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How We Can Heal
A podcast to share deep conversations about How We Can Heal from life’s toughest circumstances.
How We Can Heal
Body, Mind, Trail: Lucja Leonard's Journey to 300 Miles
Lucja Leonard's journey from forging sick notes to avoid PE class to completing a 300-mile ultramarathon across the Arizona desert reveals the transformative power of pushing beyond perceived limits. Just five days after finishing this monumental race, Lucja shares how she navigated extreme sleep deprivation, 90-degree heat, and those inevitable moments where every life decision is questioned.
The conversation dives deep into what pulls someone toward such extreme challenges. For Lucja, it's the extraordinary process of breaking down completely—reaching points of vulnerability and suffering—then rebuilding herself stronger than before. This cycle of breakdown and renewal has fundamentally changed her relationship with her body, transforming years of negative body image into profound respect for what her body can accomplish. "I am strong and fearless," she reflects, noting how ultra running has taught her that bodies of all shapes and sizes can perform incredible feats.
We explore the surprising parallel between ultrarunning and life itself—how both involve waves of struggle and recovery, both require asking for help, and both reveal our true character when pushed to extremes. Lucja shares beautiful moments of human connection on the trail, from strangers offering head torches to trail angels appearing with water when she and her pacer were desperately dehydrated miles from the next aid station.
As a coach who recently guided another runner through their first 300-miler, Lucja offers wisdom for anyone facing seemingly impossible challenges: "Just try. You don't know what you're capable of." Whether you're contemplating your first 5K or wrestling with life's biggest obstacles, this conversation illuminates how embracing challenge rather than avoiding discomfort can lead to profound personal transformation.
Connect with Lucja on Instagram @RunningDutchie or visit FindingGobi.com to learn about her upcoming speaking events where she appears with her husband Dion and their famous four-legged companion Gobi, whose remarkable story has inspired people worldwide.
Welcome back to the How We Can Heal podcast. Today, I'm excited to welcome Lucja Leonard to the show. Lucja Leonard is an ultra runner, adventurer and globetrotter. She hasn't always been an ultra athlete. She's gone from taking on the challenge to run her first ultra in 2013 to now running 100, 200, and even 300 mile races all around the world. She's a running coach and takes inspiration from helping others to achieve the impossible. Lucja and Dion, our last guests on the show, are married and living with Gobi, whose story has become an inspiration for people all around the world. Today, we talk about her very recent 300-mile race, how ultra running helped her build deep confidence and a healthy relationship to food and her body, and how events like these challenge us to ask for the specific supports we need to get through hard times. Please join me in welcoming Lucia Leonard to the show. Join me in welcoming Lucja Leonard to the show Welcome, Lucja Leonard.
Lucja Leonard:Hi, thanks for having me. Yeah, I'm excited to talk to you.
Lisa Danylchuk:And I'm really excited to talk to you because you just finished something monster. You just completed a 300 mile race across the Arizona desert and Mexico. Right, how do you feel? How's your body, How's your mind? How is? Tell us about it.
Lucja Leonard:Well, yeah, I mean, it's absolutely crazy when you think about it. It's like 300 miles. I mean, who even does that? It's just. It just blows my mind. You know, I can't even get my head around the fact that I finished. I mean, it was like five days ago now that I finished and yeah, I think today I'm finally feeling alert. The last few days I've just been like in this brain fog of like sleep deprivation and, yeah, sore legs, sore feet, just yeah, all the aches and pains. And yeah, today I finally feel human and it's kind of starting to, yeah, sort of sink in that. Oh, my God, you just did that.
Lisa Danylchuk:You just did that and you look amazing. I wouldn't know. You don't look like you're suffering, you know, like there's no way. I just I'm so amazed by the human body and by you and by everyone who attempts even these distances, because they are mind boggling.
Lucja Leonard:Most people don't even want to drive 300 miles Trying to tell people, like I've told a few people that I've seen like oh yeah, I just ran 300 miles.
Lisa Danylchuk:They're like oh, wow, and it's like no, like 300 miles, like it's not.
Lucja Leonard:Oh wow, like it's. You can't even like, people can't even comprehend it. So they just kind of, yeah, ignore it, I think.
Lisa Danylchuk:I have noticed myself since I started ultra running and I've never done a 300 mile race, but I have noticed myself while driving looking at maybe an exit sign and it's like, okay, you've got you know 30 more miles to your destination and I'm maybe tired. And I'm like, oh, that's like another 30 plus minutes on the freeway and oh, I need to go to sleep. And then I think I've run that before, so I think I'll be all right, I think I could drive it Right, I think I could stay awake Um, obviously not pushing past, like you know when we need to sleep, but yeah, it's so amazing. I think the question on a lot of non-runners minds is why, like, why? But let's, let's back up before. Why ultra running at all? Like, why this race? What was it about it that called you to it?
Lucja Leonard:Well, I think the fact that it was 300 miles, like I've done 200, I've done 240. And when they brought this race out and it was 300, I was like I've got to do it. Like I've got to do it just to say I've done 300 miles, which is just stupid in itself. But also, I really love Arizona. We've spent quite a bit of time in Arizona and it was going through Tucson, which is one of our favorite places, and so, yeah, it really called to me from that sense. So, yeah, I'd signed up before I could even really think about it properly.
Lisa Danylchuk:If you think about it too much, you start to go, oh no, why. You know there's no real reason I need to do this. But if you follow that spark of inspiration that's like, ooh, I don't. For me it was always I don't know if I can do that. I want to try, like I'm not sure I can go that far, but hey, sounds like fun and I think all of that's important. You know and Deanna and I talked about this too that if you don't want it then there's no point right, if there's not something in you that's going Ooh, this or that challenge and for some of us, like you and I, it manifests on the trail sometimes of you know, I'm speaking in your voice. Now I've done 240. Ooh, what's the next benchmark? Like if I've completed that, maybe something at some point in my life I never thought I could do. What else could I do? Does it come up that way for you?
Lucja Leonard:Oh, absolutely. And for me. You know I grew up being rather unfit, definitely not into sports. I used to forge sick notes from my parents to get out of sports class to go to being an ultra runner and, yeah, just being every time amazed at my body because, you know, I've had, like most women growing up in the eighties and nineties, a lot of body image issues and really hating my body to going to a point where I am so proud of my body and what it can accomplish.
Lucja Leonard:I am strong and fearless and I'm able to do these things that seem impossible. And even in my head sometimes you're like this is impossible, but you're able to achieve it. And just that sense of accomplishment and the empowerment you get from from doing that, like I think that's what keeps me going back for more, because you know, during the race you're just like why am I out here? This is ridiculous. I should just book a holiday to Barbados and lay on the beach like normal people do. No, I'm out here in 90 degree heat, like sleep deprived and wishing I was somewhere else. But there's something about it that just yeah, really ticks those boxes and has you coming back for more. So it does.
