WS1858 Key Strategies for Successful Real Estate Syndication | Highlights Alex Tam & Alex Kingman

Embark on a captivating journey of transformation with our guest, Alex Tam, as he shares his inspiring shift from the medical field to a thriving real estate investor. In this episode, Alex takes center stage to unveil his unique narrative, chronicling his progression from a limited partner to actively engaging in numerous real estate syndication deals. Join us as he recounts his experiences, emphasizing his prowess in capital raising and cultivating investor relations.

Fasten your seatbelt as we explore the world of virtual assistants (VAs) within the real estate landscape. Drawing insights from "Who Not How" by Dan Sullivan and Benjamin Hardy, we shed light on the strategic art of task delegation to boost overall efficiency. Tune in to hear Alex's journey of overseeing 8 to 11 VAs, uncovering valuable insights into selecting the right virtual assistant and effectively managing their tasks.

Continue the ride as we pivot to the critical role of communication and regular updates in real estate syndication. Alex Kingman imparts invaluable tips on crafting investor updates and maintaining seamless contact with a growing investor base. Discover his challenges in staying connected with a vast investor network and the innovative solutions he employs, including ensuring at least an annual call with each investor. For more insightful episodes, be sure to subscribe to the Real Estate Syndication Show and stay abreast of the latest knowledge in the field!



Don't miss out on the full depth of  wealth of insights shared in this episode! Click on the links below to immerse yourself in the complete conversation.

 

https://lifebridgecapital.com/2023/07/18/ws1731-scaling-your-company-using-virtual-assistants-alex-tam/

https://lifebridgecapital.com/2023/07/20/ws1733-strategies-for-finding-real-estate-properties-that-are-under-market-value-alex-kingman/

VISIT OUR WEBSITE
https://lifebridgecapital.com/

Here are ways you can work with us here at Life Bridge Capital:
⚡️START INVESTING TODAY: If you think that real estate syndication may be right for you, contact us today to learn more about our current investment opportunities: https://lifebridgecapital.com/investwithlbc

⚡️Watch on YouTube: https://www.youtube.com/@TheRealEstateSyndicationShow

📝 JOIN THE DISCUSSION
https://www.facebook.com/groups/realestatesyndication

➡️ FOLLOW US
https://twitter.com/whitney_sewell
https://www.instagram.com/whitneysewell/
https://www.linkedin.com/in/whitney-sewell/

⭐ Be Our Guest!
We are continuously working hard to help our listeners with their journey to real estate syndication. If you think you can add value in any way to our listeners who are in commercial real estate, then we’d love to have you over.
Apply here: https://lifebridgecapital.com/join-our-podcast/

Transcript

Whitney Sewell: [00:00:00] is your daily real estate syndication show. I'm your host, Whitney Sewell. Today, we've packed a number of shows together to give you some highlights. I know you're going to enjoy the show . Thank you for being with us today..

Alex, welcome to the show. And you have some skills that I know everybody listening, whether they're passive investor, whether active would love to learn more about, and we're going to talk about some real estate and how you got into that. And we're going to talk about this other thing that you do that's going to help us as well.

But first give us a little more about who you are, obviously a little bit about your story, what before real estate and why. 

Alex Tam: Yeah, sure. Absolutely. Well, Whitney, thank you so much for having me on the show. I really, really appreciate it. I started my real estate journey when I was almost 10 years in practice as a chiropractor.

So I run a medical practice and in 2018, I decided I'm going to go into a business conference. And I saw this guy named Grant Cardell sitting on an [00:01:00] airplane, right? On, on the, on the cover of his book, went to a conference. He's talking about syndications. And that was the very first time, Whitney, that I heard about what a syndication ever was soon after got into some limited partnership deals.

And did that from 2020 from 2018 to 2021. And in 2021, my wife and I decided that we need to be more active since other doctors now. Are asking me what to invest in, in real estate. And I didn't feel educated enough as a limited partner to teach them about that and joined the education platform. I'm Jake and Gino joined some mastermind and eventually gotten to become a GP and three deals last year and JV and a few more deals.

And here we are. Capital raising I realize is really one of my strong suits. [00:02:00] And also team building, marketing. So that's where I found that we add the most value with the teams that we've joined so far. 

Whitney Sewell: That's awesome. Congratulations to you and your wife, by the way, in making the leap, right. And making it really make it happen.

