Profile Secrets from Australia's Leading LinkedIn Profile Specialist - Karen Tisdell.

Karen Tisdell, is probably Australia's leading LinkedIn profile specialist. Karen has been ranked one of the top LinkedIn trainers across APAC and has been included on many 'best of lists' over the years  

Karen is in high demand and highly successful.  

In this episode Karen takes us deep into the various parts of our profile that, whilst on the surface, might look to be unimportant, actually have a big impact on how we are perceived by others on the platform.  

When you ask someone for a meeting/ conversation , Sales force say 83% of people view your profile as part of their research to decide whether to have that conversation or not. Your profile is the key to ensuring you get that yes.  

There is no surprise that every single person we've had on the podcast has said – it all starts with a great profile.   

So, the question begs, what do we do and how do we do that?  

Karen, takes us through the main components step-by-step. This is a lovely 'explainer' for those of you who need to build a profile OR a good checklist for those who THINK they have a great profile already. I must admit to going back into my profile after listening to this episode and making a few changes myself.  

Before we jump into the chat with Karen, I need to say thank you to all of you who continue to support the podcast. The listener base is growing and we are keen to get the message out. Please like, share these episodes to help others find us. And of course a big thank you to our corporate supporter @Bonjoro  

 Karen Tisdell
https://www.linkedin.com/in/karentisdell/ 

Mark McInnes
https://www.linkedin.com/in/mark-mcinnes/ 

Mark McInnes - Sales Training
www.Markmc.co 

www.Bonjoro.com 
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Transcript

EP 13 - Karen Tisdell

Mark McInnes: [00:00:00] Welcome to the boss podcast. Today, we have Karen Tisdell. Thank you for joining us.

[00:00:04] Karen Tisdell: [00:00:04] Great to be here.

[00:00:06] Mark McInnes: [00:00:06] Karen you're ranked one of the top LinkedIn trainers across APAC. Congratulations. I know you've been on numerous top LinkedIn lists across the years or these lists. I usually peer driven.

[00:00:19] So it means you not only know what you're doing, but others who also know what they're doing, respect what you do. I think that's important. Congratulations.

[00:00:27] Karen Tisdell: [00:00:27] Thank you. Thank you very much. It's been quite a long journey. What is it that quote, nine years of, of hard work equals overnight success? Something like that.

[00:00:37] Mark McInnes: [00:00:37] Yeah, exactly. And we've cross paths from time to time. We've been in the same LinkedIn circles if you like for quite a few years. So it's nice to finally chat and it's also nice to have another Australian on the podcast. So in the last few episodes, we've been all over the world, which has meant recording podcasts at crazy times in the morning and at night.

[00:00:56] So it's nice to have a conversation at a comparable time of day. So thank you very much. Well, Karen, would you like to share a little bit about yourself? Give us some background on what did you do and your organization for the listeners?

[00:01:11] Karen Tisdell: [00:01:11] Sure. Absolutely. well, you know, what I really love about your podcast is that you deep dive into a lot of the things that I'm really interested into that primarily being around sales people, marketing as in the psychology of why people buy, And, I also love writing, so I'm a LinkedIn profile writer, but my love for sales actually began many, many, many years ago as a telemarketer.

[00:01:34] So I used to work as a telemarketer in the early 1990s. It was one of my first jobs, selling Willowbrook, encyclopedias, cause literally you remember that advertising space for a newspaper. Do you remember newspapers, Mark?

[00:01:54] Mark McInnes: [00:01:54] Newspapers actually.

[00:01:55] Karen Tisdell: [00:01:55] Oh, interesting. That was sort of my, my early foray into sales. and then I got into recruitment, which is of course sales, you know, selling people. and I did recruitment for 14 years. It was while I was in recruitment that I started using LinkedIn. I was an early adopter in 2005. You tend to head hunt for people.

[00:02:14] And I realized then that how you show up professionally really impacts your success. Your future success. and so in 2009 in our last recession in the GFC, I launched a business writing LinkedIn profiles, and then, you know, about 2014, 2007, that became training as well. So I've got those two sort of sides.

[00:02:35]and the training is really around the foundational stuff of, have you got your profile? Correct. You know, it's amazing how many people are not even linked to the company that they work for. I haven't got company details, contact, details all over their profile. You know, I'm not talking about their customers' problems, that sort of stuff.

[00:02:52] So those are the two sides of what I do.

[00:02:55] Mark McInnes: [00:02:55] Yeah. So I'm looking forward to getting into those in a bit more detail a bit. What might you launch a business at? in 2009, what was it? 2008, 2009. What was going on?

[00:03:04] Karen Tisdell: [00:03:04] Well, actually, I was, I was lucky. I went on maternity leave when the GFC just hit. And, my last conversation in the office was with one of the various senior managers who had come down and take me into another room. And I thought it was a bit, you know, serious. Like I'm only going on maternity leave.

