On The Runs 185 | LIVE from Marathon Sports | Marathon Training and coaching relationship with Nicole and KJ

Thank you to Marathon Sports in Manchester, New Hampshire for hosting us last week. Special shoutouts to Zoe and Matt from Marathon Sports. Alexis from Saucony and Marathon Sports Ambassador who helped make this happen, Stephen Mr. 305! 

In this live episode of the On the Runs podcast, hosts Eric and Erica welcome guests KJ and Nicole to discuss marathon training, coaching relationships, and the mental aspects of running. The conversation covers the importance of building a strong coach-athlete relationship, the intricacies of creating personalized training plans, and the challenges of tapering before a race. The guests share their insights on race day strategies, the significance of recovery, and the motivations behind their coaching. The episode concludes with an engaging Q&A session with the audience, highlighting the community aspect of running and the joy it brings to both coaches and athletes.

We'll be back on Thursday this week and recap it all and more!

Chapters

00:00 Introduction to the On the Runs Podcast
05:43 Meet the Guests: KJ and Nicole
08:40 The Importance of Coaching Relationships
11:24 Building a Training Plan
14:39 Tapering and Race Preparation
17:45 Race Simulation and Nutrition
20:35 Flexibility in Training Plans
23:48 Final Thoughts and Wrap-Up
30:08 The Importance of Familiarity in Racing
33:16 Tapering Strategies for Marathon Training
33:57 Race Day Preparation and Mental Strategies
35:39 Pacing Strategies for Marathon Runners
39:46 Post-Race Reflections and Future Goals
43:42 Community and Accountability in Running
48:29 Coaching Philosophy and Relationships
56:23 The Role of Coaches in Athlete Development

My Race Tatts Affiliate Page - 15% of your purchase goes towards our TEAM FORCE Fundraising efforts for the NYC Marathon

Wrightsock Affiliate Page - 15% of your purchase goes towards our TEAM FORCE Fundraising efforts for the NYC Marathon

Eric's NYC Marathon Fundraiser - Team FORCE, a dynamic organization that supports the hereditary cancer community

Erika's Chicago Marathon Fundraiser - for American Foundation for Suicide Prevention in memory of her brother, Nick

Strava Group
Linktree - Find everything here
Instagram - Follow us on the gram
YouTube - Subscribe to our channel
Patreon - Support us
Threads
Email us at OnTheRunsPod@gmail.com

Transcript

Eric (00:00)
What's up everybody. And welcome to a very special episode of the on the runs podcast. As today's episode is from our live recording last week at marathon sports in Manchester, New Hampshire. This was an incredible night, but before we get to the episode, we want to do a few thank yous, right? Erica.

Erika (00:16)
Yes, we do. Last Thursday was such an incredible, incredible night. And we do have a lot of people we want to thank. So let's start by thanking Steve, Mr. 305 for setting this whole thing up. We got to thank Zoe and Matt from Marathon Sports for just treating us so well and giving us the platform. We got to thank KJ and Nicole for being our amazing guests. They are just so wonderful. And they had such a wealth of knowledge to share with everyone.

Eric (00:44)
And we want to thank everyone that came. We had almost 30 people there. I was counting at one point, I counted 28. It was incredible. So actually, if you add the four of us, that makes over 30. So we hit 30, but it was amazing. It was, mean, some of those people do work at Marathon Sports, but you know, numbers are numbers. We're going to count them all. It was incredible. We had so much fun. Guys enjoy this in a little treat to you. I'm even going to play the first minute.

Erika (00:55)
Huh, we did better than we thought.

Still counts. Hi, Jen.

Eric (01:12)
that we were recording before we actually started the podcast. So you can enjoy that too and hear how we pictured everybody naked or whatever, you know, in their underwear as Erica said. So guys enjoy this special, it's a real episode, but this special live recording for Marathon Sports.

Erika (01:20)
Yeah.

Eric (01:29)
we'll be back on Thursday to tell you all about it. So guys enjoy our first ever recording, not the last. I'll tell you that too. From Marathon Sports in Manchester, New Hampshire, because it was wicked awesome time. Have a great week. We'll talk to you on Thursday.

Speaker 2 (01:47)
All right, so before we get started, a couple things. One, we are the On the Runs podcast. If you can't tell because our names are so alike, I am Eric and that is Erica. We are going to do, this is going to be a full episode. We're going to introduce it like a normal episode. It will drop next week on Tuesday. And so we're going to do a little intro and then we're going to intro our guests. We have KJ and Nicole and we're going to talk marathon sports. It's going to be about a half an hour and then we'll do, we'll see if we can keep it at a half an hour.

Speaker 4 (01:55)
Thanks for being here guys.

We'll do

a Q &A. do go off the rails a lot, so don't blame us. We're going to try our best.

Speaker 2 (02:21)
And we're excited. So thank you everyone for coming. And we're going to like this, as I said, if 10 people show up, it would be amazing. And I think we've easily doubled that. So this is amazing. It's our first ever show like this. So Erica's a little nervous, but if she's just going to picture you on your underwear.

Speaker 4 (02:29)
Turn it

Speaker 1 (02:36)
Only one?

Speaker 4 (02:37)
I'm picturing everybody in their underwear, so I should be okay.

Speaker 2 (02:41)
And everybody can hear us just fine, right? Perfect. All right, you guys ready? Sure. All right. I would have had fireball shots for you, but I ran out of time.

Speaker 4 (02:50)
I ⁓

Speaker 1 (02:50)
appreciated that.

We were gonna bring tequila.

Speaker 2 (03:49)
All right, what's up, everybody? Welcome to episode 185 of the On the Runs podcast, live from Marathon Sports in Manchester, New Hampshire, in front of a beautiful crowd who's all enjoying pizza and drinks. They just ran a three-mile run, and we're here with some of our favorite friends. But first, I have to say hello to my amazing kick-ass Rockstar ever co-host, six-star Erica. What's up?

Speaker 1 (04:13)
Thank

Speaker 4 (04:17)
We're cool. This is our first time doing, like Eric had mentioned, our first time doing a live episode like this. So please excuse me if I do get a little nervous. But we are just so excited that we could be here, that you guys are spending your evening with us. And we are so excited to get to talk to these two wonderful ladies here.

Speaker 2 (04:35)
And you know what I already noticed? We already messed up. I didn't hit record on the camera. can you hit record on that camera? We'll just keep rolling.

Speaker 4 (04:41)
Is

he gonna make me it again? I don't know.

Speaker 1 (04:44)
It didn't get me like f**ked.

Speaker 2 (04:45)
You're going see a little behind the scenes thing here. Clap into your microphone and look at the camera. One, two. There we go. That's how we sync the audio. We need to do a couple of thank yous first before we introduce our guests. We need to thank Zoe from Marathon Sports.

Speaker 4 (04:47)
Just

Speaker 2 (05:05)
We need to thank, I'm sorry I forgot your name already, but you from, she's a D1 sprinter from the University of Lowell, UMass Lowell. She brought the sock and the shoes. Whoever delivered the pizza, thank you and thank you to everyone who came. And then another one we need to thank, Mr. 305 No More.

Speaker 4 (05:23)
Did you say math?

Speaker 2 (05:24)
Matt. Matt from Come on, I was getting to Matt. We just, Steve helped us come up with this about a couple, really about eight months ago we've been talking and we pulled this together in last two months. This is pretty cool. But now we get to introduce our two guests today and I'm going to let Erica do the honors.

Speaker 4 (05:43)
am so excited. These are two of my favorite people and you may have heard them previously on episodes of On the Runs podcast. So I believe Nicole was episode 44 and KJ had episode 62 and we are so excited to have them talk about all things marathon training and the taper crazy. So let's welcome them to the show.

