Are You Running a Business or a Job? (#278)

On this week’s episode of the Maximize Business Value Podcast, host and Certified Mastery Partner Dave Casey is joined by panelists Gil Bean and Scott Couchenour to tackle the "Owner Trap." Are you the "hero" of your company, solving every fire and making every decision? While it feels good to be the fixer, that dependency is exactly what kills your company's value during an exit. Tune in to learn how to categorize your tasks, set non-negotiable boundaries, and build a business that can thrive without you!

Listen to our podcast weekly to hear more from Mastery Partners and to receive relevant key content on your journey to maximizing your business value!

Podcast Chapters:
00:00 — Introduction
01:00 — Defining Transition Readiness
03:35 — Working "In" vs. "On" Your Business
05:20 — A Real Business vs. an Overworked Job
08:19 — The Pitfalls of Owner Reliance
11:11 — The Next-Act Identity Crisis for Founders
14:55 — How Owner Dependency Destroys Value
21:40 — Due Diligence Failures and Earnout Traps
25:05 — Transferring Ownership of Results, Not Tasks
31:41 — Micro-Habits for Carving Out Strategic Time
35:52 — The Transition Readiness Assessment
38:05 — Closing & Outro

#MasteryPartners #MaximizeBusinessValuePodcast #BusinessOwnerHotline #BusinessOperatingSystems #GreatGameOfBusiness #EOS

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Learn More about Dave Casey
Engaged business leader with an eye for cyber security, non-profits, and business transformation. Dave previously founded and led an IT managed services company, brought it through a successful exit, and today helps companies craft cyber security strategies.

Learn More about Scott Couchenour
Scott Couchenour, founder of Serving Strong Enterprises, offers over 40 years of leadership experience, helping business owners and executives navigate major transitions, rediscover purpose, and design a fulfilling next chapter after business or career success.

Learn More about Gil Bean
As a Certified Exit Planning Advisor (CEPA), Gil Bean applies his curiosity, empathy, and his desire to listen to maximize business value and preserve wealth. His strategic advisory leverages past success as an EOS Implementer and his long history in enterprise software sales, helping owners achieve clarity for their successful exit.

Mastery Partners

Elevating Businesses to Achieve The Business Owner’s Dream Exit 
The unfortunate reality is that for every business that comes on the market (for whatever reason), only 17% of them achieve a successful exit. You read that right. 83% of attempted business transitions never reach the closing table. Mastery Partners is on a mission to change that. We ELEVATE businesses to achieve maximum value and reach that dream exit.

Our objectives are simple - understand where the business is today, identify opportunities for dramatic improvement, and offer solutions to enhance the business, making it more marketable and valuable. And that all starts with understanding the business owner’s definition of his or her dream exit.  
Mastery has developed a 4-Step Process to help business owners achieve their dreams.

STEP 1: Transition Readiness Assessment
STEP 2: Roadmap for Value Acceleration
STEP 3: Relentless Execution
STEP 4: Decision: Now that desired results are achieved, the business is ready for the next step in the journey!

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Transcript

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Tom Bronson (0s): Welcome to the Maximize Business Value Podcast, brought to you by Mastery Partners, where our mission is to equip business owners like you, to maximize your business value and achieve the exit of your dreams, whatever that means to you. With insights gained from over a hundred business transactions, we share real world strategies, lessons, and expert advice to help you build long term sustainable value in your business.


Each episode is hosted by one of our Mastery certified partners, their seasoned experts who've helped countless business owners navigate the complexities of growth, scaling, and building value. They bring firsthand experience, actionable insights, and a passion for helping you build a business that thrives. So, let's dive in.


Dave Casey (60s): Well, welcome to the Mastery Partners Podcast. I'm your host, Dave Casey, and Today we're kicking off our 2026 series of kind of a foundational topic, what readiness or transition readiness really means, and why you should be thinking about it, even if your business, even if exiting your business, really is the last thing on your mind. So I'm, I'm fortunate enough today to be joined by two of our, my fellow Mastery partners, Gil Bean and Scott Kau. Hi guys. How's it going? Good.


