From the Yellow Chair
From the Yellow Chair
Behind the Curtain of an Internal CMO
Want a marketing plan that survives platform changes, rising CPCs, and slow seasons? We sit down with CMO Matt Tyner to unpack a practical playbook for home service companies that blends brand building with capacity-aware demand generation. From HVAC to roofing, Matt’s path reveals why the cheapest leads come from strong brands, how consistent execution compounds, and where most contractors accidentally sabotage their results.
We get tactical fast: schedule blocking that protects strategy time, capacity boards that guide spend, and a weekly reporting rhythm that replaces guesswork with clarity. Matt outlines the metrics he tracks—booking rate, set rate, close rate, average ticket, reviews, NPS, and referrals—and explains how a dedicated follow-up team added millions in closed revenue without turning up the pressure. You’ll hear why education-first newsletters outperform coupon blasts, what a thoughtful 120-day estimate cadence looks like, and how to keep tone aligned with your sales DNA.
If you run multi-location brands, you’ll appreciate Matt’s deep dive on localization. Creative must reflect the market; what works in the Midwest can ring false in Florida. We talk about filming smarter, tightening shots, and adapting social and media mixes to demographics and seasonality. And when it comes to channel strategy, Matt makes the case for diversification: balance SEO, LSA, PPC, direct mail, OTT/CTV, OOH, referrals, and community partnerships so no single platform can derail your pipeline.
The throughline is simple and demanding: consistency is the real silver bullet. Stick with partners long enough to learn, keep budgets steady enough to measure, and show up for your community so trust precedes every search. If you’re ready to get brand-forward, tighten your follow-up, and lead with empathy while you scale, this conversation will give you concrete steps to start today.
If this resonated, subscribe, leave a review, and share it with a contractor friend who needs a steadier plan. What will you commit to doing consistently over the next quarter?
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From the Yellow Chair is powered by Lemon Seed, a marketing strategy and branding company for the trades. Lemon Seed specializes in rebrands, creating unique, comprehensive, organized marketing plans, social media, and graphic design. Learn more at www.LemonSeedMarketing.com
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We'll see you next time, Lemon Heads!
What's up, Lemon Heads? Welcome to another episode of From the Yellow Chair. I'm Crystal. And guys, listen, I don't normally like fangirl, but when people truly live a life that you used to live of being an internal CMO, though he manages much larger accounts, this is going to be a great conversation all about marketing, internal CMO style vibes. So settle in, grab some lemonade, and let's zip some lemonade together. All right, Matt Tyner, I'm so excited to have you on the show. You know, I follow all of the comments that you put out there, all of your postings on LinkedIn and socials, um, because it just always resonates with my soul about marketing for the home service industry. So welcome, welcome.
SPEAKER_02:Thank you so much. And I'm I'm glad to be here so we can talk a little bit about marketing.
SPEAKER_01:Yeah. I mean, we wake up every day and we do this every single day, right? So I know that you are now, so I've known you for a hot minute at least of you came from um the HVAC side, now you're on the roofing side, but you're the chief marketing officer for bone bone-dry roofing and its family of brands. But tell us a little bit like how you got into this industry, you know, things that have shaped your whole marketing perspective.
SPEAKER_02:Yeah, so I kind of fell into the industry. Uh wasn't planning on it, wasn't a family thing. Uh, you know, the the common ways. Um, my senior year at Butler, I had a year-long internship at Delta Faucet Company, but it happened to be around the time when the housing market crashed, and that did not bode well for uh faucet manufacturers. So they obviously had a hiring freeze, loved it there. Um, actually, my two uh managers there put me in contact with uh folks in the HVAC space, and I was lucky enough to get a job. I was a character carrier territory manager uh for a period of time and loved that, but just I the fulfillment wasn't there for me personally. I know a lot of people have done very well with it and have done amazing things, but just for me personally, I really like the marketing side and the the building of a business. And so um from there went to work for one of my customers actually, uh, which at the time was HVAC.com, uh now contractor commerce. Uh was business development there, helped grow that from two to 16 million on the the e-commerce side. This was before contractor commerce was a thing. Uh and so that was a that was a ton of fun. Loved it, loved learning the e-commerce side of of marketing and what all that entails, and uh, but wanted to get on the contractor side. I was like, you know what? I've now done the the distribution side, I've done the e-commerce side. Now let's go to the the contracting side to see what that's all about. So worked with a contractor out of Cincinnati and Lexington, really just redeveloping out their marketing and sales uh strategy and team and and figuring out how to get some things corrected. They've seen they saw some downturns in their revenue uh the year prior. We were able to get the boosted uh plus one million and on an you know seven million dollar business at that time was a was a meaningful adjustment. And uh, you know, unfortunately during that time my dad passed away and perspective hit, and it's