#1675 - Is All Judgment Bad?

Have you ever pondered over the line between careful observation and harsh judgment? Life is full of choices—from buying a house to selecting a job or a restaurant. But sometimes, our perspectives can complicate these decisions. In this episode, the seasoned hosts Kevin Palmieri and Alan Lazaros share their wisdom on the delicate balance between observing and judging. They provide practical advice on making better decisions and steer our lives more positively.

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Show notes:
(2:12) Accurate perspective as you could
(4:17) Observation VS Judgment
(5:59) CBT triad
(9:17) A cognitive process
(10:32) Observation → Judgment → Decision
(14:21) At NLU, we want you to win! So, we’re giving tools and resources to ensure your success. Join our Monthly Meet-up every first Thursday of the month at 6 PM. https://www.nextleveluniverse.com/monthly-meetups/
(15:14) Patriots VS Seahawks 2015 NFL season
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🎙️ Hosted by Kevin Palmieri and Alan Lazaros

Next Level University is a top-ranked daily podcast for dream chasers and self-improvement lovers. With over 2,100 episodes, we help you level up in life, love, health, and wealth one day at a time. Subscribe for real, honest, no-fluff growth every single day.

Transcript

Speaker 1 0:00

Next Level Nation. Welcome back to another episode of Next Level University, where we help you level up your life, your love, your health and your wealth. We hope you enjoyed our latest episode, episode number 1,674, an updated check-in for all of your relationships, not just necessarily your intimate ones. Today, for episode number 1,675, is all judgment bad? The reason I wanted to do this episode, alan, is I was thinking.

Speaker 1 0:30

You hear me say very often this is not from a place of judgment, because I'll say that often I saw this happen or I was thinking about this or whatever it is. And I think there's a couple different pieces of me. I think one piece is afraid to offend people for sure. Another piece is I don't want to be negatively judgmental, unnecessarily judgmental, maybe is the best way to put it, and I didn't know what else there was besides judgment. I didn't in my mind, I never really thought about it. I never thought okay, judgment is this and there's a bunch of other things it could be. And if you are of the belief that all judgment is bad, I wonder if you're going to get as much perspective as you could. I wonder if you're going to get as much accurate perspective as you could. I wonder if you're going to get as much accurate perspective as you could, because is it judgmental to look at someone's job and say, oh wow, that person has the same job that they had in high school? I think it depends on the intention. I think it depends on the intention behind it.

Speaker 1 1:40

When we talk about me working at the gas station or working at the hospital cleaning floors and toilets and all that, I have a sign up on my wall that says don't ever forget about that.

Speaker 1 1:48

When I talk about that, I'm not talking about that as a judgment to anybody who's doing that. I'm talking about that as an observation of what it was like for me to do it and the perspective I've gained. I would never have gained if I wasn't willing to look back and revisit that time in my life. So that's really my goal for this episode is to talk about the difference between judgment and observation. Whatever word you want to use, maybe it's not observation, but when I'm looking at something, I'm not trying to judge with the intention of making someone wrong or lessening someone's belief or lessening someone's quote or lessening someone's quote-unquote success for me. I'm observing from a different perspective than I've ever had, trying to get a new lesson that I've never gotten, but if I was afraid that every time I observed I was passing negative judgment, I'd probably never do it, so I think it's an important thing to take a look at.

Speaker 2 2:45

The distinction that you had bringing this episode excites the hell out of me because, quite frankly, I've never been able to fully understand, not understand. I always feel like I've understood this but I couldn't explain it even to myself. Sometimes you intuitively understand things or your brain calculates things that you struggle to articulate to others. This was one of them for me, and I've talked in the past on past Hyperconscious and then Next Level University episodes for the new listeners. We used to be the Hyperconscious podcast way back and I talked about how judgment is actually critical. Have you ever heard of someone? Ooh, that was a good play in sports. The coach made a good judgment call there. You need to make a judgment call if you're going to make an effective decision. So my computer engineering brain could never parse out the difference between bad judgment and good judgment. I couldn't explain it, but I knew okay.

