditions where when I'm 10 pounds later and lighter, I'll love myself. Yeah, when I've got when I fit into that dress, I will love myself.

SPEAKER_01 25:54

I do think we're so objectified. Like, I feel like women get so many comments on our body image, and men do too, that it can be hard to not take those comments on board as to a standard we need to meet in the bedroom as well, you know.

SPEAKER_00 26:08

Absolutely, and but see, yeah, I suppose for me as a therapist, I can see that like when you look back, it it keeps changing, you know, because if you go back to yeah, you know, I'm gonna say the 20s, I might be wrong about this, but you know, the flapper stage with the dresses where the women used to be like um cellotaping their breasts to fit into those dresses because they were supposed to look like they were really flat. Yeah, and then it moved on to like Marlon Monroe, who was like really curvy and curvaceous and that was really sexy, and then it moved on to um I think someone called it once like heroin cheek, which is really terrible. About like the like Kate Moss kind of curve. You know what you mean? Did you know and then it went on to Kim Kardashian, who was again curvy, so like it keeps changing. Yeah. So women are like, they never know. Like it keeps like, am I like, is this the right way I'm supposed to look? Oh, and the problem is, and this makes me so sad, it's always about shrinking often. It's like how how smaller can I make myself? And women like spend their days thinking about I know, oh can I shrink?

SPEAKER_01 27:07

I mentioned to you just briefly before we started recording that that was my area of struggle. Yes, and I that's exactly what happened to me. I shrunk down to next to nothing, and I've always been like relatively petite anyway, but that is exactly what happened to me, and it was completely based off kind of society and comments on my body and comments that were given to me from a very young age that I probably took on board as being my personality, you know, being stick tin or being bony and all these other things that I was like, oh now I have to be that. But then funnily enough, as the years went on, I struggled with not being curvy enough, right? Uh like sexually, like feeling like I wasn't attractive enough because I'm flat chested or I felt like you know, your looths are not big enough or whatever. So then the obsession became to build it up hip thrust after hip thrust after glue bridge in the gym. And I kind of realized, what am I doing? Like, I don't like training this way. What am I doing it for? And I was only trained in a certain way to please the male gaze, like, and I feel like a lot of women are probably in that same boat because there's such an obsession with building out glutes, and I will say I still do a lot of like lower body training, but it's to complement my running and areas that I've been told are weaker, and that's what's leading to injuries and niggles, so I need to work on those muscle groups for that, and now I have a whole different view on strength training. But when I was in my early 20s, strength training was more so building a physique that was attractive to men. That's what it was for me, right?

SPEAKER_00 28:33

Which is so sad when you think about it, and I think it still is that way for a lot of people. It definitely is that way for a lot of the clients that I meet because they just they're constantly bombarded with you know messages and images like on on social media about you know what you're meant to look like to be accepted or to be seen as you know beautiful. Um and it's there's the messages are all also you know um conflicting as well. It's because it's like you know, you are meant to be ambitious, but you're not meant to be too assertive, you know, and you're meant to be like caring and mothering, but you're not meant to be needy, you know.

SPEAKER_01 29:08

So it's we just can't get it right. So it's really totally feel that. Like I've been that person that's been like, right, do you know? Oh, like send the message, don't send the message, you know. Like I say, I spent literally my twenties analysing, am I being too needy? Am I, you know, not being needy enough? Am I being like that too assertive, or maybe I shouldn't say anything, like too dominant, not being submissive enough, all these words, and like not finding out who I wanted to be in those situations.

SPEAKER_00 29:34

And that comes back to sexuality then, because you know, women are you know, they're expected to be attractive and beautiful, but don't be too sexual because then you're a slut.

SPEAKER_01 29:43

Yeah. So it's so true, it's so annoying. It's really hard. When it comes to sexual confidence, so this is a very open-ended question, but when do you think people are their most sexually confident? Oh, that's a really good question.