Speaker 3 (06:04)
Applause

Speaker 2 (06:08)
Who here is running a marathon this fall? By show of hands, we got one, two, I make three.

Speaker 4 (06:15)
has a goal

race, a half marathon, a 5k, anything special.

Speaker 2 (06:19)
We

got almost every hand out for goal races and we're gonna talk about both of those. I say we start with KJ first. KJ why don't you give yourself, why don't you give everyone a little bio here, a quick rundown of who KJ is. Make sure you talk into the mic.

Speaker 4 (06:32)
Okay.

Sorry. I am super nervous. I am not good at talking in front of big groups, so bear with me. I also cuss a lot. So if that happens, ⁓ just keep rolling. ⁓ I guess just KJ, the runner KJ, coach kind of same person, but, ⁓ I get to, I get to work with Erica and I love it. She's a workhorse you guys. ⁓ so yeah, I've been running for a very long time now, 20 plus years. ⁓ I was a collegiate runner.

⁓ for cross country and track and just kind of hobby jogged for a few years and then started finding it in my late, probably my early 30s started like finding more structure with my running again and then did the I'm never gonna run a marathon and then somehow I ran a marathon and now somehow I can't stop running marathons. So and then I've always just been in positions as like captains of teams or ⁓ coaches of other like

areas of my life that it just made a natural progression into coaching running. ⁓ I had wonderful friends that let me Jess over here, ⁓ practice basically. And then in 2020, I had just the birth of relentless running came to his little pandemic baby.

Speaker 2 (07:48)
Why relentless running?

Speaker 4 (07:50)
Well, it gets a little cheesy here and I don't, I don't even care. am who I am. I am obsessed with Shalane Flanagan. don't know if anybody remembers Shalane. She's kind of made her way out of the professional running scene now, but, um, she won New York marathon, right? And put up exactly. And she did, you know, um, basically just like, keep doing it, be relentless like that. And it stuck with me. So.

Yeah, so if anybody knows Shalane or any way to get in hold of her. I mean that in the least creepy way possible.

Speaker 1 (08:20)
Give her my number.

you

Speaker 2 (08:27)
We'll work on that. And then our next guest here is my coach. We thought it'd be great to bring for one of our first ever shows like this, actually our first ever show like this, our coaches. And I have my coach, Nicole Bryant here. Nicole, how are you doing? I did not.

Speaker 1 (08:40)
I'm okay. How are you? Did you run today?

Speaker 4 (08:44)
You

Speaker 2 (08:45)
We're going to talk a little bit about that, about how, because ⁓ Erica does everything KJ gives her to the T and I don't.

Speaker 4 (08:53)
I can tell

you the difference is children. He has children.

Speaker 2 (08:58)
But you just you just got in here because of children.

Speaker 1 (09:00)
Because

of children. Yes. Children. Yes. My son had an open house tonight, so I came running over here from that.

Speaker 2 (09:06)
Well, you got your run in. So why don't we give everyone a quick bio about you. You were episode 44, but refresh everyone here.

Speaker 1 (09:13)
So I've been running for 20 plus years. I tried track in high school and didn't really want to run to anybody else's rules, but my own. ⁓ So ⁓ I just started running. I got into marathons early on in life and didn't train properly. So I probably should have done that. And then I learned how to train properly. And I also like KJ just naturally have that leadership tendency in my personality ⁓ and just kind of transcribed into coaching and then.

I kind of built my own business on coaching and mental health advocate. So, and I'm now creating my own podcast.

Speaker 2 (09:50)
You are and we'll get to that later maybe at end of this. So I think we should get started with the actual theme of this. We have the theme of marathon, half marathon training, goal races training. And I think we should start with who here has a running coach already? And who here is interested in getting a running coach? We got more hands there which is great.

Speaker 4 (10:12)
Why

did Zoe go so hard? ⁓

Speaker 2 (10:17)
And we have two amazing running coaches here, so we want to talk a little bit, start, about the relationships between you and your athletes. You don't call them clients, you call them athletes, correct? Correct. Why do do that?

Speaker 1 (10:28)
You're athletic. You're You're not a glad I'm just going to say.

Speaker 4 (10:32)
that.

Speaker 1 (10:34)
Like you're a parent.

Speaker 4 (10:35)
I seem so formal

relationship with the people in coaching. Like they might not know them in the beginning and then they become pretty good friends. ⁓

Speaker 1 (10:47)
You talk to them about some pretty personal stuff eventually, right? Like a lot of life gets in the way of why you can't run and why you can't...

Speaker 4 (10:53)
There's a lot

of emojis in our text messages.

Speaker 2 (10:56)
Let's talk a little bit about your relationship and maybe how you formed it beyond getting to know each other on the podcast. two of you, Erica one day reached out. I know she was thinking about it for a year. I don't know why she waited. I think a lot of people who are looking for a run coach think exactly that. They take too long or they just hesitate too much on pulling the trigger. And Erica finally did. She even talked to you about it at the 20 mile or last year. And I think it took her about to the end of the year to ask you to be ready.

Speaker 4 (11:24)
Well,

I can kind of elaborate on that a little bit. I waited until I had the full marathon season out of the way. And I was doing a lot of ultras at the time. And it didn't seem conducive to try to work on speed and the consistency that I wanted, especially like strength training. I was terrified of strength training. So I just waited until I had kind of a clean slate. I had a new goal race and no ultras. So I had a perfect amount of time to.

To start a new build and start it the right way. So I reached out to KJ and here we are true love ever since. do think a lot of people hesitate getting help with their running because, and I've heard this a lot. It's like giving up the freedom of your running and people struggle with that because they want to be on their own timeline. Maybe it's kids. They don't think they have the time for it, or they've just like really enjoy running as it is. They just know they could benefit from the structure. and then if you have a good coach.

you have a plan that works with your life. Like there's a lot of like leniency on how you put it together, right? There's guidelines, but that's all they are. Like, so I think it's like scary for people to give up that part of they're running.

Speaker 1 (12:37)
what I've

heard too is just that freedom of like I just go out and run. I'm like well you want to get better so let's do some speed work and I think that scares a lot of people.

Speaker 4 (12:45)
It's definitely hard to do that on your own too. Cause I can tell you, was not doing that when I was just running for fun. And yeah, so it was, it was quite a change to, to get into a new routine.

Speaker 2 (12:58)
Let's talk about this. What are some of the things, I know you already knew Erica and I know you already knew me, but what are some of the things you do to get to know your athlete first? Let's say you don't know them. Let's say they're reaching out to you for the first time. Do you send them a questionnaire? Do you have a sit down at a coffee shop or a virtual call? What do you do?

Speaker 1 (13:13)
I do an athlete intake form. I have it on a Google form essentially and it has a lot of different questions on what their lifestyle is like. Are they a novice runner? Are they into strength training? What days do they want to do for rest days and strength training? Do they have kids? What's their work schedule like? And then based off of that, I have a phone call with them on what their goals are.

Speaker 4 (13:35)
I also do an intake form. I'm from Keene, New Hampshire, and it's, I'm sure just like Manchester, but there's a huge running community. So if it's somebody local, I'll definitely meet with them ⁓ because coffee is life. So we'll go that route. And then it's, you know, I would have a phone conversation if they're not local. Definitely want to like get to know them as a person too. Right. ⁓ But then.

I always just leave the lines of communication kind of open. There's a lot of coaches. did a lot of research before, ⁓ starting relentless on across the board. Most coaches will have it a clause, like depending on what package you get, that's how much communication you get. And I don't love that. So I've always kind of kept it open. You can text me if it's about running. You can text me if it's about, ⁓ I don't know what you ate for breakfast. It doesn't like matter.

