The 3rd Best Cold Caller in the World. Gerry Hill.

Life on the other side of 18million dials. 

This episode provides you with a window into the mind of a true expert. Gerry Hill is the regional VP of a company called Connect & Sell. If you’re in sales leadership or you’re a close watcher of sales tech you will know the organization is at the very front of calling technology.

Gerry does all the talking in this one which is perfect… because I felt SO far out of my depth I was drowning in information. In fact, It’s highly likely you will need to listen to this episode twice. I mean I train people to make calls.. and this guy is three levels above me.

This guy walks the walk, he is the only person ever, on this podcast, to give out his mobile number as way to get in contact’ – How’s that for serious?


Gerry Hill
https://www.linkedin.com/in/beaccurate/

Connect & Sell
https://connectandsell.com/


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Mark McInnes
https://www.linkedin.com/in/mark-mcinnes/ 

Catch all versions of me here.

https://linktr.ee/markmcinnes
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Tactical Pipeline Growth
BOSS Podcast
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Transcript

Intro: 0:06

Welcome to the boss podcast. This podcast provides today's sellers with sales tactics that will help them to reach their goals. Your host mark McGuinness brings you diverse guests. High quality discussion and valuable insights on every single show. Mark is the author of tactical pipeline growth, as well as an in demand sales trainer and coach for B2B companies all over the world. If you want me better at outbound sales, you're definitely in the right place. Now let's get into the podcast.

Mark McInnes: 0:43

Today's episode provides you with a window. The mind of a true expert, Gerry Hill is the regional VP of a company called connect itself. If you're in sales leadership, or you're a close watcher of sales technology, you'll know the organization is at the very front of calling technology. Welcome to the boss podcast. Thank you, Jerry. And I. Dairy does all the talking in this one, which is perfect because it's held so far out of my depth. I was absolutely drowning in information. In fact, it's highly likely you will need to listen to this episode twice. I mean, I train people to make calls, right? And this guy is at least a three levels above me in both skill and. This guy absolutely walks the walk. He's the only person Emma, on this podcast to give out his mobile number as a way to get in contact at the end of the episode, I mean, has that to series, if this episode has you feeling like you need to up your sales skills, there are two ways you can do that. Absolutely free. The first one is to subscribe to my twice monthly VIP sales, my life. We're all sharing the very best sales tactics that aren't confined in that two weeks. Simply go to my website to sign up. I promise there's no spam, no bullshit described value. And that's mark MC dot C. Secondly, if you're not into emails, simply go to my LinkedIn profile. And right there in my region, section is a raft of material for you to use right now to help you be better at selling, but enough let's get in and learn about cold calling with Jerry. welcome to the boss podcast. Thanks for coming on. Really appreciate it.

Gerry Hill: 2:30

Real pleasure to be involved. Thanks for inviting me.

Mark McInnes: 2:34

Good stuff. So, um, my absolute expert in spice. So, you know, you fit the best of sales strategies. You're right up there. That's going to work really well for us. So you're the VP of connecting sales. But you're also the world's third best Coca-Cola according to your LinkedIn profile. That's a pretty interesting, tell us a little bit about both of those, but let's start with a third best,

Gerry Hill: 2:57

well, people don't trust you. If you say you're the best at something generally. So I could well be the base coat quarter in the world. I've got no real way of quantifying it. Apart from the fact we did some ridiculous Coco public contests in the summer, just gone out a whole bunch of purported sales experts. Calling live using connect and sales stream to UT and it was a knockout based competition. And I finished that overall. I lost to an incredible young lady from gong called Gabriella oil. If anybody follows LinkedIn library closely, they'll probably know Gabriela. But she was just incredible. And then I'll share it a bit hard done by that. I didn't come second because to seek, leave abroad a list of inbound leads rather than outbound leads. So there were a lot more receptive to conversations than my, my list was. You know, that's always going to feel a bit bruising, but well-played teeth. Oh, my gracious dude.