SPEAKER_00 29:57

Um I okay, I I I can answer this like personally and kind of from clients because I find that when I'm working with clients in in their 20s and when I was in my 20s, like I was having and they're often having a lot of performative sex. Okay. So the sex where you're you know spectatoring, which means that you're you're not really fully present in your body, but you're like watching how you look, and you're like, you know, um sucking in your stomach and you're holding yourself a certain way, and you're you know, trying to make sure that it looks at all you're you're watching the sex rather than being in it. Okay, and it's it's incredibly performative because you feel you need to look a certain way for it to be good for your partner or to be desired. Yeah. So I think that's a very difficult place to be. And like I'd love if more, if more men and women in their 20s um were were able to get out of that mindset, were able to not spectate and actually be part of it and you know, really accept their bodies. Because if they could do it in their 20s, they're gonna have such an amazing, fulfilling journey, you know, of sexuality.

SPEAKER_01 31:01

I'm getting excited for those people that will get to do that, but I think it's hard. Like I've heard the word performative with regards to sex before, but I guess I never really knew the definition of it until right now.

SPEAKER_00 31:11

Yeah, so it's it's it's always being in that performative mode where you're not really fully, you know. You're always in your head. You're always in your head. And um, so it's again getting to switch off to switch on, you know. Yeah. To so to not be in that performative mode and to be fully in your body and to be able to ask for what you need. I don't think it happened like it didn't happen for me till I was in my 30s. Okay. And I got to a phase where I recognized that, and I think a lot of people this happens for a lot of people, that the sex would always become mature. If it was always performative, you know, it'd be amazing at the start. Yeah. Because you know, it's all exciting. And but once it got into that rhythm, um, it would always become mature because it wasn't for me, you know, it wasn't uh for me to connect, it was for me to put on this, you know, I'm this sexual being and I want you to desire me. And and I'm not saying that it's not lovely to be desired and I didn't enjoy it, of course I did, but it it it wasn't like, you know, as exciting as it could be or as fulfilling as it could be. Um and I just got to a stage, and I think a lot of people get to this where it's like, I'm either going to have performative sex for the rest of my life, which will be a chore because it's not really for me, or I'm going to start figuring out, you know, who am I sexually, what do I want sexually, how can I ask for what I want. And you know, the the fear that comes with that is I'm am I going to be judged? Am I going to be rejected? Yeah. And any of the stigmas that come up around sex, it's all about fear of judgment, you know, fear of rejection. So you have to figure out then, you know, what am I really afraid of? And how can I, you know, buffer myself, or how can I mine myself, or how can I, you know, develop my own self-worth that, you know, if I have a sexual experience that I don't think went well, that it's not going to devalue me in any way?

SPEAKER_01 32:47

Yeah. So you mentioned there not being afraid to ask for what you want. Let's say you have a sexual experience with your partner, or you've had a few with your partner at this point that have now started to go uh we'll just use the word downhill, as in it's just becoming more performative. Yeah. Um, how can people get the courage to bring up that conversation and speak about what it is they want, or let's say you know, someone's feeling that their sex life within their relationship has become too performative, um, be it for the male or the female. I feel like often it may be for the female, but it can go either way. How can we kind of build up the courage to have that conversation without hurting our partner?

SPEAKER_00 33:30

Yeah, and it is it is like a quite a tense, you know, subject to bring up and it needs to like you need to tread lightly. And I would always say like to talk about, you know, to bring the other person in and say, I remember, like bring up a sexual experience that you had together that was amazing, but like a highlight and say, I remember when you know this happened, do you remember this sexual experience? And you know, maybe things you know are have got in how maybe we've got into a routine, or you know, if you can if you can imagine what the person's next move is going to be, because you know, you've doing the same kind of you know sexual dance every time and you're like, and then he's gonna do this and I'm gonna do this and then this, then it's like time to mix it up. And I think that if you if you if you start the conversation with, you know, we are capable of having amazing intimacy, um, let's figure out how we can explore intimacy again together and how we can go on this journey together where we're you know keeping it interesting and figuring out because your body changes all the time and figuring out like what new things can we do together that you know bring about desire and and pleasure, and and it's not always gonna work.

