From Battlefield to Barn: Veterans Find Healing through Horses, Breathwork and Community

Join us for an inspiring interview with Colonel Charlie Jenks, a 28-year military veteran. Colonel Jenks has been recovering from PTSD (Post Traumatic Stress Disorder) and found peace and healing by connecting with horses, practicing breath exercises and finding kind mentors. In this engaging conversation, we delve into the transformative power of equine therapy and the profound benefits it can have on our mental and emotional well-being.

Motivated in part by the loss of his brother, also a veteran, to suicide, Charlie Jenks discusses the non-profit organization he has created, Connecting Veterans with Horses. We learn about Charlie's ambitious goals to help as many veterans, their families and others recover from trauma and find ways to connect more deeply with the people they care about and function with greater joy and peace.

Charlie Jenks shares his personal journey of finding refuge and purpose through working with horses, highlighting how these majestic creatures can serve as powerful vehicles for healing trauma and fostering personal growth. By forming a deep bond with these animals, our guest discovered the importance of trust, empathy, and non-verbal communication in building meaningful connections.

Episode "Chapters"
0:00 Introduction
01:20 Charlie's Introduction
01:59 Charlie Jenks as a former Veteran
02:52 Charlie Jenks sharing his experience on having a PTSD - Post-traumatic Stress Disorder
03:53 Questions about ourselves
05:10 Symptoms of PTSD
06:49 Charlie Jenks' healing journey
09:43 Non-profit organization - Connecting Veterans with Horses
13:24 Veterans' experiences with Meditation and Breathwork with horses
16:36 People that are Introvert and Extrovert and how they face challenges in life
19:23 Charlie Jenks sharing his path and enjoying the community he have
20:10 Margo talking about healing, and connections
24:06 Building relationships with others who can look out for you
27:02 Is it Masculine to Cry?
28:53 Most people just need a hug
31:51 Supporting the Connecting Veterans with Horses
32:57 Charlie Jenks' contact info and website of Connecting Veterans with Horses
33:57 Support and contribute to Body Aware Living's Mission to show people the practical ways to care for our health during the best and worst of times.

Guest Bio/contact info:
Charlie Jenks retired from the US Army after 28 years of active service including combat tours in Afghanistan. After struggling with the effects of Post Traumatic Stress Disorder (PTSP) Charlie discovered that meditation, breathwork, finding mentors and time in connection with horses helped him feel and function better.

In 2021 Charlie founded a non-profit organization called Connecting Veterans with Horses that provides an equine therapy program for Armed Forces Veterans, Active Duty service members and their families dealing with Post Traumatic Stress. That same year, his brother Mark, also a veteran, took his own life. Mark's death has further motivated Charlie to grow these healing programs with the goal of expanding to other locations around the country.

Contact info:
Connecting Veterans with Horses
Website:
https://connectingveteranswithhorses.com/

Email:
charlie@connectingveteranswithhorses.com

Donate to Connecting Veterans with Horses:
https://www.paypal.com/donate?token=6W5hL4MbvuaIDzPkcazwfSpptPAW5XaB_VkWCF4_VlxeoL7dnLaMuSZAMqXuRLWJTgyRpSZ0suNCKtUV

Social media:

Charlie Jenks on Instagram:
https://www.instagram.com/jenkscharlie/?hl=en

Connecting Veterans

Transcript

Margo Rose: 0:00

Hello and welcome to the Body Aware Living Podcast. I'm Margot Rose, author of Body Aware Grieving, a fitness trainer's guide to caring for your health during sad times. We're together with kind and wise people from around the world. We're looking for practical ways to get through difficult challenges and to celebrate our accomplishments. It's important to remember that none of the comments made by myself or guests is meant to replace any legal or health services. Best wishes to you. Here we go. Today's episode of Body Aware Living is called From Battlefield to Barn finding healing through horses, breath, work and community. We have an incredibly special guest, colonel Charlie Jenks, a 28-year military veteran and the founder of a nonprofit organization called Connecting Veterans with Horses. We're going to hear about his personal experiences with PTSD post-traumatic stress disorder and how he's currently helping more vets, their families and others of us who have been through trauma find healing through time with horses and one another. Hope you enjoy this beautiful interview. Best wishes.

