Dates, Mates and Babies with the Vallottons
We’re the Vallottons, and we’re passionate about people! Every human was created for fulfilling connections in relationship and family, but it’s not always what comes easiest! We know this because of our wide range of personal experiences as well as years of working with people. So we’re going to crack open topics like dating, marriage, family and parenting to encourage, entertain and equip you for a deeply fulfilling life of relational health.
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Dates, Mates and Babies with the Vallottons
127. A Day in the Life, #2 (A peek into a big disconnection in the Vallottons' marriage!)
This episode is a vulnerable look into a recent real-life disconnection in the Vallotton's marriage! Every relationship experiences disconnection, but what matters is how we navigate back to each other. Hosts Jason and Lauren Vallotton share a recent experience where two weeks of limited quality time left them functioning as roommates rather than romantic partners.
• Jason feeling a lack of nurturing and tenderness in our interactions
• Lauren's problem-solving tendency sometimes coming across as harsh or critical
• The difference between "disgust" and constructive feedback in communication
• How personality differences (Enneagram Two vs Six) affect our relationship needs
• The crucial distinction between being good at "partnership" versus "lovership"
• Understanding that some relationship patterns can't be fixed in a single conversation
• The importance of both acknowledging issues and taking concrete steps toward change
The way you start difficult conversations will determine with 80% accuracy how they end. Remember that connection should always be the goal!
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For information on the Marriage Intensive and other resources, go to jasonandlaurenvallotton.com !
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We're the Valetans and we are passionate about people.
Speaker 1:Every human was created for fulfilling relational connection.
Speaker 2:But that's not always what comes easiest.
Speaker 1:We know this because of our wide range of personal experience, as well as our years of working with people.
Speaker 2:So we're going to crack open topics like dating, marriage, family and parenting to encourage, entertain and equip you for a deeply fulfilling life of relational health.
Speaker 1:Welcome back everyone to Dates, mates and Babies with the Valetins. Great to be here with you guys.
Speaker 2:It sure is. We are your hosts, the Valetins, and it is a happy Wednesday here in Redding California, just in the thick of it, with little kids. We laughed this morning. We left the house and we were both like what in the actual world? Like why did they try to both take us down and each other this morning that was wild it was a little bit of a wild morning.
Speaker 1:It was man.
Speaker 2:We're rethinking some parenting morning, some morning time parenting strategies. Our kids wake up, ready to fight. Do anybody else's kids like wake up ready to fight?
Speaker 1:Does anybody else's kids like wake up? Yeah, they're ready to throw down.
Speaker 2:I don't know. It's not their, it's not their best time of day.
Speaker 1:No.
Speaker 2:Bummer. Oh well, here we are. They're with the sitter now. We warned her fair and square.
Speaker 1:Before I left, I told her, if I was you, I would read a book to them both.
Speaker 2:Yeah.
Speaker 1:She was like oh, that's a good idea.
Speaker 2:Yeah, calm them down. Yeah, I was like yeah, they're these kids, they're savage this morning.
Speaker 2:Weird. Yeah Well, speaking of weird, we actually did an episode. It was episode 91, I think 90 or 91. And we called it A Day in the Life, 91. A Day in the life, and it was. We got so much great feedback. We basically kind of pulled back the curtain a little. I mean, we pull back the curtain on every episode. There's not really anything hidden here, folks, you know that. But we talked a little bit about like one of our big arguments and people just loved it.
Speaker 1:Yeah, we're back.
Speaker 2:So we thought, you know what we're going to do today. We're going to do a day in the life episode Cause we're fresh off of um a big weekend, a big marriage weekend, and I think that it would be. It was actually my, my idea. This will come as no surprise to you, but I'm the foe in our story today. Uh, I am the one who wow, babe I know. I have come to realize that most of our stories about our fights. I am actually the bad person.
Speaker 1:No, I'm not the bad one, babe.
Speaker 2:Maybe the catalyst I, yeah, maybe I'm a little bit more aggressive, a little bit more.
Speaker 1:You're like a Swiss watch, babe. You're just high end. You know it's a little bit more finicky. I'm like a chainsaw.
Speaker 2:I don't understand these analogies. It's going to start.
Speaker 1:It's going to work all the time.
Speaker 2:I don't know what these analogies are about, but what I have to tell you today, folks, is a story about how I was not awesome, and I'm actually really okay to share it, because I've gotten used to airing my dirty laundry in marriage, mostly because we're actually real good at working through this kind of stuff, and I think that if we walk you through a little bit of some of the most recent argument or the recent disconnection we had, I just imagine it will help some people. So and I I'm I'm obviously joking, I mean, there's not like a good guy or a bad guy, but I am the one that usually acts out and so, wow, that's always fun.
