Reclaiming The Crone: The Midlife Power Shift Women Need | Jennifer Jefferies EP 215

Women are being told to stay quiet, look younger, push harder and cope better—then we act surprised when burnout hits.

In this episode, we sit down with TEDx speaker, naturopath, author and speaker Jennifer Jefferies, who brings over 30 years of experience to a powerful conversation about stress, exhaustion and what’s really going on in women’s bodies in midlife and beyond.

We unpack the patterns she sees every day: broken sleep, low energy, mood swings and weight changes that don’t respond to “eat clean, exercise more.” From adrenal health and cortisol to the gut-brain connection, this episode connects the dots between chronic stress and why your body starts to slow down and protect itself.

You’ll also hear a refreshingly honest take on sleep—why your bedroom should be device-free, and how sleep trackers and wearables may be increasing anxiety rather than improving rest.

Then we zoom out to the bigger cultural conversation behind Jennifer’s TEDx talk, Who Killed the Crone. We explore menopause, boundaries, voice and what happens when women stop being “good” and start being honest. The crone—the modern-day wise woman—isn’t something to fear, it’s something to reclaim.

If you’re ready for practical tools, a clearer mindset and permission to age with strength, this episode is for you.

Subscribe, share with a friend who needs it, and leave a review with the one habit you’re changing first.

Link to website - https://jenniferjefferies.com/about/
Links to any Books written - https://jenniferjefferies.com/product/fck-the-stress-book/

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I look forward to connecting with you Anita Mattu https://linktr.ee/AnitaMattu

Transcript

Opening And Why Wise Women Matter

Jennifer Jefferies 0:00

Doing everything they could to suppress women. You know, they took any reference to women in the military or NASA or everything, they just wiped their records. Full stop, they just disappeared. Yeah, the first black women pods, all these things just disappeared from all their records overnight. And uh I thought I don't want to live in a world where they're suppressing women so much. So when this TED talk came out, I went, that's it. This has been brewing me. Western world is so screwed up because we burned our women at the stakes 600 years ago, locked them up and called them mad, and today we've continued it and we keep on silenced. We need our wise women back.

Anita Mattu 0:38

Today's guest is Jennifer Jeffries. I'm delighted to be joined by Jennifer Jeffries. Jen is a naturopath, author, speaker, and present-day wise woman with over 30 years' experience. She helps women rebuild their energy, regulate stress, and step into the next chapter of their lives with clarity and strength. Jen, it's wonderful

Suppression Of Women’s History

Anita Mattu 1:06

to have you here. Thanks, Anita.

Jennifer Jefferies 1:08

It's great to be here.

Anita Mattu 1:09

With that said, what is one of the most courageous things you have done? I know we're gonna get into a lot of the what you've done, but let's start with that one. If you can possibly pick one.

Jennifer Jefferies 1:21

Uh I have to go to the most recent one, and that was to share a story that had been with me since I was 28, and I'm about to turn 65, and that was to do a TED talk um about who killed the crone. So that's the most recent courageous and took everything in me. Yeah, like everyone, you know, any woman's had lots of courageous moments through their life.

Anita Mattu 1:42

And yeah, we'll go into the TED talk a bit later on. I'll ask you all about that because I'm excited to know. Too easy. Yeah, that that's actually one thing I'd like to do as well. So maybe I can get some goodness from you. It's a thing. It's it was on my list. So what originally inspired you to start working with in the area of stress, health, and well-being?

Jennifer Jefferies 2:05

Yeah, so I was in my I I was in the army, got kicked out of the army for being gay, went into the pharmacy industry back in the 1980s, where it was a crazy world. The the whole greed is good, crazy days, and the pharmacy industry was disgusting. Eventually I burned out there and I found a naturopath who helped me. And within three weeks, I was so well I had to know how they did it. So I quit everything and I went back to school and I studied. I was well and truly adrenally burned out uh in my mid-20s, a raging alcoholic, not in a good place. And yeah, it turned my life on its head, went back to school. Yeah, in my my late mid to late 20s.

Anita Mattu 2:53

That's really courageous, and uh yeah, that's brilliant because I did the same. I went back at 35.

Jennifer Jefferies 3:00

I didn't know you could go back to school.

Anita Mattu 3:02

Yeah.

Jennifer Jefferies 3:02

I left I left school at 15, failed English, I'm dyslexic. And I remember one of my pharmacists when I was about 23 said, Why don't you go back to school

From Army To Naturopathy

Jennifer Jefferies 3:11

and learn something? I went, I didn't know you were allowed to go back to school.

Anita Mattu 3:14

Yeah.

Jennifer Jefferies 3:14

So when I eventually burned out, I went, I'm going back to school. So I did. Yeah, good on you for going back at 35. That's huge.

Anita Mattu 3:23

Yes. And I think, yeah, because I'm dyslexic as well. And they only discovered it when I went back to college here at 35. But yeah, the thing is anything is possible now. And even then, when we were growing up, I'm slightly younger than you, not too much though, I must say. But uh the thing is here, we can actually go back to education anytime we want. And I always say it catches up with you sometimes. We need to be able to know more. Yeah.

Jennifer Jefferies 3:55

Yeah, I agree. Well, we're like a tree. If we're not, you know, growing, we're dying. It's the truth. We have to, we have to keep growing. Yeah. I like that analogy.

Anita Mattu 4:06

After 30 years helping women, what patterns do you see most often when women are dealing with burnt out and exhaustion?

Jennifer Jefferies 4:14

That their body is giving them lots of hints along the way and they're not listening. So usually things like crappy sleep, crappy energy, crappy moods, and crappy weight are the first main markers I'll see if their body is adrenally tired. And then the other thing is that they're looking after everyone else and not themselves. They're probably the main kind of things that I see.

Anita Mattu 4:36

Yeah, and isn't that the case? You know, they're there for everybody else, and it's so important, all the things, but I think sleep is so underrated. Definitely one of the things.