Lisa Danylchuk:It's so, it's so magical and mysterious in that way. Right, I did the Tahoe rim trail, the 50 mile race, which was a single loop. I think now there's the double loop for the a hundred mile and I'm like anyone who signs up for that, just wow. But my partner and I did the 50 mile race and I remember being up at the top of the ridge around Lake Tahoe and looking down at the lake and seeing the lights and people. You know I'm like they're watching movies and eating popcorn and getting ready for bed and why I'm out here, right. But now when I go to Tahoe, I look up at that Ridge and I have this thirst. I'm like, ooh, I want to be back out there.
Lisa Danylchuk:You know, maybe I'll sign up for that race again. And it's so interesting because it is hard, right. There's no way around running any amount of distance depending on you know your genetics and your training and all that like. It's going to be challenging, it's going to. There's going to be moments where you're like, why am I doing this? But then you know you finish the 240 and you sign up for the 300. So do you have a sense of what that is for you, that that thirst or that connection or that wanting to get back out there? I know it's five days out from your 300 mile race, so you might not be really connected to this feeling right now, and that's okay.
Lucja Leonard:Yeah, well, I was thinking about it when I was out there because, like before the race, I really I don't know, I want to get to that point of suffering for some strange reason, like getting to that point where you're questioning all your life's decisions as to why you are now currently out here in this situation, and I want to feel that pain. I want to be broken down Like I want to be vulnerable. And I want to feel that pain. I want to be broken down like I want to be vulnerable and I want to come into a checkpoint, absolutely broken and in tears, and rebuild. And it's like I really love that process of almost like a rebirth while you're out there, because you get broken down to your bare, absolute bare bones and then you have to rebuild yourself.
Lucja Leonard:And it was funny to hear my friends actually say who were crewing me. They said during the race they sort of saw me go through this process and towards the last hundred miles, I was just like so chilled, nothing could phase me, like I was just so zen about everything and it was like, yeah, I'd, I'd reached, I'd gone into the hole, I'd come back out and yeah, yeah, I think for me it was like beforehand, it's like I want to get to that point. When you hit that point, it's so horrible that you just want to get out of it. But there's no way to get out of it apart from going through it, unless, of course, you quit, which is not an option. Yeah, and yeah, I think for me it really is. I just love how it makes me feel afterwards as well, just that whole feeling of accomplishment and taking on the world, and I think it just really balances me out, like I feel like I'm less stressed now, you know, because life stresses just get in the way and this has a real way of just cleansing, I guess, and, yeah, rebalancing you back to like an equilibrium and ready to move on again.
Lucja Leonard:Yeah, and I find that every time after a race, like no matter how brutal it is, it just knocks you down and then you come back and you're refreshed and you're like a new person, like a butterfly. You know it's. Yeah, I think it's just fantastic and yeah, for me it's really helped me just overcome everything, uh, in terms of my confidence and, you know, body image issues and and all of that, and yeah, I just find that it just helps propel me forward every time. So, yeah, I just love getting to that point of the suffering, which is strange, but I think it's because we don't. You know I'm very privileged, I have a good life. I'm not in. You know I'm very privileged, I have a good life. I'm not in a life where I'm suffering, I have good health. You know, I have a good partner, we're comfortable. But you know there's something about having to suffer that, you know, I think is part of a human nature that we need that to move forward.
Lucja Leonard:So yeah, if you're not getting that in day-to-day life. I think a lot of us go seeking for it, which is why you know there was 330 people that signed up for this race, because we're all crazy and all want to try this out.
Lisa Danylchuk:So yeah, there's so much in what you're saying, that soul cleansing element of it. I can relate to that and I remember feeling like there was this containment of well when I'm out on the trail. I also don't have to deal with the stressors of daily life. I just need to focus on hydration and food and one foot in front of the other and enjoying the landscape and talking to people or listening to music or doing whatever I was doing to, ideally for me, enjoy it. So I have a little bit of a different perspective. I think I wasn't seeking the suffering so much, but I was like um, definitely relate to that cleansing element of it and also accepting the hard parts and not know like working with the hard parts. Well, how do I relate to that? Do I think, oh, it's hard at mile 30, which means I'm not going to finish 50 miles? No, like, oh, it's hard right now, what do I need? Let me give myself that and then keep going Right.
Lisa Danylchuk:And so I'm curious for you, and a lot of times on this show we talk about trauma and recovery and that rebuilding, and you were just talking about that rebuilding on the trail. So I'm wondering what, once you hit that point where it's suffering and it's hard and part of you maybe wants to quit. There's one thing you said which is quitting is not an option, and I think having that really strong within you matters right when you really want to finish the race. It's different than like, oh, I'm just going out, we'll see what happens. And there are times Dion and I talked about this too there are times to call it like it's not this priority today. But when you are committed and you're in it and you hit that low, what are some of the things you find that help you through that? To the other zen side for the I love this last hundred miles of the race, like you're just coasting in, right, just coasting in those last hundo. No, deal?
Lucja Leonard:well, I think it'll. It changes, I think, every race, uh, that you do as well. But you know, for this race in particular, I had four amazing women that came to support me. Um, you know, they'd taken time off work, they'd made their own way to the race as well. So, for me, um, you know, I couldn't quit for them either. You know they were there for the whole week, so it's like I have to do it for them as well. So, yeah, it's having that in the back of your mind.
Lucja Leonard:At times, they would also read out some messages that people had been sending on Instagram. I had, like, one of my friends is a teacher and her class had sent a video cheering me on and they had posters and everything. And, you know, I'm just like I can't let down a group of kids in a classroom, like that's just, that would be so wrong. Like these kids are being inspired by seeing what I'm doing. So I have to show them that I'm stronger than that. So, yeah, I have to just carry on and I think sometimes you have to just let out your emotions.
Lucja Leonard:Like it was probably, yes, we did 120, 130 miles in and we'd climbed Mount Lemon, which was like a 7,000 foot climb and it was in the heat of the sun. It was like baking hot but also freezing cold at the same time, because there was this really cold wind coming through and there was snow on the ground. But I was like cooking and I was in thermals but I'm cold and I'm just like so tired and the checkpoint was just not coming and then when it finally did come, like I just burst into tears. I was just like so spent emotionally from getting up that climb and then it was just having to to from there. It was like, okay, now you're ruined, so to speak. It's like just, let's sit down, let's cool down, let's eat some food, drink some drink. And then I had all my friends like telling me how amazing I was doing. And you know, suddenly you're just like okay, I'm good again, half an hour later you're like okay, let's go, let's do this next section. Later you're like okay, let's go, let's do this next section.
