Today we have a guest, David Gadd from Vertical Plus and we discuss a very disruptive approach to eCommerce. Take what you know about managing your ecommerce and throw it out of the window. David and his team have a wholly different approach for businesses looking to scale their ecommerce sales.
Find out more about Vertical Plus here
And more about Disruption Works here
Our latest series of podcasts, concentrates on voice and how that is going to impact the next few years with tips along the way. Find out more about voicebots here and if you have any subjects that you would like us to discuss then email info@disruptionworks.co.uk with the subject Podcast and we will see what we can do ;-)
Today we have a guest, David Gadd from Vertical Plus and we discuss a very disruptive approach to eCommerce. Take what you know about managing your ecommerce and throw it out of the window. David and his team have a wholly different approach for businesses looking to scale their ecommerce sales.
Find out more about Vertical Plus here
And more about Disruption Works here
Our latest series of podcasts, concentrates on voice and how that is going to impact the next few years with tips along the way. Find out more about voicebots here and if you have any subjects that you would like us to discuss then email info@disruptionworks.co.uk with the subject Podcast and we will see what we can do ;-)
00:00:03.310 --> 00:00:17.100
Steve Tomkinson
So welcome and and hi for a new edition of disruption works chitchat. And I have a guest with me today. David Gadd from vertical plus. Hi, David. How are you doing?
00:00:17.740 --> 00:00:21.350
David Gadd (Guest)
Always. Yeah. Thanks. Very good. Very good. Thank you. Yeah. Enjoying the summer weather.
00:00:20.350 --> 00:00:20.530
Steve Tomkinson
Yeah.
00:00:21.680 --> 00:00:38.020
Steve Tomkinson
It's nice, isn't it? Yeah, it's it's properly properly. You know, when the sun comes out, it's got some power in it now and it's so it's good. I know. I've got. I've got a little bit sunburnt over the weekend. I have to admit. You know, seriously like, OK, go away.
00:00:22.700 --> 00:00:24.120
David Gadd (Guest)
Looking at it now, yeah.
00:00:31.740 --> 00:00:31.940
David Gadd (Guest)
Yeah.
00:00:37.500 --> 00:00:40.750
David Gadd (Guest)
And you, you have to stay on the podcast. But yeah, it's looking pretty good.
00:00:40.080 --> 00:00:43.950
Steve Tomkinson
No, that's right. Yeah, that's right, Rosie.
00:00:43.010 --> 00:00:43.890
David Gadd (Guest)
As indeed them off.
00:00:45.770 --> 00:00:46.420
Steve Tomkinson
Thanks for that.
00:00:49.080 --> 00:01:05.310
Steve Tomkinson
So thanks. Thanks for joining us today on the on the podcast at the the kind of the reason I invited you on to to to talk about Vertical Plus was you know we're called disruption works and part of our.
00:00:49.110 --> 00:00:49.720
David Gadd (Guest)
But.
00:01:06.940 --> 00:01:22.170
Steve Tomkinson
You know, our interest is in disruptive technologies or how people are disruptive in the way they approach things and you know, I feel that you're the way that you approach your commas is very disruptive and and it's quite different and anything else that I've.
00:01:22.670 --> 00:01:39.620
Steve Tomkinson
And I've come across in the way that you do that? Umm. So really I kind of want to have a quick chat with you about it and kind of see, you know, how how it works really. You know, if if I want to kind of come along and and use your stuff, give us a little rundown of what, of what you do.
00:01:40.190 --> 00:01:49.440
David Gadd (Guest)
Yeah. OK. No, that that's fine. And there's I think we talked before did me that we don't need to be 1 great big vertical plus sales pitch just generally talk models and.
00:01:47.030 --> 00:01:52.380
Steve Tomkinson
No, absolutely. But it it's good to introduce what you do, you know, so people get an idea.
00:01:51.130 --> 00:01:52.000
David Gadd (Guest)
Yeah, yeah.
00:01:52.900 --> 00:02:19.070
David Gadd (Guest)
Yeah, that's right. Yeah. Great. So I'm. Yeah, I'm well, thanks very much for that. And giving me the opportunity to see, I do believe we're disrupted that. There aren't many companies that work like us. You know, we're obviously a, you know, we're alternately a software company, a business growth company and our marketing company, all sort of free at the same time. And depending on who we work with, some some bits of that are more say disruptive than others.
00:02:12.970 --> 00:02:13.250
Steve Tomkinson
Yeah.
00:02:19.390 --> 00:02:19.880
Steve Tomkinson
Yeah.