How are you, Dave? Good. Good. Yeah, I'm, I'm well as well. Dave, how you doing? Yeah, I'm just looking forward to this. This is, this is this whole series of, of interviewing each other I think is kind of cool, but it's, these are really based on questions we get every day when we deal with clients. And so, really, and we've, we've decided just to make a, a series of podcasts based on real life questions that we get. So the one today should be fun. It's, it's, how do I know if I'm running a real business or just an overworked job?


So, and, and this is a question I think every business owner kind of asks, usually without wanting the, the answer, so, right. And, and, and the realization is really a breakthrough. It, it, it, it tells me when I hear that question, it, it, it's, they're equating a transition with an immediate exit. And, and if they're ready to move from owner operator to founder, they're thinking that right behind there is the exit. And that's not always the case for sure.


So really, I think what we'd like to do today is, is just dive into this and take a look at it. And, you know, I, I, I want to get your guys' feedback on this, but in my estimation, or just the way I've always tried to approach things, my, I was pretty, I had my business for over 25 years before we sold it. And, but I never really thought about it as I was, it was part of me or anything like that. It was always the business. And I always try, try to, try to make it into an asset as opposed to my life, you know, into that.


And I don't know what, what's been your experience? You both have been business owners. What's been your experience with, did you get involved in that deal where the business was just a big part of you?


Gil Bean (3m 35s): Wow. It, it's there. There's, I'm, I'm only hesitating because there are so many answers to this question, and I, I'm,


Dave Casey (3m 44s): And we don't wanna talk about any of them, do we? Yeah,


Gil Bean (3m 46s): I'm, I'm, I'm just not sure where to start the, perhaps I'll start here. And that is that the, the old saw is are, are you working in the business or, or, or are you working on the business? Yeah, working in the business is obviously the day to day, 12, 15 hour days doing much of the work. And we'll get, I'm sure we'll get into that point before too much longer, as opposed to working on the business, which is being able to step back and take a look at what's, what's happening, how things are going, and whether or not you're doing the right things for yourself, for your team, and for the business.


Those are, those are two very different things. And many times, I was going to say, I think, but I really know that many times owners put off the idea of working on the business for the sake of working in it. So they, they, they wait, well, they wait until they think they're ready to exit, or for some later undefined future date, they will wait to start working on the business.


But up until that time, they're just gonna continue at the pace they're at right now. So that's the first, that's one answer to the question.


Dave Casey (5m 12s): Yeah. Yeah. And then Scott, how about you? Because I know you, you had a a family business.


Scott Couchenour (5m 20s): Yeah, we had a family business. My, my situation is kind of unique, I think, because what I experienced was an unwanted unplanned exit. So when I was on the other side of that closing of our family business, the thing I struggled with was after the fact, after you could do anything about it. Yeah. And I realized afterward, looking back, that I actually did see the business as, not as a business per se, but as a job, you know, because, only because of the impact to me personally.


Right. You know, the, the question that we're wrestling with, how do I know if my business is a business or just a job, an overworked job? I really think that a business owner asking that question intuitively knows the answer.


Dave Casey (6m 13s): Yeah.


Scott Couchenour (6m 14s): I mean, the, the first question to ask is when was the last time you went on vacation and when you did Right. Did you truly go on vacation? And if that's, if the answer is no, I have not. Or I went on vacation, but I never unplugged. Yeah. There's an answer.


Dave Casey (6m 29s): Yep. And, and people deal with that in different ways. So there's a, a wonderful m and a attorney that we work with at Mastery Partners here in the DFW area, A longtime friend, gosh, I've known him almost 20 years, and actually, well before I was associated with Mastery, he helped me sell my business. So he was, and he's a single proprietor, he certainly has other folks he works with, but he's, he's it, he's a single shingle kind of guy, has done hundreds of transactions, probably a billion in business, at least in, in, in terms of transactions.


