Ep. (60) The Connection Between Physical and Emotional Health

What if physical pain isn't just physical — what if it's quietly pressing on an emotional wound and making the whole thing feel a hundred times worse?

In this episode of Triggered & True, Laura Duncan and co-host Brian Freise explore a connection they'd only ever hinted at before: the deep link between physical and emotional health. 

The timing wasn't planned — within a single week of each other, both hosts had their first-ever surgeries, giving them fresh, firsthand material to work with. 

What they discovered is that physical pain and emotional pain are constantly "ping-ponging" back and forth, and that a physical health crisis is often a powerful emotional trigger hiding in plain sight, precisely because it feels so logical to just say "of course I hurt."

Laura and Brian get honest and personal about what their surgeries surfaced. 

For Brian, being physically unable to "do" shut down the background program he didn't even realize was running — the little boy still working hard to keep everyone happy — and revealed how much of his life is driven by that fawning "doing" protector. 

For Laura, it exposed her deep programming toward independence and self-sufficiency, and how hard it is to let herself need help, rest, or even take pain medication. 

Together they talk about numbing physical pain the same way we numb emotional pain, why staying connected to yourself through pain matters, and how preparing your heart ahead of a hard season lets you meet it with more peace and even find the precious parts in it.

In this episode: 

🔹 Why physical pain and emotional pain constantly feed each other — and why a health crisis is a hidden trigger 

🔹 How surgery interrupted Brian's "doing" protector and revealed the boy still trying to keep everyone happy 

🔹 Laura on independence, needing help, and how hard it is to let yourself rest and be cared for 

🔹 Why we numb physical pain with the same protectors we use on emotional pain 

🔹 Finding peace and even a gift in the middle of pain — and preparing your heart before a hard season

📩 Get your free Weekly Dose of Compassion — two short notes in your inbox every week. One to speak over yourself. One from Laura: https://www.lauraduncan.com/pl/2148814868

🔗 Learn more:

https://triggeredandtrue.com

https://lauraduncan.com

Transcript

SPEAKER_05 0:29

Hello, everyone, and welcome to this episode of Triggered and True. And today we're going to be talking about the connection between physical and emotional health. So, Laura, you and I both had the pleasure of having some firsts in the last couple weeks. And uh both of us had some non-life-threatening, thankfully, uh physical health conditions that both required us to have our first surgeries ever.

SPEAKER_03 0:58

I know. And I cannot believe it. It was within a week of one another. Yes. Mine was scheduled, but it wasn't scheduled for another month and a half.

SPEAKER_05 1:06

Mine was not scheduled.

SPEAKER_03 1:07

Yours was not scheduled at all. His was suddenly, mine was scheduled. But I went in on a Monday and they said, You know what? Tomorrow you can come back for surgery. So it was still pretty shocking, even though mine was scheduled and Brian's was.

SPEAKER_05 1:20

Well, I went in on a Thursday and they said, Do you want to have surgery now or in the morning?

SPEAKER_01 1:24

And I'm like, Well, they gave you two choices.

SPEAKER_05 1:26

I actually wanted it now. I'm like, well, let's just get this over with because he was kind of actually joking. I don't think the surgeon was actually ready to do it. So I had to suffer through another night. But anyway, but you know, we haven't ever talked about this connection between uh the two. Uh we've maybe hinted at it, but the reality is that physical health and emotional health have a huge connection.

SPEAKER_03 1:49

Oh, definitely.

SPEAKER_05 1:50

And in a lot of cases, the physical health is a triggering event.

SPEAKER_03 1:56

Yes.

SPEAKER_05 1:57

You know, and it's a difficult one because it's so darn logical. You know, right? Because like you're doubled over in pain, whatever's going on, there's all this physical pain. It's completely um logical to think that of course I'm hurting, but what's happening is this physical pain is also poking at emotional pain, and it's making this whole situation, you know, like a million times worse.

SPEAKER_01 2:28

Yes, exactly.

SPEAKER_05 2:30

So um, so let's just talk about that a little bit of how you know what are some of the type of things that physical health and issues in our physical health can trigger us from an emotional standpoint.

SPEAKER_03 2:43

Yeah, you know, I mean, they're so directly connected that we don't even realize it because we've been compartmentalizing our physical condition and our emotional condition from a lot of our life. And the physical, I mean, not only do when we have emotional pain, we can feel it in our physical body. When we have physical pain, we can feel it in our emotions. And so they're always kind of ping-ponging back and forth and going hand in hand. And that's what this experience was so interesting because I haven't had a lot of physical pain in my life. So even though I have, but I haven't had anything extreme, I haven't gone through any surgery. I've, you know, I've just never had this experience before of having, I would say, kind of that the out-of-control feeling of having pain that you can't just will away. You can't just ignore, like we sometimes can with our emotional pain, and have having to actually like stay connected to myself through that process of feeling physical pain.

SPEAKER_05 3:40

Well, and you know, you you mentioned that you can't will away the physical pain. Actually, you can.

SPEAKER_03 3:45

Yeah.