Lucja Leonard:Um, and yeah, it's kind of funny how you can actually rebuild and recover on the way, because you actually get to a point where you think I'm so broken like I'm going to stay like this now for the next 200 miles, and it's like, actually you're not, you're going through waves. It's like you said, at 30 miles you might be broken, thinking oh, I can never get to 50. But then suddenly you back up and then, yeah, if you go further, it's like, yeah, you go down again and then you go back up. So, yeah, it is really about just trying to rebuild along the way and recover and overcome as you're through it.
Lucja Leonard:So, and I guess that's a bit like life. You know, when you are in the situation it's like there's no, it's not normally an endpoint to what you're going through. You know, when you are in the situation it's like there's no, it's not normally an end point to what you're going through. You know, whether that's stress or trauma or whatever, it kind of gradually changes and improves and then it may lessen again and improve again, but it is just a roller coaster all the time. So yeah, I think ultra running is really just life, but just in a shortened space of time, concentrated life, right, yeah, exactly Concentrated into a few days time.
Lisa Danylchuk:But, yeah, all the ups and downs are there. And you mentioned social accountability having people that know what you're doing and know about the goal and who are inspired with you. For you, who you don't want to let down right, that keeps you going with you. For you, who you don't want to let down right, that keeps you going. But also this element of getting through something really hard, being very broken down and then rebuilding and taking that moment. Okay, I'm going to eat. I'm going to you have the checkpoint. I'm going to eat. I'm going to drink. I'm going to talk to my friends. Oh, look, I have some energy.
Lisa Danylchuk:And I think, just like you were saying, in life, when we're going through a really hard time, it can feel like it's going to last forever. And you can think, oh, if I'm at mile 120, well, I've got another 180 miles to go. I'm 20 years old. If I live to be 90, the rest of my life is going to be tortured, right, like we do. These narratives where we think, especially when we're at our most challenging points, that those feelings are going to endure forever. Right, and, and that's not necessarily the truth, and sometimes, if we get that break and get some nourishment, some encouragement, some genuine support and connection, it's like, oh, I actually do feel different or get some.
Lisa Danylchuk:I know, in this case, in ultra running, you don't always get this, but get some good sleep right, like even a micro nap on an ultra trail can be huge. I've heard people say they slept for 10 seconds. It felt like 10 hours right. So there are ways that we can take what we need, continue on, and it doesn't mean that, oh, now that I went to this rest stop, I feel a hundred percent. I'm 120. Like it's still effort and it's still hard, but that's very much like life. There's always something Right and I think our minds can be like we want it to be perfect. Right, it's gotta be perfect and everything has to flow together. It's like, well, maybe just continue on and ride the wave. So that sounds like one of those life lessons that can come out of doing something wild like this.
Lucja Leonard:Yeah, and if everything was perfect. Like you know, I think about a few other races that I've done that have gone without any hiccups or you know, and probably talking shorter races, but they're not memorable. You know, the races you remember are the ones that have the tough moments, and it's a bit like life as well If there weren't tough moments, you're not going to enjoy the good moments either. So, yeah, I think it's important to have that contrast as well.
Lisa Danylchuk:So, as much as it hurts at the time, and there's something about being there for all of it, like not resisting. Suffering is a part of life. I know that's like in some religions or Buddhism it's a tenant of it. Right, like this is part of living. We resist that. We can narrow our scope, so then we're not really feeling anything that much anymore. So it sounds like for this race you really dove right in right. You've got the full vicissitudes of life, between the oh my God, I'm really broken down and then to where you are now of just feeling accomplished and being able to rest after and celebrate and share that accomplishment. How did the classroom react when they knew that you finished? Have you seen anything?
Lucja Leonard:No, I have spoken to my friend and yeah, they were super excited they were following the dot. Every morning they'd come in, they'd check in online and, yeah, follow my dots. So they were super excited to see me finish. So, yeah, that's great.
Lisa Danylchuk:And did you sleep at all on the trail? Did you get any?
Lucja Leonard:rest. I probably had about I want to say about three and a half to four hours sleep over the four nights. So I probably had three, one hour sleeps in the back of the car. So that felt like heaven. And yeah, I had a couple of trail naps where, it's quite funny, one of my friends videoed me getting down for a trail nap and I just saw some grass and I just dumped myself in there and it was really spiky grass. But to me I was just like that looks so comfortable. I'm just I'm in there and she's like before you can even say I'll set the timer for two minutes. I was already snoring. So yeah, it was. It's amazing how you can sleep anywhere, Like I'm normally a really light sleeper and I need the right pillow, I need the right temperature. Yet get me on a trail and I'm sleep deprived. I'm like I will sleep on cactuses. I'm just like.
Lisa Danylchuk:Oh, this is so good. That's amazing. I remember in the middle of the night, that's amazing. I remember in the middle of the night, the first hundred miler. I attempted and I was hearing coyotes howl. It's like, oh, coyotes, soft fur, they sound so snuggly. Maybe if I see some I can curl up with them. It's like you get a little delusional at points too. Ooh, that would be nice. I could just curl up with coyotes before I run another 40 miles.
Lucja Leonard:Exactly yeah, we heard some of them calling out and my friend who was pacing me told me later she was absolutely shitting herself, thinking we were going to get attacked by coyotes, and I was just like, oh, it's such a nice melody.
Lisa Danylchuk:It sounds so pretty and your friend's like, which just goes to show we can have very different experiences of the same stimuli. Right Like's so soothing, oh my god, that's terrifying. So how did you initially get into trail running? You mentioned that you didn't grow up really, you know, into sports, getting notes to get out of sports in class and things like that. How did this start with you?
Lucja Leonard:well, I'd gotten myself a little overweight. So at one point I was shopping for clothes and had to go nearly to the big girl's shop which you know talking 20 odd years ago they didn't have all the sizes in the shops. You had to shop in a separate shop. So yeah, that kind of hit home to me. I was like I need to do something about it. So I started going to the gym and just you know, watching what I was eating, like just being a bit healthier, and started to lose some weight and started to go out for you know little run, walk scenarios and thought I would sign up for a 10K race and you know, went along and did that. It was a road race and I was so nervous and was worried about coming dead last or not finishing, but I had like so much fun because everyone was so nervous and was worried about coming dead last or not finishing, but I had like so much fun because everyone was so buzzy and full of energy. And yeah, from there I just kind of started entering some half marathons and slowly but surely I started meeting some people who ran on the trails, who invited me to go out with them and you know, I just remember some of those first ones, I just had no idea what I was doing. Even simply hiking up a mountain with some of my friends, you know, I'd just go in shorts and a shirt and they'd be like, oh, have you got a jacket and gloves? Because you know we're going up 3000 feet and it's like, oh no, what do I need that for? So you know, I learned the hard way as well as to what you need to take and you know I just really enjoyed being out there. And you know, just entering my first ultramarathon was actually through Dion, my husband. He bought me a book for my birthday, which was a coffee table book of the world's toughest endurance challenges. And this was after I'd been running a few marathons and things. And he'd said you know, open the book up and the first thing your finger falls upon, we'll go and do Because my birthday is right before Christmas. So it was like that was your birthday present, your Christmas present is whatever you choose.
