Next Level University

One Of These Mindsets Will Get You Stuck… (2018)

• Kevin Palmieri and Alan Lazaros

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Are your daily choices moving you forward—or holding you back? In today’s episode, unpack how one simple mindset shift can completely change your future. They break down real-life examples—from credit cards and deep freezers to gas lines and podcast gear—to show how choosing to invest instead of consume leads to smarter, more rewarding outcomes.

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For more information, please check out our website at the link below. 👇

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Show notes:
(2:19) Consumer Vs. Investor thinking
(4:48) Is productivity worth the price?
(7:27) Making cost-value decisions
(9:08) Living with or without goals
(12:54) Math-minded decision-making
(13:06) Join Next Level Live: A virtual, immersive event for those committed to growth, meaningful relationships, and a life they love. https://www.nextleveluniverse.com/next-level-live/
(16:41) Smart spending in everyday life
(25:26) Small choices, big outcomes
(26:10) Outro

Send a text to Kevin and Alan!

🎙️ Hosted by Kevin Palmieri and Alan Lazaros

Next Level University is a top-ranked daily podcast for dream chasers and self-improvement lovers. With over 2,100 episodes, we help you level up in life, love, health, and wealth one day at a time. Subscribe for real, honest, no-fluff growth every single day.

Kevin Palmieri

How is it that the same set of circumstances can go in the favor of one person but against another ? I think you and I were talking about interest rates on credit cards recently , and some people are able to use credit cards and get all the points and pay down the balance and they never have to pay any interest . And I was an idiot in the beginning and I didn't know any of this and I ended up in credit card debt because I was a consumer , not an investor .

Alan Lazaros

An investor sacrifices in the short term for long-term benefit . It's pay now , play later . A consumer wants to play now and then ends up paying for it later .

Kevin Palmieri

Welcome to Next Level University . I'm your host , Kevin Palmieri .

Alan Lazaros

And I'm your co-host , Alan Lazarus .

Kevin Palmieri

At NLU , we believe in a heart-driven but no BS approach to holistic self-improvement for dream chasers .

Alan Lazaros

Our goal with every episode is to help you level up your life , love , health and wealth .

Kevin Palmieri

We bring you a new episode every single day on topics like confidence , self-belief , self-worth , self-awareness , relationships , boundaries , consistency , habits and defining your own unique version of success .

Alan Lazaros

Self-improvement in your pocket , every day , from anywhere , completely free .

Kevin Palmieri

Welcome to Next Level University , next Level Nation , today for episode number 2018 . One of these mindsets will get you stuck . The reason Alan is laughing so hard is because we are just trying to get through it . We're just getting through it . We're just figuring it out as we go .

Alan Lazaros

Kevin was going to do the intro and he just went , hey your brain broke .

Kevin Palmieri

We switched some things up behind the scenes and my brain is not ready for it yet . Which of these mindsets will get you stuck ? Alan told me a story today . He said one of my clients reached out and asked me if it was worth investing in a monitor , a secondary monitor they actually messaged me as well and they said can you send me or can you send me your setup ?

Consumer Vs. Investor thinking

Kevin Palmieri

and I said the same exact thing I . I said I don't think my setup is optimal for podcasting . Honestly . I think it's more optimal for productivity because my camera's under my TV , it's the whole thing . It's not great for being a guest on a podcast . You and I . It's a little bit different .

Kevin Palmieri

But I said , if you're optimizing to get more done , it's definitely worth investing in some sort of secondary screen . And going to what I talked about in the beginning , I think that's why I'm so big on awareness . If I had the awareness in the beginning that this credit card is 0% for a year , you can buy something that's going to help you make more money and then just pay it off over the course of a year with no downside . There's no punishment for doing that and you're going to get points in the process of it . I think I just would have operated way better .

Kevin Palmieri

But I I had way more of a consumer mindset of I buy the thing because I like it , not because it has utility , and I'm still more that way than Alan . But I do think the more I've moved from a consumer mindset into an investor mindset , the more successful . I have been and it makes sense . It makes total sense . When I was buying a new laptop , we got the laptop that , honestly , I didn't like . I didn't want a Mac , I wanted to do what I already had . But this our belief was it would be better long-term and that was an investor mindset and it has been . I love this laptop now . So that's just a simple example of this .

