Next Level University

#1387 - The Problem Might Be Deeper Than You Think

• Kevin Palmieri and Alan Lazaros

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In this episode, hosts Kevin Palmieri and Alan Lazaros excavate underlying issues holding you back, and discuss how our upbringing and early experiences can shape our fears and responses. Be prepared to confront those uncomfortable areas of your psyche as they guide you through peeling back the layers to reveal what's holding you back. They shed light on the transient nature of feelings, the importance of brutal honesty with oneself, and how a coach can help navigate these turbulent waters. The journey to self-discovery can be challenging, but it's always worth it.

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Show notes:
[3:01] Digging deeper into the fear of judgment 
[6:40] Everyone is fearful, just with different things
[10:02] The trampoline
[13:13] Janine Morris talks about how valuable Group Coaching is, what her takeaway is, and why she thinks you should take the leap
[13:58] Uprooting the weeds
[18:44] People are more focused on external than internal
[20:40] Learn yourself, transform yourself, and learn from the results 
[25:14] Outro

Send a text to Kevin and Alan!

Speaker 1:

You're lucky, you can figure out your sound son.

Speaker 2:

Hey you ready man.

Speaker 1:

One, two, three, Yeah, I need you to go say a long sentence.

Speaker 2:

The dog went to the mall and took a shit on the carpet.

Speaker 1:

Take the pop filter off for a second.

Speaker 2:

Doesn't? it sounds different. The dog went to the mall and took a shit on the carpet.

Speaker 1:

That sounds okay. I think we're gonna be all right.

Speaker 2:

One, two, three.

Speaker 1:

Four, five, six, one, two, three, four, five, six. Okay, let's see what happens. Here we go. Next level nation. Welcome back to another episode of Next Level University, where we teach you how to level up your life, your love, your health and your wealth. We hope you enjoyed our latest episode. It was episode number 1386, a brave thing to try in your relationships, intimate or otherwise. Today, for episode number 1387, the problem might be deeper than you think. Happy Tuesday, happy Independence Day, full transparency.

Speaker 1:

This is the second time Alan and I are recording this episode, because we were having some sound issues and it's always weird re-recording an episode because you don't know what you said in this episode or what you said in the episode that doesn't exist. So, if there's any weird energy, that is why, okay, i was on a coaching call the other day and you might think I am a podcast coach, but what comes with that is hopefully helping people understand themselves at a deeper level, whether it's as a speaker, as a podcast or as a business owner, whatever it is. So I have this client who's been struggling to promote their podcast And it's a really good podcast and they're a really good podcaster And it's different. It's a very good product. And I said why do you think you're struggling? So we've talked about this before the seven whys. If you ask something, ask why seven times. Usually you get to the root cause of whatever the thing is. So I said why are you not promoting the podcast more? Do you not believe in it? What are your feelings around the podcast? And he said no, i really believe in it. It's almost like the more I believe in something, the harder it is for me to talk about it. And I was like, okay, that's interesting. Why do you think that is? And he said well, when I care about something, i'm more afraid to get judged when it comes to that thing. I said okay, why do you think that is? And I kept digging, and I kept digging, and I kept digging And eventually we got to the point where we were talking about how this person has a book.

Speaker 1:

So this person took the time to do the research and sit down and write out a book, publish it on Amazon and make it real. And it exists on Amazon. Right now You can buy this book. And I said how'd your book do when you launched it? I'm sure there was some judgment with that. And he said oh, i've never promoted it. Yeah, nobody even really knows it's out there. I mean it's on Amazon, you can buy it, but I don't really talk about it that much. And I said interesting. I said what's underneath that? He said just the fear of judgment. I'm so afraid of that. Kept digging, kept digging, kept digging And eventually I took a stab and I said can I throw something out there?

Speaker 1:

And he said yeah, of course. And I said my guess is you were probably raised in a very judgmental household and you were probably raised by people who told you to stay quiet, not to rock the boat, don't draw too much attention, don't talk about your strengths. Is any of that resonating? And he said that's all true. And I said that's it right there. This is not an external lack of understanding on how to talk about the stuff you're passionate about. This is an internal identity level, fear belonging thing, like that's really where this is coming from.