So, and I got burned on both ends of that before, because there's some people that really abuse that open line of communication, but I'd rather that they talk to me too much than not at all kind of thing. So you really get to know people. Yes, that's true.

Speaker 2 (14:39)
Now let's talk about building a plan. right, Erica's running Chicago Marathon. In anyone else here going to Chicago? got Mo over here, Maurice. So you two started working together in January. When did you know you're going to run Chicago?

Speaker 4 (14:43)
So anybody else?

⁓ the previous November, was on deck. was on deck.

Speaker 2 (14:58)
So

you got 10 months to plan. How do you start planning for her 10 months in advance?

Speaker 4 (15:04)
I will say Erica is the exception because if you guys should have seen the email she sent me outlining her goals for this year. It was amazing. It was so good to have all this information. This woman runs so many races and some of them outside of my comfort zone. Like it's nice to kind of dabble in helping an ultra runner. ⁓ So it is a little bit different because we are kind of navigating a lot of races and then trying to really

Make sure that she's recovering in between. And that's a little bit harder. So if you have a goal race, typically you're either like a week, maybe two to like bring it down a little bit and let your body heal in your mind. not be the paces, So Chicago is coming up very shortly. Next week I have a 100 mile. And two weeks later I'm going to Chicago and that's

Speaker 2 (15:53)
She's just shaking her head at you right

now. only runs 100 meters and she's like 100 miles.

Speaker 4 (15:59)
Yeah. Let me tell you, it's how I feel, is your perspective when you're like, Oh, I ran a hundred miles and I only have to run 26.2. It's true. So Erica is a little bit different in that regard, don't have a lot different. I've been trained in my life. So I mean,

Speaker 1 (16:10)
bit different in that regard. ⁓

Speaker 2 (16:17)
Let's pretend she's not running 100 milers.

Speaker 4 (16:19)
All

right. Yeah. think that if we had been working together, so the first real big goal race was cheap, which she crushed. ⁓ So if we were starting from that point on, we would have, let's say, you know, she relaxed after in a perfect world, she would have relaxed a little longer after cheap marathon. And then we would start base building again, ⁓ which for somebody that runs as consistently as she does, and people that constantly are running, most people will keep.

their long run maybe somewhere around like eight to 12 miles. That's like amazing spot to be in to be able to just like translate into marathon training or half marathon training. In my opinion, that's what I think. It's like great, if you're already there, we can easily start the build from there. If you're not there, then we're just starting, we're starting a little bit slower. We're taking a little bit slower from the beginning.

Speaker 2 (17:11)
How about you Nicole, how do you build someone's foundation? ⁓

Speaker 1 (17:15)
I mean, I can speak to, you know, I mean, I'm just going to pick on my fiance who's sitting in the audience, but, know, from somebody who went, somebody who went from like not really running to now running a half marathon and just doing reach the beach at 17 total miles. We built that very slowly. It was a run walk. was, you know, throwing in, okay, now do a 200 meter sprint. Okay. Walk for those rest of 200 meters and really building that base of for him, a long run was three and half, four miles. ⁓ and now he can do the eight to 12.

no problem. So you're really just trying to build somebody's base and you can't just as a coach, you know, when you have so many different athletes, it could be, you know, somebody like KJ and Erica and then there's somebody like Daniel and you just have to differentiate what people's needs really are. And so starting out at that bottom of the walk, run or, you know, being like, okay, just start off walking. It doesn't matter. Just, and then just kind of jog your way, way through it.

Speaker 4 (18:09)
Is it easier for you to kind of take two different athletes like that and be able to separate your time between them? Or do you like, I don't know. I don't know how I want to ask that.

Speaker 1 (18:20)
I understand

what you're asking because it is a struggle. think right now. I do. have about eight right now and all eight are just so insanely different with different needs. And so I have it scheduled. So like I have, you know, these certain people that are on this certain day and these certain people and I have to go back and keep notes and just kind of like remember like, okay, this is where Daniel is. This is where you know, so and so is.

Speaker 4 (18:23)
You could have a whole gamut of a-

Speaker 1 (18:46)
This is where Eric is and you know Eric doesn't do his strength training so we now have to you

Speaker 2 (18:51)
I

just don't record

Speaker 4 (18:56)
Nobody look at Eric.

Speaker 1 (18:58)
KJ doesn't like that either. There's a lot of shame. usually send them the shame gift. Big fan of strength training. These are coaches that actually like strength training. You find a lot of running coaches that just don't, are so afraid of it.

Speaker 4 (19:10)
actually had to ask for it back after a little while. Cause I did have race after race after race and you were being, I guess, kind of conservative because, I was like, I'm ready. Just give it back. want some more strength. she does it all. So I try. I do.

Speaker 2 (19:26)
I do push-ups and squats in between kids. what I do. I guess I don't click on the app. You both use the VO2 app and that's how you schedule a lot of your training and you go in there on a computer. Talk a little bit about that platform.

Speaker 4 (19:31)
Yeah.

Yeah, actually Nicole and I talked last week, and we both use the app and we kind of do things a little bit differently where I believe you do three week blocks. I used to do monthly and found that people, know, things change, right? Maybe your fitness is picked up and, and, and rather than go back and have to redo it all, I do it weekly now so that I can adjust.

Speaker 1 (19:52)
Two to three depending on the person.

Speaker 4 (20:08)
Paces or dial it back if like you're not hitting the marks, which is part of running. Let's take it back a little bit. Um, or inevitably, you know, you'll write out an entire like plan and then somebody's like, Oh yeah, I'm on vacation. Um, I'm gonna be running and I'm like, that would have been cool to know. That would have been really, really cool. Um, yeah, the app I love, think it definitely, um, makes things very like you cannot, you can't screw it up. Right.

Speaker 1 (20:35)
You can't break it. think it also it's great because it allows the athlete to change things around. So it's not like I'm giving them, you know, back in the day when you had the Hal Higdon's, you know, cookie cutter type of plan and you have the three months printed out and now you're trying to like move them all around. Like if it's two weeks, I'm able to move things around. know, Eric's a busy dad of three and a wife and a job and this and he doesn't have time to sleep, let alone, you know, like moving things around. So.

Speaker 2 (21:00)
.

Speaker 1 (21:02)
I would like you to get more, but I can't control that. I'm trying to remember my circle of control,

Speaker 2 (21:08)
talk

about one thing here, planning and adjusting planning because Erica is to the T. If she has to do a seven mile run, she does a seven mile run. Where you might give me a 17 mile run on a week and that's what I have on Saturday and you don't know this yet, I'm doing it on Monday. Where I...

Speaker 1 (21:24)
I leave

notes for you to rearrange it. Like you and I have had this conversation.

Speaker 2 (21:28)
do you work with athletes like me who have time constraint problems? like, well, okay, you always give me a long run on Saturday. I do it on Saturday if I can. If not, I find a different day in the week to adjust to get the long run in. Is that easy or is that a pain in the ass? Am I a pain in the ass? Yes. Is Erica the rock star?

Speaker 1 (21:49)
You are a pain in the ass in general. You've gotten better, but your notes are dissertations. It's great when Erica's like, this is why I'm doing this, and you're just like, and word vomit. This is all of my thoughts in my head. When I was on my 17-mile run, I think it's OK to be able to work around it. I want people to feel like they have that flexibility and it's not super strict. And KJ and I, when we talked last week, talked about this a lot, where it's

As long as you're not doing a back to back long run or you're not doing your hard workout next to your long run, you can move it around as you see fit. I think as long as you're staying in the perimeter, don't act like they don't need to ask my permission necessarily. Daniel will be like, hey coach, what do I have to do today? So I can absolutely help him and I can help them move around, but I want them to feel the freedom of like, hey, I have to move my run because my kids have school or you have to get, you know.

your daughter to cheer or whatever it is. So I want people to feel like they have the freedom to do that while also staying in those perimeters.

