Modern Masculinity, Vulnerability, And Men’s Leadership w/ Corey Baum | EP 199

Modern Masculinity, Vulnerability, And Men’s Leadership w/ Corey Baum | EP 199

What if the bravest thing a man can do is stop pretending he’s fine?

In this powerful new episode, we sit down with Corey Baum, founder of the Evolved Men Project, to talk about modern masculinity, men’s leadership, vulnerability, integrity, brotherhood, and fatherhood.

Corey shares the moments that changed everything—walking away from a successful tech career, the therapy that stripped away the mask, a divorce that demanded radical honesty, and the healing power of men sitting in honest circle together. We explore how men move from isolation and image to integrity, presence, and real connection.

👉 If this conversation resonated, please subscribe, leave a review, and share this episode with a friend who needs it. And if you’re ready to go deeper, connect with the Evolved Men community and start doing the work together.

Website - https://evolvedmenproject.com/
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I look forward to connecting with you Anita Mattu https://linktr.ee/AnitaMattu

Transcript

Meet Corey And His Mission

Corey Baum 2:13

Doing the work and start asking these same questions in a safe group of other men or in community or whatever it is, but uh but to start asking the questions and start showing up and start doing the work to be that example of what it should be and and you know Today on the show we've got Corey Baum, the founder of the Evolved Men Project and the host of the Evolved Men podcast.

Anita Mattu 2:43

Corey's work is all about helping men move beyond doing life alone, beyond numbing out, pretending they're fine and carrying everything by themselves. After hitting his own breaking point and rebuilding from the inside out, he's now on a mission to guide men into self-leadership, emotional courage, and real brotherhood through coaching, community, and deep conversations. He's helping men lead themselves, their families, and their relationships with more integrity and intention.

Corey Baum 3:28

Hey thanks, Anita, I appreciate it. Glad to be here.

Anita Mattu 3:32

Yeah, I'm really excited for this because I think it's a subject that can do with a lot more open conversations, definitely.

Corey Baum 3:41

Absolutely. Yeah, I think the world's not having enough of them, so the more that we can have the better.

Anita Mattu 3:47

Definitely. And so with that said, what is one of the most courageous things that you have done?

Corey Baum 3:53

Oh man. I gotta pick one.

Anita Mattu 3:57

Unfortunately. But hey, I'm happy to go with a couple.

Leaving Tech For Men’s Work

Corey Baum 4:02

Okay. Um, I think for me, as I as I think about it, it would probably be for me stepping in into this arena of men's work in general. Right. And it's an entire paradigm shift for me, right? There was no it's not something that that I would have seen myself 10 years ago getting into, right? So it really went from, you know, I've got a background in technology, uh, is really my my previous business. And so going from technology to um supporting men in these sort of spaces, right? It's stepping into that. It's not only because the nicest thing about it is not only I have to do the work first to a certain extent, right? And so, you know, when we talk about courage and and stepping into it and doing it, like it's not like I can just step into it and kind of fake it. Like, I have to kind of do the steps all along the way in order to show up and be kind of that image and that representation and and to feel good about it, right? To have integrity. And so I think at every step along the way, it's taken uh you know, it for for me, it feels like it's taken an immense amount of courage at many different times to to step into to whatever it might be at the moment. So yeah.

Anita Mattu 5:22

Yes, and that is definitely courageous because it's out of the comfort zone, it's dealing with the unknown as well. And men are not happy or don't like to show their emotions, and this is stuff that is really getting beneath the surface. It's really understanding that we can be whatever we want to be, or we can talk about things without feeling embarrassed. Um so yeah, I really look forward to the conversation we're going to have.

Corey Baum 5:54

Yeah, me too.

Anita Mattu 5:55

Yes. So can you shape the story of how the Evolved Men project started and what was the breaking down before this work really begun?