like, all right, life, right? We we've got it, we've got to make some moves just just for family and everything like that. So my wife and I made the decision. We're both from the same small farm town in Indiana, so we we moved back to Indianapolis. Uh and I've been here ever since. Uh, was blessed to to get a job with Marsha Barnes at Valve and Meter, um, where I was their VP of marketing, really focusing on the home services, their home home services portfolio and building out the marketing strategy and plans uh for for their clients uh on that side. But then uh from there went to work for Max Service Group, which was acquired in 21 by Wrench Group. Had a great time there building building the business from let's see, when I started, it was 56 million. We took it to 112 million uh in a couple of years. It was an absolute blast, loved it. Good people, good company, good customers. It was it was just a perfect mix. Um, but wanted to wanted to make a little bit of a move back to the family-owned side of things, um, just to to get back to to that experience a little bit uh differently. So uh from there, ended up moving over here to bone-dry roofing. So we're by our estimates, we're about the second largest family-owned roofing contractor in the United States. We're hitting about 200 million, about 550 um uh employees across all of our brands, nine states, um, anywhere from Florida to Michigan over to Colorado. So um love it. Customers are customers. Um, but there are there are differences between the HBAC and plumbing space and the roofing space. But but here I am enjoying it, helping helping grow another company, and that's uh that's my story.
SPEAKER_01:I love it. So so deep entrenched in all aspects of the industries is I think such a valuable piece. I was talking to a new this new digital company came out, and they were like, Oh, we want to talk to you. So I get on a call and I'm talking to them, and I'm like, You guys know nothing about the industry. So, like you may know everything you need to know about SEO and GEO and all the alphabet soup, and I'm so impressed with that. But just knowing the industry really has so much, yeah, such gives you such a leg up. So I love that you first of all, like you had such positive react positive things to say about these past people that you've been a part of, because I think it's such a valuable part of building where you are now. So uh what I've always loved about what you say, um, your editorial brand for yourself is you know, you're very focused on building the brand, um, and you're not just chasing every single lead. Um and having a holistic approach to marketing strategy, just it's in my veins. I just cannot, I understand the attraction to just lead gin, lead gin, lead gen. I get it. And I know that's at the end of the day what we have to do to generate business, but understanding how it's the sum of all that makes a good marketing strategy is so important. So I thought today I titled this episode Behind the Curtain with an internal CMO. Um, and so, you know, day-to-day reality versus perceptions, you know. So, you know, I think there is a time when, especially when you have multiple brands, multiple locations, multiple states, all those good things, there has to be a place for you to have strategic leadership as the CMO versus a tactical firefighter, as I say. So, you know, a typical day for you probably I'm assuming includes like just overall guidance, but a little bit of firefighting as well. Um, and so like what do what is a day kind of look like for you?
SPEAKER_02:Yeah, so I try I try to get in a little early. Uh I like that uh I you know, I like that seven o'clock to eight o'clock time frame of just being able to to you know, before the meetings start for the day, just be able to focus and get the day aligned and and and ready to go. The the night prior, I like to review what my upcoming day looks like and and catch any errors that I may have made in my calendar or anything like that. Um but really uh when it comes down to it, you have to you have to schedule block certain things, you have to set time aside to think strategically. Um yeah, I the the CMO has a unique seat at the table when it comes to the the executive leadership side of things, right? We're we're typically the one that is going to have the the voice of the consumer, which is which is obviously incredibly important uh in that. Um but but I think oftentimes that can can get lost. And I think that's where the the brand building component and and all of that comes into play. But um, you know, you you have to be able to set time aside to to think strategically and and have those conversations internally. But I'll say from a time perspective, you know, I I spend a lot of time even on the operations side, right? Digging into the data, being able to see where we may have some operational uh you know opportunities, yeah, right. How we can how we can really create alignment between marketing and sales and operations, you know, through the the entire process, right? Um, so it's it's fun because you don't get bored, but it it's uh but but it can be distracting at times, and that's where I really say the schedule blocking comes in comes into effect. And you know, over the years I've learned how to when and what to turn off on my cell phone when and and just be able to to focus. But your typical day will always have fires. I never ask them to think you don't have fires. In marketing, most of the time we're firefighters, right? Um, but having an amazing team like I do be able to tackle a lot of those and put those fires out and and be able to to handle that buys me time to be able to think more strategically of where we need to go and and how we're gonna get there. Um, and that's that's the fun stuff that I that I I love.
