You Can’t Skip Levels (2375)

What happens when you try to grow faster than your foundation can support?

In this episode, Kevin Palmieri and Alan Lazaros break down why so many people get stuck trying to jump ahead in self-improvement. Based on their own journey, years of coaching, and thousands of episodes, they explore what happens when you chase advanced strategies before mastering the basics. The result is usually frustration, inconsistency, and slower progress than expected.

This conversation will shift how you think about growth, goals, and what it actually takes to build momentum that lasts. If you want real progress, you need a foundation strong enough to hold it. Hit play and check the level you’re really building from.

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Learn more about:
Book Alan’s Business Breakthrough Session. Your first 30-minute coaching call is FREE. Learn how to prioritize success and let your quality of life become the byproduct - https://calendly.com/alanlazaros/30-minute-breakthrough-session

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NLU is not just a podcast; it’s a gateway to a wealth of resources designed to help you achieve your goals and dreams. From our Next Level Dreamliner to our Group Coaching, we offer a variety of tools and communities to support your personal development journey.

For more information, check out our website and socials using the links below. 👇

Website: http://www.nextleveluniverse.com

Instagram:
Kevin: https://www.instagram.com/neverquitkid/
Alan: https://www.instagram.com/alazaros88/

Facebook:
Alan: https://www.facebook.com/alan.lazaros
Kevin: https://www.facebook.com/kevin.palmieri.90/

Email:
Kevin@nextleveluniverse.com
Alan@nextleveluniverse.com

LinkedIn:
Kevin: https://www.linkedin.com/in/kevin-palmieri-5b7736160/
Alan: https://www.linkedin.com/in/alanlazarosllc/

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Show notes:
(1:57) The Pareto principle and leverage
(6:40) Why goals determine what matters
(8:32) You cannot learn above your level
(10:46) Why do people hide what they do not know
(15:02) Know your level to keep growing
(17:10) Courage and honesty in coaching
(18:06) Outro

🎙️ Hosted by Kevin Palmieri and Alan Lazaros

Next Level University is a top-ranked daily podcast for dream chasers and self-improvement lovers. With over 2,100 episodes, we help you level up in life, love, health, and wealth one day at a time. Subscribe for real, honest, no-fluff growth every single day.

Transcript

Kevin Palmieri

(0:00) Self-improvement, personal development, it's all amazing, I love it, it has changed my life, but I think a lot of people unfortunately overcomplicate it, and they try to learn things that is just beyond their current scope, and I think it holds them back unfortunately.

Alan Lazaros

(0:15) If you try to skip levels, you're probably going to end up shooting yourself in the foot.

Kevin Palmieri

(0:21) Welcome to Next Level University. (0:23) I'm your host, Kevin Palmieri. (0:25) And I'm your co-host, Alan Lazarus.(0:28) At NLU, we believe in a heart-driven but no BS approach to holistic self-improvement for dream chasers.

Alan Lazaros

(0:35) Our goal with every episode is to help you level up your life, love, health, and wealth.

Kevin Palmieri

(0:41) We bring you a new episode every single day on topics like confidence, self-belief, self-worth, self-awareness, relationships, boundaries, consistency, habits, and defining your own unique version of success.

Alan Lazaros

(0:57) Self-improvement, in your pocket, every day, from anywhere, completely free. (1:04) Welcome to Next Level University.

Kevin Palmieri

(1:09) Next Level Nation today for episode number 2,375. (1:14) You can't skip levels. (1:16) I was talking to Alan the other day, and I'm going to start going on podcasts again.(1:20) I'm super excited. (1:21) And I said, dude, you know who I think I am? (1:23) I am like the the regular man's self-improvement, personal development, not coach, but like I'm...(1:36) I said to Alan, I said, I have a client and he's a very successful client. (1:40) You know him. (1:40) You work with this client as well.(1:42) And I asked him recently, I said, hey, have you ever heard of the Pareto principle? (1:45) And he said, no, I've never heard of it. (1:46) What is it?(1:47) And I said, well, it's blah, blah, blah. (1:49) You can explain it if you want. (1:50) But Alan has this thing where he...(1:52) Well, you should explain it. (1:53) Explain it and then I'll go deeper. (1:55) Do you want to give it a shot?(1:57) Yes. (1:57) There was a gentleman back in the olden days. (2:00) His name was Vilfredo Pareto.(2:04) Early 20th century. (2:05) Early 20th century. (2:06) I think it was like 1915 or something.(2:08) Back in the day. (2:09) I could be wrong. (2:09) He planted a bunch of pea plants and he found in time that 20% of the plants produced 80% of the crop.(2:18) Yep. (2:19) And then I haven't researched this, so I'm trusting you. (2:22) I know you have researched it, but essentially 20% of the people in the United States make 80% of the money.(2:26) 20% of the people drink 80% of the beer or alcohol.

