EP 258: Creating a Connected Classroom with Marti Smith & Amie Huggins

What if the biggest barrier to learning in the classroom isn’t behavior… but safety?

Teachers are overwhelmed. Kids are dysregulated. And somewhere in the middle, everyone is trying their best…but it’s not working the way we hoped. In this conversation, I sit down with occupational therapist Marti Smith and educator Amie Huggins to talk about what happens when we bring relational neuroscience into the classroom in real, practical ways.

In this episode, you’ll learn:

• Why behavior in the classroom makes more sense when we see it as communication, not defiance
• How connection, co-regulation, and felt safety actually support learning (not compete with it)
• Simple, realistic ways teachers can meet sensory and relational needs—even with a full classroom
  
  

Resources mentioned in this podcast:

• GET - The Connected Therapist
• GET -Creating a Connected Classroom

Read the full transcript at: RobynGobbel.com/connectedclassroom

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Get access to over 25+ free resources in our brand, new Free Resource Hub! RobynGobbel.com/FreeResourceHub

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Transcript

SPEAKER_06 0:02

So when you're baffling, and yours is too. Sometimes you're I know. Let's take a break from all the boozle. You're on the baffling behavioral.

SPEAKER_00 0:19

Hey, y'all. Welcome. Maybe this is a welcome back to another episode of the Baffling Behavior Show. It's me, your host, Robin Gobel, and today I get to reintroduce you to my very dear friend, Marty Smith, occupational therapist, and my new friend, Amy Huggins, who is an educator in Utah. And Amy and Marty came together, brought their brilliance together and their expertise, and created a new, very remarkable resource for educators. And they co-authored the book, Creating a Connected Classroom. Marty is the author of the book, The Connected Therapist. And Amy read The Connected Therapist, loved it, and connected with Marty and said, Hey, can we create a resource for teachers? So that is exactly what they did. They took Amy's 30 years of experience in the classroom and Marty's experience with the neuroscience of trauma, and they brought together their lived experience working with and supporting kids with vulnerable nervous systems and created this magnificent resource for classroom teachers who are looking for a different way to connect with the kids in their classroom and really bring out their love again for teaching. I don't want to spend time on a long introduction here. I want us to just get right into this episode and this interview because you are going to walk away, I think, feeling inspired that we can support teachers. And if you're a teacher, you're going to walk away feeling inspired that there are resources available for you to take this relational neuroscience and bring it into the classroom, even with the most dysregulated kids, in a practical and accessible way. So let's just get right into it. Marty, Amy, welcome to the podcast. I'm so looking forward to having this conversation and sharing with everybody about this amazing new book you've put out into the world. Marty, you've tell us a little bit about you and your background.

SPEAKER_05 2:41

Thank you so much for having me back on again. I always, always love working with you and joining in your projects and the wonderful content that you create and put into the world. And I would say I first and foremost would consider myself your friend. And we met back in 2010-ish, I think, somewhere back there. And we were both doing the training for TBRI. And I was previously a school therapist. And then after doing those trainings, I kind of transitioned into trauma work. And that is where I kind of focus my attention right now. And your listeners may or may not know that one of my biggest jobs, my weekly job, is to be one of the coaches in your immersion program. And then also working at a care farm that I co-founded because of one of your clients that you sent to me. And so I do see clients in person uh two days a week out there now. And then I do trainings and just really love working with people who have kids with big baffling behaviors. And so I bring that occupational therapy lens. I don't know if I mentioned I'm an occupational therapist, but that's my lens that I bring in a lot of the sensory processing and really the activity analysis as well. So it's not just sensory, I don't think. It's that whole piece of why is this kid struggling here or why is the parent struggling here? And can we adapt the activity or the event or the process to make it easier for everyone involved? And that's where I get real excited is to be creative and really break down those steps that are involved with things that are hard for people. So if it's baffling, I want to know why. And then I want to help. And I'm just so grateful to be on the podcast with you promoting this book because I'm super excited about it. And I'm also just really, really grateful for your friendship and that we get to do this together is fantastic. And now Amy gets to do it with us. So so exciting.