Speaker 1:Yeah, do you want to?
Speaker 2:start. Where do we begin? Well, okay, maybe I'll start with a little context, cause I love that.
Speaker 1:Yeah, you want to feel understood.
Speaker 2:Well, no, I just want to paint the backdrop. So we had, um, we've had a big couple of weeks. Jason went we mentioned last week that Jay had a brave co or a men's conference in Brazil that he went to. So we were apart for about a week. I had the kiddos and um, you know their ages right now like, actually, a week without Jay around is actually so much easier than it used to be with them being three and five. Now there's some parts of it that are easier. I actually took them to visit my grandmother in Colorado. So we did like a little trip the three of us while Jason was gone, but it was. It's a lot right, like having the kids like that for weeks a lot.
Speaker 2:Then we got home, so, happy to be home together, kind of jumped back into a very normal work week rhythm and never really reconnected so so by this past weekend we had gone nearly two weeks without a lot of connection and in that two-week span, well, in the week that we were home together we had some disconnection moments that didn't quite get resolved or that we just had some kind of residual emotions around.
Speaker 2:You were carrying some pain around. I was just not really super interested in reconnecting a lot. More subconsciously, I think, we just kind of plowed into work and kids and before we knew it, the weekend came along and I started feeling like, okay, we're going to have to carve out some time for this. We probably shouldn't go another week without actually intentionally reconnecting. So I took our daughter to a birthday party on Saturday and from the birthday party I'm sitting there with some other moms and I'm kind of realizing, you know, I'm like thinking about how I'm feeling. And I said I found myself saying out loud um, I probably need to go on a date night tonight, like I probably need to look for a sitter right now.
Speaker 1:And I did, right then, and there I haven't heard this story yet.
Speaker 2:I know. So we were sitting around chatting and a friend of mine, um Molly, was talking about how you know she and her husband were due for a date and I was like, yeah, yeah, same. Like, honestly, it's been two weeks since I really feel like I had a, had a, have a husband, like I have a friend at home, I have like this awesome partner he's pretty cool. He's cool. We're getting a lot done.
Speaker 2:Yeah, he cooks and things, but like I haven't really had a husband for a couple of weeks is what it feels like. And we laughed and I just said, honestly, I should just look for a sitter right now. So I texted Jay and I said should I get a babysitter for tonight? And he said, yeah, if you can. So, Long story short, Saturday, which is essentially the two-week mark of just not a lot of connection, Saturday evening we went out to dinner and I think we both knew that our dinner date was going to be a time to kind of open up and talk through whatever was going on. And we did, yeah, Take it from here, babe. Well, I mean.
Speaker 1:I felt like I had some unfinished, unresolved pain. Because, we had had a conversation earlier this week or last week, yeah, midweek.
Speaker 2:One of those disconnection points.
Speaker 1:And a disconnection point, and I can't actually remember what it was all about fully.
Speaker 2:Oh, I can tell you. It was that we had a few moments, that morning in particular, where you felt like I was being harsh and critical.
Speaker 1:Ah, yeah.
Speaker 2:And it was around breakfast time and we'd had. You know, liam threw his mason jar glass of smoothie off the counter and it shattered into five billion pieces, and so we had a couple moments that were like frustrating, but my level of like irritation about those moments and then just at the breakfast time, in general you could feel my irritation and my energy and you were like this isn't very fun yeah.
Speaker 1:So we had had a conversation um that morning where I basically told you like hey, this isn't really working very well for me and like this, as in our marriage, or what no? You're, you're. It's not frustration, it's the when I feel judgment.
Speaker 2:Yeah.
Speaker 1:Or your disgust. The disgust is the word. That's the word he was using.
Speaker 2:He used the word disgust a lot, you guys. He said when, I feel your disgust about something that I'm doing, saying, and I'm like, wow, that's harsh. Okay, I'm listening.
Speaker 1:I'm listening. Disgust is quite a word how it feels. It feels so painful, um, because it could be like an eye. It's a big sigh with an eye roll yeah walk past.
Speaker 2:There's a word, folks, for that?
Speaker 1:it's, it's it starts with a, b and it rhymes with it.
Speaker 2:there's five letters and it's not a kind word, but like there's a word for how I was acting. You know, think about that.
Speaker 1:And so we had had that conversation and it went. I would say it went 40%. Well, it didn't turn into an argument or anything.
Speaker 2:No.
