You Gotta Go Backwards To Go Forward (2170)

In today’s episode of Next Level University, hosts Kevin Palmieri and Alan Lazaros break down why true progress often comes with short-term sacrifices, whether it’s gaining weight to build muscle, taking on debt to create wealth, or accepting tough feedback from a coach. Through real stories and raw honesty, they reveal why discipline and accountability matter more than “just knowing what to do.” If you’re ready to reframe setbacks as stepping stones, this conversation will give you the clarity and push you need.

Learn more about:
📅Next Level University Monthly Meetup #45: “How to Design Your Life & Environment for Success” - https://us06web.zoom.us/meeting/register/XAKkZd2DSw6G3NMlxL67vA#/registration
👥Join our Facebook community “Next Level Nation” - https://www.facebook.com/groups/459320958216700

Free 30-minute Business Breakthrough Session with Alan -https://calendly.com/alanlazaros/30-minute-free-breakthrough-session?month=2025-04
Free 30-Minute Podcast Breakthrough Session with Kevin -https://calendly.com/kevinpalmieri/free-30-minute-podcast-breakthrough-session-with-kevin

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NLU is not just a podcast; it’s a gateway to a wealth of resources designed to help you achieve your goals and dreams. From our Next Level Dreamliner to our Group Coaching, we offer a variety of tools and communities to support your personal development journey.

For more information, check out our website and socials using the links below. 👇

Website 💻  http://www.nextleveluniverse.com

Instagram 📷
Kevin: https://www.instagram.com/neverquitkid/
Alan: https://www.instagram.com/alazaros88/

Facebook ✍
Alan: https://www.facebook.com/alan.lazaros
Kevin: https://www.facebook.com/kevin.palmieri.90/

Email 💬
Kevin@nextleveluniverse.com
Alan@nextleveluniverse.com

LinkedIn ✍
Kevin: https://www.linkedin.com/in/kevin-palmieri-5b7736160/
Alan: https://www.linkedin.com/in/alanlazarosllc/

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Show notes:
(3:01) Debt, discipline, and real leverage
(6:50) Knowledge Vs. Action in growth
(10:14) Level up with NLU: Join our free virtual Monthly Meet-up event every first Thursday for powerful insights, real tools, and unstoppable growth. https://us06web.zoom.us/meeting/register/XAKkZd2DSw6G3NMlxL67vA#/registration
(13:05) Avoiding feedback keeps you stuck
(16:03) Sacrifice required for next-level growth
(18:45) Outro

🎙️ Hosted by Kevin Palmieri and Alan Lazaros

Next Level University is a top-ranked daily podcast for dream chasers and self-improvement lovers. With over 2,100 episodes, we help you level up in life, love, health, and wealth one day at a time. Subscribe for real, honest, no-fluff growth every single day.

Chapters

• 3:01 Debt, discipline, and real leverage
• 6:50 Knowledge Vs. Action in growth
• 10:14 Level up with NLU: Join our free virtual Monthly Meet-up event every first Thursday for powerful insights, real tools, and unstoppable growth.
• 13:05 Avoiding feedback keeps you stuck
• 16:03 Sacrifice required for next-level growth
• 18:45 Outro

Transcript

Kevin Palmieri

(0:00) My thesis on this is you will not go backwards to go forward on something that you do not believe you have the capability or skills to actually go forward on.

Alan Lazaros

(0:12) I tried to propose something to our Next Level Fitness Accountability group and it went worse than I expected and here's why. (0:21) Welcome to Next Level University. (0:24) I'm your host, Kevin Palmieri.

Kevin Palmieri

(0:25) And I'm your co-host, Alan Lazarus. (0:29) At NLU, we believe in a heart-driven but no BS approach to holistic self-improvement for dream chasers.

Alan Lazaros

(0:35) Our goal with every episode is to help you level up your life, love, health, and wealth.

Kevin Palmieri

(0:41) We bring you a new episode every single day on topics like confidence, self-belief, self-worth, self-awareness, relationships, boundaries, consistency, habits, and defining your own unique version of success.

Alan Lazaros

(0:57) Self-improvement in your pocket every day from anywhere completely free. (1:04) Welcome to Next Level University.