Alan Lazaros

(2:30) It works on the macro too. (2:32) 20% of countries. (2:33) There's 195 countries.(2:35) 20% of countries control 80% of the wealth. (2:37) This is 20% of sports teams have 80% of the wins. (2:43) 20% of roads are traveled 80% of the time.(2:46) So you wear 80% of your clothing. (2:50) No. (2:51) You wear 20% of your clothing 80% of the time.

Kevin Palmieri

(2:54) Yeah.

Alan Lazaros

(2:55) Yeah.

Kevin Palmieri

(2:55) Yeah. (2:55) I wear the same. (2:56) I wear the same stuff.(2:57) I probably wear 5% of my clothing 95% of the time. (3:01) There you go. (3:01) Probably.(3:02) Okay. (3:03) So the goal and the understanding when it comes to success is you want to find the 20% of things that bring 80% of the results. (3:11) For us, this podcast is in that 20%.(3:14) If we stop this, everything would die overnight, essentially.

Alan Lazaros

(3:18) Not overnight, but yeah. (3:19) I mean, it would definitely be a huge momentum hit.

Kevin Palmieri

(3:26) So everything we've built that is level. (3:29) Level one is understanding Pareto principle.

Alan Lazaros

(3:32) No, sorry. (3:34) Good. (3:34) Good.(3:35) Level one is understanding that not every task you do is of equal value. (3:39) That's okay. (3:40) It's part one.(3:40) Perfect. (3:41) Okay. (3:41) What level two is leverage, which is 20% of your time and effort is producing 80% of the results.

Kevin Palmieri

(3:46) Okay. (3:48) You have something where you say Pareto-ing Pareto. (3:52) Explain that.(3:55) And, but real quick, as an exercise, whether you're watching or listening, let me know or let yourself know when you opt out of what is being said, because that's a really good test.

Alan Lazaros

(4:08) Good. (4:10) All right. (4:11) So if 20% of effort produces 80% of results, that is a one to four ratio.(4:19) Meaning if I put $1 in, I get $4 back. (4:24) Metaphorically, it's not. (4:27) Okay.(4:27) Fair. (4:28) Fair. (4:28) $1 in $4 back.(4:29) Good. (4:30) Leverage. (4:30) Awesome.(4:31) Okay. (4:32) If you take 20% of 20%, you get 4%. (4:37) Okay.(4:38) If you take 20% of 4%, you get 0.8%. Okay. (4:46) If you take 20% of 0.8%, you get 0.16%. And if you take 20% of 0.16%, you get 0.032%. I'm rounding. (5:00) Okay.(5:01) The idea there, if you crunch the numbers, is the one to four ratio becomes $1 in for $1,024 back. (5:12) Because it's 1 4th times 1 4th, which is 1 16th. (5:15) And then it's 1 16th times four, which is 1 64th.(5:19) And it keeps going. (5:21) Okay. (5:22) Now, the idea here, and people say this all the time in the personal development space, they say, if you could go to Vegas and put a dollar in a slot machine and make $1,024 back, how often would you play?(5:34) And the answer is I would play forever. (5:36) But what they don't tell you is you put a dollar in, get punched in the face for 10 years, and then you get your $1,024. (5:43) And you have to find the machine that actually gives that.(5:45) That's the thing too. (5:46) And you have to get really good at slots, which is a metaphor that's dumb because you can't get good at slots. (5:52) But how many people do you think need to know that?(5:58) Everyone. (6:02) Everyone. (6:04) All of it?(6:05) All of it. (6:06) Yeah. (6:06) You don't need to know anything, but you would benefit from it.(6:10) Okay. (6:10) So no one needs to know anything.

Kevin Palmieri

(6:12) Right.

Alan Lazaros

(6:12) But everyone would benefit from learning and understanding that principle and then putting it to work. (6:19) So you put that principle to work naturally. (6:21) You just don't say it.(6:22) Like you hate the quote of how you do one thing is how you do everything. (6:26) I hate it. (6:26) And the reason why is because you're good at Pareto.(6:29) You're really good at doing the really important shit and neglecting everything else. (6:33) And sometimes you neglect important shit too.

Kevin Palmieri

(6:36) Rarely, hopefully is the goal. (6:37) Less often and less often is always the goal. (6:40) But the reason I wanted to do the episode in the way that we're doing it, you can't skip levels is because you can't learn how to Pareto Pareto until you first understand to your point that there is a best use of time.(6:51) There is a way to create more leverage. (6:53) And then you have to understand what that is to start. (6:55) Well, this is the most important piece.