Speaker 4 (22:51)
I agree. I tell people all the time, like, this is your plan, make it work for you. Try to keep your hard days separate from your recovery days as best you can. Sometimes you're going to end up having like a Wednesday Hill workout that beats you out pretty good. And the only day you can do your long run is the next day. Well, that day just became a very easy long run and there's nothing wrong with that. It's not ideal to do it all the time, but it's not going to the thing that really like kind of, I don't know why mentally I don't love this. I'm a Monday start person and I don't know. There's still people that are Sunday start.

The Monday start thing for me. And then I have people that will like, I didn't do my long run today. I'm going to do it tomorrow, like Sunday into Monday. And I'm like, so you're going to have so many miles in my brain does not love it. like, it's not like this magic clock that just like resets each week and everything you did the week before your body, like it's totally good to go because it's Monday. But my brain is like, you have now you've just taken this like 30 mile week and now it's, you know, 50.

Speaker 1 (23:48)
Yeah.

Speaker 4 (23:50)
So I always try to say that's my like one like request, try not to, to carry over miles into the next week. If you didn't get them, you didn't get them. It's not the end of the world. Yeah. I love the flexibility that you guys give because it does really coach a lot of moms. It means a lot to the runner to have like a little bit of freedom. Cause yeah, we, we trust you guys, but you are trusting us that we're going to get the work in when we can.

We're all adults, Erica. Exactly.

Speaker 2 (24:18)
By

the way, for my Monday long run, I'll be carving up all day Sunday with beer. So we're going to see how that goes.

Speaker 1 (24:24)
Things you shouldn't tell your coach.

Speaker 4 (24:27)
Maybe it's athletic brewing though, who knows.

Speaker 2 (24:29)
No, it's not. ⁓

Speaker 1 (24:31)
He said beer specifically, but she did try.

Speaker 2 (24:35)
That's right. Right.

Speaker 4 (24:36)
Yeah, weren't

we supposed to do like a beer mile? Well, hey, we'll see. I a beer mile once. Absolutely.

Speaker 2 (24:39)
that.

Speaker 1 (24:42)
You won one?

Pretty impressive.

Speaker 4 (24:46)
You guys, ⁓

Speaker 1 (24:48)
I will

never do one, I will die.

Speaker 2 (24:51)
I have

that in my intro. Champion beer.

Speaker 4 (24:53)
I like to

throw wild cards and there it is. just threw it right out. I was barefoot in a skirt. It college Karen. She did weird things. It was different time in my life. Amazing.

Speaker 1 (24:56)
It's like an Uno wild card, man.

Speaker 2 (25:00)
How did that happen?

All right, so we're about one month ago. By the way, I am running New York City Marathon. I don't know if we covered that. I got under 50 days. And you have maybe 12 days. We're pretty close. So now let's talk about what to expect with a month to go before your race.

Taper time crazies. When are your long runs going to end? What's your mileage going to look like? Where would we be at right now? I'm running 17 miles. So is that my longest run, or do I have more?

Speaker 4 (25:41)
She

just stared you down. No.

Speaker 1 (25:43)
You have more.

You didn't look, but I have it ready. It's just not published. Publish. I'm going to do it tonight. can't wait. It's going to feel so good.

Speaker 2 (25:47)
She just has to hit.

Speaker 4 (25:49)
You're gonna go home.

Speaker 2 (25:55)
Can't

wait to see that 2-0. ⁓

Speaker 4 (25:57)
You ⁓

Speaker 1 (25:57)
No, I think like four weeks out I usually you'll do your 20 mile long run and then it depends on where you're at if it's a novice runner That's usually the length some runners like to do 21 22. I personally have never done that in a marathon training cycle I personally love the taper and then KJ and I both talked about that like you don't find a lot of marathon runners that love the taper they tend to get crazy and they think that their bodies are shutting down and this hurts and they have like phantom pains and they think that

you know, they're going to get sick or they're doing all of these types of things and watching the weather and I just, I'm just like.

Speaker 4 (26:31)
could be like me and have like never tapered before. The first time I tapered was with her because she told me to, I listened. I like the taper. Um, I agree. And those things will apply. Like I definitely like have panic moments where, know, if you go out for like your last long run of like 10 miles and I'm like, if I can't get through 10 miles without feeling like, I'm just going to say a shit. Um,

Speaker 1 (26:35)
On a hundred miles.

AJ's listening to my-

Speaker 4 (26:58)
How am I supposed to run 26 in a week and a half? Right. Like, so I do get the mental thing, but I do like the extra rest. ⁓ but I think that's just, ⁓ growth as a runner too, where you don't look at rest days or anything like that as like a negative anymore. Like you, those are really, really, those are huge parts of your training. Like recovery days are golden. Yeah. look forward to running, but I love running too.

Speaker 1 (27:23)
rest is. They're

so good.

Speaker 2 (27:25)
It's

actually rest.

Speaker 4 (27:27)
Hey, that's that's a problem. Life choices. Life choices are.

Speaker 2 (27:31)
You know what I'm looking forward to is I will be by myself No kids. no. Well, my parents will be there and I'll be staying I'm running Who lives in New York City so I got the place to stay but it's when I ran the Manchester Marathon last year I thought this was a perfect race to run because I live five minutes from here. I love you know, I love hills. Yeah

Speaker 1 (27:32)
to you.

Speaker 4 (27:40)
You're gonna run with your sister?

He's an anomaly.

Speaker 2 (27:56)
So we're

fixed because I live five minutes from here. Wrong. drove over 30 minutes to bring the kids to my mom's so they could get babysat. Now the race was at 8 AM. So I woke up at 5 30 to do this. And then I get here. I try to like get all my stuff together and I was so, when did I show up?

Speaker 4 (28:13)
Two wheels. It was like maybe 15 minutes before the race started. Eight minutes, five minutes. didn't...

Speaker 2 (28:17)
No, right when they started the national anthem.

Speaker 1 (28:22)
Is

that when you were in the Porter Pondy when they were doing the national anthem?

Speaker 4 (28:31)
Honey, don't be like Eric.

Speaker 2 (28:34)
thought it was great, but this one's gonna be better because I don't have to go through all that. don't have to worry about bringing...

Speaker 1 (28:40)
New York City is a lot of people, man. I ran that years ago.

Speaker 2 (28:43)
I

don't have to worry about anyone else but myself.

Speaker 4 (28:45)
You

get the true marathon experience. I actually have an unrelated question for Nicole. Have you ever fired an athlete before? I'm just like, you know,

Speaker 1 (28:56)
live podcast is asking.

Speaker 4 (29:00)
Have you ever had to break up with a client?

Speaker 2 (29:02)
guys.

Speaker 1 (29:03)
You can't say that in front of my fiance. ⁓

Speaker 4 (29:06)
That's valid.

Speaker 2 (29:09)
Well there's two people here you can flip a coin. Let's talk about a little bit about like race simulation. At what point are you asking your athlete to test fuels, to test their kit? Do you have the shoes you want to wear? Do know what you're gonna wear everything head to toe including underwear? Because that's actually important.

Speaker 4 (29:11)
Hahaha

Speaker 1 (29:27)
I

start that immediate, like right when they go into double digits and I leave those notes like eat exactly what you plan to eat the morning of the race because you don't want any surprises. you're so used to eating scrambled eggs and a plain bagel on race morning, you're like, I'm going to try this breakfast burrito and now you are not, you're going to have a code brown and you're not going to make it to the finish line. yeah, that I just, I can't.