Speaker 2 3:48

When you go to buy a house, you're judging the house. You're judging if the ceiling's leaking and if the basement is moldy and the bathroom tight, you're supposed to judge. But it gets really wonky when you judge a book by its cover and you've never met someone and you assume X, y, z about them. There's toxic judgment and then there's effective decision making. Those are two very different things, and I think the really cool distinction here, kev, is observation versus judgment. Observation is taking in data. Again, as a computer engineer, I'm just going to talk like that. You take in data from your eyes, taste, touch, smell, hearing and sight. So you take in data and then you determine, based on that input, what do I do, what does that mean? And then what do I do? There's something called a CBT triad. It's cognitive behavioral therapy. This is a modality of therapy that one of my clients does, showed it to Bianca, and it's called the CBT triad. It's very, very simple, honestly, but it's so powerful. You have thoughts, motions and behaviors. So you think okay, let's say, you smell pizza. Outside my gym there's a Papagino's and it's just brutal because you're just got a good workout in and all you do is smell pizza on the way to the car and it's just like, oh my God, what if? What if I made a judgment call here and just decided to can my diet and then ordered a whole pizza and ate the entire thing? What are your thoughts on that? I'm in. That's what your brain does because you have a thought. So first you have sensory input smell. I smell wafting delicious Papagino's pizza. And then I have a feeling of, oh, I'm hungry as it gets. And then I have a behavior of I think I'm going to go in there and buy a full pizza. And then you eat the pizza. The thought leads to the feeling leads to the behavior. But where do those thoughts come from? They come from inputs, they come from data, they come from observations. Observations are taking in data. Judgment is assigning a meaning.

Speaker 2 5:58

Yeah, the other night, emilia and I were on a walk and we got really freaked out. We saw these stars all aligned and we've never seen anything like it, and they were rising in the sky and they were disappearing one by one. It was like 10, fully aligned. And if you study nature, you know there's no straight lines or right angles. Everything in nature is like curvy and all that kind of stuff. So it was like I've never seen anything like this. This is scary. This is like the first time in my life I've ever had like is that a ufo? And then I said oh, it's starlink. Emily and I were contemplating what the heck that was. I've never seen anything like that. She's like did you see that? I was like I bet you that's starlink and we we got inside and we googled it and they launched the Falcon 9 at SpaceX. And Starlink is essentially Wi-Fi. They're trying to put satellites to give Wi-Fi to the world. Awesome, right. But what was my point of all that? That's an observation that we were.

Speaker 2 6:57

I was freaking out more than Emilia. I was like that is that broke my brain. I said that's impossible. While we were on the walk, I said that's impossible, that's impossible, that's impossible. And then my brain I said that's impossible. While we were on the walk, I said that's impossible, that's impossible, that's impossible. And then my brain was going through all the options of like, okay, aliens doubt it, potential nuclear war. I went through all the different possibilities and then I eventually was like, oh, starlink, okay. And then we got inside, we researched it Falcon 9 launched tonight 8.55 pm. We went on a walk at 9.

Speaker 1 7:24

Makes perfect sense. It would be a real shame if you got scooped up by the aliens. It would be a real shame.

Speaker 2 7:30

And I'm a math guy. So, statistically speaking, I knew that that had to be something. I just didn't know what. Maybe it was planes or whatever, but it ended up being Starlink. So my point is we observed never seen before.

Speaker 1 7:46

It was wild. Imagine 10 stars lined up in the sky, all moving upward and then disappearing. I don't go outside at all, ever. No, not really, never mind. In the night I'm in my bed, never mind in the night.

Speaker 2 7:55

So, yeah, kevin's in bed when we're walking. But that's an observation. What does it mean? It was a judgment to say, okay, I think it's starlink, I think it's spacex. The judgment determines what you're going to do. The observation is just data, and so a lot of people get offended by me, and it's unfortunate, because I'm really just trying to give them data so that they can make better judgment calls, and when they make better judgment calls, and when they make better judgment calls, their future will be bigger, better and brighter. My goal is always to give you new data, give you new feedback, give you a new understanding so that you can go make a better decision, and so I think this is fire. I never had the verbiage to explain what I was doing, because I'm not trying to be mean when I say hey, kev, you're a little less in shape than last time I saw you. I'm not trying to be mean, I'm actually trying to help you.

Speaker 1 8:46

Now, here's the thing. Word on the street is I am not balding anymore.