Alan Lazaros

(6:57) There is a best use of time if you have a goal. (7:01) Okay. (7:02) If my goal is to, this is the best metaphor, 10 pound in 10 week challenge, 25 days out, baby.(7:09) If your goal, so my client Cole, shout out to you, brother is trying to gain weight. (7:15) So eating 3000 calories a day is a leverage. (7:20) He parade that's Pareto.(7:22) But if my goal is to lose weight, which it is 3000 calories a day, is that is a negative habit for me. (7:28) Every habit, everything you do and don't do everything you say and don't say everything that you say, think, do feel and believe is either constructive towards your goal or destructive towards your goal. (7:38) If my goal is to be liked, a lot of what I say is very destructive.(7:43) If my goal is to be successful and actually help other people be successful and to be respected, then a lot of what I say is constructive. (7:51) And so it all depends on the goal. (7:53) That's why I had to get rid of the being liked thing because it was destroying my ability to achieve my goals.

Kevin Palmieri

(7:58) I think my goal is to be the every man's personal development guy. (8:02) It's great. (8:03) Every person, every man's whatever, you know what I mean?

Alan Lazaros

(8:05) Yeah.

Kevin Palmieri

(8:05) Just because I know, like if I heard Pareto, Pareto in Pareto, I would be like, yo, you need to fucking take it easy. (8:13) When? (8:15) Yesterday.(8:16) No, just kidding. (8:18) When you first, that's fair. (8:20) That's true.(8:20) No, no, no, it's not. (8:21) That was what I was hoping to get a little bit of a laugh. (8:23) Tough crowd tonight.(8:24) The crowd is stiff tonight. (8:27) My goodness.

Alan Lazaros

(8:29) I was just in deep flow for hours doing.

Kevin Palmieri

(8:31) I know.

Alan Lazaros

(8:31) I know.

Kevin Palmieri

(8:32) If you, if you started with that, when you first taught me Pareto principle, if you're like Kev, I know 20% gets you 80%, but here, listen, listen, listen, listen, divide this fucking move the integer over, move the decimal. (8:50) There you go. (8:51) 0.16. I would have been like, dude, I don't know what you're talking about because I don't know what my 20% is yet.

Alan Lazaros

(8:59) Yeah. (9:00) So you have to figure out what your goal is under each. (9:05) It is.(9:05) I do understand now. (9:07) It's fascinating. (9:07) You and I are crossing paths.(9:09) I get why success is so challenging.

Kevin Palmieri

(9:12) I think one of the reasons it's so challenging is because nobody teaches the fundamentals. (9:17) No, no, sorry. (9:17) That's wrong because Pareto principle is a fundamental.(9:21) Where did we teach that though?

Alan Lazaros

(9:23) I don't know if we ever really taught that. (9:24) I didn't learn that in school. (9:25) We didn't even take a productivity course in school.(9:27) It bothers me to my core. (9:28) I would say, where did you learn it? (9:30) Cause I, I learned it from you.(9:31) I learned it from, there's a book called 80, 20 personal development, personal development books, basically.

Kevin Palmieri

(9:39) Yeah. (9:39) Yeah. (9:40) Yeah.

Alan Lazaros

(9:40) Um, there is no time. (9:42) Oh, I don't want to say none, but time management courses, productivity courses, they tend to talk about Pareto. (9:48) Now they don't talk about Pareto in Pareto.(9:51) That is very rare. (9:53) Most people don't. (9:54) Steve Jobs was big on this.(9:56) Like him, love him, hate him. (9:57) That's not what I'm talking about. (9:58) He was like the best in the world at Pareto.(10:00) That's why Apple only sells certain shit.

Kevin Palmieri

(10:02) Yeah. (10:03) Yeah.

Alan Lazaros

(10:03) They like, they are very discerning with what they do. (10:07) Less so now, you know, Apple TV and all this shit. (10:09) But back in the day when Apple was about to go bankrupt, Steve was like, we're canning everything, all the SKUs gone.(10:17) We're just going to do these four things.

Kevin Palmieri

(10:19) What does SKU stand for?

Alan Lazaros

(10:21) Uh, dude, no. (10:23) Oh, serial. (10:24) It's, it's a product number for internal for a company.(10:28) It'd be like something unit. (10:29) I'm guessing. (10:29) Yeah.(10:30) Yeah. (10:30) Yeah. (10:30) Serial something unit.(10:32) I've always wondered serial Kevin unit.

