Most Of Us Need To Take It One Step At A Time (2453)

Are you stuck because you lack vision, or because you are not doing the work? In today’s episode, Kevin and Alan discuss why success requires both imagination and execution. Kevin reflects on how podcasting was built one step at a time, before the bigger picture was clear. Alan explains the “clouds and dirt” framework, showing why vision without action becomes fantasy, and action without direction becomes wasted effort.

They also explore self-awareness, discipline, natural wiring, and the client patterns they have seen after thousands of episodes and years of coaching. This episode will help you see which side you need to build next. Listen now, before your goals start charging rent for all the space they take up in your head.

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Book Alan’s Business Breakthrough Session. Your first 30-minute coaching call is FREE. Learn how to prioritize success and let your quality of life become the byproduct. - https://calendly.com/alanlazaros/30-minute-breakthrough-session

Join the "Next Level Fitness Accountability Group" – Reach out to Kevin or Alan on Instagram:
Kevin: https://www.instagram.com/neverquitkid/
Alan: https://www.instagram.com/alazaros88/

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NLU is not just a podcast; it’s a gateway to a wealth of resources designed to help you achieve your goals and dreams. From our Next Level Dreamliner to our Group Coaching, we offer a variety of tools and communities to support your personal development journey.

For more information, check out our website and socials using the links below. 👇

Website: http://www.nextleveluniverse.com

Instagram:
Kevin: https://www.instagram.com/neverquitkid/
Alan: https://www.instagram.com/alazaros88/

Facebook:
Alan: https://www.facebook.com/alan.lazaros
Kevin: https://www.facebook.com/kevin.palmieri.90/

Email:
Kevin@nextleveluniverse.com
Alan@nextleveluniverse.com

LinkedIn:
Kevin: https://www.linkedin.com/in/kevin-palmieri-5b7736160/
Alan: https://www.linkedin.com/in/alanlazarosllc/

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Show notes:
(2:19) Why growth starts one step at a time
(4:36) The clouds and dirt framework
(7:11) Understanding your natural wiring
(12:02) Balancing vision with execution
(14:58) When imagination or action goes too far
(16:41) Finding the side you need to build
(18:35) Researching the path before you walk it
(20:30) Outro

🎙️ Hosted by Kevin Palmieri and Alan Lazaros

Next Level University is a top-ranked daily podcast for dream chasers and self-improvement lovers. With over 2,100 episodes, we help you level up in life, love, health, and wealth one day at a time. Subscribe for real, honest, no-fluff growth every single day.

Transcript

Kevin Palmieri

(0:00) I have been having a lot of nostalgic reflections, and I was laying in bed last night, and I was (0:07) just reflecting on the episode we did yesterday where we were talking about the cause and effect, (0:13) and I was like, we have to talk more about that because I, yes, now I believe in myself, (0:19) and I believe in my ability to do things, but in the very beginning, it was literally (0:24) one step at a time, don't try to bite off more than you can chew, and I have no freaking clue (0:30) what the light at the end of the tunnel looks like, I just want to make it to the next part (0:34) of the tunnel.

Alan Lazaros

(0:36) You have to start out with some level of imagination and visualization before you get started. (0:45) Some people imagine too much and never start. (0:48) Some people start without imagining.(0:50) We're going to discuss the necessity of both. (0:53) Welcome to Next Level University.

Kevin Palmieri

(0:55) I'm your host, Kevin Palmieri, and I'm your co-host, Alan Lazaros. (1:00) At NLU, we believe in a heart-driven but no-BS approach to holistic self-improvement for dream chasers.

Alan Lazaros

(1:07) Our goal with every episode is to help you level up your life, love, health, and wealth.

Kevin Palmieri

(1:13) We bring you a new episode every single day on topics like confidence, self-belief, self-worth, self-awareness, relationships, boundaries, consistency, habits, and defining your own unique version of success.

Alan Lazaros

(1:29) Self-improvement, in your pocket, every day, from anywhere, completely free. (1:36) Welcome to Next Level University.