[00:03:21] And she said, GFCs here. We are going to lay off 30% of our workforce. And we just want to have a chat to you about how you think some people are performing and you know, where you think I'd done a little bit of sales training and flying around Australia, doing some training on, kind of cold calling people and converting people.

[00:03:40] And, And so it was on maternity leave that I just started writing LinkedIn profiles or was sort of stuck at home on maternity leave, covered in baby vomit and just had a running profile. And literally, yeah. Instead of figuring out a half notch, a face to face business, and that took me a while to figure out.

[00:03:56] But, yeah, I'm not from Sydney originally. I'm originally from Perth, so. When I went on maternity leave, you know, I'd only been living in Sydney for 18 months. I didn't know a lot of people. So I spent a lot of time, not just writing profiles, but also building my network, you know, building referral networks and affiliate networks.

[00:04:15] If you like, you know, who do I know who is selling to clients that I'd like to write profiles for? You know, that sort of stuff. So.

[00:04:24] Mark McInnes: [00:04:24] Yeah. It's, it's, it's interesting. Like nearly everybody that I talk to has got this and that, and of course the people that I talked to a very, very, very, very good at at LinkedIn and nearly everybody has gone, I was just in this position where I needed to grow my business and I needed to do it quickly.

[00:04:40] And LinkedIn's provided the best vehicle for me to do that. And I think that's what you're basically saying

[00:04:46] Karen Tisdell: [00:04:46] Yeah, I was, I was so lucky, you know, I was looking at websites and you know, we're going back so long now, 2009 says, you know, what, what is a couple of lifetimes away? I had a couple of children since then, and they're quite big. Well, one of them's almost older than me. So, you know, me, if I had had a lot of money on my business, you know, I probably would have gone out and spent a lot of money on a website, but I thought, Oh, I don't know.

[00:05:10] I'll just, you know, play on LinkedIn. It's no cost. Cost, you know, it costs us time. and, and I made a lot of mistakes. Thanks. And in terms of networking and stuff like that. But I think as an early adopter, I've managed to watch its evolution, you know, and see why do people connect with those people and what sort of content flyers or what sort of words work and, and that sort of stuff.

[00:05:31] So, yeah, I think when your back's against the wall, that's when it's time to pivot and change, isn't it.

[00:05:38] Mark McInnes: [00:05:38] Yeah. Yeah, no, look I have, I absolutely agree. I think that's, that's true. And, and so, and I'm interested in that sort of sweet. In recruiting. So when did you notice that the platform sort of changed from being really bad CVS or just a place where you held your CV and you just listed your, your, your, your jobs to, to that sort of more about being a people call it like a mini micro site for yourself professionally.

[00:06:05] When, when did you think you saw that change?

[00:06:07] Karen Tisdell: [00:06:07] Well, I was really pushing that change in 2009. And I had so many people say, Oh, it's just a resume. And we need to write in the third person and talk about myself as if I'm not really to self, And so it's probably been about the last six years. And I think since Microsoft bought LinkedIn, you know, they've spent a lot of money trying to push marketers to recognize LinkedIn as a B to B platform that works really well in attracting commercial sales.

[00:06:37] And so I think that that's really helped as well. People are. Have got the company buy it and they're not like, Oh, if I'm on LinkedIn, my boss, will they come looking for a job? They're like, well, if I'm not on LinkedIn, my boss is going to give me a hard time because I have no presence and I need that channel for LinkedIn.

[00:06:54] So I think it's really been since Microsoft really go behind pushing LinkedIn down Ave, you know, just sort of supplement that, that shrinking recruitment. Practice, you know, LinkedIn newsfeed, a lot of it's revenue from recruitment, but now a lot of it comes from beta B.

[00:07:11] Mark McInnes: [00:07:11] Yeah, absolutely. Yeah. And I, and I, and I think, there's massive upside for Microsoft in relation to the data management and the CRM component. You know, I do feel like LinkedIn is letting itself down in, in that it could be a better CRM. It could be a, you know, it could really make it easy for small and medium businesses to not have to leave this LinkedIn at all.

[00:07:32]and I just don't know why they haven't quite got there. Somebody smarter than me will know the answer to that. But, but it just feels to me like as a small business owner, I could just about live on LinkedIn. If it was had some CRM functionality and you see some of those automation tools have got, you know, that we shouldn't use, they've got CRM, we've got a CRM automation involved.

[00:07:52] So it can't be too difficult if they can do it. LinkedIn can do it anywhere.

[00:07:56] Karen Tisdell: [00:07:56] absolutely. But that automation thing, you know, that's, that's so interesting. It is in breach of, of LinkedIn's terms and it can result in people having their accounts shut down. So yeah, they really do need to fill in that gap. They do.

[00:08:09] Mark McInnes: [00:08:09] Yeah. So I'm actually doing a bunch of research. That's going to be one of my future topics, automation and technology. But anyway, we're talking to a profile expert, Karen. So, why is having a great profile important? And of course, I've got some feelings about that, but let's hear from you. and, and what are some of the things that we should not be doing?