SPEAKER_00 4:48

Yeah. Thanks, Marty. Yes, Marty, you are, you know, many talents, many, many, you have many, many talents. And you're right. Like one of I think the places you really shine is being able to so clearly look at what's happening and figure out where the struggle is and how we can support that with like regular everyday supports, right? It's not this big, you know, therapeutic, enormous intervention that feels like even more stress to implement. It's just like practical, creative, in the moment. Here's how we support this child or this family. And without question, is one of your one of your many brilliances. So also very grateful for you and and your friendship, of course.

unknown 5:37

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 5:38

Amy, you and I, though, we're meeting for the first time ever. So we jammed a little before we turned, you know, we hit record about living in Salt Lake City because I lived there a long time ago during the Olympics. But yeah, tell my audience, but also me, just about you.

SPEAKER_01 5:56

Okay. Um, I am a 30-year classroom teacher here in uh Davis County. I have been teaching social studies primarily in the middle schools. And for years and years I thought that was my love, and it still is. Um, but in 2010, I decided that I needed more stress in my life and decided to try. Why do we do that?

SPEAKER_02 6:23

I don't know.

SPEAKER_01 6:23

I really know. Now I'm okay. Asking 10 years ago, the answer might have been different. But um I decided to venture into foster care and became what was supposed to just be a respite parent. And uh the first placement that I got in in October of 2010 just moved out after finishing her master's program last summer.

SPEAKER_03 6:45

Wow.

SPEAKER_01 6:46

So um I went on this crazy wild journey of what in the world is going on with these children. Because I grew up in, you know, reserved Utah, two-parent home. Everything appeared to be fine. And when I would look at my girls, I ended up with four total. I would look at them and I'm like, why is the grounding not working? Why is this not functioning? Why are you not getting good grades? Because that's just what you're supposed to do. And so I went looking and looking and looking for anything to help me parent these children and ended up finding TBRI. And then through TBRI, I found Marty and realized that I was able to apply what I was doing at home with my girls in my classroom. And so for the last five years or so, I have been with great, I don't know, goals in mind, trying to figure out how to apply TBRI to the classroom. And then I realized that it's it's a little bigger than just TBRI, like we've got to have the sensory input. And so what we came up with is really what we kind of wrote in this book about how do we actually meet the needs of these kids in a classroom with a system that does not create fail safety, with a system that does not meet sensory needs, and with a system that is is set up to only provide success for the minimal few. And it's it's been a journey, that's for sure. But I'm so excited to be here. And yours and Marty's work has been so incredible with my girls and helping me understand how to parent them and then translating that to the classroom. So I'm just grateful to be here and to know both of you and talk about this stuff because our systems, our kids need it so much. How did the two of you meet? I had read Marty's books and we found out that she was coming to Utah to do a training. And so I begged, begged, begged. I work in the schools, but I also work for a nonprofit called Raise the Future that works with kids who are languishing in foster care. And I begged, begged, begged my um director at RAISE to let us go to Marty's training. And I'm like, you guys, we've got to go, we gotta go. She was not a hard sell because she also loves Marty. And so me and my entire office ended up in that um training. While we were there, I uh was like, my my director, her name is Brandy. She's like, Amy, do you want to go take a picture? And I'm like, I was so nervous, I couldn't even really do it. I'm like, no, that's okay.

SPEAKER_02 9:13

I get to watch her. I don't really have to talk to her. And Marty's like, or not Marty, Brandy's like, go take my picture. I'm like, okay, I'll take your picture.

SPEAKER_01 9:20

And then we're walking away. And Brandy's like, Amy, go take a picture. I'm like, okay, I will go take a picture. It took all of my courage. So I go up to Marty and I'm like, we're gonna be best friends.

SPEAKER_02 9:30

And she looks right at me and she goes, I'm sorry, my friend card is full.

SPEAKER_00 9:34

Marty is such a great response, actually.

SPEAKER_02 9:38

It is so quick and smart. And I'm like, oh, okay. But then I'm like, can we be friends in like four years? And she's like, Yes, in four years, we're gonna be friends. I'm at home and I put this on my social media and I've got a picture of me and Marty, and I'm like, I want everybody in my world to know that in four years I'm calling this woman back and we're gonna be best friends. That's entirely true.