SPEAKER_05 3:45

Because a lot of people ignore that just like they ignore pain. Exactly. No, I numb it. You numb it.

SPEAKER_03 3:51

That is 100% true. You can pretend like it's not there.

SPEAKER_05 3:54

Yeah, just numb it with a lot of the same things you might be using to numb emotional pain too. Yes, exactly. Those protectors. So, but I definitely learned some things, and like one of the things I've seen in other people, like how when they're hurting, they'll get very childlike. And and they'll start to ask for things and maybe be, you know, sometimes people can trigger and be very needy. Yeah. Okay. Or they can be opposite. They can trigger and be like they can just push everybody away. Yeah, I don't know. They're physically hurting. Okay. Yeah. And those are actually both kind of um, you know, interesting because I I think what it connects us back to is that when we're triggered, you know, we've talked about the bigger the trigger, the littler we are. Yeah and like in our development. So I'm guessing that people that get very needy, you know, they're there's one of those gifts that was missing. Yeah. You know, the the gift of being protected or the gift of acceptance or some gift. And when they're hurting, it really brings it to the forefront. Yeah. And it's natural to need people with you when you're hurting. You know, I think it's natural to need help.

SPEAKER_03 5:08

Yeah, for comfort, yeah, support and help.

SPEAKER_05 5:10

Right. But for some, I think it gets really, really big because it's bringing them back to that childhood. Oh, yeah, when they weren't cared for.

SPEAKER_03 5:18

And you finally have a reason, you know, because many times we tell ourselves, you know, don't don't be needy, you know, don't over-ass for things, don't be too much.

SPEAKER_04 5:27

Right.

SPEAKER_03 5:28

Going through something justified and you can't stand up or you can't, you know, do certain actions and you need someone to help you, I think it comes out even stronger because you finally have a justifiable reason to have the need that you've had all along inside of you that you finally can say, I'm needy now and I need, and it's justified.

SPEAKER_05 5:46

So then why would people push it away? Because maybe somebody else goes the opposite direction with their pain. Like they don't want anybody around, they want to go take care of themselves.

SPEAKER_03 5:55

They I think that comes from the same lack that we didn't have our caregivers be with us in critical emotional moments or physical moments. And because of that, our brain says nobody wants to be with you. No, you know, you do this by yourself. You're on your own. Even if you are unable to do certain things, you just get through it because you don't expect or believe anyone's gonna be there to meet your needs.

SPEAKER_05 6:20

Well, and I think uh a big connection with that could be um right along what you just said, but it's kind of a defense mechanism. Nobody was there or they weren't there for you in the way that you needed to be.

SPEAKER_03 6:32

Like we've talked about in the past, those protectors. Yep, and you're like anyone in.

SPEAKER_05 6:36

I'm gonna have to figure this out on my own.

SPEAKER_03 6:38

Yeah.

SPEAKER_05 6:38

Because I can be okay if I don't have to depend on anybody.

SPEAKER_03 6:41

Yep, exactly.

SPEAKER_05 6:42

And as adults, that's a little bit more true. Like we want to be able to be, but obviously, if you need physical pain and you need to go see a doctor, we don't want to take this to the extreme, like, well, I don't need a doctor.

SPEAKER_03 6:55

Yeah, exactly. Well, we people do take it that extreme, exactly, but we don't want to do that, exactly. Yeah, when we have a need, we want to be able to be emotionally okay, clear-minded, tender-hearted at peace to be able to take care of ourselves and get the help that we need. Yeah.

SPEAKER_05 7:10

Yeah. So for some, just letting themselves receive help is really tough.

SPEAKER_03 7:14

Yeah, definitely. And you know, this process, like I said, I knew about it ahead of time, and it took quite a while. And part of it was just logistics and practicalities, but part of it was emotional that you're avoiding getting the help that you need because of the unknown, because of you know, not knowing what it's gonna look like or feel like. And so there is some level, I I experience some level of avoidance of actually taking care of myself because it felt scary. Yeah, felt big, felt unknown.

SPEAKER_05 7:42

Well, here's one of my learnings.

SPEAKER_03 7:44

And one of the learnings. I know the learnings are good.

SPEAKER_05 7:48

And um, you obviously, when it's hurting the worst, it's very difficult to think about things this way. Yes. But um, I was able to come to the place of, you know, thank you, trigger.

SPEAKER_04 8:01

Mm-hmm.

SPEAKER_05 8:02

Thank you. Thank you that I'm hurting. It's not exactly as uh sick and twisted as that, but I was able to see that there's a blessing in this. And uh one of the big things that I learned in in my little process was um how difficult it still is, and I didn't realize this under current was running to near the degree that it still was for me to turn off the doing.

SPEAKER_02 8:27

Yeah. What do you what do you do when you can no longer do?

SPEAKER_05 8:32

Yeah, right, exactly. Well, I can work on my computer because I can still do that, you know what I'm saying?

SPEAKER_01 8:38

You can't take that from me. Can't take that from me.