Surface Relationships And The Mask

Corey Baum 6:05

Yeah, absolutely. Um, you know, and and it's something I've been thinking a little bit about lately. I've I think community has always been at the core of who I am. It's one of my core values. It's something that I believe really strongly in. And so even before I felt that sense or that lack of connection and community with other men, I think foundationally it was something that was always at the core of who I was. And so um I I had been you I had been married up until about four years ago. And throughout that, you know, it was I had had a lot of surface level sort of relationship. And when I say relationship throughout the context of this show today, it's it's meaning two people. All right. So man, woman, two people, but friendships, that's a relationship. You know, with my wife or partner, that's a relationship. And so these relationships were very, were often very surface level, surface level, right? And and it's not necessarily, I mean, at times it was because I was showing up that way and they were showing up that way. And but that's that's who we knew to be. You know, that that often, at least from my experience, that and that's kind of how I grew up, is that especially as men, you you kept anything that was that you were struggling with, that was going on in your life, things that were hard, like vulnerabilities, things you were ashamed of. Like you didn't talk, you didn't talk to nobody about that stuff. And it it wasn't until um towards the end of my marriage where I really started getting into therapy for myself to really start discovering, and and it started for me really in wanting to be able to show up for both myself and my relationship. And I have two boys as well. Uh, and I I wanted to show up in a more authentic, genuine, and present way, right? And and what that kind of meant was that you know, I was leading a life of people pleasing and giving to get and secrets, and and just it it was I was afraid to have the conversations that were necessary with with anybody, right? Not only my my wife, but with friends, with anybody like and and as a result of that, I I felt like at the end of that that I was living a life of, you know, I was always carrying around this mask, right? Trying to be whoever anybody wanted me to be in that sort of moment. And so it was it was through therapy to begin with where I really started to um to open up and start to explore, you know, what it would look like to be a more authentic version of myself, to have those hard conversations, to face those those insecurities of myself. Um unfortunately, the the marriage didn't work out and we went our separate ways very very constructively, if if I can say, but we have a really good relationship now, thankfully. Um but I went from there and started working with men's groups after we divorced. And it was really into that where I really had my first opportunities to to share with other men uh and to hear as well that like these same sort of things that I'm struggling with, that I struggled with my entire life, or through my marriage, they're all struggling with it as well, right? Like I'm not this special snowflake that I'm the only one in the world with these concerns or these fears or these things that I'm ashamed of. And it just it just really opened me up to how much men are are struggling and suffering in silence, right? And and not only you know, it's not just about that it's it's multifaceted because it's there these weren't tools and skills that a lot of us were that were exhibited or shown to us as we grew up, right? So we're we're working with like a a short set of tools here to begin with, but on top of that, we've also got society that is reflecting back to us that we're less of a man if we're doing these sort of things, right? So it's just being reinforced over and over again, and it's leading to a place where men have fewer like connections and and deep connections, strong connections now than they ever have before. Um so leading kind of along the way to get back to your question, uh, you know, just seeing the profoundness that that has had in me and the need in the world for men to not only have a place to share these things, but to learn the skills, right? And to navigate the mindsets around some of these fears that are holding them back from from being a more authentic version of their self and leading themselves and their f their family. So it led to uh the Evolvement Project.

Anita Mattu 11:19

And I love the title and that's exactly what you've just described. That evolved, you know, evolving. And I can truly believe, yes, growing up it's not talked about, you know, men I mean masculinity has its own examples and yeah, if you're brought up with, you know, you've got to be tough, you can't show your emotions, which a lot of men do have that kind of upbringing, and it's true, you don't see your fathers, you know, they're all tough and you don't see the emotions, and it's so important, especially this day and age, and I'm really I think it's fantastic the work you're doing and getting this out there because there there's a need for it. Absolutely. You know, we all need to understand ourselves, and that's what I love about this, like you actually said, you know, it's doing the work first on yourself, and I love that. It's fantastic, yeah.

Corey Baum 12:20

Thank you, thank you. Appreciate it. Yeah, the the idea is is that you know, there's kind of an archetype or an image of our fathers or grandfathers that are these strong, stoic, silent, you know, uh tough, maybe you could say masculine, like um, you know, and then there's another kind of and throughout time and evolution, we've also ended up in a different place as well of like uh almost passive as men, right? And so, you know, we don't want to go from the toxic masculinity that a lot of people know, right? And we also don't want to swing to the other side of the spectrum to this passive, people-pleasing sort of man. So it's it's really finding that evolution between the the different kind of like archetypes and generations and things like that, because that's not we can't be emotionless, right? And we also can't be overwhelmed uh by emotions as well. So it's really trying to bring those two archetypes and worlds together to really and and the world needs that, right? Our families need that. We need that for ourselves. It's ridiculous to believe that we don't as men, that we don't have emotions, it just it it doesn't work. It comes out.