SPEAKER_01 10:03

And I finally came clean with Marty and sent her copies of the post so that she would know just how ridiculous that I was. But I was doing a presentation for Ray's because I still work for Ray's the Future and I do a lot of work, advocacy advocacy work here in Utah with schools primarily. And I was putting together a presentation and had a quote from Marty. And I'm like, I am just gonna message her. So even though her friend card was full, I messaged her and I said, Hey, I want to write this book. And within like 10 minutes, she messaged me back and she's like, Yeah, I do want to write this book. And so then, of course, I freak out and I call all my friends at Ray's, and I'm like, You guys, you have no idea who just messaged me, right? Because the fangirl kicks in.

SPEAKER_02 10:43

And uh anyway, I'm like, is this real? We had this whole conversation stream. Oh, I should send you that too, Marty. About is this really her?

SPEAKER_01 10:50

Or are we getting, you know, I don't remember the word they use, but are we getting cranked or something or something?

SPEAKER_02 10:54

Yeah. This can't really hear. Who responds this fast? And she's like, I'm on my way to go skiing, but let's talk next week. Anyway, we finally talked, and um, yeah, we wrote a book in a couple months.

SPEAKER_01 11:06

And then you wrote a book.

SPEAKER_04 11:07

Four months later, four months later, I added a line for Amy. She's she got an extra friend friend line on my friend card. You made room. I made room. Yes, yeah.

SPEAKER_01 11:19

She did, and I'm so grateful. And now we're friends, and she knows all the trauma, and she's met all of my grandbabies, and I just it's been fun. So that's how we met. My her friend card was full, and then it wasn't. And then it wasn't.

SPEAKER_00 11:31

She made room. Well, what a delightful. I mean, we can laugh and giggle, and just such a delightful embodiment of presence and connection and serve and return, and you know, being persistent, like I'm being serious, like all these attachment themes, and then like the gorgeousness that can come out of that, which is of course a new friendship that you're so glad you made room for on your friend card, but also this brilliant new resource that's so, so needed. So let's talk about that creating a connected classroom. Tell me like what your hopes and dreams were for this book. Like, why now? What did you really want to like get out into the world?

SPEAKER_05 12:19

Yeah, I'll I'll take this one because I I had been wanting to write this book. And um, I had actually started writing it with Casey Saul and Casey Call, who wrote the foreword, and then also Callie Lackey, and then Callie unexpectedly passed away. And so I'd already had the foundation. It was supposed to be the connected therapist and then the connected classroom or the connected teacher was gonna be the name of it. And then, you know, Rob's gonna write the connected manager, and we were gonna have this whole series. And when Callie passed away, um, I just kind of put it on hold. And so when Amy reached out to me, I was really excited about it. And I also had new software that I was wanting to try out that helps with editing. And I wanted to see how will this even work because I do have other ideas in my head for other other books, other topics. And so I really wanted to kind of use this as a trial, but also knew that it was needed. And all of my teacher friends are so burned out and struggling. And especially since COVID, I have some because I worked in the schools for 10 years in special ed, I have a lot of my dear, dear colleagues and friends that I still keep in touch with, and they would just tell me how hard it was. And so when Amy approached me, the idea of if I can do even the smallest thing to help teachers today go better or to help them understand why we're trying to push for these new ways of thinking and being in your program as well, Robin, just watching in the club and how people are so struggling with school and they're starting to homeschool their children and just for the parents as well to give them a resource that maybe they could, you know, gift to a teacher, or I thought we need to have a resource where we can gently and kindly give this to the school systems and say there is a better way, and it will make the teachers' lives easier as well as the kids and the parents. And so it was this perfect storm that was kind of brewing in my own background. And then when Amy reached out, it just felt like absolutely, and my husband was. He was like, Do you know this woman? I was like, Nope. But if it goes bad, I'm only out a couple of months of my life, right? And if it goes good, then we are hopefully we really feel like you know, kind of turning the Titanic and the Suez Canal, right? Or the Panama Panama Canal. Like we're trying to change an entire system. And we hope that your book started it, Robin, the big big bathing behaviors. You've started a little bit of a movement. And Amy and I are hoping to kind of come in and just put some more fire behind that. And that's the goal, really.