And I know that's, that's Jake and Gina's motto, right? Make it happen. One of theirs. I like those guys. I've known them for a long time. Great group, by the way, but awesome. I think it's neat when. There's so many of us and so many people on the show can like think about the moment where it's like, wait a minute.

I never heard of syndication before. I didn't know this was a thing. Right. Uh, and, and yeah, I'm the same way. It's like, there was a time when, when I was like, Whoa, I can actually own a hundred unit complex or I can go make that happen and, but. And put a team together, right? To go do that and do that. I appreciate you elaborating on that.

Let's talk about that a little bit. You said your superpower. All right. The thing that you do well, you talked about was the marketing piece, the capital raising piece. Most of the people [00:03:00] listening want to know more about how you do that, right? And would love to know more about how you do that. And so let's dive in there a little bit and maybe you could elaborate on your, what you consider your superpower is and let's dive in.

Alex Tam: Yeah. How we, how I realized that capital raising was going to be more of my, Core thing to do and investor relations was after joining Jake and Gino, they were like, well, there's multiple things in a, in a group there's that the boots on the ground. All right, Alex, are you going to be a boots on the ground?

I said, well, what does it mean? Then I realized what a boots on the ground is and I'm nowhere near boots on the ground. Then there's the asset management. Well, I didn't have any background in that. Well, how about capital raising? I said, well, yeah, I've been at LP for many years now. They're like, well, do you know other people with money?

I said, yeah, in my circle of friends, I know other people who have money as well. Do you think they like to invest? I said, oh yeah, of course they love to invest. [00:04:00] And that's how I really got into that. Once I figured out, okay, this is what I'm going to do from there. I realized it's client relationships, right?

It's all about building the relationships. When I go to conferences, medical conference, real estate conference, building a good relationship with operators, different sponsors, finding out exactly how they work, right? What they do. And then on top of that, finding out what my. Investors are looking for, and those are going to be a few key pieces after that.

Well, I have a virtual assistant team that puts everything together on my social media, whether it's videos, audio, written blogs. So we're able to turn an idea into a reality very quickly. Because of the stature of our team. Yeah. Yeah, 

Whitney Sewell: no, I love that. I have told so many people similar [00:05:00] to what you said there.

It's like, you can't do it all right. And to buy that a hundred unit building. Yes. I think it's. It's often it's, there's not too many more steps there than it takes to buy that sixplex, right? It's just larger scale, but there are pieces of that, that, man, you just don't have the, if you don't have the asset management background, or you don't have some kind of experience level there, you need people on the team that do have that experience.

Right. But oftentimes getting started, there are parts of the puzzle that you're just better at, right, already that you can jump into depending on what your background is. And it sounds like that's exactly what you did and people, what I I've just seen over the years that people move so much faster in this business when they can do exactly what you did and like figure out the piece of the puzzle that I really want to focus on and be really good at that.

And then go find the other people that are really good at those other pieces of the puzzle. It helps them to move so much faster. And, and better as well. Right. You're not also trying to learn asset management at the same time. No, that would be a nice, you have to 

Alex Tam: know, do you have [00:06:00] to know about it? We hop on the asset management calls, right?

And, but the, the, the nitty gritty of how the property management, I'm not the one talking to property management. 

Whitney Sewell: But let's talk about then how you started to scale that to some degree. Right. I know now you have a, a team that's helping you do this as far as notify educating those investors, like you're talking about through social media and different ways. Talk about how you started to do that and even how, where you're at now with that.

Alex Tam: Yeah. You know, when, as I got more active into it, every time I learned something, I will write it down or we'll go off of a book. Right. And read about what are investors looking for? What are the problems that they're facing? Now, I don't have to look that far, Whitney, because all I do is think back of the struggles that I had four or five years ago.

I've heard before your best client and your best investor was you three to five years ago. And I said, okay, what [00:07:00] was I dealing with? I'm going to speak to other doctors. What are other doctors dealing with? Lack of time, lack of family. What is it? Right. They don't know what to do there with their money.

Maybe they lost some money in the stock market. Like I have. So I just speak to those troops. And then from there, you have certain truths that you want to speak about. You find VAs. I have my, my VAs that put things and align items on my calendar. I do videos on it. We have a production team that edits those videos.

We blast them out. And all of stories, social media, and ultimately get known in the space for what you do so that when you reach out to people, you're not just a stranger, right, in the space. Yeah, no 

Whitney Sewell: doubt about it. That's ultimately what I did as well. Uh, but, uh, speak to how you started to utilize our VAs and maybe some of the first things that you found useful for them to help you with, and then we'll [00:08:00] talk about how you scaled that some, but, but I, so much so often.