Mark McInnes: 3:55

It sounds like you deserve the third best cold call or off that competition. So mate, that's awesome. So tell us a little bit about connect and sell and how you freedom that what are you guys doing? Obviously, this is a podcast for sales people, so don't hold back there.

Gerry Hill: 4:08

So you know, that nagging feeling that you've kind of breathe deeply. You've got a list of people that you want to speak to. And you start dialing and you want to have compelling conversations with those hard to reach prospects, but every dollar you make results in outcomes that you don't want such as voicemail or speaking to gatekeepers, or having conversations with receptionist and switchboards, having bad data and facts times and often 90 minutes. You're lucky to have maybe had one conversation with that senior executive. You want to chat. Well, connect themselves a weapon, which basically eliminates all of that waste for work and transforms that use of time so that you have a conversation every four minutes, not conversation every 90 minutes, not just the tool, but it's just a way that you can radically transform how you go to market by simply accelerating the flow rate of conversations with the people in your market you want to speak to. So yeah, it's says complete transformation play for most of our customers. Like

Mark McInnes: 5:04

I say, that's pretty interesting. I mean, the way that you've described the pioneer is pretty much exactly what mark clients vice tonight. You know, they're making phone calls. They're not getting through without getting to date. How does that work? Like what, how do you do that?

Gerry Hill: 5:17

I mean, it's a, it's a phone bridge that you look into that is uniquely yours. You log into a web app, you select a list or list of people that you want to speak to, but this could be 50 prospects to 5,000 prospects state doesn't really matter. He pressed the go button, the go button, initiate its work for the sales person. And it looks something like this. You're going to get three to six styles happening at the same time, patented innovation around what's called parallel dialing. But, you know, as technology run that process, it would be a car crash for both prospects and seller because there's certain components of the work that technology can't have recognition for such as the human voice. And as a result, we put a big labor pool of human resource into this web. That basically ties on and navigates all of the dial throats that the system initiate on your behalf. So imagine having executive assistants working at you on a one-to-one relationship with every dial, my system manufactures for you. Like I often do. Bloody-minded $5 an hour phone operator work that salespeople are just too skillful to be paid for. And when somebody in that list picks up the phone and navigate a drop site onto your phone bridge in real time, and you just simply have a business development call with a one-to-many message with that person that you want to speak to.

Mark McInnes: 6:31

So my guess is you guys are experts at spending time on the phone. So because obviously you would have to then help people make fable phone calls, right? The volume of technology more Gacys you've got to be an expert in X, a lot of talking to people in cell phone with these that,

Gerry Hill: 6:48

right. Yeah, absolutely. That there's sort of four pillars to being effective at this. One's your list? Is it the right person? Right. Cohort people we want to speak to, you know, is our proposition valuable to them? The second is messaging, you know, cold call messaging or first conversation messaging is fundamentally different to most other types of messages that you put out and you go tomorrow. It's um, based on anatomy, which is you've got to win the first seven seconds. You've got to be able to create a breakthrough that has a war in it for me, component for your prospect. You've got to be able to ask repeatedly for meetings in the face of objections. And then you've got to be able to turn pivots and turbulence in the conversation to curiosity. But it's then wrapped up in a psychological framework, which is this concept that you've got to take a prospect from fear to curiosity in less than seven seconds. So we do a huge amount of work on inculcating and indoctrinate in that messaging comparator so that our customers can be successful. The next bit, that really matters is coaching. You know, can you listen to a high enough philosophy conversations to be able to catch signals on whether or not reps are drifting, whether or not messaging's getting distorted or whether or not your market. Most importantly, your market is responding to the rep with the right message at the right time. And then the last bit is transparency and visibility. No, this is an accountability part of the go to market. That's been ended in a way she is cause reps. I've publicly said that conversations with everybody in the organization, and the only way you can level up is to be accountable on this stuff. So those are the four input mechanisms that we supervise and we lend our expertise to, to help our customer. Interestingly, the ones that neglect the advice churn and don't succeed, the ones that take the advice and embrace the advice, go on to achieve stellar business results. You know, that's a massive component. Technology's only going to take you so far, actually maximizing the insight and the expertise and the velocity that we see. Can be a very, very, very beneficial value stream for our

Mark McInnes: 8:50

customers. Yeah. So the, the world is full of salespeople who know better, but still don't do very well.