00:02:20.250 --> 00:02:49.360
David Gadd (Guest)
But it's kind of, you know, we we've always pitched ourselves, you know, I saw it's from my point of view. I wanted to create sort of web solutions that were affordable, but for good ideas. So, you know, if you've got a really great idea and you think something's gonna really in itself be disruptive, but you might be facing web development bills of 20-30, forty, 50,000, then we like to think that we provide people with good ideas and a good business model and a good way forward.
00:02:29.670 --> 00:02:30.160
Steve Tomkinson
Yeah.
00:02:42.800 --> 00:02:43.240
Steve Tomkinson
Yeah.
00:02:49.810 --> 00:02:54.890
David Gadd (Guest)
With, say, our own investment to sort of invest, our developers and marketing people in the idea.
00:02:55.660 --> 00:02:57.720
David Gadd (Guest)
So in that in that way, we're disruptive.
00:02:58.080 --> 00:02:58.460
Steve Tomkinson
Yeah.
00:02:58.880 --> 00:03:05.430
David Gadd (Guest)
Because we are taking quite a big risk on ourselves in terms of the people that we take on.
00:03:03.060 --> 00:03:03.650
Steve Tomkinson
Yeah.
00:03:05.760 --> 00:03:23.570
Steve Tomkinson
So what? So the way I understand it is that you kind of managed the whole ecommerce side of things for a business without them having to invest in up front costs and and stuff like that, providing you can see a partnership in the way that you know you can work with that particular business.
00:03:08.200 --> 00:03:08.500
David Gadd (Guest)
There's.
00:03:24.020 --> 00:03:37.230
David Gadd (Guest)
Yeah, that. That's right. We do. I mean, we, I'd hate to say we don't have enough front cost because we we started off like that and then we had lots of run out on us. So we asked for like a small deposit. So that they've got something to lose and as well as.
00:03:30.160 --> 00:03:30.520
Steve Tomkinson
Yeah.
00:03:36.650 --> 00:03:38.660
Steve Tomkinson
Yeah, yeah.
00:03:38.120 --> 00:03:42.630
David Gadd (Guest)
That's why he got once the deposits over. Then we then have. Yeah, the whole lifetime.
00:03:43.230 --> 00:03:43.450
Steve Tomkinson
Yeah.
00:03:43.270 --> 00:03:47.620
David Gadd (Guest)
With the growing is that we kind of you know we we we broke most of the.
00:03:48.440 --> 00:04:05.680
David Gadd (Guest)
Investment our clients do contribute towards small amounts. So for example, AdWords advertising, Facebook, advertising that kind of stuff, they contribute, you know where the costs of advertising costs are large, but certainly all the all the web development and all the content creation and the marketing is all done in house by.
00:03:54.100 --> 00:03:54.390
Steve Tomkinson
Yeah.
00:04:05.160 --> 00:04:10.630
Steve Tomkinson
Yeah. So that includes things like SEO and swell, I suppose, and and yeah.
00:04:09.370 --> 00:04:11.280
David Gadd (Guest)
Yeah, yeah, that's right. I mean, we take a.
00:04:12.180 --> 00:04:41.350
David Gadd (Guest)
I would say you're controlling angle, but we you know, we take a we take an angle where we try and do as much as possible because then we've got stuff within our realm because we've taken risk. So we try and encourage them to use our content and our content writers or our marketing people and encourage them to use context that we've got that to to do the right kind of marketing, invest in the right kind of areas because we obviously we got the context of lots and lots of clients growing and we can see what works and and what doesn't.
00:04:19.700 --> 00:04:19.990
Steve Tomkinson
Yeah.
00:04:39.050 --> 00:04:39.370
Steve Tomkinson
Yeah.
00:04:42.250 --> 00:04:59.600
David Gadd (Guest)
You know, so as a business as a business model, it's it's an interesting one. You know, I mean we've been running it now for 10 years. We've seen some good growth. You know we have our, we have our successes, we have our failures and we have our people in the middle, you know and it's kind of we have far more successes, failures and.
00:04:50.530 --> 00:04:50.810
Steve Tomkinson
Yeah.
00:04:57.460 --> 00:04:57.750
Steve Tomkinson
Yeah.
00:04:59.730 --> 00:05:00.950
Steve Tomkinson
Well, it's always good to know and.
00:05:02.500 --> 00:05:12.620
David Gadd (Guest)
And that's right. And I think when you run a business like this, because I did, you know, I was in Exeter at the sort of an event up in Exeter where I was asked.
