Wine with Meg + Mel

Wine Education: We Blind Taste Spätlese Riesling

• Mel Gilcrist, Meg Brodtmann

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We build a fast, practical way to remember German Riesling by region, then test it with a blind Spätlese flight that forces us to use Mel's... interesting study technique. Along the way we unpack Prädikat ripeness levels, GG and VDP labelling, and the tasting cues that separate Mosel, Rheingau, Nahe and Rheinhessen. 

If you want to taste along with us check out the list below and message us your thoughts!

Wine 1: Donnhoff Riesling Oberhauser Brucke Spatlese, 2023 - https://princewinestore.com.au/donnhoff-riesling-oberhauser-brucke-spatlese-2023.html

Wine 2: Keller RR Riesling, 2024 - https://www.nicks.com.au/products/2024-keller-rr-riesling

Wine 3: Markus Molitor Bernkasteler Badstuber Spatlese, 2023 - https://princewinestore.com.au/markus-molitor-bernkasteler-badstrube-spatlese-2023.html

Wine 4: Georg Breuer Ber Rottland Riesling, 2020 - https://www.nicks.com.au/products/2020-georg-breuer-berg-rottland-riesling

As we said, play along at home and write in! We'd love to hear you thoughts on Wine, Riesling, Germany's golden eagle and everything else!




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Welcome And Study Focus

SPEAKER_02

Hi, and welcome to wine with Meg and Mile. We're here to help you navigate the world of wine. I'm Maggie Chris drawn by Master of Wine. Meg Brottman, our producer Austin is here. Yeah, Meg, you've you've arrived. Welcome. We are now on the next episode. And and you poor thing, you were at home. I was. I'm in my tracksuit pants. I'm in my walking gear. All good to go. You got here very quick. Well done. Okay. What we are doing today is we've had feedback. Thank you, everyone, who has been sending in feedback, by the way. And we had the feedback that there was a request for more episodes that would help if you were studying like Wessit 2 or Wessit 3. So I put that to Meg. And Meg had this great idea.

SPEAKER_01

The regions of Germany, Riesling by the regions of Germany, rather than by the system of sugar or ripeness, I should say. We thought we'd look at the some different regions.

SPEAKER_02

So to be clear, Wesset 2, you don't need to know this stuff. You only need to know the Praticat, which is the sugar levels. Wesset 3 is where the regions get really specific and you have to learn all these crazy German names. Um, so it's harder for sure. And I'm not gonna lie, I had to go back and look at my notes from Wesset 3. Oh, good. Because I was like, if I'm blind, I knew that this was gonna be a blind taste, so I had to go back and look at my notes from Wesset 3 to remember what the difference was in all of them, but I will get you to re-explain before we do it. Yes. So can you go through? So there's five, it let's specifically say West It 3, right? There's five key regions that you need to know a fair bit about. And then I think there's a few more that are like you just need a headline.

Why German Riesling Confuses Students

SPEAKER_01

There's 13 defined regions from which qualitat's finds can come from, and then you add in the predicate system, which is the level of ripeness.

SPEAKER_02

So there's 13 regions, but in terms of reading Let's sorry, really quickly recover qualitat versus predicate.

SPEAKER_01

So predicat is a sealed wine. It's basically the level of ripeness of the grapes at the date of harvest. So the entry level is cabinet, it's got nothing to do with the residual sugar in the wine, okay? It's the level of ripeness of the grapes at the date of harvest. So you have cabinet, which is the entry level, usually equates till about 9.5% alcohol. It varies amongst regions, but if you fermented it dry, it'd have about 9.5% alcohol to about 10. Then when you get to around that spratlaser level, it's more along the lines of 12%-ish alcohol. Bearing in mind they work with Erkschle in Germany. They don't work with our normal system of Bome, so it's very, very confusing. Erchler's like a too sciencey.

SPEAKER_02

Yeah, I you've lost me. Specific gravity system. But anyway.

SPEAKER_01

So Sprintleser is the next level of rightness. Then we have Auschleser, which is sort of 13 and a half. And often Auschleser wines will have a little bit of botrytis in them. That's not what they're informed by, but there's a touch of botrytis simply because there's what?

SPEAKER_02

Uh botritus came up in the works through questions.

SPEAKER_01

So just because it's it's later in the ripening season and sometimes botrytis comes through. These Auschlese wines are often sweet, but you can ferment them dry, but they'll be about 13.5% alcohol. They'll be high. And then we move up to the sweeter wine. So you've got beer and archleise, which is the botriedosed wines. So beerin means botrytis, basically. Then you have trockin beer and archleise, which is where the botriedose wines have got have dehydrated. So they're trokken, so they're dried. So they're like sultanas, but they've had botratus on them. And then you've also got ice vine in there. All right.

SPEAKER_02

But I make up is mnemonic the word I don't know. Something to do with Tony Abbott eats onions. I I came, I come up with just like random stuff to remember. Yeah, it's kiss abbot. So if you remember Kiss Abbott, you will remember the yeah, it's not sweetness. The the from lightest to the least amount of sugar when picked to the most. And so K-S-A-B-T. Am I missing something? Well, I find sort of that that's oh yeah, yeah, yeah.

SPEAKER_01

I sort of thing.

SPEAKER_02

Yeah. So Kiss Abbott and remember that. And you will that's that's basically if you can remember the first letter of each, then you will remember the order.