SPEAKER_01 15:58

I and a lot of my story is in the book. Um, but I hit what most teachers do towards the middle to the end of my career, where I'm just like, I don't want to be here anymore. I don't like this. This isn't fun. It was killing me. And then I also had these kids at home who were literally destroying me from the inside out. And I didn't know what to do with any of it. And as I started this shift, it was not easy. Um, and that story I think is really portrayed in the book. I hit a lot of um snags with administration and districts and things that don't really appreciate this new mode of thinking. Um, but I got a new principal a couple of years ago. And I we had a kid who was having a meltdown in the middle of the hall. And uh for me, it was very easy to de-escalate it, right? You just go in, we behavior matched, we did all of those things, uh, co-regulated, whatever you want to call it. And at the end of that experience, he was like, I don't understand you. I don't understand what you do. He goes, I don't get you and I couldn't do it. He goes, but whatever you're doing, it works. And at that moment, I was like, it does. And this is something we can teach. And that's what I that's what I told him. I said, I can teach teachers how to do this. And we had been working with Raise the Future for a while. We have a program with Raise the Future called Tools for Transformation, which is literally a curriculum that teachers that we can come and train teachers on that that does a lot of what we do in the book. We we went a different way with Marty than we did in that, but it's still the same basic idea. Let's meet sensory needs, let's create felt safety. And as I started working on that, I realized teacher school does not teach you how to do this. There is nothing in teacher school that talks about attachment, that talks about sensory needs, that talks about the impact of trauma, that talks. Nowhere in teacher school was I even taught how a brain learns, right? And as I'm looking at it, I'm like, wait a minute, these are things teachers need to know. And so it's my goal with this book is that teachers can start to see their kids through a new lens. They can start to see our profession through a new lens. When I first started teaching, I told the guy who hired me, my principal at the time, I'm like, I would do this job for free because I am that idiot that loves to stand in front of a room full of kids and I think they're hysterical. And even when they're smelly and doing inappropriate things, I still love them to pieces. And watching them learn is just my happy place. And for years I was like, I'm just doing time until I retire, right? But I'm back to loving it. Like I love working with the kids. I don't love grading papers. I hate professional development unless I'm running it. Um I don't necessarily love talking to parents, right? I hate all of that part of it. But to be in my classroom with my students is become a happy place again. And if we can do that for teachers, imagine what we can do for kids. We are failing our kids. Marty's heard me tell this a million times. Our kids are drowning in public schools because our teachers, it's not that they don't care, it's that they don't know. And the system is so hung up on PBIS and let's make sure there's a consequence and a behavior chart and all of that, that we're missing the part the kids need, which is connection. Right? Yeah. So that's my goal is that we can give teachers the skills that they can find what they love again and that parents and teachers can become a team again instead of adversaries in what's happening. I mean, if we could wrap a kid in these kind of programs at home and at school and in law enforcement or, you know, whatever they're in, imagine what we could do to society as a whole. Like schools and home, that's where kids are. Yeah. So putting us all on the same team.

SPEAKER_00 19:45

Yeah, that's interesting because that's how Marty and I met essentially, right? Is the Travis County collaborative, right? Of this intention was to bring all of these ideas and concepts and way of being with kids into all the places a child is schools, you know, foster parents, therapy, um, churches, right? That was such a multidisciplinary collaborative with that intention, law enforcement judges, yeah. Um, to be able to see like what happens if every adult that a child interacts with is seeing them through this lens.

SPEAKER_05 20:27

I just I get goosebumps looking at this screen right now, and I'm like, and we're doing it, girls. We're doing it. Like that's I I've gotten to know Amy um and and I know Robin, and and that is the heart of all three of us on this call. And I just that just uh just makes me so happy.

SPEAKER_00 20:47

What do you think is gonna be maybe one of the most impactful or the most um in the book, like the the thing that somebody a reader is gonna walk away with saying, Oh, this part, this really changed things for me.