SPEAKER_05 8:40

But no, like um, we had a lot of company while this was going on, and when you have a lot of company, the house is a mess. There's it's a mess in all of the best ways. So if any of my family members are listening to this, no, I hear you. I love this mess. I love the mess. Okay.

SPEAKER_03 8:59

But it is a little chaotic, exactly. It is chaotic, especially if you're not feeling well.

SPEAKER_05 9:03

Right. There's always something to pick up, there's always something to do.

SPEAKER_03 9:06

And what do you normally do? You're probably in there. I know your personality, you're probably in there cleaning and cooking and helping and supporting. And so to be have to sit there or lay there and not be able to do anything.

SPEAKER_05 9:16

Well, one thing I found though, it was a little bit freeing because I'd walk around and I'd see stuff that needed to be done, and I was able to, I'd be like, because I had an excuse not to. I actually felt some freedom.

SPEAKER_03 9:27

I'm like, Oh, because you've never asked for help before, huh?

SPEAKER_05 9:30

Well, that that or I just it was something I someone else will do eventually. Like, I just didn't need it, it didn't need to be done.

SPEAKER_01 9:36

Yes.

SPEAKER_05 9:37

A lot of what I do doesn't need to be done.

SPEAKER_01 9:39

Like I think a lot of what we do.

SPEAKER_05 9:40

I'll give you, I'll give you this great thing. I was at uh a couple weeks ago, I was at the um garden center here in town buying rock. Okay. And I kept going back for more and more rock. And they're like, what's the project you're doing with all this rock? I just looked at the lady and I said, I'm doing something that absolutely does not need to be done. I'm doing a home project at home. I dug up all this sod, put in all this rock. It did not need to be done. This was a project that absolutely 100% did not need to be done. It was a nice day, it was whatever. And so I was doing a bunch of work that didn't need to be done. So I think in my life, there's a lot of things I did that don't need to be done. So walking around the house that day, these are the things I'm talking about. Things that didn't really need to be done. And I felt this freedom that, oh, I don't have to do that, and nobody's gonna be mad at me.

SPEAKER_04 10:36

Wow.

SPEAKER_05 10:37

There's gonna be no expectations of me, and I have this freedom. But like this whole thing about how nobody's gonna be mad at me or nobody's gonna be upset or nobody has expectations, you know. Obviously, as an adult, I'm doing that to myself.

SPEAKER_03 10:52

Yes, exactly.

SPEAKER_05 10:53

Because even if people even if they were mad, yeah, you're not gonna be able to do it even if other triggered people and they're mad, and someone's mad that I'm not taking the garbage out or putting the dishes away or whatever, you know what I'm saying?

SPEAKER_03 11:06

But it's the making peace with it that it's okay if you can't do something, and if even if someone gets mad.

SPEAKER_05 11:12

So I realized in my programming, there's still a lot of a little boy out there making everyone happy by having whatever you think you're supposed to be doing, exactly.

SPEAKER_03 11:23

Yeah, or whatever you think you're supposed to be doing, or whatever you think will keep people happy. Yeah, it's kind of a form of fawning by doing so much to keep other people happy.

SPEAKER_05 11:32

Yeah, absolutely. So there was some freedom in that, you know, in that way. I was able to just be like, you know, those things that don't need to be done, like I was okay with those things not being done. Yeah, you know, and um, so that was that was good, and that's where I say it was a gift. I actually wrote, I actually journaled some things, and um uh I was just gonna go back to what I wrote because I wrote it in the moment, and sometimes that's that's even better when you're writing in the moment. I said for me, this doing issue is like a massive spotlight on my soul. I was very unaware how much that virus was still running on my operating system until I shut everything down. So it really took shutting it down to really recognize, you know, how much was there. Um, today, as I move around the house, I keep seeing things to do, but then I feel a sense of relief that I don't have to do them because I have a great reason not to. And I know that people will not be quote unquote mad with me or have uh expectations that I need to do it.

unknown 12:38

Yeah.

SPEAKER_05 12:38

So then I wrote, A little boy still working so hard to please mommy and daddy.

SPEAKER_03 12:43

Yeah, yeah, exactly. And to be able to have that moment to see it without the shame and without that drive that we have that's subconscious, even. You know, you don't wake up in the morning and say, I need to do everything, or mommy or daddy are gonna be mad at me. But the subconscious system, until it got interrupted by your surgery and your inability to do, it brought it to the surface. So you could see, oh, my coding, my child self still believes to some percentage that if I don't do it, mommy and daddy are gonna be upset.

SPEAKER_05 13:16

Yeah, whether that's true or not, even exactly. That's and and obviously as a little kid, it was true because that's how that programming got there.

SPEAKER_03 13:25

Yeah, exactly. Whether they intended to or not.

SPEAKER_05 13:28

Oh, yeah. Well, obviously they didn't intend to, you know.

SPEAKER_03 13:30

Yeah, exactly.

SPEAKER_05 13:30

It's the same pressure they put on themselves.

SPEAKER_03 13:33

Exactly.

SPEAKER_05 13:33

Yeah, you know, it's the same pressure, you know. My my parents are still uh in it. This is a long line, a generational line of doing.

