Feel the Fear and Do it Anyway with Kate Lindley

In today's episode, Alex had a chance to connect with Kate Lindley who was on a previous episode of the Sober Yoga Girl Podcast sharing her sober story! Kate is a former school teacher who has spent the last eight months driving her Jeep from Dubai to China. In this episode Kate shares about what it's like to travel slow, some misconceptions and stereotypes debunked about the Middle East, and some of the lessons she's learned along the way. Follow the remaining four months of Kate's journey by following her on Instagram @explorewith.kate.

Transcript

Hi, friend. This is Alex McRobs, founder of The Mindful Life Practice, and you're listening to the Sober Yoga Girl podcast. I'm a Canadian who moved across the world to the Middle East at age 23, and I never went back. I got sober in 2019, and I now live full-time in Bali, Indonesia. I've made it my mission to help other women around the world stop drinking, start yoga, and change their lives through my online Sober Girls Yoga community. You're not alone, and a sober life can be fun and fulfilling. Let me show you how.

Hello. Welcome back to another episode of Sober Yoga Girl Podcast. I haven't recorded an episode with a guest in a while, I think a couple of months, so I'm really happy to be back here. And today I have a guest who has actually been on the show already before. Her name is Kate Lindley. And I saw her last week in Dubai, and I was saying I think her episode is one of the most downloaded episodes I've ever done, which is pretty cool. And she's a friend of mine. She also was a teacher in Dubai, also from Toronto, also sober, also teaches yoga. So a lot in common. And in the first episode I did with her, which we actually recorded about two years ago this month, she shared a lot about her sober journey. And so if you want to hear more about the context of that, you could give that episode a listen. And in this episode, we're going to be talking more about something, a really exciting journey that she's been on this year. I'm really interested in learning more. So before we get into that, I'm just wondering if you want to share anything else about your yoga, sober, journey, anything about who you are?

Well, first of all, thank you so much for inviting me back on the show. I'm so excited to be here and to share about the journey. Otherwise, I'm trying to do yoga as much as I can, considering that I'm not teaching right now. I'm having a little break, let's say, or on a little break with the expedition, and then I'll get back into it. And because of the nature of the expedition, driving my Jeep Gladiator throughout all the lands from Dubai to China, I haven't had too much Wi-Fi connectivity to facilitate different yoga classes, but I'm still doing my own practice and I'll get back into it once I'm more sedentary, once I stay in one spot. So once again, thanks for inviting me, and I'm looking forward to sharing.

Amazing. So happy to have you here. And yeah, so Kate has been doing the most incredibly inspiring expedition this year, a journey. So she's been driving from in her Jeep all the way from Dubai to China, and it's just been amazing to follow it along. So when did you start it and how far have you gotten?

So I started in April. April 27th left, towards Abu Dhabi and then crossed the border into Saudi Arabia. And now the Jeep is currently in Mongolia. It's there because I have to get the visa for China. So I flew back to Dubai and had to do all the paperwork and get the the visa for China. So that's why I'm on a little break. And it's okay because it was very cold in Mongolia. It was negative 25. So think about outdoor camping and cooking and sleeping. I have an auto-home tent on top of the Jeep bed. And that just... It wasn't exciting. It wasn't fun near the end. It wasn't comfortable, I should say. It was still exciting, but not not very comfortable.

So.

Back here, and I'm going to continue the expedition to China and then make my way back towards the UAE in January. And then hopefully the expedition will finish once I cross about five countries in April, let's say, beginning to mid-April. Yeah. So which...

Go ahead. I was just going to ask you, which countries are left. What are those five countries that you're going to cross?

The countries that are left are China, obviously. So I'm going back to Mongolia, two days driving through Mongolia to the border with China, and then I'll spend about two weeks in China. Kagand, Pakistan, Afghanistan, and Iran. And for Afghanistan and Iran, I will have someone joining me, and I will not be there, basically. So I'm going to stop the expedition and then go to Canada and just not continue that and then come back to Dubai.

Okay. So the car will be driven through those countries. Yeah.

So I'm essentially taking a different route on the way back to go through China from east to west and then exploring different countries and to finish off the stans, let's say. I went on to two stans, it was Pakistan and Kazakhstan. Didn't go to Pakistan yet. Afghanistan and Iran. Well, Iran is not a stand, but Afghanistan, I'm not keen to go there right now. Perhaps in the future, for sure, but right now, it just doesn't sit well with me to go there, so yeah.