Gerry Hill: 8:55

Was it a challenge of Colton, the academic challenge at deeply the academic walks around the sales floor, telling people how it scares them, but never get shit on themselves.

Mark McInnes: 9:05

There's plenty of those out there in my training gig, I say lots. So look, I mean, this is obviously a question that we already know the answer to, or at least I'm pretty sure what you do. So based here in Australia, obviously in the UK and more, I know for a fact is that there's strong geographical differences in the way that we communicate, particularly for outreach conversations. So having trained people in the U S in the UK and in AIPAC, there's different cadences, different systems. Do you see that there's still a strong place for phone-based outreach in 2021? You're clearly you've worked for connecting cell and you get the third, this Coca-Cola, but this is going to be yes, but why don't you say, um, cause a lot of my clients say that, uh, reluctant to call, we've always been Frank, you know, there's a high level of relaxing

Gerry Hill: 9:47

AIPAC. I think there's a psychology component there. But if I look at sort of outreach and outbound and what it's designed to achieve is the hardest way to acquire the new business. You know, if you can create an unstoppable environment machine and you've got product led cards in your company, like a Datadog or Mongo DB, where your customers are flocking to you or UI path or whatever it might be, then you don't necessarily need to index the conversation. You just need to become strategic about how to grow the product inside of those, those accounts. And you can speak to that while on success basis, you don't monetize your first deals or whatever, but not everybody's got the luxury of having outstanding product. Not everybody's got the luxury of winning the marketing battle. So in order for you to actually survive, you need to go outbound until you've got maturity and sophistication enough that you don't. Now, the easy thing is to automate the trouble with automation is it's created this massive, massive paralysis in people's inboxes today. And if you look at data from HubSpot, Right. They try more outbound email than anybody sales lady email in their engagement metrics for the past two years of showing that email response and reply and read isn't the absolute cause. Right? It's down in the doldrums, in the minus percentage ranges, but the irony is people are sending more email than they've ever sent before. And it's not good email because gas, what most people just stumble into sales on professional copywriters, and they're not professional psychologists, and they don't understand the hero sticks with dynamic message and they don't know how to write short form content that speaks to business relevance. And then. 10 years of sales engagement tone, please telling us that engagement matters. Well, I'm sorry if engagement matters that much. Why do you need to send, say two messages before somebody responds to you? So it's not the emails redundant because I think it's very important. I just believe it's important. Once you've actually established the connection with the human being, using your voice to create trust, and then send the emails that you need to send off to them. It's just a first point in a process to acquire somebody's curiosity. So what's the answer to the question. I think the answer to the question is that cora.com sits on a politeness nexus. It sits on a psychological nexus, which is a lot of people are worried about the outcome of a cool and how it affects them and how it impacts them as an individual. And I think that is culturally sensitive, you know, I think it's culturally sensitive in the sense. Generationally people like you and me probably didn't grow up having to call the yellow pages for a living when we first started our careers. And that was the only way we could do stuff. So we don't have that corridor tons because we know it's about getting to an outcome, but no one to four knows by that. But as sort of technology literacy evolves and the younger reps come into the industry and they don't have to use the phone because guess what? On the iPhone, the phone app on the iPhone is the seventh, most popular app on an iPhone, by the way, did you know that across all that? So that kind of gives you some insight that people want to message and they want to message and they want to message. But if I look at my WhatsApp right now, there's about 28, what's up. So I've just not responded to in different groups and stuff because it's overwhelming. So how do you create a boy that difference? Well, I think cold calling or calling is relevant because conversations to where you might have far to trust in the science of it, it's pretty fun. Foundational there's over 200,000 bits of information per minute. In the human voice, it takes about 250,000 bits of information for human star. Trusting another human. Well, it's the currency of selling is trust. Whereas if I use email it's about 20,000 bits of information, which means I need to send 25 emails to achieve the same outcome as a minute and a half conversation with a stranger versus the 25 emails I need to send to Australians is to achieve the same design. Wow. That's