Prädikat Levels Explained Simply

SPEAKER_02

K-S-A-B-T. And if you just simply remember, look, I don't know if you do or don't want to kiss Tony Abbott. Personally, it's a no. So I think when I'm in my Westert exams, I don't really feel like kissing Tony Abbott. That's how I remember it. But but each for their own. Oh god, Austin.

SPEAKER_00

It could be more of like a kiss about, as in sort of, you know, rather than Abbott. It's more of a celebrated.

SPEAKER_01

I guess when she was studying, Abbott was probably.

SPEAKER_02

Yeah, Abbott, Abbott was I think Abbott was around when I was studying. So it felt more relevant. Now it's just probably like people listening who are young enough to not really know who Trinity Abbott is. That's true. Kiss about that's better. That's better. Okay, this is where we have a producer who makes he just comes in, did they look like things better? I know he's really not much younger than me, but he's a lot cooler than I am. Okay, uh, okay, so that's that's a Pratt that is what Pradicat is. It is a system in which the sugar at which the grape is picked determines what label is put, uh what name is put on the label. So then conversely, what is qualitat spine?

SPEAKER_01

So it's the 13 defined regions, it's like the appellations of Germany. Yep. 13 defined reasons. So you've got the Mosul, Rheingau, Feltz, Ryan Hessen, Nache, Franken. I mean, I can't remember the words.

SPEAKER_02

Yeah, Frankenber Saarua, is that a separate Baden. Baden.

SPEAKER_01

Um yeah, I didn't know this morning.

SPEAKER_02

I only went over the top five this morning. Yeah.

SPEAKER_01

But the ones for Riesling really are the Rheingau, the Mosul, the Nahe, the Feltz, and the Ryan Hessen. Yes.

SPEAKER_02

It's annoying that there's two Ryans. Kind of like Ryan Godling and Ryan Reynolds. There's two Ryans. Oh, yes. Okay, so we're gonna do Oh. Yeah. Okay, so Meg, can you quickly, before we blind taste these, go through what you would expect from each region if you are studying for your master of wine? Because truly that's the most this is that's where this is gonna come up. Whether this is not, you're not blind tasting these in was it three and expecting to know the difference between Feltz and Rheinhessen. But you might MW, so uh if can you go through each region a little bit about it and then what flavors come up?

SPEAKER_01

So Nacha is on the southwest of Germany, it has a range of soils, but there's the volcanic soils, there's volcanic red soils, which is the red soils that we see in the Rheinhessen. For me, they're quite fruit-driven, they're kind of a little bit like tooty fruity, they're very elegant. Acidity's high, like we expect from all German Riesling. There's a minerality, but then there's a minerality in most German Riesling. But for me, Nahay is tootti-fruity. It's like opening a tin of mixed fruits. That's what my defining thing is for Naha. Then you move to the Rhingau. Now, the Rhingau is the only part of the German wine regions that it's the Rhine runs east to west and they're planted on those hills. Whereas everywhere else they run north, the rivers run north to south. So it automatically changes the aspect of the vineyard. Rhine gau for me is where it's at. High levels of acidity, mineral, crisp, elegant. The fruit is definitely on that greener, cooler side. Yep. So more green apple, very quite can be floral, but there's an underlying flintiness in Rheingau, always. Okay. Mosul is your pretty one. Mosul's very floral, honeysuckle, white blossom. It has that fruit as well, but not as strong as the 2D fruity of the Narche. And then Ryan Hessen for me can often be a little bit sort of dirty, it's not the right word. It's chalky the word. Yeah, it's not really chalky. It's like a the fruit's a little bit more subdued for me in Ryan Hessen. It's not the 2D fruity or the floral that you expect in the Mosul or the

Kiss Abbott Mnemonic For Ripeness

SPEAKER_01

Nahay. Yeah. And it's not the minerality that you get. It's a little bit more subdued. Fruit, almost savory, could I say? I don't, but I don't think savory is a word that you very often use to describe. I looked it up what they say about the, where is it, the Ryan Hessen, and they're basically saying that it's it's but it the thing is with Rhinhessen, it's uh it's got this stretch of ferric oxide soil, so red iron soils. And so it does I think it does add this sort of savouriness, there is a savouriness to the wine, and it is a little bit warmer as well. So they're they're good ones. You don't see a lot of fatter, warmer. It's further south, so it's a little bit fatter. It's like almost like for me, Mosul on steroids. So it's got that floralness and fruit of Moselle, Mosul, but it's a little bit fatter and fuller in style. A little bit more higher level of intensity if you're doing it SET level two or three. So it punches you in the face. Whereas with Mosul, you have to kind of go in a little bit and search for it.

SPEAKER_02

Clear? Can I give my version now? That's the MW, uh very detailed, super clever people version. This is the I'm doing West at three tomorrow and I need a cram and I need something to remember all this version. Oh, okay. This is how I remembered it, okay? Mosul. Think of moss because moss is light and delicate, kind of floral.

SPEAKER_01

Mosul, moss. It's a interesting line, but anyway, yeah.

SPEAKER_02

Rhinga. You think of a rhinoceros because it has you think of the high backbone like spine of a rhinoceros, is that like super backbone acid that you get in the rhinkout? And you said flintiness, and when I thought of that, I was like, maybe the flintiness is kind of like what you would taste if you licked the horn of a rhinoceros.

Riesling Regions You Must Know

SPEAKER_01

Wouldn't it be just quicker to write down the flop the notes rather than all these associations?

