Talk Less, Sell More: Introverted Entrepreneur's Guide to Sales W/ Matthew Pollard

Do you need to be loud and outgoing to succeed in sales? Think again! Join us as we chat with Matthew Pollard, author of the acclaimed book "The Edge," and unveil the surprising truth: introverts have a unique edge in sales that can be even more powerful than extroversion.

In this episode, you'll discover:

Why introverts are naturally skilled at building trust and lasting relationships – a key factor in closing sales.
How to tap into your introverted strengths for powerful and confident sales conversations.
Actionable preparation tips specifically designed for introverted entrepreneurs to dominate client meetings.
Strategies for building a brand without the constant social media pressure that often overwhelms introverts.

Whether you're a struggling introvert in sales or a curious entrepreneur, this episode is a game-changer! Tune in and unlock your hidden sales potential.

CONNECT WITH PETER BOOLKAH

Website: https://www.boolkah.com
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ABOUT PETER BOOLKAH

Peter Boolkah is a business coach, author and speaker who has spent more than 20 years helping business owners build stronger, more valuable businesses that do not depend on them for everything.

He is the creator of The Hamster Wheel Trap® and author of Your Business Sucks: Build a Business That Works Without Destroying Your Life.

Peter works with founders and leadership teams on the issues that ultimately determine whether a business creates freedom or becomes another job: leadership, founder dependency, people, profit, execution, scaling, exit readiness and enterprise value.

His approach is direct, practical and built around one simple question:

Do you own the business, or does the business own you?

Learn more at https://www.boolkah.com

Transcript

SPEAKER_01 0:11

So it's said that the majority of introverts cannot sell. Well, during this podcast, we are going to dispel that theory. I'm Peter Balker, and welcome to today's edition of the Transition Guide. Now, joining me today in the studio is Matthew Pollard, author of The Edge. Thank you for joining me today, Matthew.

SPEAKER_00 0:33

Mate, I am ecstatic to be here and uh I am ecstatic to find out you're an introvert, so it's great to speak to a kindred spirit.

SPEAKER_01 0:40

Yeah. And there's a huge stigma around introverts. In my sort of 20 years of business and working with business owners, I cannot begin to tell you how often I get told by sales team that especially like in technical sales where you've got engineers and everything, and they'll say, I cannot sell. Or I don't make a great salesperson. Yeah, from my experience, a lot of the technical salespeople that I know are probably the greatest salespeople out there.

SPEAKER_00 1:09

Yeah, absolutely. You know, it's it's really interesting, especially, you know, I've spoken at like events for Microsoft in Intel, and their whole issue is they've got this outwardly spoken extrovert that does no planning and preparation. And the solution specialist who's been thinking about this meeting for weeks, yet the extrovert feels like they need to command the room and they go and they keep winging things, and it creates it, it actually makes the sale worse sometimes because they're not actively listening to what's happening in the room and what the solution specialist is trying. Now, don't get me wrong, the solution specialist didn't come in with the right plan. They just came in with a plan, and we can talk about that. But it really does add to the fact that introverts often will see that they can't sell because they look at what an extrovert does and they say, I could never do that. And as a matter of fact, it doesn't even work that well. Even the best in the business that are extroverted follow planned presentations. But what always interests me, and you know, what is the fact that most people think that introversion is something they need to recover from, or they are going to succeed despite their crippling introversion. And that's why, I mean, that's why I wrote The Introvert's Edge, it's why I created the Introvert's Edge podcast. Because I was just tired of people thinking that introverts are second-class citizens. The fact is that we dominate in most of the so-called extroverted arenas. Like we say, oh, we can't small talk. Well, Oprah Winfrey is an introvert, David Letterman is an introvert. Oh, yeah, but we can't sell. Zig Ziggler was an introvert. Well, okay, we definitely can't network. Well, Ivan Meisner, the founder of the world's largest networking group in the world, is introverted. So what so-called extroverted arena is it that we don't dominate in? The truth is that there are two groups of people. The people that realize that introverts need system and process to dominate in these so-called arenas, and that that actually gives them an advantage even over the extroverts. And then the people that don't realize that, that have to suffer from low performance for the rest of their lives. And it really is. It's not about just finding out about the fact that they need a system. It's about taking responsibility, living in what if that it's possible, and then actively doing the work. Like I've had people that read my book and told me that my book has changed their life. And I'm like, oh, so how are you applying the system? Oh, I haven't, like you suggested yet. Okay, well, what stories are you telling, which is the heart of sales, the heart of networking. Oh, I haven't really got a story, like you said yet. Well, what exactly have you done that's changed your life? Well, just knowing I can has changed my life. No, it hasn't. It changed your perspective perspective, but it isn't changing your life yet. And I hope by the end of this episode, we can get people to not only believe in themselves, but really get some tangible things that they can apply tomorrow to really start to put the work in. And by the way, if you're a CEO and you're an extrovert or a senior leader that's an extrovert, not only you know do I believe that you're probably disenfranchising your introverted team members. You can't teach what you do if you just wing things. You have to have system and process. So, all in all, like process wins supreme.