SPEAKER_01 21:02

Or I I think for me, the part that I hope that they get from it is that you can view behavior as a need, not as them trying to hurt you. Yeah. Because we have moved. I can't tell you how many times I hear teachers tell me, well, they're eight, they're 14, they should just act like it. And I'm like, they are. Right. 14-year-olds run around and do stupid stuff. Yeah, right. Like that's just how it is. And start to see the behaviors as as communication, right? Not just as these, these things uh teachers tell, yeah, that that's probably my biggest thing is can you please start seeing these kids as humans who are really doing the best they can? They are using their skills all day long. Their skills are just not what you want them to be. Yeah. So if you need them to change, that's on you. You're the teacher. Change, give them the skills, yeah, right. And and this book will hopefully provide them a way to at least start to give them the skills. It's not, it's not everything it needs to be. It's a drop in the bucket for what we need, but I think it's a good start.

unknown 22:10

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 22:10

I don't know. Marty, how would you change that?

SPEAKER_05 22:12

Well, I would absolutely agree with you. And I would also say that the beta readers that I sent it to my teacher friends when I said, Here, we've we've written this new book. What do you think of it? They all felt so seen. And they felt like they were empowered to make those changes that you just talked about, Amy. And they felt like they had been working against a system. And so to hear your words and to hear some of our dialogue back and forth, the book every chapter ends with a section called Let's Get Real, where Amy and I talk back and forth. It's like, well, this is great if you're telling me that I'm starting. Be looking for possums and watchdogs, but like I got 40 kids in my class, what do I do? And Amy's like, you pick two, right? And then the next week you pick two more. And just the way of making it so accessible for the teachers to feel like they really are being heard. I can't wait to give this to every teacher that I know. Really?

SPEAKER_00 23:09

Well, I think that's a huge accomplishment because when I um am invited to train educators, first of all, up front, I'm always, you know, letting folks know who are interested in bringing me in. Like, I'm not an educator. I've never stood in front of like, I don't even like to run groups of children. Like I am with kids one at a time. So I can give you the background, I can give you the theory. I can translate the tricky neuroscience. I can give you this metaphor. Like I can, like, I can do all that, and I'm great at that. But then how you apply it to a group of dysregulated kids, like I'm gonna have to like offer that back to you, and you're gonna go and kind of do all that brainstorming yourself because one, I have no business attempting to do that for folks because I've I've not done it. And I do find that folks can feel really frustrated by that, right? Like, all of this is great in theory, but but once you have three, four, twelve, you know, plus kids, what are we supposed to do? So, Amy, I'd love to hear from you, like with that, you know, struggle that teachers are having in particular, like what are what are some of the you know, number one ways that you can support folks through that specific barrier?

SPEAKER_01 26:07

I think sorry, you're gonna hear bells ring. We just moved into lunch and I'm doing this from school. So welcome to being a teacher. Yes, we're very much Pavlovian around these parts. Um, I think the hardest thing for teachers is, and I I call it the teacher work and the social work brain, and you can call it whatever you want to, but teacher and social work brain are very different, and yet they're working for the exact same goals.

SPEAKER_00 26:29

Yes.

SPEAKER_01 26:29

And we have these very different languages, but they mean the same thing. Yes. And when I moved into this social work brain, I'm like, I need someone to translate what you all are saying. And I got so lucky to work with a couple of women who are amazing at helping my teacher brain understand their social work brain. And so, really, what has happened here is social workers are going to read it and go, oh, yeah, this, this, this, and this. And teachers are gonna read it and go, oh, that's what they're talking about. Because the goal, one of my goals was to bridge that gap. We fight against each other so often. But I tell, I tell anybody I train all the time, teachers are brats. We're awful. We're the worst students on the planet. And I say that with all the love in my heart, having been in a classroom for 30 years now. If you have not been in front of a classroom, you have nothing to offer us. For sure. And we will look at you with contempt. Oh, I'm so sorry. It's about to just go.

SPEAKER_00 27:31

Um, but oh no, I've been in front of those people. I know exactly what's happening. We we're we feel it.

SPEAKER_02 27:38

We're horrible. I have been the person at the back of the room that's like, I'm not listening to you.