SPEAKER_03 13:43

Yeah, yeah. Lots of doing lots of doing with lots of benefit, but sometimes the detriment of our heart and our emotions and our even our mind.

SPEAKER_05 13:52

Yep. So that was that was one of my really big learnings. And and then we kind of talked about it. The the asking for help was definitely another one because um I would be more of the line of I just want to be alone. So, like, um, even for the surgery, I'm like, you know, just drop me off and we'll be done.

SPEAKER_01 14:12

That's what I was gonna do too. That's what I did too.

SPEAKER_03 14:13

I had my daughter dropped me off, and she's like, I can come back, like, you know, they're allowed to like go through some of the process with you before they have to leave. And I was like, Oh, no, no, no, you can just leave the waiting room.

SPEAKER_01 14:22

She's like, No, I actually want to go with you. I was doing the same exact thing. So she stayed with me as far as she could.

SPEAKER_05 14:28

Yeah. And then, and then when I came home, you know, I would just kind of wanted to be by myself.

SPEAKER_01 14:33

Yeah.

SPEAKER_03 14:34

You know, I fluctuated between the two. I liked being by myself. And then if someone would come over and visit, and I liked it for a little bit of time, and then I recognized that I want to be by myself again. And that's something new to me because I usually want to be around people in the past when I've gone through different things. I really wanted people to be around all the time to distract from it. But I actually found myself wanting to be by myself to be able to feel it and to be able to be with myself in it and to rest.

SPEAKER_05 15:00

Well, and I know for me that goes back to my programming because I was very much raised to be independent, self-sufficient, isolated. Yeah, you knew needing anybody was weakness. Yeah. So needing anything, even going to the doctor. Um I didn't want to take any of the pain medicine medication. And I it was actually kind of nice. The the the nurse in the hospital like really mothered me. And she's like, so she gave me the pills, and I was like, Oh god, I don't really want to take these pills as I'm leaving, you know.

SPEAKER_04 15:29

That's how I was and I was like, okay, just take one piece.

SPEAKER_05 15:32

Well, how's your pain? And I'm like, Well, I feel it pretty good right now. And she's like, she looked at me and she said, if you're feeling it right now in the hospital when you still got that other pain medicine in there, you need to take two.

SPEAKER_00 15:46

I love that.

SPEAKER_05 15:47

So I took two, okay. And um, I didn't take any more after that, probably should have. So then I was fighting myself of wanting to take anything, but but I still think I still connect that back to like that's needing something.

SPEAKER_03 15:59

Yes, exactly. You should be okay without pain medication, exactly.

SPEAKER_05 16:03

Needing something is weakness, and you really have to, that's something that's really hard to let go of. But but there again, you know, thank you, trigger. These things are out in the open now. Yeah, you know, before I knew the compassion method, before I knew anything about this, this would all be like oh yeah, more Chinese being talked, you know. Yeah, exactly. My heart would not be able, I would not be able to understand. My heart would be speaking Chinese to a brain that only knows English. Yeah, exactly. So um now I can understand the language of my heart.

SPEAKER_03 16:36

Exactly, which probably led to more rest, at least it did for me. Um, I felt like I could rest more because I wasn't fighting so much. I feel like, you know, when we're stuck in those places and our triggers all come to the surface, and if we're not aware of what the trigger is or where it's coming from or what to do with it, I feel like some of the healing process is hindered because of that wrestle that goes on. Because you're gonna feel emotions when you're physically, you're not gonna be a blank emotional slate. You're gonna be feeling just as much or maybe even more when your physical body's not doing well.

SPEAKER_05 17:06

Oh, absolutely. Absolutely.

SPEAKER_03 17:07

One thing that I noticed, um, I was similar to you in the sense I didn't really want to take a lot of pain medication. Um, but one thing I did learn that I thought was really helpful is just the fact that because I'm a doer as well, um, I, you know, push myself a lot, you know, and I feel like usually I kind of like rise to the occasion and I'm fine. But I had a couple of times where I purposely didn't take pain medication because I wanted to feel what my body was feeling. So I didn't overdo it because a couple of times when I was taking pain medication, I'm like, I'm I'm healed, I'm better.

SPEAKER_05 17:41

So the day of the surgery, when I came home after those two, I didn't feel anything. I was like blissful, you know. And I'm like, and I'm like, this isn't this isn't right because I want to feel it, you know. And um, but I think, you know, God gave me what I needed. I needed it to handle that acute pain in that moment, but definitely I totally agree with what you're saying because I think people probably rush too rush too fast.

SPEAKER_03 18:06

Yes. And I was thinking about that laying there, you know, for those days where I couldn't do a whole lot. I was thinking about the correlation between our emotionally medicating and how it makes portrays or feels as if we're healed and we're better and we're fine until it wears off or we can't get our next fix. And I'm I'm not just talking pain medication here. I'm talking whatever it is that emotionally medicates us, whether it's a person or a job or anything.

SPEAKER_05 18:33

Social media feed, whatever. Social media feed. Whatever.