SPEAKER_01:Yes, you get a little bump of energy when you put out the fires, but yeah, I call it a little hit, a little hit, yeah, a little something. Well, you know, I wrote down, you know, how to think like a consumer. So, you know, my my seat at any table, even now in my in my regular job here at Lemon Seed, is I always try to bring back that perspective of the consumer because you know, we live, you know, HVAC plumbing, electrical roofing, pest control, whatever business we're in, we live that every day. And so we're worried about the actual sides of the business that most consumers don't experience. And so we can get really technical, we can get really in our heads about that. And so making sure that as an internal marketer and as a person that's responsible for the marketing, you always bring it back to the consumer. I did a little local show recently here for just any businesses that wanted to come. Um, I love being an active part of my community too. So I did it and I said, listen, many of you wake up every day and you are thinking already in the wrong mindset when it comes down to marketing and messaging because you're thinking like the business owner and you need to think like the consumer. So I love that call out. And then schedule blocking again. A lot of um home service companies do not have a dedicated marketer. Let's not a lot of times while they end up with lemon seed, but they have someone on their team who's probably that is a list that marketing is a is a one of the bullet points on their list of things to do every day. But one hack that you mentioned here is just schedule block, like hey, two hours every other day, I stop and focus on marketing, um, which seems like a lot of time, but you need time to dig into the numbers to look at your creative and all of that stuff. So I really love um all that calling out of those two things. So, you know, and then another thing that I always like to ask like, how do you, in your overall strategic approach to building your companies, how do you balance brand building with demand generation?
SPEAKER_02:Yeah.
SPEAKER_01:It's always a loaded question, but how do you manage it?
SPEAKER_02:Great question. Um, so on the demand generation side of things, I'm I'm very in tune with what would be our capacity report, oftentimes in the in the home services space, right? Your three-day call boards, right? We need to we need to bump those up. And and and as a marketer, and specifically as a CMO, you should know what level what level levers you're able to pull to be able to drive on the the demand gen side of things. But you always have to be thinking through, even when you think about how we answer the phone, how we communicate with our e-leads customers, how we, you know, every piece of information that goes out there is a brand component, right? Whether we we like it or not. And uh I think you have to have a really good balance, but you always have to be you always have to be focused on the brand, right? Because every interaction is meaningful, and and how meaningful you make it is going to be really impactful on on how your demand gen operates. And no, I I think one thing that we just did a terrible job of as an industry, and I say this all the time, probably anytime I get to talk to anyone, is is that we did a horrible job as a home services space, we over-rotated to digital marketing, right? And I get it, it's addicting, right? Talking about that in that pump, right? Yeah, you you like that you you like seeing the results, you like seeing the the attribution side of it. And trust me, as a digital marketer, and my background's primarily on digital, I love that. But how do you drive down that cost in an ever-evolving and and increasing cost world of digital marketing? You make sure you create a strong brand, right? Because that's you're gonna be able to be the brand of choice for people before they even go down the digital funnel. And so being able to get in there, you're gonna be more cost efficient, you're gonna have more branded searches, which are gonna be your cheapest search options, right? People are gonna, you're good, they're gonna be able to leverage your your SEO for your name popping up first, whatever, GBPs, all of that. Everything gets cheaper and better as you build a meaningful brand. And I think that comes across across the board of of the the entire business. And so um I I would say in terms of balancing that, you know, yeah, you just have to you have to be very deliberate in your your overall approach and and know that you have a you have an obligation to the company to drive leads at this time to be able to get have that capacity filled, but always be viewing everything in the long-term brand window.
SPEAKER_01:Yeah, absolutely. I truly believe that the longer you trust the process of brand long-term brand building, it's it's like it just marinates and it gets better and better and better. Um, again, if I could just encourage like contractors, just get really mentally blocked. They're like, oh my gosh, I don't know. You know, you have to really focus on the fact that you can build a brand and you will build it. Yeah. Um, and honestly, if you don't tell people what your brand is, people will self-determine what your brand is. Absolutely. Um, but we're going to have a brand. Yes.
SPEAKER_02:If you build it or someone else.
SPEAKER_01:Yes, correct. And I was telling people, you know, again, another contractor a couple of days ago, I said, listen, there's nothing wrong with a lead aggregation strategy, like the e-locals, the home advisors, all that. It's a strategy. This is my whole point. Like, this is why it's extremely hard for me to be like, oh, we are not cookie-cutter templatized agency, because lemon seeds goal is to help you build like overall lead gen and overall brand building and in partnering with the right partners because every brand, every market, every budget, every owner, every culture is so different that to me, I have to look at overall like where where do you have the most opportunity? Where can you do the most? I love the statement about the overrotation on digital. I definitely think we indulged in that.