[00:08:25] And some of the things that we should be doing, would you mind sharing some stuff?

[00:08:28] Karen Tisdell: [00:08:28] Well, I'm actually going to go back to an episode that you did with Dan Disney. And I love Dan Disney's comment. If you don't have a great profile, you've got a bucket full of holes. And I was like, yes, you, they just absolutely nailed it. So many people spend a lot of time, particularly salespeople who have that real bias for action, trying to develop outreach programs.

[00:08:52] And how do I do this and how do I do that? And what about this? And what about that? But that foundational LinkedIn profile, you know, that's what people look at that's if and how they remember you. So I think it always comes back to the if and how we think we're far more memorable than we really are, but you know, it was a sales person.

[00:09:13] How, how do you stand out? How do you differentiate? You know, when they're looking at your product, is it converting them? So, so to me, that's why, yeah, it's just so important. And I think Dan captured that perfectly fucking the polls. If you don't have a great profile,

[00:09:28] Mark McInnes: [00:09:28] Yeah. And I've seen you talk about the 83% statistic in some other bits and pieces. We want to share a little bit around

[00:09:35] Karen Tisdell: [00:09:35] that's a Salesforce statistics. So, Salesforce, have an article, that is about, I'm going to guess about, about 14 months old now, which said that 83% of people look at your LinkedIn profile before deciding, before making a buying decision. Are they going to meet with you? Maybe the sales person and so 83%.

[00:09:59] So it's just so foundational to get that LinkedIn profile, right. To make sure that, you know, it really is talking about your customer's problems. I think a lot of salespeople can write their LinkedIn profile as if it's, a vanity exercise. How do I want to be seen by me? Actually, and they're talking about sales and, Dan touched on something about the president's club, you know, people, and actually that's missing the whole point.

[00:10:27] It's, it's not about you. It's about what your audience wants to see. So, you know, making your client, your customer, the hero, I knew the trusted guide.

[00:10:38] Mark McInnes: [00:10:38] Yeah. Yeah. And I think it's very hard. Well, I know for a fact, it's very hard to, to write in the, you know, write your own profile writer information about yourself. it's, it's, it's incredibly difficult to, to be able to, you know, remove yourself enough to be subjective and provide. Information. That's going to be valuable for your clients when you're writing it about yourself.

[00:11:03] It's really hard. It feels like you're boasting. It feels like you're leaving things out. You're not really sure how it's going to come across. It's fraught with danger.

[00:11:10] Karen Tisdell: [00:11:10] Yeah, that boasting is a really interesting one. I think a lot of, a lot of us, you know, feel like we need to use lots of adjectives. You know, we need to talk about how we're unique and extraordinary. And I think adjectives. Just people use too many describing words in their about section. It shouldn't be about boasting.

[00:11:30]so I think when we put ourselves in the shoes of our customers, like you would, when you're doing a pitch, like you would, when, a customer says, you know, tell me about this. You know, so you're always asking the right questions and you know, what are your customer's problems? And then talking to those problems.

[00:11:48] So I think if we start. With our mind from our customer's point of view, you know, what are their problems and get a pen and paper out, you know, what are all of our customer's problems? Let's just mind map those and then start from there. How do you solve those problems? So sort of using a formula of who do I help, how do I help?

[00:12:07] And what's the result and weaving those three things all through your profile.

[00:12:13] Mark McInnes: [00:12:13] Yep. Love it. Do you, do you have any data, in relation to how long people take to make decisions, you know, when they look at your profile and where they, where they spend their time?

[00:12:23] Karen Tisdell: [00:12:23] Yeah, that's a great question. Mark Schaefer, wrote a book that talked about influence and it's, it's not a very great statistic. I'm afraid two and a half years. He reckons two and a half years to. Really leveraged to the point where everybody's seeing it was a thought leader and wants to do business with you, which doesn't quite answer your question.

[00:12:50] Your question was, you know, what's the time difference between buying and sometimes people are early in their buying journey. Sometimes they'll see your profile answers, all my questions. Great. I want to buy right now. All the people, you know, I had a client reach out recently and I'm working on her profile.

[00:13:06] She and I met in 2015. She doesn't meet her in the meeting me, but yeah, she's seen my content. She's seen me repeatedly pop up on LinkedIn. And so she was like, I need my profile written. And I was like, Oh my gosh, you know, I remember the meeting, you weren't thinking I'd love to write a profile. She was like, Oh, did we meet?

[00:13:26] So, you know, I mean that's years ago, so I think. It depends on where they in, in their buying journey, you know, and, and what are those statistics? You know, they say sort of only 3% of the marketer ready to buy now, isn't it 3% and 7%? no, they have a problem, but they're still researching a solution and 30% know they have a problem, but it's not a priority.

[00:13:46] And you know, some of them don't have a problem yet. So I think it depends on where they are in that journey.

[00:13:54] Mark McInnes: [00:13:54] Yeah. And what about the, why people read profiles? Do you know how long is there any data available on? I'm asking these questions without any notice. Karen, so good on you.