Anita Mattu 13:39

Absolutely, yes. And you say it so eloquently compared to what I try to say.

Corey Baum 13:46

Thank you.

Anita Mattu 13:47

So when you look at men today, what's the biggest struggle you've seen beneath the surface? Because that's the thing. It is all about beneath the surface. What you see isn't what you see, like you you said earlier. It's about putting the mask on to be with whoever you've been with at that moment.

Therapy, Divorce, And Men’s Groups

Corey Baum 14:07

I mean, there's there's a number of different things, but I think the the thing that I continue to come back over and over again is this this fear, it's it's a sense of like shame, and it's a sense of fear and like a fear of inadequacy, fear of not being enough. Because that uh I think for a lot of people, both in growing up, and this is true in myself as well, that growing up, there's there is even if it's not, you know, and you've got different ways that it's disseminated, you know, there is there is the father that is very prescriptive and like, hey, this is exactly what it looks like to be a man, and this is what you need to be in order to be a man, and if you're not, then you're less than. But then there's also the the images that get interpreted, right? From our fathers or grandfathers or just men as they operate a around the world. And as I was saying earlier, you know, social media as well, that are always saying that if you're not this, then you're less than, then you're you're something else. And I think that that can be a really at any point along the way, that if they step outside of that, you know, and and even worse than that now, I feel like it has become so, you know, okay. So if if we as a man end up exhibiting some of those traits or those qualities from our fathers, right? Like maybe uh strong, right, and stoic and passive, that can also they they also have a a mirror or a reflection that is not always well received, right? And so it's this like it's this hair trigger of like, oh, you know, I I can't be too strong, but I have to be strong, you know, and it's it's trying to find that balance in it. And so it's such a like it's such a it's such a difficult place, I feel like, to be in that they don't almost know where to go at times.

Anita Mattu 16:10

Yes, absolutely, and I absolutely understand it is a fine line, and the thing is in it all, what do you want as a man? They're still, you know, trying to please or they're still trying to think ahead and this is how I need to be. If they could just actually relax and be themselves, but then there's the judgment that comes with that, then there can be perceptions that you need to be like this. It's a mind feel really, isn't it?

Corey Baum 16:39

Yeah, absolutely. You know, and to your point, I think that that's a question that honestly, and it's at times I I wonder why it took me so long, but most people don't ask themselves that question. Like, who do I want to be? You know, we we have these these pictures or images or labels that come up, and we're just like, well, I want those things, right? I I want to have those sort of things, but nobody ever really steps back, like goes all the way back to the foundations of it and says, like, who at you know, a soul level or whatever it is you believe in, like, what do I who do I want to be? Right? And then going from there to to start to construct and design their life based on who it is that they want to be. Like, what is it that I need to do as a result to be that person? You know, I think a lot of times we we go about it kind of backwards, right? We we do the things so that we can have them or we have the things, and we think that I'll be the confident person, right? If I have the fancy car or the job or whatever those sort of things is, but but we're not going back to the fundamentals. We're not looking at core values, we're not looking at what's really important to us, and and that at the root, you know, and then we start peeling back, like, okay, this is who I want to be. And if I start doing the things that I want to do, uh I have a lot of fear, I have a lot of shame. Okay, well, let's explore those, right? Let's let's navigate that, right? But that's where we have to start.

Anita Mattu 18:14

I really hear you there. I really hear you. Yes. You talk a lot about self-leadership and brotherhood. What does what do those actually mean in practice for the men you work with?

Corey Baum 18:29

Yeah, definitely. So a lot of times men can have this sort of this mentality, right? That it's kind of like I was talking about before, that you know, I'm I'm better off doing this on my own. Nobody has the same sort of struggles that I do, and they they self-isolate, right? And and it's just this like death spiral. Yeah, and and there's there's this saying, um, what is it? If you if you want to go fast, go alone. If you go, if you want to go far, go together, sort of thing. And it's really that sort of mentality when it comes to brotherhood, right? You can only grow so far, you can only make so much progress by yourself. And there's you need the the value and the connection and the camaraderie and the the trials of a community, right? You need those men to and that kind of going back to if we bring it all back around, and and it'll happen again and again, is like if we bring those those men back into the picture, our fathers and our grandfathers, to challenge us and to say, like, hey man, you know, you're not you're not living up to what are your values? You're not living up to your value, you know, okay, you haven't you haven't identified what they are yet. Okay, and if you have, like you're not living up to them, right? And we need those people surrounding us, whether it's men or it's friends or whoever it is, I think society in general, we need those people around us to call us forward, right? Not to call us out and point fingers at us and and shame us even farther, but to say, hey, you told me that you wanted to be somebody different, right? And I'm here to hold up a mirror and and support you in that. And and so other, you know, having that community and that brotherhood to support somebody coming out of the shadows, right, to to shine a light on their fears and their shame and put their arms around each other and be like, hey man, I've got the same things that I'm struggling with, right? I I hear you, I feel you, and I'm here with you.