Kevin Palmieri

(1:41) Next Level Nation today for episode number 2,453. (1:45) Most of us need to take it one step at a time. (1:48) I love podcasting, I just do.(1:50) It's like my favorite thing in the world. (1:51) It genuinely is my favorite thing in the world. (1:53) And it always has been.(1:55) But at the very beginning, there is 0% chance that I thought this was going to happen. (2:01) I had no idea this was going to be the thing. (2:05) I messaged somebody yesterday.(2:07) You had a lot more courage than me then. (2:09) Probably. (2:10) Well, in certain things, maybe.(2:11) This is how I know. (2:13) This is the thing that brought me reflection and perspective yesterday. (2:19) We have a buddy.(2:22) He's a big name. (2:24) He's an international speaker. (2:25) He's very successful.(2:27) And he just has been wildly inconsistent on YouTube. (2:30) So I just DM'd him. (2:31) I was like, hey man, this is completely out of the blue.(2:34) Are you doing YouTube? (2:35) Is that part of your strategy? (2:36) Because I can help you.(2:38) Just let me help you do it. (2:40) And then after that, after I sent the message, I was like, I never would have done that five years ago. (2:46) I would have been like, oh, he's going to think I'm trying to sell him.(2:48) He's going to think I'm blah, blah, blah. (2:50) And it was just like, no, I feel like I can genuinely help this person. (2:53) And I feel like it's a better use of my time than it is his.(2:56) Like, why don't I, it could be a very, very valuable win-win for both of us. (3:00) Why not do this? (3:01) That was step one.(3:03) That was step one. (3:04) And then step two, I was reflecting on our, I guess, inflection point too. (3:08) I was reflecting on our episode and I don't, number one, I'm glad I didn't imagine all this, honestly, because it's always like better than I expect for the most part.(3:22) I mean, it was worse than I expected for a long period of time, for sure. (3:26) Like, don't, don't get things twisted. (3:29) That's, so that's a piece of it.

Alan Lazaros

(3:30) Well, it's one or the other. (3:31) Yeah, it is one or the other. (3:31) It's either going to be better than you think or worse than you think, always.

Kevin Palmieri

(3:34) I like better than I thought. (3:37) And I really think the point is I had to take it one step at a time. (3:42) I didn't know, like, you think of something, you go do it, that creates new awareness, new perspective, and you can see a little bit further.(3:54) It's the next rung of the ladder. (3:56) I didn't expect to climb to a very, very, very tall rung. (4:00) I didn't know, but I wanted to try to get to the next rung.(4:03) And I think while so many people are like, you got to know exactly where you want to go. (4:08) And you got to figure out where the dream land is and all that shit. (4:12) Sure.(4:12) Some people are really good at imagining what they want, but they're not good at doing the things long enough to actually get it. (4:18) Some people are not thinking about that at all, but they're really good at showing up every day. (4:23) And I just, I don't know, there's something in that for you out there, whether you're watching or listening, identifying what type of person you are.(4:30) If you're more like me, if you're more like Alan, I don't know. (4:32) That's, that's, it was on my heart to talk about this.

Alan Lazaros

(4:36) The four quadrants here are X and Y. (4:40) So if X is zero to 10.

Kevin Palmieri

(4:42) Here we fucking go.

Alan Lazaros

(4:43) You know, you know, zero to 10 on dirt and the Y is zero to 10 on clouds. (4:52) Clouds is theory. (4:53) Dirt is practice.(4:54) Clouds is imagination. (5:01) Clouds is imagination. (5:02) Dirt is physical action.(5:05) Okay. (5:06) The upper right quadrant, 10, 10 is where you need to be, baby.

Kevin Palmieri

(5:12) Yeah. (5:12) That's rare though. (5:13) Right?

Alan Lazaros

(5:14) Yeah. (5:15) Like how many, yeah. (5:15) And you don't start there.(5:16) Nobody is like a little baby, like imagining the future, you know?

Kevin Palmieri

(5:21) Um, I would love to do an episode on this too. (5:23) At some point you're, you're reading, what's it? (5:26) What is the, the new Jim Collins book?(5:27) You're the one who found it.

Alan Lazaros

(5:28) Something about cliffs.

Kevin Palmieri

(5:29) Just, no, it's what's to make of what to make of a life. (5:33) Yeah. (5:33) That nice.

Alan Lazaros

(5:34) It is about cliffs, by the way.

Kevin Palmieri

(5:35) How dare you? (5:36) No, no, I know, but that's not the name of the book. (5:37) No.(5:37) What to make of a life.