Jennifer Jefferies 4:48

Sleep's yeah, look in Chinese medicine, because I look at things from the Chinese medicine perspective as well, you know, we say you're born with a certain amount of qi, and that qi lives in your adrenal glands. And so that that's our life force. We're meant to spend a bit of qi every day, put it back in, spend it, put it back in. We put it back in when we're asleep, particularly between 2 and 4 a.m., which is the most common time

Burnout Signs Women Ignore

Jennifer Jefferies 5:13

that people wake up. And so if I know someone's doing crappy broken sleep, the first place I go to is then, you know, around adrenal glands. Because I know cortisol's out of balance, stress hormones are out of balance, and there's no way their body's restoring the way it's meant to. And with the adrenals being the core of the being, they usually have got thyroid problems and they'll have reproductive system problems as well, because the the adrenal glands tells thyroid and adrenals what to do. Uh thyroid and reproductive system what to do. So yeah, it's uh it all shows. Sleep's important.

Anita Mattu 5:46

Yes. So anybody listening right now that's thinking, okay, that's me. I wake up at that time. What can I do?

Jennifer Jefferies 5:53

Yeah, so there's a couple of things. Well, there's a few things. So if I if I take it back a step, our adrenal glands, which are little glands that sit on top of our kidneys, and everyone talks about cortisol and stuff nowadays, your adrenals are where you produce adrenaline and cortisol, but also where you produce your andogrens, which is basically your boy and girl hormones, which is why it tells your reproductive system what to do. And our adrenals need between seven and nine hours sleep a night. But the most important sleep we do is between 10 p.m. and 2 a.m. Because that's when our body's getting ready for the cortisol to come back into balance. So if you're being a night owl, good on you, but it's actually taking time off your life. And I used to be a night owl when I was younger, and the biggest change I've made to my life in the last, well, nearly 40 years is I really respect my sleep. And six nights a week, not negotiable. I am in bed and I get up early because I go surfing, but I always get at least seven hours' sleep, and I'm I'm asleep somewhere

Sleep And Adrenal Health Basics

Jennifer Jefferies 6:55

between nine and ten p.m. Not negotiable. All my friends, everyone knows it. If we have parties and stuff, they know you've got to leave Jen's place before 8 p.m. so that she can get to bed on time. And I don't give a shit what they think. Because it that our sleep keeps us alive, Anita. It's huge.

Anita Mattu 7:13

I'm the same. I'm in bed by you know, nine o'clock, everything goes off. And I'm very much once I get into the bedroom, no mobile phone, no nothing. So very much on top of that, you know.

Jennifer Jefferies 7:27

Bedrooms are for sleep and sex, and that's it. It's like no TV, yeah, no TVs, no devices. It's really important because electromagnetic radiation messes with that. By the way, side note, people who are wearing all these watches nowadays that track their sleep. There's really good research coming out that's showing that those watches, just your awareness of wearing it, thinking, oh, it's going to track my sleep, will give you crappy sleep. Stop wearing those watches or the aura rings, any of those things, they are nasty messing with your electrical system in your body. Nasty.

Anita Mattu 8:03

See, that's really good to know because a lot of people, and especially the celebrities, are wearing the aura rings. You see it all the time. And people think, oh, it's a good thing, it's a good thing, you know, if they're doing it.

Jennifer Jefferies 8:15

Yeah, I would not touch anything like that. I wear a watch when I'm in the surf, um, but it's an old wind-up watch. I won't wear anything electronic because it's on you've got your meridians, which is in Chinese medicine, they're the electrical pathways that again keep your your body working properly. And so, yeah, I won't touch anything like that.

Phones, Wearables And Restless Nights

Jennifer Jefferies 8:36

No good, especially in sleep.

Anita Mattu 8:39

Controversial great group. That's really interesting to know, so thank you. That's alright. I'm happy to help you. You can talk about women sometimes becoming invisible in midlife. Why do you think that happens?

Jennifer Jefferies 8:54

Oh look I a a few reasons. Uh statistically, more women feel like they are invisible. However, part of that is that they've let themselves get invisible. So imagine they get married in their 20s or 30s, whatever, they have their kids, the kids leave home 20 years later, and they've given their whole life to raising kids. And you know what it's like? You took on three kids young, and all of a sudden it's like women, they leave lose who they are. And so on paper, and a big thing of what I work with in all my mentoring is like they've you've got the good job and the right house and the partner and the tick, tick, tick, tick, tick, tick, tick. And they they're lost. They're lost, they're like, they don't even know what it's like to be them. And so a lot of times they'll start dressing old. And it's not about dressing up, and in Australia, we say mutton dressed up as land. Don't try and dress up like a young kid, but be you.

Why Midlife Can Feel Invisible

Jennifer Jefferies 9:54

I still wear t-shirts and jeans, which I just love wearing. It's just what I do. Um, and I'm not gonna fit a certain model in Australia. I don't know if it's like it in the UK. So many women, when they get in their 50s, the hairdressers go, Oh, it's time for a bob. And they get these bob haircuts. And they said my wife Alice is 63. The hairdresser said it to it last year, and Alice has got really long blonde hair. And she went, No, normal, yeah. No, no, it's like wear your hair how you want. I've had short hair all my life. I love it. I'm lazy with hair, so I keep short hair. My wife Alice has got really long hair, but there's we buy into society's norms instead of just going, I feel good when I wear this or when I do this. So um be you. It it as much as society is telling women to be invisible, we get to choose whether we play that game or not, and I just choose not to. It's simple. Pisses people off at times, but I don't care.

Anita Mattu 10:58

Yeah, but then this is it. It's about being who we are, truly, and expressing it. And I truly understand what you're saying, you know, because you see it, or a certain age, you know, you can't have long hair, and I was thinking, what?

Jennifer Jefferies 11:12

I know it's the same over there, is it? It's definitely a thing here. Or they'll all of a sudden you're not allowed to have grey hair, so they'll dye it red. You've never been a redhead in your life, and as you age you go red. Why? It's like, no, who the hell is saying to do that stuff? It's not cool.

Anita Mattu 11:31

No, and I've never dyed my hair, and actually I get so many compliments. I like your salt and pepper. I must say it's more salt these days, but I love it. It and everyone says it suits me.

Jennifer Jefferies 11:43

So I had uh super duper duper duper duper dark brown hair, not quite black, all my life.

Anita Mattu 11:50

Yeah.

Jennifer Jefferies 11:51

Uh, and it's well and truly salt and pepper. Now it's some bleachers because I go surfing, the grey sun bleaches, which I think is hilarious. I've never had bleached hair in my life. Uh, but it's like I look at photos now of me younger with darker hair. I don't like my darker hair. I love my gray hair. It's the best.

