The Secret to Healthier Relationships: Demystifying Boundaries with Diane Sorensen EP#115

Hey, happy people! In today's episode, I’m thrilled to welcome back Diane Sorensen. You might remember Diane from her previous appearance on the podcast, where we dived into the Rescue and Empowerment Triangles. This time, Diane and I explore the powerful and sometimes misunderstood topic of boundaries.

Have you ever found yourself saying yes when you really wanted to say no? I know I have! It’s something I’m working on myself, and in this episode, Diane helps us demystify boundaries so we can better understand their importance in maintaining healthier, more authentic relationships.

Diane shares her personal journey of going from having no boundaries to discovering how they have the power to set us free and strengthen our connections with others. Whether it’s a relationship with a child, a partner, or a parent, we all play a role in how those relationships develop. And, as Diane so beautifully puts it, it all begins with setting boundaries that respect both ourselves and others.

Here’s what you’ll hear in this episode:

• What boundaries truly are and why they matter for personal happiness
• Why setting boundaries is an essential step in any personal growth journey
• Practical tips on how to start saying no in a healthy, guilt-free way
• How boundaries create more honest and genuine relationships
• Why most of us have been conditioned not to set boundaries and how we can unlearn those habits

Diane also shares how boundaries are not just about saying no to others, but about saying yes to ourselves and our happiness. It’s a powerful conversation that I’m so excited to share with you. I hope it helps you, as it’s helped me, on this journey to living a more authentic and happy life.

Check out this free resource Diane has generously provided to help you take the first step toward setting healthy boundaries. Click here to access Diane’s Boundary Resource and start transforming your relationships today! 

If you loved this episode, please share it with someone who could benefit from learning more about boundaries. Let’s spread the happiness and help each other live our best lives!

Transcript

Bona Normandeau: [00:00:00] Welcome to the Happier You podcast. I'm your host, Bonna Normandeau. The Happier You is about encouraging each of us to connect with our unique self and figure out what our personal happiness looks like. Not what anyone else thinks our happy should be, but what really fills up our cup and brings us joy.

Each episode is about exposing you to new ideas, perspectives, and tools to help you build more happy moments into your day to day life. Your happiness is your responsibility. So let's get this figured out so you can start living your best life today.

Hey, happy people. Welcome back. I am excited about today's episode because I have Diane Sorensen back and this time we're going to talk about boundaries. Now you might recognize Diane's name because she's been on the podcast before talking about the rescue and empowerment triangles. So welcome back, Diane.

I'm so excited to have you back here with me to help us demystify [00:01:00] boundaries. 

Diane Sorensen: Thank you, Bona. I am so happy to be here and I am more than happy to demystify boundaries. 

Bona Normandeau: Perfect. I think you started out with parent child relationships, Diane, right? But really relationships all have the same fundamental foundations.

Wouldn't you say? 

Diane Sorensen: Yeah, I did start out with parenting and it's blossomed into other areas. I think the parent child relationship is a unique one. It's very personal. But what I found was even though I have mostly women, I have worked with some dads as well, but mostly women come, for their relationship with their child.

However, I started to attract a lot of women who were coming about the relationship with their partner or their mother as well. So it seems those three personal relationships are the ones that are attracted to me, which is no coincidence because they are the three [00:02:00] relationships I struggled with at one time in my life as well.

Bona Normandeau: That's right. And that's I remember from last time you were on the podcast, you talked about that, how you weren't at the best spot in your life and you looked around and realized the center of all these relationships is me. And the person that I can work on is me, right?

Diane Sorensen: Right. Yeah. I was the common denominator in all of my relationships.

Bona Normandeau: Which we all are and we're all imperfect beings and I'm with you. I mean, I believe very strongly in that as well, is the person that I can work on is me. And the more I work on myself, then the stronger relationships I have. And that's such a great segue into boundaries. So this summer I was reading the book Atlas of the Heart by Brené Brown, and I came across this quote that says, it's by Prentice Hemphill, and she says, Boundaries are the distance at which I can love you and me simultaneously.

And that really struck me, because having boundaries means you [00:03:00] love yourself. And that is so important to happiness. But then also, That you love and respect this other person enough to be honest with them as to your needs and wants as well, right? And then in our pre interview, you said something so beautiful.

You said that without boundaries, we are in the rescue triangle. So it's a very interesting progression to me, Diane, because I started out asking you about the Rescue Triangle, you introduced me to the Empowerment Triangle, and now here I am, back again, asking you about boundaries. So can you please demystify for all of us, what are boundaries?