Speaker 1:

And it was a very, very vulnerable conversation and there were tears at the end And I actually said thank you to this person. I said I appreciate you being so open with me Because, honestly, i have other clients who are dealing with very similar things, but they would never tell me They would never right, they would never open up to me and say you know what, honestly, i'm struggling because I don't. I'm afraid of the judgment that might come with this. And I said, the reason you and I have so much growth together is because you're open to these conversations And you trust me and you're willing to dig deep. That's why I enjoy working with you so much. So we wrapped up the call with I want you to explore that.

Speaker 1:

I think it would benefit you to take a look back on all the times where you wanted to talk about something but you didn't, or all the potential bottlenecks you've had in your life because of this one thing. That is way, way, way below the surface. On the level, on the surface, i don't want to promote the podcast because I'm afraid of judgment. Awesome, i understand that completely. The next layer is I struggle with promoting stuff that I'm very, very passionate about because the more I care about it, the more I can get hurt by it. Okay, interesting, layer, layer, layer. The deepest layer is I grew up in a household where Me doing what I'm doing today probably wasn't allowed and it probably would have been punished, and that's why he's showing up the way he is today. So everything is deeper than you think.

Speaker 2:

It's conditioning. Okay, remember the speech that you gave. How's my audio quality, by the way?

Speaker 1:

I'm nervous. That's shitty It's. I can't really tell it sounds. It sounds off.

Speaker 2:

Yours sounds off too.

Speaker 1:

Well, thank you a little bit, a little bit. I don't know. Keep going. Well, i'll close my eyes and listen, okay.

Speaker 2:

Have you remember that speech that you gave that had the elephant? Yeah, yeah, yeah. So Essentially it was a picture of a circus elephant and how, when the elephant is this little baby elephant, the circus basically Puts this big, huge stake in the ground and ties the elephant to it and the elephant tries hard, hard, hard, hard to get free and it can't. And then it's this huge elephant and When it was a little baby elephant, it tried, tried, tried and it couldn't break free and maybe it got punished or whipped or whatever, which is, you know a whole nother thing But eventually it's this huge elephant that could easily rip the stake right out of the ground and probably the whole tent with it, hmm, but it has been conditioned not to try because it still thinks it's a little baby elephant, and I think that that's an overused analogy in this industry, but I think it's very powerful and All of us are that little baby elephant in something.

Speaker 2:

And one thing that I've found fascinating in my own growth journey And then also coaching so many people, is that everyone is a is fearful, everyone. They're just afraid of different things. Everyone is fearful, everyone. They're just afraid of different things. And I think that what you achieve in life tends to be the polar opposite of whatever your deepest fear is. So Kev, for example, not having money, not having freedom, having a lot of pain associated with not having money growing up And they did have some money. But you know what I'm saying is and, and now, his deepest desires, his goals, are very, very wealth creation oriented.

Speaker 2:

And so for this client I've said this many times in order to get to the next level, you usually have to go to a deeper level. So, in order to get to the next level of success, you have to go to a deeper level of understanding, and I think that understanding can be two different things. You can understand at a deeper level how to do something. That's external, that's how do I write a book, how do I structure a story? How do I start a podcast? How do I promote a book? How do I publish a book? That's external. We talk a lot about that at NLU, things like that how to, how to, how to.

Speaker 2:

But there's another side of that coin, which is a deeper level of understanding of self, and that's the inner work. So the outer work is the how to. How do I drive a car? How do I get to work. How do I get a new job? How do I build a resume? How do I, how do I, how do I? the internal stuff that I'm trying to do, how do I, how do I, how do I? the internal stuff is this, which is Self-awareness, which is emotional intelligence, which is understanding your own ego, understanding your own distortions, understanding your own, why you do what you do and why you avoid what you don't do, and I think that coaching usually has to do with both, because I know a lot of people that know how to write a book But can't get themselves to write.

Speaker 2:

Or maybe they can write the book but they can't promote it, like this client. And a lot of people say things like, well, i'm not afraid of judgment, but then they won't post anything on Facebook And it's a blanket statement Okay, you're not afraid of judgment, i don't. I don't think that's true. I don't think that's true for anyone. Maybe you're not afraid of what strangers think, but you're definitely afraid of what your mother thinks or your father thinks or your grandparents And parents think, or whatever your aunt, your uncle. That's why a lot of people post things on Instagram that they won't post on Facebook, and if you're not truthful with yourself. You're not really going to unlock the root cause of why you're not achieving what you want to achieve.

