Breaking Away from Pushing the River

This is the last episode of 2021 before some time away to clarify the next steps for the podcast and book writing. While all of these projects have been exciting, Jessica is coming clean about how when we push the river, we run the risk of that excitement starting to feel like too much, too fast, and too soon. 

When we want things to turn out a certain way (and who doesn't?!), we can find ourselves pushing for a particular outcome instead of letting ourselves float down the river's current and letting things unfold naturally. Being available for that natural unfolding informs our bodies of what feels good and what doesn't.  But if we're pushing too hard to get it the way we want it,  we inadvertently muddy the waters and be rendered unable to get clarity on the way forward.

Jessica also talks about the need for readiness as we embark on new journeys and the need to titrate the amount, the speed, and the intensity of our experiences to get the most success (in our own eyes) from our endeavors. 

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The One Day You Finally Knew: For Folx Breaking Away podcast is produced and edited by Jessica Chasnoff, a recovering perfectionist who is always on a learning curve. While she is a psychologist, this podcast is not a substitute for mental health services. If you're struggling with mental health concerns, please reach out to a professional near you.

In episodes where Jessica discusses cases, they are composites of her clients from over the past 20 years.  She has changed names, situations, and circumstances to protect client confidentiality.

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Transcript

Break Away from Pushing the River 

Hi there. Welcome to One Day You Finally Knew: A Podcast for Folx Breaking Away. I'm your host, Jessica Chasnoff. And I am thrilled to be here. A partner walking alongside you, as we explore and uncover what no longer serves us and how we might be able to let those things go and set them down. Let's see where our walk takes us today.

Hello there everybody. So lovely to be here with you. I want to say right now, because I fear I will forget if I leave it until the end, that this is going to be the last episode of 2021. I have been planning to take a break and this feels like the right time. It feels like a good pause point so that I can just spend the last month of the year doing as much resting as possible and letting my body do what it likes to do as it moves into winter. And just following those impulses.

So, I'm actually going to be doing a lot of breaking away from as many of the things as possible for this next few weeks. And that actually is a good segue into what the topic is for today, which is Break Away from Pushing the River. We've all heard that saying before, "don't push the river" and, you know, if we really sit and think about it, right, it's like there's this natural flow of things in every aspect of our lives.

There's what wants to unfold and the way that it's going to unfold, that can't be well, I mean, it can be manipulated, but it can't be manipulated without a consequence that isn't necessarily a positive one. Pushing the river is something that  I'm very well acquainted with.

And if you are somebody who really wants to be able to show up in your life in a way that is making things happen, right? If you are somebody who gets concerned about living by default, you might be somebody who tends to push things and tries to create change or some shifts when it's not the way that nature is letting those shifts occur when left to its own course. 

 It comes from a place of impulse for growth and for change, for wanting things to be different. And there's some beautiful things about that, right? Wanting change, wanting growth. And then at the same time, we get into this space of wanting things to be different from how they are, which creates suffering. Because what is happening is what is happening. It's a bit of a double-edged sword there, right? Being somebody who really wants to feel in control of life and yet, John Lennon said, life is what happens while you're busy making other plans.

So part of why I'm talking about that today is just because I'm really deep in this dance for myself around allowing the river to just flow and getting curious about that flow and feeling the enjoyment of it being exactly the way that it should be versus diving into something or things plural that are feeling kind of like a push, because I'd like a certain end result.

So the reason why it's a segue after I talk about taking a break is because I am feeling pressure that is, if I'm going to stick with this river metaphor, it's like, I'm this beaver that's trying to get things going in a certain way in this river home. And I'm building this dam and forming more pressure, maybe building the dam in a, in a place or in a way that is only going to cause there to be kind of a log jam.

And by the way, I don't think any actual beaver is in danger of doing this. I think beavers are following the impulse of their true nature within them versus the human thing that we do, which is like, "I got to do this here. I've got to do this now" I'm talking about me as this like, (laughs), uh,human conditioned, metaphorical beaver that is clogging up the works or trying to force a different kind of flow than the one that's actually happening. I'm no stranger to that. It's something that I've actually worked on quite a bit throughout the years.