Anita Mattu 20:41

So what does real brotherhood look like and how is it different from just having friends?

Redefining Masculinity Without Extremes

Corey Baum 20:47

Sure. Yeah. Well, there's, you know, kind of back to what I was saying earlier, that in my childhood and even in my in my adult ages, that there's a difference between and I tell the story like two friends sitting at a table, and maybe they're there with their families, and they, you know, they go to soccer games and they do the thing, and the two guys are there, and you got, you know, it's like Bob and Jim, right? And Bob asks Jim, he's like, Hey Bob, how are you doing, man? And he's like, You know, I'm doing good. How are you? Oh, I'm doing good. You know, wife's good, everybody's good. Yep, everybody's good, everybody's fine. Right, but underneath the surface of that, right, maybe any number of things could be going on, right? They're either one of them are struggling in their relationships, they've got things that they're hiding from themselves, their partners, their kids, like there's a there's an entire minefield possibly of things that are going on. And and it doesn't have to just be bad, right? But but going taking that step farther, right, to to pull back the layers of the the onion, if we were to say, and to really start to dig into who that person is at the soul level. Like, you know, why do they like the things that they do? Why do they why is health important to them again? Like, where do you want to be in five or ten years? But really starting to get to know and understand who that the character of That person really is, right? And and and that's the thing. I mean, throughout this entire when when I went through my divorce, throughout the entire thing leading up to it, I never had a single person that that stopped and had that conversation, right? It's always just like, oh, it's fine. It's fine. We're good. We're, you know. Um, and it wasn't until the very end when I asked what was one of my best friends at the time. And I stopped and I asked him, we were out mountain biking someday, one day. And this was a this was a friend that I'd climbed countless mountains with, right? We'd summoned all kinds of things together, been in all kinds of crazy situations. And I asked him one day after mountain biking, I said, Hey, what is what is intimacy, passion, and romance look like for you and your relationship? And it blew his mind. We we had never actually like we've done all of these crazy things, but we had never actually stopped and had a conversation like that. And he didn't answer it then. And he came back like a week later, and he's like, Man, I gotta tell you, like, that that blew my mind. Like, I have completely like, and he was a very introspective guy, kind of looking back, right? But he was like, I went back and I have like reassessed, I've reassessed what does intimacy, passion, and romance look like for me in my relationship. Right. And and it just, you know, regardless of what kind of came of that in our relationship, um, you know, it was profound to me that we had spent, you know, five or eight years together, and we had never crossed that boundary into like, hey, what is what does life look like for you? Like, how do you see life? How does how do you see your relationships? And that doesn't mean that I need to like know the intimacies of of certain things, but just starting to peel that sort of stuff stuff back because that's how you that's how you make that connection. And that to me is living life.

Anita Mattu 24:16

Having true conversations without any agenda, or you don't feel you know, you can just be open and honest. And I know us women do it all the time. And men, there's a certain thing that you know, you just don't talk about. And it's becoming more and more, yeah, they need to talk about this. Come on, we need to get on. The women have got it so well, not that we have, don't get me wrong. Um, but at least we talk sometimes just rubbish, but we do talk a lot. And I think more more and more the good it's having the conversations and having like the courage and having brave conversations because some of them, you know, just like you said, you know, intimacy. Do we talk about that as men or not? You know, do we go there? It's the conversations you're having in your own head, really. Just get 'em out there. Yeah. Really I think that's really brilliant. So when a man does come to you feeling stuck or lost, let's start with him.