Speaker 4 (29:55)
You have a trail stomach though. You've got older stomach. dish pizza for breakfast in the morning in Chicago? That's probably me.

Speaker 2 (30:01)
I would too. I do best on pizza and beer the night before.

Speaker 1 (30:05)
We know what

You know it works for you. So it's like if it works for you, then keep doing that. But no surprises. I've had athletes get new shoes the morning of and they're like, my feet hurt. I've also done this. If that works for you though.

Speaker 4 (30:18)
Okay.

Have I ever. ⁓ I think too, if you're in a place like you are in this area. So if you're coaching people from Manchester, ⁓ in Keene, we've got Clarence Damar, which I just love. ⁓ we have the ability to coach people to go out and actually run parts of the core, the course. And I think that that's huge, like an invaluable thing to do.

Speaker 1 (30:23)
Have you ever broken up with an athlete?

Speaker 4 (30:46)
some people don't want to know, right? You want to, I don't want to know that there's a massive Hill at mile like 20, right? There isn't just Clarence tomorrow. Yay. ⁓ but I think it's invaluable to go out and say like, okay, I know that this is going to be a really quiet spectator stretch. So I really got to tap into either my music, the other people around me, ⁓ whatever's going to get me through those moments. ⁓ so I think it's nice. And I add that as.

Speaker 1 (30:52)
is blue.

Speaker 4 (31:11)
a note for a lot of the people training, whether it's the half or the full in the area, ⁓ go out, tackle the hills around the golf course, you know, at the very least, hit the last, like, mile and get that, like, excitement for race day. This is where you're gonna be, like, you know, on display for everybody in town, so.

Speaker 2 (31:28)
Yeah. Let's talk one more thing about tapers. What's the typical taper length? When I did my Iron Man, it was 10 days. Is Marathon about the same or is it a little shorter? Is it just a week or? Two weeks. Two weeks.

Speaker 4 (31:39)
Yeah.

Two weeks usually. and it really depends on, it really depends on the athlete themselves. So I would always start to bring things down, but the thing is, if you have a Sunday marathon, that's 26.2 miles, you're not losing miles that week. You're actually probably going to go up in miles. So bringing, you know, the weeks before it down, down, down, and then spiking that week isn't really smart either. So the taper isn't so much to me anyway, for how I coach, it's not so much losing a lot of,

Uh, volume, it's just bringing the intensity down. So you'll still have some workouts because we don't want your legs to go flat. Still want turnover. Um, and still want to learn like in continue to run on tired legs. Um, but yeah, it's more like just let's bring the intensity down a bit. So that's not burnout. Do you ever have to adjust the taper based on what course somebody is running or do you just, you just back down the intensity? So it would be two weeks, whether I'm running Chicago, he's running New York. They're significantly different courses.

Speaker 1 (32:38)
I mean, think for it wouldn't be different for me. think based on what KJ is saying, the intensity of it, mean, Eric's is extremely hilly. New York City is very hard, where Chicago is very flat. So you've got a lot of differences. I would still have him do those hills. I would still have him do like a good solid hill workout. then it would just, there would be just so much more easy running. It wouldn't be like throwing in a long run workout.

Speaker 4 (33:02)
And basically at that point, Eric's like inoculated to the hills a little bit, right? You're just going to be tired, but your body is like your body is built now to go up the hills. So doing them a week before the marathon, is it going to? It's yeah.

Speaker 1 (33:13)
It's not going to

derail the race day.

Speaker 2 (33:16)
I don't think you ever told, you'd never really like that I do this, but what is my typical easy run?

Speaker 1 (33:22)
A McIntyre. Does anybody know what McIntyre is in the area? a ski, it's a ski hill.

Speaker 2 (33:28)
like

to run out of my house, it's two miles to the top of McIntyre

Speaker 1 (33:32)
You record yourself

running and you're like, I'm just up here running.

Speaker 2 (33:36)
You're tagging

me back and you're like...

Speaker 4 (33:39)
Did it again.

Speaker 1 (33:40)
I was gonna get into your airport shenanigans,

Speaker 2 (33:43)
that would give you anxiety.

Let's talk race day. Let's talk 12 hours for the race. It's the night before the race and then we're going into race day morning. What do you do? What do you tell your athlete? Do you practice for this? Do you try to get them to a run early?

Speaker 4 (33:57)
calm the nerves.

Speaker 1 (33:58)
I just

got nervous and he's like, it's race day. I'm like,

Speaker 4 (34:01)
There's no calming the nerves before any goal race. If that's a 5k or a marathon, you know that you're going to inflict pain on yourself. So it's going to hurt and there's no way to like calm your nerves about it. you just have to focus on what you can control and not what you can't. So you control, like we said, we've already know that we practice on what we're going to fuel with, what we were going to eat that morning, what we're wearing. The only thing you have to do is get to the start line. And I

I hope that if you're the night before a marathon, you've already worked out those plans. ⁓ the rest of it is just wake up, get to the start line. As soon as the gun goes off, it's another run. It's just full with a lot of people. And I mean, that's the nature of what we decided to do when we decided to be people that go out and do races and don't just run. Anything happens on race day, you might train for four or five months for a race that can go to hell in like the first mile. So you just have to, you just have to run. It's just running.

Speaker 1 (34:40)
with a lot of people.

Speaker 4 (34:59)
you

Speaker 1 (34:59)
I think it's just, I usually try to tell my athletes like find mantras or something in your brain that's going to help.

Speaker 2 (35:05)
of my wrist

hats.

Speaker 4 (35:06)
Forward is a pace.

Speaker 1 (35:08)
that will help them get through it. ⁓ And I usually have them think of those things along their training. Because I do think there's that big mental component of it's not just your body, it's your mind. You can get to mile 22, and that's my threshold of I want to die and crawl into a corner. But my brain is going to get me to the end. So I really try to incorporate that into my.

Speaker 2 (35:30)
Do you try to write a plan for them? And unlike myself, do most of your athletes follow the plan?

Speaker 1 (35:36)
No,

Ron doesn't follow the plan at all. ⁓

Speaker 2 (35:39)
Now,

talk about a plan you would write. Let's just say your athlete wants to run a nine minute pace. Do you have them try to run the nine minute pace for all 26.2? Do you say go out quick, go out slow? How do you write a plan for a runner like that?

Speaker 4 (35:55)
I actually think that's like a really good question. And again, I think it comes down to the athlete. I have got a really good friend that I'm coaching right now for a marathon next weekend. And she is the exception, I feel, for the most people that I've coached. If I said run it at 740 pace and stay there, and she would just dial in and go. Some people can just really find that pace and they can hold it.

⁓ for a marathon, think it's a little harder. Like you're not showing up to, I hope you're not showing up to like a 5k that you care. Like you're very passionate about how the outcome is or a half and just jumping at the line and going like most of us will go and do like a mile or two warmup, right? Or at least some kind of dynamic warmup. ⁓ Marathon shouldn't be any different just because you're not putting the miles in one, two, and then stopping and going to run the race. Like the first couple of miles serve as your warmup. So if your goal pace is nine.

My suggestion isn't start at nine. and it really is like the course dependent to like Clarence tomorrow, the first 10 miles it's coasting. Like it's, it's not like super downhill, but it's just downhill enough that you can just like ride it out. And that's great until you have to go to work again. And now your quads are shot. You've actually burned through so much of your like, ⁓ glycogen like the thing. ⁓

And it's just, it's not a free ride anymore. Now you're really gonna have to work. ⁓ again, course dependent, I think on how you approach that.