Speaker 2 8:50

Yeah, I've come back. I think, I don't know, I have a full head of lettuce, I do? We provide context?

Speaker 1 8:59

No, I think yeah. Alan and I we did a speech, we did several speeches, trainings, whatever in Pittsburgh, and that's the first time Alan and I had seen each other in person in a pretty long period of time, like one of the longer Probably six months or something.

Speaker 1 9:14

Yeah, one of the longer periods of time and he's like hey, man, can I tell you something? And I said, of course, man. He said you know, I want to live in the truth and this is I just want you to have the opportunity to make a different decision. If it's valuable to you, like, okay, let's hear it. He says you ever notice that you might be going a little thin on top. Is that something you might be afraid of? And I said no, I don't know if I've ever really thought of that, ever until this moment. And he's like I don't know, I haven't seen it in a minute. Maybe it's the gel, maybe it's the comb, I don't know, but it looks thinner than the last time I saw it and I was like all right, well, I appreciate it. My dad is bald, I think. I don't know. From the couple the other day and he said yeah, man, I don't know about that. I think I might have been off on that.

Speaker 2 10:02

All right, cool but that wasn't a judge alive. You had. You had good good, uh, good up top. Yeah, yeah, looked real good. Again, I do get it. No one likes to be under a microscope and I'm a scientist so I'm always observing everything. But I also asked. I said does taryn mind? Because you said you don't care at all. And I thought to myself one of the reasons why I have long hair I don't just make decisions with no data. Emilia loves it, she's, and I don't really care if any other girls look, but she loves it and she also likes to run her hair through her hand, her hair through it. She likes to run her hands through it. I ask for the data. I like the feedback. It's. It's really important that you make meaningful choices and I don't think you can do that without feedback. And so, yeah, that's. I think I was probably off. I've come full circle, I've made it.

Speaker 1 10:47

I'm back.

Speaker 2 10:47

I think I was probably. You got great hair, Great locks.

Speaker 1 10:52

I think it was a really good point about judgment is the action?

Speaker 1 10:57

in a way, it's the action the strategy, the meaning where I think observation is just awareness. That's all it is. All it is is if you've ever met someone and left and said I can imagine it's going to be really hard for that person to find someone who gets them. I don't think that's judgment. I think that's an observation. I'm just observing the way they acted and maybe their intricacies and maybe what makes them them, and maybe what makes them them is very rare. That's more of an observation than anything.

Speaker 2 11:37

Mm-hmm. Then one step further would be do you want to spend more time with them? Like, okay, let's say you hang out with someone and it goes really well. You observe, wow, that was awesome, that person's funny, we like the same things, we got along really well. They're kind, they're virtuous, whatever, whatever insert, insert core values, whatever that we have the same core values. You name it. And then you're driving home. We've all had this moment of. That was really nice. Okay, that means I'm gonna spend time with that person again. And then what do you do? So it's it's observation, then it's judgment, then it's decision, and you it has to be in that order. And then the opposite is true with certain people where it's like you're driving home questioning like am I okay? That was awful. I don't know if I'm ever going to do that again.

Speaker 2 12:30

I think that observation is how you take in data, I think judgment is when you assign a meaning and I think the meaning determines what you end up doing. And, by the way, meaning is just belief. So if Kevin believes I'm a good person, he's more likely to spend more time with me. If Kevin believes that I'm going to help him grow, he's going to spend more time with me if he wants to grow, and so that's why I think you have to judge. I actually I don't think that you do. You can't make choices without a judgment, and you can look at the neuroscience of that. Can't make decisions without judgment. It's impossible, but you don't have to be toxic about it, I think that's. That's the thing.

Speaker 1 13:28

Well, isn't judgment just weighing when you hear someone say that person made a really good judgment call? They just weighed the two options that they had and picked the better one, and in many cases, there is a best move, there is a the. There is one of the most exciting slash, most devastating moments in sports history. If you're not into sports, I apologize, but this is a really good example of this. The Patriots were playing the Seahawks, oh no, and the Seahawks were down by four. It's 2007.

Speaker 2 14:02

Was it 2007? 2007. I think they were down by four.