Lucja Leonard:So, yeah, that ended up being the Kalahari Extreme Marathon in South Africa, which was a multi-stage race over a week, so six stages, and you're basically running a marathon a day and one day you run two marathons. So 50 mile day and, to make it even harder, it's fully self-sufficient. So you're carrying a pack with all your food and kit to survive the week. So breakfast, lunch and dinner for seven days, sleeping bag, sleeping mat, change your clothes, so you know your bag's about 20 to 30 pounds as well, and the only thing the race gives you is water along the way, kind of every 10K, and at nighttime they'd give you like a bit of tarpaulin to sleep under out in the wild. So, yeah, it was.
Lucja Leonard:We went out there, having no idea what we were doing, just kind of got kitted out by some ultra running store and went out there and you know, we just had the most amazing experience, like the people that you run with, like connecting with these people that are all out there doing the same thing, becoming like family and running with like giraffes running beside you and springbok, and then seeing baboons, and oh, it was just like, it was just mind-blowing, like I'd never had that kind of adventure before and yeah, to me it really felt like an adventure. Um, crossing that finish line was just amazing and I'd actually come second female at my first ever race. So I was like, oh my god, maybe I'm actually okay at this stuff. Maybe longer distance is more my thing. You know, I'm not a fast runner and yeah, kind of from there it just sparked this interest in going to sign up.
Lucja Leonard:For I've always been excited by whatever has a high DNF rate. Yes, so I do not finish right. If I hear a race that's tough, I'm like, oh, I want to do that. So yeah, and even if that means I might not finish, it's kind of like a okay, I might not finish the first time, but I'm going to go back and do it again until I finish it. So, yeah, I really like the hard stuff and yeah, that kind of just developed this love for ultra running and trails. So, yeah, kind of turned into this mountain goat and really love the mountains.
Lisa Danylchuk:I have to ask do you feel interested by Barkley Marathon? For those who don't know Barkley Marathon, it's like it's basically a scramble through the brambles, like it has all these, all this culture around it but it's off the. You know you have to navigate yourself, you have to people often DNF that. So I'm just curious if that's something that calls to you Cause, cause I personally have my limits. I'm like I like the hard stuff and then no, not that, though.
Lucja Leonard:Yeah, no, that just seems like pure torture. Yeah Right, exactly, okay. I mean, I like to have type two fun and I don't think that that's. You know, that's going to be type three and above. Yeah, I don't think there's any fun in that race at all and it's purely like it's not running. It needs so much navigation. It's like I don't mind a bit of simple navigation, but yeah, that race is not for me. I mean, there's only been one female finisher, so guaranteed to DNF and yeah, no so I think this year there were no finishers across the board.
Lisa Danylchuk:Right, it's so. Yeah, and hats off to people who attempt, who want to and attempt that, and to Jasmine Perez for finishing that. That was incredible. I have those pictures, I think by Howie Stern, just etched in my mind, right, like, oh, what an accomplishment. But, yeah, you have to want it. And that moment when you open the book and your finger lands on this race in did you say it was in South Africa? Yeah, your finger lands on this race in South Africa and it's multi-marathons. That's very different than a half marathon, right, that's very different than something you show up in the morning. You get a good oh, I got a great start to my weekend here. Right, this is multiple days. It's an adventure. I'm wondering. There's a moment there where you decided, and you committed to it, where you could have gone oh, let's turn the page again. Or you could have gone, oh, that's nice, let's do something else. Let's go to Barbados and sit on the beach instead. What do you feel like it was in you that really committed to that race and went through with it.
Lucja Leonard:Yeah, I don't know if it was maybe like some sort of sense of adventure and also a sense of proving that I can do hard things, like I consider myself I'm quite a soft person, like I love my creature comforts, and you know, I think, yeah, just reading about it and wondering, can I put myself out there and do something like this? You know they're tough races. You hear people die doing some of these races. It can be really dangerous and I think that really called to me in a way of just excitement and adventure. And, yeah, I think it was me coming out of my shell and I've never, like, pushed myself to those sorts of limits before. You know, always been very softly, softly, and I think, yeah, doing that also combined at the time with, you know, my career kind of taking off as well, because that built confidence which then comes into your everyday life as well. And, yeah, I think it was I don't know something just sparked in me just thinking, wow, like could you imagine, like could I ever really could I, the fat girl, do that?
Lucja Leonard:Like, really, it's just yeah, I think it was just that whole thought of maybe I could like, maybe I should give it a try. Yeah, that was it really.
Lisa Danylchuk:I'm curious about that confidence and your journey with it. How do you feel like the experiences on the trail shape your sense of self and maybe your belief in yourself, your self-esteem, your sense of confidence?
Lucja Leonard:of you know faking it till you make it. It's like when you go to these races you have to have some sort of confidence to to make it to the end. And you know, to begin with I didn't have that confidence and I would just pretend that I had the confidence. And every time I turn up at a start line, like I'd look around me, I'd be like, oh my God, I'm so out of my depth. Like everyone looks so fit and so experienced and there's me. What am I doing here? Just imposter syndrome at its worst.
Lucja Leonard:And I think, just every race that I finished I just started to believe more in myself.
Lucja Leonard:And you know I'm not just finishing these races, I'm not coding, I'm not on the podium by any stretch normally, but you know I'm not on the podium by any stretch normally, but you know I'm normally in the sort of top third.
Lucja Leonard:So for me that's like that's really good, like you're not back of the pack, You're like a solid middle of the pack, edging towards the front there, and you're just this girl from way back when who didn't even like sports. And I think every time I achieved these things it just was another building block of confidence. And you know the problem solving you have to do along the way to get through these races and you know coming back and rebuilding and changing your training to make yourself stronger and learning more about yourself, and I really feel like I've become so in tune with my body. You know whether that's just day to day or it's out in a race, but I really understand what's going on with my body and, yeah, it just it's just built me up to be really confident and happy with myself. So, yeah, it's taken years, though, but years and a lot of miles.
Lisa Danylchuk:Yeah.
Lucja Leonard:Yeah, and it's a slow progression, isn't it? And even sometimes I catch myself and I'll see like a reflection of myself in a mirror or walking past a shop. I'm like, oh wow, she looks like a runner. So oh, that's me. Yeah, I look like a runner.
Lisa Danylchuk:So you've mentioned weight management through movement and diet and exercise, which just a healthy lifestyle is so important for all of us. And then there's this edge also of body positivity, of like being proud of that you're strong, right? So I'm just hearing that edge of and I'm thinking about it. For so many people it's like how do I encourage myself to make choices that maybe are hard and maybe have a growing edge, without that being a point of shame against my body? Do you get what I'm trying to articulate here?