Mark McInnes: 13:34

so interesting. I've never heard of that before. That's crazy. Um, but it does seem to make sense. What do you do so many textures, a lie is inside someone's voice. Uh, Tyrone Heiss Wolf, et cetera, you can't get on any text-driven format. I hadn't thought of that before. So that's, that's really clever. Can you say into the future, like I know you can't see the future, but what do you think is going to happen? Are people going to answer their phone less, more, you know, is electronic stuff, you know, email going to be, I mean, there must be some point where email becomes almost redundant.

Gerry Hill: 14:03

I think people are answering the phone less and less and less, which means something like connect and sell matters more and more and more because conversion of 40. Is higher than conversion out of any other channel to the harder it gets to reach. Somebody will, the more efficiency you need to create around that. But if you look at the rise of video in selling motions from top of funnel, all the way down to completion, I mean, that's my I'll use video virtually every place where I don't have to send an email drop voice notes in LinkedIn, I dropped voice notes in WhatsApp. I send text messages, but I hardly ever email. I think people use the phone. The, I think regulation is having an impact. In the U S we've seen , it's called stash shaken this, a new legislative framework, which is about call that station. You've got TCPA, GDPR, you know, phone numbers are harder and harder to come by. Golf cadet rates across the network for us last year on $18 million or about two and a half cents on average. But we bias quite heavily to companies that sell to sort of senior VP plus type of job titles in engineering and the it and big companies. So that's not to be, you know, a surprise to anybody. I think voice and voice technologies are fascinating. And I don't think it's about the traditional business telephone. I think it's things like LinkedIn voice notes. I think it's the ability to drop voice notes in WhatsApp, I think is the ability to deploy video with email as your envelope for that message. Those things are super dynamic because I can say in a two minute video in an email wrapper. What it would take me about eight to 12 paragraphs of badly written text. If you're functionally dyslexic, like most sales people to achieve. So embracing those types of technologies and the good news is it's frictionless because they're cheap. They're not the kinds of things that you need to go out and spend mega bucks on an enterprise level. Any rep can spin up a $12 an hour or sorry, $12 a month, Vimeo accountable, BombBomb account crave video to people, and then your prospects get to see a personality a little bit, like get, see that intonation, that time commitment and that passion, that narrative can't be misinterpreted anymore, which is where texts fails. Generally. That's not to say you don't need to be a great writer to be a good sort of hired. Finally, high-end salesperson, because you need to write complex documents. You need to respond to RFPs. You need to write proposals and stuff on occasion, but the ability to inject your personality as an overlay throughout the sales motion today is massive. And anybody not using voice. Is neglecting the opportunity to build trust faster than the opposition number, the competitive company that you face off against every day is your outreach. Getting you labeled as a spammer. What once worked in B2B, outbound doesn't work anymore. The goalposts have moved and so much your approach to sales. Sure. You might land odd conversation. Or even a reply to an odd cold email, but is it scalable? Well, it provides you with enough revenue to hit your yearly goals. Having worked with sales teams all over the world, we see what works and what doesn't. Our new power coaching program provides sellers with access to the very best training available today. It doesn't matter if you're a team 50 or a team of one. We have flipped traditional sales training on its head and allow you to learn in your own time and still get the important coaching help that you need. Grab all the details@markmc.com slash pow,

Mark McInnes: 17:42

how much of it do you think is the lack of skill versus just lack of activity or lack of taking action? You know, so being good on the phone or being good at voice is obviously the goal, but if you're pretty average, does it, is it still a good vehicle to use? So