Kevin Palmieri

(1:09) Next Level Nation today for episode number 2,170, you've got to go backwards to go forward. (1:17) So as Alan alluded to, we did the 10-pound in 10-week challenge in the Next Level Fitness Accountability Group. (1:23) And again, not everybody had that specific goal.(1:26) Everybody had a goal and the goal was to help everybody stay accountable, create some necessity, create a little culture around fitness. (1:34) Alan posted in there today, which I'm grateful for because I think it helps me from a place of consistency and commitment. (1:39) But he said, is there anybody, would anybody want to do something like this?(1:44) And then he linked a post that he did. (1:46) No love. (1:47) No love.

Alan Lazaros

(1:47) Essentially, he was saying, a little bit of love, but no one is game. (1:51) No one is game. (1:52) No one is game.(1:54) And Kev's like, I know, I, of course, it makes total sense.

Kevin Palmieri

(1:57) So the thought was, what if we do the opposite of what we just did, where we just tried to intentionally set a goal for weight loss, whatever number it was, whatever rate it was, it's all up to you. (2:10) Let's do the opposite, where we set a goal for weight gain. (2:13) And the second I saw that, I was like, that is not, seriously, that is not going to work.(2:19) You, yeah, good.

Alan Lazaros

(2:21) You have to gain weight in order to build muscle half tax. (2:25) These are facts. (2:26) These are facts.(2:27) Why does no one want to do that?

Kevin Palmieri

(2:30) Build muscle equals good, build muscle, good, build muscles. (2:34) Good equals good. (2:36) That is a piece of it.(2:38) If you do not feel like you have the skills to do the thing you're going to have to do after going backwards. (2:45) So this is what I said to Alan. (2:47) It's very hard to leverage the benefit.(2:53) If you don't know actually how to leverage the benefit, that's all. (2:57) That's all it is.

Alan Lazaros

(2:58) I was thinking about this. (3:00) Some people actually use debt to make more money. (3:06) Other people just go into debt.

Kevin Palmieri

(3:08) If you were to look at the stats, what percentage of the United States is in debt? (3:13) Uh, I would say 60 plus percent probably. (3:16) What percentage of them are in constructive debt?(3:20) At least 3%. (3:21) So 57% aren't, right?

Alan Lazaros

(3:24) And again, we did not look up those stats right now.

Kevin Palmieri

(3:26) Fake made up numbers.

Alan Lazaros

(3:28) Yeah, completely made up numbers.

Kevin Palmieri

(3:29) But that, that's a really good, you could do the same thing with fitness. (3:33) To me, why go into debt if it's not to leverage? (3:35) Because you don't know how not to.(3:39) In order to, in order to, uh, okay, credit cards are a great example of this. (3:44) In order to take advantage of a credit card, you know how they, you have to know how they take advantage of you.

Alan Lazaros

(3:49) Yeah. (3:49) A hundred percent.

Kevin Palmieri

(3:50) Of course. (3:50) In order to gain weight, to then lose weight in a better way to create a better.

Alan Lazaros

(4:00) Is there people who don't know how to lose weight?

Kevin Palmieri

(4:02) Of course. (4:03) Yeah, of course. (4:04) Not necessarily.

Alan Lazaros

(4:05) You can Google it.

Kevin Palmieri

(4:07) It's yeah, but there's the discipline. (4:09) There's the method.

Alan Lazaros

(4:10) Yeah. (4:11) I don't want to come off wrong in that. (4:12) I just, everyone knows how, whether or not they do it as a different story.

Kevin Palmieri

(4:17) I still disagree because if that was the case, then all of these bullshit products would not exist. (4:23) You wouldn't be able to sell skinny detox tea. (4:26) It wouldn't work.(4:27) And it works. (4:28) Sorry. (4:29) It doesn't work getting you result, but people sell it.

Alan Lazaros

(4:32) So when I say this, you exercise more and eat less. (4:36) That's it.

Kevin Palmieri

(4:38) Yeah. (4:38) I understand. (4:39) But that it doesn't work.(4:41) It doesn't land.

Alan Lazaros

(4:41) Everyone knows how everyone knows that exercise more, eat less.

Kevin Palmieri

(4:45) No, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no.

Alan Lazaros

(4:50) It doesn't get any more basic than that.

Kevin Palmieri

(4:52) I understand. (4:53) But it, the problem is it's been so misconstrued and people have. (4:57) That makes me so sad.(4:59) I think every, that makes me so sad. (5:01) Money, make more, spend less, invest the difference, make more, spend less, invest the difference. (5:05) Right?