Diane Sorensen: Yeah. So the definition I like to use with boundaries are that boundaries are what is and what is okay with me and what is not okay with me and what I am willing to do or not do to honor that. [00:04:00] So it's not about telling anybody else what they can or cannot do. It's what am I willing to do or not do to be okay?

Bona Normandeau: What am I willing to do or not do to be okay? And so does that mean then Am I willing to have this difficult conversation because I'm not willing to do X, Y, or Z? Is that?

Diane Sorensen: It could be a conversation it could just be saying, this is how it is. And we, it doesn't always have to be, okay, let's sit down because I have a boundary to tell you, sometimes our boundaries are verbalized and sometimes they're not.

Bona Normandeau: Find this fascinating because I think. boundaries have come up for me personally, as I get to know myself better. And in doing that, I start to realize, what do I need to do for myself to show up as the best version of myself I can? So when I say yes to something that I don't really want to do, or when I think sit back and think [00:05:00] about it.

It's like, no, that's not the best thing. But now I've said, yes. So I have to go begrudgingly. And then I don't show up as my best self because if I would have paused to think about it, that was not the best use of my time or my energy or whatever. 

Diane Sorensen: I always say that boundaries is really is a personal growth journey.

It is. It's a process. And I think a lot of times people get triggered around boundaries because I think there's a sense that, our conditioned mind is all about, there's a right way. I should have them. And then in the back of our mind, we know that I don't really even know what they are or maybe I don't have any.

And there's, I think a lot of shame around that. But this is what I really want your listeners to hear, is that if you are confused about boundaries or even confused of what they are, you are in the [00:06:00] majority because traditionally we weren't trained this way. We weren't trained for healthy boundaries and to take care of ourselves, especially as women, and have a voice to that.

Our traditional training really was, where our worth is attached to how much we achieve and how much we can do for other people. And, that's really a cultural standard that we are it's time to, we know so much more now, we have so much more information now that If you, if we want to have healthier relationships, we must have healthy boundaries.

Bona Normandeau: And I think we get so busy in life, and like you said, our culture is about showing up for other people and just achievement, being the, [00:07:00] being the best mom, being the best everything, that we don't take the time to spend time with ourselves to say what are my boundaries. Again, I think like you said, because we're confused about them.

But we're also, we've just never taken time to think about this, what's good for me. Or is this just me following along with what I think I'm supposed to do because that's how we've been culturally raised. 

Diane Sorensen: Right. We get so far away from what's even true for us because we've learned the, this is who I am, who I need to be in order to fit in, get along, be accepted.

And we get lost in that. We get lost in that. And so when it's like, I, you ask. do you really want? And that is a huge question. It's like, I don't know, we know more about what we don't want. But yeah, so, so [00:08:00] learning what is important for you, learning even what your values are. I remember back, way at the beginning of my journey, When we asked, what are your values?

And I'm like am I supposed to know this? And then I think it would just, just spread out, honesty and kindness because I thought that's what we're supposed to say, right? That's what we're supposed to value rather than really knowing what I do value. And when you learn to connect with yourself and really what you do value and.

What you do want and what your desires and dreams are, not somebody else's. That is so empowering and beautiful because then you are living life from a place of genuineness and truth. I think it's funny because I have a lot of people come to me about my child lied or my partner lied and they just shouldn't lie.

And, but really [00:09:00] we are Often live out dishonesty when we don't even know we're doing it because we're trying to, be who we think we're supposed to be or do what we think we're supposed to do as a child that started because we didn't want to get in trouble. And then we keep up these habits into adulthood.

We're not really bringing our genuine self to the table. And then we end up in these drama roles as a victim as a persecutor, as a rescuer. And so healthy boundaries, the process. Of healthy boundaries helps us to move over to the empowerment dynamic and it truly is freedom. And I tell you that from a place of when there was a time and it wasn't even that long ago that I didn't know what boundaries were.

I didn't have many boundaries. We do have some boundaries that we might not even call boundaries. But they are boundaries. So, I have traveled the road from no boundaries, not [00:10:00] having any idea what they were, all my relationships are falling apart, they weren't working very well, to integrating healthy boundaries into my life, and feeling truly liberated and free to show up as myself, and having genuine, honest, relationships that are blooming in my life.

Now, is it perfect? No, thank goodness, because that was the problem before I was trying. It was perfection, doing everything right, doing every, keeping everybody happy. Don't upset anybody. And now, I truly take ownership of me, my own stories in my head, what am I feeling, and my own behavior.

And then, knowing that other people are capable of handling their own feelings, and they're capable of knowing what they want and don't want, and yeah it's really [00:11:00] liberating. And it will work in progress all the time.

Bona Normandeau: Absolutely. Yeah. Okay. So speaking of work in progress how do you guide people to start setting boundaries?