SPEAKER_01 34:35

And is that where, as a sex therapist, you would have couples coming to you often at that point where they're like, How can we liven it up again and not do this sex dance that we do every time?

SPEAKER_00 34:45

Absolutely. So a lot of couples will come and say, like, it's um, you know, we're in a sexless relationship where you know we're either having this sex that we know what's gonna happen next, and we're just doing it because we should. Yeah. And it's not as you know fulfilling as it should be, and it's not as fulfilling as it used to be, and you know, how can we spice things up? And then I will give them homework and exercises to do. And one of the main ones that I start with is like I'll give them it's called it's called a traffic light system where you you give them like it's it's like it's a page and there's like an outline of a body, you know, like a dead body on the ground. Okay, yeah. And there's like lines all pointing to loads of different places from head to toe, and I get them to take it away. And so let's say it was you and your partner, okay. So I would say to you to go away and to from head to toe map out each other's bodies, like touching, massaging, kissing, licking, using maybe toys on different areas, and you would say to your partner, you know, red, that's doing nothing for me. Like, move on, that's not great. I didn't know where this is gone with top of my system. Okay, orange. Oh, maybe no, if you did it a little bit harder, or maybe if it was a little bit like maybe if you used your mouth there rather than your hand. And green, that's amazing. Keep going, keep going. That's so good. So then he gets to like map out all the places that turn you on and that you really like to be touched in certain ways, you know, or with certain body parts, but you don't have intercourse, right? You don't have intercourse doing that. Oh my goodness, yes, it's just all about mapping each other out. Now it's really you have to be really vulnerable. I'm thinking though, surely couples come back to you being like, we failed at not having words. I say it to them and they're like, oh, we'll try. Um but it's really good because like you have so much fun with it and you do have to be incredibly vulnerable. And there's parts that they've never touched on each other before that they they start and they get to bring in different things like feathers and you know, like vibrators or whatever they want, and they get to then, and it's just so connecting. It's so connecting.

SPEAKER_01 36:41

And in your experience as a therapist, do you feel like most couples who have moved into a sexless relationship or marriage do get that back? They get the excitement back.

SPEAKER_00 36:53

Only if there's trust. Oh wow, okay, only if there's trust.

SPEAKER_01 36:59

Um okay, so my next question. I actually meant to ask this earlier now, it's coming back to mind again, and I'm delighted it has. I feel like I have seen a lot of videos on Instagram, TikTok where they say a woman has to feel emotionally safe and secure and have like her wants met in so many other ways. And I mean I've like videos where people are saying, like, I need help in the kitchen, I need you to put the dishes away, I need you to do the washing more, I need you to ask me how my day was, I need you to look me in the eye when I'm telling you, not pick up the phone, all of these little things that I do think maybe a lot of men don't realise women need. Am I right in saying that is how most women can build greater trust in their partner by all of these things that are nothing to do with sex?

SPEAKER_00 37:51

Yes, the the the sex, like the the wanting for sex with women often happens way outside the bedroom. Yeah, and it's that you want to be seen, but not just sexually. Like I want to be seen in my struggle with the dishwasher, I want to be seen in my you know, argument with my friend at work that you want to listen to me, I want to be seen in my struggle with my body, I want you to tell me I'm beautiful, I want to be seen in my passions, I want you to see me not just for someone you can have sex with. And if you don't see me outside of the bedroom, it's never gonna work, then you can't see me inside, really.

SPEAKER_01 38:23

You're just you know, I'm it makes me sad because I feel like a lot of couples are in that place because of how society was from years ago, where women had a certain role and men had another. Yes, and I feel like that just l led to that becoming an even bigger problem.