And he will freely admit he has a lifestyle business that, that he's not, it's not a transferrable business. He is the business. Right. But he goes on vacations, like he's, he's about to leave for an 80 day cruise around the world. Wow. And, and, but he works from the, from the ship from time to time. And so he, he and his wife is fine with it. She says, Hey, he gets up early and, you know, types on the computer for a while, and then, you know, we're free to go tour around and do what we're gonna do.


So she says it pays for our lifestyle. We're really happy with that. So. Right. So there is a way to do both, I guess. But, but more often I see that, that there, that the business owner, like you said, they cannot leave, they can't unplug. Right. Certainly would not expect to be able to leave for 30 days at a time, a whole month right away from the business without calling in, without emailing, without checking back. And there's probably reasons that that falls into place.


One of them is the way decisions are made in the business. And, and Gail, have you seen it where, where basically all decisions, large and small come through the business business owner?


Gil Bean (8m 19s): Yeah. There's no question in the parlance, it's Owner Reliance. It's called Owner Reliance. Yeah. And the, the, the foundational question for the business owner is, you know, what, how would the business do without you, how would the business do without you? And that normally gets a lot of silence and blank stares.


Dave Casey (8m 40s): Well, usually it's like we, I've never tried.


Gil Bean (8m 44s): Well,


Scott Couchenour (8m 45s): I don't have time. Yeah. I'm trying to answer so many questions. I don't even have time.


Dave Casey (8m 49s): Yeah. But I time to talk to you because, you know, I've got people at my door. You know? So


Scott Couchenour (8m 55s): I think that, that, that the challenge really kind of is rooted in the, in the very inside of the business owner and what they put, what they consider their identity, because it's gratifying to be the one that everybody comes to. I mean, I work with a business owner who, when we first started working with Together, struggled mainly with the fact that he loved being the knight on the white horse to come in and, and save the day, you know, have the salespeople do as far as they could, but then, Hey, Mr.


Owner, we need your help on this situation. And he loved that. Yeah. And that became a, a definition of his identity. And I think we kind of, we, business owners, especially those who have egos, which I, I'll go ahead and say it. Most of us, most of them are men. Sure. Yeah. We like to be the answer giver, the fixer, the doer. And that's okay. But in the context of transition, which is inevitable.


Right. We can't, we can't, neither can we stop a transition, nor can we choose sometimes our transition. Yeah. Sometimes it's chosen for us and, and, but so it becomes a problem when it becomes a problem.


Dave Casey (10m 19s): Yeah. Yeah. Well, and it's, yeah, I think talking to a business owner, and, and, and like I said, I think almost everyone that I've ever dealt with kind of knows it's a problem, but they're okay with it. 'cause they, they grew, you know, they built the business because they liked solving problems. Usually they liked doing it better than either where they worked before or, you know, I've, I've seen people start businesses just 'cause they couldn't hire anybody to do what they wanted done.


And so they, I wanna start a business to do that. And, and so there's some of that. And then I think that firefighter syndrome, I love to fight fires, you know? Yeah. Gimme, gimme some more fires. So, and yeah. As we know, it doesn't lead to, to building much value after


Scott Couchenour (11m 10s): A while. Yeah. Right.


Gil Bean (11m 11s): Well, I have a question for both of you, and that is there, there's a clear trend right now that baby boomers who were once anticipated to start phasing out of their businesses when they were 62, 65, or 67 in that, in that range, and are now working way past that well into their seventies. Do you think that has anything to do with the dynamic that Scott just talked about? The, the, the desire to do it all? Just a question. I don't know.


Hmm.


Scott Couchenour (11m 42s): Well, in, in, in the work that I'm doing with personal planning, I think a lot of that has to do with the, the void of what's next. Yeah. You know, if there's not a what's next, then there's, there's likely going to be, I, I'll just stick with the familiar. And to me, that's, that's what is called the comfort zone. I, I prefer to call it the familiar zone, which is comfortable. We're familiar with what we've done for 30, 40 years. To think about not doing that is like going out the, you know, the word exit.