Speaker 1 14:05

I think it was 28 to 24. The Patriots were winning but the Seahawks were on like the three yard line and there was like 30 seconds in the game and all they had to do was hand it off to their running back, who was like the best in the league and he most likely would have scored a touchdown, and they decided to throw a pass and the pass got intercepted and then the Patriots won the game.

Speaker 2 14:29

That was not 2007. I thought you were going to talk about when they had the almost undefeated season. Oh, no, no, no, I know 2007 because I was in my college dorm watching that game and that was when I decided I'm not going to watch sports anymore because the New York Giants caught the ball in their helmet to win the Super Bowl. So my bad. No, this was worse yeah this was the worst.

Speaker 1 14:52

I remember I lived in Methuen. I lived in Methuen, massachusetts. There was a place called Mano's that had the best pizza. I lived in a pretty sketchy apartment. It was not great. It was not a great place to live, but I remember getting Mano's and watching it and I was so sad. I was like, oh man, this is terrible. And then I remember that play happened and I said, oh my goodness, what an idiot, why would you do that? That was the worst judgment call. You have the best running back in the league. Give him the ball and just let him run. That's what he does. It's probably known as one of the worst judgment calls in sports.

Speaker 2 15:29

It is. There's a book called Thinking in Bets. Yeah, I wish I could remember her name. She's awesome, annie.

Speaker 1 15:35

Duke Nice. Yeah, I know, how did you do that. I know things too son.

Speaker 2 15:41

That's how you don't usually know.

Speaker 1 15:44

authors' names I think I used. She's a poker player, right? Yeah, I think I know her from poker, not from her author. That's why you know.

Speaker 2 15:53

She wrote Thinking in Bets. It's actually right around the corner. We have a place in between Amelia and I's office called called the nook, where she has a chair and I have a chair. We read not lately, but we used to spend a lot of time up here we don't anymore, sick of the upstairs, but anyway. So it's called thinking in bets and it talks about this. Yeah, it's, it's a decision making paradigm. It's it's a cost value analysis. So let's say, your core values are family, friends and personal growth. Okay, you're going to choose the family members to hang out with that are into growth and that you also can hang out with your friends. That's called the decision-making paradigm. But here's the thing you have to judge all of your family and all of your friends in order to make that decision, and you do. You have to call a spade a spade. This is hardcore, alan. You have to see the truth. I'm not gonna go play tackle football with my weakest friend when I have money riding on it.

Speaker 1 16:58

I am like against him no, no, no with him on my team. Oh, like against him. No, no, no With him On my team. Oh yeah, no Against him.

Speaker 2 17:04

I'm all in If I have a and again, that's a playful, funny example. But okay, if I'm going to go play, if I'm going to buy a computer, I have a specific person shout out to my buddy, ben, who I reach out to to to ask advice, because he builds computers, he knows the processor, the motherboard, he knows all the right equipment, he knows what website to go to. You don't go to the dentist for heart surgery, that's fair. And you don't go to the gym looking to watch Netflix. Those are all judgment calls. It's just when it comes to people we have a hard time with it. When you go to buy a home, what's the difference between a shack and a mansion? I talk about this all the time. You judge Is that home worth 500 grand? If the answer is no, okay, why not? Well, boom, boom, boom, boom. But with people we don't do that Well it's personal I consider you, kev.

Speaker 2 17:59

I can say this authentically you are a very high-value man.

Speaker 1 18:02

I appreciate that. I don't entirely know what it means. I hear it a lot on the interwebs. It sounds good, but if it's positive. I'm in.

Speaker 2 18:10

And you're in a very non-high-value chair yeah no, this chair sucks, it keeps hammering.

Speaker 1 18:15

I.

Speaker 2 18:16

It's funny. Okay, so Kevin is what I consider to be a high-value man. What does that mean? Just like when you build a home I don't build homes, so I don't know anything about it but you build the foundation and then put on the roof. Whatever you do, what you do, kevin is like a mansion of a man. He's invested a lot more money, effort and time into building himself up, way more than when he was okay. So if you took 16 year old kevin and put that version of kevin in a competition in basically anything with 34 year old kevin, 34 year old kevin would be smarter, more capable, more articulate, more mature, more kind, more virtuous, better at everything. There's nothing that 16 year old kevin was better than 34 year old version of kevin at, except for, probably, athletic.