Alan Lazaros

(5:06) No, again, but everyone knows that doing it is different. (5:11) Everyone knows make more and spend less is how you get wealthy.

Kevin Palmieri

(5:14) I think it's not, I don't know. (5:16) I think the vast majority of people think make more and they don't ever think spend less and they don't Google it.

Alan Lazaros

(5:28) This is why I think people have a hard time with me. (5:31) I feel very triggered right now because I'm going to come off like a Dick, but Google it. (5:37) Just fucking Google it.

Kevin Palmieri

(5:38) You still do it.

Alan Lazaros

(5:39) This is why I, you, I don't think it's because they don't know how I think it's because they can't get themselves to do it.

Kevin Palmieri

(5:44) Well, I I'm telling you right now, there is a subset of people who are, have been run through the ringer of snake oil salespeople on social media when it comes to fitness. (5:55) I'm telling you, I'm I've seen it. (5:56) I low carb, low fat Atkins.(6:02) Yeah. (6:02) Weight watchers slim. (6:03) None of that would work.

Alan Lazaros

(6:05) It makes me very sad. (6:06) It bothers me so much. (6:08) You know what it is?(6:09) It, it makes me sad first and then it pisses me off second.

Kevin Palmieri

(6:12) Yeah.

Alan Lazaros

(6:14) Understand. (6:15) That's it. (6:16) Earn more, spend less, invest the difference and you'll be wealthy.(6:20) Eventually over time you'll get more and more wealthy over time. (6:23) I'm helping a lot of people get wealthy actually. (6:27) And then exercise more, eat less and you will lose weight.(6:33) Scientific fact.

Kevin Palmieri

(6:35) I understand. (6:36) I understand.

Alan Lazaros

(6:37) And that's the end of the episode.

Kevin Palmieri

(6:39) I have had many arguments because to me, knowledge is not power. (6:42) It is pure.

Alan Lazaros

(6:43) Well, I do. (6:44) I agree. (6:45) Well, I agree somewhat with that.(6:49) What I will say is I used to say this in fitness coaching. (6:53) I helped one person lose like 115 pounds. (6:58) They gained most of it back, unfortunately.(7:00) And then someone else lose like 50 pounds. (7:02) They also gained most of it back, unfortunately. (7:05) But I used to say this and now I realize I used to say anyone can teach you how to lose weight.(7:11) Almost no one can get you to actually do it. (7:13) That's the difference between my coaching and other people's coaching. (7:16) I will get you to actually do it.(7:18) Yeah. (7:19) And they're like, how? (7:21) Military mindset, accountability, commitment devices, tracking, metrics.(7:25) I will get you to get leverage on yourself. (7:29) Kev, I am always pressuring you to become better. (7:33) Always.(7:34) Sure. (7:34) But I'm not asking you to do anything I'm not doing. (7:38) So leading by example first, because how dare I tell you to do something that I'm not doing?(7:43) And I'll never do that. (7:44) But what I will do is, and this is again, unapologetic coaching plug. (7:48) If you can't get yourself to do things, I can get you to do them.(7:52) I'm serious.

Kevin Palmieri

(7:54) I know.

Alan Lazaros

(7:54) It is my job to get you to actually fucking do the simple things. (7:58) And it's my favorite work in the world. (8:00) And I've been thinking about this a lot lately.(8:02) You're not going to go to boot camp, boot camp for the military in the Marines and then be upset that someone is like hard on you. (8:09) So this is what I'm doing now before I sell coaching is like, don't come to my coaching unless you want it to be hard. (8:15) Like that's the fucking point.(8:17) You're not coaching with me so that I can like baby you. (8:23) You're coaching with me so that I get you to listen to your highest self so that I can help you reach your full potential. (8:30) Like one of my least favorite parts of my job is this is going to be for the listeners, but I need to express something.(8:38) Every time I hear about Kev, they always say he's, oh, what a great guy. (8:43) What a great guy. (8:43) Everyone says that about you.(8:44) And I know you appreciate that. (8:46) There's a part of me that's like, no one ever fucking says that about me ever. (8:51) I've never, that's not the first thing anyone would ever say about me, but dude, and again, this is nothing against you.(8:58) I help more people than you do. (9:00) Why are you a great guy? (9:02) And I'm a fucking asshole when I'm the one who's helping people more.(9:05) And I'm actually asking, I'm not trying to attack you.