Anita Mattu 12:10

Yeah.

Jennifer Jefferies 12:10

So I'm not covering up anything.

Anita Mattu 12:12

No way. And this is it, it makes who we are, and we enjoy being uh, you know, who we are, and that's the thing. We don't have to change, we don't have to pretend, we don't have to be, you know, hiding behind something. Agree. Yeah, totally agree. So that that nicely goes into my next question. What is the hidden strength or wisdom that often emerges during this stage of life?

Jennifer Jefferies 12:40

Uh women find their voice. It's interesting, as estrogen naturally drops, which is what it's meant to do at this time, as our ovaries shrivel up, our adrenal glands are still meant to produce progesterone, but at a much lower level. And so we get what's called excess kidney. And so if you're playing along on YouTube, you can watch. See the vertical lines on my top left? That says that my ovaries have shriveled up. My period left me at 49. Uh, so that's a normal sign. And women go and put Botox and things in it. It's like, no, it just happily it means that we're Crohn's, we're barons. But when that when the estrogen naturally drops, our care factor changes. So estrogen's given to us so we can nurture and raise the kids and do all that stuff. As the estrogen drops and disappears, which it's meant to do, we care deeper than we've ever cared, but differently. And at the same time, we don't care at all. It's a biological hormone shift in our body. And so all of a sudden,

Menopause, Hormones And Finding Voice

Jennifer Jefferies 13:47

women start, you know, wanting to use their voice, whether they've got the courage to do it yet or not. That's why I love working with women and helping them to learn how to use their voice. And I know you do similar kind of stuff. It's such big work. And so it's it's busting inside them. That's why so many women in their 50s and that start to feel so restless because the hormones are naturally changing and it they're wanting to say, don't do that, or do more of this, or whatever it is. And um their voice is the biggest thing. It sits behind everything because our thoughts create our feelings, our feelings create our actions, our actions create our results. And so people are wanting, you know, women at this time in life, they're wanting different things, and it we have to use our voice, the thought that comes out our voice, because that starts a cascade of different events. So it's uh it's an interesting time seeing women have the courage to take that step and say no or yes or or whatever, but actually say what they're thinking versus being good little girls and keeping their mouths shut, like we were raised to do. I'm sure you were in the UK as well. Like women always kept their mouths shut. Fuck at that. I did when I was younger, not now.

Anita Mattu 15:00

I know, and you know, so many people do, and the amount of people that still don't speak up because in society or their culture or their even sometimes in their workplace, you know, they can't have their own voice, and more and more I'm not saying, you know, go out and cause trouble, but at least view your point. And it's so important because you're s suppressing who you are.

Jennifer Jefferies 15:29

Yeah. And we're the ones who get sick if we don't use our voice. They don't. We do.

Anita Mattu 15:34

Absolutely. Yeah.

Jennifer Jefferies 15:35

Yeah. When a woman uses a voice nowadays, they call her a Karen. I don't know if that's a thing in the UK, but in Australia and North America, they've been labeled Karen's when a woman's just saying, don't do that. And it pisses me off so much. It's like we're we're being put down in such a bad way, just because we're we're having the courage to use our voice. The patriarch is in full flight at the moment and feeling threatened because women are standing up, and in so many straight relationships, heterosexual relationships, the male partner is not used to the woman saying no, and divorces are just gone through the roof because that are not to be all of a sudden the woman's saying her piece and isn't just submissive. It's uh it's interesting time, but I love it. I love seeing women use their voice.

Anita Mattu 16:24

Couldn't agree more. Absolutely. Yes. So your book, F Astricht C K the Stress. Yeah, I'm sure we can all understand what that means. You am I allowed to say it on your show? It is a clean show, but I'm sure you can say it. Um fuck the stress.

Jennifer Jefferies 16:44

That's it. Like I've I've written 16 books over the years and uh on you know all the physical stuff and the emotional sides of illness. But I I went when I wrote this one uh 12 months ago, 18 months ago, it was like we don't need another book on how to relax. We don't do it, you know, we don't need books on that stuff. There's so much information out there. So for me, I wrote that book as a tool for women, it's 70% of it is the mindset stuff that I use to keep my brain straight, working for me. And then the rest of it is the physical, because again, if we don't get that, you know, our thoughts right and how our brain fires properly right, the rest doesn't matter. That's what sits behind everything. So I went, it it's about we're presented with stress

The Mindset Behind “Fuck The Stress”

Jennifer Jefferies 17:33

all day, every day, and stress is good for us, but it's what we do with the stress that matters, how we respond. And so, you know, laying down and going, oh, I'm tired and I'm stressed and all that stuff is never gonna help. However, saying, fuck it, I've got this, that's what it's about. So the book is very practical ways that I dug myself out of an adrenal burnout hole nearly 40 years, and how I've been um coaching, mentoring women to do so ever since. I'm a very practical, bottom line kind of Aussie. So um, yeah, it's a very straight to the point kind of book. Yes.

Anita Mattu 18:10

Yeah, that's excellent. Because the thing is here, especially like, you know, why do you think stress has become such a defining issue today?

Jennifer Jefferies 18:20

Well, because the cost of it, the in, you know, if I think of in the workplace, I've been working as a professional speaker on preventing burnout in the workplace for 30 years, 28 years. And the biggest thing is the cost to companies, it costs so much money to acquire staff. And if they've got a high attrition rate, it's costing the businesses relentlessly. And nowadays in Australia, we've got things like work cover. So if someone's getting stressed at work and they're off on work leave, on stress leave, well, that costs the the companies another whole level of income and so all costs. So it's the stress has always been there. However, people aren't just soldering on like we did decades ago. That's a big part. Then the other part is which is what I talk about in the book, because I wrote the book post-pandemic, is that our body, when we're first presented with stress, there's this thing called gas, general adaptation syndrome. And our the little adrenal glands I talked about, when we're