Speaker 1 19:02

Oh, I was going to say and drinking hooch. The first drink I ever consumed as a young man was Southern Comfort and sugar. I didn't really like the way it tasted so I just poured a bunch of sugar in it. It's called hooch. Yeah, you think about like prison hooch. You just mix up whatever you got to. When you're 16, you're like I've never heard that before in my life. Well, you probably don't know as many people that have been to jail as I have. That's a fair assessment.

Speaker 2 19:35

You know what I'm saying. That's a fair judgment.

Speaker 1 19:38

But Observation that's a fair observation. At 16, I was better at drinking than I am today. I would say.

Speaker 2 19:43

Fair, but that's when I say Kevin's a high value man value, man, that's a judgment.

Speaker 1 19:53

Yeah, it's just a positive one. Yeah, exactly, that's all it is. Don't judge a book by its cover. If, if, if that's something that doesn't resonate with you, okay, but you do observe a book by its cover, your, your observation is the first opportunity you have to recognize something. So if I grab a book I don't necessarily like let me grab evan carmichael's book, you're one word. When I look at this, I don't. I'm like let me grab Evan Carmichael's book, your One Word when I look at this, I don't. I'm not necessarily judging when I look at it, but my observation is well, it had listen, adventure, grace, maximize, strength, momentum. It seems like a very positive book.

Speaker 1 20:25

The powerful secret to creating a business and life that matter. I love the fact that it has hashtag. Believe I like that. It has hashtag. Believe I like that it has Evan's little. He has his little paper plane on here. Those are all observations. Okay, a judgment would be the powerful secret to creating a business and life that matters. Matter. That's dumb and probably not real. That's judgment, I think. What do you really think? I love it. Yeah, I'm a huge fan of Evan.

Speaker 2 20:58

Okay, evan's my dude. So you're making a judgment of Evan right now?

Speaker 1 21:02

Yeah, just a positive one.

Speaker 2 21:05

And therefore, with that judgment, you assign meaning. And when you assign meaning, now you might hire Evan as a coach.

Speaker 1 21:19

Evan's coached us. Why do we in the past? Yeah, why do? Why does amazon and grubhub and instacart and doordash have reviews so you can judge the restaurant based on other people's experiences? That's why most I don't know I'm very, very focused on this. I always look at reviews, airbnbs. If there's anything that jumps out, I'm like. I know you've had trauma in the past with airbnbs. It was not great experience.

Speaker 2 21:41

Yeah, for emilia's birthday I got us an airbnb that we had to clean we tried.

Speaker 1 21:45

I tried to help you, I think, at the time, but there wasn't enough time. It was a whole thing. I didn't have the reps, man, that was Airbnb's, that was my first time ever booking an Airbnb.

Speaker 2 21:53

I was late to the game and I didn't read the reviews because there were none.

Speaker 1 21:56

That's your first mistake right there and that's the sign there you go.

Speaker 2 21:58

There's the sign. It was terrible. It was genuinely terrible.

Speaker 1 22:00

We still had a great trip and we, the mansion, called cliff walk, cliff walk, unbelievable. Yeah, big fan, newport's a great place, all right, what's your next level lesson? He's taking a big sip, he's thinking, deeply, contemplating, and here we go.

Speaker 2 22:20

My next level lesson is open your mind to more observation and stop allowing your fear of being judgmental to stop you from making great decisions.

Speaker 1 22:29

and stop allowing your fear of being judgmental to stop you from making great decisions, a lot more concise than I had expected. I've been working on it.

Speaker 2 22:38

Yeah, yeah, extreme work, great work. Did you say string work? Yep.

Speaker 1 22:43

String work. I said a lot of things I don't know.

Speaker 2 22:47

What's your next level? Nugget, my friend.

Speaker 1 22:52

Um, just be careful. Just be careful the way you label something. Just be careful the way you label something. I understand judgment can be painful and it can be scary and it can seem negative, but there are times in your life where you're going to need to judge things to be safe and to make accurate, positive, long-term decisions. I think a restaurant is a great, great, great way to think about it. If you drive by a restaurant and it is packed, every time you drive by, you're going to judge it in a positive manner.

