This week on Disrupting Burnout, I’m joined by Chulu Chansa, a Woman Who Defines Disruption by emphasizing the importance of therapy, community, and listening to the signs of disruption in our lives.
Chulu is a writer of modern African culture & lifestyle, a transformational speaker, mentor and the host & producer of the award winning podcast, Africana Woman. In this episode, Chulu shares her personal story of moving from burnout to purpose and discusses how she found her voice and discovered her true passions, leading her to create Africana Woman, a community dedicated to empowering women to live in their purpose.
03:25 - Three Stories Of Burnout
18:00 - The Tells Of Burnout
26:30 - The Power Of Community & Self-Discovery
40:00 - The Path To Healing & Freedom
Buried Under Success Takeaways
● “I burned out not once, not twice, but three times.” - Chulu Chansa
● “I am a big advocate for therapy.” - Chulu Chansa
● “Community saved me.” - Chulu Chansa
● “When I didn’t have my own faith, I had to borrow the faith of my community.” - Chulu Chansa
● “The business was a good business, but it just was not for me.” - Chulu Chansa
● “I wish I had started sooner because I would be so much further.” - Chulu Chansa
● “I had lost my voice.” - Chulu Chansa
● “The journey doesn’t happen overnight, it takes time.” - Chulu Chansa
● “We are changing lives, one person at a time.” - Chulu Chansa
This episode is brought to you by HeartWork Academy! If you’ve ever felt like you're marching in place, putting in all of the effort, but not moving forward, this program is for you. If you feel buried and you’re ready to move into brilliance, it’s time to join a community of disruptors who understand and who genuinely want to support you and hold you accountable as you show up in purpose everyday. To join the Heartwork Academy, visit: http://heartworkacademy.com.
Connect With Chulu:
Support the show
There's not really like monetary terms of other way people define success that can really express how grateful and happy I am that I can be part of a community like this, that is literally transforming lives. Hey, hey, hey, friends, listen, I am too excited to share with you all today. As you as you all know, we have a new series called women who define disruption. And my heart and my goal for this series is for you to be exposed to women who have said no thank you to the structured career ladders that have been offered to them, but not created, especially for them, and who are living freely in purpose, you know that one of the strategies that we use to do disrupt burnout is discovering our brilliance or purpose, right. And not just discovering it, but maximizing that brilliance, living in that brilliance every day, not because someone gave us permission, not because our education has led us to it. But because we know, this is what we were created to do. And this is what we were called to do. And I want you to experience that freedom. I also believe and in order to experience that freedom, you need to be exposed to it. You need to be exposed to women who have done and are living in this way so that you know what is possible for you and for your life. So today Today Today, I have a very special guest on the podcast. My sister, the beautiful Chulu Chansa is coming to us from Zambia, and she is going to share her story. I'll just tell you a little bit. She is the creator and the host of the Africana women with Chulu podcast. She is also the curator and creator of the African women Podcast Network. Come on somebody come on network, okay. And the African a woman visionaries. She's a storyteller. She's a storyteller in so many ways. So without further ado, because she's going to tell you much better than I can Chulu, welcome so much. Welcome to disrupting burnout. And I'm going to greet you like you greet your community. Hey, beautiful. I love it. Thank you. I feel so welcome. I'm so excited to be here. When I saw your invitation, I was just like, yes, yes, yes. must do this. Well, thank you for your Yes. And thank you for sharing with us today. So we are going to get right into it. And I'm going to ask you to introduce yourself to this audience in your own way. Tell us your story. Tell us who you are. Oh, yeah. Oh, my goodness. Okay. Hello, everybody. So my name is Chulu. And I am the founder of Africana woman. I like to refer to myself as a light worker. I am a storyteller. I am a mom. I am just someone who is seeking peace, joy, happiness. So I am from Zambia. And if you're not familiar with that country, it is in the middle of Africa, Southern Central Africa, landlocked country. And I am trying to figure out where should I start from because I you know, I feel like I have a story that has so many layers, and they've been peeling back slowly. But I think it's so essential to share the story of how I burnt out three times you would think that I learned the first time I burnt up one separate twice and still didn't learn I had to burn out three times. Now I you know, I got into the workforce pretty much as we all do, you know, you're getting out of university, it's all you you have to go find a job. And to be honest, I was kind of like, I would go into a job and then