We go out the back door into this black abyss. So by contrast, we default back to, okay, I'll kick the can down the road another month or two or year and make that decision later. Because not only is there a lot to do anyway, I don't know what I'd do without this. So


Dave Casey (12m 35s): Yeah. There, there are people, you know, definitely people that I'm really happy. I've, I've always done this. I'm really happy doing it. You know, I've watched buddies of mine retire and kind of their health goes down and can only play so much golf, and you're bored and, you know. Right. I'm not bored, you know, there's a line of people at my door, you know? That's right.


Scott Couchenour (12m 54s): Yeah. Purpose.


Dave Casey (12m 55s): Right. I, I heard something actually on the radio this morning that was interesting. It was a interview with a, one of the analysts that, that works with Wall Street Journal, but they're talking about, this year in particular, it seems like graduates coming outta college are having a tough time finding spots, finding jobs. And there's several reasons for it. They, you know, the, the underlying reason that everybody was trying to drive it to was, well, it's ai because AI is replacing everybody and all this kind of stuff.


And he said, that plays a factor, but it's not a big factor. Companies still realize they have to hire people. They have to, you know, get people in and, and, and grow them, you know, in an organization. One of the things was is that companies are, they're reluctant to let go of experienced employees that, you know, we used to talk about ageism where you got to a certain age and a company's trying to push you out the door. And now they're trying to entice people to stay. These baby boomers that have a, a body of knowledge.


And, and, and so it's really interesting. It's a, it's like they're not, they're not getting outta the way for the next generation to take over. So it's, and it kind of, you know, kind of th thrust goes down the hill to, to the entry level, you know?


Scott Couchenour (14m 12s): So I'm thinking if I were, if I were 35, 40 years old again, I would simply wait until the exit was inevitable and it took place. And you buy a business on a fire sale. Yeah. And you just build it. You've got the bones of a organization. Yeah. Granted, a lot of it is, has been dependent on the owner, but when the owner is gone, you could build it. You've got a, a, a staff of people.


And, but we're not talking about those people. We're talking about the people in the trenches working on a business is in, won't,


Dave Casey (14m 52s): Won't leave.


Scott Couchenour (14m 53s): Right.


Dave Casey (14m 55s): So let's talk a little bit about it and, and, and, and you, you alluded to it, that why this, this destroys value within a business. Why, how does a buyer look at a guy that's just kind of buried in the day-to-day of his business


Gil Bean (15m 15s): Has a tremendous impact? Well, first of all, the buyer, that question that I asked before, how, how does the business, what does the business look like without you? That's gonna be foremost in the buyer's mind. That's, if that's not one of the first five questions that a buyer asks, I, I, I, I don't know what is, it's right up at the top. So it, it's a, it's not a positive thing for a buyer because they wanna, they wanna know that the respon the various responsibilities within the, the organization are spread out over a team of people who really understand individual processes and, and, and work with them and improve them and refine them every day.


It, it's a, it's a very critical issue. I, I would say that the, if, if owner, re owner reliance is probably the number one thing on the, the number one point that the buyer wants to resolve, wants to understand clearly if the business is reliant on the owner, how is it possible to move ahead and improve that situation? Or is that a deal breaker? Does that break the deal right from the beginning?


Scott Couchenour (16m 45s): You know, if I were, if I were a buyer looking at a business, the first, I, I would look at relationships and I would ask, what are the three employee, the three top key employees that you have? What are the three top vendors in your organization? And what are the three top customers or clients in your business? Now tell me how deeply ingrained are you with those nine people and and how much do they rely on you? Because, you know, to the extent that that, like if the owner sells, are they gonna lose those top three employees?


Are they gonna see this as their opportunity to move on to something else? The vendors, maybe they're, it was built on a deep relationship and clients built on a deep relationship that you, it, it makes the business less valuable because the buyer will not pay for a vulnerability. They won't pay for a risky business. They're just not into that. That's why they have due diligence.