SPEAKER_00:Yeah.
SPEAKER_01:And now we are like, we are addicted to it. And like right now, I mean, I think contractors wake up every day mad at their digital company. And I'm like, a digital company is a response marketing, so it is based off there being actual demand. So they it's it's uh and it confuses contractors, and they get to me, they place blame on the wrong place, but it still happens, still happens. So, you know, how do you decide, you know, what matters every day? Um, how do you prioritize every day?
SPEAKER_02:Oh, that one's an easy one. I have it as a post-it note, even on my monitor. It is revenue, efficiency, everything else.
SPEAKER_01:Okay.
SPEAKER_02:What's gonna what's gonna impact revenue, what's going to drive efficiency across the business, and then everything else.
SPEAKER_01:All the fun stuff has to come last. Well, especially like new projects or something new, you know. I I think we can be distracted by shiny objects.
SPEAKER_02:Oh, in this space for sure. Like that's I got out of most of the Facebook groups because all it is is shiny object squirrel moments. That's it. And we're always we're always trying to find that next secret, and and everyone's just so is blind to the fact, and this isn't an insult at anyone, but people are blind to the fact that it comes with marketing is successful because it's done consistently over a long period of time. And you you create that brand by being consistent in your marketing messaging, in the customer experience, and how you then nurture them throughout the rest of the relationship or the longevity of them being a customer. And and we just keep wanting to find these silver bullets that are just going to drive more leads, more leads, more leads. That's great. Or we create a long-term sustainable scalable business. And I think that's where uh I get a little frustrated in this in the space, is that everyone is is not uh staying focused and staying consistent enough to be successful.
SPEAKER_01:Consistent is such a big word.
SPEAKER_02:Oh, it absolutely is. Uh that you know, that's that's why you when you think of like top mind awareness, right? Reach and frequency, right? How many times do you reach them? How frequent do you reach them? Um, you know, that that comes down to consistency. You've just got to consistently be driving driving the messaging and the experience.
SPEAKER_01:I do a whole presentation on the silver bullet for marketing, and literally I deflate people every time when I'm like, I have bad news for y'all. The silver bullet is consistency. Yes, many of you will not be still, you won't be still with your digital provider, you won't be still with your budget, you won't be still with making sure you're holding your team accountable for KPIs, and so you're not consistently doing anything. And so I I learned this in science, right? You have to have a constant. So before we can measure a lot of things of what's changing and what's impacting things, is I don't have anything consistent. So I don't know what moved the needle, good or bad, because everything's wild. Um, I met with a again, a contractor story. Um, and this is literally how the conversation started. He was like, I'm on my fifth digital provider this year. I'm like in 2025. So I'm like, sir, you are the problem immediately, immediately, because I refuse to believe now, maybe Matt, I default to good too many times. I refuse to believe that there are, I'll even go with five um well-known agencies in the digital space that are all scumbags that are taking advantage of everyone. I just I do I refuse to believe that that's the truth. Um, and so I'm like, there is an issue here with either our expectations, our understanding, our budget, something is the problem. But I said, hey, you're whoever number six gets the lucky pleasure of being, they are screwed from the get-go. Yeah, because they have so much ground to make up. Yep, and you have no patience. And I'm like, you need to just be still. Sometimes, like, stillness should be your goal for 2026. I'm going to be still and move methodically and intentionally, and not so like a wild caged squirrel, you know, that's out out for the first time.
SPEAKER_02:Everyone wants the quick wins, but but these big brands in in the markets, whether it be home services, retail, whatever, it's not an overnight success. It never is. If it is, it's not sustainable. Um and and you know, typically. End up seeing that on the other side.
SPEAKER_01:Yeah, so yep, absolutely. And you find out, you know, remember social media, especially is a highlight reel. It is everyone's best pieces, best days. And honestly, there's so many things like I can say all kinds of things on here that are true, but without any context or how I got there or anything like that. That's definitely the truth. Well, let me try to change gears for a second here. I want to talk about that you as a marketer, you know, the systems, the dashboards, maybe even the apps. I'm not, you don't necessarily have to give me actual vendors, but I'm looking for like what are you using every day? Is it is it your service titan dashboard or your CRM dashboard? Is what tools have you really learned as a marketer are impactful to your job performance?