Yeah, that makes sense. Wow, this whole journey is so incredible. So what inspired you to do this?

To be very honest, well, as you mentioned, I was an elementary school teacher. I was getting a little bit tired of working in the corporate education world, let's say. And I was teaching online during the pandemic, and I just wanted a break. I wanted to do something different. And this travel, which I like to call slow travel, is much different than flying to the destination, spending a week or two weeks. It's very much you're immersed in the country and the culture altogether. And I just love being connected to nature. So as you know, living in the UAE, it's a beautiful, beautiful place. Although I want to explore outside of this area and this region, let's say, even outside of the desert. Those places, do you want me to go through expedition route, let's say?

Yeah, that would be amazing.

That was the best. Yeah, 19 countries, 31,000 kilometers. So starting in UAE, back to Saudi Arabia, Bahrain, back to Saudi Arabia. As you know, Saudi Arabia borders all these countries, Kuwait, and then back down, Saudi Arabia, all the way across to the west part and then near the Red Sea in Yenbo, we spent three weeks in Saudi Arabia. It's a beautiful, beautiful place. I highly recommend people to go and explore there, considering now they have opened it up to tourists. Then after Saudi, we went up to Jordan, Syria, Lebanon, and then took a ferry boat from Lebanon to Turkey and then to say a different ferry to Cyprus and a little island time there. Then we decided to go back to Turkey over cross Kurdistan, which was also quite interesting place, to Armenia, Georgia, and then Russia over a little bit and down to Kazakhstan, Uzbekistan, back to Kazakhstan, back to Russia, and then to Mongolia.

So yeah. It's so incredible. And one of the things that I really love about what you're talking about is slow travel and really spending time in places. And I'm thinking about it as you're sharing. And I think about from my perspective, and I'm sure a lot of listeners or modern-day people would probably relate to this, is like, for me, I'm like, Oh, my God, I can't imagine giving up a whole year and being disconnected from the internet and not building my business or not working or whatever. And I feel like it's so hard for people to just take time off for learning and joy and curiosity and fun. And that's what I find so inspiring about what you've done because it's just a year of like, I'm going to learn and have fun and explore. And I think it's so hard for people in this day and age to really honor that and step into that. It feels like we always need to be accomplishing or doing or...

It's so true, the societal conditioning that I have come to deem as the right way to live life, like the conditional way... I'm sorry, not conditional, the conventional way. It was uncomfortable for me at some point because I'm like you, a retired teacher, well-prener, entrepreneur, and I'm used to all these scheduled days, this time, this time, this time to have all this freedom. And then every day, I'm seeing new and different things, which is incredible, which is amazing. But if you're used to working and being on a schedule for a long time, then it takes a little bit of just letting go, surrendering, being in flow, being okay with not having a set plan. Of course, I had to map out the route and say, let's try to get to this spot. But then again, just understanding that it's okay to stop in this field and relax and do a meditation or go for a run, and or cook. Sometimes there were no restaurants around. A lot of times, I shouldn't say sometimes, a lot of times, especially in Central Asia and me being a vegan as well, it was very hard to find food or let's say, vegetarian food.

So altogether, just to spiral back to what you initially said, yeah, I'm very proud of myself. I won't lie. I am very proud of myself for this because it just allowed me to be in the present moment and really savor these unexpected moments. You know what I mean? Because it's one thing to travel to a place for a week, and then even if it's an all inclusive or even if it's just within one area, then you want to do as much as you can. And it's the same, but you have the agency and the flexibility to decide exactly what, exactly when. And the routine is good. The longer I was on the road, the more I was craving for my morning practice or even some sunset yoga, listening to mantras, doing these things that really ignite and align and feel good to my soul. So it was a lot of introspective time and just reflection of who I am as a person. And yes, I am a traveler, but what else is there about me and what else do I love in order to get the most out of the trip? Yeah. Yeah.

Yeah. Wow. That's so amazing. So do you think that you would have ever done this if you hadn't been alcohol-free? If you hadn't been sober?

Oh, that's a great question. And I would say probably no, considering. And I remember from the first episode when you asked me like, What's the best part about being sober? And I said, Fresh mornings. So when you're sleeping in a field and the cows are wooing and there's a lot of activity. A lot of times, just park in random places because they allow for life camping. The governments say that that's okay. So these different areas where I was, anything goes. And even some traffic noise. But generally speaking, it was a lot of animals, horses, cattle, different birds, of course, waking me up. So back to your initial question, I would say that probably no. My priorities would be different. I would be spending my money in different places. It would be different priorities of life. And so, being sober and focusing on holistic wellness has really allowed me as well to step outside of my comfort zone. So as you know, the different adverse effects of alcohol in the brain in general, I don't know. I'm not an expert. I don't know. But speaking for me personally, I think it wouldn't... Let's say going to Syria.