They'll put a letter of intent out there, but then it's subject to due diligence. What they're looking for is where are all the vulnerabilities? You know, we don't wanna buy a liability or vulnerability. And so I, I'd look at relationships. 'cause that's what a lot of stuff, a lot of work and business commerce is, is based on


Dave Casey (18m 14s): Yeah. And it's, go ahead. Go ahead Gil. I was


Gil Bean (18m 17s): Gonna say, an extension of what Scott just said is that it's one of the reasons why buyers sometimes end up buying a part of a company, though the buyer buy a, a part of a company that's attractive because of the relationship, the, the relationships with customers are not spread too thinly or the relationship with vendors there. That those, there's no dominance in either one of those sectors, but maybe over in another part of the business, another division per se, or for example, that that might be prevalent and they wouldn't be interested in doing that.


So that there ends up being a, a segmentation of what the buyer's interested or not interested in what a competitor might be interested in or, or not interested in. A lot of, a lot of different dynamics take place there.


Dave Casey (19m 12s): Yeah. And I've seen firsthand a couple of times where there's buyers that, you know, the seller is like, oh yeah, I've, I've got everything down. You know, everybody, this thing kind of runs itself. Right. And, you know, I'm, I'm certainly, I founded it and you know, these bigger clients, I originally signed those clients, but now my team's taking care of 'em and all that kind of stuff. And, but when they get to due diligence, sometimes that story doesn't hold up. And I think that probably the statistic that hurts the most is that probably 70% of deals fall apart in due diligence that either the buyer comes back and says, yeah, this is not what you really said it was, so we're revising, you know, here's what we can offer for this.


Right. Or they just, they just walk away silently and just say, well, yeah, it's just, yeah, just not a good fit. And, you know, good luck and see you later. But, but sometimes they will just open up and say, here, here was the problem. I've got a buddy right now. He's, he, he has a ranch. It's really a resort. It's, it's a good size ranch. It's used for all types of camping and retreats and all that kind of stuff. And he turned it from a personal ranch into a business.


And, but he's intimately involved. I mean, he's making decisions on, you know, bedsheets and, and cleaning services and all this kind of stuff. And he's got it up for sale and he thinks that it's a big advantage that he's, you know, I will stay on as, as the GM, if you will, as somebody takes it over, just because I know everything about everything. I know every building and the history behind the air conditioning systems and blah, blah, blah, and all the way down the road.


And he thinks that's a, that's a plus. And I'm sure the buyers are looking at going, you know, if we buy this, we have our own ideas what we're gonna do. And, and it's probably doesn't include this guy, you know, so. Yeah.


Scott Couchenour (21m 14s): Well you, I think it sounds like you limit the, the pool of buyers when you take that approach there. I'm sure there are some buyers that would say, great, we have a built in GM of a I'll be a mailbox owner, don't run, kind of thing. Yep. But, but you


Dave Casey (21m 31s): Know, and then they look at the GM and they go, well, how long can this guy,


Scott Couchenour (21m 34s): That's true. Not 30 years old anymore.


Gil Bean (21m 40s): Yeah. And Dave, one of the other outcomes to the example that you just, that you just stated there, is that they, they'll, they'll say, yeah, you please stay on. We want, we want you as the owner to stay on, but part of your liquidity is going to be tied to the performance of the organization over the next two to three years. And, and then the owner goes, I don't,


Dave Casey (22m 6s): Yeah. Yeah. So that, that turns from a, a cast deal to a very large earnout. Yep. Yeah. They have to perform against the e also, I think would shrink the multiple that they get as well. Yeah. Yeah. Def definitely, definitely cases. The, do you guys have any firsthand examples, you know, maybe clients that you've dealt with that, that really ran into this kind of buzz saw of owner dependency and either it either screwed up the deal or it just didn't turn out the way they, they dreamed?


Scott Couchenour (22m 45s): Well, working with a, a prospect right now who started off the business, she absolutely loved what she did. It was a passion project, and I guess you'd call it fortunately or unfortunately, it grew and became popular and became very, very, you know, I'm thinking of the, of the story in the book E-Myth where someone starts out, Hey, you're really good at what they do, and you ought to open a business and sell these pie.