I'll jump out and then everybody will be looking at me like oh, why are you not working? Yeah. But I'm like, but I am working, I'm creating, you know, this business or whatever it is, but because we're so used to conventional systems and structures, you know, everybody has sort of like, what the people around me have had this definition for what success looked like. So I kept trying to force myself back into this workforce, this space. But essentially, I think I would start my story probably foods complicated. So my story from, you know, I got out of high school, and then I went to study, now, I left my country when I was 18 years old. And obviously, if you're coming from an African country, you know, here you are a majority, you've never thought of things like race or anything like that. And I came to study in the States, I first studied in the UK for two years, and then I studied in the States for four years, and I was there for an extra year. So, you know, when I came to the, when I came to the States, you know, I and the UK, then you I was confronted with this thing about, Oh, you are, you know, with racism, with, with people having a problem with the color of my skin, with people. And even worse, when you're coming from Africa, you know, I heard things like, Oh, I could never date an African woman like, or an African girl, because you all have AIDS, you know, so that for me, put a damper into my spirits into my soul. And I was also, I grew up with a single parents, I grew up with my mother. My father was alive. He had other children, but he just didn't care for me. So then I also had abandonment issues, as well. So by the time I was getting back to Zambia, after my seven years out of the country, I was very, I was very fragmented, very broken. And I remember the, it took me a while, first of all, to just reintegrate. So when I finally did get a job, probably, I think, three or four years later, from arriving back, I had an experience, which was very heartbreaking again. So I experienced being raped by two men. I had gone out with a friend. I did not want to sleep at his place. So when he got to his car, his gait, I jumped out of the car. This is midnight, way past midnight, I jumped out of the car, and I started walking because I could hear I could hear a busy center. So I thought, Okay, let me just go and get a let me go and get a ride. I'll find a taxi there. So I got out. And then I was met by three gentlemen who, who proceeded to rob me. So they got my bag, they got everything, took everything. And I'm like walking around disoriented. And then I met two other men who then rates were so and during that process, the the original three men who had attacked me, they even walked by and found this happening to me, but they still walked on by. And after that experience, I was just now totally shattered. So this happened in our capital city, and I couldn't stay, I had to run away. So I left the capital city and I went to work for a mining related company for the up north. In that company, it was, you know, it was a factory. So it was 24/7. And it was a startup. So I had my manager or the CEO, and then I was doing the business admin, basically, I was doing everything starting up everything, but I buried myself in work because I just couldn't handle having to deal with all of this stuff, which is on my personal life, right. So I buried myself I Did everything I was doing accounting, I was doing HR I was doing everything you can think of it often. And I burned out, obviously, I people will be calling me at 2am in the morning, oh, my machine has broken in the in the factory on a Sunday. You know, all week, I'm on call, it was just too much my body just could not take it anymore. And and then also, I wasn't getting the support to say I need help. That wasn't coming. So then I just couldn't do it anymore. So I had to stop that job. And I burnt out first time. Then the next time, then I had a bit of a short break, did some volunteer work. And then I was invited to work as a manager at a hotel, a group of hotels. So you know, went in as the hotel manager. And again, when you're talking about hospitality, these are very long days. They're very long days, and then it's six days on one day off. And then as the manager, I'm also on call, even on my day off, so I would be there opening up thing offices or storerooms. First thing in the morning 6am. And then I would have to be the one to lock up, let's say the bar or whatever it is at like midnight, because you're waiting for the last person to leave burning both ends of the candle. And I still did it. Like I just didn't learn. I just came out of the situation like that. But I still jumped in. Why? Because I'm still running. I'm still running from actually dealing with all of the things that have been happening and that have happened to me. But I just don't want to face them. So I burned out, burned out number two. Okay, so then, um, I then decided that okay, my mom was retiring around that time. And she was kind of trying to figure out like, what am I going to do? So we decided to start a a baking company together. Now, she had been baking for a very long time. And it was like a nun brain. I