Alan Lazaros

That is the perfect example , brother . I was top now , so that's just a simple example of this . That is the perfect example , brother . I was going to go there too . So kev got a new macbook , macbook pro , and we picked , I think , the lowest of the newest ones . So apple always does three and it's the high-end , middle-end , low-end . And tech improves so damn fast , especially especially with computers . That , how old was your old laptop ? What ? Six years or something .

Kevin Palmieri

I think I got it in 2019 . It was like six years .

Alan Lazaros

Yeah , so it was time . We also got a new client . We've been talking a lot about that and Kevin's going to be doing a lot of work . So you need to be as productive as possible , and that MacBook Pro that we got you dude , that thing is capable of whatever . You need to be as productive

Is productivity worth the price?

Alan Lazaros

as possible .

Alan Lazaros

And that MacBook Pro that we got you , dude , that thing is capable of whatever you need , baby , that thing's good to go , awesome , right . So this client she had me send pictures of my setup and she's trying to become more productive and she asked me is this the best use of my capital , time , effort , money , what's the best use of your time , effort and's the best use of your time , effort and money ? I said , well , it depends . What are you using ? Now she has a macbook as well and she said , well , should I invest in this monitor ? I said how much is it ? She said 324 dollars or whatever . She sent me the links . I said yeah , absolutely .

Alan Lazaros

I said how much more productive is it going to make you ? And again , it's a hypothetical question , it's very hard to answer that actual question . I said how much more productive is it going to make you ? And again , it's a hypothetical question , it's very hard to answer that actual question . I said , right now , I have you up on a 52-inch behind me . I don't know where I got this TV . Was this from the studio , I think ?

Alan Lazaros

that's mine , this is yours .

Kevin Palmieri

Maybe I don't know .

Alan Lazaros

I have a monitor over here . I have two computers going and I've got a 52-inch over here . My other computer is off because my internet sucks . Yeah , take it easy it sucks it does .

Alan Lazaros

Sometimes it yes , it pisses me off , but I'm always optimizing for productivity . So this client let's break this down An investor says , hey , I'm going to buy this monitor so that I can be more productive , so that I can go and earn more money by adding more value . That's an investor's mindset . So I'm going to invest this 330 bucks and then , a month from now , three months from now , a year from now , it'll pay itself back . And then some Okay , a consumer would go buy I don't know a new , a new .

Alan Lazaros

This person likes clothing . And she said it would be a dumb use of my capital to just go buy a bunch of a bunch of clothes just because I like it . I don't need new clothes , I already have nice clothes . I said that's exactly it right now . It doesn't mean you never , ever invest or spend money on what you want . It just means you have to be intelligent with with your money . And I think of life like a giant chess game . It's what is the best use of my time , what is the best use of my money ? And if you are always playing that way , you end up with more time and more money and more effort and you get better .

Alan Lazaros

She also asked me this . She said should I go to this training ? It's three days . I said okay , let's do a cost value analysis . What are the inputs ? She said it's going to cost me 800 bucks . I'm going to get certified and I think she gets a certification . I don't know if it's , I think she gets like a hey , you did this thing . I don't know . I don't know if it's an actual cost her three days . It's going to cost her 800 bucks .

Making cost-value decisions

Alan Lazaros

I said how many people are you going to meet ? She said ah , maybe hundreds . I said okay , are they in your industry ? She said yeah . I said okay , are you going to learn a lot ? She said yeah , are you going to improve your craft ? Yeah , I said it sounds good . Now here's the part that I want to try to make land .