Speaker 1 (37:25)
I'll do a Google doc for most people. look at the elevation. I look at the weather. I look at the athlete. then I will the same thing. The first two to three miles, it's just that's your warm up. So you don't want to start at that goal pace. You want to start back. So I usually have them do like a minute slower. And then they can work their way up to that goal pace. But also, to KJ's point, you could train for ⁓ sub four marathon and get to mile two and be like,

I, this isn't my day. So you, and then it's also working with that athlete on adjusting if that happens.

Speaker 4 (37:59)
It's also really hard. I'm like anybody that's run a race. It's hard to say, I'm going to, I'm going to dial in. want this to go this way. So I'm going to start at nine minute pace. And then you get around the atmosphere in the energy and the adrenaline. And all of sudden you're running eight thirties, but you're like, I'm fine. You're like, okay, we didn't actually train here. ⁓ I've done. ⁓

Speaker 2 (38:22)
I've heard or read or heard on a podcast when I was listening to another coach prepping for this actually was that you sometimes you feel so great because you've just did that taper and you feel like I'm super strong but there was this importance to rein that in in the beginning

And have energy and speed and strength at the end versus going out way too fast and struggling. Is there anything you tell them like to say science look for or things to like watch out for in the race?

Speaker 4 (38:53)
Nothing in particular. I mean, you just have to listen to your own body, but everybody's body will respond differently. And the one thing that I will say is that, especially if you are somebody that runs a lot of races, doesn't hurt to take it. It sucks. Like we just said, you could train, train, train for months and give up all this time and energy and maybe put yourself first, which is really hard for a lot of us to for one race. But if you're willing to go out and

Run hard and you're willing to die, right? And go out and die. And maybe you do, maybe end up walking it in, maybe you DNF. We don't know what we can do until we do it. So, you know, you can train here and say, well, I've trained at nine minute pace this whole time. Maybe you are capable of running eight 25 and you don't know it. So prepare to die and maybe you won't like prepare to go for it. It's going to suck if you have to walk it in, but I mean, it's just running. Then there's another marathon, right? yeah. Yeah.

Speaker 1 (39:44)
gonna suck if you don't try.

Speaker 2 (39:46)
Alright, so you just ran your marathon or your athlete just ran their marathon. They just crushed it. They crushed all their goals. What's next? What do you do with your athlete after they accomplish their race?

Speaker 1 (39:56)
I usually like talk to them about like, do you want to continue? I have a lot of I've had athletes just drop off and not even say anything to me, which don't do that if you get it

Speaker 4 (40:06)
It's so ghosted. I don't like that.

Speaker 1 (40:09)
⁓ And I usually just, a lot of them will continue, but NKJ and I talked about this last week is, you know, a lot of us, once you run a marathon and you want to keep going with your run goals, even if it's not a marathon, it could be a half marathon, could be PR, PRing a 5K, which 5Ks are incredibly difficult, so it's a completely different dynamic of a training. ⁓ And so you want to keep working with your coach. You don't want to just be like, well, I'm done my marathon and I'll pick it back up next spring when I'm ready.

there's a lot of work to be done in between those, that time of, I'm done my fall marathon and I don't need you until next fall. So in between that, I'm just gonna, I'm just gonna just stop doing any work with you and I'm just gonna run a few miles here and there. And then I'm gonna pick it back up and in that timeframe, that athlete has lost a lot of base, they've lost a lot of their speed work, their legs don't turn over the way that they used to and you're rebuilding that.

that base again and rebuilding that formation. And now they're wondering why they're not as fast and why they're not now reaching that new PR they want to set. And so I try to have those conversations with them, not trying to like sell myself or be like, I'm the greatest coach and you need to still give me money. Like it's more. Thank you. We are the greatest coaches. Let's do that.

Speaker 2 (41:18)
his coach, by the way.

Speaker 4 (41:19)
I'm just kidding.

I, to Nicole's point, ⁓ I do see that often too, where, especially in a, in a race town, ⁓ everybody wants to start in April for a race in September and they, but they have a different goal and their goal gets faster every year, but we're starting at the same point every year because they didn't run all winter. whether or not you work with a coach consistently, it's just like, if you have big race goals, you're doing yourself a disservice by not.

Maintaining a certain level of fitness. does not have to be the fitness that you're going into, actual race training. But I also think that working with a coach and doing like a one-off that's great. If you got what you needed out of it, amazing. but I don't, I mean, I will speak for myself and I believe for Nicole, I tried to do a really personalized plan, nothing cookie cutter. You may be running the same race, but you are different athletes and you have different life demands, body demands.

The best way for me to coach somebody is to continue working with them so that I learn more about how to coach them, not how to coach, how to coach this individual person. I'll pick on Jess again because she has been the first person that I've coached from day one. She's been, and because we've worked together for so long, I just know how to coach Jess, like Jess, the person, just the runner, Jess's life, Jess is what Jess likes, what Jess doesn't. Cause what Jess doesn't like to do, that's what Jess needs to do. ⁓

Speaker 1 (42:46)
Sorry,

Jess.

Speaker 4 (42:47)
Sometimes we that push to do things we don't want to Yes, you have to look at it. you have a coach and it's an expense, that's something you have to take into consideration. No, but like it's just you get this like, what am I looking for? ⁓ You just get to a place where you know each other very well. So the coaching is even that much better for you. If that makes sense.

Speaker 1 (43:08)
you build that relationship over time, then that athlete doesn't feel like, I need to not do this or they feel more comfortable reaching out and saying if they're struggling or if they need need something, I think that that makes real sense.

Speaker 2 (43:20)
Well, this is great. think we just did a whole rundown about a marathon cycle, pretty much. And we want to open the floor for some questions here. We also have some questions. We did an Instagram thing where some people sent some questions. I saved one. You have one on your sheet. But we'd like to open the floor first for anyone here who has a question for Nicole or KJ or even Erica or myself about running or Erica.

Speaker 4 (43:42)
Mostly Nicole and

KJ.

Speaker 2 (43:44)
Erica's hundred milers and her craziness, but are there any questions that anyone wants to ask from the floor? And don't worry about coming up from the microphone. I'm not going to make you.

Speaker 4 (43:54)
Do a song and dance in front of the camera.

Speaker 2 (43:56)
We'll have, next time we do this we'll have a wireless mic and we'll have Mo walking around and handing it out and getting the news from the back of the crowd. Anyone have a question for these girls right here?

Speaker 1 (44:07)
⁓ I love it. It's a great question. You're like, come on up girl, we're good company. We love this.

Speaker 4 (44:13)
You should see my house.

Speaker 2 (44:15)
So

the question was, what are your thoughts on a shoe rotation?

Speaker 1 (44:15)
Yeah.

Like

you need to have your I have like so many shoes though like when I just went and ran reached the beach and like Daniel's like I got my one pair and I was like I got like three pairs of shoes like I have my my regular running like trainers and then I have my speed shoes and then I have like two pairs of speed shoes because I think that that's the speed shoes are typically what I race in so you want to make sure that they work for your feet all different types of shoes are different for different types of feet so I definitely agree with rotating through your shoes

Speaker 4 (44:47)
same for all the same reasons, but also because I love shoes and I think that they just look good with everything. So you should support every brand.

Speaker 2 (44:56)
How early should you break open your Erased A shoes?

Speaker 4 (44:59)
I always try to get my athletes at least one long run, but a couple, ⁓ you know, going out for a three mile run, most shoes feel pretty good. ⁓ especially if they're brand new, they feel like little fluffy clouds on your feet. These are very nice. These are very nice guys. Yeah. yeah, definitely. And ideally a workout too, whether that's like on the track or yeah, just to, just to get some motion in the.

Speaker 1 (45:13)
I'm

These are great.

And then you retire them at like 200, 250 miles or after like six months, whichever comes first.