Speaker 1:It just didn't get fully resolved. You were still flustered from the morning and then I think that just the weight of wow, this isn't working for me super well.
Speaker 2:Yeah.
Speaker 1:Just tipped the scale, so we hadn't fully reconnected. So when we went out to dinner I think in your mind we had already talked about the problem the problem earlier.
Speaker 2:We just hadn't really reconnected. Yeah, yeah.
Speaker 1:And for me, I was really feeling like we didn't. I didn't feel fully heard or seen or known, and I wanted to make sure that we talked about that stuff.
Speaker 2:Yeah.
Speaker 1:And so I had brought. I'd been feeling for a while too. Um, I'm a two on the Enneagram.
Speaker 1:I'm a six and she's a six and, uh, my, I am a high pleaser by nature. I love it. I love helping people, I've love fixing problems and I really love not having any problems or causing any problems, so this is an area that I can go a long time. I'm very tolerant, so that's why I have less issues in the sense of that's why I'm easier, because I just by nature I'm much more flexible and my need to please is really high. So I had been feeling for a while like I needed more. I wanted to feel wanted and nurtured, which probably probably some people are like that's an interesting word, but for me not like a mom nurtures a baby, but I think the nurtured for me is I want to feel cared for. I want it to feel like a soft landing when I come in.
Speaker 2:Yeah.
Speaker 1:And I think as a two on the Enneagram. I'm not an Enneagram specialist, by the way.
Speaker 2:Mm-mm.
Speaker 1:Some people are.
Speaker 2:Neither of us are.
Speaker 1:Shout out to our friend Margaret. We know a little bit Margaret's Enneagram specialist, but for me, my greatest fear is that I'll be unloved, and so it is like my greatest desire is to feel.
Speaker 1:Really loved on yeah tender, nurtured, loved on, cared for, and your greatest fear, according to the Enneagram, is that you'd be left alone and that you would be unsafe unsafe on your own to battle the world. And so that dynamic is an interesting one, because what happens at least what I experience is your need for safety control, um, to feel partnered with, is at the forefront, and that can often kick you into it. It it feels like what I experienced as criticism is sometimes your observations of danger.
Speaker 1:Yeah, what I experienced as criticism is sometimes your observations of danger.
Speaker 2:Yeah.
Speaker 1:What I experience as criticism can be your trying to create like order and, but to me it's a. It's like such a painful place.
Speaker 2:I think we should give some examples because, I think this is a common dynamic, but I think a lot of people misinterpret these kind of interactions like um I will say it's not all a misinterpretation oh, no, sorry.
Speaker 2:I mean, let's give some examples, because I think I know that because of how, I think I know that there's probably couples out there that have these kinds of interactions and rather than attributing it to, or rather than validating each other's experience, they can kind of dismiss it because it just looks like differences or oh, I didn't mean that, because that's what happens to us.
Speaker 2:A lot is like okay, let me gosh. I don't know if I can think of a specific example. But okay, how about this? Um, we're making breakfast in the morning and you grab a cereal bowl to mix up the eggs instead of a mixing bowl. Well, we're down to like five cereal bowls. Folks, I don't know if any of you can relate to this in your household, but, like dishes have broken over the years, silverware is gone. I don't know where it goes. I don't know what happens to it, but it's gone.
Speaker 2:We've got like five cereal bowls left and then a drawer full of mixing bowls. So the way my personality works is I am a we're actually both maximizers, but it works differently and I forecast out every single moment of my day. Every task that I do is with the future in mind in a bizarre, bizarre way, because who the actual heck cares what bowl you use to?
Speaker 1:mix up eggs, but in my left to myself.
Speaker 2:I promise you I care. So I'm like please use a mixing bowl, because later in the day when I'm going to serve the kids, food we're going to be out of the eating bowls and I'm going to have to use like a cup or something because everything's dirty. If you use a mixing bowl to stir the eggs up before you cook them, then I can serve my children in the actual dishes. Please don't use our dishes for mixing up eggs in the morning. But you know even just how I said it. Right then, just doesn't feel kind Right so.
Speaker 2:Jay would be like okay, it's one thing for you to say, can you please use a mixing bowl to scramble the eggs. It's another thing for me to feel disgust about my choice. Like that I chose a cereal bowl disgusts you. Or you can't believe what an idiot I am for having chosen a cereal bowl to scramble the eggs. You know, and I'm like okay, whoa bro, like that feels really sensitive to me in my personality. I'm like that feels really sensitive. I'm practically just saying to you I won't have bowls to serve the children lunch in if you use it now. But the way that I say it or how I communicate it so here's what I'm saying. Maybe you have those kinds of interactions in your marriage and your default is to go like that's not what I meant. Why are you? Why are you being so sensitive? Or why are you reading into it so much? Or why are you like this is you don't do the dishes, or you know, like except for except for he does.