I've pushed people to use VAs for like five years. Once I started figuring out, Hey, this is pretty amazing. Right. That it's, you're building the team. It's almost exactly what you said. You have a focus right in the syndication business that you're really good at, but then you're building on a team of people that are really good at pieces of what you need as well.

Early on, what were the first, say, few things that you had them do for you? And yeah, yeah, we'll start there. 

Alex Tam: No, great question. So this, we have to kind of go back a few years. It goes back to 2016 as the doctor in the office, as the business owner, I'm right, I'm wearing a lot of hats and one of them is marketing.

And I would go online on weekends, create newsletters, create flyers, try to edit videos all on my own. And Saturday and Sunday morning, I'll be in there three, four, five hours at a time and lose out on those morning times with my family. Eventually I wanted to find help. [00:09:00] And someone online mentioned a VA.

I didn't know what a VA was. I thought it was veterans affairs, right? I thought a VA, find a VA. What do you, what does the military have to do with it? It's a virtual assistant. When I hired my first virtual assistant, they made a lot of graphics because our business has to get known, right? And it worked out so well, I hired a second full time one for my paid ads.

And now we have 11 full time VAs working for our own team between the medical office, the virtual assistant business, and the real estate. On top of that, we have multiple VAs that work for other clients as well. Part time and full time. So we first started delegating all of the marketing and then eventually now I have a VA.

That's my personal executive assistant, handling my calendar, [00:10:00] reaching out to you, booking this podcast, answering emails, following up, right? We have ones that develops the CRM and making sure that our follow up system is intact, focusing on all the social media, making sure that the comments. And messages are going out, coming in, are being answered and any, any piece.

I read the book, who not how Whitney. And we went from eight VAs to 11 VAs. Um, and that's, that's where we're at. 

Whitney Sewell: Yeah. I've also, I've got it actually right here on the shelf behind me. And I highly recommend that book. Yeah. Dan Sullivan, Benjamin Hardy, no doubt help you wrap your mind around not doing everything yourself.

Right. So you can do it a lot better. Right. And hiring VAs, maybe you have a couple of tips on. On finding some, you know, the right VA, right? Some people are so hesitant about using somebody that's in another country. Right. How did you get past that hurdle and feel comfortable hiring somebody [00:11:00] that's in another country?

Maybe a couple of tips on finding the right person. 

Alex Tam: I realized at the beginning, I said, man, I know in the Philippines, they're the same time zone as Hong Kong. That's where I grew up. Right. And I said, When it's in the morning here, it's in the evening over there. My relatives are sleeping in the middle of the night.

And that's the biggest hurdle that I had to get out of my mind. And when I started talking to VAs, I realized a lot of the VAs in the Philippines, they work on us time. I was like, Oh, you guys are already used to that, right? Then it's a matter of trusting and verifying. You trust them with doing certain tasks.

A VA can do any tasks, Whitney, that you can do on the computer or on the phone. They can call people. They can email, they can do anything as long as they don't have to physically do it. Now, until they come out with the robot, I could put a VA on. We can't do that yet, but you start off with simple tasks.

That trust is so important, [00:12:00] right? And once they can prove to you that they can do the simple tasks, start increasing the level of critical thinking, the level of importance in the task. And then eventually it's really as if I'm hiring someone on my team, but they're in the next room. What's the difference?

I don't see them. They're just working right by, beside me. And if I call, they pick up during our office hours. So it's no different than a remote worker in the States. 

Whitney Sewell: What level of expertise do you require? It depends. Or what should we expect? It 

Alex Tam: depends on what level of expertise are you looking for.

Right? A VA can, we have VAs that write. They can blog. They can post on social media. They can do graphics. They can edit all your videos. We have bookkeeping VAs that we found for other clients. We have sales VAs, cold calling VAs that have done that. [00:13:00] So, heck, there are VAs out there who does programming if you need to, right?

Building websites that you can find, you know, and certain proficiencies. It depends on what you're looking for. And anything that has to do with computers or on the phone. You could probably find a VA that could do it. 

Whitney Sewell: What about, uh, tracking? How do you, you pay them hourly salary? How have you found the best way to say, make sure you're getting the best bang for your buck or that they're actually working when they're supposed to be working, cause they're not in that room next door.