Shame, Inadequacy, And Social Scripts

Corey Baum 25:23

For me, everything goes back to the core values. Right. A lot of my a lot of my perspective and the way that's been really helpful for me is really really having that foundation set, like having at least begun to explore it. Um and then everything leads from that. And and and a lot of the way that that I I describe it and have seen it for myself in the past is it's more of a sense of like self-leadership. Right. And so starting at the beginning of that, looking at what our and and I hadn't, I had never explored what my core values were. Right. And it was really interesting because when it happened, and when I started really exploring that, I was doing it with another group of men, right? And it was like, okay, we got 20 minutes, here's a big sheet of of values. Everybody, it was kind of how it went, right? And everybody like, pick out some values and we'll establish our core values. It took, I mean, it still is still to this day, am I really refining my core values? Like, this is a really important thing because from that, from that, you start to base every action that you take on back to your core values. And it becomes, you know, instead of me having to reassess and evaluate whether or not something is right or feels right or resonates to me in my life, I just go back to my core values. You know what? I've already done the work, I've already established what these are. Is this me acting in integrity right here? Is this leading my family? Is this building community? Is this having courage, discipline? If it's not, then I don't do it. If it is, then I move forward. Right. And so for me, everything goes back to those core values and really buying into why it is that those are important to you, right? Not just pretty names on a piece of paper, but to really embody what those are. And then from there, as I mentioned earlier, going from your core values, right? Who it is that you want to be, and then doing those things.

Anita Mattu 27:36

Yes, absolutely. And it is, it's all about who you've been in that situation as well. And like you said, you're embodying it. And I think there's not enough of that that goes on. Has there been a moment with a client or in a group where you thought, yes, this is why I do the work I do?

Corey Baum 27:57

Yeah, absolutely. There was uh there was a man uh a couple of years ago that I worked with that in in a group setting that came in, his marriage was in shambles, his wife had asked for a divorce, like I think they were separated at the time, and he he kind of similarly to my own story came in and completely rebooted himself, tore everything down to the studs, and over the course of probably six months to a year, like uh uh along this timeline, things had progressed where the you know they moved back in together. It was this progression of a most beautiful progression to the point of like it couldn't have gotten any worse. They were on the steps of divorce, right? They had separated, they were living separately, to having like the healthiest, thriving marriage and relationship again. And that's still to this day, and that's been probably five years now, right? Where this man not only is he and and that's part of this transformation as well, is that it's not just about like, oh, okay, I showed up, I did the work, and and now we're back together. Like, let's go back and revert to the old patterns. Like, no, he's he's now he came back and did the work, and he's now leading himself in an entirely different way, which makes him a leader in his family, in his community, and his friends. And it's so it's a complete transformation. And those are the sort of things, right? Those are the sort of things that it's like saving a man from whatever that might have been, right? And even at times, you know, you could look at it and be like, oh, even for the men that have divorced, they might say, like, oh, it's too late. All of this has always happened. Like, there's always more that's still yet ahead of us, right? And so it's you still have to do the work anyways, right? Whether it's now or for a future relationship. And so it's really never too late.

Anita Mattu 30:03

And I think it's like always doing the work, but it's an everyday thing as well, because it you can relax and you soon end up being back to your old ways. It's keeping it, you know, interesting, keeping it you want to make that difference. Yeah, absolutely. So what's the biggest challenge men face when they try to step into vulnerability? Because that's a big thing for men. Showing their vulnerability.

Corey Baum 30:34

Yeah. Well, I think I think to start with is feeling safe and and practicing it. You know, so it has to be an environment where they feel like they can share these sort of things and not have it used against them, right? Not have it um pointed out, not have it laughed at, sort of thing. And and this sort of stuff goes like not just for men that are in groups with other men, but just being vulnerable in in general, right? Like this is I I look at it sometimes, you know, we've all got different different parts of ourself.

Anita Mattu 31:22

Yeah.

Corey Baum 31:23

And and a lot of times that part that's coming out at those vulnerable sort of times, right? And it could be having a hard conversation. It could be, it could be just asking another man, like, hey man, you seem really cool. I want to hang out sometime, right? That's uh that's a moment there where somebody's putting themselves out there, like they're for better or worse, like that five-year-old kid's putting his neck out on the line right there. It's going back to to that elementary days of do you like me or do you not? And so it's um, yeah, it's it's creating a a space for yourself and for other people that is it's safe for people to do that. And just kind of knowing that that everybody out there is having these same sort of thoughts and these same sort of struggles, and everybody is is dying for somebody to go first. Everybody is looking for somebody to be the one. They're all having the same thoughts.