Lisa Danylchuk:There's something in there about doing something healthy and getting strong and being proud and being proud of your body and connected to your body, while letting go of that 80s, 90s and it perpetuates, right. But that toxic influence of this is what a body looks like and this is a good looking body, and this is a quote, unquote pretty woman, or this is right, all these different messages we get that are so deeply ingrained in our culture. How do you feel like running has helped you tease that out and come to a place of? You know it's always dynamic, it's always ongoing, but come to a place of feeling good in your skin?
Lucja Leonard:Yeah, well, I think in the whole running community, and particularly trail running more so than road running. But when you're out there you're surrounded by all different body shapes and different abilities, different ages, different ethnicities, like, and I think that really is a balancing thing. You could be at the start line and I'll be looking at someone thinking, oh wow, they're super strong, super skinny, they're going to be ahead of me and then they'll end up finishing hours behind me and you start to think well, actually, the fact that I have some fat on my body and I'm a bit bigger is actually good in the endurance world because I've got something to draw on when I'm out there for 100 miles plus, like I'm drawing on reserves that other people don't have. So you know, I always like to think you know the first 100 miles I might be back a fair way. But then I start to come through the field because I'm just like a locomotive, I just keep going. I think for me that's really built that up in my head and you know, as you're going through the race and you're sitting there with other people and running with other people and you're seeing all their different shapes and sizes, and we're all strong people and it doesn't matter what size you are when you're out there. And, yeah, I think that's really helped in balancing that as well.
Lucja Leonard:And being out there and knowing that you have to eat, you have to drink, like there's no, you can't restrict things.
Lucja Leonard:And you know, even in the training side of things, like I used to go out for 20 mile runs and try not to eat because it's like, well, then I can burn more calories, right Whereas now it's thinking, no, you have to eat because you need to do the second 10 miles as a good training run, like the first 10 miles, and you can't do that if you don't eat.
Lucja Leonard:So, yeah, it's having that whole mind shift into you know, food is good for the body and just, yeah, having that all around you, I think. Just all the different shapes and sizes, because, yes, you can be skinny and strong as well, but you can be big and strong as well. But you can be big and strong as well and everything in between, like everything's okay, whereas, yeah, I think the media like to project one certain body type, yeah, whereas now it seems to be opening up. Especially, I just find in ultra running, it's so open with everything that it yeah, I just find that really welcoming and really encouraging as well. So yeah, that really welcoming and really encouraging as well. So yeah, ultra running the community.
Lisa Danylchuk:I think, maybe because people have been out on the trail and done the digging that you're talking about within themselves and found those difficult edges and seen just how you figure out how you relate to yourself and how you relate to support and and I think, doing some of that work you know it's not sitting on a therapy couch, but it's very effective for getting to know yourself right.
Lisa Danylchuk:It's a wonderful way to self-reflect and learn and I think people do across the board feel so much more welcoming and open and supportive and I know that's even explicit in some communities. They're really working to be increasingly inclusive and like encourage people to come out and like look at this, this amazing nature you can be a part of. Look at this amazing experience you can be a part of. Whether you're hiking it or running it, whether you're on still places, you can just celebrate the experience of nature, of being together, of being out, of doing something hard, of doing something fun and getting to know each other in the process. I feel like the trail running community is beautiful in that way.
Lucja Leonard:Yeah, and I think that's the thing with the competition Like you're really just competing against yourself, competition like you're really just competing against yourself.
Lucja Leonard:And you know, apart from the few that are going for the podium spots, that's really what we're doing out there is we're competing against our own beliefs and our own perceptions of what's possible, and yeah, so I think, yeah, it's a great way to get to know yourself.
Lucja Leonard:I mean, you just touched on that briefly, but you know, when you're out there and you get to that really low point, it's the time where you really uncover who you are as a person. And you know, sometimes you might not like what you see out there. And that's when you go back to your normal life and you think, right, that's where I need to make some changes. You know, like you know, I try to run with joy and be happy and friendly out there, and you know, sometimes you think, gosh, you know when I'm really down, am I being that good person out there? Am I making the right decisions and being kind to others? When I'm in that low place, and I think it's a really, yeah, really sort of touching place to get to where you can actually see yourself for who you truly are, and and yeah, see if that needs changing Whole scope, right?
Lisa Danylchuk:The whole scope of how we behave and how we interact with other people. I mean, I've walked by people and I try to say hi a lot of the times, or smile. I'm out there and sometimes someone's just in a really grumpy space. I try to remember like I've been there, I've definitely been there where, whether it's low blood sugar, I've just been out a long time or I'm working through something deep, like there are times where someone says hi to me and I can barely manage a grunt, or an odd or whatever, or times where maybe I was so deep I didn't even notice, or that's probably happened, I don't know because I didn't notice then.
Lisa Danylchuk:But I try to give the benefit of the doubt to to other folks, and I think that's a part of that empathy that weaves into the community. As people are like oh, I've been there too, I can identify with that low. I'm no longer judging people who are even grumpy or snappy, right, because they're like oh yeah, I've been there, let's get you some food. Exactly, and I think relationship to food is such a big thing. I mean, as a therapist, I think a lot about with addictions. People can cut things out. If you're addicted to certain substances, even certain relationship dynamics, you can set a firm boundary and say like well, I don't do that anymore. We can't do that with food, right, if someone has like a relationship with food that feels like it's negative or it's, you know, going into eating disorder territory, we can't just be like, no, well, I just don't do food, I do, I do breathing. I mean, I guess breathitarians I've heard of before. I don't know how long they live, but as a rule we need food and water to stay alive. And so, working through your relationship to food.
Lisa Danylchuk:I've found that to be really interesting in the trail community too, and just like in health and wellness, there's trends, right, and I see right now trending more towards hey, fuel yourself, right.
Lisa Danylchuk:Hey, you need food while you're out there, not just for energy on the trail, but also for recovery and repair, like if you're really trying to get better and not just burn calories, as you mentioned. If you're really trying to get better, then you need that fuel to rebuild while you're out there, to rebuild after. And that's really interesting. And there was this moment when I was training this was when I was still at the half marathon stage of my running journey where something clicked in my brain and I wouldn't have ever thought that it hadn't clicked before. I would have told you no, food is energy. I get that thought that it hadn't clicked before. I would have told you, no, like, food is energy, I get that. But I was like, oh I, the food is energy. Like it just clicked in a deeper way I can't describe it better than that where I was like, wow, exactly what I put in is impacting what I can bring out, and I've had that even recently.