Kevin Palmieri

(9:07) Oh, because you create more fucking resistance in their life than I do. (9:11) Of course. (9:12) Simple.(9:13) You're a pain in the ass with love that that's all. (9:17) Isn't that a good thing? (9:18) No, it's not.(9:19) We just want to run amok.

Alan Lazaros

(9:20) Like, I think it's, it's, that's why I don't like leadership, man.

Kevin Palmieri

(9:25) I understand. (9:26) Look to the degree I can understand. (9:27) I understand.(9:29) I don't know. (9:31) It makes sense.

Alan Lazaros

(9:32) It's like, because I always feel like the bad guy, you know, it's like, why am I the one who has to say, Hey, it's actually not that fucking hard. (9:40) You got it.

Kevin Palmieri

(9:40) That you, you dislike in high school is usually the one you look back on and say, fuck, that was a good, that was actually a good coach.

Alan Lazaros

(9:46) Yeah.

Kevin Palmieri

(9:46) You had a coach.

Alan Lazaros

(9:48) You were late. (9:49) He fired you. (9:50) Yeah.(9:51) Yeah.

Kevin Palmieri

(9:51) And he was the best coach I've ever had. (9:53) A hundred percent hands down. (9:54) But at the time he was such a dick at the time.(9:56) And if you didn't have ownership at the time, you would have convinced yourself like, dude, what an arrogant asshole. (10:01) I was five minutes late twice and he fired me. (10:03) No, that's good for him.

Alan Lazaros

(10:05) Yeah. (10:05) And he also made thousands of dollars an hour and coached me for free back when we were broke because he believed in me and I saw what, but that's the truth. (10:15) NLU listener, what is happening?(10:17) I just wanted to jump in here and let you know, if you want to get to the next level faster, we have a free virtual monthly meetup at the first Thursday of every month. (10:26) You can connect with like-minded people and become a bigger part of this amazing global community. (10:31) The link to register will be in the show notes.(10:35) Same with your, uh, your fitness coach. (10:38) Yeah. (10:39) He was, he's like, dude, if you July 4th or something, I just tell that story.

Kevin Palmieri

(10:46) Yeah. (10:46) I was prepping for a bodybuilding show. (10:47) My bodybuilding show was in September.(10:50) I had my birthday, I think two weddings in the 4th of July. (10:55) And for the 4th of July, we had gone somewhere and we were like on the beach and I had a handful of M&Ms and a couple of s'mores and I texted him. (11:03) I was like, Hey man, I had a handful of M&Ms and some s'mores.(11:07) And he's like, first of all, why would you even tell me? (11:09) I would not have known. (11:11) And second of all, if you weren't you, I would fire you as a client right now.(11:15) And I was like, Whoa, I wish I didn't tell you, but that's the level, not a W for ownership. (11:21) It's again, this, this is triggering to people. (11:24) So I want to throw it out there, but like I would go to the best coach you've ever had.(11:29) A hundred percent. (11:30) You're the best. (11:31) No, you're the best coach I've ever had.(11:32) Oh, thank you, brother. (11:32) You're very welcome. (11:33) I would go to him.(11:35) You ever want to punch me all the time today, like 15 times today. (11:39) Already. (11:40) It's only 1240, but I would go to him, strip off my clothes, get in my underwear and then say, what, where are we?(11:47) How far off am I? (11:48) How much am I? (11:49) What would you say?(11:50) Usually it was like, no, on pace. (11:52) Good, good, good on pace. (11:54) But I know there were times where if I wasn't, he would tell me and say, dude, you're, you're, it's not happening fast enough.(12:01) Like we need to speed this up.

Alan Lazaros

(12:02) I know this isn't the point, but this is fire. (12:04) Do you want the truth or do you want someone to make you feel better?

Kevin Palmieri

(12:08) Well, that's, it depends on the goals.

Alan Lazaros

(12:12) Yeah.

Kevin Palmieri

(12:12) And it depends on what you've what you've been convinced you need.