I think if I was in that mental state and my brain with drinking and consume alcohol, I wouldn't be able to be as confident or as okay with the fact of... It would drive my anxiety. That's what I mean to say. I think my anxiety would be triggered so much more. And also the fresh mornings, I would be hungover. And then I wouldn't be able to drive. I wouldn't be able to relax. I would be like laying down, like I can't move, and someone helped me and bring me a garbage pill beside me so I can comment. Sorry to have that beautiful disclosure. But alcohol and I, as I mentioned, just we don't mix, and it was just a very tumultuous relationship. So I am super happy four years into it. Sober, life is personally for me, the good life. And yeah, for my time, my energy, my bank account, my sanity, and just for allowing me to feel more rounded and more relaxed and more in the flow.

Yeah.

It's a very long trip.

Yeah, it is long. I'm blown away by it. When you told me that you started in April, I was like, I've been following it along on social media, but I'm just like, Whoa, it's already eight months. It's incredible. Yeah, 200.

And I was doing a daily blog in 222 days since leaving Dubai, coming back. Yeah, really long time. So that duration, you have to have a stable mind, let's say, for that duration being on the road and consistently seeing these different places and everything.

Let's talk a little bit about... So you mentioned earlier about anxiety around Syria, and that made me think about just both you and I are from Canada. We both lived in the Middle East. We both lived in Kuwait and then the UAE. And something when I was moving to the Middle East was like a lot of misconceptions and stereotypes about the Middle East and safety. I'm just wondering, were there friends and family that were worried about you driving along through the Middle East? Did you have to have any conversations about stereotypes and misconceptions?

Yeah, that's a great question. Well, considering that I've lived outside of Canada for the past 12 years, and I lived in various countries, including Turkey and Kuwait and now UAE, and I've traveled to a few of these countries in the Middle East a few times. So I think my friends and family know the type of person that I am. I am a risk taker. So, yeah, I did have a few conversations, but at this point, they're pretty much like, It's okay, Kate knows what she's doing. And in Syria, I drove with someone else. So for some of the trip, I was not alone. I was with someone else. And we had to hire, or rather the government in Syria only allows tourists. So you can go from Syria to Lebanon with the transit visa. But we wanted to explore Syria, and so we hired a private guide. So that gave me a lot of peace of mind. And let's say when I was telling my mom, who was not afraid to still question my choices, I comfort her in saying that we have to have a guide. And he honestly made me feel super safe and secure as soon as I saw him.

And as soon as I saw how he just handled himself and everything within the land border between Jordan and Syria, I was like, This man knows what he's doing, and I feel very safe and secure. So that really helped. Otherwise, yeah, I think that anything can—and this is what I remind people—anything can happen anywhere. So, unfortunately, because of what the media or how the media portrays certain areas, especially in the Middle East, it's like, danger zone. You're going to get bombed, you're going to get robbed, you're going to get harassed, all these things. And it's like, thank you for your opinion. I see where this is coming from. I'm going to continue to live my life without fear. And I was just having a conversation with someone yesterday. Maybe this is a little bit extreme, but I'm going to say it anyways. I'm content with how I've lived my life and I'm 34 years old. That's not that old. But I'm okay with knowing that if it's pre-written for me to go at a certain time, it's okay. I find comfort in that. That's how I... Not to say that I don't get nervous or I don't get anxious or I don't overthink things.

It still happens. But I have this peace of mind that it's okay. I'm protected. The universe has my back, and what will be will be. And if it's going to be something really difficult, challenging, or my life is gone, okay, it's just... Yeah, it'ss just meant to happen. So some people are like, whoa, you're crazy why you're saying that? That's a bit extreme. This and that. But it's just their opinion. So it all depends on your opinion and your perception and your perspective on life. Some people are doing crazier things than me, and kudos to them, but it just depends on your experiences, and I feel as though once you step outside of your comfort zone and build on your experiences, then certain things don't phase you as much, just like anything. If you are a pro-athlete or something, let's say, extreme in something, then the little things that other people would consider to be a big deal aren't as big of a deal. So safety and security, my main point is things can happen anywhere. Lots of things happen in North America and Europe, everywhere. So now the world is just at a point where live your life and find your comfort in yourself or you don't really know.