Lisa Danylchuk:Again, right, we relearn these things millions of times my daughter for two years now and being like I don't think I'm getting enough food. I'm getting super grumpy. This feels like a trail run when I need a gel, like, okay, I, probably this was like last week. I'm not even kidding where I'm like I need to fuel myself better. I'm, you know, having protein shakes or chia packs or eating the rest of my daughter's food Like that doesn't count as breakfast, or eating the rest of my daughter's food Like that doesn't count as breakfast. So how am I going to actually fuel myself? I think that's a beautiful conversation that can come out of trail running, where, in relationship to body image and body positivity, it's also just like having that relationship to food. That's like what's really intuitively too. What's going to fuel me? What do I go up to an aid station when they have more than water?
Lucja Leonard:When.
Lisa Danylchuk:I go to an aid station and I see something and it just looks like the right thing. How do I learn how to trust that? How do I learn the boundaries around what's really not good for me even when it does look good? So there's so much nuance to it, right In terms of just getting to know yourself and refining that essential element of life Like how do I have energy? Right, I have energy to do the things I want to do.
Lucja Leonard:Yeah, and also like I think it's dangerous to think of food as just fuel Cause I think that's coming out a little bit now as well, that it's like, well, it is just fuel. You know, I just eat to get fuel and it's like, but it should also be a source of enjoyment. You know, like I've loved nothing better than coming home and Dion had got me this amazing celebration cake and you know, eating like slab after slab of this cake has been absolutely divine. And, you know, going out, we had a celebration lunch with my friends and it was just, you know, also just having food to enjoy and as part of you know, connecting with people. And you know, building relationships over, and you know, building relationships over food, I think, is also just so important. And, yeah, I think a lot of that's missed these days as well, because, yeah, everyone's like rushing around or they're on their phones or they're, you know, worried about how much they're eating. It's like, no, you've got to live life as well.
Lisa Danylchuk:Like, go out and have the meals, go out and eat the ice cream, like it's all, all part of it, you know, makes you happy, things that you enjoy, like really giving yourself the things you enjoy and I've heard people coming out of eating disorders saying that too of like, oh wait, this isn't just a measurement Right. And even as athletes, even if we're, we can go in that direction of like and I don't do this so much myself, but I see it around where it's like this many grams of this and that many grams of that, just choke it back, even if you don't like it, and I'm like no, no, I got to want it. There was a season I was training for Boston Marathon. I just wanted lemon. I was like lemonade lemon, I'll just just go with it. Like you need the energy, find it in a form that you enjoy and then you have a celebratory cake right. Social and cultural elements of food, like I think we can. We can get far away from that when we get too scientific about it.
Lucja Leonard:Right, yeah, exactly. And there's nothing better than, like some of my paces would have a surprise snack on the trail for me, like you know, a little chocolate bar or something that just like yay, that's something I didn't have. Great, I'll eat that.
Lisa Danylchuk:Something novel, right? Something that's a gift, that's a treat. Yes, so trail running has become such a part of your life. Right, dion's an ultra marathoner. He met Gobi out on the trail, who's a part of your family. You're coaching as well. How is that for you as a family? It seems like it's pretty integrated into your lifestyle to be doing events and to be challenging yourselves in these.
Lucja Leonard:I mean, it's great to have a partner that understands as well.
Lucja Leonard:You know, I've worked I've got friends and worked with clients as well where their partners don't support them, and you know it. Just it's so hard when they don't understand what you're going through, what you need to go through to get these races done as well. So, yeah, that's become really important and we both understand from each other like you need to get out to get this training done, and you know it's about making time for that as well and making each other go out and do the training. You know, because sometimes you're on different schedules, like at at the moment, I'm relaxing, but Dion's out doing a 15 mile run right now and he needs to go and do that, and he already missed it on Saturday because I wanted to have Bloody Marys for breakfast, and so it's like you can't sabotage each other because of you know you're going through a different process. So it's about supporting each other in that as well. And yeah, I think that's really important to understand that. And if your partner's not into it, you know it's trying to maybe get them to come along and see what happens at these races, to understand how deep you're having to dig as well and why the training is so important. And yeah, but it has definitely become. You know it's part of our lives and I guess it will be for a long time to come yet, but yeah, I think it's a healthy thing as well. I love going out for runs with Dion as well, so it means we can share in it together. You know, being fit and healthy when you go somewhere, you can go and climb a mountain and look at the views, and it doesn't always have to be about running, but I think by doing the running we're fit and healthy. That enables us to go and do some other experiences that you might not do if we were still back where we were smoking and drinking too much, that you wouldn't have those experiences. So, yeah, I think it's lovely to have that as part of our life and coaching people as well.
Lucja Leonard:I actually coached a guy called Travis who also finished the Arizona Monster yeah, so that was amazing. Like the feeling of yeah, just accomplishment from getting him across the line is also something else. You know he'd never he'd DNF Moab the year before at 67 miles, never run a hundred miles before picked up coaching with me in December and it might have been November got him doing 100 miles in January and then just coached him through until now and, yeah, he finished as well. So, yeah, he had an amazing time and he can tick that box that he's done it.
Lucja Leonard:So, yeah, I think, getting people across that line as well not just myself, but that's also amazing. I got to share a few miles with them out there as well, so we ran together for a bit and, yeah, that that is also amazing. I love seeing other people accomplish these ultras as well and and seeing what they're capable of. You know, I've coached a few people and there's one lady in particular from Scotland. She came to me for a 50k like probably six, seven years ago, and you know, since then she's now run 100 miles and a multi-stage race and you know it's like, well, what's?
Lisa Danylchuk:next, can I get her?
Lucja Leonard:to do 200, but it's you know, she's just just surpassed everything she ever thought was possible as well. And yeah, I love working with people and sharing that knowledge with them as well, because so much of it isn't just the training you know, you know what you need to do to run 100 miles. You just got to do the training and you can get a plan offline that will get you to the finish but it's understanding all those other nuances of you know the mental side of the whole sport. So, yeah, I love sharing that with people and, yeah, trying to help them understand what sort of obstacles they're going to be facing out there as well. And, yeah, hopefully my knowledge and my mistakes help them make less mistakes and get to the finish as well.
Lisa Danylchuk:Yeah, and the emotional support and the personal experience, like AI will never have that.
Lisa Danylchuk:Exactly AI doesn't know what it's like to get to the top of Mount Lemon at the night and feel broken. It might, but it doesn't. Well, congratulations to Travis, to all the people you've been coaching, who have made it through these tough things, and I'm like sign me up. I actually have a. There's just a 50K. Since I've come back from maternity leave, the longest I've done has been a 30K so far. There's a 50K that's on my radar that I haven't signed up for yet.
Lisa Danylchuk:I feel like after this conversation, I will go on the website and be like okay, sign up, got these bridges through the Alps. Oof, that's the thing I want to and that's the thing I'm curious about. I've never had that before. Oof, that's the thing I want to and that's the thing I'm curious about. I've never had that before. I honestly I want to do the a hundred miler. I just don't know, honestly, if it's the right thing for my body right now, because I'm still working through some postpartum niggles that I'm like am I going to just hurt myself? Cause I don't want to do that? So it's, you know, no-transcript.