Alan Lazaros

(12:17) Yeah. (12:18) Well, being appreciated in your own time is not easy when you actually care about people reaching their potential. (12:24) I don't care if you have more fun, dude.(12:26) I care about your fucking future and the future of this company and the betterment of the world and the listeners. (12:32) And I think it's, it's more meaningful, you know, it's more meaningful, but it's always harder. (12:37) Of course.(12:38) It's like, so I think I'm going to give more disclaimers from now on, not just on the podcast, but in general, it's like I, my monthly meetups, we have one coming up in September. (12:47) So the link will be in the show notes. (12:50) Kev used to do these with me.(12:52) And now the whole first five slides are just disclaimers. (12:55) Like seriously leave. (12:56) If you're in a bad state, seriously leave because the whole thing is basically going to make you feel wildly inadequate because the truth is we are inadequate.(13:05) I'm inadequate. (13:07) I have to get better every day not that successful. (13:12) I really want this to land.(13:15) I am not even fucking close to as strong of a leader or speaker as I need to be to achieve my goals. (13:22) Not even close. (13:23) If I was, we would have already achieved the goals.

Kevin Palmieri

(13:27) So this idea that no one wants to feel inadequate is, is actually making you inadequate because if you're avoiding all feedback, but that's where the, I'm telling you, that's where the thing is, where if you already feel level 10 adequate, the way to help somebody is not to make them feel more adequate.

Alan Lazaros

(13:48) Yeah. (13:48) And if you feel inadequate, if you feel level 10 inadequate, the way to help them is not to make them feel inadequate.

Kevin Palmieri

(13:53) That's actually what I meant to say.

Alan Lazaros

(13:54) If you're a good coach, you won't.

Kevin Palmieri

(13:56) No, I know.

Alan Lazaros

(13:57) But I think if someone feels level 10 inadequate, I'm not going to make them feel more inadequate.

Kevin Palmieri

(14:00) No, no, I know. (14:01) I know. (14:01) But I think that's why I think more people feel inadequate than people would guess.(14:07) And you and I, how many people have we... (14:08) And they're putting on a show like they're not. (14:10) Of course.(14:10) That's been fascinating for me.

Alan Lazaros

(14:12) Okay.

Kevin Palmieri

(14:12) So if somebody shows up and says, Hey, give me a hundred percent. (14:16) Like if I went to that fitness coach, right? (14:18) If I went to that fitness coach and said, look, give me, I want you to treat me...(14:22) Like you treat yourself. (14:23) Yeah. (14:23) Like you treat yourself.(14:24) What would he say to you? (14:26) I, you...

Alan Lazaros

(14:27) He probably would have been like, dude, you're a, you're what the fuck? (14:30) Like you're terrible at this.

Kevin Palmieri

(14:31) But if I wasn't real when I said giving that feedback, that would have been wildly detrimental to me. (14:39) It was not detrimental. (14:40) That's exactly what I want.(14:41) Give me the, give me what you got. (14:42) I'm fine. (14:42) It's going to be fine.(14:43) Not a big deal. (14:44) Right.

Alan Lazaros

(14:44) I've been... (14:45) You did almost. (14:46) You did have some serious mental health issues.

Kevin Palmieri

(14:48) Yeah. (14:48) Well, that's not because of the advice you gave me. (14:50) That's because I was, I was committed to winning plastic trophies at the expense of my mental health.(14:55) All right.

Alan Lazaros

(14:55) All right.

Kevin Palmieri

(14:56) Last thing.