SPEAKER_01 27:44

You haven't been in a classroom. And that's where I think Marty and I honestly were the perfect duo to write it because I need her neuroscience brain. That is not my area of expertise. I can understand it, and I can understand it because you people like you and Marty put it into words my teacher brain can understand. Yeah. But I can take what you're telling me and I can put it in front of these educators and say, this is how you use it. So when you have a kid who's melting down and they're constantly tapping a paper and they're con or their desk and they're constantly tapping people, maybe they need some proprioceptive input. And teachers are like, no, they just need to stop. I'm like, no, their behavior's telling you something, right? So let's get that proprioceptive need or whatever it is, but have to play around with it and figure it out. But um get all of those needs met. And so I think to my grave, I will tell you teachers will only listen to teachers. Sorry, it's just us we're you know, it is what it is. Yeah, and there is something about standing in front of a classroom that until you have done it day after day, year after year, you just don't get it. And so I'm telling all of you teachers who are listening, I get it. This is not the book that's gonna stand up there and tell you you need to connect and then give you no skills. Yeah, we're gonna say, you need to connect, and this is how you do it in a classroom. This is how you make eye contact in a classroom, this is how you use healthy touch in a classroom, this is how you behavior match in a classroom, this is how you meet sensory needs in a classroom, and this is how you do it all while you wrap it around curriculum. If we do not wrap it around curriculum, it means nothing, right? Because at the end of the day, social workers' job at the end of the day is to be the therapist or to create the change in the behavior or whatever. Our job at the end of the day is to teach the curriculum. Right. So we have to stop. I am so sorry. I am so sorry. You can edit out all of this back.

SPEAKER_00 29:36

No, no, no. This is just life. And I probably wouldn't be my life. I wouldn't be surprised if it's my software is not even picking it up.

SPEAKER_01 29:45

So apologies for all of you who are listening, the announcements are going off because we're at my school. But anyway, I just think we need to give teachers the skills to meet the needs while they're teaching the curriculum because we are still accountable for these tests. Yes, we are still accountable for kids learning how to read. And that is our ultimate job. But we need to do it in a way that actually lends itself to learning. When I have a kid who's shut down and feeling unsafe in class, they're not learning a single thing. Like I have teachers who tell me all the time, it's about the curriculum. I have to teach in the curriculum. And I'm like, you're missing the whole point. The curriculum means nothing to them until they feel safe. And that is a hard sell for teachers. And if you have social workers who come in and say that, they're gonna look at you and say, and then they're gonna look at me and they're gonna be like, oh, because I'm gonna say, Yeah, I sorry, this is how it is, right? Like, and and you can't tell me I don't know what the classroom is because I'm still full-time in the classroom. Yeah, you know, um go ahead, Marty.

SPEAKER_05 30:45

Yeah, and I think that one of the things that was beautiful about us coming together is that I did work in the schools for 10 years. And so I could bring that lens of trying to do these things, right? And I was the therapist coming in and telling the teacher, like, here's all these wonderful, you know, fidgets, and I'm gonna leave them here. And then I would come back the next week and they'd be like, they threw them all across the room and get the fidgets out of here. And so when Amy would talk about things, there was an element of like, oh, I get that. And and this is not my lane, right? Like this is, and so the book is really a lot of, and I wouldn't say staying in our lanes, but it's that wonderful, we were driving the same car, but we knew when to go into the lanes and who would who was to take over the driver's seat. And and I think that's important uh because of all the things that Amy just said. And I also think it was important because the OTs do go into the buildings. And if an OT picks this book up, my hope is that they can see a bit more of the teacher's plight and that they can really understand a little bit more of where those teachers are coming from and look at the strategies that we've put forth as more of an offering of this is more likely to actually be carried over. And and how do we as OTs make those suggestions? And we talk in the book. There's like I said, there's so many fun parts where we talk about that funkal, right? And we swoop in, we're the fun uncle, and then we leave before the mandated state uh state testing comes in, right? Which is kind of how teachers feel. And so, how did we write a book that we're really asking teachers to make this shift while also validating all of those things? And so that's why it was so important to have Amy's voice that you're hearing right now so well articulated of that yes, like she needs to be the one that is saying these things. And then the OTs of the social workers need to also be in the car with her and help to guide. And and so I think that the book, I think it did it beautifully.