[00:14:09] Karen Tisdell: [00:14:09] I knew you would ask me, I'm like, do you think it's 30%? I'm like, I know it's stripes in I've written it down. Cause I knew you would ask me that.

[00:14:18] Mark McInnes: [00:14:18] But, so if someone looks at your profile, do you know, do we know how long they look at your profile for and what areas of your profile they spend most time online? Is there any data available around that? I know there was some data about 10 years ago. I'm talking about heat maps, for example. Is there anything, is there anything new?

[00:14:38] Karen Tisdell: [00:14:38] No, I haven't seen anything like that. but. We do need to keep in mind how LinkedIn is used. And so when we look at what people remember the most, your professional headline, the bit that sits underneath your name, which if you haven't changed, it is just your position title. That is so, so, so visible used to be 120 characters.

[00:15:03] It's now expanded to 220, And the reason why that's visible. I unfortunately haven't got data or heat maps, but what we do know is that piece follows you around. Every time you comment on something, every time you interact with somebody, they see your face, they see your headline.

[00:15:21] Mark McInnes: [00:15:21] Yep.

[00:15:22] Karen Tisdell: [00:15:22] critical piece to get right.

[00:15:24] Mark McInnes: [00:15:24] So what would be some guidelines that you provide people in relation to getting that headline? Right. Do you have a little formula or something like that to help

[00:15:30] Karen Tisdell: [00:15:30] Yeah, again, it's the, who do you help? How do you help? And what's the result and playing with those three, you know, who do I serve? you know, how do you help? And, and what's the result and playing with those so that you're mixing the orders. So it sounds right. And by sounding right, I'm really looking for.

[00:15:49] Alliteration. So have I, can I use two words, that stuff, the same letter? okay. Can I, you know, just, just roll off the tongue. So, so I kind of got it. Yeah. And actually who's a lawyer who, whose profile I finished. we wrote helping recruitment agencies become unstoppable by making legal stress-free complicated without costing the earth. So you're talking about who you serve. He serves recruiting agencies. What does he do? What makes them unstoppable? How does he do that? By making legal stress-free and uncomplicated, and it doesn't cost the earth. So looking at those three, who do you help? How do you help what's result and just switching it around?

[00:16:30] Mark McInnes: [00:16:30] Yeah. Good, good, good tips there. I found, I was actually connected to a gentleman this morning from the U S from Pennsylvania, and I just want to share his headline because I think it was, was really clever. And so his name is Vinny and I've sent him a message this morning, congratulating him on his headline and he's headline is paper jam storyteller.

[00:16:49] Toner spill counselor black belt in control plus P

[00:16:55] Karen Tisdell: [00:16:55] I love 

[00:16:55] karen-tisdell-linkedin_recording-1_2020-07-13--t01-34-50am--karen: [00:16:55] that.

[00:16:56] Mark McInnes: [00:16:56] so he's clearly, he's a photocopy guy, you know, he helps people.

[00:17:02] Karen Tisdell: [00:17:02] he does what just sells your photo, but it's all about the service, making sure there's no spills. So really strong visual words are really, really, really great, woods. And to try to keep it as simple as possible, you know, I'm removing all those adjectives. No extraordinary, no unique. And please don't talk about being a sales person, the moment you had in your headline.

[00:17:23] You know, business development, sales, you're instantly flagging what you do. And so I think we're so attuned now to just switching off to just, you know, I'm being sold at what, you know, as opposed to I have a problem, where's my solution. Everybody's looking. Yeah. And what I love about LinkedIn is that they're already in that mindset, you know, they're not.

[00:17:48] On Facebook, sort of trying to connect with their friends and thinking about leisure time, they're already thinking about their work problems. So if you can talk about their work problems and how you solve them, you know, they're, they're already there. They're already in that head mindset.

[00:18:03] Mark McInnes: [00:18:03] Yep. Yeah. If I see one more sales manager with a headline in a building high performing sales teams, I'm going to scream. so, so what other sort of tactical, so that's the headline? What else should we be looking at? We we're looking at profile pictures. I mean, if you've got some tips system, some really strong stuff around there to help us out.

[00:18:21] Karen Tisdell: [00:18:21] Yeah, thank you for asking that. again, this is so foundational and it might seem obvious and people like, I don't need to know about it, a profile photo, but so many people, especially salespeople will have a profile photo that is a torso. And their face. So it's there, you know, almost a half body or a whole body shot, and we'll have to remember human science.

[00:18:43] We trust people when we can look in their eyes. So don't show me a picture. Your eyes are just so tiny. I can't look in them and don't be at a wedding wearing sunglasses and not, you've seen some right.

[00:18:59] Mark McInnes: [00:18:59] Yep.

[00:18:59] Karen Tisdell: [00:18:59] We're trying to build trust here. So it's not about looking. Really handsome. It's about looking approachable. Like somebody can trust you, you know, and having that really close, like head shot, you can look in their eyes. So make sure that the cameras that you're actually looking in the camera's eyes, you don't want to be looking over your shoulder or turning away, or, you know, something like that.

