Improving your Retirement with a Dynamic Financial Plan (#232)

In this week’s episode of "Maximize Business Value," Dave Casey introduces Jeff Sandene, President of Sandene Strategies LLC. Tune in weekly to hear more from Mastery Partners and to receive relevant key content on your journey to maximizing your business value! 

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Learn More about Dave Casey
Dave Casey is a seasoned business owner with deep expertise in all aspects of organizational behavior and a passion for helping entrepreneurs reap the full rewards of building their companies. He understands that a truly valuable business isn’t just profitable—it’s secure, scalable, and transferable. In addition to his work with Mastery Partners, Dave actively gives back to the entrepreneurial community through leadership roles with organizations like Business Navigators, Biz Owners Ed, and Liberty Ministry. Whether advising on strategic growth or mentoring the next generation of business leaders, Dave brings clarity, integrity, and decades of real-world experience to every interaction. His mission goes beyond exit planning—he’s committed to helping owners build lasting legacies.

Learn More about Jeff Sandene 

Since 1996, Jeff Sandene has built lasting relationships with executives, business owners, and their families by listening attentively to their personal, business, and financial goals. Jeff is known for implementing strategies objectively, with integrity and with diligence. He strives to help his clients grow and preserve their wealth by creating comprehensive financial plans and professional investment portfolios.

Sandene's core philosophies for planning and investing are heavily influenced by evidence-based investing and behavioral economics.  Jeff makes decisions based on facts, not emotions or hype, with an intense focus on risk management. 

Jeff believes that a secure financial future requires discipline, hard work, and a long-term perspective.  He has applied those attributes towards completing over 20 marathons, including four Boston Marathons. In addition to achieving the Certified Financial Planner® (CFP®) designation, Jeff also earned an MBA in Finance from The University of Texas at Dallas, as well as the Chartered Financial Consultant (ChFC) and Chartered Life Underwriter (CLU) designations from The American College

Mastery Partners

Elevating Businesses to Achieve The Business Owner’s Dream Exit
The unfortunate reality is that for every business that comes on the market (for whatever reason), only 17% of them achieve a successful exit. You read that right. 83% of attempted business transitions never reach the closing table. Mastery Partners is on a mission to change that. We ELEVATE businesses to achieve maximum value and reach that dream exit.

Our objectives are simple - understand where the business is today, identify opportunities for dramatic improvement, and offer solutions to enhance the business, making it more marketable and valuable. And that all starts with understanding the business owner’s definition of his or her dream exit.
Mastery has developed a 4-Step Process to help business owners achieve their dreams.

STEP 1: Transition Readiness Assessment
STEP 2: Roadmap for Value Acceleration
STEP 3: Relentless Execution
STEP 4: Decision: Now that desired results are achieved, the business is ready for the next step in the journey!

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Transcript

MAXIMIZE BUSINESS VALUE PODCAST - EPISODE 232 Transcript

(1s): Tom Bronson

Welcome to the Maximize Business Value Podcast, brought to you by Mastery Partners, where our mission is to equip business owners like you, to maximize your business value and achieve the exit of your dreams, whatever that means to you. With insights gained from over a hundred business transactions, we share real world strategies, lessons, and expert advice to help you build long term sustainable value in your business. Each episode is hosted by one of our Mastery certified partners, their seasoned experts who've helped countless business owners navigate the complexities of growth, scaling, and building value.

(45s): Tom Bronson

They bring firsthand experience, actionable insights, and a passion for helping you build a business that thrives. So, let's dive in.

(1m 3s): Dave Casey

Hi, this is Dave Casey, and welcome to Maximize Business Value. This is a podcast for business owners that are passionate about growing, scaling, and building long-term sustainable value in their business. So today I'm excited to welcome a longtime key referral partner for Mastery Partners, Mr. Jeff Sandene of Sandene Strategies. We've worked together for years supporting mutual clients, and we're always grateful for his partnership and his wisdom. So, Jeff, welcome to Maximize Business Value.