Charlie Jenks: 1:20

Hello everyone. I'm Charlie Jenks. I'm the founder of Connecting Veterans with Horses. It's the equine therapy nonprofit. It started with veterans and their families in mind and that has grown. I think we've talked about before beyond just veterans and we're looking to expand it as well, create a bigger nonprofit as well for all people who are looking to heal. This was so cool to be on here and talk a little bit about what we're doing. Thank you.

Margo Rose: 1:55

You're a veteran as well. You've had. How many years were you serving the military?

Charlie Jenks: 1:59

US military- yes, I was in the Army. I'm retired of armies. I was in 28 years, served all over the world a couple of tours of combat. My personal story is my first combat tour was 2005 in Afghanistan and I knew something was off. Shortly thereafter, I started having severe panic attacks in 2007. Speaking in front of a large audience is just thinking maybe I was just nervous and not a great public speaker and then it just snowballed until really about 2016, early 2016 when I first started to realize that something's up and maybe it might be really the PTSD.

Charlie Jenks: 2:52

There's a lot of stigma as to people oh, I don't have PTSD or I didn't do enough in combat to have PTSD. A lot of shame involved. I was the same way and it was really a dot. I think we talked about it the first time. A medical doctor at my physical said hey, buddy, you meet all these checks and have you seen the psychologists across the street. I was like, why? He's? Like, come on, he was really down to earth and cool. I was like, okay, I'll go see him. That's really what started my path. Now, here we're talking, seven years later and some things started to work and the consistencies were horses and meditation and breath work. I started my nonprofit to include that, to share that with others, but in other traditional equine therapy activities like riding groundwork and just hanging out with horses too.

Charlie Jenks: 3:50

It's been amazing.

Margo Rose: 3:53

We're going to follow up with some really interesting questions about ourselves and about each other. One question and we're going to go into it a little more now than the previous interview was how do we know we need help? The other question that we're going to start looking at, which is way more fun, is how do we know what feeling good feels like? How do we know healing is happening? My favorite question I've been asking myself this a lot this year is what will it be like to be happier than I've ever been? Some of those questions and how do we get from point A to point B. We're going to go into many of the healing modalities that you're already doing, but we talked a little bit about all these different symptoms for PTSD.

Margo Rose: 4:36

I did a little bit of research because I wanted to figure out the question how do we know we need help? I was researching after we said oh, there might be 12 symptoms that people are in the middle the professionals are looking at. I found some websites had 12, some websites listed 17,. Some websites were up to 100 examples of people having a hard time functioning well and discovering that they might need to do something different. Should I take just a second and read those off from my research.

Charlie Jenks: 5:07

Yes.

Margo Rose: 5:10

All right. One was vivid flashbacks and nightmares. I'm like okay, but then it gets into stuff that could be really hard to interpret. In one's personal case it was self-isolation, depression, substance abuse, emotional avoidance, feeling on edge or hyperarousal, memory loss, trouble concentrating insomnia, negative outlook on the present or the future, physical symptoms like panic attacks, which you've mentioned, pain, sweating all that feeling emotionally numb, struggling to regulate emotions, trouble maintaining personal or professional relationships, self-destructive behavior like drinking too much or driving too fast and being easily upset and angry. That would just seem like a really long and potentially confusing list of things to try to figure out about oneself. Is it complicated to figure out? Is that just who I am? Is that me trying to heal? Is that what I'm experiencing? Within the range of normal? It seems even more complicated if somebody actually is a vet or has been through some other forms of trauma. How does any of this land for you?

Charlie Jenks: 6:28

Yeah, I say check, check, check. It's like you're listing them all off and that's what the doctor was kind of getting at me. So we were having a long detailed discussion and he was like you know, you meet all of those. You're telling me about all of those you know, but you're not telling me directly what's going on. You know, and that's the huge part and that's why I keep going back to the horse.