And I also see this happening with the various projects that I've been involved in and they're all exciting, right? I mean, this podcast is really a delight and I love the feedback that I get from people that it's a benefit to them. And it's a lot of work to produce a 20 to 25-minute podcast every week. It's probably six to eight hours of work that I put in to have the polished version that everybody gets. There's my workaday life, which is beautiful and amazing, and also intense in these times. And then there's the addition of working on the podcast.

 And then this book thing that I've been trying to get off the ground. This is really the way that I'm seeing more of the pushing the river with regards to the social media piece. It is such a disappointment to me that the way of things in 2021 is that a literary agent is just not going to pick you up. If you don't have a very large following on a platform. Despite having good content, that doesn't mean that you're going to get a large following. And in order to get a large following the amount of time that an individual needs to spend on social media cultivating that is not the amount of time that I'm willing to spend because that's time in my life that I'm never going to get back.

 Really, truly, I'm not a social media person. I, uh, I have had mixed feelings about it from the beginning. I'm one of the few people that actually has not had a Facebook account until very recently and it's been for the purposes of getting the word out about the podcast and also the upcoming book.

And at this point, there's three chapters of the book that have been written, but the way that it works in the literary agent world and the traditional publishing world is that you only write two to three chapters before you start pitching it to literary agents. It's best to not actually write the whole book because they might want to do some tweaking if they take you on.

And so what's actually happened is that I've been pushing this river around the social media stuff. And yet I am kind of getting further and further away from what I've wanted to do, which is to just write this book. So what I'm realizing within myself, Again, always listening to what's happening in my body. Well, not always. I don't always listen. But when I forget then remembering to get a sense of what's going on in my body and feel into what it's wanting, what it's needing. And, uh, it does not need more time on social media and it does not need more time pitching literary agents that are saying no, because I don't have a platform. 

And by the way, when I say lots of followers, I mean, I was kind of thinking maybe I'd be able to, it's so naive now, but I was thinking, oh, you know, if I could get a thousand followers. No, I mean, it's like 15,000 plus followers that they want you to have. And, um, the Instagram now is not the Instagram, even a couple of years ago. It was much easier to get a following.

 It's just not a game that I'm willing to play. For those folks who are willing to play it, good on them. I am not judging that at all. But for me, it's bringing discomfort and unease, uh, and a feeling of chaos. My digestion hasn't liked it. That's because my sympathetic nervous system was getting activated by it and it was, uh, stopping my digestion.

So listening to that, I realized that something needs to shift. Wanting to get these things out into the world, which, which comes from a positive impulse, unfortunately when the pushing comes in, that changes things. And so I'm just going to be moving into a place of more listening and into a place of writing the book. Getting it done, whether or not anybody else reads it. Whether or not it actually goes out into the world.

 It's a special thing to be able to just say that you've written a book, whether or not anyone else reads it. So that's the direction that I'm going at this point. And it feels really sweet to just kind of be floating down the river, floating on my inner tube, uh, which is most definitely a doughnut, um, a strawberry frosted, uh, on top, glazed donut floating down the river on that rather than, um, pushing my doughnut down there and creating some kind of log jam,

Weird mixing of metaphors. Bear with me. What can I say? So there's another piece here though that I want to talk about. I've had so many clients over the years and there is some element of pushing the river. And this can be wanting some kind of result on the outside, in the outside world, or this could be something going on in the inside that they're pushing.

We do a lot of pushing on ourselves. I want this to change. I don't want to be like this anymore. Why am I still doing this thing? And we have this inner critic, which is the internalized critic of caregivers or other people in our lives who were critical and lacking in compassion potentially.

 That's a way that we push ourselves. And then of course, paradoxically, the more we push, the more we can wind up in this place of collapse or numbing out or being stuck in some way. And the same goes for clients who are coming to me with a situation externally where they're pushing the river.

I see this a lot with folks who have been socialized to be girls around relationships, especially, not always, but especially in romantic relationships with people who are socialized as boys.

 There is this incredible anxiety about wanting something to happen with a romantic partner. And, um, oh my goodness. I mean, I can just feel it right now. The way that I used to feel when I was wanting a romantic partnership. Having this idea of what you want and feeling like it's not happening on its own or feeling like somehow you've got to do something to make it the way that you want it. And I see so much pushing the river this way.