Alan Lazaros

(5:39) Yeah. (5:39) Cliffs, fog, fire, and the self-knowledge imperative. (5:43) You can tell Jim Collins is an erudite professor.(5:46) He doesn't know what people care about.

Kevin Palmieri

(5:47) Uh, he's terrible title. (5:49) It's a terrible title, but the book is fire so far.

Alan Lazaros

(5:51) Yeah.

Kevin Palmieri

(5:52) So far, so good talking about encoding. (5:53) You're encoded with something, which is like a, a natural inclination. (5:58) Essentially.(5:59) Yeah. (5:59) Nice genetics. (6:02) I was thinking of, dude, there are some things where like, when I do them, it's just like, this is so easy now, but there's also some things where I was like, I've been doing this for so long.(6:16) Why am I such shit at it? (6:18) My job where I was like in construction, I am terrible at it. (6:21) I'm not good at that.(6:23) Like using a tape measure, like I'm better than the average person, but I did that for five years and I didn't get really much better at it. (6:31) Honestly, honestly. (6:33) But I remember when we were, when I was young, my buddies and I, we used to ride our scooters down this big hill and we would slam into snow banks and do front flips.

Alan Lazaros

(6:41) Oh yeah.

Kevin Palmieri

(6:42) That was always so easy for me. (6:45) There's something about when my body is in the air and in motion, I can feel, I know everything.

Alan Lazaros

(6:50) Yeah.

Kevin Palmieri

(6:51) So one of the reasons I want to be a stunt man, bottle bodily slash kinesthetic intelligence. (6:57) That is a piece of it, except I can't swing a hammer or drill straight to save my fucking life. (7:01) So that, that didn't convert to that.(7:04) I know that's not connected to this, but I wanted to bring that up because I think we should do that in a future episode. (7:08) All right. (7:08) Uh, the four quadrants go.(7:10) Yeah. (7:11) Yep.

Alan Lazaros

(7:11) Well, no one starts at 10, 10, so no one is fully clouds or dirt and we all start at zero zero. (7:17) So all kids start out at zero zero. (7:19) And, uh, I do believe some of us have the encoding or the genetics or the epigenetics or the natural inclination to imagine more.(7:30) Uh, I do think some people are, there's this whole thing in the leadership literature of like, are you born a leader or leaders made? (7:37) It's obviously both. (7:38) It's obviously both.(7:40) Like I was on a walk with my mom once and I said, did you notice how different I was? (7:49) You know, we had this, there's so many things looking back that were so weird that are not like who builds their first computer at 12, pretty rare. (8:03) And, and, and so only looking back is, are things super clear, particularly when it comes to like how weird that stuff was.(8:11) Because for me, none of that is weird. (8:15) And I think that's why it's so cool that I get to coach people because I get to tell them things that they think are normal. (8:25) And sometimes it's not good.(8:26) Sometimes it is. (8:27) I was on with a client recently and I said, do you know how much you and your husband, like, where do you feel like you fall on spending money? (8:34) Right?(8:35) Yeah. (8:35) We spend a lot. (8:36) It's like you spend more than anyone I fucking know.(8:39) And you guys don't make as much as a lot of the coach. (8:42) Like you got, and I said this and I said, this can be a wake up call for you because you might think this is normal. (8:50) This is like way too much spending.(8:52) Like you guys have to button it the fuck up with love, but they don't, they might not know that because they just are living their life and being there. (9:00) Like, right. (9:00) So comparing and contrasting, people say comparison is the root of all evil.(9:05) It's, it's, it's the thief of all joy. (9:07) That's the dumbest shit ever. (9:08) Comparison is absolutely critical to understand anything about yourself.(9:12) Others in the world, like a shack is worth 500,000. (9:17) Well, you should probably look at them home. (9:19) That's worth more than that.(9:20) Like everything's based on comparison.

Kevin Palmieri

(9:23) Kevin is short compared to what the average male in the United States.

Alan Lazaros

(9:28) Exactly, exactly. (9:31) You take away all meaning when you don't compare anyways, different, different topic fired up back to the core of this is you kind of have to figure out where you fall on this. (9:44) Like if I, I didn't know that you didn't envision all this.(9:48) Oh, how could you? (9:50) When we first met, you had a $2 million net worth goal and I figured you planned all this out. (9:55) I didn't know that you had it as planned out as you did.(9:58) Yeah.