00:05:13.320 --> 00:05:20.880
David Gadd (Guest)
How do you manage something like performance marketing so that the performance marketing company doesn't end up being?
00:05:21.580 --> 00:05:39.050
David Gadd (Guest)
Completely knackered with what it does for people, for almost nothing. So you you have to be really good at your data. You have to really be good at knowing what works and then sort of forcing a situation where you're going for stuff that works. That's got a, you know, a very proven ROI.
00:05:24.030 --> 00:05:24.390
Steve Tomkinson
Yeah.
00:05:25.520 --> 00:05:25.780
Steve Tomkinson
Yeah.
00:05:39.340 --> 00:05:40.410
Steve Tomkinson
Yeah, yeah.
00:05:39.530 --> 00:05:52.780
David Gadd (Guest)
Uh, so you know, I think from our point of view, I like to think that we're kind of quite good at knowing what works, because we put our life on the line. You know, we we don't, we don't, we don't charge someone £500 and if it works, it works. And if it doesn't, it doesn't we.
00:05:47.290 --> 00:05:47.600
Steve Tomkinson
Yeah.
00:05:53.200 --> 00:06:22.380
Steve Tomkinson
But there's an advantage in that in the business that you're working with, uh, you know, and it and it, you know, the whole thing here and everything that I know about you guys is that you're working in a true partnership here. So, you know, from a business perspective, you can then steer because you have the data and you can see what's going on in the market. You can see trends that are coming up. You can steer product developments to to help that business grow a product that's gonna fly rather than.
00:05:53.380 --> 00:05:53.750
David Gadd (Guest)
Approach.
00:06:22.580 --> 00:06:24.880
Steve Tomkinson
Trying to trying to.
00:06:25.740 --> 00:06:36.720
Steve Tomkinson
You know, just paddle something that's just isn't gonna sell. Really, you know, and I think that's that's the thing that I thought was really interesting. Is that that true partnership really helps from the core of the business.
00:06:37.220 --> 00:07:07.430
David Gadd (Guest)
Yeah. Yeah, that's right. Yeah. And, you know, we have to manage people's expectations. Some people have more, far more tastic about their business idea than we are. And sometimes we're more enthusiastic than they are. So it is again, it's, it's, you know, it's a bit like a business relationship, you know, I mean, many years ago when mentioned names or whatever, we we would, you know, we were approached to sell all sorts of preposterous kind of things that that business owners genuinely kind of believed in and they were ultimately unsellable. Almost so, you know.
00:06:42.630 --> 00:06:42.890
Steve Tomkinson
Yeah.
00:07:03.440 --> 00:07:03.790
Steve Tomkinson
Yeah.
00:07:05.920 --> 00:07:06.710
Steve Tomkinson
Yeah, yeah.
00:07:07.600 --> 00:07:33.290
David Gadd (Guest)
But we try and maintain the positive air and listen to people's ideas and try and come back with solutions and proposals. But we do turn down more websites than we take on because we don't wanna take people on and see it fail. We have to see some kind of viable way forward, even for our costing. So in that way we're, you know, we're like to think themselves is quite an ethical business. And the way that we kind of operate.
00:07:18.760 --> 00:07:19.080
Steve Tomkinson
Right.
00:07:33.800 --> 00:07:51.090
David Gadd (Guest)
And people were upset, you know that I think they have big dreams and things didn't work out the way they wanted to. And sometimes they can blame us. You know, we like to think that might be that might be the partial that's to blame. But you have all sorts of things that can go wrong with the business and with products and with pricing and competitors that.
00:07:42.340 --> 00:07:42.640
Steve Tomkinson
Yeah.
00:07:51.140 --> 00:07:51.680
Steve Tomkinson
Yeah, yeah.
00:07:52.470 --> 00:07:54.720
David Gadd (Guest)
Like things? Not really our fault.
00:07:54.110 --> 00:08:22.040
Steve Tomkinson
But I think it's, you know I, you know, in any of those things, if you're in the middle of that stuff and you date you've you've decided to take that Ponce on on Bing, that full performance, marketed business. You know, there's a lot of transparency in that relationship because there has to be, you know, so somebody's getting there as eyes open, if it's not quite working out then this it's quite clear why it isn't. Usually I would have thought you know, so you have to be a grown up and the way that that works really.
00:08:10.460 --> 00:08:10.760
David Gadd (Guest)
Yeah.
00:08:18.220 --> 00:08:18.500
David Gadd (Guest)
Yeah.