Charlie Jenks: 6:49

It was the horse that woke me up in part that, hey, I needed help. It was me and if I wanted something to change, I need to focus on me. And I know a lot of times we think of just looking, thinking about us. We were even talking about this off off right before. It's in a way selfish, but really it's what's needed. It was like when I shifted to focus, working on me, then the relationships with others and we were talking again about my, my children, but just people in general changed and it was like some, you know, I've been talked to many big, high, spiritual people, really spiritual people, who said you know you open up your heart and things will happen and you know they're right in a way, you know. So, whether people are into that or not, it's like focus on you and what I? And it's always the question is like so what do I do? And it's, you know, like you're saying, there's many facets of healing, but the ones that consistently, consistently come, you know, fruit for me is, is, is the meditation, the breath work, the getting inside of me, and then somehow you're you include these horses in into that and it's magical. It's so magical Like there was a guy, a veteran, yesterday with us and he, you know, he's got his own story, his own. He's on his own healing journey. He's a fascinating, brilliant guy. But you know what he needed yesterday? A hug from the horse. That's what he needed. We went, we were going through breath work and all I sent you I just texted you the pictures too that's all he needed was a hug. And he and again, I'll always defer to them, the participants, how they feel, cause I always ask them just know how you feel now, at the beginning, and how you feel at the end, cause that's what I'm about, like these, these horses. Just being around them made me feel better.

Charlie Jenks: 8:48

I just kept marrying, male, doing more of that, you know. And oh, by the way, it goes after your question, like what does it feel like to be happier. Well, I know there's a jump or a bump in my time with them. So how do I keep tasting that? That's that was one I always say, even with the meditation.

Charlie Jenks: 9:06

Once I started tasting that more like what it is you're, I think you're talking about that's when I got really excited about it and I go. You know, there's to me in the beginning of it was it was words Do this meditation for five minutes or whatever, try it. And it's like, yeah, how do I meditate when my mind is racing. But once I started tasting that, just a little bit, I was like tasting what? That happiness, that connection, you know all of that. And it's like, oh, and then after a bit, I started feeling better. I was like I have to share, try to share this with others, and that's what you know.

Charlie Jenks: 9:43

That was the genesis of the, of our nonprofit, you know, which is like five or six years ago now, was like I got to find a way through horses and through this breath work, and it just so happened that I could. You know, we're at this amazing center that gives me the freedom to do this. I mean, it was just me and a stall in the beginning and then it expanded, which you've seen, you know me, in a round pen which was a training pen for horses, with one horse and the participants of the class, and even that there's some risk in that, right, because people aren't horse people, they're nervous, they're in all those those, those symptoms, what you just described. So the horse is picking up on all that stuff, right. So there could potentially be some you know danger there. But it's just been so amazing because these horses are pros, they're therapy horses, they're on their second and third career, they're in their late teens, their early 20s, and they're just so patient with us and with all that you know. It's just amazing. I'll stop there, sorry.

Margo Rose: 10:46

Well, you know, you said, oh, I was feeling better. And that is exactly part of the question. Like one thing you mentioned when we were off cameras, like I woke up feeling more optimistic, like, like, how do we know what feeling better feels? Like, what else could we add to that list of things? When you in things you've seen your other vets experience, how do you know your vets and the other participants, the families of the vets and the other people who are joining your program, like what do you see in their behavior, in their outlook, in their posture? How can you tell when they're having benefit and healing happen?

Charlie Jenks: 11:17

Well, they keep coming back. That's the one. It is once like me that we're skeptical in the beginning, especially of all this. You know, if people say whatever meditation like, they're like I don't know anything about that, I'm from the East Coast, I've never heard, you know. It's like, okay, well, let's just think of this as exercise. Then we're doing a breath exercise with a horse and we're going to move her out a little bit, you know. And they keep coming back. But the one thing I always hear from them is the community. So it's like they belong somewhere. So it's that isolation part, right, because you become one of those symptoms you're detached from people. So this is a place you can come that not only the people are accepting of you, because we're all in a similar situation, but the horses. Horses live in the present and they're accepting of everyone. It's just like they're open. They're not going to push you off If you're. You know again, if someone's up and they're really in a flight situation of talking about a human, the horse is going to feel that. So they're going to respond to that a little bit. But really I, what I see is the horse goes all right, come here, I want to talk to you and then the horse, which I think you saw the other day, just locks on somebody. I didn't tell you.