SPEAKER_03 18:35

So when you remove that, you can actually see what your true pain is and how much of the time we're pushing through because we're medicated in pain, thinking we're fine. But underneath that, there is a body, which in this situation it was the body needing to be healed, but there's a heart that needs to be healed that we're not even aware of because that medication is taking away the edge that recognizes, oh, my body's still healing. And then I added a second part to it as I was kind of becoming more aware of it, of like I would be laying there and I would be like kind of, you know, encouraging my body to heal and saying, like, I'm here and I'm gonna support you and I'm gonna rest, even though resting is very hard for me, because I want you to heal correctly and I want you to heal well. And and I could feel this agreement with me and my body because for so much of my life, I've done everything to the point of hurting myself to a certain degree. I mean, I remember moving furniture by myself, like full-on furniture by myself, figuring out ways of how to move a whole like room of furniture by myself. But that's hurts your body, it hurts your back, it hurts everything because you're not meant to be carrying furniture by yourself. But I just did it because that's what you're supposed to do. And I felt like there was a little bit of like a reconciliation with my body of like saying, like, I'm not going to push myself and hurt you, and I'm not going to take a ton of medication that's gonna give me the illusion that I'm okay and then unintentionally hurt you as well.

SPEAKER_05 20:07

Right. Well, that's really good. That's deep, Laura.

SPEAKER_03 20:09

Yeah, it was really it was new, it wasn't something that I felt comfortable with, especially the first couple of days. I just wanted to be up, I just wanted to be doing.

SPEAKER_05 20:17

Right. But no, that that reconciliation with your body, you know, talk about being compassionate.

SPEAKER_03 20:23

Yes, exactly.

SPEAKER_05 20:26

Yeah, this is being compassionate to your physical body.

SPEAKER_03 20:29

Exactly. And when I felt the pain in the past, I felt like pain was against me. So, like, you know, having the surgery when I felt the pain, normally my brain would be like, oh, why is it doing that to me? You know, why is that happening to me? But instead, I actually thanked my body and was grateful that it felt the pain because that was actually protecting me and caring for me. It wasn't hurting me, even though it hurt.

SPEAKER_05 20:56

Right, right. Well, and asking for help is another great way to be compassionate.

SPEAKER_03 21:00

Yes, no, it is. And I I definitely humbling myself. And um, my daughter, she's really she's really good at that, where she just said, you know, why why wouldn't you ask for help? You know, her programming's different. She's like, Why wouldn't you? I know exactly. She's like, Why wouldn't you ask for help? And then um to piggyback, your nerd, um, I had a nurse that was very kind and nurturing and mothering to me too. And she just looked at me, she goes, Why do you think you need to be the hero? Like by not taking pain medication. Wow. And I was all, huh. She goes, Don't be a hero.

SPEAKER_01 21:30

I was like, I feel like I've tried to be a hero most of my life, or you just like push through and you just don't need to take it. And she was like, No, don't be a hero.

SPEAKER_03 21:39

And I was like, I had her voice in my head when I would just decide if I want to take pain medication or not. I'd be like, Don't be a hero. You you can take pain medication, it's okay.

SPEAKER_05 21:49

Oh, that's great. Well, you know, this morning I was I was reading in uh Hebrews actually, and this this verse just jumped out at me, and it's about asking for help. So it was like really speaking to me.

SPEAKER_00 22:01

So hey, if it's in the Bible, it's okay to ask for help. Exactly.

SPEAKER_05 22:04

It's uh, and I'll read it from the message. It's Hebrews 4, 14 through 16. Um, it's translated as Now that we know what we have, Jesus, this great high priest with ready access to God, let's not let it slip through our fingers. We don't have a priest who is out of touch with our reality.

unknown 22:28

He's been

SPEAKER_05 22:28

And through weakness and testing, experienced it all. All but the sin. So let's walk right up to him and get what he is ready to give. Take the mercy. Accept the help.

SPEAKER_04 22:45

Yeah, I love it.

SPEAKER_05 22:46

Take the mercy. Accept the help. I feel that's so good.

SPEAKER_03 22:52

Yeah, I love how that's such a participation, you know. Take the mercy, that's an action. You know, accept the help is an action, you know, like and how that's participating.

SPEAKER_05 23:03

Yeah. And that's yeah, to to help to receive help, it definitely takes effort.

SPEAKER_03 23:10

Yep, definitely. I want to share um one more thing. Did you finish that thought or did you want to? Okay, yeah. I want to share one more thing. It just came into my mind. Is one thing I did notice because I had the luxury of knowing I was gonna have the surgery, and I know Brian didn't really have a lot of pre-planning before, but um, I did find this one thing very helpful in having that day before I went into surgery. Is that day before was actually I felt a lot more grief. I felt scared, I felt, you know, sad. I went through different emotions. I felt a lot during that day. And it was kind of an ongoing off and on all day long. At the end, you know, right for going to sleep, I kind of felt this like rest, even though I still felt some of those, you know, sadness or scared or different emotions. And but in the morning when I woke up, I had so much joy before surgery, which this is my first hospital experience ever. I was as scared about the experience as I was about the surgery, just because I'd never had an IV. I'd never, you know, been in a hospital bed, I'd never had had anyone, you know, I had never had the experience before. So that was scary too. But I woke up the next morning and so much joy. And that actually throughout the whole process, from the time I woke up until the time I went to sleep, that surgery day was actually a very hopeful, joyful. We like ended up like having fun. The nurses were all laughing, me and my daughter were laughing. We ended up having like this really like joyful experience. But one thing I attribute to is the pre-grieving, the pre-processing. Instead of going into it feeling like the hospital is going to be potentially the scary thing or the problem. I dealt with what was inside of myself the day before, so that I could go into an environment that has felt scary to me in the past, and it didn't feel as scary because of that pre-processing.