SPEAKER_01 3:59

And I'd agree with that. And that's something that Jack Daly actually alludes to in his book, The Hyper Sales Playbook. He talks about the best salespeople being out there, are very often the introverts. And actually, anyone can sell all they need is that system and process to sell too. Once you've got that in place, selling becomes easy. I think it's that intimidation factor, though, that the extroverts are so gregarious, they come out there, they appear to be self-confident, and all of a sudden the person out there that's probably been introverted their entire life, and probably this guy sends back from the days at school. You know what it's like at school? The extroverts dominate in first watch, it probably goes as far back as that, and that's where the belief structure sort of forms at the very early stages.

SPEAKER_00 4:49

What really interests me though is that a lot of times, well, firstly, I think we project extroversion on anybody that's successful. So, I mean, hearing me speak right now, people are, oh well, you maybe you were introvert in the past, but you're definitely not now. That's not true. I mean, Peter, you and I brainstormed for what, 30 minutes about exactly what we were going to do before we got on and pressed record today. So both you, both you and I planned and prepared. That's something that introverts are great at. Secondly, we're talking about something that I am really passionate about and really knowledgeable. So I'm not looking like searching in my head for what to say. And also, this is probably my 180th interview. So I've had a little practice, right? The difference is strong system, planning and preparation and practice allows somebody to dominate, especially if they're not winging things. Now, extroverts, sure, they're better originally at winging things, but they never get to a level of professionalism that sometimes an extrovert will get. Like even Jeffrey Ginnamore, who's an amazing sales trainer, he's an extrovert. And he's like, until I gravitated to a system, I could, I couldn't teach it others. So, you know, we were, I was on his sell or die podcast and usually interviews people for like 20 minutes. We gasbagged for about an hour and a half. And it was just because there are there are so many similarities on what makes an extroverted salesperson successful and what makes an introvert successful, except extroverts run for it for dear life and because they they will like winging things, and introverts need to hold on to a system for dear life. And if they don't know that, they fail. But what gets me is that people don't lean into this because they they do. They look at that, the those people that dominate in school, and they're like, okay, well, I can't do that. And then anytime somebody's successful in the workplace, they're like, oh, that person's an extrovert. And what's even worse is we were talking about the survey uh that I did at the AAISP leadership summit. Uh, you know, you're talking the best in the business in the sales profession, every senior leader for every logo you would probably recognize. And I just thought I would do a survey just to see where they thought they were at. And I was blown away that like 15% of the population, like I didn't have it as an open field. Like, right, are you an introvert or are you an extrovert? And I left it as an open comment. And there was like 20% of people that didn't know. So, firstly, if you're trying to help your sales team and you don't know if they're introverted or extroverted, firstly, you need to create a place of emotional safety for them. Because if they know that if you see them as an introvert, you probably won't give them a career trajectory that's going to be great for them, or you'll see them as second-class citizens, why would they own up to that? But if you don't know, you don't know how to help both groups of people. But then secondly, there were people that responded. There was like 15% of the respondents that their answer horrified me, which was, you know, oh, I'm a recovering introvert, like they're recovering from a disease, or I was introverted, but don't worry, I'm not introverted anymore. Like you firstly, you can't change who you are. You know, firstly, introversion is just where you draw your energy from. But there's nothing wrong with being an introvert. As a matter of fact, as I said, I believe we dominate in all of these so-called extroverted arenas. So we've got to break the psychology, especially if you run your own business, because firstly, there's something heroic about a person that has enough talent, skill, and belief in themselves to start their own business, but it frustrates me no end where they feel like the cards are stacked against them because it's just not true.

SPEAKER_01 8:01

Yeah. And I think a lot of it stems from the beginning, like you said earlier, a lot of people don't know they're an introvert. And there are so many great profiling tools you can take. I mean, one of my go-to tools for people at the beginning is disk, a great tool for communication. And in fact, we've even gone that far that on our website you can go on there and get a free desk assessment so you can actually do it and start to understand. Because unless you understand yourself, you're never gonna understand anybody else. And it is about leaning into your strengths. There is nothing wrong with being an introvert, there is something wrong with being introverted, thinking that's not normal, looking at everybody else thinking that's normal, and then feeling really shitty about yourself. That's not great.