Very similar situation. Now it's killing her. And, and thankfully these owners rep recognize this, and they're looking at, we can't live this way forever. What was a passion is now this burden. And what do we do? Well, we can't really sell because of all that we've been talking about so far. I mean, it wouldn't be worth the sale because everything is dependent on me. So the only other option is to build things like standard operating procedures and, you know, build the moat around the business so that it is not as dependent on her.


Gil Bean (24m 2s): That's, that's really interesting. I, I think, I think this is more prevalent in, in very small businesses where solopreneurs are, are running the business rather necessarily than entrepreneurs. And in, in, in that situation, if, if they decide to leave, that is truly a lifestyle business that is truly a job. And they are looking for someone to, who wants the same job, which is really a very narrow slice of the, usually a very narrow slice of the market.


I, I, I definitely see that in the, the example that Scott cited in, in the E-Myth. Was it a pie shop or a BA bakery or I think,


Scott Couchenour (24m 56s): Yeah, there was a pie shop. Pie shop. It was known for building great pies. Yeah,


Gil Bean (24m 60s): Yeah. That, that was great example of exactly that, that dynamic.


Dave Casey (25m 5s): Yeah. And it's, so there's, there's things obviously we, I think we've zeroed in on where the, where the pitfalls are and what the problems are. You know, part of our charter at, at Mastery Partners is to, when we engage with the business owner and we perform our transaction readiness analysis, a lot of these things come to light typically. Yes. And I wanted to highlight a few things that, that maybe we can do or we can, suggestions we can make to help them start building a business that would run without them.


So the first one I had is, is zeroing in on those decisions. This takes some time, I think, but decisions that they're involved in that they don't need to be involved in. Yeah. And have you guys had firsthand experience of either, either getting away from those yourself or helping a client away?


Scott Couchenour (25m 59s): Yes. There, there were four questions that I ran across years ago that I now employ in this context. The first, the, the four questions are what must be done. That's the first question that only I can do. Those are the two key. The other two are nice to have if you can. And that is, I'm good at it and I enjoy it.


Dave Casey (26m 25s): Yeah.


Scott Couchenour (26m 25s): Right. Because a lot of times you're doing things that have to be done that only you can do that you don't enjoy or you're not good at only because of the position that you hold in the company. But time after time, when you do that analysis, the number of things that must be done that only you can do are minimal because you can, you can build systems, you can hire strong people to do a lot of the things that must be done that you don't have to do.


Yeah. And then that, that kind of narrows down the, just a couple of, you know, a handful of things that only you can do, and it makes the business transferable because you transfer just a few things to the buyer instead of this enormous behemoth of decisions and I intellectual property that resides in the head of the owner. Sure.


Dave Casey (27m 21s): Yeah.


Gil Bean (27m 22s): It, it also forces the business, if you will, to create viable processes. Yeah. When, when something is inside the owner's head, as you, as you say, Scott, you're, you're exactly right. That that can, it's just a o off the cuff. Nothing is documented, nothing is really driven by process. When you allocate that to other team members and they start to refine it and make it more viable, then the process becomes more robust, more valid, and certainly more attractive to buyers.


Scott Couchenour (28m 1s): There's a question in the transition readiness assessment that we do at Mastery Partners, and that is, do you have an operating system?


Dave Casey (28m 7s): Yeah.


Scott Couchenour (28m 7s): And if the answer is no or I don't know that that opens up a whole can of awareness of owner dependents. Interesting question.


Dave Casey (28m 20s): Yeah. We, I, I had done a podcast last week with, with Amy and David, two of our other business partners, and that, that came up with, you know, it's, we were really contrasting EOS and great game of business. Sure. And, and it's funny, the conclusion was, they, they are both business operating systems.