SPEAKER_00 38:39

And there's so many couples that come and it's exactly that like I need the emotional connection in order to be intimate, and the man will say, and I need the mint intimate connection in order to be intimate. Yes, it is like this circle. How do you break that? So you they both have to be willing, it can't be, you know, who's gonna go who's gonna give in first. So they both have to come together and you know, in little ways figure out how they both want to be loved. And for a man, absolutely he wants he wants the intimacy, but it's more than that. He wants to be desired, yeah, you know, but he she can only desire him if she thinks that he really cares about her, you know? Yeah. So so you you work on the communication around figuring out what their love languages are and how they both want to be loved, and making sure that the husband is doing things or the partner, whoever, is doing things that makes her feel loved and vice versa, you know, and that when she feels like he's making an effort to show her and to love her in the way she wants to be loved, then there's much more of a likelihood that she'll want to be intimate.

SPEAKER_01 39:37

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 39:38

But it's a two-way street, it has to be.

SPEAKER_01 39:40

And do you feel like that two-way street then? I suppose I I listed off a number of things that the woman may want. It that's really down to love languages at the end of the day.

SPEAKER_00 39:48

It's down to love language, it's also down to you know, your willingness to see your partner, you know, your willingness to, you know, really want to get to know them and really want to, you know, connect, not just on a physical level.

SPEAKER_01 40:01

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 40:01

You know, because you can go through the motions. I can tell you this is your partner's love language, and you know, she likes words of affirmations, and he can say, Okay, three times a day now, I will tell her she's beautiful and I love her. And then she'll, you know, sleep with me tonight. You can't do that. No, it can't be transactional. It can't be transactional. Because like a lot of guys say to me, and I emptied the dishwasher and I sweeped the floor and I read the child the story and I went up to bed and she turned her back on me. Sure, what am I meant to do?

SPEAKER_01 40:26

Yeah, it's funny though, because that is a tally system, then it's it's not because they truly cared about making her feel secure or safe. It was I'm doing this to get what I want, yeah, not because I wanted to feel safe. Yeah, and that's the problem. Am I right?

SPEAKER_00 40:41

You're 100% right. It's so that's what I'm saying. It and I will say, like, it can't, it can't be I've done this, so now I deserve this. Yeah, because it it's not like a currency, you know, you can't use the dishwasher currency. Bought her a handbag. Um, it it has to be real connection, yeah. Because otherwise, what's the point, you know?

SPEAKER_01 41:00

What I remember once having a conversation with a friend years ago and she was in a relationship for quite a while, and she was like, God, sometimes you do just have to remind yourself like to to like have more sex and to like do more for him because you f forget that like you have to kind of you know put out for him or he might not stick around, sort of thing. And I remember I don't think I was in a relationship at the time when I had that conversation, and I remember just feeling kind of like sad about because I've I was like, God, so many people in long-term relationships, is that how it all goes? Is that how it just goes that the woman just feels like, oh, I have to remember to do this, or he's not going to feel like his needs are met, and he won't stick around and he'll leave if I don't do this. I I fear that a lot of women in really long-term relationships do this or act that way. Am I way off or no? Have you grouped your bang on the money?