Gerry Hill: 17:56

if I'm still in my prediction, We've got more sales jobs on market than ever before, but that's because the head count covers some of those still the model, but it's demanded by companies and investors. Each person that you hire becomes fundamentally less profitable to the business. It was salesperson's key metric it's net fee income per employee. Right now, most people stumble into sales. So how many of them take their skill development seriously? And the individual level I'd probably say about three to 4% would be willing to stick a thousand dollars on a credit card. Unpaid marks, take them through some breakthroughs on how to get better at their job and actually go and use that companies probably don't index enablement enough, especially in the sort of 80% of mid medium sized companies that have got salespeople to is 20%. Yeah. Companies that probably do do some form of enablement. And there's about 5% of the companies that are committed and dedicated to it and actually resource against sales coaching. And then for the rest, they have to seek out information from communities right now. And the communities are sort of saying usefulness. It sounds with everything, right? There's, half-life, there's diminishing value in every strategy and a nice sort of take inspiration from hedge funds and traders a little bit here, which is I can catch a signal on a stock really early and I can pump back stock for all it's worth. But at some point, somebody else in the market is going to like that in the five to six. But they're not going to be able to execute it as well as me for a number of reasons. Firstly, they don't understand the strategy fully, or they don't have the liquidity or they don't have the execution or they don't have something, but they're going to be able to ride my coattails. Then another person is going to jump onto their hotels and their coattails in their coattails. At some point that stock stops trading alpha and alpha as the signal, which is about profit. Right. It's the same with sales tactics and sales strategies. What did we see? We see as kind of like watching a five-year-old soccer game. One kid runs to the ball ahead of the others. He gets there first and every other kid runs to the ball. They don't hold their space. And that's what we see in selling modern selling. Right. Everybody's got the next new thing. It's account-based it's this it's that it's engagement. It's the next thing. I think the only thing that ultimately holds true, and I've been doing this since 1399 in various guises. The only thing that holds true is. Can I ask people good questions? Can I understand the answers and kind of stimulate conversations to keep people on course and on program and on task, the rest of it, just fluff and process and system and bias and people trying to find shortcuts in the hacks, doing boys, fundamentally a hard job, and whilst professional selling still exists and it will do for the next 15 years in the way that we understand it. Cause the technology leaps that Justin predicts aren't quite there yet. The people that will continue to win are the people that are capable of driving conversations, whether that's real strangers to create opportunities or with people who aren't strangers to move deals forward up, out closed, won, or lost, that's it that's the job. And you can't do that without actually having conversations with people. So that's where I'd be focusing my time and attention is on talk tracks. The rest of it. It's just fillers and tactics. Marginal

Mark McInnes: 21:14

gains. I love the way you've stripped that down to reality. So what did you say? 18 million? The oils that you go

Gerry Hill: 21:20

yeah, roughly a year. That's the average run rate per year for our customers.

Mark McInnes: 21:25

So, okay. Let's say we're just agitated somebody to get off their backside and stop typing the telephone seriously. When they've been not doing themselves any favors on that front prior to now, one of something that they should be doing start what's the thing that you would sign, who would have the biggest impact, never talk

Gerry Hill: 21:39

about your product. Never talked about your product in a first comment. Number one objection in the world we saw analyzed against three and a half million dials. Where was it? The derivative of the, where all set objections, where, okay. We're covered the number one reason that that objection, materializes is because most reps go into something that might sound a bit like this, where the number one verified got low cloud technology is being used by two of your competitors and DevOps today. The reason I called was to see if I could share some information with you. Send meeting with one of my experts to discuss further. If I'm the prospect there, what have I got? I've got three or four different reasons to get out with my dignity and entire one is I don't trust God. And there's all that analysis too. I don't understand any of the buzzwords. You just threw at me three, I've got a service or proposition that I've just contracted. That looks something like what you're describing to me right now. So thank you very much, but a way, and those really hard objections to come back. Right. Whereas if I said, um, came up, Terry Hill had discovered a breakthrough, which completely eliminates the waste of frustration of having to deploy code at the weekend. When you could be spending time with your kids, just wanted to see if we could grab 15 minutes to share whether or not this breakthrough would be rather than to your work over . Do you happen to have your calendar available completely different narrative? Yeah.

Mark McInnes: 22:59

You haven't even made one of these.