I love that. So yeah.

And it speaks to this concept in yoga philosophy. I don't know if you're familiar with the Keches and, which is fear of dying. And Pontangali says that this is one of the five causes of human suffering. And people are so afraid of dying, but they're really afraid of living. And this would be the example. People are afraid of doing something like doing a road trip because what if I get bombed? What if this happens? And you've outlined it so well and put it so eloquently there, you have to be accepting of like, okay, if this is my time that's meant to go, then I feel at peace with the way I've lived my life. And that's one way to be living yoga.

Exactly. Yeah. And I felt this way. I remember distinctly the first time I flew to Jordan from Kuwait, and there was this person beside me, and I was stereotyping him and judging. And he was just acting a little bit weird. So I was like, okay, just keep my center is fine. And then I reminded myself like, if you're going to go, then you're going to go up to plane as well was flying, if the plane is going to go down, then it's just pre-bredden. I scuba dive as well. Oh, something had happened scuba diving. Okay, So if you're a risk taker and you just want to continue your experiences, then it's just a part of the journey. It's the part of being a human. Absolutely. Absolutely. I love just bringing it back to yoga, but yeah.

Yes, always. Everything is yoga.

Yeah, it's true.

I'm wondering, what has been one of your favorite moments of the trip so far?

People ask me this a lot. Let me tap into my internal hard drive and my computer brain over here. I would say, oh, there's been so many, but what stuck out to me when I initially thought about this question is one night I was doing a full moon ceremony in Saudi Arabia, in the moment, I think. And I watched the full moon rise over the desert. And I've been living in the desert for some time, but it was never like this. And I had shows with my friend at the time. So we had these desert roses and we spent the day digging to find these desert rose crystals. So I made this incredible altar, let's say, just makeshift altar. And just the feeling and the silence. I appreciate silence so much, and that's it. There's lots of times where there was funny things that happen or people that we met, but just being one with nature, with the moon and watching it rise up, and it was so full. Yeah, that was a moment that... And I told the person I was with as well, This is super special. This is a special moment. I love it.

Sometimes moments are the most impactful and the most memorable.

I just love the simplicity in that answer.

Yeah, and eating outside, too. I love those moments when I prepare my food and then I just sit down, whether it's on the grass or on a makeshift table and just enjoy being outside. I think also being outside for the majority of the trip allowed me to not be really scared because it was like, when you're in the city a lot and the energy, for me at least, it's very draining and it's very anxiety-draving. But when you're in nature, it's like just you and Mother Earth, Mother Gai is there with you. With that, those moments just allowed me to be content and happy and what more do you want?

I love that. And on the flip side of that, what has been one of your most challenging moments?

Getting stuck. Because when no one's around, so on the flip side, it's amazing when no one's around and you're well with nature. But when no one's, let's say, okay, in Mongolia, Mongolia was the last trip, the last country, and we were there for one month. And in the Altai Mountains, let me tell you, the Altaid Mountains are a very special place as well. It's very pure nature, let's say, and there's an energy to it. With that, the weather changes so quickly. For example, we were driving, and in Mongolia, lax infrastructure is very sad, but it's also allowed for a big adventure. There is only about two or three main roads, like paved roads. So all the rest of it is off road and hardcore. And I was driving, and all of a sudden this big cloud came over and started snowing and then completely covered the whole sky and the sun. It was really weird, but the clouds were moving so fast. And so I was driving and went off road, went into or tried to go up a hill. And the Jeep, let me tell you, is GCC Spex, which means that it doesn't have all train air.

It has all train tires, but doesn't have snow tires, doesn't have chains on the tires. Got stuck there. And no one's around. No one's around in remote Mongolia, and there's no service. So that was a little bit scary. Luckily, I was with someone, so we were able to put the tracks down and shovel out the snow. But imagine that we weren't prepared and didn't have the equipment to get the Jeep out of the snow, then I could still be there. I could be still be there. So that was the only thing. In Jordan also got stuck in the sand. That was a little bit scary because no one's around to help you. In Qatar, we got stuck as well in some mud, some really thick clay mud. And luckily, a Qatar man was there. He was so nice, so humble, he just came, brought us to a towing station, or brought us to a place where we found a tow truck and then drove us back, and then got us tea and all these things. Arabs are so hospitable, bless them. But luckily, that was one case, but the rest, we were essentially alone. Well, when I was with someone else, it was better, but getting stuck is not fun.