Speaker 1:

It's hard, because it's very hard to do this on your own To dig and dig and dig and dig. It does in the episode that we didn't finish recording because of the issue. I said what's what? did I say what's below that, what's beneath that?

Speaker 2:

Oh yeah, what's underneath that?

Speaker 1:

What's underneath that. I think that's something Allen uses in coaching. I think he'll ask a question and when you answer he'll say what's underneath that. But it's hard if you don't have somebody there doing that. I used to say this It's weird how you'll be thinking of something and you'll get to a point where you're like, eh, that's it. That's as far as I can go. But there's a layer under that and sometimes it requires somebody to ask you a certain question to get you to dig there.

Speaker 2:

Yeah, i call it the trampoline. So Kevin and I will be masterminding behind the scenes, like we always do, and I'll make this sort of hand gesture of like a trampoline. It's like that. It like doesn't land, does not compute, does not compute. It's like you're trying to get me to understand something, or but my mind doesn't want to take it in. Yet There's a block. There's a block, and usually there's some sort of trauma under that or maybe some distortion or something you don't really want to admit to yourself. That's usually.

Speaker 2:

I told Kevin this earlier today behind the scenes. I said you don't have to ever worry again that I care more about understanding than my temporary feelings. And obviously Kevin doesn't want to hurt my feelings, you know, like obviously not. But what if you have to share something with me that might hurt my feelings? What you've had to do before? for sure, and it's interesting because in hindsight, those are the moments that changed my life the most. But yet we don't want to hurt other people, and then we don't give people the permission to hurt us, and so maybe that's another episode, i don't know. But these deeper layers and I'll use one example of someone I know I'll keep it anonymous There's someone that we do relationship talks coaching with, who said I know why a lot of people haven't been consistent in relationship talks coaching Because we've had a lot of clients but some people fall off And he's stuck with it for years now.

Speaker 2:

At this stage He says it's just really hard to face the difficult truths. He said you and Emilia essentially go to the deepest layer And I had to face my deepest demons. And in this person's case they basically had to face the fact that that they don't think highly of their family. As a matter of fact, it's the opposite. They actually think very negatively of their family. They had to face the truth that their family is messed up And I think on some level that's what your client is going through too of I don't want to face the reality that.

Speaker 2:

I want to think my mom and dad were great And I want to think they had my best interest at heart And I want to believe that when we're kids, our parents are our heroes And a lot of times we don't want them to fall from that pedestal. And so usually the inner work has to do with uncomfortable truths that you don't want to face about yourself or about your family. Outer work is just learning how things work and why they work that way. So if you want to learn how to garden, you got to learn how tomatoes grow, or whatever. I think that outer work is easy personally, but of course, i would think that, since the inner stuff is the the hard stuff that I've had to face, I I would tend to agree, though I think the The external is new, the internal is usually old.

Speaker 1:

It's like digging up old stuff versus planting new stuff. Yeah there's just so many roots and there's just so many memories and That's interesting. It's just, it's a chat, good if you want to.

Speaker 2:

You know another garden gardening analogy if you want to plant a new garden, a new life, you have to uproot the weeds. Yeah, you know, you have to go and and Like, updo the soil and and updo I don't know the gardening terms but seriously you have to uproot all the roots and Turn the soil or churn the soil, i don't know, but That's kind of what therapy Is and, in some cases, inner work, coaching, personal growth, self-awareness. You're kind of like going back to your past and like Uprooting all the weeds And then you're planting new seeds in a fresh Soil garden that's ready for transformation, and I don't think you can imagine taking old, dirty, weedy soil and trying to plant new seeds. It's not gonna work, you know. So you kind of need to do both. Yeah, you need to learn how to plant and water and sunshine and rain, but you also have to learn how to uproot the old crap, the toxic soil. You have to learn how to, how to You know, work through all that stuff.