SPEAKER_02

Different people learn different things. I can't do what you do, I have to do this. Okay. Uh, third, nahe. So nah is got all these different sub-frigging things. There's like it's it's all over the place. And so if if you taste a reason, you go, nah, hell, I can't figure it out, it might be from the nah because there's so much going on there. Okay, and when you say to fruity, there's a lot of things. They kind of align. Yeah, yeah, tootie fruity, and there's a lot going on there, kind of aligns. Okay, okay, so fals, when you see it written down, it's looks like the word pals, just with an F thrown in. It's like P F A L Z Z. So it looks like pals. And what do your pals do? They bring you peaches. If you've got good friends, they will bring you peaches. So it's a lot of work to get to that. That's how you remember the stone fruit. Now, if you've got a friend called Ryan, he's not a good friend, because Ryan hasn't brought any peaches, and that is why it's not gonna have fruit characters, it's gonna be more savory. Bang! You've passed West at three.

SPEAKER_00

Right, right, right. Do you study that way?

SPEAKER_02

That's how I study. And students, I say to students, Am I being ridiculous here? And they're all like taking notes, and they're like, No, this really fucking helps. Oh no, I think so. Yeah, people definitely especially uh the ADHD ones who don't just retain information easily. Okay, okay, let's go. Tasting.

SPEAKER_01

Oh, let's taste. Yeah, I was like, what do we do now? Right. So just so everyone knows, we've had these wines poured blind, they are all of Spatlazy level. Two of them are labelled Spatlazy, suggesting residual sugar. Yeah, so um, but the other two have been fermented dry. I'm thinking the market in Australia is call calling out for the grossgevark Erstlagen styles of wines at the moment, which are Spatlazy and Ripert levels, but fermented dry, because it's very, very hard for me. I've struggled to find four wines of Spatlazy level from these regions. Yes.

SPEAKER_02

Now we now we need to explain GG.

SPEAKER_01

Oh Jesus.

SPEAKER_02

I'm not even going to attempt the full name. You you try again. You didn't nail it, but you can try again. So Grossgevack. Grossgevack. Gross Govak.

SPEAKER_01

There we go. A few years, probably ten years ago now, the Germans went decided why don't we have a system like they have in Burgundy where vineyard counts and producer counts. So they came up with a VDP system. I'm not even going to go close. It's Verde Predicat something. It basically translates as producer of sealed of note, you know, credit worthy producer. So it's VDP, it's got a ver it's got an eagle on it, and so you'll see VDP producer

Flavour Cues For Each Region

SPEAKER_01

on the label. So that's the producer. And then they've gone through and they've given to certain vineyards Groskevac, which is Grand Cru level.

SPEAKER_02

Yep. And then there's But like GG is like for short. I think people refer like if you see it written down, I'll probably just say Gigi.

SPEAKER_01

Yeah. So we've got Großkvac, which is GG. So it has to be Spatlazy or higher levels of ripeness, or up to our schlese, but fermented dry. Dry. So I think we've got a couple of those. It's simply because I really and I've spent we've I really spent the whole time with since we first discussed this a few weeks ago looking for these wines. Probably should have gone directly to Salahhand. That would have made life a lot easier. Didn't think of that until right now. Anyway, Salahand is a great importer of German Riesling.

SPEAKER_02

So you've got a Nach, you've got a Rheinhessen, you've got you know which ones a Schvatlese and I don't.

SPEAKER_01

Because you bought them, or do you not remember? I can't. I know one of them is that isn't, but I can't remember. Okay, don't worry. That's fine. So what we've got is we've got a Nahe, we've got a Rheingel, we've got a Mosel, and we've got a Rheinhessen Riesling, all of the same ripeness levels. Yes, made in different styles.

SPEAKER_02

Yes.

SPEAKER_01

But all spatles level of ripeness.

SPEAKER_02

This is an interesting exercise because people so often taste sweetness and in their head it fruit and sweetness are interchangeable, right? This is actually just good practice for me to be able to look past sweetness and be like, no, what is the underlying character that could still equate to one of those regions?

SPEAKER_01

Okay. Or it's gonna be hard because the sweetness is having an overriding effect on the dry wines. I'm actually gonna tell you.

SPEAKER_02

Which ones are dry? Yeah.

SPEAKER_01

Those two, you're sweeties. So do these two first.

SPEAKER_02

Are we left to right? Are we are always do they marry each other?

SPEAKER_01

Two and four are so sorry, these are sweet or dry? One and three are sweet, two and four are dry.

SPEAKER_02

Okay, so we start which one four.

SPEAKER_01

I I I just think it's gonna be easier for totally.

SPEAKER_02

Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. Okay.

SPEAKER_01

Because when I tasted that one after the sweet one, it was like, oh Jesus. No, no, no, no, no. Why we taste left to right?

SPEAKER_02

It's just a no, no, no, it's just a traditional. No, no, no, no, no, no. We need a system. Like, where like but why left to right? Why not right to left? Oh, because you just need a decide. Like if like you know how like when you're walking towards someone

Cram-Friendly Memory Hacks

SPEAKER_02

and you go, ooh, ooh, ooh, like you know, one should go left and one should go right. That's we just need to choose and and keep it that way.

SPEAKER_01

Apparently, when you walk into store, you're more likely to go, is it left? Or no, right. And so they put the things they want to sell on the right. There's a there's a science behind where they place products.