Alan Lazaros

When she goes to buy the monitor , she's not doing a cost value analysis up against just a monitor versus buying clothes . You're you're basically trying to maximize every dollar and every unit of your time up against anything you could do . That's why it's so overwhelming , brother , it's . It's not a chess game . A chess game has what ? 24 pieces and it's a tiny little board . I'd have to look it up . I think it's 24 , but the point is is in life it's infinite possibilities . I said you need to ask yourself this question and this is overwhelming as hell . Is this use of my money better than any other use of my money ? It's not like you're at the store going I want this jar of jelly versus this one . I don't know why I always use jelly . There's a psychological study they did with jars of jelly and how there's too many options and it doesn't matter . But the point is it's not like you're doing strawberry versus blueberry jelly . See , that would be easy . Ah , blueberry .

Kevin Palmieri

Right , you got to go blue . Nutella , for me neither Okay .

Alan Lazaros

Okay , sounds good . But when you make a choice for your career , when you make a choice for what to do in fitness , when you make a choice of what monitor to buy , there's , there's , thousands of options . It's very , very difficult to pick . What do you do ? I was thinking about this recently . When you wake up in the morning , how do you know what to do ? It depends on your goals .

Living with or without goals

Kevin Palmieri

Yeah .

Alan Lazaros

Well , if you don't have goals , how do you know what to do ? Seriously , I'm actually asking Like I don't know what it's like to wake up in the morning and not know what to do , and that sounds really probably arrogant and pretentious , but I've always been reverse engineering goals't . I don't know what it's like to like , just wake up and do stuff you know , whatever you do , you kind of do whatever you want , regardless of consequence yeah well , there is no consequence because there's no goal to measure it against .

Kevin Palmieri

I remember I would and I miss these fucking days again . There's the nostalgia piece of just having not really knowing the downside . I know it . Yes , I want to make sure I know the downside , but the nostalgia comes with wishing you didn't at times and then remembering what you didn't so you would just do things without knowing where it was leading .

Kevin Palmieri

Yes , yeah , back in the day , back in the day , Back in the day , I would be in New Jersey for work . My two buddies would be . I left a key to my place . They'd be at my place waiting for me . I would get home at like 6 o'clock at night . We'd hang out , we'd play Call of Duty , we'd order pizza , sleep in , and the next day it was like we just did whatever we wanted . We went to the gym , played video games , hung out , watched a movie , whatever there was . No , the goal was relaxation . That was the goal . The goal was relaxation . That was the goal .

Alan Lazaros

The goal was relaxation , the good old days , by the way I was with a uh , a client yesterday who he's an engineer as well and ap cal teacher and I I don't know if he ever got his degree . So when I call you an engineer , sir , again I'm just talking high level everybody . But he went to my school WPI . So I think he is an engineer , but again , correct me if I'm wrong , brother . But he and I were talking about how , back in the day , we would calculate the exact amount of alcohol per unit of calorie , per volume , per cost . So I'll give this tiny example and I think this will be of value . So back in college he and I were at college at the same time , he was in my fraternity and Miller High Life was $9 for 18 bottles and it's alcohol per volume , per price point was optimal . Volume per price point was optimal .

Alan Lazaros

So I went with that and him and I were talking yesterday on the phone on Zoom about how we've never not calculated everything and how weird it is to live in a world where other people aren't doing as many calculations . And he's someone I would consider kind of a math genius and he's an AP Cal teacher and a lot of his students aren't calculating things quite as accurately or as optimally as he thinks they should , and that kind of thing , and he's awesome , he's great . But him and I have never not done that . We've never , like I , calculated the exact amount of drunk .

Alan Lazaros

I wanted to get by the exact moment , in the exact amount of money , with the exact type of alcohol , because each alcohol is a different type of drunk and I would purposely eat a certain amount in order to make sure that I could sustain it long term throughout the night . But everything's equations and math and I know you're laughing , but here's , here's the thing , right to make this relevant to anyone watching or listening . What are you calculating like are you ? You got to make sure what you're doing is building toward a bigger , better , brighter future , and I don't I don't want to project on anyone and say you have to , but you're definitely in trouble if you're not doing that . I mean , if you were still just playing video games , you know , going to the gym and getting drunk , you'd be screwed straight , straight up

Math-minded decision-making

Alan Lazaros

, screwed .