You're not, how do you manage that? You 

Alex Tam: know, initially I did a lot of the first few years. I did a lot of hourly tracking, right? They're working with me hour. I paid them per salary. But they're working eight hours a day. And at the beginning, I felt like I needed to track their time. Well, eventually, I realized there are softwares out there that move the mouse once in a while.

That helps you virtually [00:14:00] move the keystroke once in a while so that your VA can look like they're working, right? As you're tracking them. But they're actually not. So eventually you have to be the one that gauges your expectations. You know, these things need to be done per day. Is your VA doing it right?

How productive are they setting the expectation and then checking up on their work? Having a virtual team is no different than having a team here that is also virtual. Can you trust them? The moment I can't trust the VA, they're no longer on my team. I'll tell you that much. If I have to question whether or not you're doing work for me and whether or not you're actually doing the work, you're already off my team.

I can't trust you. If I can't trust you with just punctuality and time, how am I going to trust you with something way [00:15:00] more important than that? 

Whitney Sewell: No, completely agree. I have personally struggled with the tracking pace. And, and I've led, it's led me to exactly what you just said. It's like, wait a minute. If I can't trust them, I, they just can't, I, I don't have the, I don't want to spend the mental capacity on worrying about if I can trust them.

Right now, I need to be able to trust them and know that they're pushing the ball forward. Right. 

Alex Tam: Right. Cause their job is to make my life easier. Right. If your job is not making my life easier, it's making my life harder. I no longer need you on your team. I don't care if it's in 

Whitney Sewell: person or virtual. 

How can the listeners get in touch with you and learn more about you? 

Alex Tam: Um, they can find me on LinkedIn, which is Dr. Alex Tam, Facebook, Instagram. My cell is 775 717 0090. And your listeners can call me, reach out to me, shoot me a text, either way works.

Whitney Sewell: Alex, welcome to the show. 

Alex Kingman: Hi [00:16:00] Whitney. Thank you so much for having me.

I'm really excited to be here. 

Whitney Sewell: Yeah. Honored to meet you and to have you on the show. Give us a little bit about who Alex is, your background in maybe real estate or what was before real estate and let's dive into our topic today. 

Alex Kingman: Sure. So before I went full time into real estate, I was in sales and marketing, and I actually was a top Airstream salesperson and I loved it.

I was really into it and it was a springboard to be able to go full time into real estate. And so now I'm full time in real estate. We started investing in real estate about five or actually it's been about six years now. About six years ago, and we started with a house hack, so it was a three bed, two bath with a gross granny unit on the other side that was kind of like a little studio with a bathroom and a garage right next to it.

So we actually lived in [00:17:00] the granny unit, rented out the three bed, two bath, and then renovated the granny unit and the garage into a two bed, one bath. And so we lived in one side, rented out the other, and that's kind of how we just got into the space. From there, we decided that we really liked real estate investing.

And my partner is the, he's now a general contractor. At the time, he was just kind of in the construction industry and working, um, in the trades. And so we decided to specifically focus on. Heavy value add properties, distressed properties where we can bring it up physical value add component to it because we had that going for us already.

We had the background in it early seated and I was the partner. So then we, we decided we want to continue investing in real estate, but this first property was in California, so we decided to continue investing elsewhere. [00:18:00] Because as probably most of your listeners are aware, California is not necessarily the most popular for real estate investing.

So we moved into a couple of different markets. Uh, we did a lot of research and we landed on, uh, Jacksonville, Florida and, um, South Bend, Mishwaka, just Northern Indiana area. Um, so we bought some different properties there and learned a lot along the way about, uh, different. Aspects of investing from a distance and about just managing larger rehab projects and things like that.

So it was a really good experience. At some point in the process, we actually learned that we had a lot of people who are actually interested in investing with us. So we started doing some JVs and, and it kind of just went from there. We decided that we wanted to go bigger and. Then we got [00:19:00] into multifamily simplifications, doing the same kind of strategy of the distressed or heavy value add properties, specifically with that physical component.

And now we have been just looking for the next properties and usually focusing kind of in that 20 to 100 unit space. And we've done, we have a property in Oklahoma that we're working on. Renovating at the moment at 72 unit property. And that one has been going really well. And so yeah, from here, we've just been working on growing everything and bringing more, you know, new investors in and what gave you the 

Whitney Sewell: confidence to be able to move into, you know, syndication specifically, did you all maybe have some mentors, you surround yourself with other people that were doing it, 

Alex Kingman: how did you do that?