00:08:22.440 --> 00:08:22.730
David Gadd (Guest)
Yeah.
00:08:22.550 --> 00:08:48.200
Steve Tomkinson
You know one thing that was because we we did speak a little while ago and one thing that was an interesting conversation, we had a very brief conversation about was some kind of battling the Amazon effect. You know, that's the first point of call now for a lot of search for product is via Amazon rather than on Google and and it's that's got to affect ecommerce now.
00:08:23.510 --> 00:08:23.700
David Gadd (Guest)
Yeah.
00:08:49.840 --> 00:09:02.690
Steve Tomkinson
But they get. They obviously have it right. You know, they own the whole supply chain mechanism and things like that. How do how do businesses now, an ecommerce battle that kind of scenario? What's what's the things, the tips that you could give?
00:09:03.200 --> 00:09:24.590
David Gadd (Guest)
Well, I think you know I like something like Amazon. I mean, they're very good at what they do. And if you've got a great product line, then that's really good to sell it on Amazon because it's the biggest market for ecommerce. So you know you you need to be on Amazon, that the the issue is. And so I don't have to come up with me, but can be a tendency and will not depending on your approach.
00:09:07.270 --> 00:09:07.550
Steve Tomkinson
Yeah.
00:09:16.540 --> 00:09:16.850
Steve Tomkinson
Yeah.
00:09:25.730 --> 00:09:30.130
David Gadd (Guest)
The you know it's a race to the bottom. You know, you like you might operate on very low margins.
00:09:31.370 --> 00:09:31.700
Steve Tomkinson
Yeah.
00:09:31.440 --> 00:10:01.610
David Gadd (Guest)
With other he's also reporting on very low margins, including Amazon, and you'll find yourself in a situation where you need to have a very good relationship with suppliers so that you've perhaps got a better price than Amazon itself or as good a price. But the main thing is it's so price sensitive that once you're the you're the cheapest price you can sell many, many hundreds of the products. Unfortunately, you might only be making a penny a product and asking yourself whether it's worth it. And so to sustain that, we kind of think, you know.
00:09:43.700 --> 00:09:44.060
Steve Tomkinson
Yeah.
00:09:55.960 --> 00:09:56.420
Steve Tomkinson
Yeah.
00:10:01.660 --> 00:10:33.790
David Gadd (Guest)
Get diversity. Yeah, we we come. We've had new clients that are just on Amazon and they do very well and we try and encourage them to go multi channel to also be on other platforms such as eBay and Etsy. But then also we kind of think they're website is there ultimate best end resource because it's it's where really they it's their customers actually when when you sell stuff on Amazon, Amazon see their customers as their customers that are actually using your store. So why didn't you go and just buy this off these people then come back and buy stuff off us.
00:10:03.410 --> 00:10:03.680
Steve Tomkinson
Yeah.
00:10:07.520 --> 00:10:07.780
Steve Tomkinson
Yeah.
00:10:34.110 --> 00:10:55.070
David Gadd (Guest)
Whereas when more people buy stuff off your website, they're buying off you and the relationship with you rather than Amazon, and so not many people actually realize they think they're buying from Amazon and not actually from you, even though you're fulfilling. So your business value that you get from that transaction is is much, much lower than the value you get from a direct website sale.
00:10:34.170 --> 00:10:34.740
Steve Tomkinson
Yeah.
00:10:37.980 --> 00:10:38.250
Steve Tomkinson
Yeah.
00:10:55.490 --> 00:10:56.740
Steve Tomkinson
Yeah, yeah.
00:10:55.620 --> 00:11:24.380
David Gadd (Guest)
Uh, so our advice really is diversifying, but also to put stuff into your own website so that you can build up that as a business and as a ranking and as a operation. Then on Amazon itself, we have taken on clients before, as I said, that's done. They did many, many thousands of pounds a month on eBay, Amazon and you know, the big job with them has been setting up the website, doing some stock integrations and then trying to.
00:11:14.940 --> 00:11:15.240
Steve Tomkinson
Yeah.
00:11:25.030 --> 00:11:29.630
David Gadd (Guest)
Get their website as a as a sort of marketing entity and I think.
00:11:30.770 --> 00:11:41.460
David Gadd (Guest)
You know, because of the margins really, but also the risk that say we've had, Amazon will sometimes stop customers for all sorts of reasons. You know that maybe you get a bad review and suddenly everything's off.
00:11:42.180 --> 00:11:43.600
Steve Tomkinson
I say right now.