So I'm all about off-roading. I'm all about adventure, although you just have to be very wary and aware, especially in Mongolia, because the terrain is a little bit rough and so is the weather. The weather is so unpredictable.

It was crazy. Man, as I'm listening to you talk, I'm like, You're just so brave. I could not... I can think of the one time in my life I can think of getting stuck was like when I went on a desert safari and the car got stuck and we were like, Oh, my God. But there was only staffed tourist experience where they just removed the car for us. It was fine. And I have a photo of my uncle being like, Oh, my God, the car is stuck. That's my only context of being in a car being stuck and I just can't even fathom. I can't even imagine what it would be like to be in a car stuck in remote Mongolia without data. It's incredible. The thing that you've been able to problem solve in a moment of that fear and stress and think about how applicable that is to your life and the nail, the things that you can take on knowing if you can do that, you can do anything.

Yeah, it's so true. Well, yeah, in hindsight now it seems like so far away. But in the moment, it was like, whoa, very extreme. Also sleeping too. So the Jeep has, as I mentioned, a tent on top. I was sleeping in that for pretty much the whole time. And a few occasions had a visitor knocking. One time it was the army. I won't say the country, but it was the army. So I didn't know, but I would just sometimes... I was driving at night, and so I would pull off and just go to the side of the road and sleep far away from the road, but still close enough that I could find it easily because sometimes it would be hard to go back on track. Anyways, the point of what I'm saying is that I was driving on army bases and there was no signs or a lack of signage. So in the morning time as well, a few times knock on the 10, like Excuse me. You're in unauthorized zone. And they could see that we're overlanders. And these countries were places where I think that the locals, they encounter overlanders. Overlanders are just people that are doing the same thing that I'm doing.

They're driving with their vehicle, long term vacation, let's say, or expedition stuff. So if they're familiar, it's all right. Very chill. Just say we're going to do some demonstration or whatever the case may be, and then just left. But it's a little scary when you're sleeping and you can hear all these animal sounds, and then all of a sudden you hear human footsteps and then. So sometimes I let my eyes left with my head at the front and not at where the door is open. But that was just my own monkey mind getting in the way. I was like, It's okay. I'm secure. But the sounds, because I'm a light sleeper as well, affected me a little bit much, but got used to it, let's say.

Wow. Yeah. You're just blowing me away right now. I'm glad we had lunch last week, and I'm glad I didn't ask you any of these questions at lunch. Just to sit down and hear them all now, it's just amazing. I'm wondering, have there been times when you've had to rely on the kindness of strangers to help you out? And has there been a moment that's really stood out to you as powerful?

Oh, yeah. There's been, I would say, countless times that strangers have been there for me and for when I was traveling with someone else. And it's just so amazing. I have so much gratitude and respect for these people. And I'm going to say, okay, Armenia, the people in Armenia are blessed, so kind, so friendly Georgia as well. But in the GCC, especially, and especially in Saudi Arabia, we would just meet people driving or at a place taking photos, and they would say, come over here.. Come over. Have some tea. Have some dates. The dates are phenomenal. And it's just it blew my mind because the perception of Saudi that it's close and it's extreme. And it's like, no, not really. And the people are so friendly and wanting to meet and wanting to share cultural experiences and to talk and to learn more. So a few times with the car mouth-function, let's say, when we got stuck, people were willing to help. And also, if we didn't know where to go, just pull down the window and just ask them, Hey, where should we go? And sometimes people invited us into their house. So it was just like, Yeah, in Kazakhstan.

Also, Kazakhstan is a place to go people, if you want to go to. If you want to go to Central Asia, Kazakhstan is phenomenal. I'm not sure if it's because of the car, they knew about the Overland expedition or just like, Wow, this is amazing. I've seen a Jeep and some countries hadn't seen a Jeep. Let's say it was Beckistan. Not to say that they haven't seen it, but they're not manufactured there and they're not imported there. They have three main car companies and Jeep is not one of them. So they're just blown away by it. Or maybe it's just my good car where people I'm helping others. I don't know. Or maybe it's just I believe that humanity and humans are innately pure and kind. So if they see that someone needs help, then they will. Yeah.