SPEAKER_02:Yeah, absolutely. So uh internally, I think I mentioned the the the capacity board for us internally. So we know what our first available appointment is across every market so that we can uh you know become better marketers at that. Um I'm a big fan of AREFs, still old school in that that place. I love jumping in just seeing if we've had you know, I pay for the daily monitoring just to see if we've seen any you know numbers change up, down, whatever, just be able to catch on to those early so we can so I can get them to the team to to make a decision. But I think ultimately, you know, a lot of the data comes right because our our focus at the end of the day is is revenue, right? Whether it be through direct, you know, the customer acquisition or the top of mind awareness channels, it's revenue. Uh, we need to constantly be digging in and making uh making our own reports to be able to pull what data is important to us. You know, I'm I'm a big fan, I've always have been of return on marketing spend, return on ad spend, so that we can really see how our partners and channels are performing from a revenue perspective. Also keeping in mind that there are stories behind each of them of why one may perform better than the other, and one may be having a more of a top of mind impact. So it may be a blended mixed attribution type type approach. Um, but I think I think at the at the end of the day, you have to know what's important to your team and your business to be able to move it forward, and you have to be completely aligned with it and what you're looking at so that you're you're also moving the company forward through that. So um I didn't give you any names, but you know, there's there's plenty of tools. I'm one of those with you know a thousand tabs open on my computer at a point in time. Just constantly looking at at the data and and where we can make the improvements across the organization.
SPEAKER_01:No, absolutely. So, you know, this is one thing that does drive me crazy. When I if I were to, if you and I were really working together and I called you and was like, hey, so let's talk about average ticket, call count, call booking rate, you can probably rattle those off very quickly. I work with a lot of contractors, so a lot of contractors still have to wear the marketing hat. They cannot say they they don't know. And so I'm like, how do you know how many leads we need to actually gather if you do not know average ticket and how your team is going to handle those? And so a lot of this is taking responsibility for your portion of the equation, right? So, like you said, you're constantly looking at your team performance opportunities, the actual performance of your vendors. Like, are my vendor partners performing? And if they're not, it's not to go eradicate them from my strategy, it's a true partnership. Like, I need to get with my whatever digital partner, direct mail partner, billboard partner, whatever, and say, hey, this is what I'm showing, what's going on, and how can we pivot? It should be an open line of communication. I would be making every meeting that my partner scheduled for performance reviews. I am kind of their squeaky wheel. I don't complain all the time, but I'm constantly monitoring everything that's happened. I love the A ref's idea because digital marketing really, I think, is everybody like they are so scared of it, it changes so quickly. Um, and most contractors do not need to be in the driver's seat of their digital piece.
SPEAKER_02:Well, and you know, it what I like to do is each week pull the prior two weeks performance of the entire funnel. And I have a series of reports that I throw into a simple Google Sheet that I can track. Then, okay, here's what my here's what the number of phone calls we received, web forms we received, here's what our booking rate was, here's what our close rate was, here's what our well, appointment set rate, close rate, you know, average all of this. It's nice to be able to view. And then even off to the side, I have what our Google reviews were for the prior two weeks, what our NPS score was for the prior two weeks, and then what our referral programs have driven the last two weeks. And referral meaning a true, hey, refer your neighbor, you get X dollars off, whatever. Um, so I I really like looking at that entire view because that's going to tell you the health of the organization right there. And then that enables you as a marketer to make decisions with your team.
SPEAKER_01:Well, and I equate this a lot of times. Thank you for that. I equate this a lot of times to like getting blood work done, right? So when you go to the doctor and they're they're evaluating what's going on with you, they need to see a complete picture. They don't just be like, well, your blood pressure is high. You know, they're they've they have to know that your blood pressure was high and you had a temperature and your white count and this and that. And so that's why it's important to have as much data. Data is so powerful.
SPEAKER_02:It is.
SPEAKER_01:Um, and I think that separates the men from the boys a lot of times is people that solely are making decisions and listen, this is contractors every day. You're making a decision based off your gut.
unknown:Right.
SPEAKER_01:And your gut, a lot of times you might have a good direction, but wait till you see actual numbers, and it really will um kind of change your thoughts a lot of times.
SPEAKER_02:And even worse, they're making decisions on if they were the consumer. Newslash. Probably not.
SPEAKER_01:Uh yeah, you're not. You're not your consumer. You're not your ideal avatar for sure. For sure. Well, um, I wanted to talk about some mistakes that we think contractors make and maybe a little bit of how to fix them. Um, chasing tactics instead of building strategy, I think we kind of hit on that. You know, um, there is a strategic approach to marketing, and it's a lot of times a balance. And I know that you're managing several brands. Do you kind of have a a formula that you use or do you change that formula based off brand and where they're located and things like that?