Speaker 1 23:24

But, if you go in and you see a cockroach running across the floor, that's your observation. That was a cockroach, I believe, or it was a leaf that moved really fast with legs, and it probably isn't it. I don't think. I don't think leaves have legs, leaves have legs. Whatever, the next step is do I want to eat here, yes or no? If yes, why? If no, why? That's a judgment, but it doesn't have to be negative. It doesn't have to be negative.

Speaker 1 23:52

If you've last story before we go, I was telling Taryn and I went and saw Mom and Memes last weekend, two weekends ago, three weekends ago, I don't know A recent weekend and I was telling a story of when I was 10 years old. I you ready? Yeah, it's not as funny, it's not as funny as the other ones. When I was 10 years old and I was playing baseball, I didn't get picked by a coach because I was too short. The first time I played against that team, I hit a grand slam, and every time I played against that team, I did amazing, like most of my home runs came against that team. His name was Alan Ashcraft and him and I actually became friends after that Because he admitted that he judged me wrong and we were like we were buddies.

Speaker 1 24:38

After that, kev's been proving himself ever since. I've been getting judged my whole life my whole life. That's one of the reasons I got tattoos. One of the reasons I got tattoos is because I wanted to break people's judgment of people who have tattoos like I do. There's a piece of me like I want to get. I'm terrified to do it. I want to get my hand done with the cats because I know there'll be certain people that'll judge me that I can turn around Because I know statistically I don't know, I don't really even even that's a judgment. I'm sure many people that see hand tattoos assume something negative. Just like 25 years ago, if you saw any tattoos, you probably assumed something negative. But things have changed.

Speaker 2 25:18

You dig the reason I was laughing, tell me. You said, I told story.

Speaker 1 25:28

I think I said I told a story. I believe your ears are gunked up.

Speaker 2 25:32

My observation tells me. You said I told a story.

Speaker 1 25:37

It's possible.

Speaker 2 25:37

It's okay, it was funny. There have been a couple little things that I think are hilarious on this episode and I'm grateful. It's fun.

Speaker 1 25:46

We do have a good time, isn't it weird, I think so Most of the time. Stuck that really in there at the end. Isn't it weird that we get to do this as a? This is our job. Isn't that so strange. It's great. Yeah, big fan, it is very weird to me.

Speaker 2 26:01

It's not as weird to me, no, but I love it yeah.

Speaker 1 26:03

It's super weird to me. If you have not yet gotten your next level dreamliner, I don't know where mine is. Oh, here it is. So we have the next level dreamliners, so you can get one every quarter. Nine times four is 360. Don't worry about the other four days, don't let that bother you, don't worry about them. They just disappear somewhere off into the ethos and we'll just kind of collect them next year. But the idea is to get a dreamliner every single quarter slash, every single 90 days. So if you're up for a Dreamliner, click the link in the show notes. It'll take you to Amazon and we have hardcover and softcover paperback. Hardcover takes longer. Paperback is like immediate shipping.

Speaker 2 26:45

They're just FYI, I use the Dreamliner every single day. I've used it every single day for 2024. And it has gratitudes, most important tasks, most important win, most important improvement, next level nugget, and then it's got a space for notes. My favorite part about it I've said it before, I'll say it again is that it's sustainable. It's a journal that doesn't make you feel terrible about yourself because you can't sustain it. That was the goal. I don't want another journal where I have to look at empty pages and my own inadequacies. I want to be able to be consistent and actually do it daily, because I've had many journals in the past that were way too much. It took an hour to do them, so it only takes 10 minutes a day. Everybody has 10 minutes a day and it will keep you on the train tracks towards your dreams Towards your dreams.

Speaker 1 27:34

Momentum, momentum, dreamlining, dreamlining Tomorrow. For episode number 1,676,. Is loneliness necessary when you are growing, alan? And I haven't talked about this episode at all. I don't really know where Alan's going to go. I'm not really sure where I'm going to go yet, but I had a thought about it. I don't really know where Alan's going to go, I'm not really sure where I'm going to go yet, but I had a thought about it and I figured you know what, let's give it a shot, see if we can add some value in that episode. I'm sure it'll be a good conversation regardless. So that's what we're going to talk about tomorrow. As always, we love you, we appreciate you, grateful for each and every one of you, and at