Charlie Jenks: 12:33

There's a follow up to the story from Friday when you were even there. One of the veterans that I took the photos of where it's locked on this gentleman. What he told me was Saturday. He came back again Saturday class and was saying he was having this hard time with his throat locking up like clamping up, which is a symptom I had too. Like you lose your voice. You hear that right, you don't have the confidence to whatever that is. I was the same way and that was part of my panic attacks and so forth. But this work clears that and we'll get too far into it. But what he was telling me was he felt that not only our practice was helping him. The horse helped him and then his face even yesterday it was brighter. The other veterans were commenting on it.

Charlie Jenks: 13:24

You look clearer today and I didn't know that happened to him. I just knew that he needed something in a sense. But the horse saw it first because, if you remember, the horse was trying to lead with you right before that and then turned, as we're doing that meditation, for five minutes or so and locks in on this gentleman and I had to stop and I do it all the time. I'm sorry I have to take a video or a picture because no one's. In the beginning I said no one's going to believe me, but it happens just about every time. But then the follow-up A, then the guy came back the next day, which is not, and he lives like 30, 40 minutes away. It's not like he lives around the corner too. So there's something there that, whether it's community, whether it's feeling accepted, whether we're all in the same boat, have some sort of same story Like this gentleman is a combat veteran who was injured in combat too, his lower leg and so forth, no-transcript. But then it has the PTSD, the mental part too.

Margo Rose: 14:30

I, you know. So we have a lot of material to be sharing In addition to this podcast, the actual portion that we have. I've now been to your meditation with horses class twice and I was taking some video and some photos, and I've also we have a lot of material to start pulling together and sharing with people, because I also started doing videos with some of the vets and other participants with their permission. And are we talking about Gonzalo? Is the example you're giving with Gonzalo? Yes, okay, so I have an amazing video. I didn't get to send it to you yet. Gonzalo, last time I was there, did an amazing video with me. It was so honest and sweet. It was before we went out with the horses and it's about nine minutes long. I'd like to share it with you. I'd like to share it with your community because I was asking here here's like an injured vet, real McCoy, and I was like finding out how his program had affected you, and he goes. I'm just looking for joy. He's like I'm dealing with. He was so honest and I'm willing to say this because he said he gave permission that I was okay to share with this, but he was like I was depressed, I was. It's confusing to come back and after being in a military world it's really confusing. It's easy to isolate when you feel confused like that and I'm just looking for joy and I thought that was the simplest request of what people are going through and I just want to.

Margo Rose: 15:56

Since we're already here, I just want to talk briefly about this idea. One of the symptoms of worrisome symptoms of potential low function is listed as isolation. It's listed right near the beginning. But I also wanted to touch briefly on the idea that some people might just also want a little bit more time to themselves, especially if they're confused about how to interact socially. They might want to not make mistakes by keeping to themselves a little bit more. And there's also people who are more extroverted, and so good signs of more health for them. If they're extroverted, they want to go out in a crowd and they want to be somewhere loud and they want to connect with a lot of people.

Margo Rose: 16:36

But there's other people and I'll include myself in this category, especially increasingly, where we're kind of introverted. Like for us, what might feel good. You know, the amount of a loan, a loan, time or isolation we might actually get benefit from is also very much based on our personality. Does that make sense? If there's a continuum, I don't think isolation is automatically a risk factor. I know I am not a mental health professional. I am not trying to replace the mental health or professional services anybody needs. This is just me just trying to learn and add vocabulary to that. But would you agree that some people just I think it depends on their personality.