(1m 38s): Jeff Sandene

Hey, hello Dave and greetings to everybody in Podcast Land. How are you today? It's always a great pleasure to share a little bit of information on the Maximize Business Value Podcast and, you know, looking forward to the conversation today. Cool.

(1m 54s): Dave Casey

Yeah. So I know you've been on the podcast before with Tom hosting, but if you could just tell us a little bit about yourself and sanding strategies and kind of what you're all about.

(2m 4s): Jeff Sandene

Yeah, sure. So, Sandene Strategies was founded in 2005, 20 years ago. We're a full service financial planning and wealth management firm. Everything we do culminates with our clients experiencing smarter, smarter outcomes in, in their planning process. Everything from the education and knowledge we bring in to the referral partners that we have to the processes and procedures and, and specific financial strategies that we have. So we like bringing that experience to our clients and, and have a lot of fun doing it.

(2m 41s): Dave Casey

Oh, that's super. So I know you work with individuals, families and, and particularly with, you know, with business owners helping them plan and execute, you know, strategies as you, as you've described. But recently I've been talking to you and you, you've got something else up your sleeve. So I was wondering if you can share a little bit about what's coming up.

(3m 0s): Jeff Sandene

Yeah, it's, well, we're always looking for a new way to make a positive contribution to people's lives and one thing that I've discovered recently is that the non-financial aspects of financial planning are almost just as important as the financial aspects. And it's, it's something that not a lot of other financial advisors go into. So, yeah,

(3m 24s): Dave Casey

I've never heard anyone talk to me about non-financial aspects of financial planning. So that's kind of cool. 

(3m 29s): Jeff Sandene

Yeah, I mean, So if you think about anybody that's leaving the workforce, whether, whether they're a corporate employee retiring or a more, more specifically a business owner selling their business, they spend a lot of time on the business and the exit dollars, but they don't really think through what happens when they no longer have their business from a, from a sociological and psychological standpoint. Oh yeah. So, I'm exploring the different outcomes there.

(4m 2s): Dave Casey

That's cool. 'cause you know, I, of course I went through that. I had, I did work for large corporation for a short period of time, and when I left there, it wasn't very emotional 'cause I wasn't close to retirement or anything. And then, but I had my own company for over 20 years and I guess when I left that company, it was a little bit not probably as dramatic as some people 'cause I stayed on with a firm that I sold it to for, for a time. But when I actually left, left and never went in, you know, didn't stop going to the office. I guess that was, that was a bit of a change and I think, is that what you're describing? Just kind of

(4m 41s): Jeff Sandene

Yeah. So I mean, Void or what you feel. Yeah, so, so Exit Planning Institute did a study of business owners post exit and they talked to owners one year after their sale and found that 75% of business owners profoundly regret selling their business. And it's because they've lost meaning and purpose in their lives.

(5m 4s): Dave Casey

It wasn't that they missed the work, they just missed the whole environment it sounds like. Just,

(5m 11s): Jeff Sandene

Yeah. And, surprisingly, it had nothing to do with the amount of money that they received in the transaction. I mean, there were people that received a life changing amount of money, but they still felt depression and, and just a sense of loss one year later. Yeah,

(5m 32s): Dave Casey

Well that's certainly something, I mean, I know when we work with business owners, we try to prepare them for that. And I, I've gotta say some are maybe better prepared than others, but I think if your dream is I'm gonna, I'm gonna stop working, you know, 80 hours a week and play golf, that's probably too, too abrupt a change for most people to, to Yeah. Adjust to,

(5m 55s): Jeff Sandene

There's only so many tee times. Right. And, you know, I mean, there certainly a person's life will include things like that. Yeah. You know, spending more time with grandchildren or parents or your own children, just extra family time. But, you know, at some point you need to find, or people need to find an internal reason that motivates them and keeps them energized and fulfilled.