SPEAKER_00 41:52

Okay, yeah, unfortunately. I didn't want to be. No, it does often become like that, unfortunately. And it's life, it's like it's it's the busyness of life at the moment. And it's it's also I know I'm like a broken recognizing, it's also screens. So, like a lot of couples are really against understandably, they're really against scheduling sex because then it it feels like oh another thing to do on our list. Oh, we're scheduling sex in and we'll have sex every Sunday morning or every Saturday night or whatever. So, what I say is like I'm also against that because I know that kind of takes the eroticism out of it or the spontaneity or the fun. But what I would say is that if you've got into a routine where like your relationship has become sexless, or if you if you're having if you're having sex less than 10 times a year, you're you're in a sexless relationship. Okay. Okay. Yeah. So if you're only having sex like less than once a month, um, or you're not having sex at all, and you're thinking about okay, we need to, we need to work on the intimacy. What I would say is don't schedule in time for sex, but schedule in time for connection. Say every Friday night we're gonna put our phones away, we're gonna, you know, either watch a movie together where we where we chat or we're gonna go to bed early together. We don't have to have sex, but we need to like cuddle and chat and yeah, catch up and you know have a bit of a kiss. It doesn't always have to lead to sex. Yeah, but you have to schedule in time for the couple to be together in an intimate way. So it's not your schedule and sex, you're scheduling time for the relationship. I call it like save the marriage night. Oh, I love it. Okay, we're gonna have save the marriage night and you're gonna decide what's the but it doesn't have to be sex. It can be you can go for dinner, you can go to the movies, you can go, but you're gonna have to schedule in time if you're gonna protect your relationship. And screen free time. Has to be screen free time. Because sometimes people are together, they're sitting on the couch, but they're watching completely different things. Yeah, and they're totally there's not they're not even nothing, there's no connection there at all.

SPEAKER_01 43:37

I really like that because that was one of the questions I was gonna uh ask you today is about scheduling sex because I think that came up when we spoke about it a long time ago on my old podcast, and it is it's a funny one to navigate because it just doesn't sound sexy or fun. Oh, there's so much pressure, yeah, and I think pressure I think for most women can turn them off it. Oh yeah, no, you just it's just never going to work, it's just going to go.

SPEAKER_00 44:00

Downhill. No, it's not. And if you feel like you have to be turned on or you have to be interested and you have to be ready for sex at a third time, you're almost guaranteed to not want to death that exact time.

SPEAKER_01 44:08

It's so true. It's way too much pressure. Yeah. Um, okay, we've we know we've already spoken about this one. Can confidence be faked until it becomes real? You know how people often say like fake it till you make it. And I've actually said in the past, I believe that from not in a sex perspective, but I feel like in other areas of my life, like when I was first on the radio, or maybe first did a podcast or first posted a piece to camera to Instagram, I really was not confident. And the more I did this, I got confident. Yes. How does that apply to the bedroom or to sex? Do you think it does?

SPEAKER_00 44:44

I think it does in that if you were, you know, putting on this amazing performance sexually okay. Yeah, and you wanted to really embody it, yeah, but you weren't, and you were just faking it till you make it, if you were doing the work in the background, if you were doing the embodiment work yourself in the background, where you know you were practicing the the self-love and the you know, noticing maybe something you don't like about yourself and immediately deciding, okay, you know, maybe I've decided that's not good enough, but what are the things I do like about myself that you're constantly aware and conscious of how you talk to yourself. So maybe it is it hasn't, it's like not 100% that you're feeling fully confident and you're you're performative or you're faking in some way. I think it will come together as long as you're doing that about the work in the background on yourself. Yeah, it's again that you can't eat yourself into self-love. Yeah, you can't. So I I wouldn't say, oh, don't do that. I think that like there's always going to be an element that's um performative at the start until you get really comfortable.

SPEAKER_01 45:41

That's I feel like that's reassuring for a lot of people to hear. I like that answer. That was lovely. Um, okay, moving on then a little bit. I literally feel like I could talk to you for hours about this. I love it. Yeah, you're amazing. Um, when it comes to awkwardness and stigmas, why do you think so many people are uncomfortable talking about sex?