Why Modern Stress Keeps Rising

Jennifer Jefferies 19:17

first stressed, they actually physically get a little bit bigger and go, here's here's a bit more energy, here's a bit more. Okay. Stage two, they go, Well, I can't get any bigger, but here's a bit more energy. And that's where the classic is you go on holidays and you catch a cold day one of your holidays. You get your body sitting, usually sitting around that stage two. And then stage three, which is where I went to when I was working in the pharmacy industry, they go, Yeah, I got nothing left. And you're just gonna lay down for the next 12 months, and that's the way it is. So during the pandemic, so imagine our adrenal glands that they're all about fight and flight. They're doing everything they can hormonally to keep us alive. So when all of a sudden the world locked down in 2020, we went into absolute uncertainty. The world had always been predictable. You could kind of sort of think of things as, you know, hey, this is all right, I can plan. And me, I was working, traveling the world as a professional speaker, booked out two, three, four years in advance for speaking gigs around the world. And and I flew back into Australia when I could get back in and went into lockdown. And it's like for about three weeks, my brain, and I'm trained in this stuff, went, what the fuck? Like, really, I my brain started to go down the rabbit hole. And I thought, wow, if I'm going down the rabbit hole, what are other people doing? And so the book I wrote about that, so I got myself out of the rabbit hole, obviously, but uh for a couple of weeks I went to ice cream, thought, well, this is just I'll just eat ice cream every day. It was uh it was it was so strange to not have you know some kind of predictability. And my income, like so many people around the world, went to zero overnight, everything changed. And so you had everyone in survival mode, adrenals, all of a sudden the whole world went into alarm mode, stage one. And you already had people tired. Two years later, the world broke, they send everyone back to work, they just go off you go, pandemic's over, magic, everyone go back to work, and their bodies have still haven't caught up with them. And so when we stress out, bottom, you know, really basic kind of how your body works, when cortisol's high, it we say in in Chinese medicine, your gut's like a big crocodile. I'll talk about all of this in the book, but it it kind of dampens, it puts a fire out in your belly, in food stews instead of digesting. And there's this thing called the gut brain axis. So most of your happy hormones are actually made in your gut. And so if that's shut down because of high cortisol and stress, people mental health has been an issue, huge issue, ever since because their body is still sitting in alarm mode. So we've kind of got A world that's sitting been sitting in stage two adrenal stress since the pandemic, stage one or stage two. And even like this week, you know, as we record this, they're starting another world war, there's no certainty. And people are living in alarm mode. Their adrenals are not coping. And so, yep, sleep's important. Adaptogen herbs, which are a class of herbs, help the adrenals to get out of that exhausted state. And they don't that, you know, like I said, stress is good for us, but we've got to get our body to be able to adapt to stress so that when we're knocked off center, we come back quicker and we don't, you know, throw out as far and stay around what we call the alkaline corridor better. So yeah, we have to be able to get to adapt to stress better. It's huge. It's huge.

Anita Mattu 22:48

And it's killing people. So interesting though, isn't it? I mean, we can do something every day to help ourselves, and people just don't because they think that's part of life, you know. And sometimes, not everyone, but people wear it like a badge of honor being stressed. What's that about? Yeah, I know I'm working hard.

Jennifer Jefferies 23:08

Good on you, probably killing you. Yeah. And then they'll flog themselves in the gym. And when the body's already tired, flop, you know, racing around the block or doing a hard workout, it's the wrong thing to do. Where restorative exercises to balance out adrenals are things like yoga, tai chi, qi gung, going for a walk instead of a run without the phone in the pocket. Just walk. Look at the trees, look at the sky. That's restorative to adrenals and in some cases as good as sleep. Where flogging yourself when your body's already tired is not going to help. And and women particularly, we see, you know, the muffin top thing comes in, and that's cortisol, that's visceral fat. That's heart attack stress fat that's sitting there, taxing the body. And so again,

Pandemic Aftershocks And The Gut

Jennifer Jefferies 24:00

people think, oh, I'll just eat clean, exercise more. But if you do that, you make a smaller body with a higher percentage of outer balances. So anyway you lose is generally um muscle, not fat, and it comes back and brings all its mates because your body goes, Oh shit, you're even more toxic than you were before. Yeah, it's a vicious cycle, and it's kind of counterintuitive to deal with it. And we keep looking for magic pills and things on Instagram, it's like stop doing the magic pills. There's no magic pills. You get a strong foundation, which is what my book's all about, and then you can adapt to what's going on.

Anita Mattu 24:39

And it's so true. People do want, you know, a magic pill. There is no such thing. Can people understand that? Please. You may have to do a little bit of work, but in the long run, this is your body, this is your temple, this is your home. Honor it.

Jennifer Jefferies 24:56

Yeah. It's carrying us around. And if you want to, you know, I the the weight loss, the GLP1 drugs are huge in Australia at the moment, like they are in most countries around the world. And people are going, oh, I can lose weight quick. Yeah, but you're running the same crappy habits that got you in that place, and it's been proven that the weight that they lose, 40% of it is muscle. And and then they wonder why they've got no metabolism, because it that we need that high aline muscle percentage to keep our metabolism going. It's we haven't even seen the stuff of some big mess coming ahead with people's health with those drugs coming in. Huge, but there's so much money at stake.

Anita Mattu 25:35

They're gonna keep going. Absolutely. And that's really sad. Really sad.

Jennifer Jefferies 25:41

Yeah, I find as a practitioner, I find it really frustrating. And I get it, it sucks. I'd love to sit and eat ice cream every day too. Done help. Sometimes, 80% of the time, stick close to nature, behave 80% of the time, 20% have some fun. Sadly, most people's lives are the other way around, and that's why they they're not coping with life. And everything just gets amplified as we age. So, you know, if you're out of balance now, when you hit your 40s and 60s, 50s, 40s, 50s, 60s, we start getting more things where we can choose to, you know, get the basic foundations right, and our body still will carry us comfortably and healthy all the way through, you know, into proper old age, 80s and 90s.

Anita Mattu 26:24

And that's the thing. A lot of people say to me, or, you know, like to live a long life. I said, I want to live a long life. If I'm able, there's no point if like I'm not able, you know. I want to do everything I can to make sure I'm able, you know, a walk every day, you know, even if it's just half an hour, 20 minutes, it's getting outdoors, get in the sunshine, I eat clean, I look after myself. And this is the thing, people, you know, you've got to look after yourself. And it's not just you're eating, it's

Exercise, Cortisol And Weight Traps

Anita Mattu 26:56

like getting fresh air. It's so important to get fresh air. Like you said, go for a walk, forget the mobile phone. Yeah, look at the stars, look at the trees, you know, notice things. Yeah, it's really be present, I think, is what we're saying here.