said, Okay, why don't we do this baking thing, she had the baking skills. And then I had the, the marketing the business side of it, you know? So we put our skills together, and we started this company, and it was really doing well. But again, because everybody's looking at me saying, oh, yeah, you don't have a job. Like, you know, they're looking at me like you're not working. But I'm like, I outwork you think I am? Yeah, I mean, you don't see the vision, but it's fine. So then I for the third time, I got pressured to go back into a more traditional nine to five. So I started off with one company and then transitioned into another. Now I was in the education sector. Now, in that space, it was much better. It was much better in the sense that the hours were better, would start early, but then would also leave earlier than most people. But then the business was still going. Right. So the cake business was still going so we grid from doing speciality cakes, then we started specializing in wedding cakes, you know, from one year we went from three wedding cakes that year, the next year, we went to 17 wedding cakes, and then it just started growing that way. So literally, you know, I'm doing this 95 And then I've also got this business that's really, you know, growing and doing well. Burning both ends of so around 2019 I believe 2019 Yeah, 2019 My mom left the country and then left the business with me alone. I managed it for the year but I just couldn't do it. Because essentially, that was her business. That's her passion. So yes, I have the skills but it just wasn't in my heart to continue with that. But around that same time that I was working in this education space. I started to feel a I'm not sure what the word could be. But there was something in my spirit that just was not settled. You know, and It just like over the years, I was there for six years, or five and a half years. So over the years, it would come up. And I'll tell people like, you know, this, there has to be something more, I want to do more, I believe I have more potential. This, this is not enough, you know, but the job that I was in was, it was a very good paying job. Like I was paid very well. I had two cars. I had, like, if you looked at me from the outside up, like she said, You know, it's one of those jobs where people feel like, Oh, I've arrived, you know, and then you just need to put your feet up, and you're good, you're gonna be there for the next however many years, but there's just something that kept coming up. So every time that I would tell people that, oh, this is my, I'm not okay. People will be like, You should be grateful, like, appreciate the job that you have. Right? So then they would they, you know, so then I'll just like bury it. And then it'll come back up again next year. So by the time I was getting to 2019, there was now just so much piled up that I had thrown to the back, thrown deep down whatever reasons I thought it was. So I had one spirit that was saying that you were not meant to be here. I had things to deal with abandonment. Just that feeling of not belonging. feeling unworthy, from just the experience of the way, there was just a lot of things that just needed to be dealt with. So when I got to 2019, I now was just full blown in depression. And then I'm also burning both ends of the candle and I'm tired, you have no idea was lost. And I just had to say, you know, I would find myself in parking lots have gone shopping, I get out of the shop, I get into my car, and I just start weeping. Like nothing that has actually brought it on, I just start weeping. I can't even drive home for the next 30 minutes because I'm about to lose my mind. Then I get so let's, I'm gonna I'm gonna jump in here to La Chulu for a moment if that's okay. Because one, I feel great through coming. I feel great through comments. But before we get to break through, you have said so much. And I don't want the listeners to get so involved with your story that they miss. They missed what I call the tales te ll s ELLs, right. We have symptoms, we have signs, we have evidence that we are burning out that we are overwhelmed that we are literally just surviving. And as women we're taught to ignore. We're taught to ignore the signs were taught. And you Oh, my gosh, you see, oh, you said so much. Okay, so let me just review just a few things. First of all, you mentioned this definition of work, where people around you even though you were working, you were working. But because it didn't fit a traditional definition of work, there were people around you, who accused you of not working and made you feel this pressure, that you need to go do something else, you need to add something or do something else, right? We experience this pressure, this judgment. I always say a part of checking your backpack is knowing what is your definition of work? And does it align with who you are, most of us have borrowed a definition of work. Most of us have borrowed a definition that does not align with who we are as women. It does not align with our spirit. So that definition of work was so important. You talked about all of the things that you walked through. And first of all, let me just