SPEAKER_00 32:45

I think what I'm hearing both of you say so clearly is that we can remember that teachers became teachers because they love kids, yeah, and they wanted to teach kids this thing that they love, right? Like I'm married to an educator, and you know, my son went to essentially what really in many ways felt like a military academy and learned how to be a pilot from a pilot in the like in the military, and there was something so amazing about this human being who was uh like a fighter jet pilot in the military who became a high school teacher. There was just something so magical about this human and how much he loved his um craft and he loved kids, and he wanted to teach what he loved to kids, right? And my husband's a musician and he's been a music teacher, and I think there is it's easy to forget that piece that's to be true about teachers that they have dedicated their lives to this because they love kids and they want to teach this kids that the subject that like excites them, you know, more than anything. And when kids are having such enormous behavior challenges, they're not able to do any of that. Yeah. And really helping, I think, all of us, especially who aren't teachers, because we can be just as big as snots as teachers can be, right? About like teachers this and teachers that. And if the teacher was just and if blah, blah, blah, right? If we can all just sort of like look at each other and remember, oh no, we're all here, just like you said, Amy, for the same reason. We love kids. And we have this part of us that wants to be with kids all day long and share ourselves and our knowledge and our excitement for the future with kids. So, how do we get back to that being like this common denominator? So you love to go to work again, right? And equip teachers with these skills because it's just true that like the classroom doesn't look like it did 30 years ago. Classroom doesn't look like it did eight years ago, no, five years ago. And that's such a key piece, I think. If we can remember that again, not an educator and would never want to be, I'd be a terrible classroom teacher. I really would be terrible at it. How do we hold that at our fore at the front of our mind? Like, that's what this teacher wants more than anything.

SPEAKER_01 35:14

I think the only way we do that is to bring play and felt safety back to the classroom.

SPEAKER_03 35:20

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 35:20

Right now we spend so much time with rote memorization and with testing and with giving these kids computers, and they have lost the ability to play. And I mean, the research is really clear on this. Kids learn through play. And so we have to bring play back. Play also disarms fear, right? Which means that kids can learn when they're playing. And so you'll hear in the book, I try to play every day in my classroom. Like we have little animals that we play with, and there's a really funny story in the book about that. And I play with Play-Doh and we play with sand trays and we do all of these things in order to play. And I'm teaching seventh, eighth, and ninth graders. So I'm teaching middle school and early high school, and these kids are playing. And I also think schools right now are inherently so unsafe. Yes. And not unsafe because they're necessarily unsafe, but because they feel unsafe.

SPEAKER_03 36:13

Right.

SPEAKER_01 36:14

Teachers do not feel safe here, kids do not feel safe here. And until we can figure out that connection piece so that kids have safety in school, they're not, we're not going to get anywhere either. Right. So we have to start looking at this systemically different. We have to start um rewarding teachers. And I don't mean with like rewards and tangible things, but like giving teachers the credit for you're building a really good connection. Let's let's use that, right? Instead of punishing them. Like there's some stuff in there that was really difficult for me to write about some of the stuff that I had to go through as I first implemented this because teachers are also, I guarantee you, some of them are sitting there listening, saying, This sounds all great and I love this idea, but my administrator is never gonna let me do it.

SPEAKER_00 37:00

That was gonna be my next question, actually, which is assuming we don't all have an administrator or a person in charge who comes in and watches us be magic with kids and then says, Yes, we want what you want. What does that teacher do to create connection with an administrator who is also in charge of a very stressed out, traumatized system? Yes.

SPEAKER_01 37:27

I don't know if we answer it completely because I don't know if we have a complete answer. Yeah, right. But we do definitely address it in the book, and I think we address it pretty well. I think like a whole chapter. There is a whole chapter on the chapter. And and we're we're pretty, I'm pretty open in what happened to me. I I of course it's not super descriptive or whatever, but um, the names of the innocent shall stay nameless. But um I there's things that we give them ideas on how to do. You can still do a few things in your classroom, you can still um find your coffee club, you can still find your people at school. And I have a coffee club at my school that has changed everything for me. And they are my people. And we talk a lot about them in the book too. But I think everything you read in the book is something that I have tried in school. There is nothing in this book that has not been tried in a public school by me, right? So if it's in there, it's been done and it's been perfected, and there's it's been successful and unsuccessful, and there have been absolute explosions in my classroom.