What you're describing of the Arabic hospitality, I have to say that has stood out to me because I grew up in the city in Toronto, and I have never felt... People are kind here and friendly, but I've never felt in Toronto like people were including me or welcoming me into their life in the same way in the Middle East. Like when I moved to Kuwait, people were inviting me to their homes, to their birthday party, to this wedding. They don't even know me. They're like, Come to this wedding. And it's just like the hospitality of Arabic people wanting to include you in their life. It's pretty incredible for those listening who haven't experienced it. It's very special.

And in Jordan, especially near the end. So I drove from Aqaba, like from Saudi to Jordan, then all the way up to and even passed that, the Syrian border. I stayed with three different families who just met them by chance. Sorting something out in the back, and they just said, Come on and stay with us. Stay in our house. I think it's a part of Muslim culture, one man was explaining to me it's a part of Muslim culture in the Quran to welcome strangers.

Oh, my gosh.

It's something within the Muslim religion.

Islam, I should say, not Muslim religion. In Islam, yeah, to welcome strangers and provided amazing food. The food was awesome. It was just so good. Then we were using Google Translate as well because there was a language barrier in some places, and Jordan, not as much as others. But yeah, people were just like, It's okay, we'll just use Google and Google will translate. I was super grateful for that and those experiences. And just to really... That's how you really get to see the culture and being in the family house and sharing a meal with them. It's just... Yeah, it's just amazing.

That's so cool. Speaking of that, it's funny. It sometimes feels like your answers are leaning right into my next question, because my next question is, what's your favorite food that you ate on your journey that you tried?

Well, I know which food I didn't like or which countries didn't have amazing vegan food. Just kidding. Lebanese food, as you know, the mezz is delicious, so that was good. And in Lebanon, the food is very fresh. So I appreciated that. The dates in Saudi Arabia were the majul dates, or I don't even know what they're called, something with the K. Incredible. Like, so sweet, so delicious with the Arabic coffee. It was just that flavor, that taste is so distinctive and forever in my mind, let's say. Georgian food is also quite delicious. They have two main dishes, which is called one of the dumplings called kingali. No, Kachapuri? Kingali, yeah. And then one is like a Turkish style pie, which is a long pizza. Super fresh, delicious ingredients. Very good. I'm celebrating just thinking about the Georgian food, too. Anything that's vegetarian and fresh is good for me. But I would say that the homemade food was probably the best, too, when I got the chance and the privilege to have a meal with people, especially, as I mentioned, in Jordan and Kazakhstan was also good. But when they found out I was vegetarian, they're like, Oh, wow.

Okay. But it's okay. I respect their cultures and meat is very heavily heavy in their diet, which is fine. So yeah, it was just very nice to see how people are so willing to accommodate. It just blows my mind. And so, yeah, like you were saying in Toronto and in Canada, people are friendly, for sure. And I know Canadians are always... People are like, Oh, you're from Canada. You're so friendly. I'm like, Okay, but I don't know. I don't think that we're that friendly.

I agree. There's a difference between... People will smile and say hi when I'm walking in the park. I don't ever remember when people would move on to the street in my neighborhood. I don't ever remember us welcoming them with a dinner. We never got together with my neighbors. I don't ever remember really, for example, there were lots of newly immigrated students at my high school and new to the country, and there was no thought to welcoming them, taking care of them, asking them how their transition was the same way in the Middle East. It was always like, Oh, you're from Canada. How's it going? How can I help you? If you need anything, you're new here. And I feel the same way about living in Bali, actually. I feel people are always looking out for me like, Oh, if you ever need anything, just let me know. And it's just it's not... I don't feel that so much in Canada. Yeah.

And I think it has to do with societal norms of collectivist versus individualist. They're very much based on collectivist. Even when I was living in Korea, it was the same thing in Asian as well as Arabic, let's say, or GCC regions. It's more, yeah, based on the family and community network that you have. And then in Canada, as we know, it's more so, okay, family, yes. But as we know, more individualized or individualized culture.

Absolutely. So I'm wondering, of all the countries, what country has surprised you the most?

I'll take a second to think about that. I usually tell people Saudi Arabia and Syria just because those countries are places that I didn't know that much about. I didn't know the history. And kudos to my tour guide about the history, even the Roman. How much history Syria has being in that part of the Gulf region. And yeah, it's just incredible. And the architecture there, unfortunately, a lot of it is destroyed, but damascus is still standing. And it's an amazing, amazing city, reminds me of Beirut in Lebanon, also Saudi Arabia, the nature in Saudi Arabia. And I didn't even explore the Southern part. People were telling me, Did you see the monkeys? Did you see the rainforest? Not rainforest, but the monkey area in the Southwest. And I didn't even get there because the country is massive and drove up, down, and then across. So I would say, Saudi, Syria. Yeah, just because I'm a person that doesn't like to research too much before I go. Okay, history is great, but I like to see it for myself and talk to people and then develop my understanding. And then if I need to Google to reaffirm or to make sense of it, then I will.