They operate a little bit differently. EOS is very good about structure. I think scorecards meeting cadence, length of meeting, you know, how you do your one-on-ones. How do you establish KPIs? And, and, and really how do you solve issues? Great game is interesting because it is more centered around open books management, where essentially we're essentially, you are sharing with the entire team, you know, here's how we're doing, we're making money, we're not making money, we're, we've got a challenge in this area, we're really killing it over here.


And, you know, kind of encouraging people to, once they understand how their actions contribute to the, to the greater good or eventually EBITDA of the company, then they will voluntarily or, or more, more likely to change their actions or improve their actions and stuff. So I I thought that was kind of interesting. And, and I think that's a, that's a key thing is if, if they don't have those processes down and, and, and people are owning those that aren't the founder then, right.


Yeah. But that, that's where we really get into it.


Scott Couchenour (29m 59s): Well, the thing about the EOS and great game and other, you know, operating systems is that it, it takes the, the relationship and emotions out of it, and you, and you build a system, it helps you build the system so the system becomes the bad guy. And, and it removes, you know, removes a lot of the, of the, or at least it helps to remove a lot of the emotion out of it.


Dave Casey (30m 27s): Yeah. And I think that I've seen, certainly with my company, I was fortunate enough to join a Vistage group, and my Vistage parties really helped me step back from a lot of the things, decision points that I was making in the business. And really the, one of the things they talked about was transferring ownership of results, not just tasks. Sure. Excuse me. Powerful. And, and that really helped me because I think my employees, my team members really became much more energized when they realized, I'm not gonna tell you how to do this.


I'm not gonna micromanage you, but you are fully equipped to do this particular part of the deal, and I really, I need you to do that and, and, and let me know what kind of resources you need to do that. And, and we did that in the financial side. We did it in the technical side, we did it in the sales side, and it really had great results. So I, I've gotta say that was a, and that helped me eventually transition outta the company, which was, I'm so thankful for my Vista guys.


Scott Couchenour (31m 33s): Well, and transition outta the company successfully.


Dave Casey (31m 36s): Yes. Yeah, yeah, yeah. Not feet first, you know, so.


Scott Couchenour (31m 40s): Right, right.


Gil Bean (31m 41s): I think one of the corollaries to system, one of the common denominators in the systems that we, that we have been talking about is discipline. I, I think the more that you, it, it, it can be viewed as a negative word, I suppose, but the more that things are allocated across the team and people are given responsibility and people are held accountable, you're gonna have more and more discipline in the organization, which is a, but you can only be a good thing.


Dave Casey (32m 13s): Yep. That's a good point. I think the other thing to, I think it would help a business owner is that when you, when you're transferring that responsibility, that you're also looking at it not just, I'm not just blindly turning this over to you, we're gonna have a system of audit and, and follow up and process so that don't feel like, you know, I'm, I'm giving you this responsibility.


If you screw it up, boy, it's your head buddy. Right. All or


Scott Couchenour (32m 51s): Nothing.


Dave Casey (32m 51s): It, it, and so that you're, you're giving them more to do and take on responsibility, but you're not, you're not penalizing for making mistakes. You know, and, and obviously you try to design it so they, they don't make any, you know, fatal mistakes for the business or themselves. But


Scott Couchenour (33m 12s): You know what I would, I'm sorry. What I would say to a business owner who is listening to this and saying, you have no idea how busy I am, you have no idea what you're asking me to add another hour to a 24 hour day. Yeah. Because I'm just up to my eyeballs. Well, you know, Gil used the word discipline and, and in the right context, you know, discipline and boundaries, there's freedom and boundaries. Yeah. I, I like to look at it in terms as well as building in a practice.


You don't have to change everything overnight. In fact, you can't, you know, working on the business, the business has to keep going. But I've always been successful at helping business owners look two or three weeks out into their calendar when it begins to open up just a little bit and get, put three 30 minute slots as appointments in the meeting and, and treat it like an appointment. And, and that's where you carve out that 30 minutes, three times a week or whatever cadence you choose, and you work on the system, on the business, and when the alarm goes off, you stick a pin in it and you go back into the business.