stop for a moment and honor your experience. And thank you for sharing with us. Because I know there's somebody listening who needs to know that they're not the only one. And I cannot imagine the trauma that you endured. And I appreciate you giving voice to women who have survived such trauma. Thank you. Thank you for sharing with us, and thank you for also sharing how you just push it to the background. Let me hide myself in work. Let me hide myself in busyness. Let me hide myself even in success. Let me hide myself in doing because that is too much. So I can't face that. I let me push that back. And let me hide myself, let me hide myself. And you mentioned in your first experience with burnout, how your body just stopped, your body just gave out right? I consider burnout, it is an IT is an unwanted an undesired shutdown, you don't get a choice, your body, your soul or your spirit, or several of those just stop. It's shut down. I cannot anymore. I cannot do it. Right. In in one of your other situations of burnout. When you talk about being in the parking lot of the shop, and and being so emotional, that you can't even leave this, that's your soul. That's your emotions, your your heart shut down. I cannot do this. I cannot do this. And in all of that Chulu you weren't doing wrong things like you were working you were taking care of a business. And even from the outside looking in, you had the cars you had the income, you had all the things that people from the outside look at and say, Oh, you got it, you got nothing to complain about. But yet your spirit. Your Spirit said, there's more. Your spirit said this is not it. Your spirit said we are uncomfortable. We are longing something is missing. It's that danger zone between the zone of expertise and the zone of genius, right. So I can't think of the name of the author. The book is The Big Leap, where he talks about that, that zone of exit gate Chapman, that zone of expertise is where you're really good, like better than most people and the debt. The danger is that we can get comfortable and stay there because we're really good. And people will look at us and say check that success. But yet there's a longing, yet there's a pool, yet there's a cry out on the inside of you, that says there's more. And so many women settle for the zone of expertise because it looks good. And it sounds good. But their spirit is screaming, trying to get their attention to let them know that there's more. So I want you to go back and please, please continue. But I didn't want anybody to miss all of the wealth that you're giving us it oh gosh. And one more thing. In your mom's business. You said it was her passion and your skill. If that is not the perfect definition of zone of expertise, I've never heard it that beautifully. It was her passion, but your skill. And I'm not saying we never serve somebody else's passion. But we shouldn't have to sacrifice our own purpose in order to serve somebody else's passion, when we're serving someone else's work our own purpose to shine as well. But when it's your skill, your expertise to somebody else's purpose, or somebody else's passion, there's going to be a misalignment and your soul, your spirit is going to scream out at you. And I know it's been a while since I came to you in this way. But I've got something to share with you, you all know that I'm in the process of writing this book. And as I'm doing this, there are strategies and ideas and, and thoughts that are coming to me that I've never had, and I'm so full. I can't wait to get it to you and the book is coming this year. But I can't wait until then I'm seeing the evidence in my life and in the lives of folks that I'm coaching one on one. And God has laid it on my heart to create something for folks who may be interested in one on one coaching but you can't afford it doesn't fit into your budget. Or maybe you're curious about coaching, but you've never had that experience before. This is for folks who feel like you're marching in place. Like you're putting in all the effort but you're not moving forward, you feel buried and you're ready to move into brilliance. I'm ready to share out. I've got some strategies. I've got some things to work through with you. Listen, friends, this is not going to be fancy. There's no fancy sales page. There's no course plan form, this is going to be us meeting once a month through zoom, for me to pour out to you what I have and to support you in your journey. That's it. That's it. This is 40, not 40, this is 3030 bucks a month. And there has to be some kind of investment, or I've learned that people don't show up, right. But at that level, you deserve $30 a month, you can find $30 A month. So if you have wanted to work with me, but just couldn't find it in your budget, if you've been curious about coaching, and just not sure if it was a good fit for you jump in on the HEartwork Academy 2023 I have an even if we work together before a friend, you ain't seen this yet. You haven't seen this yet. I am so ready. I'm so thankful. And I'm ready to share with you and I'm ready to support you. Okay, so listen, if you're interested, join with the link here. Fill out the form, join us in