SPEAKER_02

Yeah, I don't know that one. Anyway, okay, let's get on with it. Okay, okay. The first wine that we're going to taste is wine number two. So Meg's already determined the dry ones. Only because when you're tasting, if there's sweetness, it's really hard to go back and taste wines that aren't sweet. It just like overrides your palate. Like when you brush your teeth and then you like can't taste anything afterwards, sweetness can have that same effect. So it was kind of important that we tasted the dry ones first. So we know that two and four are dry. So this is hard. Wine number two.

SPEAKER_01

Can you just tell me what the difference in age is it if I got like gone out and gone 2020s right up to 23s? Because I suspect I have. I didn't even look at the vintage to be fair.

SPEAKER_02

I think wine number two has a distinct something not fruity in it. Like it to kick off. Is it I wouldn't call it savory, but is it that thing that you were talking about with Ryan Hessen?

SPEAKER_01

It's got a flintiness to it, I think. Ryan Hesn't poured any peaches. So they're not friends.

SPEAKER_03

Yeah.

SPEAKER_02

Oh, actually, there's a little bit of like a canned peach.

SPEAKER_00

One of the ones is 2020, is 2020. And then the other three are 2023 or 2024.

SPEAKER_02

Okay.

SPEAKER_01

So that's 2020.

SPEAKER_02

What else about number two? Acidity. Nice. It's real nice.

SPEAKER_01

It's got a really acidity is just so refreshing. And I'm just thinking of, you know, vice first with mustard. And I went to the scrape butcher lunch in Germany. I know. And they you can buy all your food for the week, and at the end they have a barbecue where they're doing sausages and beer. So you go and buy your meat, and then you have a sausage in a roll with a beer. I mean, how fucking civilized is that? Why are we not doing that? Yeah. My butchery in London did. They used to do burgers. Sorry, back to the wine.

SPEAKER_02

Yeah. Me responding to her talking about food is the same as her responding to me talking about pop culture, like the Ryan's. Okay, so that is distinctly lime. It is maybe caffeine lime. It is like lime. Okay. Finger lime

Spätlese Flight And GG Explained

SPEAKER_02

too. Because it's got that floral finger lime character. How would you differentiate between finger lime or caffeine lime?

SPEAKER_01

Caffe lime for me obviously has more of a leafy character to it, a green leafy character, whereas caffeine lime for me is so perfume. I would love a perfume from finger lime.

SPEAKER_02

Oh, from finger lime.

SPEAKER_01

Yeah. I just think it'd a bit more.

SPEAKER_02

Or you think finger lime is more perfumey lime and caffeine lime is more leafy lime. Yeah. Yeah, nice. Good descriptor. Yeah, that was a good, that's good to clear that out for me, actually. Okay, so maybe let's leave it there. We'll go to number four.

SPEAKER_01

It's almost a bit reduced, stinky. It's our copper! Meg bought me copper today. It's there. I I need some more wine though. So uh you have to close your eyes now.

SPEAKER_02

Oh my god, I'm so excited. Wait, should we zoom in on this?

SPEAKER_01

Can you put can you pour some more wine? We'll close our eyes. Close your eyes, Mel.

SPEAKER_00

Hang on, no. I got uh number two?

SPEAKER_01

Hang on, let him pour the wine and then you can put the copper in.

SPEAKER_02

Okay, I'm so sorry, Austin. This is gonna be a hard episode to edit. I am so excited we get to use our copper. Okay, so in one of our previous episodes, Meg explained how if you suspect something is reduced, you can use a copper coin. Now go back and listen to the episode. We're not gonna go through the science again. But what do I do, Meg, practically? I just Okay, so Okay, let's go. I was so excited.

SPEAKER_01

Leave it for a few minutes. It's not gonna fizzy up, it's not like a bath bomb. Okay, so do we just move on now?

SPEAKER_02

And just like come back to it, give it a swell.

SPEAKER_01

Okay, there's mine. So you need to compare and contrast. Smell mine first and then smell yours. What do you mean? Because mine hasn't got the copper coin in it.

SPEAKER_02

Oh, does the copper take the reduction out? Yeah. I thought it just changed the colour. I didn't know it actually fixed the wine. No, it fixes the wine. Holy shit. Okay.

SPEAKER_01

I don't know if the wine is reduced, but it just felt a bit reduced. No?

SPEAKER_02

I don't know if I'm making up the difference in my head. That's yours. Oh, clearly. Mine's copper coin.

SPEAKER_01

I think these are two different wines because mine's cloudy.

SPEAKER_02

Yeah, because the I I cleaned my wines before.

SPEAKER_01

That looks cloudy. Yeah, because the No. Look at it. They look like the same wine. And these look like the same wine.

SPEAKER_02

No, they don't. That's so much. No, totally not. Whereas they're the same way. Ooh. Okay. It's it's because of the glassware we're using. I clean my glasses, I'm not yours. Oh.

SPEAKER_01

Thanks, bitch. Right. No, I don't think it's made a huge difference. I think, okay. The other thing about German wines, this is gonna be a very hard episode to listen to. It's gonna require a lot of editing. The other thing about German wines is they often have high levels of sulfur dioxide when you First, open them because they've got very low pH, which means the free sulfur dioxide is very high. That means that when you first open them, they can be a bit dulled. Is a copper clean, is it clean? Oh, so it should be cleaner when it comes out. Should be. Well, you can't you didn't really test it beforehand.

SPEAKER_02

So yeah, I forgot to take a photo beforehand. We are really fogging this up. All right, okay. Putting it back in.

SPEAKER_01

Anyway. Yeah. So my wine's not cloudy. My Mel just didn't clean my glasses. We've established that. Thank you. Let's go. Wine

Dry Wines First And Why

SPEAKER_01

two. What do we think?