Charlie Jenks: 17:22

I do know from talking to them and again, I'm not a professional either and I generally don't talk to even the veterans about their specific situation, unless they're want to share something with me. And generally then I just listen to them and because I really think the horse is the healer, you know, like this is the professional, you know, but I just try to create the environment. But a lot of, I do hear a lot of the veterans talk about their isolation and just the fact that they don't, like leave their home ever. We're talking not even like, hey, I need a weekend to kind of decompress, because I'm that way too. If I'm busy during the week, I need a day to kind of recover. I've always been that way and you know, in relationships and stuff I've been with extroverts to where they just want to be out and I'm like I just need one day. Or after a work week, you know, I just need Friday night, then I'll be good on Saturday.

Charlie Jenks: 18:18

I didn't know what it was at the time, but it's different people. There's a great book out you meant quiet, I believe, is the name of it and it goes into that exactly. It's saying you're not. Then you goes into, like Harvard Business School, people are all they look for extroverts for the MBA program. Right, that's what they're looking for, but that doesn't necessarily mean that everybody has to be that way, you know, to thrive. And then she goes into like studies of like you know, most of the world leaders and business leaders are introverts because they think you know, and you have those people out there to do that work. You know the extrovert work, but you need a balance of it and that's why I think it's like anything, I think it's individual and you need a balance and that's why I keep going back to it.

Charlie Jenks: 18:56

And I know this may not sound right, it may sound off because I always talk about like meditation and stuff. Like, because in the beginning it sounded off to me. I was like what are you talking about? Like Qigong meditation, you know, and it was like, but I truly believe like you need to get inside yourself to get those answers to like, answer to be like A I need a break, a I need to back off, or A I need to engage. And that's the part I go like.

Charlie Jenks: 19:23

You know, I always tell people like I'm on a path. I don't know where it's going, but it just feels good to be on that path and that's. And my path is totally inconsistent with because most people, like in my situation, retired. They got some sort of contracting job with the government, you know, supporting the government, whatever. You know, because I were ex-military and I was like, you know, I can't yeah, it sounds enticing, I'd make more money and all that stuff. I was like I really have to work on me, otherwise it's just going to keep snowballing, you know, and I think finding the answers come from within. That's my opinion. Again, I'm no expert on you know, I'm just talking about myself at this point, but that's what I'm finding and I'm seeing it with others too. That's what's cool about being in this community now.

Margo Rose: 20:10

Well, I mean, every time we talk, there's a million more things to talk about. It's always fascinating and there's always more to go into. And there's something you talked about I want to go back to it because it was really super important and it's how do we know improvement is happening? And you mentioned that after your time with horses and learning to regulate your own kind of emotions and connect, and that a wider range of emotions was okay to experience and you found some safe people in places to be around. So you know, isolated or with who Like how do you, how does each person know when they feel safe? How do they know if an environment is safe, fun, beneficial, and that's what you've helped create with people they can, even if they tend to like a lot of isolation, they'll come around you and the horses will be like okay.

Margo Rose: 20:59

This is the kind of connection that actually enhances my feelings, and you were talking about a part of your own journey with that where you described it as becoming a better father. You had this breakthrough that you're willing to be more honest with your kids. People wishing they could be closer to their fathers or fathers wishing they could be closer is so important, and could you tell us more if it's not too personal. What was that experience of getting closer to your kids like?

Charlie Jenks: 21:28

Oh yeah, I think it. I don't know that I would say it's even being a better father. I think it's just being a better human, in that I might. My one teacher is it's a master's, his name is Sam Tam, he's up in Vancouver, but he always talks about becoming whole. Our work is to become whole and then, when we become whole, then we can be connected to the greater, to people and all this stuff.