Kevin Palmieri

Yeah , I'd be in trouble . I'd be in trouble , for sure , yeah you wouldn't have built this magnificent life .

Alan Lazaros

You have right , and Taryn wouldn't want to be with a guy like that .

Kevin Palmieri

No , no , no . Well , the truth is , I think she deserves more than that

Join Next Level Live: A virtual, immersive event for those committed to growth, meaningful relationships, and a life they love.

Kevin Palmieri

Next Level Nation . We are very , very excited to announce that we are doing our first purely virtual Next Level Live . On April 5th 2025 , from 10 am to 4 pm Eastern Standard Time , alan and myself will be live streaming from Worcester , massachusetts .

Alan Lazaros

Next Level , live 2025 . Be there , it's only $47 for a full day of personal development , self-improvement , holistic health , wealth , life and love .

Kevin Palmieri

We have a global audience . Obviously , if you live somewhere else in the world , it's hard to come across the country or across the world for a one-day event , so we wanted to make sure it was accessible to everyone .

Alan Lazaros

You're not going to get to the next level of your life by default . You're going to get there by design . Join us Design that next level . By default , you're going to get there by design . Join us design that next level . So how would you ? Where would you go with this ? Because I , time , effort and money are the resources we all have and we all have to make choices based on what we want to build in our life , career , calling business success , relationship . It's all by design . How would you explain that ?

Kevin Palmieri

Well , for me it's the conversation of where are you naturally wired ? The thing that's always been very interesting to me , and again , I don't mean this from a place of judgment . This is a really powerful place of awareness judgment . This is a really powerful place of awareness when gas , when there's a gas station , let's say , gas is expensive and gas they do like a giveaway , and it's 50 cents off a gallon for a day and there's a four hour line to get gas , if we really sit and think , okay , we're going to save 50 cents per gallon , awesome , we have a 12 gallon fuel tank . Okay , you're going to save $6 . $6 ? No $4? .

Alan Lazaros

What did I say ? It was 50 cents off each gallon by 12 .

Kevin Palmieri

Yes , isn't it $6 . Isn't it ?

Alan Lazaros

isn't it six dollars , isn't it ? Isn't it four dollars ?

Kevin Palmieri

no , no , 50 cents times 12 is six dollars 50 cents times 12 , all right , cool .

Alan Lazaros

Well , clearly I can't figure out . Usually I'm really good at this math you're gonna save that amount of money yeah , is it really that means you're valuing your time at very little three , three1.33 per hour .

Kevin Palmieri

Right , right or $1.66 . I don't know , the number is the whole , thing , let's do six divided by four , the whole thing's Jeffed .

Alan Lazaros

No , no , no , it's 1.5 . Okay , so you're valuing your time at $1.50 an hour . If you're waiting in a four-hour line to save $6? , yes , that leads to a lot of other things .

Kevin Palmieri

Like , I'm not interested in going and standing in line for Black Friday . I don't really . I'm going to save $50 on something that I don't need . Nah , now , if so , this . So there's two thoughts . One I'm going to sit in line for seven hours on Black Friday , get there first so I can go in and buy a big screen TV that I don't really need , and I'm going to get 30% off . Okay , that's one . The other one is I'm going to sit in line for seven hours so I can go buy six new PlayStations and then I can flip them and make money on all those . Now , six PlayStations would be a lot of money . You'd have to have some cash on hand for that . But that's the difference between a consumer mindset and an investor mindset . Those are two very , very different things .

Smart spending in everyday life

Kevin Palmieri

Taryn came to me . She sold me my wife sold me on something Well , very , very well . She said , hey , I think we should get a deep freezer , and I was like what , where the hell is this coming from Nice ? Get a deep freezer ? And I was like what , where the hell is this coming from nice ? And she said , well , it's like 140 bucks . We'll split it and I'll be able to buy food way more food . When it's on sale , we can freeze it and you'll never run out of ground beef , and you'll never run out of ground turkey , and we'll always have frozen food available . Smart , okay , I'm in . I'm in .

Alan Lazaros

But all it was was yeah , it makes sense .

Kevin Palmieri

That makes sense financially .