SPEAKER_00 8:46

No, and I have to admit, I like I'm gonna uh you know, fall on my own sword a little bit. I've done it myself. Like, I remember watching this speaker, the guy's name was Dan Walshmitt. I still remember I was speaking at the Selling Power 2.0 conference, and I remember seeing this guy. This was just when I was starting to speak. I mean, I'm honored to say I've won a whole bunch of speaking awards now, including sales kickoff speaker of the year. So by the way, if you think you can't speak and you think you can't sell, that hopefully that makes you see that that's just not true. But I remember seeing this guy and going, my gosh, this is the most dynamic speaker I have ever seen. And I remember going home and going, there's no way I'm ever going to be like this guy. And later on, I'm talking years later, I asked, I he asked me why I hadn't reached out to him to endorse my book, the first book that I wrote, The Introvert's Edge. And I said, Well, you know, I'm only getting introverted people to endorse. And he's like, mate, I'm an introvert. Like, why? Like, how do you think I'm an extrovert? And I'm like, Well, I saw you from stage. I had projected extroversion on him. And so I understand why people do it. We have this psychology that we just can't. He'd spent years perfecting that art, and I now have two. But the difference is that my energy levels are different now because of it. And and I think this is this is really key. Like a lot of people, when they do when they think about introversion, they say, well, I can't still be introverted because I enjoy networking now, or I enjoy sales, or I love public speaking. I love all those things too. Like when I public speak, I now, firstly, I have to get on stage and tell a story because I mean there's some science behind that. But when you tell a story, it activates the reticular activating system of your brain. And what that means is the storyteller and the story receiver, even in a virtual environment like this, actually our brains synchronize and it creates artificial rapport, which has been proven introverts are amazing at creating deep rapport. But when I go on stage, I say like the same sentence to lead in, and then I say, Let me tell you about Wendy or let me tell you about Alex. And I tell a story, and the moment I start telling a story, I notice that I feel at ease. And everybody else in the audience feels just a little bit less scary because I can see that they're at ease. When I go on podcasts, a lot of times I'll tell a story as well, just to again develop rapport so people feel like they have a relationship. But it's it's the heart of sales, it's the heart of networking. But I enjoy speaking from stage now. I even hang out and they answer questions, and I'm probably the last to leave. But when I get home, gosh, I feel like I've been skydiving. When I do sales calls, to this day, I still don't do Zoom calls because that takes a lot more energy from me. So I notice the difference, but I do phone calls, I follow my same system, my closure rate's phenomenal. So the difference there is that I love sales, but I've had to find and lean into what works for me. Now, there are other extroverts, sorry, other introverts that need to be on camera because they feel uncomfortable only listening to voice cues. So you've got to lean into what works for you, analyze, and everybody is different. But the one thing that I know to be the same is that when you follow system and process, it takes less energy, there's less anxiety leading into it, and there's less non-positive rumination because you can use rumination as an introvert for continuous improvement if you do it properly. But rumination in a negative way is terrible, which is why it drains you so much. And that's why people that discover a system report to enjoy these things, it takes a lot less energy. So they think they're moving closer to ambiversion. And in truth, they kind of are, but they are still very much an introvert because you put them in something they don't have a plan and strategy for, they're exhausted again.

SPEAKER_01 12:11

So, Matthew, question for you. Because very much I think that you've identified your unique strengths or the edges you call it in your book. How can somebody identify what their unique strengths are, what their edge is, so that they can build confidence in their sales approach?

SPEAKER_00 12:30

Yeah, so I think there are there are two answers to that question. So I understand that as an introvert, my edge is my ability to plan and prepare and be thoughtful and to empathize. Um and you might say that extroverts aren't the best listeners, they're not the most empathetic, right? So I know I've got, I can reign supreme there. Now, that's not to say, and I don't want this to be considered extrovert or bashing because extroverts can go and learn how to actively listen. They can go and learn how to empathize, just like an introvert can learn a sales system or a networking system. The difference is, especially if they work for a global organization, HR will send them for active listening classes where they say, oh, poor Sarah's an introvert, we can't promote her, or we can't put her in sales. So there's a big difference there. And if you're a corporation listening to this, you need to redefine the word introversion to make people be excited about saying they're introverted and then lean into the strategies that work. But especially, and this look, I've I've worked with corporations, people, you know, career professionals that are trying to get into senior management and predominantly, because my passion is helping introverted service providers more than anything in the world. And what I find is that most of them define themselves by their functional skills. So they they feel like they want to find their edge in sales. But the truth is planning and preparation means that you really want to remove a lot of the heavy lifting before you even start. And I mean, let me give you. No, no, go ahead, go on. Let me give you an example. So, you know, I worked with a language coach out of California and she taught kids and adults Mandarin. And I mean, we're talking $50 to $80 an hour for private consultation. But if you want to consider a more commoditized market, I don't think you'll find many, right? You've got people now, she had people moving into California, willing to do it for $30 to $40 an hour for private consultation. She had people in China, thanks to the global economy we live in today. And we were talking about geopolitics before, right? There were people willing to do it for $12 an hour on Craigslist. And then worse than that, there's now technology. I'll teach you manor and Peter, you teach me English, we just won't charge anyone anything. So she's competing against free. So she comes to me for sales advice and she's like, can you show me how to sell better as an introvert? And I'm like, yes, but do you see how much more inauthentic that's going to feel? Like I can show you some tactics and some strategies, but gosh, wouldn't it be better if the sale was easier? So what I said is, let's look at how we can avoid the battle altogether. And what we did is we looked at all the clients she'd worked with over the years. And what I discovered is there were two people specifically that she helped with far more than just language consulting. These were people that were being relocated to China. And I mean, if you think about the Chinese economy, like she helped them understand the difference between e-commerce in China and the Western world, the importance of respect, like learning the language isn't enough. You have to reduce your accent, how to handle a business card and why it matters so much in China. But more importantly, she helped them understand the difference in rapport. Like in China, like, well, let's talk about the Western world, Peter. If I was trying to sell you something and I was really bad at my job, at the end of 45 minutes, I might say something horrible, like, do you want to move forward? If you say, Let me think about it, and I reach out to you a week from now and you still say you want to think about it, what do you think my chances are getting that sale up?