Speaker 1:

Well, and we've we've said this many, many times usually people are You tend to be really good at one. Just for some reason seems to be the way it works. You're really good at one, and then you ride that one off into the sunset for as long as you can, and then usually Something happens and you realize oh interesting, this isn't the answer to everything. Which one do you?

Speaker 2:

think is your proclivity, proclivity.

Speaker 1:

I don't know what that means. No, i do. I don't know. I would say Maybe internal, naturally same. I don't think it was great.

Speaker 2:

Yeah, i think for me it was more External. that was, uh, my proclivity, proclivity and. I think yours was more internal and I think in some ways, you were ahead of me on that when we met, and I think I was. I know I was ahead of you on the, the planting new seeds and learning how to garden. You need both.

Speaker 1:

You need both if you want to awareness Yeah, you want a holistic self awareness versus world awareness. It's you can know. Again, this person knew how to write a book. They were confident enough to write a book. They were confident enough to publish the book. It wasn't that, it was the internal stuff behind why they weren't doing what they were doing. This is one of the reasons.

Speaker 1:

I think, one of the reasons people have Midlife crisis is because eventually, you get to the point where you get all the things that you thought would bring certain results And then you realize, oh, this is, this is inner stuff, more than anything.

Speaker 1:

That's really what we're trying to do is trying to Maybe tell a story or give a lesson or whatever it is. That will land in a different way. Or maybe you might say something similar where it's like okay, i, maybe it's not a book, maybe it's not a podcast, maybe it's not a coaching program, whatever, but maybe you are not doing something because of a fear From your childhood. You just don't know it yet, and until you land On that, it's always going to seem like it's other stuff, and so you find the right key to the lock. That's the interesting thing. You could go watch a motivational video and that might seem like the right key to the lock. It doesn't do anything. Oh no, you can go Be around somebody inspirational and maybe that'll give you a little turn of the of the lock, but that probably isn't it.

Speaker 2:

Everything else is kind of a band-aid for the deepest of all problems, and Just finding them is usually super challenging what I've found And there seems to be no exception to this What I've found is that everyone has a natural inclination towards one or the other. I know a lot of people that love the inner work and all the books they read are emotional intelligence and codependence and Internal family systems and therapy and psychology and all of that. I have this pyramid of the universe that I call it and it starts from the bottom and it works its way up. It goes math, physics, chemistry, biology, physiology, neuroscience and psychology. And I joke with Emilia she started from the top and worked her way down. I started from the bottom and worked my way up. I started with math, physics, chemistry, all that. She started with the human condition, psychology.

Speaker 2:

I didn't learn psychology stuff. I mean I knew I took a psychology course in high school but I didn't dive deep into psychology and neuroscience, more psychology, until like after 26. After 26 is when I went all in on all psychology, inner work, emotional intelligence, all that kind of stuff. But the whole beginning of my life was much more external. I think everyone is more focused on external or internal, and I think that usually people. So I have one client, linda, who's been focused on internal her whole life. She's unbelievable in that, but she needs to learn some more external. She's great at that too. So, linda, if you're listening, please don't get offended. I think you're amazing at both, but I can tell you right now she'd much rather read how emotions are made than peak performance, and that doesn't mean she's not a peak performer, but I think that you need to kind of get outside your comfort zone and try to do the one that you have maybe neglected a little bit.

Speaker 1:

You've heard the quote if it's not broke, don't fix it. You've heard that. I'm sure It's hard because a lot of the stuff that seems like it's winning in life might actually be just like 50% of the result you'd actually get if you did the internal work. That's the interesting thing You don't know And you can't really ever know until you do it. It's a very paradoxical thing, but over the last six years that really has been.

Speaker 1:

The biggest difference, for me at least, is now I understand when you do a certain thing, it's not just because you do the thing that way. There's a lot of layers under it And the more layers you understand about yourself, the more self aware you are. Ultimately, the more influence you have over yourself. We have so much knowledge about, like our cell phones or social media platforms, or what this person's doing or whatever. If we understood ourselves at the level that we understood our favorite reality TV show, starz, we would be in a much better place, because that's what self awareness is And, at the end of the day, that's the most valuable thing in the world to understand, because you happen to be attached to this thing for the rest of your life. So the better you understand yourself, the more holistically successful you will ultimately be.