SPEAKER_02

I think that there's Do we call it yet, or can we just move on and come back and call it? All right. Oh well, no, no, no, actually, no, no, you're right. Because this helps us remember the key things. Okay, look, the key thing that from the Mosul that I remember is a is lime is just the overarching character. Whereas all the others have different things coming into play. So I would personally be going Mosul, or there was a slight flintiness. So the flintiness of the Rangao, they're where I've got my money at the moment. Actually, Mosul in theory would have the least sugar, and so it's going to be less weight because it's a cooler region. Yeah.

SPEAKER_01

Than Rangau. Rangau's cooler. Than Mosul. Yeah. Yeah. I mean, it's look, we're talking margins here. Mosul, I don't think that's Mosul. Because I don't get that floralness.

SPEAKER_02

That's true. I don't get floral.

SPEAKER_01

The white blossom. And because we're in Chapatlazy level for Mosel Mosul, I would expect every time I say Mosul, I guess think of that those people that that guy that murdered his son, and his property was called Mosul. He killed his son and his wife. The the Maud Murders. Oh my god, you've got to listen to it. It's incredible. He's just been in and out of jail. You're so dark. Do you want me to go back to talking about Ryan Reynolds? His pro his property's called Mosul. He went and shot his son and his wife. And they got him because they've got his son talking to him and he said he wasn't there on his phone. Anyway, I don't think that the second wine is Mosul because I don't think it's floral and bright and delicate enough.

SPEAKER_02

I think this is a good time to let everyone know that we're also trying really hard to get our episodes up on YouTube. And that will be a really fun one to watch, just my face. When Meg is describing this dark shit. Okay, so um let's go and four. Okay, comparatively older for sure. We can tell that A, because it's got the darkest colour of all the ones in front of us. But it's also got this like mazepan

Copper Coin Fix For Reduction

SPEAKER_02

caramel vibe to it.

SPEAKER_01

Does it have your kerosene that you love?

SPEAKER_02

It's not kerosene. I don't think I think it's more like a candied walnut. Oh, candied walnut. Maybe a little bit of kerosene. But yeah, it's more that spectrum for me. I get the more petrol from an Australian one. I don't get it much on.

SPEAKER_01

Yes, the Germans actually think it's a it's a bad thing. And Jansis Robinson famously wrote an article a couple of decades ago, probably now, saying, Oh, yes, we don't we don't expect to see that in German wrestling. We only see that in Australia in those hotel. Wait, did she say it in a bad way? I don't think she was being super. But she does love wrestling, so no shade on Jansis. We love her.

SPEAKER_02

Okay. Okay, this is a Jansis. This is an pro-Jansis zone. Wow. Okay. I suppose I should taste it. It smells really freaking interesting. I'm intrigued. It's yummy. Austin, have you even poured yourself? These is what some of the best wines we've tasted lately. I'll just drink it after. No, taste it with me. We've got $500 worth of wine here. He's like, no, I'm gonna be a producer. Fine, do your job. And they've all got low alcohol.

SPEAKER_00

Give away which ones if I start pouring.

SPEAKER_01

Oh, okay. Okay, it's a good point. Oh shit, that's good. That is so young. I reckon that's Rheingel. You know, it's just got that that that block of acid straight down your palate, and it smells, it's got some age on it, so it's got some, yeah, that marzipan almost nougat character, but just that acidity is just next level. I don't know.

SPEAKER_02

That is such a fucking good wine.

SPEAKER_01

That's why I think it's Rheingau. Rheingau's one of my favourite regions in Germany. And if you ever want to go to Germany, go there. It is stunningly, stunningly beautiful.

SPEAKER_02

I just, I just, I just uh love this.

SPEAKER_00

In Germany, where are these regions? Or are they more towards France? Are they?

SPEAKER_01

Oh no, so uh do you know Frankfurt? Frankfurt's down here. The Rheingel's sort of here. Uh Mosul's towards the French side, but it's not it does it's not there, but it's towards the French side. Narche's southwest, so it's towards the French side as well. Rheinhessen's sort of in the middle, almost under the Rheingel. But the go go. The Rheingel just has these uh these powerful,

Rheingau Stops Us Cold

SPEAKER_01

amazing lines.

SPEAKER_02

I'm gonna have a go at explaining what happens when you taste this line. It is this vibrant, it's lime, it's maybe finger lime, it's this vibrant finger lime, perfumed, maybe zest, slightly zesty, slightly shebitty almost something. But then it's like you get that straight on the mid palette, and then kind of a filling around it, around the rest of your mouth, and kind of under it is this like a toasty, like this buttered toast. And then hang on, wait.

SPEAKER_01

I've finished mine, I might need some more close my eyes.

unknown

Oh my god.

SPEAKER_02

And then, and then in the finish, kind of like under here, kind of like a at the at the end at the finish of the what's the difference between front palette, front palette, mid palette. Oh, sorry. What's the last one? Like end palette? I don't know. At the end, you get this. The finish. I don't know. It's like, it's like it's the two. There's two. It's running this like zesty, bright, sherbety lime is running down the train track up the top. It's not a train track because there's two lines. Get a glass up the top. Get a glass mosole. I was gonna say down the bottom. Is this is this buttered toast, it's this candied walnut, and it is unreal.

SPEAKER_01

Well, don't look because Austin's pouring himself.