the HEartwork Academy will kick off in May, we'll meet once a month on Zoom. And we're gonna walk this thing out together. Nothing fancy, but let's just get it done. It's time for you to live in brilliance. You need to know what it means to show up in purpose every day. And I'm ready to help you. All right, I can't wait to hear from you. And I'm excited to serve you. I'll see you soon. Bye. Ah Please, julu Please continue. Thank you for letting me jump in there for a few minutes. Of course. So I got to probably mid mid 2019. And I found myself in bed bedridden just for three days straight. I did a bath didn't eat was just crying, crying, crying. And I got to the third day. And I thought you know what, enough is enough. Like I have to do something, I have to find some sort of solution. Because if I continue on this path, I don't know where I'm going to be in the next two weeks. The next month, will I be here by the end of the year? Like Will I still be on this earth? Like, you know? So I, I'm by happenstance, I happen to just pick up my phone spirit load. I picked up my phone, and I browse through and I found the podcast by Patrice Washington redefining wealth. And I decided to go to the beginning. And I said, Okay, let me just listen. And she talks about pillars, she got to explaining her space pillar, which really just talks about how your physical environment is a representation of what's happening in your mind. And that just there was something in those words that just made me get up and start to make my bed and start to clean up. And I just continued listening to the podcast, from there on, I was just binge listening. And then eventually, I did end up taking a program with her with Patrice Washington. But essentially what I had to do to get out of that depression, that the anxiety all of that was one get therapy. So I am a big advocate for therapy, you know, really looking after your mental health. In Africa, you know, we are we are and I'm sure even in your community, you've heard things like, oh, you know, therapies for like white people, you know, it's not like we don't do that, that kind of thing. So there's a lot of stigma around that. But I really do believe that that is something that just literally saved my life. The other thing that saved me was community. Because when I got into this container mastery and momentum and purpose to platform, I found women who were like minded like hearted that were so open to sharing their love and just you could borrow their faith. Like when I didn't have my own faith, I had to borrow their what they saw in me the greatness they saw in me so that I could just I started to step out slowly, slowly, you know, and they would like one person would tell me, oh my gosh, you're a good writer because you know, we have this a group chat and you know, I'm like one of those people that's very long winded, you can tell. So, you know, type a lot and like, you good writer, you should, you know, you should try and think about what you could do with this. And I was like, oh, okay, I was invited to be a speaker and, and impostor syndrome to Cova. And I said, Oh, I've been invited, but I'm not going to accept. What am I sisters was like, Excuse me, ma'am. You are gonna go back. Right back to those people. Until then you are going to speak okay. And I was like, Oh, okay. And that's how I, you know, I started speaking. And it is even just from that, I think that that's the talk that I did was called African women, past, present future, the power of African women Past, Present Future. And it was literally that seed that, that birth to what I'm doing right now with African a woman. But if I had received that invitation, and not had the community to push me to get me out of, you know, all of this nervousness and all of the intimidation, I wouldn't have done it. And I don't even think that what I have right now would would exist in the way that it does. Anyway, then, let me just fast forward. So in that year, I have even been nominated for one of the best wedding cake designers in Zambia. So you can when I tell you that the business was a good business, but it just was not for me. That's what I mean. So I had to at the end of that year, I had the old 2020 Hope number years ago, you missed it notice end of 2020. Yeah, I decided to close the business. And two days, people were still calling me asking me, Can I do a cake for them. But I had to close it because it just wasn't aligned with me. It wasn't what I wanted. I had to go on a journey to discover who I was. I had to really then also think about, you know, what, what do I want to do on this earth on this planet? What is my purpose? Who am I called to be? Where do I really shine? Where can I make the most impact? So I, as I mentioned, I decided, someone said, Oh, you're good at writing. I had actually had started a blog in 2017. It died down decided to take it up again. So I started the blog, Africana woman. And then I eventually started doing interviews, and then I converted that into a podcast. So we have the African a woman podcast, and then a community develop because you know, as a small business owner, that was the height of COVID. You know, and I mean, like