SPEAKER_00 46:02

I think it brings up so many uh issues for people in terms of you know how they have been, how how how sex, how they've been thought about sex, how their experiences about sex has has gone. It's such a personal um issue and it brings up so much vulnerability. And we don't know what what people have been through sexually. We don't know if they're you know they're survivors of abuse, if you know they've had difficult experiences, if you know sex hasn't worked out for them, if they're not able to reach orgasm. And it's so personal, I think, that anytime sex is mentioned, um people kind of you know freeze a little bit internally or will jump to oh making fun, make it make it fun, make it light. Um that's definitely my experience when people find out I do psychosexual work. Um so I just think that there's lots of stigmas because people are still scared of how of being judged around sex because you know I often work with people and they're saying like, I feel judged by my friends for not wanting to have sex casual sex, or I feel judged by my friends for having too much casual sex. Yeah. So there's always judgment, you just can't get it. There's always a little bit of judgment. So I think you have to get to a place where again, you know, it comes back to that question of do you know who you are sexually and how you want to express your sexuality? You know, so so like how do you do you think that like the thing that turns you on the most about sex is being submissive? And how do you want to express that with a partner? Yeah and how comfortable do you feel talking about that? Or like do you want it to be really fun and light? Yeah, and do you want to laugh a lot? And the only way like you can reach orgasm is if you feel like you can have a laugh with somebody in the bedroom and you can make it really fun, but like you're with someone who's really serious, you know. And how do you then express yourself, you know, or you have to figure out like who am I to myself? So the work is with yourself first. So figuring out all the things you like about your body sexually, yeah, all the things that turn you on, you know, exploring different toys, you know, different things that get you there. Women um really respond well to audio, audio erotic novels. What women love women love a story, men love a visual. I'm being I'm being very broad down here, but generally, okay.

SPEAKER_01 48:15

I was gonna go into asking you more about women uh and orgasming and how to get us there because obviously there's big question marks around that. So we're like, take the floor, tell me more about this.

SPEAKER_00 48:24

We love audio. So any of the research that's come out in terms of you know helping women to feel more sexual, okay. Um it's well known that like men, men are visual creatures and they love the image, but like the the porn that women respond to most is the porn that has a story, right? So any of the ethical porn sites where you know the actors are not being trafficked and they're being paid as much as the men, um, there'll often be, you know, they they're obviously more geared for women. Um there'll often be a story, there'll be a background, there'll be some, it'll be it'll be short, but there'll be a storyline to some degree. So in a book, in a novel that's like erotica, there's a real backstory, you know, and there's a build-up. And women just love the connection piece or how they got together or what happens. So, like erotic, um, audio erotic books, you'll you'll get loads like this. I could list off them and um, but women find that really, really a big turn on.

SPEAKER_01 49:16

So let's say you're on a long drive home from somewhere.

SPEAKER_00 49:18

Oh no, listen driving vodka. So do you know what? Like if you if you let if you know you're gonna be home in 20 minutes and you're hoping to rush in the door and drag him to the bedroom, definitely sort of the story on. This is madness.

SPEAKER_01 49:39

That is, I feel like this is really helpful information for people though, because I've never obviously with a lot of friends, like you'd be having conversations about what's you know gone on and different things you've experienced. I've never heard anyone say we listened to X or Y and it led to this incredible sex. I've never heard this.

SPEAKER_00 49:56

They don't talk, like people often don't talk about yeah, these little things.

SPEAKER_01 50:00

These little things, yeah. So one topic that we haven't touched on, two topics that I'd love to touch on before we move towards the end of the podcast. One would be toys and how I don't know if important is the word, but how useful you think they are, how much you might recommend them, uh, how much of a place you think they have in, I suppose, a sex life for a couple.

SPEAKER_00 50:21

They have a big place in a sex life for a couple if that's how the woman um reaches orgasm alone. Okay. So, you know, if if a woman finds that like the the easiest and you know most erotic experience she has while she's by herself is always with a toy. Yeah, then she should absolutely be bringing that toy into the bedroom. Okay. And that should be welcomed.

SPEAKER_01 50:40

And so that was my next question. I feel like often if I was in a man's shoes, you might initially feel like you're not good enough, or you can't do that for her if she has to bring in this toy. Well, you can't vibrate to that degree.