(6m 23s): Jeff Sandene

So it sounds like you've, you've come across as not just in from a theoretical sense, but, but, but an actuality. I mean, can can you share an example how you've helped maybe an exiting business owner really look at, you know, care, their planning and, and digging into the psychological aspect of what's gonna happen, what the life change is gonna be after

(6m 46s): Jeff Sandene

Working? Yeah, I mean it's, so there's two things going on there. First, I, I, I try as much as I can to focus on the advanced planning aspect of it so that we, so that we think about those things ahead of time. Yeah. I haven't seen too many business owners go through it, like from beginning to end and, and Right. Experience that regret. But what I do know in my life, I saw that happen to my grandfather. Really? Okay. He, he, he, he was a farmer up in South Dakota and also had some, had a seed corn and a hog feed franchise.

(7m 27s): Jeff Sandene

And I mean, he did a number of things wrong, but one, including not really creating a business from that. So when he retired, the income dropped 'cause there wasn't anything to sell. But in addition to that, he didn't really have a social network that didn't include people that he knew from business, whether customers or suppliers or, you know, other, other people. He just, so when, when he retired, that social network dried up too and Wow. Yeah. It was, it was just not good.

(8m 8s): Jeff Sandene

And he didn't have a lot of outside interests. He only had a high school education, so he never really developed a mentality for lifelong learning. Yeah. Intellectual curiosity, those types of things. And I think the more you can plan for that type of thing to keep you going mentally as well as socially and financially, it'll make a big difference, you know, after the business owner sells.

(8m 38s): Dave Casey

Yeah. I, you know, I've seen it firsthand with a couple of my friends that probably went both ways, you know, ones that had a business, worked in it very hard, you know, sold pretty successfully, but they had a plan after the plan. They, they really were, they actually got a second home that was closer to their grandchildren and they spent some time there and they traveled quite a bit. So they don't seem to be at a loss for anything to do. And in fact, I've just spent this weekend with that guy and he's like, yeah, I've got, I got plenty on my plate. You know, he said, even though he is not doing what he used to do.

(9m 18s): Jeff Sandene

Yeah. Still has a lot to do. Well it feels like he has a lot to contribute, I guess, too, you know, which is, see

(9m 24s): Jeff Sandene

That's great. I mean, because what we were talking about earlier with golf and grandchildren and, you know, bingo on Tuesdays, I mean, it's not hard to stay busy, but that doesn't necessarily give a person purpose. So Yeah,

(9m 39s): Dave Casey

That's true. True.

(9m 40s): Jeff Sandene

I think that's the piece that I, I'm, I'm, I'm, I'm thinking people will find ways to, to, to kill time, but I mean, will it give them the satisfaction and fulfillment that they had from running their business? Is this the question I'm trying to ask?

(9m 55s): Jeff Sandene

And that's, to me that's, it's, I think it's so unique that you're doing that because that, again, when I think of financial planning and wealth management, it's kind of that cut and dry, okay, what, you know, what's my portfolio gonna look like and, you know, how much risk am I gonna take? And all that kind of stuff. That, that, but it sounds like you're, when you work with people, it kind of goes way beyond just the nuts and bolts of, of financial planning.

(10m 22s): Jeff Sandene

Yeah, I mean, I mean, at the end of the day, that aspect of retirement is just a math problem, right? So I mean, if all you wanted were numbers, like a target dollar amount, you could go to Fidelity's website and get that, but

(10m 37s): Dave Casey

Invest in the 2030 fund or the 2050 fund or whatever, you know. Yeah.

(10m 42s): Jeff Sandene

So, I mean, but I've got a process that incorporates six different elements to it, and this non-financial piece is one of them. The financial assets are another, but I mean, you have to consider tax strategies, estate planning strategies, risk management strategies, and, and really make sure that you're doing the right things inside the business to help you with your personal retirement plan as well.

(11m 10s): Dave Casey

Yeah. And that's something again, we, we just, we were together at the Business transition summit recently, and there were several of the presentations I saw were in GAR regarding tax planning. And I think that's something people think, well, I'll have to plan for that after I retire and get this chunk of change. And that's, that's probably the worst thing you can do. Wait, yeah.