for our business with wedding cakes, it was a no like, you know, you just couldn't have wedding. So when people are talking about oh, pivot, where do you pivot? Like, should we have a secret wedding? Like you're not I mean, the business was just decimated. So I knew that as somebody who had experienced that there were other people that are experiencing things like that. So I brought women together in a community and as the Africana woman visionaries, knowing that one I needed to let go of the business. But then I just found myself with so much joy and happiness in all that I do with Africana woman, I was still working my nine to five and I worked with them for another year. And I knew that I wanted to eventually leave so I figured out a an exit plan. I ended up leaving earlier than my intended date of exit. But and then I'd say like it's been one year, exactly one year when you're hearing this and it's been about a year since I have been out on my own. I'm now working full time with Africana woman and I know I was having a conversation with with somebody and they're just like, Okay, what are the lessons that you learned from this last year? And I said to them, you know, I wish I wish I had started sooner because I would be so much further. But because of you know every Like, allowing other people to tell me to define for me what sucks? What success is that really just put a block on where I should be right? Or, or even just the confidence in myself, you know. So I had to and I think also, whilst I was doing the program with Patrice, I realized that I had lost my voice. And I really just, I couldn't speak up, I couldn't speak out. And I didn't know who I was what I wanted to say. So it really was a process. And, you know, whilst you're going through this journey, it doesn't happen overnight. Right? It takes time. And that's why when I started, I was talking about how it's like an onion peeling back, there's so many things that have happened in my life. But right now, I, I left my nine to five, I decided to leave the capital city because the capital city is not for me, traffic, all of that kind of stuff. I love nature. So I moved to a small town up north of the capital city. I live in a home, our family home, which has got a beautiful garden, my office is looking at it the garden, that's the thing that I see every day, even in my bedroom, cut the garden all around. And that's so important to me. But you see, that's important to me, being in nature may not be important to you, but do you know what is important to you? And are you actually pursuing it? You know, so I am just so grateful that I get to live this life that I get to to be intentional and design the type of life that I that? That fills me. And I work with amazing people. Oh my goodness, like I was reflecting on the community that has grown around African a woman. And I just thought, Oh, my goodness, you did that. You did that. You know, we have a book club Real Story really quickly. We have a book club and in the book club. You know, we've we've had a lot of women, but then I've had some men want to join us like okay, sure, if you're not, then I feel uncomfortable. You can join and sign. So we read The Vagina Monologues by Eve Ensler in December and in January. And one of the gentleman sent me a message, like a private message. And he just said, You know what, I was skeptical about reading this book. But I'm so grateful that you had us read this book, it has completely changed the way that I see women. And I think every young man needs to read this book. You need to we need to get it in people's hands. And, you know, like, my mind was just like, blown because literally changing lives one person at a time. And, you know, the types of conversations that we have in there. We talk about, you know, things that are often taboo to talk about, people don't usually talk about but we were breaking that culture of silence. And like, there's not really like monetary terms of other way people define success that can really express how grateful and happy I am that I can be part of a community like this, that is literally transforming lives. You said that you're grateful that you get to live this life. You chose to live this life. You made decisions that ushered you in to where you are to today. And I want to honor you for making those decisions. It's not it's not easy to go from good to great, right? So the business was good. The business was good, right? But Chulu you let go of that business which was good. And order to grasp and to hold on to something that's great. This mission, this ministry, this beautiful community I have African a woman. And not just that, let's talk about the path to healing and to freedom. Let's talk about the path because you mentioned counseling. And you're right. And in our communities, counseling is not something that we've been taught. It's not something that we talk about, even if we do it. Um, it's not something that we encourage, but it is timeout for that. We, I was having a conversation with my daughter, who's a young adult now. And I told her us a baby, we're all raised by broken people. And I told her, I said, I know who raised you. So I'm telling