Gerry Hill: 23:00

I haven't mentioned what it is and that's deliberate. It's by design because all I care about is trying to create. Statement of value. That sounds something like the problems you exist with every single day. Yeah. But here's the thing. If I'm going to get out of my office and having not done this work for awhile, I'm going to have to require myself to think deeply about what do my prospects that I speak to most often care about most often, because there's a lot of advantage. In average, you need to be able to come up with a message that would speak to 90%, a hundred percent of that. You need to go and have a conversation with most sales reps are going rely on marketing for that marketing consistently message for this workup, because all they ever want to talk about is they're expensive for us to report, not the actual what's in it for me component. Have a conversation with a complete stranger. So it is hard work to create that and test it and get it right. And refine it kind of like doing SEO or email. You don't get how from day one, you get hell for in six months time. Once you got to tell us the beta up, right.

Mark McInnes: 23:55

I love that conversation about marketing and sales. I mean, marketing or doing dead. If we try and take their job and use it for ourselves as sales people, it's always going to find that they're talking. It's that cliche, you know, they're talking one to many, we're trying to talk to the individual. So if you take that talking to general tense, nobody sees themselves as it might just like everybody else. We're all special.

Gerry Hill: 24:16

Yeah. But I think that's one of the problems that we have in modern selling today is that we believe all of our prospects are uniquely special and then not, they form around clusters that you can take advantage of micro one, too many messages, you know, and that can lay through an organization. You know, if I speak to a CEO, I'm talking about something fundamentally strategic, I'm talking to a VP, I'm talking about something fundamentally strategic and tactical. I'm talking to a sales development leader. I'm talking about something functional and tactical. If I'm talking to a rev ops person, I'm talking about something time and cost saving, but I don't need to know that the rev ops person went to university. And my sister's three times removed because that's largely irrelevant information and it distorts the impact as the thing that I need to talk to them about. And I might end up talking to them about that for conversations down once I've done my demo. Locking my proposition at the top of the funnel. It just doesn't matter for me. That's the biggest takeaway from Tustin Michael's book and the work that I've always done. My greatest success has always been on this one statement. Relevance is always greater than personalization. Yeah. I love that

Mark McInnes: 25:23

good stuff. It's that segmenting? 95% of people I speak to don't segment by those, each of those roles. So you just need to me was I want to do this so quickly. You know, most people would try and distill that message. What's the con distill that or widen that to, what's the one thing that fits all of those segments. Oh, I know it's saved them time and money. Right, right. So then you're not bringing this say, yeah, I was saying, Hey, I can save you time and money. You bring the CRO. I can save you time and money. And it's your Sam terror. Yeah.

Gerry Hill: 25:55

And the other thing about sort of spam messaging is commission breasts on objection and objective based outcomes. Right? I think when I coach my customers and when I coach reps to work for me, I just get them to detach from the outcome completely and use the conversation to drive this concept, completed conversation and like complete your conversation. Now I don't care if I don't get a meeting with that person. But kind of like getting into an end of conversation where I extract information and learn something about that person that can then tell me when to re-engage with them. Right? So there's some econometrics at play here. Chat homes came up with this concept of the buyer's pyramid. And in most B2B services, you kind of getting replaced or displaced once every 12 courses for something that looks like. That's surface mark itself. All that Jerry gets out all that Joe blogs could sell. Another reality is that there's 3% of your market in market for that service solution or offering right now. But if they're in the market right now, you've probably missed the boat. If they haven't come to you proactively. And we know all of that from the sort of challenger based stuff, which says that 78% of buyers are, you know, 75% of the way through that journey or whatever that stat is. But actually what's the value in outbound. It's identifying the next 6%. It was starting that research journey before they engage with vendors. And the next 12% of people behind that, that are open to learning about the art of the possible. And then you've got another 60% of the form around. It's never going to be right for us based on current business situation, or it's never going to be right for us because we just don't buy stuff particularly. So what am I doing if I'm able to get my outbound strategy right on timing, all of that information from my entire addressable market, so that I can get closer to market dominance by simply being able to time and identify relevant, I can identify relevant. For when to re-engage with somebody with the right information at the right time in the right channel, all of a sudden I've made the goal of outbound a lot easier to digest from a psychology point of view because we index the object, which is a meeting over the real objective, which is the timing and relevance information. We've got a generation of reps who are just blindly pursuing them and no real understanding of how it fits into the buyer. Yeah. I have a 12 to 36 quarter