[00:19:23] You want to be actually be looking at the person directly. Chin Dan's really important. And that might sound strange, but a lot of people put their chin up when they're about to have their photo taken. And for a woman that can look like they're looking down their nose at you and from the man that looks like you're about to enter a boxing ring, you know, like I'm going to take you on, you know, you want to have that chin down.

[00:19:43] So you're sort of leaning into listen to your prospect.

[00:19:47] Mark McInnes: [00:19:47] I love this. I mean, this is a really good tip and I think this is very underwriter.

[00:19:53] Karen Tisdell: [00:19:53] Yeah. People are like odd. I need to think about a photo and I'm like, yes, because it's how you make your prospects feel.

[00:20:01] Mark McInnes: [00:20:01] Karen, I don't have $200 to go and get a professional to take my photo. What should I do instead?

[00:20:06] Karen Tisdell: [00:20:06] Great, absolutely take a headshot at home. It doesn't matter about the background. You can use an app called remove.bg, and you know, if you've got a really ugly brick wall behind you. It'll remove all of that and it'll change the color of that background to match whatever you want. make sure that you're looking in the camera.

[00:20:26] So you've got to have a light behind the camera shining into your eyes. So you want to light up your eyes. You want to have a slight smile or a big smile. Either one is fine. Slight. your chin down and a slight head tilt will make you look just that little bit more empathetic, which might not be appropriate depending on the type of sales we're doing.

[00:20:45] So think about what are the products you're selling, how empathetic do you need to appear?

[00:20:52] Mark McInnes: [00:20:52] Yeah. And people might think that we're getting a bit nitpicky here. you know, like make sure your head's down, no background, but, but my experience says, and I'm looking for some support. You know, my experience is that people make a decision, whether they're going to trust you or engage with you extremely quickly on social media.

[00:21:12] You know, so if I can't see your eyes, if I can't see your face, if you're there with your partner and you can't figure out exactly what it is that you do or how you raise you and I might be connected, then it's really easy to just ignore that connection request or ignore your message. so I think these little things that you're sharing with us whilst they're little, they're actually very significant.

[00:21:34] Karen Tisdell: [00:21:34] Yeah, because it's all those little bits that make a hole. And I think, you know, we have to remember here, humans are hardwired to look for patterns. So if they are reading a headline that talks about them being an extraordinary, you know, leader of sales teams, and then they've got a, you've got a photo of you wearing mirrored sunglasses with a Carnation in Europe.

[00:21:57]you know, buttonhole and you know, and then they're reading the about section and it's all in the third person. You're so you're talking about yourself. Like you're not yourself, like you're too important to connect with somebody directly and they need to connect with your secretary. You know, that's how it reads.

[00:22:14] If they're saying, you know, you know my name and I, you know, it feels very disconnected. They're not going to feel. Warm. So it's about connecting all of those dots. So they ask more details, but the small details create the feeling of the whole.

[00:22:30] Mark McInnes: [00:22:30] No good stuff. So is there anything else on the, on your profile picture or should we go somewhere else

[00:22:35] Karen Tisdell: [00:22:35] I think we can go somewhere else.

[00:22:38] Mark McInnes: [00:22:38] next year? The superstar, where's the next thing that

[00:22:40] Karen Tisdell: [00:22:40] Not about section, make sure we have one. Some people don't even have an about section.

[00:22:45] Mark McInnes: [00:22:45] So how do we get one? If we don't have one.

[00:22:47] Karen Tisdell: [00:22:47] Click on, add new profile section,

[00:22:51] Mark McInnes: [00:22:51] Yep.

[00:22:51] Karen Tisdell: [00:22:51] which is just on the right hand side. And you'll have two buttons there and just click on, add new profile section. And it's either add about, or add summary in some parts of LinkedIn it's called about in other parts, it's called summary.

[00:23:04] It used to be called a summary, but they've changed it to about, and I think, I'm a bit obsessed with words, but. The fact that they've called it and about this is about who you are and it's about the problems you solve. It's not a summary of every single job you've ever done. you know, so I really love, you know, sort of where it, again, it's talking to the customer's problems, it's talking to how you solve those problems.

[00:23:30] And critically, it's talking about why you're interested in those problems. If you're selling, software as a service, you know, what interests you about that? Well, why that, you know, if you're selling people, if you're a recruiter, you know, well, my, that, you know, what is it that interests you about your space?

[00:23:47] And I think you need to be very genuine, you know, you need to show that authentic interest. You know, I use my accountant because my accountant is really interested in tax, you know, I mean, Lovely guy, but you know, Adrian's that my accountant, it's the kind of guy he'd stay up at 10, 11 o'clock at night going, Oh, tax manual.

[00:24:05] Must read one more page. You know, so that's not my interest, but I love that it's his interest.