Yep. Then that next appointment pops up, you pull the pin pin out, set the alarm, and pick up where you left off and you just chip away at it. Little by little by little over time, you'd be surprised how far you can get.


Dave Casey (34m 43s): And it is the 80 20 or 90 10 rule. One of the, I guess it's a business operating system. We didn't really treat it that way, but we went, we ran on the four disciplines of execution for a few years. Yep. Which was a book several years ago by, well it was McChesney actually wrote it


Scott Couchenour (35m 3s): Chesney and, and Fueling.


Dave Casey (35m 4s): Yeah. Yeah. Yep. But it was great book and, and a great concept of the whirlwind is gonna occupy 80% of your time. That that's the, that's the line of people at your door and, you know, best customer just left or best supplier just went bankrupt and all those things that we can't control. Right. But the piece that we can control the, you know, the 20% or 30, you know, hopefully 30%, but say 10 to 20%, then we really need to focus on those when we have that time. And, and, and don't try to do 10 things at once.


It's just bear boil it down to one or two.


Scott Couchenour (35m 39s): And, and if you can normalize that as a, just a part of doing things, I call 'em teeth brushing kinds of things. You just do 'em, that's just, yeah. It's just what you do. Oh, that's super. Yeah.


Dave Casey (35m 52s): Perfect. Well, I think we dressed it, you know, it's, hopefully somebody that's viewing this will say, well, I, I'm not gonna have a transferable business unless I solve this problem. I think that's number one. And, and it just so happens that we're in a position to help, you know, right. Not just the three of us, but mastery partners in general. And so really, I mean, every, every day business owners really make these decisions that, that really impact the value of their company without realizing it.


And we're trying to help them make the right decisions there. So that's really why, you know, Tom Bronson, who's our founder, helped put together the transition readiness assessment, which is a, a deep dive into a business. It's a, and, but it's a rapid result tool that really uncovers the hidden value gaps in the business. And its owner dependency is certainly one of the largest ones we'll find there. And we'll heat map that and we'll figure out, you know, where, where are the points that can be, you know, changed that will have the most impact on the value of the business.


Whether there's an exit in the cards in the next two years, five years, 10 years, it really doesn't matter. The business is just gonna be better, I think. And really, we, we, you know, we dedicate somewhere between two and four hours to just gathering the data and several more hours analyzing it and, and bringing it back. So we really think that that's, that's this one of the strongest things we can do to help a, a business owner. So if you're viewing this and, and you know, you can really get a feel that you really want to know where your company stands, you can go to mastery partners.com and, and learn more.


So we hope that this conversation today with, with, with Gil and Scott really has given you clarity to, to lead with purpose within your company. Guys, I thank you so much for your time and expertise. You know, we're, we're all kind of the same generation, so we think we're smart and, and wise and, and, and hopefully others do too.


Scott Couchenour (38m 2s): We're just as delusional as the next guy. Yeah, that could


Dave Casey (38m 5s): Be it. That could be it. And if you're a business owner, they're viewing this, you know, just thanks for tuning in and we're, we have a succession of these. We'll be putting out podcasts pretty much every week for the rest of, of 2026. And next week is gonna be an interesting one as well, is why do buyers, or what do buyers see in financials that I don't, you know, so we're gonna dive in a little bit of the financial side of that. So make sure you subscribe to the podcast so you don't miss Great question. Until next time, we want everyone to just keep maximizing business value.


Thanks guys. Thank you. Thank you.


Tom Bronson (38m 46s): Thanks for joining us for another episode of the Maximize Business Value Podcast. I hope today's conversation sparked new ideas on how you can continue driving value in your business. But remember, it's not just about listening, it's about taking massive action. Visit our website mastery partners.com for more resources. Grab a copy of any of the books in the Maximize Business Value series on Amazon or via the links below.


And don't hesitate to reach out if you want to know how to apply these concepts to your business. So until next time, I'm Tom Bronson reminding you to relentlessly execute while you Maximize Business Value.