SPEAKER_02 38:36

I mean, word of point, don't ever do pinatas with the flower mixture. Always use, always use the watered down glue. I can tell you, oh, and glitter, glitter has its own set of rules. Like these are all things that I have learned over time.

SPEAKER_01 38:49

Right. And I'm happy to share them all. But everything in there is either my personal experience or it's shared with permission from someone that I know, or it's something that I have done. And so I think that's where eventually when we start creating safety in school and we start seeing teachers as human, I think eventually it's not gonna be fast, right? We're you're talking about systemic change. Yeah. But I think we can start getting there. And if we can get one school here and one teacher here, the movement will grow, right? Like that's because this is it. This you want here's here's my my my end of all story here. This is the only way we are gonna get to kids right now. You can continue to do what you've been doing for the last seven years, it's not working. And our schools are showing you it's not working, and their behavior is showing you it's not working, it's not working. I am telling you, this does. Yeah, it's not gonna be the perfect answer, right? But it works. Yeah, so until people start doing what works, nothing's gonna change.

SPEAKER_00 39:47

Yeah, yeah, yeah. Y'all, I'm just so grateful that um Amy, you were bold and told Marty you were gonna be friends. And Marty, you made some space. No, no, I'm just using it. I know it does not work like what.

SPEAKER_05 40:04

And it's hard not to be friends with Amy, though. Once you have one conversation with her, you're like, oh yeah. And people are gonna come up to Amy now and be like, Can I be your friend? She's gonna find out real fast.

SPEAKER_02 40:15

I would be like, I'm sorry, Marty told me Marty took my last slot. There's no more. I don't know. Maybe we can make a sponsor you, Robin. I'll have to see. Okay, you come highly recommended.

SPEAKER_00 40:25

I would be honored. Clearly, Marty's the one who like really made out here. And so I would be honored, Amy. I mean, it's just always magical to meet people who are, you know, loving this work the same way, loving these kids the same way, doing the really, you know, doing the hard work, but also doing it all in our really unique way and recognizing that we're all doing our own unique thing in our own unique way, right? We're not trying to, you know, do things that we're not equipped to do, and instead finding the people who are equipped to do those. I mean, I think that's just really powerful. And I think that is a piece of how we are gonna create this systemic change. And it is unfortunately exceptionally slow, but we're gonna keep doing it anyway. So, Amy Marty, tell everybody where they can go. What's the best place to go online to get your book?

SPEAKER_05 41:19

I would say right now Amazon, and it's called Creating a Connected Classroom. There is a connected classroom out there by a woman named Jody Smith. So we had to change the name because the same last name, same title looks like.

SPEAKER_00 41:30

Oh, yeah, the last same thing. Okay, so creating a connected classroom.

SPEAKER_05 41:34

Yeah. And I tell people to look for Amy's kids on the front. Her grandbabies are on the front and they're looking out through a window. And so, yeah, on Amazon, it's on Kindle. We've got paperback, we've got hardback, and we're just so excited to get it out in the world. We sold a hundred copies in the first week, which is amazing to me. Absolutely amazing. Not really have much advertising. Um, and that just shows you how much people love this because they buy a copy for themselves, and then what I'm seeing, people are texting me that they're then buying it.

SPEAKER_00 42:05

Buying it from friends, right?

SPEAKER_05 42:06

Yeah, which is the biggest compliment I think you could get. So, yeah, Amazon is where you're gonna find it. Amy Huggins is her last name, and then mine is Marty Smith.

SPEAKER_00 42:15

Well, Marty, it's always wonderful to be with you. Also, it's just kind of a part of my regular everyday life now. Amy, this has been a joy. Thank you.

SPEAKER_01 42:25

It's been so fun to meet you.

SPEAKER_00 42:26

Yes, same. I mean, to talk about Salt Lake and those Olympics and being old enough for the Olympics to come back. Oh my gosh. Um, but just to also just meet, you know, another person who's out there doing this work and loving these kids. I hope this is the first of like many, many times we can be in connection with each other.

SPEAKER_02 42:46

That'd be awesome. Yes. All right, ladies. Thank you. Thank you. Thanks, Robin.