But beforehand, I'm not like, Okay, I need to know all this information. And so that's why I would say that they surprised me the most, because I was like, Okay, I have a general idea, but the landscape as well was just incredible. Kazakhstan as well. Same thing. I was like, Okay, Kazakhstan. Let's see. And then I was like, Oh, my gosh. I was literally camping in the seabed. Two, 23 million years old. There's this place called... I forget now. It's like Ucerid Reserve. Sorry, I'm not pronouncing it correctly. But it's essentially like a seabed, 23 million years old. Yeah. Imagine that. So now you have to see to believe. So if you want to look, you can check on my Instagram, everybody. But that also was just crazy, amazing place. So did you mean surprised in general or surprised in one way? It's hard to say because-.

I know in any way, I think what I really meant, and you had a great answer of that, of what surprised you in terms of what you weren't expecting or in any way. And I was thinking when you mentioned Syria that I actually remember seeing you posting being in Syria. And I had an immediate... It's funny because I asked you about stereotypes and misconceptions about the Middle East, but I'm pretty sure I had a reaction of like, What is Kate doing in Syria? I'm pretty sure I had that stereotypical mis perception. And so to hear what a positive and incredible time you had, it really opens my mind, for sure.

Yeah. It's just okay. I have to just watch how I freeze this. But like I said, anything can happen anywhere. So, of course, certain areas, let's say, places. I was just in Myanmar as well. It's a very unsafe place, very unsafe country because of what's happening with the resistance towards the government. It's the same thing. So certain areas, not safe. But if you're an experienced traveler, you use your discernment. You don't go to these places, and it's highly, highly secure, made secure by the military. So there was checkpoints, I would say, and that's probably what slowed down the expedition. Checkpoints every five, 10 kilometers. And if it's not deemed a safe area at that time, you turn around, you go back, you go somewhere else. So you have to have a level of caution wherever you travel. But it's unfortunate about the media and how the perception of that place is just no go zone. But the people there are exceptional, exceptional human beings considering. And I think that they're exceptional because they're so resilient. What they went through in the history, and same with people from our Burmese people, what they went through, it's like they're happy to be alive.

So they're always smiling, always gracious, always grateful. And so with that, it's like you just look beyond what other people have told you. And that's the thing. I was scared before going to. Even in Jordan, the Jordanians were like, don't go. Don't go. You're going to get robbed. And then it's like, like I said before, you have to have faith in just what will be will be. Yes, it is a little bit risky. I'm not going to say that it's not risky going there. But if you want to do it, then just do it. So you never know what's on the other side. It's also risky going to Antarctica. It's also risky skydiving.

Yeah.

Absolutely. But it depends on your level of comfort and how much you put faith in yourself and faith of others. Different activities involve a different level of risk. So when it's outside of yourself, I think that's when people get scared because the media wants you to be scared and wants you to be fearful. What are they hiding? Sorry. I'm not trying to get into conspiracy or anything here. That's for another episode.. But it's like, yeah, you just have to trust and do your research. And also, well, with Syria, I didn't really do my research like I said, but I just had to faith with that one. So it's okay. It's okay.

And you know what? This whole thing just reminds me of something that I wrote about in my book, Actually, which is going to be coming out later this year. I talk about how when I was moving to Kuwait, literally every other person was like, It's war-torn, it's dangerous for women. And I was like, Literally, someone said to me it's war-torn. And I was like, The last war was in 1991, before I was born. In Kuwait? I don't know the reason. And these are the stereotypes about this part of the world. And then in contrast, then at the end of one year in Kuwait, I went to Spain for a week. And first night in Spain, I get into a taxi that is refusing to let me out. I ended up jumping out of the car. Second night in Spain, I get robbed and get everything stolen from me. And my reflection on that is like, Wow, I spent an entire year in Kuwait where nothing bad happened to me at all. And then I go to Europe where everyone thinks it's fine and safe. And in 24 hours, I've had two of the most traumatic experiences in a year.