It's very hard when it comes to matters of love or, uh, or infatuation, at least. Limerence. It's so difficult to just cruise, right. Just float down the river and see what happens. If we could all do that I think that we would be showing up in much more regulated ways in our nervous systems.

So, I'm thinking of many clients that have come and they're wanting to be living together or they're wanting to be proposed to, or they're wanting to be married or they're wanting to have babies. And to just see the way that this pushing starts to come in.

And then unfortunately what happens is that when we push, we can't really see what is naturally going to unfold, which will inform our bodies whether or not a person is appropriate for us as a partner. I mean, I remember, oh my gosh, this is like, I mean, honestly, this is, this is up there with my, some of my most, uh, mortifying stories. 

Many, many years ago, I think I was like 24. I was in grad school in Chicago and I, I was dog-walking at the time. I met this man who was charming and adorable. He had given me his number and then something happened. I couldn't believe it. Something had happened and I lost it. And, um, I was desperate to find him, right. It was like, it's like, I was not in a position at that point in my life to take in the possibility that that number got lost for very good reason. And that it was better for me, for my heart, uh, to not find that number.

 But no, no, no. I had to push the river. It's so embarrassing because I mean, there's those ways that it's like, practically, I mean, it's not stalky, but like a little, a little stalky. I was like looking for this person. I was trying to kind of figure out when he might be in the elevator again.

And I knew which building he lived in. It was this huge comedy of errors because, um, uh, I'm making up a name. Let's say, uh, his name was Dan and, his building had a door person and, I said, you know, uh, Dan had given me his number and I lost it. And I was hoping to find him and, and he was like, well, I can't give you his number, but I do know which unit he lives in. If you'd like to leave a message, I can dial the phone number and you can leave a message. And I was like, okay, great. 

So. Oh my God. Oh my God. So, I call and leave a message. And I was like, Hey, Dan it's Jessica, we met in the elevator and you gave me your number and oh my God, would you believe it? I lost it. But, uh, Joe, the door person was kind enough to let me call you from here. He didn't give me your number, but anyway, here's my number, uh, and, uh, call me.

And so I was super delighted to get this call from. Dan. When he called me, he said, hi, I don't know who you are. You left your message and I never met you in an elevator. And my girlfriend doesn't believe me. Thinks I gave my phone number to some rando in the elevator.Anyway. Yeah. That was embarrassing. Yeah. I was like, do you want me to talk to your girlfriend and say it wasn't you? No, no, I think you've done enough, he said. But here's the thing is I actually did wind up running into the real Dan.

And, uh, things went very, very badly in the attempt to date this person. Really what had happened was, I pushed the river. When I somehow through some divine synchronicity, I was supposed to lose that number. I mean, and I didn't, I mean, we could say, you were supposed to have exactly the experience you had, otherwise you would have had a different experience. True, true. I get that. And at the same time, oh, how I wished I had lost that number because my heart was trodden on, in a pretty big way. Uh, yes. Moral of the story. Uh, don't push the river.

If you lose somebody's number. Think about the possibility that you were supposed to lose the number. Uh, but yeah, I have a lot of clients come in and talk about this. And while I'm not thinking about any story in particular, and just because I wanted to offer you mine there, I'm gonna say that I've had lots of stories like that come into my office through precious people who are suffering because they really wanted it the way they wanted it. Like we all do. And boy, do I understand that. And yet, we often regret the pushing.

So those are some thoughts on that. There's a body-centered piece that I want to add in here when we're looking at pushing the river. And that is the idea of readiness. I don't think this is something that we discuss enough or get curious about enough within ourselves, this idea of whether we're ready for something as we're attempting to push for it.

I mean, going back to the story about losing elevator guy's number. You know, I really wasn't in a place of readiness for romantic relationship. I had so much stuff to work through and myself and really understand my worth as a human being. So there's readiness in that kind of way. Are we ready for this thing? Whether it's relationship or some kind of adventure.