Alan Lazaros

I'm in . So , it's 70 bucks each 70 bucks . The question is when it's called internal rate of return . So how long does it take for you to break even ? Probably Probably like three or four months Eh . Probably like six , I'd say probably six months yeah , this is a good long-term investment , assuming you take it with you when you get a home yeah , well , it's coming .

Alan Lazaros

It's going to come everywhere so let me ask you this , so . So if people were to ask me like , hey , what are the most important character traits for success , I would say number one is self-belief , number two is humility , number three is work ethic and number four is intelligence . In that order , intelligence is just making smart decisions . That's why people are afraid of ai , because it can make smarter choices than than them and it'll take their jobs . Essentially , um , I have a client who uses chat gpt to coach him all the time yeah and I'm like , oh , I better keep my shit together here , right , but I'm honestly not .

Alan Lazaros

I'm being playful , but at the end of the day , I do understand why people are scared of that right .

Alan Lazaros

Intelligence is a threat , because if we create a machine that's smarter than us , we're in some trouble potentially , and again , that's terminator stuff and all that . We're gonna be all right . But the point I'm making is and I I'm asking you this , kev I've always considered intelligence the most important thing . The ability to make an effective choice is the most important thing . I mean other than self-belief , work , ethic and humility . But like , if you can't make intelligent , long-term choices , you basically are winging it and you're going to end up in a bad place . That's just mathematically true . How do you sell people on how to make more intelligent choices ? Like all my failures in the past were my own dumbass choices .

Kevin Palmieri

Same . I don't know . I think the thing that you're the thing right now that is hurting you the most , somebody else has probably found a way to make it super beneficial . It's like , again , I keep using credit cards as an example , but for every 10 people that are in massive credit card debt and they don't know how to , how they got there , there is one person who knows exactly how to use it for the benefits that you can have from it . But it's not set up that way . It's set up so the well it is . It's set up so the people who really know what they're doing can benefit from it . But the the vast majority of us have never been taught about what an eight , what apr , means . I still don't know . If somebody said explain apr , it's like I couldn't possibly I don't know annual percent rate or something .

Kevin Palmieri

Yeah , it's like I don't know it . It runs in a certain cycle and that's how it gets . The interest accumulates in a certain jeffed way , but for every , for every 10 people that are stuck in credit card debt because it's like , well , I'll just pay the minimum and I'll get out , no , it's gonna take you like 25 years , depending on what the amount is . There's somebody else who Matt's a really good example . My buddy Matt would get a card because he had really good credit . He would go spend $10,000 on something that he needed for his investment property , get a bunch of points for it and then say , okay , I spent $10,000 . I got to pay this off within 12 months .

Kevin Palmieri

I'm going to pay $950 a month on auto pay and then it'll be done . Cool that way .

Alan Lazaros

he pays no interest , he gets all the money up front and he gets free capital from the cash on hand .

Kevin Palmieri

Yeah , it's a win-win-win-win . But he also has a finance degree , so it makes sense why he would do that and somebody else like me I would never have done that in the past . I just didn't understand how it worked . There was a snowstorm a couple years ago and the complex was plowing and if you don't move your car , it gets towed , like that's the thing you got to move your car , it's going to get towed . And taryn knocked on the office door and said , hey , you got to move your car . And I said I have a call with like a very warm potential client . I said let him fucking tow it . I'm gonna get this client . And she's like what I said babe , you gotta think about it . This client is 500 bucks a month . If they stay for one month , I mean how much is gonna cost for me to go get the car ? A couple hundred bucks . Let me see if I can get this client Assuming .

Alan Lazaros

Taryn couldn't just move it herself ?

Kevin Palmieri

Right , yes , but I think she was leaving .

Alan Lazaros

Yeah , she had work , I think she was doing something .

Kevin Palmieri

So it was like , yeah , it is what it is . Either it's going to get towed or it's not going to get towed . I'm not going to move it , that client with us for two years Nice , I was thinking of the now again . You can't do that all the time .