SPEAKER_00 50:56

So, you know, you really can't, and you're not expected to. Yeah. And you know, a lot of women um orgasm through clitoral stimulation, and there's no woman that expects a man's penis to do what a vibrator can do. Yeah. Or uh, you know, a clitoral stimulator toy um can do. So don't take that pressure off yourself immediately and be like, you know, she's really going to enjoy all the foreplay, she's going to enjoy the intercourse, but she's also going to enjoy being able to orgasm in the way that like she knows that it's going to work for her. Yeah. And you're going to then bridge that orgasm gap that's so massive between couple in between men and women, and it's always going to be a wonderful experience for both of you, um, as long as you don't make it about yourself. Yeah. Don't make it about whether you're good enough. It's nothing to do about whether you're good enough, it's about, you know, that her clitoris needs this kind of stimulation. And you should be holding that toy for her and having a great time watching her, having so much fun. I love this.

SPEAKER_01 51:48

I love it. Okay, my last question then you mentioned bridging the gap. Um, so it's kind of around that. And I guess how how can we so if he says, you know, I'm not gonna get there tonight, or if she says, I'm not gonna get there tonight, I feel like that can just happen. These things happen. So how do how does the other person not feel bad about that?

SPEAKER_00 52:10

So I think you uh it should almost be a given before you enter into any sort of intimacy that there needs to not be any expectation. Like take the expectation off the table. Like we're just gonna be curious and explore and enjoy being the expectation to finish to orgasm. The expectation to finish, yeah. That it it's not about you know getting there, it's not about who comes or who doesn't. It's it's about you know how lovely was that. Yeah, how nice was that to connect, you know, how wonderful was that for you know, you to touch me there and that was really pleasurable and enjoyable, or you know, for you to spend time connecting with me, or you know, whatever I could go into loads of different things that you could be doing to each other. Um but like when there's pressure, you know, there's it takes away from everything else that was nice because it feels like a pass fail, you're going into a a pass or a fail. And then it becomes like the elephant in the room, and then the focus becomes on whether you finished, whether you finished and if you didn't, it was a fail. The second you put that kind of pressure on yourself, so much performance anxiety comes into the room, and then it stops being about just being curious and being playful and having fun and connecting, and it should always be just about those things.

SPEAKER_01 53:19

Yeah, I think that's probably something a lot of couples needed to hear or individuals would need to hear. Thank you so much. This has been incredible. We are coming towards the end, but before we do, I often ask, I always ask guests if they have a ground shaking confession they could share with me. Now, often these, you know, it doesn't I was gonna give you a warning on this one, and then I said no, I won't, because it doesn't have to be something personal, it could just be something as simple as you know, uh add-on you did to your studies that completely changed things for you, something you did to elevate your business, it doesn't need to be personal. I want you to know that. But something, if you could confess to us, that you've done that really shook things up in your life, big or small.

SPEAKER_00 54:00

Oh, this is gonna sound um maybe a bit vanilla, which I shouldn't be, but I think actually training to going adding on after doing the master's in cognitive behavior, deciding to go on and do psychosexual. I couldn't agree with you more, was what shook things up because I would never have there's so many, it's brought me down so many different avenues of understanding people's sexual behaviours, kinks, you know, different uh groups of people and you know, things they're gonna get up to that you'd never know about that you'd never know about unless you're involved in. Um that is, you know, so fun, so exciting, so liberating that had I never gone down the route of studying sex therapy, and it was like I remember like doing a radio show before and like you know, people not being happy about things I was talking about, or you know, having to warn my dad that I was going on the radio to talk about sex. You have to warn my dad about this episode before we share. So, like there, like there was you know, loads of questions about whether it was the right thing to do. Um, but I'm just so glad I did it because it's really brought me closer to understanding sexuality and got me closer to, I suppose, um, exploring my own sexuality and being able to express it in a really authentic way. And like that's my wish for everyone because there should be no shame, there should be no um judgment or or fears. You know, it's about moving towards first self-love and then connecting to others.