Mark McInnes: 28:13

period. Great. So it's very clear that you know exactly what you're talking about, and you're certainly an expert in the chemical space or the calling spice more mobile. I mean, if people want to get a bit more of Jerry, what's the best way for them to do that, how can they get in contact with

Gerry Hill: 28:26

you? I'm on LinkedIn. So it's just Jerry Hill connect themselves for that search for anybody who is going to be a bit tougher for the APAC guys. But I do take calls from like five in the morning, cause my seven month old sun's up. And I normally try and get nine holes of golf in before I start my day. So I'm always taking calls from weirdo. So there's sort of five in the morning. He called me for help. My number is plus 4 4 7 7 0 2 0 3, 4 0 8. And then my email address is jerry.Hill@connectandsell.com.

Mark McInnes: 28:56

Carrie, you're the only person to ever give out your phone number on this podcast. Talk about, you know, walking the walk,

Gerry Hill: 29:05

like you can't be a hypocrite on this stuff. Like I've got one mindset, which is, can I help people get better at something that they struggled with today? Now it might be as a function of my technology, but it might also be somebody can call me up. This is an amazing young rep, but I've got to give a shout out to called Elliot bowl. He works for an organization in the UK called sales impact academy. He's an SDR, but he called me up one morning at 6:00 AM. I was in the bar. And he was like, Dario, just really sort of listened to something that you did the other day. And I thought, I'd give you a call because I wanted to design a career. And I was just wondering if he could mentor me, but honestly, he's the only person who's ever actually listened to anything that I've ever been on or published where I've given out my phone number. You know, there's been thousands of people that have listened to the podcasts and stuff that I've been on and only ones over politics follow up. So I don't see it as too much of a risk on those maps.

Mark McInnes: 30:02

That's the people that are asleep, but you might be in trouble

here because 5: 30:04

00 AM UK is about three. I am Sydney and Sydney toner based in Australia. So, so, you know, there might be a hit of people at three o'clock. I think, you know what? I might just give curious.

Gerry Hill: 30:17

Yeah. Um,

Mark McInnes: 30:21

but, uh, is there anything else coming up that people should keep an eye out for?

Gerry Hill: 30:24

Um, it's hype cycle game stuff that staying streamed it's mark is learning from sellers and sellers learning from marketeers or some competitions and stuff will come as both. Great. Justin, Michael and Julia. And then we've got the sales innovation expo coming up in the UK in November, which is a sales technology. Face to face exhibition at the London Excel, which I'm really excited about. And then there's a book off the, I produced with a brilliant top of funnel guy out on the stage called Ryan Ray's art, where we look across control, go to market strategies between the U S and Europe, which is basically a very grumpy old man complaining about the state of the world boy or my therapy session. And that's called the sales more as in the. Yeah, that's strange total cost aggregates.

Mark McInnes: 31:11

I'm very grateful that you've taken the time to come and share real knowledge bombs here on the boss podcast. Derek, thank you very much.

Gerry Hill: 31:18

Thanks for having me. I really appreciate it.

Mark McInnes: 31:26

How would you like an electronic copy of tactical pod lawn garage sent directly to you for free you say on a mental health paid to swap you for all you have to do is leave us Mr. Review on apple podcasts, as it would really help other listeners to find us. And it helps us find more great guests in the future. And of course then better than guests than better on the sales strategies. The good news is it only takes you about 60 seconds to do, and you can probably access the review function directly from the device you're using right now to listen to us. I really appreciate it. Simply leave us a review and then screenshot that and send it to me either via DM on LinkedIn or directly through my email. And I'll send you a copy of the book straight away. So that's it for me, Shawn, catch you on the next thing. So thanks for listening.