SPEAKER_01 15:24

Very slim.

SPEAKER_00 15:25

Very slim. Well, in China, they're probably gonna want to meet with you five or six times before they even discuss business. They're probably gonna want to see you drunk over karaoke once or twice. It's just who they are, but they're talking about 10, 20 year deals, not transactional 12 or 24 month contracts. So they want to know the character of the person. And she helped them understand that. So I was like, Wendy, look, you blow me away with this. Like, you're doing so much more than your functional skill. What are you doing? They're like, they're just a few things. I'm just trying to help. She didn't even give value. This is what I find. Everyone listening, everyone here has something unique that they do. Otherwise, why would your customers recommend you, refer you, pay you a premium? And by the way, there's always someone cheaper. So they are paying you a premium, I promise. And I'm like, Wendy, look, you're stuck in your functional skill. Is it fair to assume as a result of the assistance you're giving these people, they're going to be more successful in China? And she's like, I mean, yeah, that's the point, right? I said, great, let's call you the China success coach then. Forget about Mandarin education for a second. Let's create what we ended up calling the China Success Intensive. Now she loved the idea of this, but she's like, well, who do I sell it to? What she's really asking is, what niche do I go and market to? So what I said is, well, who do you think? Now everyone goes to the easy target. She went, well, obviously it's the executive. That makes sense. I moved from Australia to the United States. I was terrified, and they speak the same language here. So I got it, but I was like, that's not your ideal client. She's like, obviously the companies would pay. And I'm like, that makes sense. Like a lot of them have millions of dollars riding on the executive being successful. I just don't think it's your ideal client. She's frustrated with me now. So she's like, well, who then? And I said, I think your ideal client is the immigration attorney. Now she looks at me like I'm speaking a foreign language. And I'm like, well, think about it for a second. These people make five to seven thousand dollars for dealing with all the bureaucracy and paperwork that comes with organizing a visa. That's not like that's that's their revenue. Like profit-wise, they'd be lucky to make $3,000. They've got to do the paperwork and the bureaucracy and deal with that, staff, rent. They've got, you know, cost of getting client, which often isn't cheap. I said, why not just offer them $3,000 for a simple introduction? So now she's networking with immigration attorneys. They love the idea. They're like, what do I have to say? And she's like, all you got to do is say, congratulations. Or you've you've now got your visa. I just want to double check though. Are you ready to go to China? They're like, well, yeah, I mean, we've got our place sort of, we're learning the language. Kids are getting pretty good at it too. I think we got our visa now. I think we're set. And they would just respond, or she'd have them respond with, there's a lot more to it than that. I think you need to speak to the China success coach. When he was charging $50 to $80 an hour before, she now charges $30,000 for this China Success Intensive. She pays a $3,000 commission when she closes the deal. She makes $27,000 for the easiest sale in the world. That's rapid growth, but it comes from understanding the unique things that you do outside the scope of your functional skill. That's what gets you the easy sale and the easy introductions. Then saying, what's the higher level benefit of that? For Wendy, it was rapport, respect, and e-commerce. The high-level benefit was China success. Look at me, I'm a sales trainer, I'm a networking coach, I'm a branding expert, I'm a master in NLP, I'm an introvert specialist. Who cares? Nobody does. They don't care how hard it was for me to learn these things or how long it took me to learn them. But when I say I'm the rapid growth guy and I specialize with helping introverted service providers obtain rapid growth in a business they love, the simplicity of that message is what gets me heard in the crowd and marketplace. Now think about how much easier selling is compared to saying, oh, I'm a sales and marketing expert. People look at me and go, sales? No, I'm an introvert. I don't want to sell. Now they look at me like I'm one step above a scam artist, as opposed to the person that can help them get to where they want to go. If I say I'm in marketing, they're like, oh, I need that. How much do you cost? Well, that's even more awkward. The rapid growth guy and the niche that I serve transitions everything. And the China success coach and the niche that she serves makes all the heavy lifting of sales dissipate.