SPEAKER_05 25:05

What it sounds to me is that you did the compassion method, which is which is to feel your pain.

SPEAKER_00 25:12

Yeah. Oh, yeah. Which you did the day before. Yeah. No, I did. Felt your pain and got comfort too.

SPEAKER_05 25:17

So that was what you called pre-grieving, was yes, you you you free you felt your pain. Yep, you got comfort, and then you were able to go play, and the hospital adventure became more adventurous than yes.

SPEAKER_03 25:30

No, it was so much fun. I was just gonna share really briefly. Like my older daughter just said, you know, I know it's hard for you to go to the hospital, but just pretend like you're going to a resort for the day. And at first, my brain's like, that does not feel like a hospital resort. That feels very different. But then I thought, because I was in a joyful mood because I you are pampered.

SPEAKER_01 25:48

I know, but she said, You're the center of attention. You are exactly. So she said, just enjoy it.

SPEAKER_03 25:53

So I I played along, and me and my daughter, we we were talking about the nurses got in on it, and what the IV was something I was worried about. And she's like, Part of your resort features is we're gonna give you an IV today. And I was like, Oh, really? They're like, Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 26:07

So they turned they turned it into this big kind of like joke, playful thing.

SPEAKER_03 26:12

Yeah, and it and they went through every single nurse and doctor I saw until I was on and the surgery table. Everyone played along, so it actually brought joy into an atmosphere that's usually pretty serious and scary, and all the emotions I was feeling the day before.

SPEAKER_05 26:28

Yep.

SPEAKER_03 26:28

From being able to feel my pain, get comfort and go play, it created this really amazing experience.

SPEAKER_05 26:34

Yeah. No, absolutely. I that's great. I remember, well, you know, as I shared in episode 18 when I had my great awakening, I did go to the emergency room when I had my uh anxiety panic attack that was beyond what I could stomach. Yeah, and um that was I was so worried about like that. I'd get judgment.

SPEAKER_03 26:58

Yeah. The experience of it.

SPEAKER_05 27:00

Yeah, I like I figured the people would judge me like, oh, he's what's he doing here? He doesn't have a real problem. He's just got anxiety. We we gotta be treating people that are in car accidents here, not be talking to this guy that's got this going on. And I was so like shocked that how that how opposite the actual experience was. Like the people that work in those roles, like um, they're just very special people.

SPEAKER_02 27:28

Yeah, yeah.

SPEAKER_05 27:29

I I learned that too to do that as much as they do and see what they do and yeah, and be able to to handle that. And uh like I did not get judgment, I got compassion. Yeah, yeah, and that's I got compassion.

SPEAKER_03 27:44

I totally felt that too. And because the experience was so uncomfortable for me and so unknown, I had felt myself villainizing, you know, the medical staff because it felt scary, you know, and and I felt I felt vulnerable, you know, you're going under a knife, you know, like you you want to make sure everything's done the right way. You're not gonna be able to advocate for yourself because you're gonna be under, you know, different things like that. Where I had the day before, part of my processing was the de-villainizing of what I had betrayed felt like the medical staff could be towards me. And then it ended up being that my, I think, you know, from that I was able to see, like you're saying, so much care and compassion and nurture in the staff that was helping and serving me. And it was a completely different approach. They were definitely not the villains of my story anymore.

SPEAKER_05 28:32

Yeah, I was look, I kind of looked at them more as the rescuers because I was in a lot of pain before surgery. So I was like, yeah, this this is this is this is gonna help me, you know. So I was a little bit different.

SPEAKER_01 28:43

That's true. Because I was like going in and it was gonna happen to me, even though I was volunteering and I signed up for it. I could see how if you were in pain before, you're like, you're saving me from pain, and I was feeling more like you're gonna make me feel pain, even though it's completely backwards, because they're actually in a rapid long term. Yeah, but in that moment it felt vulnerable.

SPEAKER_05 29:02

Absolutely. You know, you speaking of play, it uh reminded me. Mine was a little different because you're a little more advanced in me. You're a little more you're a little more advanced than me in this whole compassion method process. You know, I'm a little takes me a while to catch up. So um, my revelation around play was something you told me that I'd written in my notes many years ago. You said you defined what play is. You said play is the freedom not to have to do anything.

SPEAKER_02 29:33

Wow. Yep.