Charlie Jenks: 21:50

And I feel like through the work, like through the work of me internally in many cases, right, and how people get after that, whether it's, you know, prayer and all that stuff, meditation, you know there's many ways to get in my opinion and get after it. But it caused me to be more open and to be more vulnerable. And that's when my kids, like the year that you're their dad, they're always trying to put you up on the pedestal. They want you to be something greater, right, oh, my dad did this, my dad did that. But when they see that your dad's just human, that was the part that it was like, because there's still like that friction to you know, when there is that pedestal, you're like you're separated in a sense. But when they realized that I was struggling, I think it was really when it's changed. So I don't pretend to be like a perfect dad or anything, but we are relationship. I feel that you got to ask them to on their side, but we can talk. Now there's no like barrier to talking. There's not. They should not. I again I defer to them, which shouldn't be like hey, I missed, this is what happened. And they're afraid to tell me, like no, just tell me what. And we've already had that. They have school and all this stuff.

Charlie Jenks: 23:04

So it's like that's when, like through the work of my on myself, caused me to be more vulnerable, to be more open, and that's when I think our connection became greater and I think now we're we're great friends in a sense, even though I obviously I'm their dad and in some cases I have to have that more than my role. But I think we're more friends in a sense. You know, we're just more open and we try to support one another. That's what I feel. And it was through again I go back, it was really through the horses.

Charlie Jenks: 23:35

It was through another gentleman, monty Roberts, who has a veteran program, who sat down With my three kids and me in like a and he is like a PhD and he's on a couple of them, I think in the mental health world too, and he talked to us about it and he was just like so what's going on? You know it was just very basic stuff, but that was the first time we really like address, like you know, neck grievances, but what's going on? And and then from there, scott, further, it just grown, I feel.

Margo Rose: 24:06

The mentorships and wisdom, some willing to be more open, some, you know, I just all of this sounds like what more people wish they could do with their families, or perhaps families of choice, you know, just finding mentors If your own family isn't a place where you can find the healing, then finding healing with what you're talking about mentors, people who are older, people, who are learned, people you can trust, people who want to look out for you. I think we can create those relationships. You know, who has wisdom we want and need and who's willing to look out for us. And hard. Just one thing I'm still so curious about you were mentioning that at some point in this willingness to be more vulnerable, that you had an experience you hadn't had in a long time that involved crying like at some point. You know crying is a healing tool. It's a tool to cleanse the cleanse the spirit, release some emotions, and would you be willing to share what crying felt like after you hadn't done it in a long time?

Charlie Jenks: 25:06

Oh yeah, it was because you know you're kind of like this. I was kind of like this knock this battery off my shoulder or people like me don't cry, or whatever. So I didn't really cry like my whole life. I mean I probably could count it on one hand like how many times I've cried, and maybe before, like six, seven years ago. But I think it was more of letting go and it helped that a friend of mine was crying right before me who I thought again wouldn't cry.

Charlie Jenks: 25:37

You know, in a group, we're in a group setting and we're given some feedback on what we just experienced with a horse again and he opened up and I was like whoa, that totally because I was next to speak and I was just like, oh my gosh, that just totally blew me because I would have given like some straight face answer yeah, it was nice, or whatever. And then he starts crying and it just let probably allowed me to cry, I don't know. But ever since then I was like, yeah, I mean it's okay, but I still think it's like it's letting go. I mean it's like we're holding all this stuff. It can't be good.

Charlie Jenks: 26:17

I mean that's how we do this meditation to breath work and Qi Gong. It's about letting go and connecting. You know, and that's what I feel. It's like just breathe, my teacher, I think I mentioned this the other day but it's like, do you breathe out of every cell of your body? It's like no, I don't have to breathe out of this tube, you know, it's like respiratory system, like yeah, but yeah, when you breathe that way, you're still like contracting every part of your body. It's like why it's a waste of time, you know, especially if you're not lifting something or something. You know, it's like yeah, that's like sense, just let go. And it's so easy. I always say this stuff is so sound, so just let go. You've heard that your whole life. Right, just let it go. But then to do it is another thing, you know.

Margo Rose: 27:02

It's another level of it. I mean, what would you say, having experienced this emotional release, this physical release, this refreshing sort of funsing sounding moment Like? What would you say to people who think you know, oh, is it masculine to cry Like? Or they've been trained, it's not masculine to you? Know, what is the message from Charlie Jenks to the world on this topic of masculinity and crying?