[00:24:11] Mark McInnes: [00:24:11] Yep. It seems like we have the same text account because mine's also known Adrian and he also loves text. So it wouldn't that be ironic. so I often get a bit of pushback when I asked people to put their contact details inside this part of their profile. What's your theory on that?

[00:24:27] Karen Tisdell: [00:24:27] Yes, absolutely. now what's the statistic for you? I know who said the statistic? Rebecca Lieb. So Rebecca Lieb, L I E B, wrote a book on websites. About 11, 12 years ago. And it was something like 70 center website, something like that. 70% of websites fail because people can't find the contact details, no contact details, no purchase.

[00:24:56] You know, Tim Hyde has found various yeah. studies as well. So he did, worked with a client and they had all of these, and it was what, $200,000 worth of sales sitting in shopping carts. And when they reached out and said to clients, you know, why didn't you close your shopping cart on your eBay business?

[00:25:13]they said, Oh, well, I just had a phone query. I just wanted to call somebody and ask about something, but it was too hard for the tech guys to put. An email address and a phone number in the order, so they didn't do it. And so I think when you look at stats like that, and you think of yourself as the person who's going to sell this product or service, you're the mediator.

[00:25:36] You need to flatten the path to make it easy for customers to do business with you. Then you're not constantly relying on outreach, but people are looking at your profile and going, wow, this person is. Solves all my problems. I'm picking up the phone right now and asking how much

[00:25:56] Mark McInnes: [00:25:56] Yep. Yeah. I think that's important. And a lot of 'em excuse my camera.

[00:26:05] I think that's important because a lot of, Engineers, a lot of technical people are real Lockton to be contacted. So when they're building these platforms, they leave the contact details out because they're thinking about themselves, not thinking like the customer service or the sales agent. And I go so far as to say that you can prove that LinkedIn was built by engineers, by the way, that standard LinkedIn connection thing is worded.

[00:26:29] Karen Tisdell: [00:26:29] Yeah, absolutely. And also the fact that the connection button is so well hidden. Although I think that that might actually be a deliberate move. And by the connection button, sorry, I'm talking about the contact information section. So many people haven't even completed the contact info section. They have their personal email address in there and that's it, you know, so if you want to be connected to your clients, you know, you can put in there your instant message address.

[00:26:57] You certainly should, should be putting in there, your website, and most people don't, you know, making yourself as an accessible, as possible by putting as much information in there and putting it in your about section. And in my headline, I've got my email address. and since I put my email address in my headline, which is.

[00:27:14] Coming up to close from about two years ago, massive increase in emails that come through. and yes, I do get spam, but also get all my clients through LinkedIn. So I think in a span, this is, you know, receiving yeah. Incoming inquiries, you know, I know what matters the most to me, I can put up with a bit of span and can either filter it out.

[00:27:38] So I think it's really important to be accessible. So important flatten that club.

[00:27:43] Mark McInnes: [00:27:43] Yeah. So in your own personal business, I want, I want to explore this a little bit. Is LinkedIn your only strategy or do you have alternative inbound strategy or marketing plans as well?

[00:27:54] Karen Tisdell: [00:27:54] He's my only strategy. I actually even went through a branding crisis last year and pulled down a website. So I didn't even have a website at the moment, Mark. And I've still, you know, with all of this, you know, this thing was COVID, I've been busier than ever, and it is all through ninteen all that.

[00:28:15] Mark McInnes: [00:28:15] Yep. Okay. That's great. That's great to hear. I completely agree. I do have a website just to be clear. Okay. So is there anything else, you know, what we've missed? What about the background?

[00:28:26] Karen Tisdell: [00:28:26] The background banner. So that's another place that you can put contact details in there. I really like having an email in there, even if it's inquiries at, and again, you can have a website address in there. so 60% of click throughs. two websites come from social. So it's important to make sure that you have got everything as accessible as possible.

[00:28:45] So, because customers want to do research these days, you know, they want to know who are they buying from and what they're buying. So trying to make it sort of as accessible as possible. What I really do like and background band, it's also a visual of what it is you do. So if you can, and I'm not talking collecting lots of money or whatever sales, but I'm talking about what are your customer's problems look like?

[00:29:08] So when I've been working with Slims and they do, a recycling, you know, we've got images there of, you know, a dewy leaf. So it looks all very sort of planet and sustainable, but we're also in an image of recycling in there. So. You know, what are your customer's problems look like? You know, if you're selling printers or photocopiers have some movement with the photocopies, what you don't want to have in your background, banner is an image of the beach, because that just tells me when you're on holiday.

[00:29:37] Mark McInnes: [00:29:37] Yep. We're still based in Sydney and you've got a picture of the San Francisco, the golden gate bridge, as soon as I say that, I'll just assume you're in San Francisco.