Anita Mattu 32:22

Absolutely, and I love the fact you said they're all waiting for someone else to go first because it's having that fear, and then when someone does it, then that does create the safe space space because it is about having that space, that safe space. Absolutely. Yeah. So how has fatherhood shaped your views of leadership?

Who Do You Want To Be

Corey Baum 32:45

Oh, man. I fatherhood is like the the the ultimate crucible, I feel like, you know, it's uh it and it continues time and time again, just when you think you've got one phase or pattern understood, and you know, that it morphs into something else. And so I'm so I'm so grateful for the opportunity to be to be a father because it it not only for for myself, but for my kids. I mean, uh a lot of this journey for myself is if I look back at the the beginning of it, is seeing the same tendencies and patterns of myself starting to show up in my kids, right? And there's no better uh for me, there's no better motivator than to have that thought and that kind of forward thinking that if I don't start to handle this, right? Uh not just like handle this, but like if I don't start to do this this work, it's going to repeat and be exactly the same sort of thing that that I likely struggled with at different times. And and for me, that was that was a huge shift to to for me to think that my kids are going to struggle with something that I've known my entire life about for myself, and then I've watched it develop for them over the course of their entire lives, right? And so putting myself in that place, you know, 10, 20, 30 years down the road where I knew all along what was going into this, it was that's one of the things that continues to get me up and doing this work on myself every day, to not only lead myself, right, to continue to grow and expand and lead my family and my my community, but for them as if nothing else, uh like a statue and an image of at least a good direction. And I I don't want to say that like, hey, this is exactly what you should be, but I at least want to embody, you know, as we go back and as we talk about courage and discipline and some of these core values, like you you figure out who you are, but I'm going to at least embody these sort of traits that that I believe to be to be helpful. So fatherhood has been a cornerstone of of who I am, you know, and I I it I don't know that I don't know that I would be the same person today without it.

Anita Mattu 35:21

So Yeah. That's beautiful actually. Yeah. Thank you for sharing that. Yeah. And I think that nicely goes on to my next question because it's you know, breaking generational cycles in fatherhood and leadership. Because like you were saying, you're being the example you want to be, showing your children how they could possibly be as well. And without reverting back to old patterns. Because what's your perception on breaking generational cycles in fatherhood and leadership?

Corey Baum 36:00

Yeah. Well, to exactly that point, it I think it's so important that it's almost like a it's almost like a rubber stamp. You know, if uh or or an input and an output. If we just keep putting the same thing in, we're gonna keep getting the same thing out on the other end. And so somebody at some point along the way has to be the one to recognize these patterns and start to start to turn the ship, you know, and and sometimes I kind of describe that as and ships don't turn fast, right? If you've got a giant cruise ship that you're on, it's not like a speedboat. That it could take generations for these dynamics to start to shift, right, from one direction to another. And so somebody has to be the one to, if nothing else, start asking these questions of themselves, maybe doing the work and start asking these same questions in a safe group of other men or in community or whatever it is, but to but to start asking the questions and start showing up and start doing the work to be that example of what it should be. And and you know, often I talk a lot about um in my community uh this sense of mentorship and elderhood and things like that, that the need to have people that are breaking these patterns, and they're able to show that in a way to the future generations, right? And to even say of like, hey, uh how it is that they got to that place, right? It's it's one thing I think to explain to people like, hey, don't do this, but it's an entirely different thing to actually explain to them like, hey, this is what was happening for me because I realized this. This is the realization that I had and the impact that it was having on me and my family, and and any of that sort of stuff, myself and the the negative impacts, and here's what I did as a result of it. And and I tell you what, I failed time and time again along the way. Right, probably more often than I succeeded. But I'm here today and to share that with you.

Anita Mattu 38:18

And that's brilliant because it's having that open conversation and seeing the shifts as well. Absolutely. Yes, because you are the host of the Evolved Men's podcast. Tell me more about that.

Self-Leadership And Real Brotherhood

Corey Baum 38:34

Yeah, so it's a a podcast to not only represent the community, but to go out and find other people that are exploring this this new this new sense of what masculinity could look like, right? Through different ways, and so looking for answers to some of the questions uh that men have and that men are asking. So being that focal point where the men can come to for information. So trying my best to find people, not to not only question, answer questions that I'm having for myself, right, of you know, discipline and courage and self-respect and core values and health and relationships and emotions, just all of it. Um, but being a place for men to come to, to one place to not only have resources, right, to listen in on some of that sort of stuff, but to also have the community to reflect, right, on what it is that they're hearing.