00:11:42.390 --> 00:11:51.140
David Gadd (Guest)
So so you can lose. You can lose traction on Amazon and set in the same way as you can lose traction on eBay, where it's on the website. No one stopping, no one stopping you.
00:11:51.160 --> 00:12:20.410
Steve Tomkinson
No, no. You've got that autonomy, haven't you? And and one thing that we discussed before and which was a very interesting thing there is that you know, a lot of businesses that are selling online, they do have an Amazon similar service. So it is, you know, no quibble returns. That's it is easy to get delivered, collects a return and all that type of stuff. But it doesn't seem as though it's promoted as well as it should be.
00:12:20.620 --> 00:12:32.380
Steve Tomkinson
You know, so you don't get that visibility or the the security or the the the knowledge that that's the that's happening you know and and that was something that I thought was a good set to kind of put that front and center.
00:12:32.920 --> 00:12:54.930
David Gadd (Guest)
Yeah, I I think that's that's probably one of the big things that that when we look at our website, which isn't done by ourselves, actually we had this concept to keep benefits. So it's a little bit like all the key benefits of the business being presented to the customer at the point of sale and a lot of people hide their refund policy or their delivery rates in somewhere like the about us page or the delivery page.
00:12:39.330 --> 00:12:39.650
Steve Tomkinson
Yeah.
00:12:47.470 --> 00:12:47.800
Steve Tomkinson
Yeah.
00:12:51.680 --> 00:12:51.990
Steve Tomkinson
Yeah.
00:12:55.290 --> 00:12:55.610
Steve Tomkinson
Yeah.
00:12:55.920 --> 00:13:26.560
David Gadd (Guest)
And then you know, but they also important in in people's head is that can I get it click and collected? Can I have it delivered? What if I don't like it? How do I send it back? Yeah, that's the thing that people have lots of questions about and sometimes it's extremely hard to find that information. And and there's also a tendency to be protective is that this is this kind of thing. I don't really want it is my refund policy but I don't really want people to know it as if it might protect them in the future from some refund thing where is actually you you get a lot more customers.
00:13:04.650 --> 00:13:05.050
Steve Tomkinson
Yeah.
00:13:10.820 --> 00:13:11.130
Steve Tomkinson
Yeah.
00:13:26.660 --> 00:13:47.130
David Gadd (Guest)
From having the good refund policy, then you would have by saving money by people submitting refunds. We refunds are very are relatively low thing to do. Not many people undertake refunds but I don't know if you know, but it actually varies quite a lot across Europe. So I've heard that apparently the the Germans are the most keen on refunds then.
00:13:37.900 --> 00:13:38.280
Steve Tomkinson
Yeah.
00:13:41.440 --> 00:13:41.740
Steve Tomkinson
Right.
00:13:47.110 --> 00:13:48.260
Steve Tomkinson
Alright, so OK.
00:13:48.020 --> 00:14:18.020
David Gadd (Guest)
That's the whole of Europe now and it's almost a refund culture there. That's like a click and collect refund culture is that you know, they have far more refund collection points and all the rest of it. And there's almost a someones given and said that when you order something on the website you're trying it out then if you don't want Matt whereas in the UK there's a bit like you're committing to it but you only send it back if you genuinely don't like it. So it does vary across different European countries and they've got different resources for refunds but.
00:14:03.990 --> 00:14:05.030
Steve Tomkinson
Ah, I see.
00:14:18.470 --> 00:14:18.870
Steve Tomkinson
Yeah.
00:14:18.470 --> 00:14:22.350
David Gadd (Guest)
You know, I mean clothing, obviously the biggest refund area that.
00:14:21.980 --> 00:14:52.090
Steve Tomkinson
Yeah, well, that's gonna be, isn't it? And I think that's always the hardest one to sell online for the simple reason that you've, you know, you're not quite sure it's gonna be. And that's why I think we, we've still got High Street clothing stores and droves still available to us because there is a it's a difficult sell. You know it is. You know there's always that touching, going this and that's one of those items that people buy, you know four of and then they send the other three back you know something gets well say.
00:14:41.890 --> 00:14:42.230
David Gadd (Guest)
Yeah.
00:14:52.430 --> 00:14:54.820
Steve Tomkinson
Those things are gonna be a big deal as well, I suppose.
00:14:55.560 --> 00:15:25.280
David Gadd (Guest)
Yeah, I think that's, I mean with the with the COVID pandemic, it's it's one of the things that's really changed is most of your High Street stores have now got a fully sort of Omni channel strategy. So that the website integrates with the store and you can click and collect or you can order online and you can organize your returns. I think you probably be staggered in the amount of major online retailers that didn't have that so fast before the end. Nick and I think that's one of the maybe the positive or negative things about the pandemic is that.