SPEAKER_01 19:02

Yeah, I learned that less than a long time ago. When you're the rapid growth guy, I'm the transition guy, you serve a niche, it does make it so much easier.

SPEAKER_00 19:12

It does. And you know, for an introvert specifically, it's actually far more about passion. The problem with what introverts do is they go to what's logical or what's practical. And the problem is you, I mean, think about how much passion and energy I'm putting into this. The reason for that is I love what I do. If you don't have the same staying power, how could you possibly compete with someone like me? And a lot of introverts get into that practical mindset. Like I worked with a guy that was an insurance salesperson. I mean, you think about it, they look at a sales trainer as a scam artist. Wait until you try and sell insurance. Now, he read my networking book and he's like, Matt, I love the concept of unified message. Haven't got that yet. But every time I say I'm an insurance, people, it doesn't matter if I'm interested before interesting, like you suggest. You know, after 20 minutes, they ask me what I do. I then say I'm in insurance. I get this eye explosion and they're trying to run away, right? So selling's obviously not easy. He said, but I just don't know what to do about it. I'm like, well, let's lean into your passion. Well, I just want to help everyone. That is fear that's running that, or an inability to be real with yourself. I said, tell me who you're really passionate about. He said, everyone. I said, all right, someone earning 50 versus someone earning 250,000. He's like, well, the 250. Okay, why? Well, they can buy more insurance. Okay, we're not getting anywhere with this. Let's try somebody that studies in high school, grows up poor, gets top marks, goes to college at Harvard because they got a scholarship. Now there is a C level executive job earning 250 a year, has 10 staff, versus someone that dropped out of high school, started a business, now they got 10 staff, they're making 250. He said, Well, obviously the small business owner. I'm like, why? I mean, I could never study and get to Harvard like that guy. That's incredible. And he responded with, I just feel like they deserve it more. I'm like, tell me about that. And then he opened up about his grandfather that actually did start a business. He owned, opened up a farm and he hustled for the last, you know, for so many years, prioritize his stuff. And the last 10 years of his life, because he got sick, he had to sell the farm, move into this tiny little apartment. He said, I just watched my grandfather fade away in front of the TV and die. Like, I just felt like he deserved more than that. You know, and I said, okay, how would it be for you to get up every morning and help these hustlers of the world, the people that create something out of nothing, protect them from the second-class retirements? He said, That would be amazing. So we called him the Hustle Lifeguard. And we built, he had this amazing way of grabbing high cash flow businesses, putting cash flow into insurance products, leveraging the interest and then putting it into investment products. And I was mind-blown at how much he knew, but he knew that because he was passionate. He studied those products more. So we then talked about his passion and mission for helping these people. And that's what allowed his business to explode. And I mean, he would do it for free. He's honored to get paid. And I would do what I do for free. And by the way, no one would be doing that for very long unless they got paid. So truthfully, for those people, those introverts, they're like, oh, I just want to help people. Like, I'm not trying, it's not about the money. For me, well, you will not help the world for very long unless you can eat. So you have to make money to save the world. So for Nick, exactly, he would do it for free. He doesn't need to, though, and he shouldn't have to, and he can't or he won't be doing it for very long.

SPEAKER_01 22:14

Exactly. Most people only say they want to help people because they suck at sales, because they haven't learned how to sell. And that is true. We had a few followers or three of our network. Actually, I've got a couple of questions to ask. And considering that you're talking about heavily about branding, if you think about it, the last couple of examples, they've had quite strong branding. Building a brand often sort of involves a strong social media presence. Can introverted entrepreneurs succeed without constantly putting themselves out there online?