SPEAKER_02:Yeah, so so specifically, like I'll give you a great example on this is is our Florida market. Much higher when you look at the demographics of that, a much older demographic, much more wealthy demographic. You know, we we're in the Sarasota Punta Gorda area, and then we have Edgewater uh and Titusville on the other side of the coast, and two very different clienteles in demographics. And I think when you look at it, um, we had to create essentially a separate for social media, a separate social media strategy just for Florida, uh, because they're it's a different buyer, it's a different customer than what we may be accustomed to in the Midwest or even out in Colorado. You know, a big thing people often don't think about when you're thinking multi-location is the pictures that you're sharing, right? Probably shouldn't share snow picks in Florida.
SPEAKER_01:Yeah.
SPEAKER_02:No, we we probably should even the the outside uh you know, outside when good lord, shooting a TV commercial is next level hard when you have all different locations and you're trying to create consistency across them because you got to get really tight shots because you can't show the wrong plant, the wrong tree, whatever, because people will call you out.
SPEAKER_01:Yeah, that tree doesn't live, that tree is not native to here. Like, where were you?
SPEAKER_02:Right. So um I love that.
SPEAKER_01:Yeah, there's there's we could go on for days because it matters, because you know, even your strategies matter based on tons of different pieces, and that's why, like again, I see this a lot with digital sides, you know, digital companies are like, well, this is our secret sauce. So I'm like, hey, so and as as a fractional CMO for contractors, I sometimes will go in and say, Hey, so while I appreciate that being how everyone starts, how have we pivoted for now my client who's in the middle of Minnesota in December versus the middle of Lufkin, Texas in December? There's gotta be some pivoting somewhere. Um, and same thing with brands, right? So, you know, your brand needs to be authentic. Um, yes, you can buy something, you know, that well, this just looks good, but to me, you gotta believe in it, you gotta have a story behind it so that it's not just another company, you know. So I definitely think that's one thing. So um lack of consistent follow-up systems. So do you guys have, I'm sure you do, a uh robust follow-up system that you guys use for open estimates and even top of mind awareness with people that have done completed work with you.
SPEAKER_02:Yeah, totally. So um a couple different systems that we utilize. When you're talking about email, when you're talking about re-engaging with people that have done business with us in the past, uh, we do have a few states that are pretty um, they're tough when it comes to texting. So we we have to stay away from that, uh, which I would advise every contractor to read their go to their attorney general's website and read the texting and email laws for their individual state because it matters and it can get really expensive if you don't do that. Um, but from a follow-up perspective, e-leads perspective, we we currently utilize Hatch. Uh, they've done a phenomenal job for us creating out our our campaigns and our our strategies, workflows, all of that. Uh, they've been a tremendous partner for us, and we've just seen uh a lot of growth. When I started probably a year in, we started the follow-up team. So I have two people, that's all they do is they follow up on every open estimate in the entire company. Uh, you know, it's and so far we've been able to close about$6.5 million uh just on just on the follow-up. And we've got a 120-day, very tight 120-day cadence, e-lead side, we have a very tight seven-day cadence. Um, and and our approach is very different. We are not a highly aggressive company. We're that's just not who we are as our DNA. And I think I want to pause there for a second because I think a lot of a lot of people as marketers need to understand this. You have to understand your sales DNA within the organization, meaning you can't be making promises that you're not a high-pressure sales organization and then you're a high-pressure sales organization.
SPEAKER_01:We push the hell out of everything, yeah.
SPEAKER_02:Right. Um, because what you're gonna do is you're gonna say something that ends up being a lie in the con in the consumer's eye. Um, because what they are told and what they're experienced are gonna be two completely different things. But I I can honestly say, from our perspective, not a high pressure sales organization, we probably fault to the the other side of the pendulum on it of being too um you know, too, too patient with things, but being able to bring that sales follow-up team in again, all our scripting is not high pressure, it's purely we want to help. Do you have any questions? Uh, I'm here for you. I'm just another person at Bone Dry Roofing that is dedicated to make sure your experience isn't as amazing as possible, right? And they're just things like that they that that you can do um to really help move the company forward. But I I 100% believe in the the whole the entire follow-up side of it. And even on our our our newsletter cadence to our customers via email, right? Everyone has a newsletter, they're throwing their promotions in there. We don't really ever have promotions, um what or off or special offers or anything of that nature. What we're gonna do is we're just gonna educate people, right? We're gonna tell them why, why they what they need to look out for, checklists around the home for that season, things like that, to actually for them to have a reason of why they want to subscribe and and open the newsletter. Um, so so we just try a little bit of a different approach there. And then if we need to educate them that hey, we're going into insulation and your 30% tax credit goes away at the end of this year, you know, let people know. Let people know, but but it's all about being genuine and and helpful, not being sales oriented. No, people don't like being sold.