So we actually decided that. What we were doing made more sense for the people we were working [00:20:00] with, the partners who wanted to be more passive in deals, and then for ourselves to, I guess, have more economy of scale to go into the space. We didn't have any particular mentors. We actually weren't sure exactly how to get into the space at first.

So we were kind of like, okay, we're going to do it. Now what? I think a lot of people get stuck there because it is kind of a whole mother. level in a way than one to four unit properties. And it takes a slightly different skill set because you have to learn about terminology and the syndication world in general.

So we actually, we weren't sure what to do. So we just started with what we. Thought would be best. So we just started networking. We started just getting around people who were doing what we wanted to do. And networking, we went to a lot of online and in person networking meetups and events, and really [00:21:00] from there.

It took off, we met the right people that we wanted to work with and we just went from there. So that's a good start. Yeah. 

Whitney Sewell: Congratulations to you all though, for just making it happen. Thank you. You didn't get stuck there. I think so many people, they hear the word syndication and it kind of scares them, right?

Yeah, 

Alex Kingman: it can definitely be a little 

Whitney Sewell: intimidating. Yeah. They don't move forward and it sounds like it didn't. So you all down, you kept moving forward and, and surrounding yourself with people that were already doing it. I think that's doing it. The, I think that's huge for myself and for so many people that I've seen move forward, right?

It's all about getting out there, meeting people who are ahead of you and being able to ask some questions. So you have a sales marketing background and now you're in, it's a really good background for investor relations, right? And marketing in our business. Can tell us, let's dive in there a little bit and some of the skill sets maybe, or Things that you learned from that background, right?

That have helped you in this business to not only attract investors and get them to sign up and all [00:22:00] those things, but provide great service, right? To our investors. And so let's walk through that process a little bit, but what are some things maybe you brought from that background that have, that have been so beneficial to you that maybe I wouldn't have, right?

Without 

Alex Kingman: that background. I think one of the biggest areas that I've found it to be helpful. Is when I'm sharing a deal with investors, I know what they're looking for a lot more. When sales, one of the reasons that I did really well is because I didn't focus on trying to just close everyone or be like a lot of, a lot of people think about sales and they think that they can't trust a salesperson, but I was always trying to be the opposite of that.

I was always trying to be as helpful as I possibly could and figure out exactly what it was that people. Those, that specific, um, client needed and wanted, and then give that to them. So it was always a very open process and [00:23:00] something that was really enjoyable because you actually got to help people get exactly what they wanted.

So when it comes to sharing deals with investors and, and it's really, it really just comes down to giving them what they want. So you just figure out exactly what they're looking for, what their why is. They want to dig deep onto. What it is that they're trying to accomplish with these investments, not just, Oh, we're just going to make some passive income and, but why?

So what is it? Are you trying to have more time freedom in your life? Are you actually, are you happy with your job and you're actually, you're just looking for a retirement later on? What is it that you're trying to do? Because that affects, you know, the type of deals you want to do and what your strategy is.

And so from there, you're able to, you're able to. Really understand each investor and then be able to show them the deals that will be best for them and why it will be best for them. How do you, 

Whitney Sewell: how do you find that information out? Where do you, when in the [00:24:00] process, or when do you ask that? Or, you know, when does that come up that you learn that exact thing?

Alex Kingman: A lot of times when an investor is interested in what we do, we'll do a call and just get to know each other, see if we're a good fit to potentially work together in the future. And at that point, a lot of times I'll. Ask questions about what it is that they're looking for and see if, if what we do, um, specifically with the value add, um, type of properties is something that could be a good fit for their goals.

And if not, then I can know pretty quickly and maybe share with them somebody else who might be doing something more in line with what they're looking for. How do you document that? Typically, I just kind of take some notes while I am talking to them and And then I just have, I just use, right now I use HubSpot and I'll just put all their criteria in there.

And that [00:25:00] way I always know it's always connected to them and I always know exactly what it is that they're working for so that when a deal comes up, I can match the two and 

Whitney Sewell: go from there. Let's, let's go a little bit earlier in that process, marketing background. How are you attracting them? 

Alex Kingman: I do a lot of networking to start with.