Kevin Palmieri

(10:34) Nice. (10:36) I just think that most people start at a level like they think they start teaching stuff beyond certain levels. (10:46) Yeah.

Alan Lazaros

(10:46) Because, because I think this is what I think is happening. (10:51) And you did this to, uh, several of my clients that I've been coaching for many, many years. (10:56) It's, it's been very clear.(10:57) Now, the person who is the student is afraid to look dumb. (11:03) The person who's the teacher is probably bad at building a bridge. (11:11) Fair.(11:11) So if you will use you and I, cause the listeners know us nine years ago, you acted like you knew more than you did. (11:19) Definitely. (11:20) So how the fuck was I supposed to know that you didn't know Pareto?(11:23) I'm not, I think you did a great job.

Kevin Palmieri

(11:26) I don't know. (11:26) No, no. (11:27) Back then.(11:27) I think you did a great job. (11:28) I just think today, if I was learning it, you would overwhelm the shit out of me with Pareto and Pareto.

Alan Lazaros

(11:33) Maybe. (11:34) Well, there was many times where I feel like I talked way over your head because you acted smarter than you were for sure. (11:40) And I didn't understand how far behind you were in your knowledge.(11:44) And, and God, that sounds so mean. (11:47) At the end of the day, like I actually do this with my clients. (11:50) Now I say, stop me when you don't understand.(11:52) And I go through, cause I need to know where they're at with mathematics. (11:55) So I'll do, I'll say, okay, uh, pre-algebra, algebra one, algebra two, geometry, trigonometry, pre-calc, calc one, calc two, integral calculus, linear equations, differential equations, discrete mathematics. (12:13) And I'll just keep going and they'll be like, stop.(12:15) And it's like, okay, I need to know what of that you don't understand. (12:19) And here's the thing that people don't like about me and, and, or don't like in general. (12:23) Like if you don't know any of what I just said, you can't win at the level I can.(12:28) Yeah. (12:28) I remember people at these companies know this.

Kevin Palmieri

(12:31) I remember we were, I was in Vermont, uh, we, Taren's family has a cabin up there on, on the water. (12:37) It's beautiful. (12:38) And we had a team meeting and you sent over the map of mathematics and you're like, Hey, I just like, just let me know.(12:47) You said this to the team, like, let me know what you, uh, what, what, let me know what you, no, no. (12:54) You said, let me know what you do understand.

Alan Lazaros

(12:57) I think, no, I said what you don't understand on this map. (12:59) And then everyone else said, I said, I should point to what I said.

Kevin Palmieri

(13:03) I said, honestly, everybody just point to what you do understand because most of myself, especially not even included, especially, I know, like even when you were saying that, it's like, dude, how far did I get in high school? (13:15) I don't know, brother.

Alan Lazaros

(13:16) I genuinely don't know.

Kevin Palmieri

(13:17) How far does the average person go? (13:19) I don't know. (13:20) I don't know.(13:21) Maybe geometry, sad trig. (13:23) I don't know. (13:25) I was playing a Mario on my graphing calculator.(13:28) What was that? (13:29) Why did I, why did I, why did I need, I mean, I did too, right? (13:32) So it's like, I know, but you also pass the tests probably.(13:36) For sure.

Alan Lazaros

(13:36) I was doing that at the never got less than any math course in my entire life. (13:40) I don't think I ever got any signal analysis. (13:42) It's not a math test engineering, but I was a math of engineering too.(13:45) But the point that we should make here is, on one hand, I had no idea. (13:51) Like I didn't know that other people don't understand that stuff because I was, uh, ever since I was a kid, I've always saw and thought of and numbers and all that stuff. (14:01) And Emilia has really helped me understand, like she reads really fast, like super fast.(14:07) She listens to audio books on like four X and it's like, no, no, I'm trying to do dishes and listen. (14:14) No, it's like, uh, but I do that with math.

Kevin Palmieri

(14:19) You know, one of the most beneficial things ever is I was a personal trainer who taught people who had never squatted how to squat. (14:27) And it, I almost got fired because somebody came in brand new client. (14:32) And I love this person.(14:33) We got along really well. (14:35) And I put her through a, what I thought was extremely sustainable. (14:39) It was literally body weight.(14:41) It was pushups. (14:42) It was air squats. (14:43) It was, she called and had to miss her next session because she was so sore.(14:47) And I got my ass chewed out by the owners. (14:51) They're like, Kev, what the hell are you doing? (14:53) I was like, we just, it was just like body weight stuff.(14:55) They're like, yeah, I do better. (14:57) It's like, yeah, no, that's fair.