SPEAKER_02

And it's like it's not even that they're perfectly integrated, to be honest. I think that they are standing out as two distinct different characteristics and they are playing simultaneously at the same time, which is really interesting.

SPEAKER_01

I mean, I could I could be totally wrong, but the thing at those Rheingel wines is they stop stop me in my tracks.

SPEAKER_02

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01

And that is that is so unhelpful for someone doing what you but the thing is, you're going through all these descriptors. This could be the bloody Ryan Hessen or Naho, I don't know. But you're going through all these descriptors of these why uh of what's there, and they're all quite contradictory.

SPEAKER_02

They are, they are, they shouldn't exist at the same time.

SPEAKER_01

Yeah, exactly. And that's Rhine Gau for me is the growing region of Germany. I had a friend that worked there. It's just it's a beautiful region. Go there.

SPEAKER_02

That is the best wine we've tasted so far this year.

SPEAKER_01

Oh, Jesus.

SPEAKER_02

Like halfway through the year. I know. That's the best wine we've tasted so far this year. That is my favourite wine. I have maybe tasted this.

SPEAKER_01

It's got some minerality in yum.

SPEAKER_02

Anyway, okay, we need to move on. Uh, let's go, wine number one.

SPEAKER_01

All right, so I don't I don't know where this one is yet, but I've I've decided on that one. So

Sweet Wines And Apricot Signals

SPEAKER_01

where am I? I've got Naha, Mosul, and Ryan Hessen to go through.

SPEAKER_02

But we haven't tasted our sweet ones yet. Should we go back to Y1?

SPEAKER_01

Yes, because we have one. We need to taste the two sweeties.

SPEAKER_02

Okay.

SPEAKER_01

Oh, yeah. I love that style of wine. Oh, peach apricot. That is that classic canned apricot. When we talk about reason ripeness, we talk about the green end, the green apple and the lime, and then the apricot. And a lot of you probably think, what are you talking about? That is like, if any of you have had the luck of having apricot chicken back in the 80s, yeah. Right? Uh-huh. It's like that that tinned apricot stuff that your mum opened. No, well, you grew up in a European household. So we grew up in an Australian household. It was very trendy in the 80s. I think it probably travelled through to the 90s. You've had apricot chicken. When we lived in London, we used to go to the Australian shop to buy the apricot nectar so that we could make apricot chicken.

SPEAKER_02

Um that is apricot. Okay, so this is exclusive. If anyone cares enough about wine that they are this far through the episode and listening to this level of detail, you deserve to get this information first. You're hearing it at the same time as Megan Austen. They don't know what I'm about to say. I have finally, finally, after years of saying I'm gonna start research on this, I've started research on where we could do a live event. And I think I've found somewhere in Melbourne where we could do a live event. And I'm just saying, should should apricot chicken should we bring it? So that no, Austin says no. And you served it with rice. White rice. Okay. I know it was just a thing. Austin wants us to go more like highbrow.

SPEAKER_01

Like, yeah, that's right. Yeah, the calrose, I think it was called. Cal calrose medium white rice that you boiled, yeah, and then you drained it in the colander.

SPEAKER_00

Yeah, that's yeah. What would you garnish with?

SPEAKER_01

There was no garnish. There is no garnish, it's the 90s. It was rice and protein, babe.

SPEAKER_00

Steam brogli.

SPEAKER_01

No, I don't even think there was vegetables in there. There was no vegetables, it was chicken and apricot. As my father famously said to my children, rice is a vegetable.

SPEAKER_02

Hey, but interesting, don't you think though? Oh my god.

SPEAKER_01

It is not a vegetable. My dad hated vegetables, and so like if you'd had rice and they go, Papa blue, why don't we have any vegetables? Rice is a vegetable. It's not his dying. Tell you what, we give away some great advice on this.

SPEAKER_02

We should start health and well-being forecast. I'm kidding. Rice is not a vegetable. So um we should start.

SPEAKER_01

There has to be tin eight. Because it comes out of a tin, apricot chicken.

SPEAKER_02

Anyway, Paul, uh you're gonna have to that interesting, interesting. Can we actually circle back to an interesting thing that I've picked up from what you've just said? You didn't just say apricot, you didn't say canned apricot or dried apricot. The fact that you're talking about this specific dish is because it was a curry type dish. It was apricot chicken what had curry vibes. So I'm wondering if that weird savory thing that you were talking about before with Reinhazen is the curriness of this. And Ryan Hazen is more on the spectrum of yes, possibly.

SPEAKER_01

I just it's so pretty, and I know that's a terrible term.

SPEAKER_02

No, I know what you mean by pretty.

SPEAKER_01

But I can't.

SPEAKER_02

Think of me listeners. I remember I regretted it as soon as I saw it.

SPEAKER_01

My old boss said to a winemaker Tobias instead, I'm looking at you, I want the wine looking prettier. And Tobias, in his very laconic Australian way, said, I'll tie a fucking bow around it. That is not a winemaking term. Yeah. I I don't know.

SPEAKER_02

Okay, so it kind of a final thought for me is that how sometimes I get fresh apricot and sometimes I get dried apricot, and usually uh sorry, fresh versus dried apricot usually means that it's

Final Guesses Under Pressure

SPEAKER_02

like aged. Fresh apricot usually means for me, it's dry but ripe. And if I call out canned apricot, I think it's got residual sugar.

SPEAKER_01

Well, it has got residual sugar. And we know it's got residual sugar. But the smell itself is it's a spatlasy level wine. Do we see floralness in this wine? Compared to that we've got these two.