Speaker 2 (45:33)
Shameless plug here, if you have a brand new pair of shoes and you're about blisters, you should get yourself what Erica?

Speaker 4 (45:40)
a nice pair of right socks.

Speaker 2 (45:43)
Any

other questions? had one back there. I thought I saw another hand. Did we have one up front?

Speaker 1 (45:50)
Love that.

Speaker 2 (45:56)
What distance? Any distance. So we have someone here who only runs three days a week. They do a lot of strength training. They throw weights around. They also hit golf balls pretty hard and far.

Speaker 4 (46:06)
So I've seen

online. Yes.

Speaker 1 (46:08)
That's

your total mileage you've done in a week.

Did you do any like workouts or anything? Okay.

Yeah, I think it's definitely possible. don't think you need like, some people love to run five, seven days a week. I think it's perfectly fine to do that and even PR a race. Because I think it just depends on what you're actually doing, but it sounds like you're very structured in what you're doing and consistency builds that. So if you increase kind of your workouts, I think you would definitely be able to PR that.

Speaker 4 (46:49)
Yeah. And I think you being as active as you are in general, but because I do stock you on Instagram, but, with the strength training too, you're doing yourself, you're doing yourself a justice with that. yeah.

Speaker 2 (47:05)
Jess, you had a question?

Yeah, so are there any coaches, any people in your life that you lean on or that you came to for advice or maybe that you took advice from? Maybe you don't know them, know, Celine is what I'm thinking. Like maybe you heard them on another podcast and you're like, yeah, that's right.

Speaker 4 (47:21)
⁓ no, I think that's a great question. ⁓ I have had a lot of coaches with different sports. ⁓ so I don't. I will say, and I don't mean this to sound negative or spin it. I've actually, think I've learned more about things that I wouldn't do than I would, if that makes sense. ⁓ nobody's reinventing the wheel when it comes to coaching, ⁓ runners, you know, we there's basics, there's, know, you can come up with some fun ways to do different fire leaks and intervals and stuff like that. But at this core.

We're all kind of training the same way, really. ⁓ but yeah, I've definitely, I've definitely have some coaches. My, my college coach, ⁓ definitely left like an impression on me on how to structure my running. Right. That makes sense. And I've had some coaches post and I have a great coach now. everybody always like, you have a coach, you don't coach yourself. I'm like, psychologists, you,

Speaker 1 (48:14)
That's what I say. have to go to doctors. don't want to write this up. I'm writing it up for everybody.

Speaker 4 (48:16)
Somebody else wants to write this up for me.

That's a good question. Yeah, I definitely think that there's like, and I definitely spend a lot of time on social media, ⁓ looking at other coaches pages for inspiration and yeah.

Speaker 1 (48:29)
Yeah, definitely. remember my, my high school field hockey coach comes to mind. I didn't play until my senior year, but she wished I had played for so many times and she just built me up so much. And even though she would just tell me, get that left arm out, let's go come on. And like, she just pushed me in such a positive way that wasn't like coddling me. And that's the kind of coach that I strive to be is like, I understand things happen and my fiance can tell you that I tell him all the time, like no excuses. Like there's

We have three kids, like we can, you know, I can figure it out. So can you, you just have to get up really early or you have to do, you know, make, make the time. ⁓ but I remember her being that way. Like there's no excuses. You can get better. You can do this. It's you who puts the work in.

Speaker 2 (49:10)
Awesome, any more questions before? We got a couple more minutes before we have to wrap up. I know you do. Let's see if we have anyone from the crowd. We have one. Okay, I see two. So we'll go with the blue shirt in the back first.

Speaker 1 (49:31)
We've been running for 20 years, we don't want to do it either, so that's normal.

It's really hard because once you're out of it, it's so much easier to not, you know, to just to be like, okay. And like, you know, I can attest to like after having a baby, you get that way. You know, thank God my best friend Robin's there. Like we used to do that all the time. And like, so I think finding somebody that if you have any other friends that also, yay, love that for you guys. You guys help each other, right? Like sometimes you can say self motivation all day long and it's just not always there.

So if you can text your friend and be like, I need to walk today and she's right there to help you, great. Or you need her to pull you out of it and be like, hey bitch, get up. you know, like, you know, like it's something like that. Cause I can say that my friend Robin would be like, bitch, get off your ass. Like, let's go. So it's just finding those, your people and who are going to push you to be a better you.

Speaker 4 (50:33)
Are you racing? Do you have a race that you're doing? you running and you're kind of like enjoying it?

Speaker 1 (50:44)
also love.

Speaker 4 (50:45)
that.

Love this. Okay. I was going to say it also helps and it doesn't have to be a race, but find something, right? Pick something. Maybe you guys have a group run you're looking forward to, but like, I agree with Nicole. Like I would probably never turned into the runner that I am if I didn't have like my community. ⁓ I do love a solo run and I think there's a great time and place for it. ⁓ but having people to run with, whether it's one person or a group, it makes all the difference for me. So it's just accountability and I'll say other flip side, not to.

in no way, plugging myself or Nicole as a coach, ⁓ having a coach is another thing. somebody put something on paper and that's what they've taken the time, energy and effort to do for me. I'm going to do it.

Speaker 1 (51:27)
And then get to check a box and I love that. Yeah, I don't want to see the X. I want to see the check mark.

Speaker 4 (51:30)
Checking boxes. Runners are a certain type.

I can totally attest

to that too. It's so satisfying. It is so satisfying.

Speaker 2 (51:38)
Something we talked about in our pre-show meetings we had was the distance between a competitive runner who's running for time versus someone like yourself back there who's new into it and they just want to get a new distance. How do you approach someone like that who's just a distance goal runner versus someone with a competitive time?

Speaker 4 (51:57)
You're such a clean slate. You haven't been burned by the sport.

Speaker 1 (52:01)
We love that. You're so fresh and new. Yeah. Yeah. Sorry. I didn't, I don't give a lot of speed workouts in the very beginning. It's building that base and just really depends on how novice they are. Do they need to run walk? So I try not to scare them too much with the, with the workouts and really just go on the easy runs. It's really just building the mileage. The mileage is really, once they start to increase, it scares people a lot. So you can go from that like two miles to now you're like, I have seven.

Speaker 4 (52:03)
I

Speaker 1 (52:29)
like on a Tuesday, like, nope, don't love that. So it's really just that building that base with the long longer miles and also your mentality. So that's why you start off really like I start off really, really easy. And I don't, try not to scare people sometimes it happens, but I try, I try not to. Exactly. It has to be fun.

Speaker 4 (52:47)
to make sure you keep the joy in it too. I

have to remember too, you don't have to be a racer to do this, to be a runner. It doesn't make or break anything. Like we have one of my best friends. She runs all the time. She has run some races, only marathon. She's never done anything else. It's wild. Like she just did not pass go. And she just runs.

And it's like a foreign concept to just run, but you're not training for something. It's like, my gosh, she actually just enjoys this. it's.

Speaker 2 (53:19)
We're gonna do one more question over here before we get to that and then we'll do our final two questions here. But before we get to that, I actually want to shout him out because he's here. He drove all the way from Rhode Island. have Moe. Maurice, the running Panda. But Moe has his own. He's also a marathon sports ambassador. He has his own event. So this is Steve's event in the back, Steve. This is his that we're doing. He has his coming up October 19th. That's a Sunday morning and it is a Panda 5K.

Speaker 4 (53:46)
⁓

Speaker 2 (53:48)
Panda

Posse 5k. So Mo, what was your question?