Kevin Palmieri

(9:58) I probably hid that. (10:00) Or maybe you weren't curious enough. (10:01) I don't know.(10:02) No, I, you said it was going to happen, but it was like, how could you possibly fucking know? (10:07) How could I be so like, how could I be so in the dark about what is possible? (10:13) You know?(10:15) Yeah. (10:15) Like how the fuck could I possibly, like so much of this has been a surprise, but I think that's the thing. (10:22) Like we were talking in the previous episode and you said, well, I think people need to use their imaginations more.(10:26) I don't think so. (10:27) I do for sure. (10:27) I think some people do, but you don't mean people I've met who have the grandiose ideas of what they're going to do.(10:33) It's like they don't, they have no issue. (10:35) They have no issue imagining it, but I think they do.

Alan Lazaros

(10:38) They, they have no issue imagining it like a child imagines, but they have an issue with imagining it in, in reality and actually manifesting it through physical action.

Kevin Palmieri

(10:50) But the imagination is not the problem. (10:52) But is it, what about, isn't there like a degree of, if you imagine the result, you must imagine you must, I'm not saying you must, you must also understand the process. (11:01) Like what if that's the piece that's missing is when you imagine a result, I'm still fucked.(11:08) I'm pissed off that you put the, you put, we're going to do a fat loss challenge in the next level fitness accountability group. (11:14) I don't want to do it. (11:15) I want to do weight loss because I don't know what else will be interested.

Alan Lazaros

(11:21) Fuck no. (11:22) Is it because they don't want to share their body fat percentage? (11:25) I think that is a, it's just a, um, remember when I wanted to do a bulk challenge?

Kevin Palmieri

(11:30) Like brother, everyone's trying to lose weight. (11:34) That's so interesting. (11:35) I thought one of the deepest fears of people is gaining weight.(11:39) So the last thing most people are going to want to do is gain weight on purpose. (11:43) Yeah. (11:43) But that's easier to unlock them from that fear because they feel in control unless it went wrong.

Alan Lazaros

(11:48) Yeah, exactly. (11:49) But if you have, yeah, well, yeah, yeah.

Kevin Palmieri

(11:53) Fair.

Alan Lazaros

(11:54) Back to the crux of this, the core of this, I always need to do that because I tend to be clouds. (11:59) Right. (11:59) And I don't want to do that anymore.(12:00) I want to be dirt. (12:02) What is the dirt of this? (12:04) You either imagine too much and don't take enough action or you take action that is like aimless and not reverse engineered.(12:12) You can't reverse engineer something you don't imagine.

Kevin Palmieri

(12:15) Which end would, which end would you rather, which end is more likely to succeed? (12:22) Which extreme?

Alan Lazaros

(12:23) Dirt.

Kevin Palmieri

(12:24) Right.

Alan Lazaros

(12:25) Yeah. (12:26) Yeah. (12:26) Dirt.(12:27) But there's a caveat to that. (12:34) Oh, of course. (12:35) Every company has a visionary.(12:41) It's so interesting in the, I'm studying a lot. (12:45) I'm reading a book by a Navy SEAL and the three feet in front of you, just, just worry about the three feet. (12:51) That's the dumbest shit ever.(12:52) Like you have to zoom out and look at where you're headed. (12:57) Imagine just chopping through the jungle, like aimlessly. (13:01) You have to like climb a tree and look, okay, so we're going in the wrong direction.(13:04) Right. (13:05) So you need both. (13:06) And that's always the answer.(13:08) You always need both. (13:10) Like, dude, uh, it's not that hard to like look into the world and see what exists and then look at what used to exist in history and then predict what's going to exist in the future.

Kevin Palmieri

(13:23) No, that's a blind spot for you. (13:26) It's practice it.

Alan Lazaros

(13:27) You have to practice it.

Kevin Palmieri

(13:28) It's not hard to look at a relationship and study them for five minutes and predict with very high accuracy, whether or not they're going to last. (13:36) Of course. (13:37) I agree with you now.(13:38) Yeah. (13:38) But, but in the beginning you didn't. (13:39) And I think that's also a skill.(13:41) Like, I don't know how to explain that. (13:42) Just, I don't know.