Anita Mattu 39:40

Yeah, and just share. I think like sharing is a big part of how we can get involved. Absolutely, yes. So, what is one of the most important lessons you've learned over your life so far?

Corey Baum 39:56

Oh man, I've got a list here of all of my important lessons. I think the thing that I come back to time and time again, and even as early as today, is for me is really around presence um and taking the time to slow down enough to acknowledge more moments. And for me, that creates the space to acknowledge how it is that I'm responding to situations, right? Situations for myself and alone day to day, but situations how I'm responding to my kids, how I'm responding to my partner, how I'm responding to people that cut me off on the freeway. Right, and from there, from having that presence and I've creating that space, I can start to explore a little bit deeper um, you know, where where it is that that comes from.

Anita Mattu 41:01

So that's brilliant, yeah. And it's the old classic, yeah, you know, getting cut up in the driving and things like that, yeah. And it's who you've been in even in that moment. Everything makes a difference. Just because you're on your own in the car doesn't mean you you know need to behave a certain way. So yeah. It's actually embodying, like we said earlier, embodying who you are.

Corey Baum 41:28

Yeah.

Anita Mattu 41:29

So if there was one key takeaway you want every listener to walk away with today, what would that be?

Corey Baum 41:36

I think one of the things that has been most besides presence, that has been most transformative for me is is really from my mentor, um, being on your own side. Right. And to to really um acknowledging and working on and developing the relationship with yourself. Right. And that that is really getting intimate and personal with how that dialogue goes and those conversations go and everything around that. Because from that, you can if You really pull on that thread and you dig into it, you can really start to explore where those different parts of ourselves come from and and what that looks like. And from there, right, once you start building that better relationship, you're you're more able to step into uncomfortable situations and start having some of these courageous moments and hard conversations and and maybe stepping into a place of community and to start to share and start to be vulnerable. But a lot all of it starts with the self internally, right? And your own your own thoughts and the conversations that you have with yourself.

Anita Mattu 42:53

I couldn't agree more.

Corey Baum 42:54

I think the only thing I would say is that, you know, just for men to to get out there, to have the conversations, to be vulnerable, that, you know, as we said earlier, that everybody is looking for someone to lead, for somebody to go first. And we're all we're all struggling with the same stuff. We're all dealing with the same day-to-day sort of thing. So find uh yeah, reach out to a friend and be the one to take the initiative today.

Anita Mattu 43:21

That's beautiful. Yes. So where can the listeners find you online, your podcast? What's your website, Coopie?

Corey Baum 43:29

Yeah, yeah. So the podcast is uh Evolved Men Podcast, and the website is really the best place for everything, and that's the Evolvemen Project.com. And at the website, you find on there I've got the circle, which is a free community for men to connect with me and and other men that are doing the work and to to just start to dive into it. So it's a free resource just to dive into it.

Anita Mattu 43:57

Please do go ahead and have a take a look at that. And even if you feel it's not for you, you might know somebody that you can pass it on to. So that's a good resource.

Corey Baum 44:08

Awesome. Well, thanks, Anita. This has been great.

Anita Mattu 44:11

My pleasure. So thank you for sharing your insightful wisdom and knowledge with us today. And by doing so, I know you have helped so many others and made a big difference. I'd really like to acknowledge you for that. Corey Bomb.

Corey Baum 44:25

Sounds good. Thanks, Anita.

Anita Mattu 44:27

My pleasure. So we are all about creating the courage to be fearless podcast here. What is your definition of courage?

Corey Baum 44:36

You know, I I love courage. Courage is actually one of my core values. I think it's uh courage is doing and I didn't necessarily have it have it typed out ready for this, but for me, I think courage is often um acknowledging or recognizing the the fear, uh, but doing it anyways, sort of thing. So it's it's not this it's not this like big bold leader with a sharp axe, right, and a heavy hammer. It's like, yeah, I'm afraid and I'm terrified, and it's still there, but I'm gonna I'm gonna step into this, maybe slowly at first, but I'm still gonna take one one percent move forward.