00:14:55.920 --> 00:14:56.160
Steve Tomkinson
I.
00:15:06.720 --> 00:15:06.960
Steve Tomkinson
Yeah.
00:15:12.560 --> 00:15:12.780
Steve Tomkinson
Yeah.
00:15:19.800 --> 00:15:20.060
Steve Tomkinson
Yeah.
00:15:25.810 --> 00:15:56.340
David Gadd (Guest)
And those businesses have now got their act sorted out and the other, the other interesting thing is again on that basis of click and collect and is that those businesses that are fried, I either spreadsheet many years ago where I tried to demonstrate that what business need to do now is is before the pandemic and when only say 10% of people were using ecommerce which you found the businesses that thrived were those that embraced the sort of ecommerce thing early. There were many feared it and tried to pretend it would go away and wouldn't develop online presences.
00:15:28.890 --> 00:15:29.200
Steve Tomkinson
Yeah.
00:15:44.890 --> 00:15:45.160
Steve Tomkinson
Yeah.
00:15:51.580 --> 00:15:51.860
Steve Tomkinson
Yeah.
00:15:56.570 --> 00:16:26.150
David Gadd (Guest)
And they have lot by and large kind of gone bust. Some of them are caught up, you know, because they were big enough to catch up. You would argue, you know, the the sort of ones that have gone bust are the ones that haven't dealt well with saying online environment where you can get a product and see 33 other people selling it and see the price. They get it out and how long it's gonna to be delivered. So they they they've thrived really on 300% margins and people walking in the store paying a stupid amount for something that online you can get 10% of the price and then.
00:16:00.000 --> 00:16:00.330
Steve Tomkinson
Yeah.
00:16:03.340 --> 00:16:03.590
Steve Tomkinson
Yeah.
00:16:14.470 --> 00:16:14.800
Steve Tomkinson
Yeah.
00:16:25.640 --> 00:16:25.940
Steve Tomkinson
Yeah.
00:16:26.510 --> 00:16:36.710
David Gadd (Guest)
Is that what kind of fall on the way line because they don't really have anywhere to go in a certain environment where all their products are up for sale against everybody else and so?
00:16:37.570 --> 00:16:44.000
David Gadd (Guest)
You know, it's interesting times, but if you look at some of the failures, you know, like I think Debenhams recently failed and they and.
00:16:44.000 --> 00:16:44.470
Steve Tomkinson
Yeah.
00:16:44.780 --> 00:16:50.540
David Gadd (Guest)
And and and various others that they do rely on. You know, the large department store high margins kind of.
00:16:51.390 --> 00:16:54.420
David Gadd (Guest)
Scenario has been a very tricky trading environment for them.
00:16:56.150 --> 00:17:02.680
Steve Tomkinson
It doesn't really. It doesn't really appeal in the same way to the uh, that generation, that is.
00:17:02.880 --> 00:17:19.910
Steve Tomkinson
Umm, uh, really focused around 1:00 this stuff now and don't want to do that human interaction really as much as they used to and stuff like that. You know, I think we probably have got a bit of a lag on that. I post code as well, where people just don't wanna be.
00:17:11.810 --> 00:17:12.020
David Gadd (Guest)
Right.
00:17:12.870 --> 00:17:13.090
David Gadd (Guest)
Yeah.
00:17:20.640 --> 00:17:31.160
Steve Tomkinson
Umm, you know the that they're a bit Friday if kind of engaging with people as much. So the high streets got a hell of a way to recover from that. You know whereas ecommerce this too easy to do.
00:17:29.100 --> 00:17:29.660
David Gadd (Guest)
Yeah.
00:17:31.550 --> 00:18:02.940
David Gadd (Guest)
I mean, I think there is a bit of luck there because you know the new millennials coming through are are as Internet savvy as you know the consumers are. So they're driving a new wave of Internet savvy, informed consumers that spend all their time on their mobile phone, buying everything, doing price checks, checking reviews, going off with your media sharing products. You know that that, that's the kind of new wave of online retail that was all a bit of a mystery 10 years ago. And, you know, I think there's a lot of, you know, there are a lot of millennials out there now that are very highly sophisticated in.
00:17:48.780 --> 00:17:49.080
Steve Tomkinson
Yeah.