Alan Lazaros

(13:43) I'm usually unconscious competency, but I actually do think that's fairly easy now because you practiced it. (13:49) Yeah. (13:49) All you have to look for is disrespect.

Kevin Palmieri

(13:51) Yeah. (13:51) That's pretty much it.

Alan Lazaros

(13:52) And you know what else you look for? (13:55) If someone thinks they're better than they are, that relationship is fucked. (13:59) Fair.(14:00) Anyone who thinks they're better than they are is like doomed to failure long-term. (14:06) Remember when Kanye like started shoes or whatever? (14:09) It's like Kanye, you're just too, I get you're great, whatever.(14:16) I'm not a fan. (14:17) So like don't with this, but like, you're just, you've lost it.

Kevin Palmieri

(14:22) You've lost perspective on, well, you got very good at music and got very famous.

Alan Lazaros

(14:30) I'm a creative genius. (14:31) Yeah. (14:31) Great.(14:32) Awesome. (14:33) I'm a genius too. (14:33) Cool.(14:34) Like now what? (14:35) Like who cares? (14:36) There's a lot of people that are geniuses.(14:38) Like go do something of value in the world that people actually want and get out of your own bullshit. (14:43) Right. (14:44) And, and again, I don't like talking about things like that, but people know Kanye.(14:50) That's why I use it as an example. (14:51) I can't talk about John down the street. (14:53) No one knows John down the street.(14:54) So anyways, my point of this is like, you can overdo either one. (14:58) You can be just in the dirt and never really look up and then wake up 50 years from now with an existential crisis and need to buy a Ferrari to feel okay. (15:06) Or you can like constantly mentally masturbate on what you're going to do and never do it.(15:12) And neither one of those is, is useful for anything in the world. (15:16) And that's why I can't stand like the whole manifestation thing, because I have a manifestation equation that has 10 steps, but only one of those 10 steps is visualization, right? (15:29) The rest of them are like self-awareness and facing fears and courage and doing hard shit that you don't want to do.(15:38) And so, so everyone has manifestations and equation. (15:43) It's a, it's a formula. (15:44) Anyone can do it, but everyone has a giant kink in the hose.(15:49) That's at a different part of the equation. (15:51) I was on with an RTC client yesterday. (15:54) We did sort of a where I coached the female and Emilia is coaching the man.(15:58) And she just has low self-discipline, like 90% of her failure at achieving her goals is just, you really suck at doing hard things you don't want to do. (16:10) And you just can't be successful at anything of meaning and value without doing hard shit you don't want to do. (16:16) Like nobody wants to do their taxes.(16:19) Nobody wants to fucking work out. (16:21) I know they say they do, but they don't. (16:22) And if they do, it's because they've gotten to a point where they actually do that.(16:25) No one, no one wants to work out every day. (16:28) There's always like, if you can't do things you don't want to do and force yourself to do it, you can't be successful at pretty much anything. (16:33) So there's these fundamentals that apply to all of us, despite the goal, regardless of the circumstances, like all that kind of stuff.(16:39) And, and, and it's just different for all of us. (16:41) So which quadrant are you in? (16:44) Are you all imagination, no action, or are you all action, no imagination.(16:47) And then how do you work on the opposite one?

Kevin Palmieri

(16:50) I think the ultimate goal for most people, again, I don't know if you're anything like me, if you're not, don't listen to what I say, but if you're anything like me, you have to make it micro. (17:00) I don't, I don't the three feet ahead thing. (17:02) Like I understand, but you have to understand what direction you're going in.

Alan Lazaros

(17:07) Well, you had a leader, leader who did know where we were going for sure. (17:14) Yeah. (17:14) I was up in the tree house looking and you were chopping.

Kevin Palmieri

(17:17) Yeah.

Alan Lazaros

(17:17) I was like, no, no chop. (17:19) You're chopping the wrong way, man.