SPEAKER_02

I don't get floral. Nah. No. I would go as far as.

SPEAKER_01

I get orange blossom. Only because I have a tree in my garden that smells like that. Honeysuckle? No? Maybe a better one. I don't know.

SPEAKER_02

I think I think only because I'm being pushed, I'm getting the honeysuckle, but I think it's the power of suggestion more than legitimately getting it. Getting honey, but that's just because it's sweet. Okay. So then we go to the last one, wine three.

SPEAKER_01

Not floral.

SPEAKER_02

Not at all. It's mineral, it's flinty as fuck. Huh.

SPEAKER_01

Well, maybe I'm wrong, am I? I can't. This is a good thing that I bought these a while ago, so I do not have a memory. Could be Ryan Hessen, because they say that it's bloody irony. Irony.

SPEAKER_02

So bloody irony. Sorry, I just scared Meg. I'm so glad we're on YouTube. That will also be funny. Watch us on YouTube. And TikTok. Yeah. Well, not entire episodes go on TikTok.

SPEAKER_01

No, I know, I know, I know. I'm not so old. Sorry, man. Anyway, you know that you know the TikTok. Fire up. Shall we say that's Ryan Hessen? Because of that irony.

SPEAKER_02

Yeah. Yeah, I think so.

SPEAKER_01

Where what have we got left? Nahe and oh. That is the least fruity, most. What have I said about Nahe, tootie fruity? Maybe the first one's Nahe.

SPEAKER_02

Yep, first one could absolutely first one is 2D fruity. Second one I maintain has the most lime. I reckon that's Mosul. Third is Ryanhessen which leaves Ryan Gal.

SPEAKER_01

Rheingel definitely for the last. I don't have a problem with that. Because it is Mosul. Making is it normal?

SPEAKER_02

Meg, are you not considering that this is the only wine with a couple of years more age? And and perhaps that is why it's stopping us in our tracks. Okay.

SPEAKER_01

I think we're aligned though. Hang on.

SPEAKER_02

Okay, I'll I'll call mine and then Meg, we'll see if Meg's different. Mine is uh wine one is not hair. I say that because it's yeah, truty fruity. There's a lot going on. It's really different. Yeah. Number two is where I get the most lime. I do get a uh like a white blossom. I do get that floralness. Number two. I'm putting my cards in Mosul for number two. Number three is the most one that I would describe as not fruity. It is, it's it is that iodine. Is it iodine or iodine? How do we say that? Iodine? Iodine. Like Benad Benad, what's the thing that you used to put your put on Benadryl. Benadryl. No. What's the thing that you used to put on your benadine. Benadine. Benadine. Benadine. That you put on your cuts. That's right. That's the smell. Can I have more one three before we um also that say I don't need to, I've already called it savory type thing. And then the last one, I said rhine gal, I only because I'm backing you, but also it's also the only one left. That's my final.

SPEAKER_01

Oh my camera's still like. Wine one Mosul. Wine for Rhine Gal. Oh. Hopefully you. You can't know what I was. Which one we do think was do we think was Ryan Hessen?

SPEAKER_02

I know which one I thought was Ryan Hessen. I'm not giving you your answers, Meg. Nah, nah, I'm not giving you anything, Master of Wine. You tell me. Ryan Gow. Oh my god, we get it. Why forest wine gal?

SPEAKER_01

I've got myself really confused here.

SPEAKER_02

Which is weird because I have so much clarity. It either means I'm delusional or I'm amazing.

SPEAKER_01

Mosul? Nah, hey. Ryan Hessen. This doesn't help in the all the way. No, no, no. Wine wine is Mosul.

SPEAKER_02

Why number two is. Oh no, not agreed. Okay. So you say wine wine is Mosul.

SPEAKER_01

It's either one or three.

unknown

Fuck.

SPEAKER_02

Oh my god, Meg, we don't have all day. I know. Okay.

SPEAKER_01

Nahe. Ryan Hessen. Mosul. So wine one, Nahe, two, Ryanhesson, three, Mosul, four Rheingau. Change the first one because it is riper and a warmer region.

SPEAKER_02

Alright.

SPEAKER_00

So both of you have wine number one as Nahe, and both of you are wrong? Correct. Oh, yes!

SPEAKER_01

That is delicious wine. Oh, so can we

Bottle Reveal And Scorecard

SPEAKER_01

take a photo of this because this is the VDP? Uh yeah, okay.

SPEAKER_02

We'll put that out there.

SPEAKER_00

A little bit Nazi like. Oh my god. This is okay. I was gonna say, so you mentioned before it was an eagle. The symbol for this is a golden eye. I've seen it, of course. But the golden eagle that they mark their wines with is incredibly nuts.

SPEAKER_01

So this is a line number one is Don Hoff. The first time Meg said that, I cut it out of the episode.

SPEAKER_02

I was too, I was too scared. I didn't know what would happen. But now we have a producer that can say. So what was the second one? Ryan Hessen?

SPEAKER_00

Second one was, which you two have disagreed on.

SPEAKER_02

We disagreed on. So what did I say? I said it was Mosul. And Meg said it was Ryan Hessen, and it is Ryan Hessen.

SPEAKER_01

Oh, it's Keller.

SPEAKER_00

Keller Ryan Hessen. Now wine number three is Mosul. Meg has gone four for four.

SPEAKER_02

Meg's gone four for four.

SPEAKER_00

And the Ryan Gow is wine number four, which was the only one that everyone seemed to agree on.