[00:29:47] Karen Tisdell: [00:29:47] Absolutely. Most people put the city that they're in. but I would think that it's so easy to get an image of your product. And again, an image of your product get an image of something. You know, what you're selling is a product you can't see like cloud technology. It is so easy on Google to get some free images of, you know,

[00:30:09] Mark McInnes: [00:30:09] W one of the best ones I've seen and I want to share with you. And also the rest of the listeners was a gentleman that I was working with was selling, like payment apps, you know, like the, you know, the F POS machine that's correct term for, for hotel hotels, specializing in hotels, pubs restaurants. And he had a photo of himself in an alleyway in Sydney with all the beak MTB kegs stacked up behind him.

[00:30:33] And. And considering his target market was pubs and clubs. I just thought that worked really well. Like, you know, as soon as you saw his profile, even though you may not understand what the technology was. Cause you know, these companies have got, you know, XYZ payments. Yeah. And you've got, and who you're attracted to.

[00:30:49] And I've just that stuck with me that must've been three or four years ago, but you know, I think that's a really terrific example. have you got any others like that, that stand out.

[00:30:58] Karen Tisdell: [00:30:58] Really great example. well, I'd hope that all of the work that I, my team do, I've got a team of graphic designers and they design background Venice. And sometimes we'll pick out key words, you know? So what are the words that resonate with their audience? but you know, it's so easy to just look at images of what it is you do, and create some images around that in the dimensions and, and ensure that it's also, that you're making it, you're making the font big enough so that it can be read on mobile.

[00:31:28] I think that's something a lot of other people forget. Sometimes people try to cram too much in there. And simple as best

[00:31:35] Mark McInnes: [00:31:35] guilty myself at times. Yes.

[00:31:38] Karen Tisdell: [00:31:38] you're in section as well. You know? so we haven't touched on the experience section and I think that's also a massively underutilized area where Eddie so easy to pull words from your company website, you know, you don't even have to write them yourself. that talk about. What your, what the business does, what does the business do?

[00:31:58] What does that look like? Do you know? So where's your about section is talking about your customers' problems and why you're interested in those problems, how you solve them and what the result is that experience section. Can be written more like a website in that it's a little bit more distant. It's not talking about, you know, you're interested in technology because of this or whatever.

[00:32:21]you know, but it's telling up talking about the problems and again, having contact details in there, you know, and if you're worried about. Receiving tons of spam. And I wouldn't be because I think spam versus opportunities, you know, at least have, you know, info at email address, you know, you really want to be as accessible as possible.

[00:32:41] So I think that's another important space that I think people should really focus on.

[00:32:46] Mark McInnes: [00:32:46] Okay. Th th this has been good. So I liked the way how we're so granular here, you know, like a lot of people would just brush over this stuff. So let's summarize for everyone. and then I'll ask you a couple more questions if that's okay. So background needs to be representative of the organization that you work for or what you, what you do, and preferably with some contact details.

[00:33:04] Karen Tisdell: [00:33:04] Yes. So email or a website address.

[00:33:07] Mark McInnes: [00:33:07] Yep. Picture no background, you know, really just your face and the top of your shoulders. Nothing further than that, just, you know, sunglasses looking down. and we've got a tool called remove BG to do that. I'll put that in the show notes, headline should be who you help, how you help them and the results that YouTube as a result.

[00:33:29] Karen Tisdell: [00:33:29] Yes,

[00:33:30]Mark McInnes: [00:33:30] And then the about section or summary should be written in first person. And it should be similar talking about why you help people and how you help them is like,

[00:33:37] Karen Tisdell: [00:33:37] absolutely. Always in first person don't ever talk about yourself. Like you're not yourself. You really want to make people feel that you are likable and approachable.

[00:33:46] Mark McInnes: [00:33:46] And then we come down to the experience section, which is where we brought a little bit more like a marketing speak, if you like, or a website.

[00:33:53] Karen Tisdell: [00:33:53] Absolutely just to get a little bit more granular again. so with that about section, another thing that I'd think about doing in that section, particularly cause the experience section can literally be a cut and paste from the website. And then you give that to everybody who works in your organization. You also give everybody who works in your organization, access to the background better. I designed this for our company cause we don't have one. You guys could all have it. And then that increases brand footprint, but without a bounce section, I think it's really important to use strong words and keeping in mind.

[00:34:26] What your customers want and putting yourself in your custody, ms. Shoes, making sure you've got really strong words that talk about what it is you do. And so by strong words, I'm thinking about, not having words like responsible for, or ability to, you know, whenever I see ability to, it's a bit cheeky, but, 

[00:34:44] Mark McInnes: [00:34:44] Well, I might not have.

[00:34:49] Karen Tisdell: [00:34:49] Yeah. I always say, I always say knowing my husband has an ability to unpack the dishwasher. Like I know, I know the DNA will get what I'm saying, right. Just because you have an ability to do it doesn't mean you do it. So what we really want to have is words that make us feel from our customer's perspective.

[00:35:09] Like we are a safe pair of hands, so delivered, built. Grew it identify enhanced, collaborated, you know, re negotiated, aligned, drove really strong action words.