Speaker 2:But I'm saying like in your marriage.
Speaker 1:Yeah, totally.
Speaker 2:And so the reason I want to give that example and to even say all of that is because, at the end of the day, it is those kinds of interactions, because of how Jay's wired and because of how I'm wired.
Speaker 2:It's those kinds of interactions that if we don't make room to validate each other and how you're feeling because of those kinds of interactions, I mean I could write it off as I didn't mean that or you're being too sensitive or whatever, but that doesn't do anything for our connection. And if our goal is connection, then it's important that I actually listen to him and how he's experiencing me, so that we can interact differently, so that our connection is protected. It doesn't do me any good to talk to him that way if it hurts his feelings. And so it's those kinds of interactions that he was feeling. They were heaped up on top of each other and he's basically telling me like, hey, often I feel your correction, your judgment, your criticism, your disgust, if we're going to use that word again. I feel that more often than I feel your softness, your kindness, your affection for me, I want to feel wanted, and those kinds of interactions leave me feeling like you don't love, care for, nurture me.
Speaker 1:Am I right? Yeah, you're spot on.
Speaker 2:Guys, see, I got it, I'm tracking.
Speaker 1:Yeah, you know, everybody is so different in the way that they receive. I love you.
Speaker 2:Yeah.
Speaker 1:And there's no such thing, really, as being too sensitive, being too sensitive. Uh, there's a, there's the message I love you, and there's a message I'm I'm not interested in what you need. I'm interested in what I need I need the cereal bowl more than I need you.
Speaker 1:Yeah, yeah, and so, um, what was really helpful in that conversation was I think I was able to express and explain to her that I'm experiencing pain in an area that is actually really painful for me and I feel really unseen in this area, because I'm way more sensitive in this area than she is, and and Lauren did a great job of listening, like she listened for a long time and mostly said at the beginning like, wow, okay, totally, I can understand. Um, and at first you thought that I was talking about our sex life or that that was a large piece of it. Maybe.
Speaker 2:No, well, I mean ish, but you left out this part. So what we kind of ended up talking about was how we tend to. We basically talked about like in our marriage we need, we want connection, like we really desire connection. And Jason said I can actually go pretty long feeling I can feel connected to you without having this other need met, the need being Without feeling honestly, without feeling super cared for you in this area.
Speaker 2:Yeah, he's like I can feel connected to you, but I have quieted my. Basically he's kind of like these are, these are my words. It seemed like you have kind of lowered your expectation for felt care in these kinds of areas. So we can feel connected, we can be connected, and you're still over here actually wanting more.
Speaker 1:Yeah, because the way also the difference is the way that you show care for me is much different than the way that I receive, and that's what Jason said that's what he said.
Speaker 2:Is you actually said to me I know you love me, I know you actually do care for me, you do things for me all the time, you show me that you care for me all the time. And I said yeah, I probably show you that I love you in the ways that I enjoy receiving love more so.
Speaker 2:I said I'm pretty good. I'm really good at acts of service. I do things for you all. I said I'm pretty good, I'm really good at acts of service. I do things for you all the time I'm. I'm pretty good at words of affirmation I've gotten better at that over the years and I'm really good at gifts and remembering and thinking about you. Um, I'm probably not. I'm not as good at physical touch, which is your number one, and physical touch slash, that kind of like lovey nurturing thing, which is funny because I'm actually pretty quite nurturing by nature. But anyways, for whatever reason, in marriage I just tend to not overly nurture.
Speaker 2:Maybe, I don't know, we could psychoanalyze that later but then you said yeah, and I said I'm really good at partnership. I'm not as great at lovership.
Speaker 1:It's true.
Speaker 2:And he was like yes, that's true. That was really a helpful distinction and as I said it, I was thinking to myself like right, those kind of like lovey nurturing Jason eats that up, like it's actually a part of how his love language is really. That it's like the really lovey Carrie and I have a friend who's a two on the Enneagram and she is that in her marriage she's so affectionate, she's so lovey.
Speaker 1:I would hate that she's so affectionate and she's so lovey.
Speaker 2:I would hate that. She's so affectionate and I'm always looking at her like where does that even come from? Like I don't even have that bone in my body Like I can nurture a child when they scrape their knee, but for some reason the nurturing lovey, like really affectionate lovey dovey, you know, in my marriage it just doesn't come as naturally. And so when I said that out loud I'm not as good at lovership, but I'm great at partnership it was kind of a light bulb and Jay felt really seen and heard in that moment, but where I took it was.