SPEAKER_01

And it is so I've got to say the Don Hoff and the Mosul. The Ryan Hessen, Don Hoff, a credible producer and the Mosul. Tricky. That was hard.

SPEAKER_02

I've got to say I'm bloody impressed that the master wine could still do her thing. Like, well, I mean, that was a long time ago. You train and you train and you train and you train before you.

SPEAKER_01

The reason I landed on Nahe for that was that apricot, because it is southwest. It is a little bit warmer and it's quite ripe. And to be fair, we've we we've done ourselves a disservice because I don't any of them the same vintage?

SPEAKER_00

Too well.

SPEAKER_01

But that Rheingau is that the Gilg Brewer? Yeah. That is my friend worked there. That's where I made ice wine.

SPEAKER_00

The Mosul and the Nahe are the same vintage.

SPEAKER_01

Okay. So that should have made it easier for us to well, they they I've got to say it's Donhoff versus who oh Moliter.

SPEAKER_02

Okay. What is the uh price? What was the most expensive one here? Is is is is the price all around the same price, or are we talking big difference here?

SPEAKER_01

Right. So the first wine was the Donhoff uh Oberhauser Brug, reasoning spat laser 2023. That was $102, $120 from the Prince Wine Store, but we paid $102 because we get a discount. Thanks, Prince. The

Prices Importers And Where To Buy

SPEAKER_01

Mosul, which is the Marcus Molliter 2023 Berg Castella Bus Jube, Spat Lazy, was $58.65.

SPEAKER_02

Okay.

SPEAKER_01

From the Prince. Uh actually, no, 69, but we get the discount. We've had an expensive episode. I did I did tell these fuckers that it was going to be expensive. Yeah, I know. We're going to be drinking Glen Jacobs Craig for the episode. Then we have the 2024 Keller R R Ryan Hessen. So this comes off the red soils, those ferric oxide soils, which I think we picked. Yeah. $173.

SPEAKER_02

Holy shit. What was that? Y number two.

SPEAKER_01

Yeah, because you're in that GG. You know when you said to me, let's do GGs? And we did GGs and they're hideously expensive.

SPEAKER_02

Here. The copper is coming silver-like.

SPEAKER_01

Yeah. More copper-like because it's taking the oxide off it. Cool.

unknown

Sorry.

SPEAKER_01

And then the last one was a 2020 Gjork Brewer Rotland Riesling. So that's off the red siles at Ryan Gau, $165. So look, these aren't wines. WSET students and MW students get together because there's $500 worth of wine there. You can get 15 pulls to a bottle. So 500 divided by 15 is a glass of wine. An expensive glass of wine. Two glasses of wine.

SPEAKER_02

That was fun. All our friends out there with wine clubs. Okay, the one in particular, we know apartment number six is so going to be doing this the next time they meet up. Um can they invite us? Oh yeah, bring us. You know, you know they will invite us. But can I just say the last one? 160 bucks. I'm sorry, if you have a spare 160 bucks.

SPEAKER_01

2020, 2020, so buy it young.

SPEAKER_02

If you have how many friends? If you have 13 friends that are willing to put in money so that you can have a no, you don't want to taste one glass of this. Only invite, like, have like six of you. What's what's 160 divided by six? Someone? Uh 30. Yeah, okay, 30 bucks each. You're doing that for a glass of this. That's the best wine I've had so far this year. That is brilliant.

SPEAKER_01

The beauty about these wines is look, the the GGs, which are the two, the Keller from Rhein-Hessen and the Rhine Girl, are expensive because they're gross kavax, they're dry. I just there's an inflated price to those, whereas these Spatlazy wines are still bloody delicious. Yeah. Um, buy them younger. The Girlg Brewer, we're obviously paying a premium because it's a 2020.

SPEAKER_02

Are they all from Prince?

SPEAKER_01

No. The Keller, which is the Ryan Hessen, and the Girg Brewer are from which is the Ryan Gau are from Nick's.

SPEAKER_02

So Prince and Nyx? Yeah. Are the two places you source from? Okay. Yep. Both do sell online,

WSET Takeaways And Farewell

SPEAKER_02

right? So if we have international. Yeah, all of them. Yeah.

SPEAKER_00

I'll link them in the show notes.

SPEAKER_02

Thanks, Austin. All right, that was really fun. Um, please, please, please, please, please, if you go away and taste any of these wines, make sure you're tagging us on Instagram. We would love to know if you do this because it was an excellent exercise. If you're studying Wessett 3, this is a really, really good episode. Meg, would you say for people studying Wessett 3, these wines did a pretty good job of displaying what the course material would in theory.

SPEAKER_01

Yeah. Yeah, look, it to be honest, if I was going to go, the only one that I didn't think was super reflective of where it was from was the Mosul wine. So anything from Luosen, Ernst Lucen, and it's cheaper, reflects where it's from. Because this is this is a spatlazy wine, but it's actually, if you look at it, the sugar's not as high as you expect, and it doesn't feel as ripe. I don't know much about the 2023 vintage. I thought the Nache presented better as a classic Spatlazy wine than the Molotor.

SPEAKER_02

Awesome.

SPEAKER_01

Both of those are from the Prince.

SPEAKER_02

All right. That is all that we have time for this week. I can't believe we have other episodes to do. I just want to sit here and drink this Riesling. Um, but we will be back next week. Okay, goodbye. Join us class wine.

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Meg Brodtmann MW

Co-host
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Mel Gilcrist

Co-host