SPEAKER_01 55:21

Oh, I love that. That is so beautiful, and it's such a gorgeous answer. And I do think, you know, coming having you come in today, we were like, I love having people who are the definition of you know, leading the example and shaking the ground. This idea where the where the name of the podcast came from. And it's not just having you here to help people do that in their intimacy and their sex life, but you are someone who has done that by becoming a sex therapist because it comes with so much judgment and stigmas, I which it shouldn't, but it does. So I think that is such a beautiful answer, and you are incredible. We're definitely gonna have you back on. Thank you so much. Um, honestly, this has been such an incredible episode. Before we finish, Audrey, I usually do a quick fire where I'd say things like, you know, tea or coffee, sunrise, sunset. But I'm gonna take a bit of a different angle here. Okay, and I'm gonna say finish the sentence. Okay. Now we've kind of probably like spoken through a lot of this, but we're gonna just hopefully kind of give these sentences a short and quick synopsis if possible. Okay. Right, okay.

SPEAKER_00 56:22

So the first one people would feel more sexually confident if they uh allowed themselves to accept themselves fully and practiced self-love and care. Beautiful, love it. The biggest intimacy killer is screens. Oh sorry. Most people are overthinking how they look and yeah, whether they're um acting like porn stars. Yeah, I love that. You become your most attractive when you figure out who you are sexually and how to embody that and express it to the fullest degree. That is beautiful.

SPEAKER_01 56:59

Um the sexiest thing someone can do is be themselves. Yes, I love that. A healthy, intimate relationship needs time, time and care.

SPEAKER_00 57:13

And toys, yeah, for sure. Time and toys. No, time and care. Time, time and attention, yeah.

SPEAKER_01 57:22

Oh god.

SPEAKER_00 57:22

Um a lot of people secretly believe that they are only sexy if they look a certain way. So true. The healthiest couples usually the healthiest couples usually talk about intimacy together but are not afraid to ask for what they want and show up for each other in loads of ways outside of the bedroom.

SPEAKER_01 57:52

This is beautiful. I feel like we could make a little like flipbook out of this with like, you know, different pages with each of these. The very last one, Audrey, the advice I wish more people heard is You are normal.

SPEAKER_00 58:04

You are so normal, and it's okay to not feel confident, and it's okay to struggle with body image, and this is a journey, and you are not abnormal to like be struggling with this issue because everyone is, and you are so normal, and you are entitled to pleasure and love, and there is a way, it's a practice. It's not gonna happen with a pale, it's not gonna happen with a therapy session. Unfortunately, it's not gonna happen by just listening to this podcast, it's a practice, and if you get into that practice, you can have all of those things and more that you you deserve. That you deserve for sure. Audrey, thank you so much.

SPEAKER_01 58:34

You're so welcome, it's lovely. Absolutely amazing. Before we finish up, guys, I just want to take a moment to thank our partners at Amplify Podcast Studio. Honestly, having the right team behind you makes all the difference. And Amplify don't just produce podcasts, they build podcasts designed to last. If creating something meaningful in this space is on your mind, definitely check them out at amplify.ie. And that brings us to the end of today's episode. Audrey, I truly can't thank you enough for taking the time to join us here today. It has been my favourite episode so far. I think it's just, I guess it is breaking down that stigma and the awkwardness that comes with it, and you make that seamless and so easy, and you've created such a safe space. I know this is going to help so many people.

SPEAKER_02 59:16

I hope so.

SPEAKER_01 59:17

If they want to get in contact with you, how can they do so?

SPEAKER_00 59:20

So you can go to the website which is www.sextherapysolutions uh.ie, or you'll find me on Instagram under um activation.

SPEAKER_01 59:29

Amazing. Thank you so much. So, guys, if you enjoyed this one, don't forget to like, subscribe, or leave us a comment wherever you are listening. It makes a huge difference to help us keep going. Until next time, thank you so much. Thank you for having me.