Alan Lazaros

(14:59) Okay. (14:59) So I know we got to go here. (15:02) There's levels to everything.(15:05) And you cannot be a good guide or teacher or student. (15:09) If you don't know what level you're at, but you don't, it's very hard to know what level you're at because people aren't honest about that. (15:15) And they don't really know is a good, if you're one of your good student level, you're at math.(15:19) You don't even remember. (15:20) I know it's not high. (15:23) Okay.(15:23) What does that even mean? (15:24) And I also, you're a 10. (15:27) If 10 is, you know, an MIT student, where are you?(15:31) What's five, the average person? (15:32) It's the thing you've never, you don't hang, you, I remember you said, I don't even know engineers. (15:36) So you've never even been around.

Kevin Palmieri

(15:38) Yeah. (15:38) But I know it's not that what's fine. (15:40) What's naturally I ask, what is average?

Alan Lazaros

(15:44) Cause I'm closer to average than I am to 10. (15:46) Probably. (15:46) I figure it depends where you live, right?(15:49) It depends where you live. (15:50) And this is something I learned in book club. (15:53) Steph, shout out to you.(15:54) She's from Connecticut and she grew up in Connecticut. (15:56) We grew up in Massachusetts. (15:58) Dude, class rank was a big deal for us in Canada with the people in book club are like, Oh, class rank.(16:03) We didn't even think about it. (16:04) It's like, yo, that was like, we were hunger games style. (16:08) Like to get to the top, me, Tara, like you remember all those people, we were like gonna kill each other to get to the top.(16:15) I mean, it was, I'm being playful obviously, but like, it was, it was a bloodbath for sure. (16:19) And that's a Massachusetts thing. (16:21) Nobody gives a shit about that in other places.(16:23) It depends where, right. (16:24) I'm not saying nowhere, like there's 195 countries. (16:26) Massachusetts is like education.(16:28) It matters like deeply. (16:30) So in MCAS and all that shit, like SATs, you know, ACTs. (16:35) I remember I did my GMATs for my business to apply to business school.(16:40) Like, I don't even know. (16:41) You don't really know. (16:42) Cause you're not, you're not, no one is honest or understands their own inadequacies and or their own strengths.(16:50) Like if you're great at running, you kind of don't know. (16:53) Cause you're comparing to Olympic athletes and if you're bad at running, you kind of don't know. (16:57) Cause you're hanging out with a bunch of people that suck at running.(16:58) And even if there, you have a friend who's really good at running, you're certainly not going to run with them. (17:02) Right. (17:02) So we're all in sort of a, you have to really take yourself out of an echo chamber and then try your best to contemplate where you fit on every bell curve.

Kevin Palmieri

(17:10) Well, I think if you want to be a good student, you have to admit when, when you lose the plot for lack of a better phrase, like, when do you, when does it go away?

Alan Lazaros

(17:18) So how do you do that? (17:19) I know we got to go, but, but like you, you have to have a ton of courage to do that, don't you? (17:23) Because you don't want people to think less of you.

Kevin Palmieri

(17:25) Yeah. (17:25) I mean, you have to have a ton of courage, but you also have to understand you're selling yourself short if you don't like, yeah, your coach or mentor might like you, but they're not, it's not going to matter. (17:35) You're not going to be successful.(17:36) They might like you, but you're not going to be successful because you're not going to be able to do what they say. (17:40) And I'm as guilty of this as anybody more than you want perception for sure. (17:43) In that instance.(17:44) Yeah. (17:45) Cool. (17:45) I'm glad we did this because I, I told Alan, I said, I'm excited to do this because anytime I have like an experience, I want to bring it to the podcast because I think those are the best episodes.(17:54) All right, cool. (17:54) If you're looking for somebody who can help you with this, Alan is the guy, right? (17:58) I know we talked about how he would overwhelm me, but he's gotten way, way, way, way, way, way infinitely better at building bridges.(18:04) So you're very welcome, brother. (18:06) He is your guy as always. (18:07) We love you.(18:07) We appreciate you. (18:08) Grateful for each and every one of you. (18:09) And if you are as committed as you say you are to getting to the next level, make sure you tune in tomorrow because we will be here every single day to help you get there.(18:14) Keep leveling up to reach your full potential.

Alan Lazaros

(18:16) Next Level Nation.

Kevin Palmieri

(18:18) Thanks for joining us for another episode of Next Level University. (18:23) We love connecting with the Next Level family.

Alan Lazaros

(18:25) We mean it when we say family. (18:27) If you ever need anything, please reach out to us directly. (18:31) Everything you need to get ahold of us is in the show notes.(18:34) Thank you again. (18:35) And we will talk to you tomorrow.