Alan Lazaros

(14:57) All right. (14:58) So I said at Never Quit Cat... (15:00) Jesus.(15:01) At Never Quit Kid and I have been thinking a lot lately about how to keep ourselves and the 10 pounds in 10 week challenge ends. (15:10) And you and I have been talking about this a lot too, Kev, where we want more motivation. (15:14) So let's, let's do this.(15:15) Let's win, win, win. (15:16) I know a lot of people aren't a fan of reverse dieting, but gaining weight is how you build muscle naturally and is super important for strength, wellbeing, and longevity facts, scientific facts. (15:28) If any of you next levelers would be open to mixing it up with a reverse diet challenge, starting in Q4 when it gets colder, please DM me, please DM us and let us know.(15:39) We are still thinking on it, but any feedback would be great. (15:41) Thank you. (15:42) Hashtag next level you.(15:43) I forget the hashtag apparently. (15:45) So I thought that was a great idea because it'll get people outside their comfort zone. (15:53) You, everyone says you have to get outside your comfort zone in order to grow.(15:56) Well, you have to learn how to gain weight just like I have to learn how to lose it. (16:02) I was tall and lanky, so I like being bigger. (16:04) So for me, it's outside my comfort zone to get leaner.(16:07) For most people, it's outside their comfort zone to get bigger, particularly women. (16:12) Understandable. (16:13) I'm not making that wrong, but you cannot go move.(16:16) You can't get to the next level without sacrificing the current level. (16:21) That's a principle. (16:23) I'm very frustrated at our company.(16:25) Like I'm ready to go to the next level and everyone can feel it in my intensity. (16:29) I also realize I have a warrior. (16:31) I never shared this with you.(16:32) I know we got to go, but Kev, I had a Halo two montage way back in the day called warrior within. (16:37) And I realize now that one of the reasons no one says Alan's a nice guy is because I have a warrior in me and warriors are only appreciated during war times. (16:47) And so I'm going to be a great coach for you if you're really down and out and you really want to win, but I'm going to be very much a pain in the ass if you want to chill.(16:56) Yeah.

Kevin Palmieri

(16:56) And I'm just pretty comfortable.

Alan Lazaros

(16:58) Yeah. (16:58) If you want to be comfortable, I'm not stay comfortable.

Kevin Palmieri

(17:00) Yeah.

Alan Lazaros

(17:01) It's all good. (17:02) Stay away and that's fine. (17:03) But to wrap this in a bow, you have to sacrifice the current level to get to the next level.(17:09) You have to gain weight to build muscle. (17:11) You have to lose muscle to burn fat. (17:15) There's always a loss that you can't.(17:18) People always say, well, I want to, they literally do this all the time. (17:20) It's mind blowing. (17:22) They say, well, I want to build muscle and burn fat.

Kevin Palmieri

(17:24) And I say that, no, well, it's cause they've been lied to.

Alan Lazaros

(17:27) You can't do that unless you take steroids. (17:29) And even then you kind of can't even people on steroids do bulks and cuts.

Kevin Palmieri

(17:33) That's because they, that's their stuff out there that says you can do it. (17:36) That's not scientifically accurate, but nobody looks at the science, baby.

Alan Lazaros

(17:41) Why not? (17:42) Let's fix listeners. (17:43) Look at the science, do the research, chat, GPT, deep research function, baby.(17:47) Like it's not, you'll have a plan or reach out. (17:50) I got you. (17:51) I will tell you the truth and then it's up to you what the fuck you do with it.

Kevin Palmieri

(17:56) I like intense today on a Monday, a little intense on a Monday.

Alan Lazaros

(18:01) I dig that. (18:02) You got to bring it.

Kevin Palmieri

(18:03) I dig that. (18:03) All right. (18:03) What's the meetup on?

Alan Lazaros

(18:06) How to divide, how to divide, how to design your life and environment for success.

Kevin Palmieri

(18:14) Perfect.

Alan Lazaros

(18:15) So set up your desk, set up your office, set up your home, set up everything.

Kevin Palmieri

(18:19) Yeah. (18:19) And that is on Thursday, September 4th. (18:25) Correct.(18:25) Correct. (18:25) Boom. (18:26) All right.(18:26) So we'll have the link in the show notes for that next other nation, the best Facebook group in the world. (18:31) We could brand it that way and like lie and say, this is the best, but we're not going to do that. (18:36) But it is really good.(18:37) It's best Facebook group in 278,000 countries, 12 continents. (18:43) We'll have the link in the show notes for that as well as always. (18:46) Love you.(18:47) Appreciate you. (18:47) Grateful for each and every one of you. (18:49) And if you are as committed as you say you are to getting to the next level, make sure you tune in tomorrow because you know we will be there to help you get there every single day.

Alan Lazaros

(18:57) Next level nation. (18:57) Keep reaching for your full potential every single day.

Kevin Palmieri

(19:02) Thanks for joining us for another episode of next level university. (19:06) We love connecting with the next level family.

Alan Lazaros

(19:09) We mean it when we say family. (19:11) If you ever need anything, please reach out to us directly. (19:14) Everything you need to get ahold of us is in the show notes.(19:18) Thank you again. (19:19) And we will talk to you tomorrow.