 (11m 34s): Jeff Sandene

You know, once you have that check, there's not much tax planning you can do.

(11m 37s): Dave Casey

No. Except write the check for taxes. Maybe that's your plan. So, pretty wild. So what, what do you think is the most rewarding thing, and you've been doing this for 20 years, so I mean, you've, you've built, built a heck of a business and a and, you know, a clientele. So what's the most rewarding thing that you do, in working with your clients?

(11m 59s): Jeff Sandene

Well, I mean, that's, that's a really good question. And I, I believe that I initiate communication within a household. Oh. And, and, and I've seen, 'cause you know, I'll always involve spouses, not just, if it's a male business owner, we'll have his wife Right. And we'll talk about things and, and when, when we talk about the life planning aspect of it, many times it comes out that they have a different idea of what retirement's gonna look like. 

(12m 36s): Dave Casey

Right. Yeah. And, and One that may not have been voiced yet.

(12m 39s): Jeff Sandene

Yeah, yeah. Well, so it can be a little tense if there's a significant difference. But I get satisfaction from seeing them talk about stuff like that. Yeah. And then working it out, you know, making compromises and doing things ahead of time so that those issues don't come up. Yeah. And unknown to them. Like they, like, there's always, I had an example where, and wasn't a business owner, was a corporate person, but he traveled almost a hundred percent of the time, and his wife's idea of retirement was traveling the world. Right.

(13m 19s): Jeff Sandene

His idea for retirement was drinking pina coladas, maybe traveling, but to a beach and drinking. Yeah. Yeah. And, and it's like, wow,

(13m 29s): Dave Casey

We need, you know, I, I've, I've experienced some of that over my career, even even week to week. So it'll be Friday afternoon and I get home, and Doris will go, so what are we doing? I said, well, I just did it for the whole week. No, no. Where, where are we going out for dinner? I've been out for dinner twice this week. She says, you have, but I haven't anything else. So it's on a small scale, I've seen that. And then of course it changes when you, even when you talk about travel, if, if you travel for business all the time, it's probably the last thing you wanna do is get on that plane. Even if you're going to a cool place, you know, the travel aspect's not quite as glamorous. So,

(14m 6s): Jeff Sandene

So, so, so I guess the, I I just get a lot of satisfaction of helping people work through things and you know, like there's the old quote from the A team, remember, I love it when a plan comes through or something like that. Yeah,

 (14m 19s): Dave Casey

Yeah, yeah.

(14m 19s): Jeff Sandene

So, so to be, to be in this business long enough where we've put the plan down and got to the point where we're implementing the retirement piece of it, and to see that it works is very

(14m 31s): Dave Casey

Satisfying. Yeah. See it come to fruition, it's gotta be great, you know? Yeah. And again, you're changing how you're, maybe you're, I call it you kind of the accumulation phase for a long time and then you kind of get into the, the spending phase, if you will, or, but still, it's a, and that was a hard mindset for me. It was a hard mindset not to make a contribution to my retirement account, you know, but actually start taking money out, which is Yeah. That's a hard thing to, to, to face sometimes. So I, I've got one last question for you. This has been fascinating and just, you know, just the, the aspects that go way beyond just the, like I said, the, the, the numbers and everything for financial planning, but you know, this podcast is all about maximizing business value.

(15m 15s): Dave Casey

We really try to work with business owners because their business, in many cases, at least until they exit it, that is their, their wealth management or their, their plan to, to invest. So what's the, what's the most important thing that you recommend to business owners to build value in their business?

(15m 39s): Jeff Sandene

I love that question. And I, I don't have a, I don't have a single thing, an answer. In fact, what I have is not one answer, but one analogy.

(15m 47s): Dave Casey

Ah, okay.

(15m 48s): Jeff Sandene

Yeah. So I run marathons.

(15m 52s):

I love seeing marathons. I run Waka Waka littles. 