SPEAKER_01:No, and they won't and they won't hang around, yeah. And so, you know, limit see we always build out the offers for the quarter. And I've I've taught my team, you know, an offer doesn't always have to be, you know, zero percent financing for 16 months. You know, we can say, hey, we're not gonna have any aggressive like actual promotions, but we're gonna educate on why our shingles do not get the black streaks. Yeah, and we're gonna do a whole campaign around that. So the offer, if you will, is more an educational piece or you know, adding extended warranties or adding different why you need to clean your gutters and downspouts and all these things. So, you know, I think promotional people tie that in a lot of times to like a dollar amount of or you know, and sometimes it can be just like, what are you promoting this, this, this whatever quarter season, whatever you're doing? So I uh I love that. So, what about um over reliance?
SPEAKER_02:Which you kind of tapped into this a little bit, over-reliance on one channel of advertising, which we said the over rotation of digital, but uh yeah, that's a tough one because you we are humans and when we see something working and we'd want to just do more and more and more and more of it, but if you don't have a diversified strategy and you're 100% reliant on that lead channel and that lead channel goes away, how's your business going to survive? And that's when I when I go in and look at our our annual planning and and what we're gonna be doing for for this year, next year, whatever, it's really sitting down and and you've got to purposefully go into it of like if any of these channels goes away, where or how would we pivot? Or how do we make sure our business isn't reliant on it? And right, and I think that's why, and it's not preached enough, that's why marketing mix is important. Because your brand's never gonna go away, right? That that's always out there because once you're in someone's once you're in someone's mind, you're there, and that's free. Um But if you're looking at a lot of the paid channels, right, you're you're starting to see your your search, your search organic search results go further and further down the page as as you know, like Google does more AI overviews, as they're doing more GBP sponsored areas, LSA at the top, right? They're they're pushing things down. So, okay, you shouldn't be surprised when something happens because you should have other platforms and channels in place to be able to supplement it if needed.
SPEAKER_01:Yeah, and again, you know, when you rely so heavily on GLSA and you're like all of a sudden I'm not showing up anymore, and you go into panic mode. I'm like, this is why marketing is a gigantic puzzle, right? And so every puzzle piece is important, but the whole puzzle is built upon other things, and so some people have built their house on like a house of cards, basically. So one bad move and everything falls apart. So marketing mix, like I preach this all the time. Like, you've got to diversify a little bit to do a lot of those things. So, okay, rapid fire, yeah, really quick. So one leadership lesson you learned the hard way.
SPEAKER_02:Um I would say always always care for your team and genuinely and and have empathy. Uh I think that's one that that's missed a lot. And even myself, oftentimes, you know, like I make a joke, like you hurt my feeling, like that I only have one. And it's like it took some some team members over the course of my career saying, Yeah, Matt, you may want to soften up a little bit.
SPEAKER_01:Yeah, yeah, you were a little harsh.
SPEAKER_02:To really understand um that you know what the empathy side of things is extremely is extremely important because you need to view people as people. Uh you you have to you have to genuinely love your people uh to be able to earn the right to lead them.
SPEAKER_01:Yeah, I love it. Earn the right to lead them is is a a really cool statement. I love that. So um what Matt wishes every contractor really understood about marketing.
SPEAKER_02:It's the consistency. I uh yes, it it is the consistency and that your consistency and your community matters.
SPEAKER_01:I love that. Okay, last one the marketing hill that you will always die on. So it might be that one, but the marketing hill that Matt will always die on.
SPEAKER_02:Uh, community is incredibly important.
unknown:I love it.
SPEAKER_02:That's they're just you know, everyone wants to focus on on leads, and I'll even throw billboards TV, all of that in the leads category. But if you're not showing up for your community, right? How I said, if you if you don't, if you don't love your team, you don't earn the right to to lead them. It's same thing for your community. If you don't love your community, you don't earn the right to serve them. Yep. And so we have to, as businesses, we have to be good corporate partners and and be able to come in and and impact real meaningful change. And and I think that's that is one hill that I absolutely will die on because you know you can you can do as many things as you want from a marketing perspective, but if you don't show up, it doesn't matter.