you now go to counseling. I'm taking full advantage. I'm letting you know that I know I made mistakes, not intentionally. But I know I did. I know I wasn't a perfect parent, I know I've made impacts on you, that may have negative consequences. Please go go to counseling, please go understand yourself and understand how to heal. And then you discussed community and the power of an aligned powerful community. Right. So in one part of your story Chulu, you had a community who was trying to force a definition of work on you that didn't align with who you are. And then in another portion of your story, you had your mastery and momentum and your p2p community who drove you forward because they were in alignment with who you are. So both communities challenged you, but one community challenged you to a place that drove you to burn out, another community challenged you to a place that drove you to purpose. So what I would ask the listeners today is where is your community driving you? In what direction? Are they pushing you? Are they pushing you towards purpose? Are they pushing you towards burnout? You have to decide if you're connected to the right people. And here's the beautiful part of community. Right. So you all have heard me talk about Patrice Washington before you've heard me talk about her programs. Chulu and I we're not in the same programs. So we had the same coach, but I'm in mastery and momentum. Now she was in mastery and momentum before I we were not in the same p2p group. But because of the community that Patrice builds and curates. Now we are connected. Now we have this connection that we can share with you all today. That is the power of community, not just the personal impact on you, but the impact you can have in the world, the impact that you can have in the world. So I just want I want you to know that this, this moving into purpose is literally one decision after another. It's one step at a time, releasing the business, a successful business, I'm sure was very, very difficult, but to live in what you lives in today. And to see that impact not just on the not just directly on women, but through this young man who said I see women differently than I ever have now. That is your purpose impacting the world. That is you the blessing that you are poured into this earth impacting change in the world. And that is beautiful. To Lou, I want to ask you a question and I want you to answer this from your heart. How do you define disruption? How do I define disruption? I think disruption is I think I think disruption is it's a it's I think it's like a divine call and message that's inviting you to something better. I think a lot of times, you know because we've been ignoring the signs because we've been told like the spirit has been telling us like you need to change you need to or you know maybe your health you're not doing your health well. You know you've had signs over and over and over again. which we tend to ignore. But there comes a point where I think, you know, God, Spirit just says, You know what, I'm just gonna have to shout. And then that's when the disruption comes. So we've been gripped like, it's like, you know, it hits us on the left side, like our, like our nowhere, but the signs were there. Yeah, but you just weren't listening. Oh, my goodness, listen, I've had to keep myself on mute for this entire interview, because I've been aiming and you and shouting you down the whole time. Often, what we experience as trouble trial or frustration is really disruption. And disruption doesn't come to break us. It comes to make us it comes to push us into the space that we were created to live in. I love I love your definition. And I appreciate the work that you are doing and the community that you are building and the way you are pouring your life out to build up African women. I want to know how can we learn from you? How can we support you? How can we hear more from you? Chulu How can this community connect with you? Thank you. Um, I think the best place is the website. So you just go to Africana. woman.com. So it's African with an A at the end woman.com on all socials, Africana woman, so Instagram, Twitter, Facebook, but personally, my playground is Instagram. So my personal handle is truly by design. And when you go on the website, it really just opens you up to all the stuff that we're doing. We have retreats, we have courses, we have bought the book club, we have the we have the visionaries, and I mean, the beauty, isn't it the beauty about the internet like this that we can connect, it's a global community. You know, it's, we just we just come together and we are just helping each other to be better to grow to we, we stand on celebration, collaboration, and connection. So those are our three pillars and values. Beautiful, beautiful, I love it. So I hope that you all will follow to Lou will listen to her podcast will go to her website, join her community, because I'm telling you that my life is forever impacted by meeting this woman. And I know it's the same for you. So listen, we celebrate you all as always, you know that you are powerful. You are significant. And you are loved. Love always PB day. Bye everybody.