Lucja Leonard:No, not touch wood, not injuries. I've been very lucky with that. The worst I did was actually strained my groin last year doing Rio de Lago 100. Yeah, yeah, I had to take a few weeks off and, yeah, just kind of rehab that. But touch wood, that that's kind of the biggest injury I had. I guess the worst thing I've had to overcome was um.
Lucja Leonard:I had COVID a couple of times um, back in 21, 22, and I remember going to Tahoe 200 in 2022 to run that and I'd had COVID just six weeks before and I must have been experiencing some sort of long COVID and you know, dion had said to me you probably shouldn't go to this race. You know you're not breathing well, you're not feeling well, I'm like, no, I'm fine, I'm going to go do it. And yeah, going there, and then DNFing was proving right, I shouldn't have gone. And yeah, having to overcome that. It took me like probably 18 months to get myself back on track, dnf'd another hundred in the meantime through having illness issues again, uh, arising from that.
Lucja Leonard:So for me it hasn't been injury, but it's actually been like health issues, um, and finally getting to that point where I've figured out what I need um. So, yeah, now I'm on vitamin B12 and vitamin D supplements and that seems to be my magic potion. As soon as I stopped taking them, I get sick again. So I'm like, right, that's me. For life I'm on those supplements. So I don't know what it is, but, yeah, that seems to work for me. So you found what you need yeah, yeah.
Lisa Danylchuk:So those are some of the challenging moments. What are some of your favorite?
Lucja Leonard:moments on the trail. Well, favorite moments, wow, seeing sunrises. I love sunrises. I get really bad sleepies at around three or four in the morning and then when the sun comes up, just it just feels like such a rejuvenation, like it's such a new day, and just the way the light falls on the earth, like it, just you know. You just have to stand there sometimes and just look around, and the same with sunsets. I mean, they're just so magical when you're out in the middle of nowhere as well, just some random spot in a trail, um. So yeah, definite highlights are things like that and highlights of, you know, generosity of people as well. Um, I've had a couple of times in races where my head torch has failed and my backup batteries have failed and I'm in the dark with nothing and a runner will come past and I'm like, do you have a spare head torch? And yes, and they give it to me. I'm just like that's just amazing. What if they need that later on? But they're, you know just the simple, I don't know kindness of people, of helping you. I just think that that's magical.
Lucja Leonard:And even on the race that we just had, I was with my pacer and we were about to come into Oak Tree Aid Station. We're about four miles out, run out of water. So we're probably I don't know, I want to say 230 odd miles in. No, it's probably 250, actually it was closer so out of water it's 90 degrees. We're in exposed desert and we are literally dying. And she told me afterwards she was really panicking because it's like what are we going to do? We are out, we are literally dying. And she told me afterwards she was really panicking because it's like what are we going to do? We are out of water, there is no shade, there's no water sources.
Lucja Leonard:And then we saw this guy who was just picking up some trash from the trail because he threw hike the arizona trail last week. And he saw us and he was like would you girls, do you girls need some water? We're like yes, do you have some? And he gave us like one bottle that he had on him and we just like downed it, like it was so thirsty. And he was like do you want more? Like my car is literally just parked just out of this trail a bit. I could go get you some water. We're like, yes, please.
Lucja Leonard:And he brought us like three liters of water and topped us up and, oh, amazing trail angel, and it's like just that time and place, like had we been a bit quicker we would have missed him, had we been a bit slower we would have missed him, and it was like it was meant to be. You know that he was there at that precise moment that we needed him and was willing to help. Uh, yeah, just those moments I really love, because you know there's so much inhumanity out there in the world at the moment and hate and fighting, and and then you get out on these trails and everyone's just loving each other and helping each other and yeah, I think they're all. My favorite moments is is that? And obviously crossing the finish line. I mean that is an amazing feeling.
Lisa Danylchuk:Crossing the finish line and then being out there and having those moments of magic, having those moments of connection, feeling like, oh, we're supporting each other through really hard things. Again, that's life right To be able to have someone by your side to joke with, or have someone that's willing and able to give you their head torch or to get you some water. I feel like so often, humans are wired to want to help each other right, and we can forget that. And then we meet people that are like I've got water in my car, do you want more? Sure, yeah, here you go, have it. Let me top you out. It's such a nice feeling to connect in that way, and often it's someone we've never seen before, we might never see again. And yet there's this moment of connecting with each other and of feeling supported in a really important way. We are dying out there.
Lucja Leonard:They don't want anything in return, like there's no, apart from a simple thank you. That's all is needed. And yeah, I think it can also be a lesson to take back to life, because a lot of the times I think people are scared to ask for help, or, you know, or they think that they're alone and it's like but if you just reach out, there are people there that want to help you. You just have to, sometimes, you know, put your ego aside or whatever it is that's stopping you from asking for help, and just ask for help. You don't have to do it alone, you know. Yeah, that's what I take from it anyway. You're not alone in anything. You just have to ask.
Lisa Danylchuk:Yeah that's such a lesson, so someone might be listening and thinking, oh, other people do this, right, other people do 300 mile races. That's not for me and it might be something different for each person like the challenging or crazy thing. But what would you say to someone who's listening, who's like, oh, I could never do that?
Lucja Leonard:Well, just try. You just don't know what you're capable of. Well, just try. You just don't know what you're capable of. And it might not be 300 miles. Your thing might be kayaking down a river or whatever. It might be rock climbing, cycling. It might be running 300 miles, but just give it a try. What's the worst that can happen is that you don't finish, or you have a horrible time and you realize it's not for you. Is that you don't finish, or you have a horrible time and you realize it's not for you, like, but it's all about just trying these things and having the experiences and, you know, just opening up, yeah, that that realm of possibility. So, yeah, I would just say, just give it a try, reach out and ask for some help and some guidance and, yeah, get in there and yeah, we'll see you at the start of the next 300 miles. Yes.
Lisa Danylchuk:I love that. What's next for you? It doesn't have to be a race, because you just finished something huge, but what's next for you? Is it a period of rest? Do you have your eyes on some other experience or something professionally?
Lucja Leonard:Well, I've got 100 miler in July, so I'm doing Cascade Crest 100, which is up near Seattle, and it's a Western States qualifier and a hard rock qualifier. So I'm going to hit two birds with one stone and then, stupidly, three weeks later I have a 215 mile race across Scotland. So, heading back to the UK to do the race across Scotland, which is really exciting for me because I started ultra running when I moved to Scotland. So I lived in Edinburgh for six, seven years. So, yeah, that's for me, I'm coming back full circle. I started there and now I'm going to come back and run across the country.