Jennifer Jefferies 27:10

Yeah, we are for sure. It's interesting in Chinese medicine. Well, I I do a lot of work teaching up in Asia and in China, you know, that they pay the practitioners to keep them well. If you get sick, you don't pay. Which is the complete opposite to the Western model. So they'll go and see their acupuncturist regularly, same as I do. They'll go and see their different practitioners to not wait to get so far out of balance. And the biggest change I've made in my health the last 30 odd years is I live from a place of prevention. I don't, I I mean, I plan to do good sleep. I, you know, I plan to do the core basics all the time. Um I don't wait to do crappy sleep. I don't wait to do all those things. And I have massage, you know, regularly, I have acupuncture treatments regularly, I go on, I do my Pilates, I do my walks, I surf every day. I do the stuff knowing it's what I do today that's gonna give me my health in 20 or 30 years, because there's a big difference between health span and lifespan. You can live long and be in an oldies home and not be healthy. Or you can choose to do the bits now 80% of the time and age strong, fit, and healthy with a health span, which is what I want to do. I want to be still surfing in my 90s and remembering that I'm surfing in my 90s. I do everything to look after my brain, all those things.

Anita Mattu 28:33

Oh, that's brilliant. Absolutely brilliant. Love it, love it all. So if someone was listening right now feels overwhelmed or exhausted, what is the one small step they could take now to start restoring their energy?

Jennifer Jefferies 28:49

Make sleep your biggest priority, not negotiable. Six nights a week, be in bed before 10 p.m. Not negotiable. Full stop, that's it. That is the one it costs you nothing. And like I said, if you're feeling like, oh yeah, but I'm a night owl and I love it, and you just don't know, Jen, I'm a night owl, I can't go to sleep. Well, set different sleep habits and help yourself go to sleep. So if you're having trouble going to sleep, you're generally low in calcium. One of my favorite foods for more calcium is sesame seeds. It's got more usable calcium than a glass of milk. I have two teaspoons of sesame seeds a day on my food somewhere. Easy. I put a few drops of lavender essential oil on, you know, my my bedding and stuff when I go to sleep at night. Lavender is great. It's a great essential oil helps to calm our nervous system. It's also been shown to help balance out

Prevention And Building Healthspan

Jennifer Jefferies 29:38

the cortisol. So if you're having trouble getting to sleep, you're usually low in calcium and the floury essential oils work. Having trouble staying asleep, you're low in magnesium. Magnesium-rich foods, um, almonds, pecans, walnuts, have a small handful, very small, because they're incredibly nutrient dense and calorie dense. So, you know, have a dozen almonds of an afternoon as a snack to get a little bit more magnesium. And then essential oils, the heavy ones, so things like taken from the wood of the tree. So things like vetiva and sandalwood and cedarwood, any of those essential oils, using them if you're doing broken sleep, you know, put a drop on the soles of your feet, go to sleep. You know, simple things from prevention can support us to have much better sleep. Yeah.

Anita Mattu 30:26

Yeah, that's really interesting because you mentioned sandalwood, because I love my sandalwood incense. Yeah, I love them and I I love the smell. Uh it makes me feel really great. So yeah.

Jennifer Jefferies 30:38

Yeah, it's it's really nice and grounding. The essential oil is more potent for sure. Um, you know, one little drop on the soles of your feet is gonna be more beneficial than using an incense. However, we used incense in our home as well. We love it.

Anita Mattu 30:52

Yeah. Yeah, it's grounding. You recently delivered a TEDx talk. What was the core message? What happened? Tell me all about it. You know, what did people take away from it?

Jennifer Jefferies 31:06

Yeah, look, the the core man, the core message was who killed the crone. So the middle of last year, Chris, the guy who started TED, he did a call out on the TED Instagram page that they wanted to run a global idea search. And they ran it through, they found the top nine TEDxes in the world. So TEDx TED is just run at the main TED stage in Vancouver. TEDxes is everywhere else around the world. And so they picked the the nine biggest, you know, best Islam. So Sydney was one, Sydney, Australia. And they wanted ideas that would disrupt. So you weren't allowed to go and do a talk about, yeah, I was bound out and I did a walk and did this and this, and I'm great now. You weren't allowed to do that. You were meant to, it was meant to be a disruptive message that could help the world. And I thought, I've always wanted to do a TED talk. This is it. And I honestly started to get really pissed off the start of last year, which is why I started my own podcast. Uh I've got a couple of podcasts, but started the more recent one, Present Day Wise Woman. And I did that because I saw, particularly in the United States, where they were doing everything they could to suppress women. You know, they took any reference to women in the military or NASA or everything. They just wiped their records. Full stop. They just disappeared from, you know, the first black pilots, all these black women pilots, all these things just disappeared from all their records overnight. And I got really pissed off. I have fought and stood for women. Suffragettes in the UK in 1906 inspired me when I learned about him in my mid-20s. They really inspired me, and I've lived to mindfully follow in their footsteps ever since. So that's all good.