 But there's this piece in the somatic world around how too much, too soon, too fast is potentially going to create the causes and conditions for trauma. If not trauma, then certainly discomfort and unease and a lack of peace, a lack of feeling of safety. And so we really need to titrate certain levels of experience for ourselves. If we're determining whether we're ready.

If we don't have that core readiness in our system, then we might not be able to take part in a project in a way that is as successful as it could have been, had there been readiness. Life is going to come at us sometimes too soon, too fast and too much . This is part of life, right? Trauma is actually part of life and it isn't the event itself. It's if we are not able to complete the activation and deactivation cycle within our nervous system from the experience.

Okay. So if there's the detritus, the residue of that energy that didn't get moved through. If that hangs out in the system, then there's potential discomfort, unease. And so when we are embarking on something new or when we're deciding to do something where there's some trepidation, right. We can go toward it if there's trepidation. We can go toward it if we are feeling a little bit, tremulous. You know, we don't want fear to stop us from doing things.

And we do want to be able to move into things as softly and slowly and in a titrated or like a, a piece by piece a little bit, and then a little bit more, and then a little bit more kind of way to have the most successful outcome for us. And when I say successful outcome, I don't mean what everybody else thinks. I mean, the way that it feels in our body. 

So I think in terms of takeaway for today, I'd like for all of us to just feel like we can let ourselves sit and feel into the way it's feeling inside us to be moving toward what we're doing and what that impulse is feeling like. And what's the pacing feeling like. Is it too much? Can we back off a little bit? Is it too fast? Do we need to slow it down? Is it too soon? Do we need to back up a little bit and give more space so that we can feel some readiness? And so we're not pushing.

And I feel like this is the last thing that I want to say here today. I mean, I really, I am, you know, there would be a time in my life where I wouldn't be, I wouldn't, I don't know. I guess maybe I'd have more ego investment in looking like I had it all together. And now I just am much more interested in being raw and real.

Letting it rip and showing everybody who I am so that they can feel like they can be who they are and show who they are. I talked about that at the very beginning when I started, but I'm really happy to say, wow, so I did this thing and I noticed that I actually wasn't so sure about my readiness or that it started to feel like too much, too fast, too soon. So I don't have any shame or embarrassment in saying I feel like it's been a little like that here in terms of getting all these things going at once.

Book and social media and podcast. And that what I'm going to do with that is to take some time away. Because that the, for the too soon piece, like, okay, let's just kind of give it some more time and the too much. Okay. Well, when I come back and do more episodes, it might be every other week. I've backed way up on my social media. I was posting twice a day at one point and then once a day, and then a couple times a week is kind of where I am now and I'm really just not even looking at all because I just don't want to spend my time that way. And, uh, slowing it down, slowing it way, way down.

So I'm just going to invite everybody to look at that and, and feel their way into whatever you've got going on. You know, are you pushing? Are you letting the river carry you down the current? Right. You know, how is the speed of it? How is the amount of it? How is the intensity of it? Okay. So just getting ever, so curious about that. All right. Yeah, I think that's kind of a nice way to round out the year. 

Not that I'm a fan of resolutions, really, but I will say, as I'm moving into this break from other things, there is some intention setting around that, right? I would like no matter what's coming down the pike in 2022, to feel more ease and peace and comfort and safety in myself. And let the impulses around what I'm going to do outwardly come from that. Perhaps you might find that you would like to do the same.

So my dears, I just want to round this out by thanking you so much for choosing to spend 25 minutes of your week listening to this podcast. That it is meaningful and of benefit to you is so, so sweet. I've just really appreciated being able to share with you and be of service in this way.

May the rest of this year bring only good things. And if it doesn't, may you continue to take courage with whatever is coming your way. May you be able to soften into whatever is on your internal and external path and may we all be able to find even the smallest, sweetest little joys in every day and be good to ourselves when that's difficult. Okay, my dears, I'll see you on the flip side. Until then, be gentle with your sweet selves.

Thank you so much for listening today. If you are enjoying this podcast, please consider writing a review and giving it a five-star rating. This is something that can make the podcast more visible to others who might benefit. And if you are wanting to connect with me, I would love it. My contact info and socials are in the show notes.