Charlie Jenks: 27:26

I say ego gets in the way, right? So you have to let go of that ego. It's like I've heard so many times over and I think I mentioned this, but it's like I didn't even think I had PTSD because we're not supposed to have it A first in the beginning, right, and I was an officer too. I was a leader, you're not supposed to. And then there was the whole guilt of like, well, was I really in that combat like these other warriors? You know no. So it's like that shame thing, you know. So it's just like all this stuff is like or you name this the Marines don't have PTSD. Like what, you're killing me. Like leaders are saying this you know what do you pick? The four I'm not trying to pick on the Marines, but the? It's like we do, we're not perfect and you can show your vulnerability, and it's just like. That's the part again I keep going back. It was the horse. The horse told me because the horse lives in the present. And it told me hey, buddy, you're jacked up, it's not me, it's you. And I'm like because they're just responding to you. And it's like and if something's not quite right, yeah, they could be a wild horse or whatever. But if they're relatively trained and they're kind of and they start jumping around, you go like it's like don't lunge at them or just kind of move slow. It's like it's so crazy. But that that was the part where, like just said, it's okay.

Charlie Jenks: 28:53

You know one of my mentors speaking of a mentor, he's a therapist that works with veterans and trained therapist and he's like most of you guys just need a hug. Most of you big macho guys just need a hug. And I go you're probably right. It's like, yeah, we never got that. I mean, we're not, we're too tough to get that. You know what I mean. He's like that's what I find this guy and he hugs everybody. You know that's his deal. He's like he just hugs people and some people don't want. I didn't want to be hugged in the beginning, you know Cause I was like that PTSD, like get away from me, buddy, I don't want anyone near me. But he was right At the end of the day. Like I said about the veteran yesterday, he just wanted to hug a horse and this is a macho guy, you know, like attack helicopter pilot guy. You know you're like it's pretty cool to see.

Margo Rose: 29:42

Well, there's, there's a million different ways you're helping other people and you've, you've, you've channeled what you've been learning into all these beautiful, this beautiful new program connecting, you know, connecting veterans with horses, now expanding that to try to reach out to more people. And before we run out of time, I just want to, you know, thank you for everything, thank you for all the different kinds of service you've already performed and the current way that you're you're wanting to grow this program, and how can we help what you're doing be more successful? What are some of the things we can contribute and and provide so that this vision grows the way you hope to?

Charlie Jenks: 30:20

Yeah, I mean, ultimately, I'd like A just get the word out that, like we're just talking about it, like you're not, you're not the only one that's going not that, not that it's not important or downplaying it, but there's a lot of us are going through the same thing. So get the word out that there are people who are trying to work on this collectively, together, and it's all different.

Margo Rose: 30:39

So people could share this on social media. Everything, everything you've said we've got all this material and all this content we're coming up with, so one way people can help help you and help what you're doing next is to share some of these clips and these videos on social media. You were also mentioning about people who have land, people have horses, people who might want to have some sort of small version or a pilot program across the United States or maybe the world, that there's other facilities that have horses that might want to invite some portion of what you're doing to be on their land and with their horses. Is that a possibility?

Charlie Jenks: 31:15

Because that is where the name part of what the name came from connecting the horse. It was really just me being like a putt of going out to each spoke of where they provided services that are somewhat similar to ours, you know. And so, yes, we're looking to grow. I'm looking to grow within my organization, but I know that there's a lot of great. Maybe it's just identifying hey, we're doing something similar, because I keep finding like-minded people that are doing they call it something, they're more technical and they're certified and all this stuff Like, yeah, we're kind of doing the same thing, but yeah, you are a medical doctor I'm not, you know, but it's like it's pretty cool.

Charlie Jenks: 31:51

So A that. And then funding too. Like we are looking for donations as well, because I really my goal is to turn these programs over to veterans, like let them grow them to run these again around the world, around the country at least, but maybe around the world too. Like we can establish a program that has the juice to pay people to do it, you know, and give them and then grow them to teach others. You know, that's really my goal and I don't foresee me like doing this, you know, on the grass-roots level for a long time, but I wanna be part of it and help run this organization. You know, after I turn it over to people, that we've kind of helped. It may be get back on their feet but maybe just need a little bump and you know to get there or so and a little help to get there. So that's kind of where I'm looking for.