Um, I like to find groups. That typically, I guess, uh, different passive investors are already hanging out in. So maybe that's bigger pockets forums, or maybe that's for example, the left field investors group or something like that. And then I like to be able to share something that I think would help them maybe provide some kind of value, whether that's online on LinkedIn with a post or whatever the case may be, but share something that would be valuable to them and then see if they are interested in.

in chatting more and if they'd be interested in just learning more about KGI [00:26:00] capital, what we do and, and then just go from there. 

Whitney Sewell: Yeah, no. Awesome. What about a, your maybe cadence for reaching out, right? Making those things happen, whether it's BP or other social media platforms. I don't know, just provide some insight in your marketing there and how you do that.

I get questions about that all the time. Sure. Yeah. How do you market to investors and how do you do that? It's 

Alex Kingman: a good question, especially because, especially if you are a sponsor that focuses on 506B, it starts to be like, you can't really put out there what you do or, you know, the deal you're doing, but you got to have investors to do the deal.

And so it can be a little tough, but what I like to focus on is a lot of times I will, for example, let's just say on our first, when we were first getting into the space, I joined A group, um, an investing group. It was tribe of Titans. I think Brian Briscoe, I don't know if you're aware of it, but [00:27:00] it was just like a tight knit group of people.

A lot of them were active investor, but some were also passive. So I actually just reached out to everyone on the platform. I was just really excited to learn from anyone and everyone, but also hopefully find a couple of LPs in there and see if any of them had any interest of working with us. So I just messaged each person and looked at their background and I was like, Oh, this is cool.

Tell me more about this. Really tried to build relationships with everyone there, and that was really beneficial. So that was kind of a good way to get into the space, but also to make those connections and, and, you know, build relationships with the people that are looking for the deals that you have. So, yeah, that was a good, a good way.

And if syndicators are looking for a way to make those relationships, finding a group where people are really engaged and have. Potential investors in it is a good way to start and then just reaching out to those people and [00:28:00] getting to talk to them on a zoom call or in person, if they're local, even better, and then just kind of 

Whitney Sewell: going from there. 

Now that you've been doing this a bit, what would you say are some of the biggest mistakes that other GPs or operators are making that cause say passives not to want to invest or reinvest? 

Alex Kingman: That's a good question. I think one of the biggest things that I've heard, you know, a lot of people that I've talked to that are passive investors have worked with other syndicators in the past and the main thing that I hear is, yeah, actually the returns were fine, the deal was okay.

You know, I even got really good returns, but they did not ever communicate with me. I could never get ahold of them and I never got any updates. And so really the biggest issue that I've heard from LPs is poor communication. And that's one of the easiest, in my [00:29:00] opinion, one of the easiest things to be able to give to investors.

And one of the things that I think that shouldn't be a question, it shouldn't be whether or not they're going to hear back. I think it needs to be something that's taken really seriously because. You are a steward of their investments, so you need to be upfront and be sharing what's going on because it's, this is their, their capital and their, their money.

And for some people, if they are just getting started in the space, a lot of times it might be quite a big sum for them to be putting into a deal and. That's important for them to hear from you and for them to be able to know what's going on, whether it's good or bad, they just want to know. So, and they just want to know if it is bad, what are you doing about it?

How are you handling it? And things like that. So, communication, um, sending updates at least quarterly, telling them what's going on, what's going [00:30:00] well, what are you focusing on, what's, you know, looking forward, what's going on. And then keeping in contact in between those updates as well, whether that's going rock climbing or just giving them a call and saying, Hey, this is kind of what's happening and, and just keep you in touch.

I think that is one of the biggest, most important things that I think a lot of people and syndicators kind of forget. Yeah. 

Whitney Sewell: Yeah. It's a. It's a difficult thing, especially as you grow and your investor based scales. I wish I could still talk to every investor more often, right? And it's, it's very difficult to make that happen.

And we're trying to set up even systems now where I can still like. And at least like once a year, still call all of our active investors. That's difficult, right. To get done or, you know, and trying to be more available, but for them, cause it is a service, right. That we want to provide. Your updates, and we'll shift to a few final questions in just a moment, but maybe highlight what you would suggest is important, say in an investor [00:31:00] update, right, the monthly or quarterly or whatever.

 How can the listeners get in touch with you and learn 

more 

Alex Kingman: about you? Yeah, absolutely. And thanks again for having me. If you guys are looking for a way to get in touch with me, I'm, I'm on LinkedIn, just Alex Kingman.

And then our website has a little space where you can schedule a time to chat with me if you want to. It's that invest with KGI. com. And I'd say those are the two best places to get ahold of me. That's where I'm most active.