One Step To Restore Energy

Jennifer Jefferies 32:55

I started to get pissed off and I went, and uh, I thought I don't want to live in a world where they're suppressing women so much. So when this TED talk came out, I went, that's it. This has been brewing me. I wanted to to say the world, the Western world, not the world, the Western world is so screwed up because we burned our women at the stakes 600 years ago, locked them up and called them mad. And today we've continued it, and we keep on silenced with things like visually, well, like Botox and stuff. We culturally, it's like we're telling women they should look like their daughters. It's bullshit. I'm about to turn 65, I've got wrinkles, I don't care. I'm meant to look like this, I am this age. And so my TED talk was about how when I was 28, I'd I'd been studying about the suffragettes, and I can't tell you how inspired I was by them. Just say, they're courageous women. Blew me away. And when I was 28, my mum turned 50, and I sent her a card and said, Congratulations, you are officially a crone. Meaning, I am so happy for you, Mum. This is the coolest time in your life. I'm so excited for you. And she was so deeply insulted. And so in my late 20s, I thought, wow, this is this is actually pretty messed up. Now, in those days, we had no internet or anything, so I researched, you know, through books and everything. And Crone had been designated, uh, not in my world, in the the patriarchal kind of system, that it's like the old hag and all that stuff. And I went, no, mom, no, this is cool. She could not get it because society was telling her she should turn into this little old lady. And my mom had always been the cool chick. Rock and roll, dance right through life. I swear she turned 50 and turned into an old lady. So that's that was my motivation. I wanted to put the message out there that um we need our wise woman back. You know, you think about the nonnas in Italy, the year yars in Greece. I run a charity in Thailand, and Matao, who's the matriarch in the village where all my kids are, I see 17-year-old boys, 18-year-old boys who are meatheads in Australia sit at her feet and listen. Deep respect. So in the non-Western countries, the non-colonialized countries, there's still that same wisdom of the men and the women is respected. Or maybe not some of the Middle East right at the moment, however, in most of the countries, indigenous cultures. And it's so it's like the Western world is has lost its soul. You know, the the crone is like the cultural nervous system. She doesn't just guide with words, just her presence in a room at shows in, you know, with co-regulation can settle everyone else's nervous system. So I put all of that into it. It was a huge experience. And for me, I've been working as a professional speaker for nearly 30 years, and the red dot was cool. And to see how TED works behind the scenes, really cool. They are absolutely as cool as you want to think they are. I promise they are. But the topic was the biggest topic of my life, and that was the first place in the world I ever delivered that topic.

Calcium, Magnesium And Essential Oils

Jennifer Jefferies 36:17

So it was it was big. And we recorded it back in November, start of November, and the TED Talk just came out this week. So it's uh it was a big experience. And they made a whole documentary about the whole global search. So every country they did a 45 document 45-minute documentary about five of the top speakers uh from that. So if anyone wants to look at TEDx, and you'll find Jennifer Jeffries or uh Who Killed the Crone, you'll find my TED. Uh they gave us six minutes. I went to seven. Wow. So I knew I went over time. You'll see I had some I was controlling the energy. Uh and they they filmed us all the day before, and that's all the stuff that's in the documentary. They show all the behind-the-scenes stuff. So uh it's an interesting thing. Yeah, yeah, project. I loved it. It's just a great experience.

Anita Mattu 37:13

Wow, wow, wow. I mean, huge congratulations because that's something, you know, really inspiring. You know, that that's I don't even know, it's a huge thing. So inspiring doesn't cover it, you know. And it's courageous, and you're talking the message about something that we all go through and it's understanding it. I mean, how cool is that, you know?

Jennifer Jefferies 37:37

Yeah, it's brilliant. Thank you. Thanks, Anita. There was only one topic I could talk on, and that was we need our wise women back. I want women 50, you know, 40, 50, 60, 70, 80 to stand in their power. I go surfing, you know, I started to learn to surf at 56. Um, I I surf with other women in their 80s and 70s. I know I want women to stand in their power. It's don't, you know, we age, we age with wisdom. We don't have to turn into a little old lady that society says we should, old and frail. Bullshit. One of my mates I was just did a just did a podcast with just before uh for my podcast. She took up running at 60. She'd never run in life. She did a one of those park runs. So I went like from couch to 5k. So she's now 67, and she just she's run two years in a row, she's run over a hundred K race. She's now 67. She just ran another 100K race two weeks ago. And she's lined up already, booked for the 100-mile

TEDx: Who Killed The Crone

Jennifer Jefferies 38:47

race next week, which is 163 kilometers in New Zealand. So age is bullshit. If like, sorry, but it really is. You can do whatever you choose. Will you have to train? Yes. Will you want to get a mentor and everything to help get your mind right, physical, all that right? Yes. And do it. Or sit in your chair and be old and boring, like my parents did, like before my mum died. My dad just is 89, sits in the chair all day, and it's just their choice. Their choice. We don't have to buy into that game.

Anita Mattu 39:20

And I really hear you there. It's so true. Really hear you there. You know, you have the ability to do anything you want. It is just a set of like your mindset. You can do it. You know, don't buy into oh, so and so says, you know, we not need to be careful, this and that, you know, or they're retiring. You know, do what you like. Have fun. You know, have fun till your last day.

Jennifer Jefferies 39:48

Yeah, totally. Never die wondering. I took up Pilates uh 14 months ago because I wanted to improve my surfing. So balance is huge. So I took up reforma Pilates. The stuff I couldn't do and I felt like a gumby learning 12 months ago. I can't believe the stuff I can do now. My balance is insane. My core strength, it's yeah, it's been a year of you know, doing a class a week and doing my own, you know, bits at home, but I'll take that balance any day to keep me strong for the next 30 years. Because so often, you know, uh, as we age, you have a fall breaker hip, you're dead within six months. I'm not playing that game. And so it's been worth feeling all I could do was laugh in the earlier. I couldn't believe the stuff I couldn't do. And I had good balance, but not like really not like I've developed over the last year. So let yourself I think a big problem, Anita, is that people they don't let themselves be bad at something long enough to get good at it. Uh so if I think if someone had told I started surfing, well, you know, it's coming up ten years ago. And if someone had told me 10 years ago, I'd still be just what's called an intermediate surfer, which is I can surf, but still, if someone had told me 10 years ago it would take that long to get to this level, I probably wouldn't have started it. However, I have had 10 of the best years and healthiest years of my life, especially mentally challenging myself learning to do something like surfing. So I am I am so grateful, but it's bloody hell, some days it's hard work.

Anita Mattu 41:39

It's really hard work and worth it. Yeah, it that's the thing, it's worth it. And the value for your own body, you know, the health, and ah, it must be I mean, I can't surf at all, but hey, try to.

Jennifer Jefferies 41:54

Well, not yet, you might. I uh wanna I want to go and surf in Cornwall. They've got an amazing group of women who surf down at Cornwall.

Anita Mattu 42:01

That's right.

Jennifer Jefferies 42:02

I want to come over when the world's safer to travel, come back to the UK and surf Cornwall.

Anita Mattu 42:07

Why not? Yeah.

Jennifer Jefferies 42:09

Yeah.

Anita Mattu 42:11

Yes, they might. You never know. So Jen, was there a moment during your presentation or delivery of the TED talk that really stood out for you?