Kevin Palmieri

(17:20) But like, so you need both. (17:22) You can't go from, you can't go from zero to a hundred. (17:27) Like, I think that's the, that's the most common thing that people think they're going to do is like, you're going to go from having this goal and having this dream and having this vision and having this, this imaginative, imaginative thing that you've created in your head.(17:40) And then it's just going to happen. (17:41) It's like, well, no, that's not the way this works. (17:43) No one actually thinks do they?(17:45) I don't know. (17:46) That's what I'm saying is like the imagination part. (17:48) I don't think it's that hard because all you have to do is look at something that already exists.(17:53) Okay. (17:53) Uh, there's a podcast out there. (17:55) They, okay.(17:56) They're kind of, they seem successful. (17:57) I want that. (17:58) Awesome.(17:58) Great. (17:59) Imagination done, done. (18:02) Now get to work every day.(18:05) And if you don't know, people aren't simulating that they don't know. (18:09) No, they're not simulating. (18:12) They see the result.(18:14) Again, this is what I did. (18:16) I saw the results of a level of success and said, ah, that would be nice. (18:20) That's my goal.(18:21) $2 million net worth, baby. (18:23) I didn't know what that meant. (18:25) And I didn't know that like in the grand scheme of things, that's not, that's not much like, that's not what I thought.(18:31) I thought 2 million, like, fuck yeah. (18:33) Yachts and boats trips. (18:36) I had no idea.(18:37) The distinctions, it's the distinctions. (18:39) It's very hard. (18:40) I think it's very hard to have an imagine.(18:44) I don't want a childlike imagination. (18:48) I don't think that's healthy. (18:49) I think that's dangerous because when you're a child, there are no distinctions and you just think things happen.(18:53) They just fucking, they just happen. (18:55) Yeah.

Alan Lazaros

(18:55) But you're supposed to grow up and become less and less naive over time. (19:01) I, I, that's why it starts with imagination.

Kevin Palmieri

(19:03) Like, we have, we have one minute and you have to go shit.

Alan Lazaros

(19:06) Yeah. (19:07) When you imagine being an astronaut and you simulate that and you think, okay, that would be amazing. (19:14) Then you go gamify it.(19:16) You go and learn, okay, what, what do I need to do to get into NASA? (19:20) And then you, okay, what would that actually be like? (19:23) What is that process?(19:23) Okay. (19:24) Well, I have to get straight A's. (19:25) I need to keep my vision strong.(19:26) Like I'm not just making this up. (19:29) I thought about all this.

Kevin Palmieri

(19:30) Well, yeah, but that's, you need to help me figure out how to do it myself.

Alan Lazaros

(19:35) You, you, everyone who has a dream, you just write down the dream and then you go to work on researching the past, present, and future of that industry.

Kevin Palmieri

(19:46) How do you know, okay, we're going to do a part two. (19:49) I knew we're going to do, I already said that. (19:50) I already said we're going to do a part two because I knew we weren't going to have enough time to get into this.(19:54) That if we can land on that, because, okay, I'm learning about John Glenn and how John Glenn became an astronaut. (20:00) It's like, fuck, that's awesome. (20:01) I didn't realize you were a test pilot and blah, like all this stuff.(20:04) This is amazing. (20:05) Awesome. (20:06) That's vetted.(20:07) Cool. (20:08) How do I know if somebody like lied, cheated, stole? (20:11) Yeah.(20:12) That's the thing.

Alan Lazaros

(20:13) There's a lot of hidden distinctions that are hard to find. (20:14) So we're going to talk about hidden distinctions. (20:16) And then you have to read between the lines.

Kevin Palmieri

(20:17) Let's do that. (20:17) If you're looking to read between the lines of the book of your life and you need a coach to help you it, Alan's the guy, Next Level Fitness Accountability Group. (20:23) I guess we're doing a body fat percentage thing.(20:26) I hate it. (20:26) You don't have to love it either, but if you want results, come hang with us and we'll all get results together. (20:30) As always, we love you.(20:32) Appreciate you. (20:32) Grateful for each and every one of you. (20:33) If you are as committed as you say you are to getting to the next level, make sure to tune in tomorrow because we'll be here every single day to help you get there.(20:38) Keep leveling up to reach your full potential.

Alan Lazaros

(20:41) Next Level Nation.

Kevin Palmieri

(20:43) Thanks for joining us for another episode of Next Level University. (20:47) We love connecting with Next Level family.

Alan Lazaros

(20:49) We mean it when we say family. (20:51) If you ever need anything, please reach out to us directly. (20:55) Everything you need to get a hold of us is in the show notes.

Kevin Palmieri

(20:58) Thank you again and we will talk to you tomorrow.