[00:35:26] Mark McInnes: [00:35:26] You know, Karen, I think it'd be worthwhile if you're open to it, to get you back to and go even deeper and sort of explain how some of these words work and then why they're more influential than others, what we should do and what we couldn't do that might be a bit of a nerdy, super nerdy topic for people like you.

[00:35:43] And.

[00:35:48] Karen Tisdell: [00:35:48] Okay.

[00:35:48] Mark McInnes: [00:35:48] So I've got a couple of questions and we'll close this out for everybody. So the question I'll ask everybody is LinkedIn in particular social media, you know, finding opportunities on LinkedIn, do you think we've seen the best of times or, or is it getting better? Is there more blue sky ahead? What are your thoughts?

[00:36:09] Karen Tisdell: [00:36:09] I try not to use words like better. Yeah, because I think in days what it is, you know, you, yeah. I quite like the olden days when, you know, they would just only articles and there were no videos and I was really great for me cause I'm a writer. So I really stood out, you know, cause I could write really great content and nobody else was writing.

[00:36:30]now we've got video. and you've got some incredibly great PayPal, you know, sales paper always graded a video, even if they think they're not, they are always amazing because you know, they've got that charisma then I had to present just takes a bit of practice session. So I think what we have now and what we will have in the future is just lower barriers to entry. So with that might come some stuff that you don't like seeing. So it's really important while you're on the newsfeed to click on those three buttons are three dots on the, on the right hand side of each piece of content. If you don't like it, click on those three dots and click on. So you don't keep seeing that stuff in your news feed.

[00:37:10] It's not going to be disconnect you from anybody. It's not going to block anybody. You'll still remain connected, but you're not going to keep having that stuff in your newsfeed. 

[00:37:19] Mark McInnes: [00:37:19] Yeah.

[00:37:20] Karen Tisdell: [00:37:20] Yeah, I think it's just about lower barriers to entry. And I think we're just going to see increasing lower barriers to entry and to get a little bit granular on that.

[00:37:27] How exciting stories are using stories for sales at all yet?

[00:37:32] Mark McInnes: [00:37:32] Stories? No, I haven't. I do have, I do have it, but I haven't. I mean, I don't use stories on Instagram either. Not that I'm big on Instagram, but,

[00:37:40] Karen Tisdell: [00:37:40] Instagram again on real thought about stories. So I've done like two stories. I'm not excited for myself about stories. and I don't think that behind the scenes, but LinkedIn profile is really that compelling. I mean it is to me, but not to anybody else, but I think this has fantastic potential for sales, particularly for those organizations that are.

[00:38:00]confined around TGA guidelines. Yeah. Less pharmaceutical companies. Well there's medical companies that cannot talk about products on the internet because it's in breachable or those guidelines. You can create a story because the stories that the new feature that only goes out to people who are in your network are following you.

[00:38:21] So it's like an email really.

[00:38:23] Mark McInnes: [00:38:23] Hi. Kay. That's great. So it can't go any more viral account leak out, so to speak.

[00:38:29] Karen Tisdell: [00:38:29] No, it falls under the same guidelines as emails today,

[00:38:33] Mark McInnes: [00:38:33] And how long did they hang around for do they last for a long cause I know with Instagram, if you go back.

[00:38:38] Karen Tisdell: [00:38:38] something really, really, really short.

[00:38:41] Mark McInnes: [00:38:41] Alright, we should figure out how to use that more effectively. That'd be good. What would be your, if so, if you could, we've got bunch of people listening to this and thank you listeners for listening. What would be their one takeaway from listening to Karen? What would be the single most powerful message that you could give people listening to this podcast?

[00:38:59] Karen Tisdell: [00:38:59] Talk about your customer's problems. It's not about you. It's all about them. You want to be the Yoda to their Skywalker.

[00:39:10] Mark McInnes: [00:39:10] Love it. That's fantastic. That's a great takeaway. All right, Karen. So, my guess is you'd be interested in getting in contact with people, particularly people who might need a hand with their profile, that sort of thing. What's the best way for people to be able to do that.

[00:39:22] Karen Tisdell: [00:39:22] Arlington, you know, we're gonna find one

[00:39:27] anywhere else. I keep thinking I must get onto Twitter. So Twitter sort of been on my agenda.  that's a really, I think Twitter is interesting. but absolutely look me up on, on LinkedIn. please do note, I've just got the weirdest spelling of my last name. So last name is T I S D E double L. So please look me up Karen Tisdale.

[00:39:45] Mark McInnes: [00:39:45] Great stuff. Karen, Karen, I really appreciate your coming on the podcast. Thank you very much. I think we'll need to get you back to do that deeper dive into, into the linguistics that we need to place on him and our profile, but thank you very much.

[00:39:56] Karen Tisdell: [00:39:56] You're selling on the fantastic, thank you very much. It's just, you know, this is the greatest hour of my week. Thank you. I'm thrilled.

[00:40:03] karen-tisdell-linkedin_recording-1_2020-07-13--t01-25-52am--mark_mcinnes: [00:40:03] Thanks, Karen. Thanks a lot.