SPEAKER_00 22:46

Well, okay, so that's a really great question. And actually, that brings me back to networking because my secret mission, as a matter of fact, I don't tell you this until the last chapter of so if you're going to pick up my networking book, I apologize in advance. Actually, maybe stop listening because I'm about to give you what is it, you know, like when somebody tells you the ending of a movie, some people need to read the last chapter of a book to be happy with continuing. I'm on the other hand, I'm like, don't give away the the twist. The twist of my networking book is I want to show you how to master the networking room so you never have to go back to one. Because here's here's the thing. Firstly, I believe that sales and networking are systems like anything else. And for an introvert, they need a system that allows them to leverage into their strengths. Truthfully, you don't even need to follow my system. There are thousands of other introverts that are dominating sales. I'm on the global list of top 30 sales professionals, and so are so many other introverts that I know. Right? The problem is they don't write the word introvert on their book. So you project the extroversion upon them. But with networking, the whole goal of networking is to be able to articulate your value. I mean, most people can't even articulate their value when somebody's politely listening to them in a networking room. What chance do they have online? So they have to be the loudest because they're definitely not the clearest. Once you get your message right, which by the way isn't talking about your functional skill. Like what I find most people in networking, when I say, oh, you know, you're struggling to get people to buy, okay, let me just ask you for a second. If you were to meet someone in a networking room and they asked you what it is that you do, what would you say? And then all of a sudden, I either hear, well, that's where I get stuck, which is horrible. If they've had a business for five years, how is that possible? But then worse, you might hear this elevator pitch. I do this for this group of people, even if, which is all I, I, I. It's so transactional. And this, it's what actually I call transactional networking. Do you want to buy from? What about you? What about you? I hate that. But then it's a lot better than angularist networking, which is what the introverts and a lot of extroverts do, which is kind of what is it you do? Oh, well, my day job is because I don't want to be promotional, but who wants to talk to someone that says that? Right? They're not inspiring. So I focus on strategic networking. So when somebody asks me in a networking room, what do I do? I don't say I'm a sales trainer. I don't say I'm a marketing specialist. I say, oh, thanks for asking. I'm the rapid growth guy, just like I said, I'm an accountant. And when they ask me what that exactly is, I say, well, one of the things I love to see more than anything in the world is an amazing, introverted, service-based business owner with enough talent, skill, and belief in themselves to start a business of their own. But what I find, I just hate seeing this, they get usually stuck in this endless hamster wheel of struggling to find interested people, trying to make the sale, and feeling like people only care about price. Do you know anyone like that? When they say yes, I then respond with, well, I'm on a mission to help people like this realize they really can have a rapid growth business doing what they love, but not by focusing on their functional skill. It's usually three things outside the scope of that that really allow them to build a business that revolves around them and their family and their life, not the other way around. Now notice I didn't even tell you what I do. There was no mention of sales, there was no mention of marketing. It was all passion and mission-based, which means, especially if you're selling something complex like insurance that's highly regulated, where you're not allowed to get into the details, you can use this all day and talk about your passion for helping people exit their businesses and make sure that they retire without losing all the money to the tax man all the time. You're not giving financial advice. But what I find is when you can learn how to articulate your value clear in a networking room when somebody's politely listening, you can then leverage that online. And you don't have like when I looked at online, because I can tell you, when I when I moved to the United States, like I built, yes, I'd been responsible for five multi-million dollar success stories, but they're all bricks and mortar, telemarketing direct sales. I'm almost embarrassed to say I avoided online because I thought it was a bunch of scam artists. And truthfully, I thought it was a bunch of people taking photos of their dogs and donuts for something to say online. Often it is. Well, it mostly is because people are trying to stay, I'm still here, I'm still here. They're trying to be the loudest. When you're the clearest, you can use automation to break through the noise. Like we've used automation for the last decade. Like I spent three days setting up social media and let everything post after that for the next five years. And then after that, we did a refresh when I launched my first book, The Introvert's Edge, and we included some videos and some additional content. And then we didn't touch it for another three years. Then we launched the Introvert's Edge to networking and we did a refresh. People tell me I'm so active on social media. I'm never on social media. Right now, don't get me wrong, when somebody comments on something that we post, I will interact. But I don't think about what I'm going to post today because what I did is what all introverts are great at. Firstly, I planned and prepared in the networking room so I had something clear to say. I then validated in the networking room so I knew it breaks broke through the noise and I could be the clearest, not the loudest. But then I planned and prepared how to leverage that online with planned and prepared content that I now have automated and on autopilot. So people chase me. People come to me from all over the world from social media and from podcast interviews. Because think about it this way: when you have something profound to say and you can say it eloquently, when you go on a podcast, thousands of people hear about you from all over the world. And I can do this at home in my PJs if I want. And people will come and chase me. Digital is where it's at today. And as a person that learned how to sell watching YouTube videos after losing my job at a, you know, as a data entry person just before Christmas and having no option but falling into commission-only sales, I can tell you, I was I had a lot of pride associated with being in sales and being able to cold call. My identity was almost completely shaped by that. But now, gosh, I can get people to chase me from all over the world. And sure, to everyone here that's listening today, I hope this sounds completely dynamic. There is nothing that I've said today that isn't planned and prepared and practiced. Now, sure, there may be some slight differences because I'm synthesizing different elements of things that I've planned and prepared. But introverts can do that well. I'm not stuck in my head for working out what to say. I'm saying which one of my planned and prepared responses is more relevant. Or, like all introverts, when they're talking about something they're passionate about, they can't wait to open their mouth. It's only when they're talking about sports or the weather, the last thing they want to do is open their mouth. And it's the same on social media. Talk about, talk to your niche, make them feel like they're the most important person in the world. And I promise you, your current clients won't fire you. You're not going to lose referrals. Nishing is a new market acquisition strategy. But talk for your passion about serving them and speak about their core three problems and share content on that. And you will have people come from everywhere to chase you to work with you.

SPEAKER_01 29:06

No, that's a good answer. So one final question from our followers was how can an introverted entrepreneur build a team that complements their personality while ensuring a strong, like while ensuring strong team communication skills.