Jennifer Jefferies 42:23

Yeah. I'd actually say it was in the rehearsals the day before. So we did rehearsals. And I cried all day on the her rehearsals. Every time I tried to do my talk, I cried. And if you watch the documentary about the TED Talk for City, uh, I cried. And it was just so much emotion. I was I cared so much about delivering that topic. And there was honestly a moment when, and if you watch that documentary, I say, I kind of go, fuck, I'm sorry. It's just so big. And in that moment, I actually had the thought, I can't do this. I really, really, really thought I can't do this. And uh I looked at, you know, the TED team and and the other speakers, and I thought, I have to do this. And I I took a breath and wiped the snot away. And uh, and I just I wriggled my toes, I got back in my body, I was in my head, I grounded myself, and I just went again. And I'll remember that moment for life because that was one of the toughest things I've kind of ever done to continue. It was it was so big and so important that I just kept blanking out. I couldn't remember my lines. My brain it was just and it wasn't that it was Ted, it was the topic meant so much to me. I felt like I was carrying the weight of the world of every bloody woman in the world on my shoulders and Yeah, it was doing my head in. But I I'm really proud of myself for that moment. Yeah, just to walk on that red dot was it was a good thing.

Anita Mattu 44:14

It was a big tip. But it took a big courage. Yeah. I can really hear your passion there. Really. And the courage it must have taken, absolutely. Beautiful. Yeah.

Jennifer Jefferies 44:30

Thank you. I've worked as a speaker forever, you know, like the longest time. And one of my mentors, because after you do anything, it's like, you know, you do it and then you think, oh fuck, I should have said that, could have done that. What if that happens? Who's gonna hate on me for that? All that

Ageing Strong Without Apology

Jennifer Jefferies 44:48

through stuff runs through your brain. And one of my mentors said to me uh years ago, it doesn't matter what we do, 50% of people will never love what we do. Ever. I'll never get us. And 50% of people will love us no matter what what no matter what we share. And I thought, I'm doing this for that 50% who are gonna hear this and women who need to hear it. Because um Marianne Williamson, she wrote a poem for Nelson Mandela. Um and in it there's a line that's always resonated with me. She says, you know, when we let our our own light shine, we give others permission to do the same. And I thought, me using my courage and using my voice here this way, if you know, those women who are meant to hear it get one piece of courage out of it, I've done my job. And the feedback since has been, yeah. It's been really well received. So I've had one guy be a dick so far, otherwise everyone else has been great. So yeah. You're gonna get them, but the thing is. Yeah, I um it's a reality. It's just a reality, and the bigger you get, the more you get. So you just yeah, that's okay. I block and delete. They're not my they're not my part, not part of my trial.

Anita Mattu 46:03

Yeah. Yeah. So do tell me about your podcast, the present-day wise woman.

Jennifer Jefferies 46:10

Yeah, so the present-day wise woman is a a a term I coined oh, probably ten years ago now, when I was really deeply working in my crone journey. And I thought, you know, what's a how would we describe the crone nowadays? Because so much derogatory stuff has been put onto the crone. We bought into that game, and I'm out to reclaim that word. However, for those who need it, I've I present, you know, the present-day wise one. And so when I started this working on this more than 10 years ago, so I first I kind of called it uh the ascendants of the feminine. Well, that didn't work. Um I've had Smart Sassy Seniors, which I thought was really clever. Um, but no, seniors has got a worse name than Crone. So I've had four evolutions before I got to the present-day wise woman, and it just feels right in my bones. And it's a podcast that's meant to disrupt. It's a I'm and thank you, you're going to be a guest on my show. Uh, it's a it's a place where you are allowed to swear. Yeah, I want you to be women to be as real and authentic as they are. So I have got regular non-s in the street through to super high-profile uh people I interviewed, one of my early ones I did, I think it's episode 17. I interviewed uh the woman who did the research the day after John F. Kent, sorry, um Martin Luther King Jr. was assassinated, and she ran the Blue Eyes Brown Eyes study and proved that racism is learned. And Jane was like, she ate me for breakfast. That woman, she will find white privilege in everyone. And it was the just the coolest life experience. She's 92 nowadays and fierce. If I can be remotely like her, I'll be happy as I age. You know, Barbara G. Walker, who has since passed, she was 96. I talked to her just a few weeks before she passed. She wrote one of the best books out there on the crone, just and the most the deepest researcher who researched everything about the lineage of women. And whoa, just yeah. But their messages are just as important as the lay person on the, you know, I meet cool, just women.

Learning New Skills In Midlife

Jennifer Jefferies 48:37

So I'm all about highlighting the lives and the wisdom, bringing the wisdom to um that real crone archetype. So women kind of late 40s, 50 plus. Yeah. Not after influences or specialty, I'm just after bloody solid women who've got great wisdom. And it's a very real and raw podcast. Nothing pretty about what we do, but great wisdom. Yeah, that's what I do.

Anita Mattu 49:06

And that's what it's all about. Yeah, it's what a chrome is. It's what a chrome is.

Jennifer Jefferies 49:11

Own who we are. I know life is too short, really too short, to die wondering. What if I gave surfing a go? What if I did this? What if I did that? Don't what if? Give it a crack. Learn. Learn what you need to do to get whether it's fit enough or mindset, whatever it. Learn, get help, get coaching, get help, get healthy. Uh, and but do a tiny step towards doing it every day. You know, my TED talk went to the stage 37 years after that message called to me. So every day I was living, growing into being that person to be able to deliver that for don't die wondering.

Anita Mattu 49:58

Yeah.

Jennifer Jefferies 49:58

It's uh life is way too short.

Anita Mattu 50:01

And too cool. You gotta live it. Yeah. This is a big question, but maybe after decades of helping people, what has this journey taught you personally about life?

Jennifer Jefferies 50:18

Uh that it's short. I had an uncle, my dad's best friend, best mate, died yesterday. Life is short. Really short. My big sister never made it to 60. Um treasure, I treasure every day. I I know the importance of living from a place of prevention. And at the same time, I was a perfectionist when I was younger. It was all part of me burning out. So I live 80% good now. So I I do all the basics 80% right, you know, right 80% of the time. And that just gets rid of a huge amount of unnecessary stress. So I wish I'd known all that kind of thing younger, and through working, you know, with patients from my clinic years through to speaking all around the world and across so many cultures. Um enjoying the whole journey. So many people think when I retire I'll do this or I'll do that. Fuck, don't. Just enjoy every damn day right now because life is really short.