SPEAKER_05 29:36

So I was thinking of that. That quote came back to me when I was going through that. I'm like, this thing that's running in me, this this virus on my operating system that has me just constantly having to be doing. Yeah, that has definitely been still to this day a harder thing for me to connect with is play.

SPEAKER_02 29:57

Yeah.

SPEAKER_05 29:57

It's hard for me to, you know, get to that place of the compassion method where I have that. Well, it's hard because I never it's hard for me to free to have that freedom, yeah, not to have to do anything when that virus is running on my system. Oh, yeah, where there's still that pain. Guess when that happens?

SPEAKER_03 30:18

Never, yeah, because there's always something.

SPEAKER_05 30:21

Yeah, because we live on planet Earth, everything's always falling apart. Exactly. You know, the grass grows back, you know, whatever. The pool, it's clean, it's not no, it's an hour later. You know, you wash windows and they're clean for literally a few minutes, you know. Exactly.

SPEAKER_03 30:38

Um rest in the midst of all the things that could or should be done and being able to say, I don't have to do anything.

SPEAKER_00 30:46

Yeah.

SPEAKER_03 30:47

And I don't even have to play, you know. It's like play can become a duty on the list too. If you're not actually being able to do it from a place of rest and peace and connected to yourself, yeah, yeah.

SPEAKER_05 30:59

You can't force it. You definitely play is not something that can be forced. That's like the opposite, like it can't be. Exactly. Maybe there's an element of you have to push yourself out of your comfort zone, and then once you get there, you can play and let loose, you know.

SPEAKER_03 31:14

But to genuinely feel the benefits of play, it comes from a place of letting go, like you're experiencing.

SPEAKER_05 31:21

Yeah, yeah. You know, pre well before the compassion method, because I had I had stopped this long before I even heard about the compassion method, you know, drinking. Drinking definitely got me to play. That was barriers, those protectors down. Oh yeah. And if I had to say, like, what do you miss about not drinking? That's it. That is the only thing. Like everything else about it was ugh. But that part of being able to let that guard down and do that. But here's what I know. Like I've seen glimpses of that through going through this compassion method process. Like, I've seen the glimpses, I've experienced the taste of it, of that freedom not to have to do anything without an external substance.

SPEAKER_03 32:08

Yeah, yeah.

SPEAKER_05 32:09

You know, I've tasted it, I still see it out there on the horizon. Do I feel like I've like grabbed a hold of it and like have become like I've mastered that? No, I don't. Okay. But I yet I have a great hope because I've tasted it.

SPEAKER_03 32:26

Yeah. And I remember you remember you sharing about your daughter's wedding and how you were able to like dance and play and not feel like you needed to drink to be doing those things, you know. I feel like that was definitely an experience that you had. So, like you said, it may not be active in your life on like a daily basis, but you had the day of that wedding.

SPEAKER_05 32:45

That whole day of that wedding was magical. I honestly um think it was more magical for me than anybody there.

SPEAKER_01 32:53

Even the bride, yeah.

SPEAKER_05 32:54

Exactly. Well, it's a huge thing. Well, because I think the the bride and groom unfortunately have so much extra pressure. And as the father of the bride, I'm a I'm a step removed from that pressure.

SPEAKER_03 33:05

You're able to just enjoy.

SPEAKER_05 33:06

I was able to enjoy probably a lot more, unfortunately, you know, than they were. But um, but that whole day was very, very magical.

SPEAKER_03 33:14

So when I talk about how I have tasted, you know, just uh, you know, and that's a moment you can go back to, you know, we talk about with like especially the 10 gifts, we talk about vivid imagination and we talk about that as far as comfort and getting our needs met, but we can go to moments when we felt like our true self and were able to play and to participate and to enjoy and go back to that feeling that you had, and that can help lead you through even today.

SPEAKER_05 33:40

You know, when you think about like um like some of the things that um were overlooked that day, like um that no one else will ever remember, you know, but um you get so hung up on on a day like that, like all these things gotta be check, check, check, check, check in order. And then like there's some major things that just like the end of the day, we're like, oh, that didn't get done. And it's like nobody, nobody, nobody, but nobody cares or knows or whatever, you know.

SPEAKER_03 34:12

So um but yeah, so much more about what's going on inside of us than if everything is perfect on the outside.

SPEAKER_05 34:19

So I mean, I think in the in the big sense, I really feel like the little physical health thing here went through was was such a great um kind of an opportunity to check in.

SPEAKER_03 34:30

Yeah, you know, because like you it makes you have to pause.

SPEAKER_05 34:34

Yeah, it was a it was great because it helped me see that, oh, you know, this is still an area that I wanna go back to.

SPEAKER_03 34:43

Yeah, I found other, I'm not gonna get into all the other ones, some of them are personal, but there was a handful of things that I haven't taken the time just because I was so busy to go back to. And I had the opportunity to face different areas of pain in my life or different lacks in my life because I had that space. So I think you don't necessarily have to have surgery to have that space. I think it's also an opportunity to allow ourselves to have some moments, some days where we're able to do nothing to be able to take that space and that break, to be able to face some of the things that we put off because we're so busy.