Lucja Leonard:Basically, so rest and relaxation now and then get back to building. This was all part of the process of building and now I know what I need to work on, which I probably knew beforehand. But you know, I want to get a little faster, get a little stronger. It's always those sorts of things. But, yeah, trying to build and be better for next time, and yeah, I think that's exciting. Yeah, and from a personal perspective, yeah, we're reapplying for our visa, so hoping that we can stay in the US a bit longer, and yeah, so working on all those things and just trying to keep the business going and, yeah, just excited about all of that. So we're going to have the summer in Tahoe, so that should be a good training ground.
Lisa Danylchuk:Yes, that's great training ground. Are you going to broken arrow by chance? No, no, that's at the end of June in Tahoe. We'll be there, my partner and I and my daughter. I already signed. This is like I'm already such a ultra running mom. I already signed up my daughter for the kids race but I'm like wait-listed. I'm like, oh, it doesn't matter what I do, as long as she gets in the kids race. Of course, that's the only one that doesn't sell out.
Lucja Leonard:But we'll be there the last, maybe I can. Uh, that's probably sold out, I guess, but um no.
Lisa Danylchuk:So you might like the triple crown, which is, uh, I think uh, vertical kilometer one day, 23 kilometer the next, or maybe a 46 the next day and then a 23 the next day. I mean that's like cake for you, that's like a morning jog. It's a great community. You might really love that. I'd love to see you guys If we end up at the same race.
Lisa Danylchuk:You mentioned a Western States and hard rock and I say my daughter's done all the kids races for both of those already, as well as UTMB. I can't believe I better not go in this direction too hard, but I was like we got to get her in the UTMB race. Yeah, she's done all of those under the age of two. I haven't done any well. I've done ETC at UTMB, the short one, and then you know mad respect for the longer ones, cause that was plenty. And, um, I haven't done Western States or hard rock, but I do have the interest in hard rock. I get it like that one. I would love to do. So if you do get the Western States hard rock qualifier and end up back out here or in Colorado, let us know because we might be there too. Yeah.
Lucja Leonard:Well, I'm a few years deep into applying, so hopefully my chances keep improving every year. So, yeah, wait and see. So yeah, latency. But yeah, maybe I'll see you at Broken Arrow then I'll have a look into that.
Lisa Danylchuk:Look it up and look up the triple crown. They also have an iron face one where you actually are climbing part of it. I don't know if that's your thing. That's kind of where I drew the line. I was like, oh, I'd like to be on my feet. I'm not really a climber, but you know we can have a look at that, and can you?
Lucja Leonard:tell us how is Gobi these days. She's good. She's good. She came out and saw me. Dion surprised me. I think it was about halfway. So, yeah, he came out and said hi, and I saw Gobi. So that was a real boost as well.
Lisa Danylchuk:And, yeah, she's doing good, so she's happy so if people want to connect with you and follow your journey, what is the best place to do that?
Lucja Leonard:Probably on Instagram. Running Dutchie on Instagram is kind of where I do most of my posting. I'm on Facebook and Tik TOK as well as running Dutchie, but yeah, instagram is my most used platform, for sure, so yeah.
Lisa Danylchuk:And do you often go out with Dion and Gobi to speak as well?
Lucja Leonard:Yes, yeah, so we do a lot of author visits at schools because we have a chapter book and a picture book, so yeah, we do lots of that, and we do corporate events and, yeah, public library events as well. So, yeah, and when we do the libraries, I talk as well, so we share a bit of both of our journey, so that's a really fun event for people to go along to when we do those and, yeah, and of course, gobi's there as well, so it's a whole family affair.
Lisa Danylchuk:Oh yeah, gobi's so famous, so famous, and so where should people? Is it at dionlenardcom, or do you have a Finding Gobi separate page if people are interested in that?
Lucja Leonard:Yeah, if you go to findinggobicom, we have an events page. So, yeah, we list any upcoming events there and, yeah, if anyone wants to book their own event, they could reach out. There's an email address on there and information about speaking events as well and a bit of a rough calendar as to where in the country we're going. We kind of, you know, bounce around everywhere. So, yeah, currently West Coast based and yeah, then we'll be heading back to the East Coast at some point too. I'll have to look up the Tahoe dates.
Lisa Danylchuk:Maybe those will overlap yeah.
Lucja Leonard:Well, trying to get a public event there. So yeah, and you and Dionne.
Lisa Danylchuk:Of course it's like having a baby right. Everyone's like how's the baby? You're like I'm fine. 're like I'm fine.
Lucja Leonard:Thanks, I'm tired yes, yes, I know, I get that well, lucia.
Lisa Danylchuk:Thank you so much for your time today. Congratulations on completing your first 300 mile race. That's amazing. Good luck all of your upcoming races. I do hope we get to meet in person sometime soon.
Lucja Leonard:That'd be really fun well, good luck and I hope you sign up to that 50 K.
Lisa Danylchuk:I know now I'm like maybe I should sign up for the a hundred miler, but I'm like you at the 3am time that's when I really questioned things I'm like I value sleep so much more now that I'm a parent too. So that was the thing that I was like you know what, maybe just a day, maybe something that's not overnight would be good for my body right now.
Lucja Leonard:Yeah Well, sometimes that's a nice, refreshing, good, hard challenge, but you get to go to bed Like that's something to be said for that sometimes as well.
Lisa Danylchuk:Eat a meal, take a shower, go to sleep oh, the bed never felt better. Yeah, well, wishing you lots of rest and celebration in the days to come, and congratulations again. Thanks for being here.
Lucja Leonard:Yeah, thank you so much.
Lisa Danylchuk:Thanks so much for listening. Now I'd love to hear from you what's one big goal you felt is too big to conquer or to even get started on. What bolsters your confidence in your body, in yourself, and how has your relationship to activity, food or your body evolved over time? Share your answers and what's been healing for you in the comments below on YouTube, or find me on Instagram at HowWeCanHeal. Don't forget to go to HowWeCanHeal. com to sign up for email updates as well. You'll also find additional trainings, tons of helpful resources and the full transcript of each and every show. If you love the show, please leave us a review on Apple, spotify, audible or wherever you get your podcasts. If you're watching on YouTube, be sure to like and subscribe and keep sharing the shows you love the most with all your friends. Visit HowWeCanHealcom backslash podcast to share your thoughts and ideas for the show. I always love hearing from you.
Lisa Danylchuk:Before we wrap up for today. I want to be clear that this podcast isn't offering prescriptions. It's not advice, nor is it any kind of mental health treatment or diagnosis. Your decisions are in your hands and I encourage you to consult with any healthcare professionals you may need to support you through your unique path of healing. Also, everyone's opinion here is their own and opinions can change. Guests share their thoughts, not that of the hosts or sponsors. I'd like to thank our guests today, everyone who helped support this podcast directly and indirectly, especially Alex. Thanks for taking care of the babe and the fur babies while I record. Last but never least, I'd like to give a special shout out to my big brother, Matt, who passed away in 2002. He wrote this music and it makes my heart so happy to share it with you here. Thank you.