Diane Sorensen: Like you said, it is a whole progress. It's a personal growth journey. But where our logical reasoning mind likes to see them, where we kind of start is noticing where in your life are you saying yes, when you really want to say no. So we have this habit of just saying yes, before we even think about it, and then we're like, oh crap, how am I ever going to get all of this done?

And a lot of times we're angry because somebody asked us something, right? They've made a request, they've asked, hey, can you do, ABC? And we're just like, okay. And then we're like, why did I say that? So what I. The practice that we start with [00:12:00] is creating a pause when somebody asks you something to practice saying, let me get back to you on that.

And you can be specific. You can say, let me get back to you on that. I'll get back to you by two o'clock this afternoon, or I'll get back to you in the morning on that or whatever. And then make sure you do, but use that time to really check in with yourself. What do I think? What do I want? And do I want to say yes to this, or do I really want to say no and I'm afraid?

Bona Normandeau: And why do I want to say yes to this? I like that because for me, I know sometimes it's like, I want to say yes, because I want to please the person, not because it's something that I really want to do. 

Diane Sorensen: Right. Yeah, absolutely. And, I know for myself too, if we really think about this, if I ask somebody to do something for me, or, I make a [00:13:00] request, I really want them to say yes.

If they are saying yes, a genuine, honest, yes. I don't want them to do it if they're just like, why is she asking? She's always asking me stuff. I guess I have to say yes. That would feel icky to me, but yet we're doing it all the time.

Bona Normandeau: It's so true. I don't ever want someone to say yes to me and feel icky about it.

And I think for me, because I'm so sensitive to other people's emotions, I can feel when they're not honestly. 

So when it's a fake, yes, it doesn't feel good. I think to either person. 

Diane Sorensen: Yeah. And agreements really come in the empowerment triangle where we are consciously entering into an agreement saying, yes, I'm entering into this agreement and to uphold your agreements once you've said yes, but when we're doing it out of a knee jerk reaction we're not [00:14:00] necessarily we're really not entering into an agreement.

We're really appeasing somebody. And really We're just reacting ourselves. We're rescuing ourselves from the discomfort of having to say no and being truthful, 

Bona Normandeau: right, right. And I think what really strikes me and what you just said to is the conscious decision. And that's where I think your pause makes a lot of sense.

So it's not a reaction to just. like rescue ourselves, like you say and get away from the difficult conversation, potentially. It's about pausing and saying, it's a conscious decision. Am I in or am I out? Instead of just the, like you said, noticing our natural reaction to say yes, when we don't really want to.

Okay. So that's how we start is we start by noticing and then we add in the pause. So where do we practice this? Because I know we'd all love to fix our most intimate relationships with people who we live with every day, but those are some of the hardest [00:15:00] ones I think to start with, right? 

Diane Sorensen: They are. Yeah, so you can start with somebody at work makes a request, somebody I don't know, the church ladies make a request to bring something to a potluck and then just practice saying, Let me get back to you about that.

And then thinking about it, is this something I want to agree to? Am I going to be stretching myself too thin because I don't want the discomfort of saying no and then there's a possibility that they will be upset? So this is one of the biggest reasons we don't set a boundary is because We don't want the discomfort of other people's upset.

We fear upsetting other people, and we don't want the discomfort of that. So, I'll get back to you on that. And then, this isn't about getting my needs met at the cost of you, or you getting your needs met at the cost of me. That's a zero sum game, and that is not how the world [00:16:00] really works. This is about expressing my truth, in a way that does not diminish anybody.

And that's why, sometimes we get mad just for people asking, Oh, why are they always asking? They probably do because you've taught them unconsciously. You've taught them that you say yes. So why would they not ask you? So it's really taking ownership of that and coming back with that thing you asked me earlier today about bringing the cookies to the potluck or whatever.

That's not going to work for me. Period. That's all you need to say. And sometimes people ask why not? And it, when people ask, it doesn't, just because they're asking for a reason doesn't mean you have to give one. Right? You can just it just, It's not gonna work this time. 

Bona Normandeau: Yeah. Okay, but now, so we do that, and [00:17:00] then what happens when people keep coming back and they're te like, so I did my, I hit my boundary, I'm all proud of myself, and then two days later, the volunteer group calls me and says, we really need cookies.

Oh, yeah. So they're testing my boundaries. 

Diane Sorensen: I hear you. Yeah, that's not gonna work for me. 

Bona Normandeau: Wow, you're really good at that. Really good at that. 

Diane Sorensen: It takes practice. It does. It does take practice. And then, here's the thing, the guilt will come in. And here's what I want you to hear about guilt. It doesn't mean, oh, that was the wrong thing to do.