SPEAKER_05 35:18

There's another thing I want to read, another quote from you. This one, this one is one you shared with me. Um this is really good. And um, this is taking you back to what you shared in episode seven when you shared your story. But uh, I don't know if you shared this in your story or if you just shared it personally with me. So um let me get to it again here. You said you were talking about kind of your family and um you talked about um how you missed in some cases the beauty in that time as you were going through the caregiving time. The caregiving time, yep. You missed some of the beauty in that time, some of the miracles, some of the clothes closeness to heaven that was felt.

SPEAKER_04 36:08

Yeah.

SPEAKER_05 36:08

And you were comparing that uh at the time with um when I was because this was kind of like when I was in the middle of my big mess. Okay. And I was talking about uh another person that I knew that um had gone through kind of an emotional health come apart, like I was coming through. And uh he had gone on medication and he was doing really, really, really well.

SPEAKER_02 36:35

Yeah.

SPEAKER_05 36:35

And I had chosen to go a different route of pursuing more of the compassion method and less of the the medical side. And I was looking at that person as having arrived, and you were really helping me see that wait a second, there's beauty here in your process, yes, and you were comparing it to the beauty that was in that caregiving time and death and caregiving, yeah. Yes, yep. Um, and you were talking to me about you know not being afraid of that, and um you know, I never would have thought in a million years, but I look back to the Great Awakening as being a so precious. And um to a much lesser extent you know, this physical health situation to a lesser extent, but it's very precious too.

SPEAKER_03 37:57

It really is, and it's not only when we avoid pain that we suppress it, that it builds up and causes those infections and those triggers that come out, but it's also we miss the opportunity of being with ourselves in the middle of the pain. And there's something about who we are in the middle of our pain that is precious, uh, that we're so busy rejecting because we're so busy rejecting pain that we can't be with ourselves in a way that is a deeper connection, a deeper intimacy, a deeper, a deeper knowing. And that's why feeling your pain is so important, not just for the comfort that comes, but feeling our pain is the ability to actually be with ourselves.

SPEAKER_05 38:42

The opportunity, yeah.

SPEAKER_03 38:44

Such an opportunity, it feels uncomfortable, but such an opportunity. I agree with you wholeheartedly that there is precious, precious pieces to it that when we're fighting it so hard we can't see, but we can rest and be with, we can start to see some of those places of who we are in the middle of it.

SPEAKER_05 39:03

Yeah, absolutely. Yeah, I mean, in that season, I definitely learned it could be connected to myself, you know, more so than I was, you know, a week ago.

SPEAKER_03 39:13

Yep.

SPEAKER_05 39:14

I think you know, it's so easy for um when things are at the tolerable levels of pain, yep, that you can just kind of get past it.

SPEAKER_03 39:27

Stay in that mode until we hit those big triggers, those big moments, and that gets our attention to come back to ourselves, to be with ourselves.

SPEAKER_05 39:35

Yeah, absolutely, absolutely.

SPEAKER_03 39:38

I think as we wrap this up, I just want everyone to be able to take this episode with whatever physical things that you're going through or have gone or will go through, to be able to take the opportunity to be able to explore more of our pain in it, but also just more of ourselves in this process. And that um if you're going through things, I know your knee-jerk reaction, just like myself, was to not want to do it, to avoid it, to feel the discomfort of it. Push the help away. Yeah, push the help away, feel like you don't have to do it, you don't need to do it, put it off, but really being able to embrace the ways that we need to take care of ourselves and be able to take care of our emotional world as much as we're taking care of our physical world so we can go through these things and still have hope and still have joy and still have peace, even in the middle of it.

SPEAKER_05 40:27

Absolutely. And I also want to encourage everyone if you'd like to go deeper with your own compassion method journey to check out Laura's master course. Uh, you can you can find that by going to uh compassionmethod.net. And if you enter podcast 50, you'll get $50 off.

SPEAKER_04 40:46

Yeah.

SPEAKER_05 40:46

And that is just a great way to take everything you're learning here at the podcast and really take it to the next level.

SPEAKER_03 40:52

Yeah. And just like I said, I did like that pre-processing before I went into surgery. If you have anything in your life that you would like to prepare your heart for, I highly recommend getting the course and walking through it. It's gonna set you up to have such a different experience by being prepared in that way.

SPEAKER_05 41:08

Well, and the reality is we all have things coming at us because uh whatever that looks like the shared, the shared part of humanity that connects all of us is that we're all gonna experience great pain.

SPEAKER_03 41:19

In some way, we are going to experience pain.

SPEAKER_05 41:21

Yep.

SPEAKER_03 41:22

And sometimes joy. Yep. And whether you have something in the future that you can prepare for or you don't have anything, but you'd like to be prepared, I think it's such a valuable thing to go through so that you can be in a place that things look different, they feel different, they're not as devastating. You see the hope in it, you see the precious parts of it.

SPEAKER_05 41:42

Yeah, absolutely. Well, thank you everyone for joining us on this episode of Triggered and True. And until next time, goodbye. Bye, everyone.