SPEAKER_00 29:24

Yeah, so there's there's two answers to that. So one is you shouldn't hire a team that complements your personality. Like a lot of introverts feel like they need to hire a bunch of introverts so they all don't feel like they have to have these collective meetings. That's not true. Like I have extroverts on my team. But one thing that's important is that I'm honest and humble enough to talk about my Achilles' heels. And everybody else on my team is confident to do the same because we all help and strengthen each other's Achilles' heels by educating them, by sharing trainings that might help them, and by allowing each other to leverage each other's strengths. Like most of my team, when I'm speaking in an event, they know they need to protect me for about an hour beforehand because I can't help myself. Like if they send me an issue, I feel like I need to solve it because I'm in a heightened state. And so I'll call them and I won't be my best self. I'm more like a five-year-old tantruming child trying to complain about this, the problem and trying to fix it, not in the right space. So because of that, they protect me for that period. Now, I also know that after a period of time when I do it, they plan rest time for me. And if I book something in, they call and make sure it's moved because they know that if I don't, then I won't emotionally regulate the way that I need to. Like I just got asked, I'm speaking in Hawaii, and they asked me if I would be willing to stay in a private house that, you know, I mean, the guy's a millionaire. He's got this big house in the back, and he's like, why would we pay for you to stay somewhere, like stay with us? And they said, you know, my team responded without even asking me. Look, Matt would love to do that because I mean the place is a mansion. Why wouldn't I want to stay there? But he said, as long as he's not hosted, because a lot of people feel like they need to invite him in for dinner and they need, you know, next thing you know, he's gonna be sitting there looking at family photos from their last trip to Australia. And the problem is that he needs time to recharge, otherwise, he won't be at his best self. And he also works hard because he's passionate about what he does. And the problem is that when we do that, we spring him out and he's just, you know, he's not as successful as he should be. So is that okay? And the person responded with, Oh my gosh, I'm exactly like that. When I go and visit doctors, they think it's they're doing me a favor by hosting me. And they're not because they're always bringing me in for dinners with their kids and they feel like it's because they're extroverted that they they should be doing that because they get lonely. But for me, it's not helpful. So it's actually created a kinship between us. But then on top of that, they've actually now highlighted where my strengths and weaknesses are. And if they want me to be my best, which I mean they've hired me to speak, right? They want to make sure that they're protecting me too. So if you're trying to hire a really good team, you need to understand what their strengths and weaknesses are. But you must, must make sure that you don't define them by them. Some of my best salespeople are introverted. I've got some great extroverted salespeople too. I've got some of my best team members are extroverted, some of my best team members are introverted. The truth is that if you want to create a great team dynamic, you need to create a culture of learning, a creator, a culture of honesty. And anybody should be allowed to talk about an Achilles heel, but they shouldn't be allowed to define themselves by that Achilles heel. And what I mean by that is so many times, you know, one of my best presentations that I deliver for corporations is uh story playbook. And I, one of the things, while I talk about the science of story and why it works so well and the fact that most people in a sales dynamic, they they believe they tell stories, they don't. They tell case case studies. Customer wanted this, so we gave it to them. And to me, a story is more like the story of how you met your husband or wife, right? In the beginning, it's a little bit bulky. You start to remove things. Some people love certain elements, so you embellish a little bit. Like the story of how I met my wife now is it's like a theatrical masterpiece. Like I say certain things, my wife says certain things, we say things together, uh, and then we say, that's how we met. In business, we don't tell stories like that because we're trying to be mindful of time. It doesn't stop us from spewing out a bunch of jargon at somebody, but we don't tell stories because we feel like it's not helpful. Even though the best way to get customers out of their own way, which is what sales is about, by the way, sales, the actual true definition came from the Scandinavian word to serve. Best way to serve your clients is to tell them a story rather than jargon to get them out of their own way and help them see a moral. The problem is that stories, well, the positive and the negative, when you tell a story, it short circuits the logical brain and you speak directly to the emotional brain. In sales, it's wonderful, right? Because the logical brain's thinking that'll work for me, my situation's different, that won't work for me. Send me a proposal, I don't have time for this, hang up. So when you tell a story, it short circuits that part of the brain and the emotional brain goes, story time, and it just listens and it assumes all the detail of the story is fact and it hears the moral. And if the moral resonates with them, like we work with someone just like you and we got them to an amazing outcome, they want what Wendy had or they want what Alex had. And it's transformational. The problem is if you're telling yourself negative stories, like I can't do this because, then all of a sudden it's the same power, but in a negative format, right? Your logical brain now knows as an introvert you can sell by just following a system. Your logical brain now knows that you should be focusing on marketing before sales and you can now be on social media. But if you keep telling yourself stories, that part of the brain's diffused, right? You just are thinking in your emotional space. So anytime a team member should be openly honest about, and this is the best culture, a culture of open and honest uh understanding of each other's pros and cons. But actually, I'm not gonna say pros and cons, strengths and weaknesses. But then if you start hearing stories or reasons for why they can't fix these situations, you need to then say, when did you decide that? And when they respond with their really well-structured story that you know is not in their best interest, you then need to help them with affirmations, help them believe they can. That's what a leader's job is to do. And that creates an incredible culture because now you're helping them become their best self, right? You don't say, try this sales strategy, which is built for extroverts, or try this leadership strategy, or speak like that guy who's an extrovert. But they say, oh, Johnny self-ef identified as an introvert and he's doing amazing. Why don't you learn from him? Oh, because he'll show you that you can. So by creating an open and honest culture and creating a culture of learning, but not defining yourself by your problems, that's the best job an introvert or an extrovert can do. But pigeonholing people and letting them live in their stories, that's the worst culture you can possibly have.