Let me go back. In this context, when guilt shows up, it is showing up for you. You can use it as sign a signage that you are moving in the right direction. You are moving in the direction of you. Guilt's going to come up [00:18:00] because you're not used to doing that. It's disrupting a familiar pattern. So let the guilt come in, feel the guilt, be with the guilt.

This is another thing we do with boundaries with my clients is we become friends with our clients. Feelings. Because here's the other thing, when you're talking about intimate relationships, one of the biggest boundaries that we work on is owning my own upset. So we often think about boundaries as something we put on someone else.

Boundaries are very personal to us. They're our boundaries. And one of the biggest boundaries I think we can benefit from in our culture is owning our own upset, owning our own triggers, our own feelings. Because they, they are inside of us. They're not [00:19:00] out there. There's this unspoken rule, a cultural standard that we have that it's like, you don't upset me.

I won't upset you. And then nobody has to deal with feelings, any emotions. Yes. Healings. We don't have to be vulnerable to that. And this is so essential in healthy relationships. Because you're no longer blaming other people for how you feel. And this, I call it a big barrier, a big, like, it feels like a boulder.

Because it can feel so true that all these stories in our head that, But that's so disrespectful! It feels so true. But just coming back to, whose anger is this? This is my anger. Owning our own thoughts, feelings, and behavior. Because they're ours. 

Bona Normandeau: That makes a lot of sense to me because I know for me, I shy away from discomfort or uncomfortable feelings.

[00:20:00] And as I am going through this personal growth journey, I am realizing that there's worth in going through those and feeling them. And then what are they telling me? And what am I going to take away from this? 

Diane Sorensen: Boundaries is an emotional development skill. And It is where the seeds of respect and responsibility begin.

It's really coming into this. Boundaries helps us become emotionally mature. And I will tell you, I was not an adult with emotional maturity. Many adults are not. And again, that's not your fault. We, in earlier generations, we didn't have the the information about how to be emotionally mature.

We didn't have the information on emotional intelligence and emotional development skills. But now we do. And so when we have the willingness to [00:21:00] learn some new skills, these emotional skills, we liberate ourselves and our relationships and they bloom and they grow. 

Bona Normandeau: Yeah. And because I think healthy relationships are The key to a happy life, right?

Diane Sorensen: And the foundation of our life. 

Bona Normandeau: Right. Yeah.

And I think boundaries too, are a healthy relationship with ourself, because like you said, it's that emotional intelligence, the ability to realize what I'm feeling. But then pausing and saying what do I need right now? 

Diane Sorensen: That's exactly what boundaries are.

They are how to have a healthy relationship with yourself so that you can have healthy relationships. with others. It's all starts with their self. And so I say that boundaries is a personal growth journey and parenting also is a personal growth journey. And we don't, see things like that, right? We don't [00:22:00] usually see it that way.

We see parenting as two roles. I'm the parent, you're the child. I set the rules, you follow them. I tell you what to do, you listen. And that doesn't set us up for healthy relationships. So, when we're willing to open up our minds and our hearts to, to some new information. Yeah, we can begin to move in another direction.

Bona Normandeau: Thank you for all of this, Diane. I have really loved this conversation. I know for me, I'm a work in progress. And and it's always fascinating to just talk it out and validate some of the stuff I've been feeling, but also be reminded that I need to You know, feel the feelings that, that it's not always easy, but it's important and getting to know ourselves and being able to set boundaries creates, and I think you said it so [00:23:00] beautifully, I think you said genuine, honest relationships, which is such a beautiful gift to ourselves, but also the people around us.

Diane Sorensen: Yeah. And future generations, we're breaking patterns here. 

Bona Normandeau: Yeah. So, okay. So you've been on the podcast before, I always ask my guests for one of their favorite quotes. Do you have a quote ready for us today?

Diane Sorensen: I do. I do. So this is my quote for today. Everything we are seeking externally needs to be resolved internally.

Bona Normandeau: And who is that by? 

Diane Sorensen: That is by Nancy Levin.

Bona Normandeau: I like that one. 

Diane Sorensen: And yeah. And Nancy is a, she wrote the book on setting boundaries will set me free. Yeah. And I really, everything I talk about, I practice in my own daily life. So I'm not just here preaching this stuff. I [00:24:00] am also living it. every day.

Bona Normandeau: Thank you again, Diane. I appreciate you coming on and sharing your wisdom and your heart and just your time with us. That's so awesome. Thank you. 

Diane Sorensen: You're welcome. Thank you. 

Bona Normandeau: All right, happy people. Remember, when you have a choice, choose happy, have a good one, and go get your happy on.