And I think that just speaks to how we have a misconception about certain parts of the world that are inaccurate. It's just bad things can happen anywhere and good things can happen anywhere.

It's so true. I've been in Middle East for nine years now, living in Turkey. Turkey is not really Middle East, but it's like on the border. So yeah, it's just you have to transcend, let's say, transcend people's polarized thinking. And it's very unfortunate because there's so much to see and so much to explore here. But if people deem whatever the media puts out there to be true, then of course, that's what they want. It's brainwashing, essentially, the propaganda and this fear mongering. It's like, okay, fine. But for me now, I just live my life. So it's okay. Yeah. And like you said, with Spain, with anywhere, you can say in Canada, too. There's murders. There's crazy stuff happening. I saw something that was like, Canada is the safest country. And people had comments like, That's false. No, it's not. Come to. So it's like anywhere.

So I have one last question for you that feeds into what you just said. If someone were listening to this who is really interested in doing similar traveling to you, like a road trip, they're afraid of stepping outside their comfort zone, what wisdom or advice would you give them? What would you say?

Yeah, I would say if that's the case for you and you're just feeling a little bit unsure, just take small steps. So what I was doing was not small. It was like a leap, going that far. Let's say you're living in GCC, decide your car, decide your route, and go to Saudi Arabia, Qatar, Kuwait, or wherever within the region. Or if you're in Europe, okay, you start in, and Balkan countries go around there. It depends where you are. But let's just say take baby steps. Just go slowly. You don't have to try to do this elaborate, full year expedition. I would say just go slow. Not even go slow, but just do what feels right. If it's going to be a little bit shorter timing, then have a shorter route. And if you really want to do it, then just try even doing weekend trips. Just going to the in the weekend or on the weekend and do that. I would say also, be comfortable with the discomfort. If you're uncomfortable, just feel into that. Because I was uncomfortable so many times on the trip. And even now, thinking about going back into the cold, it's sometimes mind over matter.

So it can be applied, I think, in this case. Yeah, if you want to do it, and also be aware that it is a big adventure, and it's going to be asking you to step outside of your comfort zone, like you were saying, problem solve, make the most of things, and really cherish the small moments. So if you have that mentality and you're wanting to just do something different outside of the normal vacation, yeah, go for it. And if you're a planner person, then plan it. For me, I was like, all right, let's just go. But to be fair, in the GCC, besides Saudi, I had already been to all the countries. So I was like, I know what to expect here here, and it's all good. It's all safe and there's food everywhere. You just see it like nowhere else in terms of quality of food and abundance of food. And I'm talking about restaurants, and obviously, in my experience, the people being so hospitable. So yeah, I think that if people have a fear as well, fears are created in the mind. You're not born with the fear. Fears are created based on your mind and your perception.

So try to work through that. But the best way to do it is to face your fear. There's a quote that I learned actually from a student I tutored in Kuwait, actually. And it's like, Feel the fear, but do it anyway. And I'm pretty sure her mom, so she learned it from her. But she told me that. And I was like, Cool. And I started seeing it. Feel the fear and do it anyway. So it's the expression of leaning in. So you lean into the discomfort, you lean into it. And like I said, just find joy in the small moments. Yeah.

I love that.

And be ready for anything to happen and be open as well.

Love that. Kate, this has been so amazing. I'm so happy we did this episode. I just learned so much from you and I'm so inspired by the way that you're living your life and your adventure and curiosity. I think everyone listening is probably going to take something from it. And for those that are listening, if you want to see more, Kate has a really cool Instagram that's been documenting what she's been doing. And so you can follow her. I think it's explorewith. Kate. Is that it? You've got it. Amazing. So I'm going to put the link in the description. But if you want to follow her, check out what she's doing and offering. And I know once her trip is done, she'll probably be getting back into coaching and teaching yoga and all of the incredible work she does. So you can look into those offerings as well.

Thank you so much, Alex. I am so grateful to be able to share my voice and to share my experience and to encourage other people that are perhaps thinking about it. So thank you for allowing me to do that on your platform. I always love talking to you. So thank you so much.

Hi, friend. Thank you so much for listening to this episode of Sober Yoga Girl Podcast. This community wouldn't exist without you here, so thank you. It would be massively helpful if you could subscribe, leave a review, and share this podcast so it can reach more people. If we haven't met yet in real life, please come get your one week free trial of the Sober Girls Yoga membership and see what we're all about. Sending you love and light wherever you are in the world.