SPEAKER_01:Absolutely. And you know, I too um preach this like literally, you know, lemon seed was born because I wanted more people to understand the power of marketing mix and also including brand building, but just this boots on the ground, literally, I say it almost every single day. Um, you know, kissing babies, shaking hands, petting dogs. That's why I love a mascot. You don't have to have a mascot, but I love one. It just honestly just softens the barrier so quickly. Um, so you don't have to have one. Like some people are like, well, that's not really me. That's cool. Um, I I'm just of the belief, like I know what's gonna resonate in a community and be remembered. And I think there's power, so much power left on the table. And people are just honestly, a lot of times I encourage my contractors, do what everybody else won't do, which is invest in a team that's built for your community, invest in a brand that's built for community. So, you know, I I too can have such a strong aversion when people are like, hey, listen, I want all lead aggregators and all digital ads, and let's go. I'm like, I don't know that you and I are gonna get along.
SPEAKER_02:It's interesting because before I came in here, I actually took a call from our uh general manager in Bloomington and he he wanted to reach out and he said, Matt, I just wanted to let you know. Um, we just got a like an$8,000 gutter replacement job, and we asked how they heard about us, and it was because of our partnership with the local humane society. Um, and so it that stuff is meaningful. You know, I give I gotta give Tony Hart, who's our community engagement manager here on the marketing team, a ton of credit. You know, we we helped vaccinate and microchip over a thousand dogs this year. We've helped adopt uh get over a hundred pets adopted. We did 14 free roofs for veterans this year on Veterans Day or at least that week. Um, you know, we're we're over, I think, 93 baseball teams that we sponsored, uh, 20 some high schools we sponsored, and and it's just all of these things, and that doesn't take into effect parades we've sponsored, one off things, you know, donations, all of that. Those are just things that we had a true a program or a process wrapped around to be able to make a meaningful impact. So Um, all of that stuff really, really matters to people. And you know, it all goes it all goes back to showing up for your community.
SPEAKER_01:Absolutely. I mean, listen, I could talk about community all day long. So love the fact, number one, that you even have a community marketing manager. Oh, Tony, I just love what he's probably his job is every day, um, is to engage actively in the community and give back in a healthy, honestly, let's call it what it is, a measurable way, like being able to say we microchipped and spayed this many animals, we it put gave this many roofs away. And a lot of contractors are already naturally tender-hearted, so they give money anyway. We might as well, we might as well make it, you know, intentional and organized and structured because it does have brand impact.
SPEAKER_02:Yep.
SPEAKER_01:For sure, for sure.
SPEAKER_02:Even more so, yeah. I remember talking where it really stuck with me is is a couple of jobs ago, I was speaking with um a not-for-profit that that we had been partnering with for years. And I I spoke with them and they said, Matt, here's here's the thing: we don't have a ton of marketing dollars. You all have a significant a good, healthy marketing budget. And they said, Any time that you can talk about our organization helps us immensely because that is supplementing the marketing dollars so that more dollars can go into our programs and our people. And that was just something that that really stuck with me of like everyone wants to say, you know, oh, we're just being humble here. We don't want to talk about what we're doing in the community. Well, you're not doing you're not doing the charities that you've decided to partner with that are important to you, you're not doing them justice by not talking about it because that's their natural marketing avenue. And so I think we just kind of we we have to be thinking about things differently.
SPEAKER_00:Yep.
SPEAKER_02:Um, and how marketing really is an asset to move things forward, not only within the business, but within the community.
SPEAKER_01:I'm telling you, it's such a powerful move that people really sleep on too much um and don't give it enough attention. Well, Matt, thank you so much for joining me today. This has been super engaging and and I love it. Uh, thank you for what you do, just you give back so much, just free information. So if people wanted to go follow you on socials, I know you're on LinkedIn. That's where I follow you the most. Facebook.
SPEAKER_02:Yeah, LinkedIn's generally going to be the the the best one that I'm that I'm pretty in tune with and and pretty active on. Again, Facebook. I just for my own sanity had to take a break for from Facebook and Zoom scrolling. So uh LinkedIn will be the best, will be the best place to go.
SPEAKER_01:Perfect, perfect. Well, thank you so much um for being here. And again, just thank you for sharing all that you do. You are doing a fantastic job with Bone Dry. I'm obsessed with it. I love watching everything you guys do. Um, and thank you guys for having such a powerful impact on your local communities. I think that's so important. So, and for all of you that are listening, thank you for listening to another episode of From the Yellow Chair. Go follow Matt Tiner on LinkedIn. Great content coming out from him all the time, very consistently. So, of course, consistency being the main main thread here. So, our encouragement, I feel like from both of us is going to be just focus on your marketing when you can have intentionality behind it, get consistent and get brand forward. And I really think truth um be told, you will excel from being consistent and being organized in your approach. Uh, don't forget strategy before tactics. And guys, we hope you have a great rest of your week. Thanks for listening to another episode from the yellow chair, and we'll catch you next time.