(15m 58s):

Well, you can use marathons as an analogy for a lot of things, but I think it applies particularly to business owners maximizing value, scaling their business, and eventually selling. The first, first thing is, you don't wake up one morning and decide you're gonna run a marathon. Now. And the same holds true for business owners. You don't wake up one morning and decide you're gonna just sell your business. You're done. I mean, I've seen business owners try that before and it doesn't work very

(16m 27s): Dave Casey

Well. No, those are guys we like to talk to because it didn't work

(16m 31s): Jeff Sandene

Well. The second thing is, if you decide you wanna run a marathon, you wake up and you gonna put a plan together, but you, all you've been doing is running five Ks. The plan you had for running five Ks won't work for your marathon training. So you need a new and better plan. And that would hold true for a business owner that has been running their business and now they're trying to scale it and sell it. That old plan is not gonna work. Yeah.

(17m 2s): Dave Casey

Yeah.

(17m 2s): Jeff Sandene

And the third, the third piece is, if you're gonna run a marathon and have never done that before, it's probably a good idea to surround yourself with people, runners who have done it, maybe even a coach who's run multiple marathons and train people on how to train for marathons because the business owner, or I might be a good 5K runner, but on my own, I may not be a very good marathon runner. And, and same would hold true with a business owner. They're good at running their business, but they're not, they've never sold a business before. So why not hire an expert that's been around the track a few times and you stay in your lane and, and surround yourself with owners.

 (17m 47s): Jeff Sandene

So it's really, the analogy has three parts, and that is think ahead, get a better plan and hire experts. So that's my piece of advice for

(17m 57s): Jeff Sandene

Business owners. Yeah, that is awesome. And that, you know, I can see where that applies in many aspects for a business owner too. It's just not, it's just not one person's advice. Maybe you need to be seeking, you need a, you need a team really of folks to help you. 

(18m 11s): Dave Casey

Absolutely.

(18m 11s): Jeff Sandene

Sure. And that's, that's one, I mean, I love, I love working in this space because no single person does have all the answers. And it, and it feels good to bring in other experts, subject matter experts that that can solve it a particular problem, because that's what they do. And, you know, it's so we do it professionally. And I mean, that's the other advantage. Business owners don't necessarily have the network of people that are experts in all the areas that need to be, but you and I do. And we can bring those people in. And that's, that's why I love the, the tagline, smarter outcomes, is by bringing in a team of people, you really do end up with a better and smarter outcome than if you had done it yourself or maybe hired somebody that doesn't have those connections.

(19m 5s): Dave Casey

Yeah, yeah. Well, and I think there's a little more personalization there too, when you've got people that they're recommending people that they trust and in many cases use for their own stuff too. So that's, that's always important. Yep. Super, man, these are wise words. Indeed. I'm glad we had this conversation for sure. So really, thanks for really sharing your insights and experiences. I think our folks are really gonna, you know, get a lot of value from that. And, and it, and these, what we try to do with these podcasts are just tangible benefits. Things that people can actually take action on, and work through. So this is the Maximize Business Value Podcast where we give practical advice to business owners that are very serious about building sustainable value in their business.

(19m 54s): 

Be sure to tune in each week, 'cause we're gonna be doing these on a regular basis, and not just me, there's gonna be a variety of hosts as well. And then subscribe to the channel so you won't miss a single episode. So this is Dave Casey, we will see you next time.

(20m 12s): Tom Bronson

Thanks for joining us for another episode of the Maximize Business Value Podcast. I hope today's conversation sparked new ideas on how you can continue driving value in your business. But remember, it's not just about listening, it's about taking massive action. Visit our website mastery partners.com for more resources. Grab a copy of any of the books in the Maximize Business Value series on Amazon or via the links below. And don't hesitate to reach out if you want to know how to apply these concepts to your business.

(20m 53s): 

So until next time, I'm Tom Bronson reminding you to relentlessly execute while you Maximize Business Value.