SPEAKER_01 35:20

No, thank you for that, Matthew. Now, if anybody wants to connect with you or they're interested more about what you do, what's the best way to connect?

SPEAKER_00 35:31

Yeah, absolutely. Well, for those uh introverted service-based business owners that are listening, I would suggest, I mean, you don't need to hire me for this. Go to the intro, sorry, go to MatthewPollard.com forward slash growth, and there you'll be able to download a template to create your version of the China Success Coach, your unified message, and discover your niche of willing to buy clients. And, you know, I did this at the National Freelance Conference about a year and a bit ago now. And like nearly at the end of the session, I said, put your hand up if you now believe you've got a unified message that will excite and inspire people to want to know more, and you've identified a niche of willing to buy clients. Like 97% of the room put their hands up, which sounds great. Till I tell you the whole session was 90 minutes long. And when I said, look, do me a favor, put keep your hands up if this is the most time you spent actively working on your marketing, not listening to marketing podcasts or reading marketing books, but actively working on your marketing, like 85% of the room kept their hands up. So this template absolutely works if you spend the time doing it. And I would suggest you do this go to matthewpollard.com forward slash growth, download the template, and then get somebody else to listen to this podcast and at least hear the Wendy story so they know what they're doing. And then now, if you're a business coach, don't work with another business coach. If you're a managed service provider, don't work with another managed service provider because you've got to get out of your functional skill. My bet is that if you spend about an hour, hour and a half on them and then they spend an hour, hour and a half on you, you will transform your business. Now, if you're somebody that believes that you can't sell or you can't network, go to the introvertsedge.com or the introvertsed to networking.com. And my publisher's gonna hate me when I say this. You do not need to download my book. So you don't need to buy my book. What I would recommend is you download the first chapter of either. And to use the sales book, for example, if you download that first chapter, the first thing is I'll give you overwhelming evidence that you can sell as an introvert. As a matter of fact, you have the edge, and then I will give you a seven-step strategy. And if you do nothing more than grab what you currently say and put it into that, you'll quickly realize there's some things that don't fit. Throw that out. You shouldn't be saying that to customers. That's a lot of your jargon that's causing people to ask for a proposal or say it won't work for them because they're overwhelmed. You'll then realize there's some gaping holes, usually around asking not questions, but the right questions and telling great stories. And I don't just mean case studies or testimonials, I mean eloquent stories. If you fill those gaps and throw out the things you don't say and then put the other things in order, because usually people say things way out of order, you'll double your sales in the next 60 days. If you just do those things, you've got a small business, you will transform your business. If you're a career professional listening to this, download the introvert's edge to networking and you'll realize that you're either engaging in transactional networking or aimless networking. Neither will help you. And I'll help you understand the importance of planning and preparation for strategic networking. So you don't go into any room with not knowing who you already want to speak to and what you want to say.

SPEAKER_01 38:08

And then once you've done that, buy the book.

SPEAKER_00 38:12

Well, I will say the book actually has a video implementation training in the back of each. And I was actually honored by this. So the sales book specifically, it just got the free program that got the in the back, in the back bonus section, just got listed by Global Gurus as one of the top five sales development programs in the world. Funnily enough, it's the only one that's under about three or four thousand dollars. And it's just free with the Kindle, the audiobook, or the print book. So if you can buy the book, it's very simple.

SPEAKER_01 38:40

That's why you buy the book. Now, if you want to know whether you're an introvert or extrovert, why don't you head over to check the comments below? On booker.com, you can take the free disk personality assessment, and that will give you a starting point, what profile you are. Matthew, thank you for being such an awesome guest. There's been so much cover today. Many of our audience are gonna have to re-go over the episode a couple of times just to pick out all the golden nuggets.

SPEAKER_00 39:07

Mate, it's been my absolute pleasure. You know, as as you know, my passion is helping introverts, and I I really appreciate you giving me the opportunity to help more introverts realize that they're not second-class citizens. They just they need to find a different path to success.

SPEAKER_01 39:19

No, thank you so much. And remember, failing to learn is learning to fail. Stay safe and find out whether you're an introvert or extrovert.