Charlie Jenks: 32:47

So, yeah, this is the word. If the people are generous enough to donate some, then you can go to my webpage, connectingventorswithhorsescom.

Margo Rose: 32:55

Wait, I'm sorry, say that again more slowly.

Charlie Jenks: 32:57

your webpage wwwVentorsWithHorsescom, okay, or on Instagram, you can get there too. It has my webpage there, but on Instagram it's connectingVentorsWithHorses as well. We post all of our weekly. We post our videos and photos from our sessions. We're really trying to make the horses now there's nine horses, the celebrities too, because they really are, but I mean, that's gonna be another project. I'm trying to get someone to run to show you these amazing healers, and they all have had their different paths of lives too. There are competitors and stuff, dressage and all this stuff, and you really can see like these are some amazing horses, but they're healers. That's the cool thing. They're locked in Once we start class and you've seen it. But it's so cool to see how I just kind of let them take over and realize what I feel I still facilitate. But that's what happened again yesterday.

Margo Rose: 33:57

Yeah. So if people want this type of healing, if people want this type of message, if people want more of Charlie Jennings and more people to feel and behave like with all this, you know, who do we become and we become happier than we've been like and how do we, how do we start using those new, happier selves out in the world? It's just such a fun question. I so you know. So media support, cooperation with other organizations that have similar, similar goals, that they can, we can collaborate. We don't all have to run our organization separately. You have the donation button on your website and we can include a link to that, and you know I'm interested. We have almost enough material for me to do a full-length documentary about your program already, and if people want to learn about that or support about that, they can also go to my website, which is because I'm doing this full time too, like I, just I want to be supportive of this. I'm willing to use my time, my energy, my wisdom, my curiosity to put a highlight on all the different healing modalities, especially those with horses. So if you want to help support any of that, you can go to bodyawarelivingcom, and bodyawarelivingcom already has a way to stay connected by email so I can let you know, as let you know what Charlie's up to, let you know what my other guests are up to as they develop. I'll keep you posted if you want to stay connected by email.

Margo Rose: 35:29

And I think I'm going to put a contribute button on my website too, because I want to. I want to do this full time and if, if people wanted to donate, I'll put it on my website. I mean contribute. Contribute I'm not a non-profit organ, I'm a not profitable yet organization, meaning it's just me trying to. Right now, doing all this stuff is just really an extremely expensive hobby Because I hate people to help me with all the tech stuff. It's hard. So I'm going to put a contribute section on bodyawareliving website as well. I'll have to figure out how to do that, but I will donate back to Charlie's organization a portion of any contributions I get to start making these documentaries about his program and I start documenting other programs like this that are looking for ways to, you know, practical ways to care for our health during the best and worst of times.

Margo Rose: 36:21

So all that's coming up. We're going to have a lot of those links in the show. Now it's Charlie. Thank you so much time for your time, for everything you're doing. Yay hooray, more Charlie's. We need more Charlie Jinx out there.

Charlie Jenks: 36:34

Thank you. Yeah, it's been. It's been nice, nice connecting with you. Thank you for coming. You've been for everyone else. Yes, you've put so much effort into this, or so grateful, and hopefully that people will see that and grow your side, because we won't be able to. You know, if people are into this, which I keep finding, like I said, like minded people, into even the horses and meditation and stuff like that that you're, you'll be the source to show us that. So that's what's cool. So thank you for what you're doing too.

Margo Rose: 37:05

Thank you. I'll put 100% of my time in, if I can afford to do so. This is really a big passion. So thank you so much, I'm sorry, say the last thing, I didn't mean to do.

Charlie Jenks: 37:14

It's noted the time that you have to put into it Just in a little time. I've met you at how much effort you put in already. I appreciate it.

Margo Rose: 37:22

Thank you so much, Charlie. We will be in touch.