00:17:56.170 --> 00:17:56.480
Steve Tomkinson
Yeah.
00:18:03.250 --> 00:18:06.830
David Gadd (Guest)
What they do with their online marketing and their social media engagement.
00:18:07.540 --> 00:18:30.950
David Gadd (Guest)
And so, you know, is it things have changed a lot and you know we we in in doing that we've tried to find our niche and maintain our competitiveness as a business and just you know obviously with us it's all about managing large inventories and getting products on the websites and and things like that most customers you know there is there are click and collect options but we don't live in that kind of world.
00:18:10.920 --> 00:18:11.240
Steve Tomkinson
Yeah.
00:18:25.700 --> 00:18:26.100
Steve Tomkinson
Yeah.
00:18:31.750 --> 00:18:41.140
David Gadd (Guest)
And but it's interesting, you know, talking about Amazon was it cause they recently had a sort of poor share price valuation. Didn't think that the worst quarter for the lab.
00:18:40.770 --> 00:18:42.610
Steve Tomkinson
Ohh OK right now I didn't know that.
00:18:42.860 --> 00:19:12.590
David Gadd (Guest)
Yeah. Well, I think you know and again, there's been a lot of unraveling on that because I think a lot of ecommerce companies have been on that. Shopify and others have done so well in the pandemic with, you know, stores being shut that suddenly now they've reopened. They've had disappointing first quarters in January to March quarter. It's really been the first quarter of a genuine non lockdown relationship with people genuinely heading back to the High Street and probably where it is now is where where we are say, you know, two years on.
00:18:49.210 --> 00:18:49.470
Steve Tomkinson
Yeah.
00:18:57.640 --> 00:18:57.970
Steve Tomkinson
Right.
00:19:03.790 --> 00:19:04.790
Steve Tomkinson
Yeah, that's right.
00:19:13.350 --> 00:19:16.500
David Gadd (Guest)
There's not that fear out there anymore going into stores.
00:19:16.690 --> 00:19:48.030
Steve Tomkinson
No, not as much, no. But I suppose that then is a. Yeah. So now you've all the kind of bizarre trends that happened over the pandemic period where he had massive spikes and stuff like that. It's stored in a normalized now, really. You know, so you're you're you're in a real trade and environment. Like you're saying now coming out the other side where he commerces where it is and the High Street is where it is pretty much. And you know, we're back to more of a status quiet in that relationship between the two I suppose.
00:19:18.610 --> 00:19:18.880
David Gadd (Guest)
Yeah.
00:19:48.650 --> 00:20:01.920
David Gadd (Guest)
Yeah, I think everyone who was going to go bus has gone bust because, you know, we pandemic and now the people who haven't gone bust of those will have a pretty good. So you know, online presence or or strategy for how they can you know and how they can compete.
00:19:51.340 --> 00:19:51.650
Steve Tomkinson
Yeah.
00:19:55.730 --> 00:19:56.150
Steve Tomkinson
Yeah.
00:19:59.740 --> 00:19:59.970
Steve Tomkinson
Yeah.
00:20:02.440 --> 00:20:02.760
David Gadd (Guest)
Umm.
00:20:03.680 --> 00:20:07.570
David Gadd (Guest)
And you know some exceptional winners and the pandemic and now getting less than.
00:20:08.630 --> 00:20:08.880
David Gadd (Guest)
Pretty.
00:20:09.660 --> 00:20:10.370
David Gadd (Guest)
Any trading?
00:20:11.280 --> 00:20:37.330
David Gadd (Guest)
Nonetheless, still there isn't. There is a thing that you know the industry has moved on about five years into the future in, in, in a really simple matter of time because of people having to embrace ecommerce. Cause. I mean I just go back a even just a couple of years ago and they're still people wondering whether they should do it. We we were working with clients that regretted not doing it before the pandemic is they found they had nowhere to go and now they think everybody accepts at least that they need to have a.
00:20:17.790 --> 00:20:18.280
Steve Tomkinson
Yeah.
00:20:34.330 --> 00:20:34.590
Steve Tomkinson
Yeah.
00:20:38.020 --> 00:20:50.770
David Gadd (Guest)
Fully working, operational and profitable online store as part of their Internet offering if they are in retail. Yeah, you know, and then it's all about kind of what can they put together, you know.
00:20:45.450 --> 00:20:46.580
Steve Tomkinson
Yeah, yeah.
00:20:52.250 --> 00:20:58.320
David Gadd (Guest)
It seems that is interesting times for us. You know, we are we are looking, you know, not not bit of a business pitch I said I wouldn't do.