Kevin Palmieri

Right Because if I did that and we didn't get the client , we didn't have any money and I lost my car . That's a whole different . So there are layers to it , but I think that's probably my best example of like . I don't know , that's not a typical story , but that was very much me saying all right , I'm going to invest my time into this call where I can make that money back today and let me see what I can do . And luckily it paid off .

Alan Lazaros

So Emilia and I live in a condo complex and all the landscaping , plowing , all that stuff gets taken care of . But we all pay . Everyone in the condo complex pays for that . As long as emilia and I are productive during that time when I would have been plowing , that's a net win right . But if we're , and I try to make this land and maybe it'll land differently this time . But one of the benefits I think of working so much is you're not spending as much no , no but seriously real talk , brother .

Alan Lazaros

When you're working you're not spending I .

Kevin Palmieri

You only need five minutes to spend five hundred dollars .

Alan Lazaros

Doesn't take long , yeah , but when you're focused on your work , you're not spending money , brother , because if you take a weekend off , really think about this , you're gonna end up spending money . I mean always . You don't take weekends off and not spend money .

Kevin Palmieri

Nobody does well I could work , yeah , but I would still .

Alan Lazaros

I would get food or something , even if I were you and I worked all day , sunday okay , if you work real talk if you work 20 hours on a saturday and a sunday , you're gonna spend less than if you just hung out all that time I would say if you're not intentionally focused on saving money exactly which is normal well , you always say it to me like if you work more , you're going to spend less .

Kevin Palmieri

It's like , brother , I'm already trying not to spend money it might be the . It might be the opposite for me , because I get to the end of the day and it's like I need to drive some food into this belly of mine , yeah , yeah .

Alan Lazaros

Well , even then you're running the equation of it's going to take me , I'm going to save time so that I can be more productive . I mean , emilia and I were going to be getting takeout . We're going to yeah much time . So , again , at the end of the day I said this to my client earlier I feel like my dream came true . I feel like I'm a math teacher . I wanted to be a math teacher when I was a kid and I loved math and I said I can't be a math teacher , quite frankly , just being very honest , because they don't make enough money . And that was my decision when I was very young . I decided not to do that and I figured I'd be a professor , maybe one day in my 70s or 80s . And now I get to teach math to business owners and to podcasters and to listeners . And this client I know we got to go . This client . She asked me well , how are you calculating all this ? And I said that's the hardest part . I don't know how to explain it because unless you understand the mathematics underneath it , it's very hard to calculate . So the simplest way I can give it to our listeners now is what are the inputs of time , effort and money . And what are you going to get out of it long-term ? Because that freezer example that's not going to actually pay off until six months from now . That's a decision you're making now that will pay off in six months from now and only if you use the freezer optimally

Small choices, big outcomes

Alan Lazaros

, right ? So that's just .

Alan Lazaros

It's an investor versus a consumer mindset . Consumers are in trouble if you don't also invest . I'm a consumer too . I bought a couple new hats . They're seven bucks each , athletica . Thank you so much . Awesome hats . Okay , I bought four of them , all in different colors , because I don't need much and I use them every goddamn day in the gym , every day . I go to the gym now because of this long hair , but that's an investment , because I can focus more . It's , it's , everything . Is is either building towards your bigger , better , brighter future or destructive everything . And so just get a little bit smarter , a little bit more intelligent , make a little bit of better choices over time , and your life will get better and better and better Little by little .

Kevin Palmieri

This episode is going to be destructive to my calendar if we don't get off here because you and I both have calls .

Outro

Kevin Palmieri

As always , we love you , we appreciate you , grateful for each and every one of you at NLU . We don't have fans , we have family . We will talk to you all tomorrow .

Alan Lazaros

Keep making next level decisions , Next Level Nation .

Kevin Palmieri

Thanks for joining us for another episode of Next Level University . We love connecting with the Next Level family .

Alan Lazaros

We mean it when we say family . If you ever need anything , please reach out to us directly . Everything you need to get a hold of us is in the show notes .

Kevin Palmieri

Thank you again and we will talk to you tomorrow .

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Alan Lazaros

Host
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Kevin Palmieri

Host