Anita Mattu 51:21

Yes, I can't echo that enough. Yeah. Yeah. Shoot. Just touched on this actually. What do older women understand about life that younger women may not even realize yet?

Jennifer Jefferies 51:35

Oh, that is so good. You know, that that I see, oh bloody influences drive me crazy. I see influences now, they're like 30 years old doing that because the wise woman's kind of getting airplay. And so, you know, 30-year-olds doing that. Be be a micro matriarch. I'm like, you're 30. A matriarch has got another 30 years' life on you. That's what makes us a matriarch. So that you have lived wisdom. You have all of those little experiences. I I see women who go, Yeah, but you know, I was just a housewife and raised three kids. Fu shit stay. Really? Do you know what you did? You raised three humans and you probably birthed three humans. You did something that just can't be done. Like, don't undervalue them. Don't undervalue yourself. Every woman, like I said, my podcast is about everyone from you know, I'm at the Ugandan old ladies soccer team. I've got a meeting with them on some Saturday to get them on the podcast.

Anita Mattu 52:40

Wow.

Jennifer Jefferies 52:40

They've got as much wisdom as someone who's written 50 books. Every woman has wisdom. It's time to own it. It's time to own how cool you are. Because the

Tears In Rehearsal And Real Courage

Jennifer Jefferies 52:55

youngins need to hear those stories. Our wisdom's travel, our wisdom travels in stories. And if I think about even the places, you know, well, like in Asia, when I'm up there, you know, every meal is like an hour and a half. But it's all about connection and story. Think about the Italians. You wouldn't dare go and have a meal in Italy, not with the whole family. You wouldn't. You're here in Australia and people don't even sit at the dinner table. The wisdom's not being shared in the Western world. And if people keep waiting for someone else to do it first and start, you dream it because everyone's busy. So the world is waiting for everyone just to start. Don't wait for someone else to go first. Do it. If you see something in an injustice, use your voice, especially on social media and things nowadays. Say no, not cool. Um if you see something, I you know, I actively, mindfully pay compliments to everyone of every age. I've as I've gotten older, and I'm a bloody shy introvert, but I really mindfully get outside my comfort zone and try and make other people's days. I learned that from my mum. It used to piss me off when I was young. I thought, gladie, Mum goes and talks to everyone. I realized as I've gotten older, I learned that from her. And it's a treasure to be able to do that. So every woman has wisdom to share. Gosh, I don't know. How to make pasta sauce properly, whatever is your thing.

Anita Mattu 54:31

Yeah.

Jennifer Jefferies 54:31

How to garden, how to, it's all wisdom. It's all knowledge that needs to be shared. My Pilates teacher asked me the other day, Jen, will you, because I gave her a pumpkin I grew myself, will you come around and teach me how to grow pumpkins? Because that was so different to the shop once. I went, I'd love to, Georgia. That's sharing wisdom. She's a 30-year-old woman who had no idea how to grow a pumpkin. It's that simple. That's just as important as doing a TED talk.

Anita Mattu 54:59

It's in every woman. It really is. Absolutely. Yeah. If there was one key takeaway you would like every listener to walk away with today, what would that be?

Jennifer Jefferies 55:12

Don't try and do everything at once. Okay, so I see people, you know, thinking, oh, I'm gonna do a healthy diet, and I'll try to change 50 things in one day, and then it's not sustainable. Whatever you're gonna do, it's gotta be sustainable or it won't bring long-term change. Simple. So instead of going for a two-hour run your first day when you haven't exercised for three years, go for a 10-minute walk and then the next day go for an 11-minute walk. And just be consistent at a pace that at whatever it is that's sustainable. For me, if I surf, you know, I aim for six days a week if conditions are right. Uh it's got to be something that's consistent. That's what's going to bring long-term change. So don't try and do everything at once. However, always do something. And if it's baby steps, baby steps. They they all add up. They they add up. We think we have to do the giant step all at once. No. Do the baby steps. Just keep moving forward.

Anita Mattu 56:16

So, Jen, where can the listeners find you online? Your book, TEDx Talk, your podcast, what's your website?

Jennifer Jefferies 56:23

Yeah, if my website is Jennifer Jefferies, J-E-W-F-E-R-I-E-S. Most people forget the E because I'm lazy and don't say it. Pretty simple. So jenniferjefferies.com

Present-Day Wise Woman Podcast Vision

Jennifer Jefferies 56:33

and on there is everything in my world is there. And my shop for the book, my books are also in Amazon and on Kindle and on Audiobook, all those things. And my other books are as well. Uh follow me on Instagram and Facebook. If you search the present-day wise woman, you'll find me or Jennifer Jeffries. And I've got Linktree's in that, which has got everything. YouTube, Jennifer Jeffries, Present Day Wise Woman. All simple. I keep it really simple. So you'll find me everywhere. The TED Talk is in the Linktree. Probably go on socials or on my website. We're loading up a page tonight, which is before you'll load this out, obviously. We're putting building the TED Talk and everything under the resource section on my podcast. On my website, you'll be able to do it. And all the links to all my podcasts and everything. Everything's on the website in one place. Nice and easy.

Anita Mattu 57:22

That's brilliant. And the links will be in the show notes, listeners. So please do go ahead and connect. Check it all out. It's a phenomenal resource, I can assure you.

Jennifer Jefferies 57:33

Yeah, there's free ebooks to download. There's lots of stuff. Lots of stuff.

Anita Mattu 57:42

I know this conversation will make a real difference with so many of the listeners. I truly appreciate taking the time out here. And I acknowledge you, Jennifer Jeffries.

Jennifer Jefferies 57:54

Thank you, Anita. I appreciate it so much. Thank you.

Anita Mattu 57:57

We are all about Create the Courage to Be Fearless podcaster. What is your definition of courage?

Jennifer Jefferies 58:03

Uh I say courage before confidence. So just take a breath, take a step. We never know where that step's gonna take us. Just courage is to take the first step.