Speaker 4 (54:28)
Yeah. that's actually a really great question. ⁓ I think there's a place for all different types of coaches for people that don't necessarily, there's a lot of people that don't do big human interaction, right? Or like they're not looking to have a best friend. They're just want, they want to be told what to do. That's all they need from you. There's nothing wrong with that. And I think plans like that are great. ⁓ I have a, in my intake form, I have a question that's, you know, what type of relationship are you looking for? Kind of question.

You know, is there something that you're going to need from me? I need to know, do you need coddling? Do you want me to like tell you you're pretty or, know, do you want to be left alone and this is business only? Like there's no wrong answer there, but I also have to decide at the end of the day, is this somebody that I want to take on? Because if that's not my coaching style, how much am I willing to budge on that? know? ⁓ so that's a really good question. I do think that there's, I don't think there's anything wrong with getting a printout, Hal Higdon plan by any means, but.

If you are looking to progress past that, think you would be doing yourself a huge disservice by not reaching out and actually having a relationship with a coach.

Speaker 1 (55:33)
I agree with basically everything that she's saying. don't ask that question on my intake form because if you're looking for someone to tell you pretty, go see KJ. Don't go see me. ⁓ I am definitely a big cheerleader for my athletes. I don't ever want to get out of that. You can only text me once a week. I think that would be very difficult to manage if I'm like, yeah, like I'm.

coaching my fiance and he gets free rein because he lives in the same house. you know, like Jess is now coming with me and now she can only text me once a week. Like I just don't think that that's very fair. Sorry. I took her. I just don't think that that's a very fair kind of way to do things. But like I said, I think if you're looking for that type of coach, that's like, I don't even want to be in the same state as you. ⁓ You know, there's those big running companies that have that. So I'm not looking to do anything like that, but

Speaker 4 (56:05)
But.

Speaker 1 (56:23)
Hats off to anybody who, as a coach or an athlete who want that.

Speaker 2 (56:28)
Yeah. Erica, I think you have a question that you got online or texted to you.

Speaker 4 (56:31)
I sure do.

Yes, it was texted to us, but it comes from our good friend Patrick from Mentor, Ohio. Intervals or sprints come with recoveries between segments. Can those recoveries be walking or running at a slower pace or both and why? that is a great question. ⁓

Speaker 1 (56:48)
⁓ That's a great question. They think yes.

Thank you Patrick They it can be both I have you know athletes where if you're if you're really like working hard and you jog and then you're like on that last lap and you're Struggling walk. It's not going to as runners. We tend to think if we are walking I used to have this mentality very early on in running that if I was walking down the street and car saw me I was like ashamed because it's just like now I'm walking and I'm not a good runner and it's

You are recovering through a very difficult workout. So if you're not jogging that out, that's perfectly fine. I walk during my workouts, like during the rest segments, and there's still, there's no shame in doing that. So I think we are very hard on ourselves during those times where we struggle to recover between those segments of the workout.

Speaker 4 (57:39)
Yeah, I will agree with that. ⁓ I, it's not something that every athlete either needs or gets. It really depends on what their goals are, where their fitness level is. ⁓ but I'm picturing like a hot August track workout. ⁓ and maybe we just know this is a really uncomfortable day. And even at six in the morning, if you're out on the track, ⁓ maybe you're ripping 800 meter repeats. So let's do a standing rest or let's do a walking rest.

Just to get the heart rate back down, give yourself a minute to grab water. ⁓ I don't think it makes or breaks anything. If your entire training plan is full of walk, rests or breaks that we're training ourselves to take those rests a little too often, but I never ever beat anybody up or myself when I'm like, even on a long run, if I'm like, damn it, I need a minute, take a minute. Like, you know what I mean? Yeah. Don't that way all the time and you're going to be good. That's a really good question.

Speaker 2 (58:32)
Sorry, what? Oh, it's fine. We're figuring everything out as we go. We're going to have a fancy camera one day. That's a basic one I bought for Disney World years ago. This is fun seeing everything evolve and grow and you two have been a big part of it. So the final question is, why do you coach? Oh, okay. You're going to go with that? I haven't asked that question yet.

Speaker 1 (58:33)
the red light.

Speaker 4 (58:35)
We gave up on the camera.

I'm not sure.

Speaker 1 (58:56)
He

did like stare at you like-

Speaker 2 (58:59)
I got a question for Erica earlier someone asked me and I said maybe I'll ask it I don't know we'll decide you want to know the question ⁓ People want to know if you really have an only feet page

Speaker 4 (59:05)
Sure.

coming soon this is also just me finding out that it's something called only Phoenix Oh I thought it was like a subject so many questions

Speaker 2 (59:25)
No, the real last question, why do you coach?

Speaker 4 (59:29)
Gosh,

I actually think about that a lot because it does come up a lot. I just I don't know if I have a good answer to that. I don't I just can't imagine not coaching. I think the answer that I have always given is that at some point it's just going to hit a little close to home, but at some point I'm not going to be able to run or run the way that I am used to. And I want to make sure that I'm always a part of this sport one way or the other, because it's just everything to me. So.

I'm going to pass that off to Nicole now. Emotions.

Speaker 1 (1:00:06)
I think for me, my love of running started in high school. We lived on a hill and I would walk and then I would jog and it really just helped me mentally. And running was always there for me when I needed it the most to take me out of some dark places in life. And just even when I was happy ⁓ and I want someone to experience that with running. that coaching just...

is just a part of who I am. also with KJ, I'm not always gonna be able to run the way that I want to ⁓ or ever again someday, which is sad, but I wanna share that joy and also that mental health component of it ⁓ is a big piece of running to me. And I want to be there for somebody who is either struggling or needs help ⁓ and have them work it out that way in a healthy environment.

Speaker 4 (1:00:54)
Nicole, that's a good answer.

Speaker 1 (1:00:58)
All in your feels tonight, girlfriend.

Speaker 4 (1:01:00)
getting a drink after this.

Speaker 2 (1:01:02)
Mental health is something that's really important to you. You talk about it quite a bit, probably just as much as you talk about running, you talk about mental health. Yeah. Be on the lookout this fall. She just finished recording her first season of her new podcast called Run Your Mind. Took us a little bit to get there, but we're gonna do seasons and season one is done and it will be out in about, see it soon, probably sometime after New York because I got some long runs.

Speaker 1 (1:01:10)
Definitely.

I gotta go home and hit publish.

Speaker 2 (1:01:30)
This was amazing. Everyone before we before you actually leave, I want to get a huge group photo of everybody here. I want you to be a part of this and we're going to blow it up poster size and put it behind Erica and her. Fairfetium studio. No, this was great. This is a lot of fun. I hope everyone enjoyed this. If you're listening to the podcast now on Tuesday, we will be back on Thursday with another amazing guest, someone that Erica loves so much. And if you like Yuki.

Speaker 4 (1:01:41)
You'll see it in my...

Speaker 2 (1:01:56)
Cause a lot of you here probably know Yuki. Your love this person too. They dress up just as much and just as awesome as Yuki does. So this was amazing. think Erica, you need to wrap this up. You need to take us home.

Speaker 4 (1:02:08)
Thank you so so much for coming. You know, we love you. Well,

Speaker 2 (1:02:13)
Thank you Marathon

Sports, thank you Steve, thank you Mike, thank you Sock.

Speaker 4 (1:02:17)
Thank you

for coming. Thank you for listening. You know, we love you. And don't forget to stretch. ⁓

Speaker 1 (1:02:18)
Thank you, pizza.

Speaker 2 (1:02:19)
Thank

you everyone for coming.

Speaker 1 (1:02:23)
Thanks, Paige.

Speaker 2 (1:02:31)
Fear the code brown.

Speaker 1 (1:02:36)
We didn't talk

I just watched you the whole time. You did awesome.

Speaker 4 (1:02:50)
in this care.

I'm so much.