00:20:59.370 --> 00:21:00.070
Steve Tomkinson
You're alright.
00:20:59.630 --> 00:21:18.850
David Gadd (Guest)
We are, we are genuinely, you know, this year we we are looking for good entrepreneurs, people that wanna grow quickly with us on the performance based model and it's kind of really for us we are look you know we're out we're actively looking for people with with you know with big ambitions and angry.
00:21:07.510 --> 00:21:07.760
Steve Tomkinson
Yeah.
00:21:18.440 --> 00:21:19.090
Steve Tomkinson
Yeah, yeah.
00:21:20.020 --> 00:21:21.890
David Gadd (Guest)
That we wanted to the back, you know.
00:21:21.610 --> 00:21:21.790
Steve Tomkinson
But.
00:21:22.630 --> 00:21:26.760
David Gadd (Guest)
I think I used the word incident, but I was told not to say that by someone.
00:21:23.020 --> 00:21:23.540
Steve Tomkinson
And I.
00:21:26.210 --> 00:21:28.070
Steve Tomkinson
You said. What was that I missed that?
00:21:28.320 --> 00:21:47.210
David Gadd (Guest)
Well, that we see ourselves as a bit of an investment company. You know, we will invest the money in ideas and we are we, but we don't actually you know we invest time, money, resource posting and the rest on the basis of sales. So you know we are we like to think we are a good partner to work with if you if you think big and you've got a good idea.
00:21:31.130 --> 00:21:32.340
Steve Tomkinson
Ah, see. Yeah.
00:21:37.850 --> 00:21:38.080
Steve Tomkinson
Yeah.
00:21:41.140 --> 00:21:41.440
Steve Tomkinson
Yeah.
00:21:48.190 --> 00:22:00.910
David Gadd (Guest)
And you know, I mean we we had a call this morning from someone that said, you know, Dave, I wanna make 10 million, you know within two years and that's the sort of people would like to talk to. OK tell Alice, how are we gonna do it? You know? So it's that.
00:21:58.910 --> 00:21:59.480
Steve Tomkinson
How silly.
00:22:01.800 --> 00:22:31.670
Steve Tomkinson
Yeah, yeah, absolutely. Well, and that's it. I mean, you know, you have to, you have to take that. So you're taking the risk as much as the other party is and and you know, the way that their business is gonna progress online. So, you know, it has to be a joint, a joint partnership. And that's the way I see it, you know, but a partnership has to be the right partnership and not all partnerships. So, you know, are gonna work. So you have to be the right people to work.
00:22:02.930 --> 00:22:03.270
David Gadd (Guest)
Promise.
00:22:16.200 --> 00:22:16.510
David Gadd (Guest)
Yeah.
00:22:31.790 --> 00:22:41.520
Steve Tomkinson
Work with, but you know, as far as I can see and Umm, you know, knowing you pretty much since she started up and you know in and out.
00:22:42.700 --> 00:23:13.180
Steve Tomkinson
I don't know anybody else that's a more profession that ecommerce in the market. I think you'd really are incredibly, you know your stuff and you and your team have been doing this, you know, to the enth degree for for a long time now. And you know like we said at the top of the show, it's it's a very disruptive model the way that you're doing it, there's nobody else that I know this in this very performance related marketing and management of a whole ecommerce operation and it's great.
00:23:13.260 --> 00:23:21.790
Steve Tomkinson
You know, it's a really good, you know, it's a it's a really good model if you can make it work and you clearly have, so you know well done to you.
00:23:22.060 --> 00:23:25.630
David Gadd (Guest)
Yeah, great question. Good, good to do the fan as it was.
00:23:25.810 --> 00:23:28.870
Steve Tomkinson
Yeah, absolutely. No, no. And you know.
00:23:28.370 --> 00:23:31.820
David Gadd (Guest)
Invite me off. I enjoy chatting and let's get a coffee soon.
00:23:32.160 --> 00:23:44.120
Steve Tomkinson
Yeah, we should do face to face. Yeah, the, you know, get so we can actually be next to each other rather than doing this remotely. Yeah, we should do that. All right, David. Well, like, thank you very much for your time. Appreciate it.
00:23:41.440 --> 00:23:42.570
David Gadd (Guest)
Yeah. OK.
00:23:43.790 --> 00:23:45.150
David Gadd (Guest)
Yeah, we'll see. Bye.
00:23:44.970 --> 00:23:46.200
Steve Tomkinson
Alright, thank you very much.