Speaker 2:

The formula is this Learn yourself, transform yourself, then you'll transform the results you get And then you'll learn from those new results, which will then kind of get you to face another layer within yourself. I mean, as we've gotten to the next level, next level, next level in our life, we've had to go deeper and deeper and deeper into our past and into who we are and who we want to be. It's really quite, it's very important to do both of those. I it's really important to do both of those. I remember when I was doing the most inner work but I was broke And I was super fulfilled Trying to pet the deer. I was trying to be so centered that the deer would stay in my presence.

Speaker 2:

And they did, they did. I accomplished my goal. Now I need to hunt the deer and sell the meat. I'm kidding, no, but real talk that is, and that it just happened with my mic. I think it just happened. Yeah, i'm sorry if the audio quality on this episode is a little less than usual.

Speaker 1:

We're trying to figure it out. Yeah, we're trying to figure it out.

Speaker 2:

I think we would have it figured out after 1,400 episodes. You would think You would think. But maybe there's something deep inside ourselves we need to look at in order to figure out how to get this audio quality to work. But I think it's transform self, and then you'll transform the results, and then you'll transform yourself again, and then you'll transform the results, and I think it's a cycle And hopefully, hopefully you're doing both the inner work and the outer work, and that's all I've got Same Next level nation.

Speaker 1:

As you know, we pride ourselves on being a wonderful community of heart driven humans. If you are looking for more people like that in your life, social media is a wonderful place to find them. Please join our private Facebook group, Next Level Nation. It's not private, So excuse me. It's a wonderful place.

Speaker 1:

Yeah, it's a wonderful place. It's not private to keep you out, but it's so you can feel safe being in there And you could be yourself. You don't have to worry about what you're posting And you're not going to get made fun of like Alice making fun of me right now. We promise there will be none of that in Next Level Nation. Hey, you better say whatever about whatever you're about to say, perfectly.

Speaker 2:

I know, i know, go ahead, we have fun here. I really enjoy this, even though we're still just jeffing forward Always What I'm going to say next is is is.

Speaker 2:

Group 11 is about to close. We have it on July 11. We actually had someone reach out today via email. They said I'm ready to do another round. Let's rock and roll. We have a promo code. Email me, alan at nextleveluniversecom. Say Alan, i want the promo code. I want in You and a group of nine other like-minded individuals. Here's what I can promise you. What you are struggling with, what you are going through, what you are growing through, is not uncommon, and you are not alone And you can learn from other people's experiences along the way. So if you feel lost, if you feel hopeless or helpless and you feel like you just need to get on some train tracks, you need to get some direction, you need to get some clarity. Group coaching is literally designed for that, and please reach out.

Speaker 1:

Tomorrow? Oh no, What's the next level nugget When you go for the next level nugget?

Speaker 2:

Next level nugget is whichever proclivity you have for either inner work or outer work. For me, i prefered outer. I really love the outer work. How to learning how the economy works in the world. I had an aversion to the inner work, and it wasn't until 26 that I really started going inward, and so my next level nugget is figure out which one you are naturally inclined to and try to work on the other one.

Speaker 1:

OK, i would say next time you feel like you are a layer below, ask yourself what's below that one, because it's there, which is a matter of time before we get there. So next time you feel like you have the answer to whatever it is, ask yourself why And ask yourself if there's something below that. If you do that long enough, every time you say inward, i think Squidward Every single time. I almost laughed Tomorrow for episode number 1,388, we're creeping up on 1,400, how to maintain momentum this summer. I see a lot of people who are celebrating And I'm all for celebration. I love it.

Speaker 1:

I just don't want anybody to lose momentum. You've been working very, very, very hard for the last six months, for the last couple of years. The last thing I want you to do is lose all the momentum over the summer because a lot of people are going to. As the NLU family, we don't want that to be you. So we will be talking about that tomorrow, as always. We love you, we appreciate you, grateful for each and every one of you, and at NLU we do not have fans, we have family. We will talk to you all tomorrow.

Speaker 2:

Find out what's underneath that next level nation.

People on this episode

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Alan Lazaros

Host
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Kevin Palmieri

Host