Speaker 2:I said, you know, cause of the physical touch thing. I said something about how I kind of felt. I feel like if you were more satisfied in our sex life, that tank would be full in a way that is not currently.
Speaker 1:And the truth is is that that's not the truth for me?
Speaker 2:I'm.
Speaker 1:I'm actually the most satisfied ever I've ever been in our sex life. So he made that clarification and I know that, like you're pretty attentive to that area of life and there's always areas to grow and things- like that, but for me we could have great sex and I could still walk away.
Speaker 2:Not feeling nurtured. Cared for, Not feeling nurtured, yeah.
Speaker 1:And so this was a great for us. This was a great conversation because it's like a big pain point for me that led to me feeling more seen, known, cared for. Yeah, and it wasn't even a hard conversation. You did such a great job listening and not being defensive and like really engaging with me in the conversation.
Speaker 2:Yeah.
Speaker 1:And then man the next day like whole new woman.
Speaker 2:I mean it doesn't take much, that's what I found. It really doesn't take much. It's awareness. But okay, let me say a couple of things. Are we good on time?
Speaker 2:Let me say a couple of things, because there were some things about that conversation that were really hard for me, and it's hard because, well, you don't want to let your spouse down, you don't want to be the cause of a problem. I, you know, told you at the beginning, like most of our really hard conversations, our most frequent hard conversations are actually more about me managing or not managing my high emotions or my um if jason is a pleaser back to that word disgust, whatever. Um, it's a bummer, that that's the word. But you know what? It's just true, the attitude the attitude of like disdain.
Speaker 2:Yeah, I'd use the other word, but it's even more okay um, if jason is a high pleaser and he said this to me jay's a high pleaser on the. You know, in his personality I'm more like, um, I love, I love connection, I love peace, I love fun. It's not like I'm over here trying to like blow stuff up all the time, but. But what's true is if I have a need, I'm quick to speak. If I need something or want something, or if something's not going the way that works for me, I'm quick to speak up. Hey, that didn't feel good to me, like, if, if I do feel like you have an attitude with me, or if you treat me poorly in a moment, I am very fast to recognize it and let you know. And Jay said you're actually a lot better at that than me. And I said finally, thank you, there's something that I'm better at than you in this marriage. Um, but what that? What happens there is? You know, I come off as less, I'm less focused on him. I think he feels like I'm less focused on loving on him, more focused on making sure that things are going the way that I need them to go. And so in this conversation, um, you know, I'm wired a certain way, and so I started feeling as we were talking. I was like, wow, this isn't. I'm wired a certain way. And so I started feeling, as we were talking, I was like, wow, this isn't.
Speaker 2:I'm very uncomfortable in this position because he's actually talking. He's not talking about an isolated event where I hurt his feelings. He's not talking about this one thing that happened. He's actually talking about like the way I am, it's not. I can't actually be like, oh my gosh, I'm so sorry, I did that that one time. I'll never do that again. I'm like I would like to say I'll never behave like that again. But this is the way I think this is the way that my brain works. I'm like in a groove here. Obviously it's not working for you. It matters to me that I grow and change, but I'm uncomfortable because I actually don't know what to say to make this right. So it's often, you know, common in a conflict or in a conversation or like when your spouse confronts you about something best case scenario you can kind of like repent right there and change and like commit to a new way forward. But because we're talking so much about the way that my brain works, the way that my, the way that I communicate, it's like I'm 40. These aren't.
Speaker 2:This is a big ship to turn is how it felt in the moment, and so I actually voiced out loud which I think this is helpful, like this is kind of a key maybe for some of you is. I actually said out loud I hear you, this matters a lot to me. I don't quite know what to say because I'm aware I can't just say something right here and make you trust me in this area. It's going to have to be like I'll acknowledge that what you're saying matters to me and then I guess I'll have to work on this, like I don't know really what else to say. And I think why that matters is because sometimes in your marriage you don't actually know how to make it right in the moment, or there isn't a way to just quote make it right right there.
Speaker 2:If you've got a pattern or like a history of behavior that's destructive or leads to disconnection, sometimes you can't just fix it right then and there. And you have to be okay with okay. I guess we're going to be on a little journey here for a minute, cause he does not trust me in this area, so much so that he's willing to lower his expectations of my ability to care for him and find other ways to feel connected. Whoa, that that takes some doing like that's been some time that we've worked on this dynamic. So now we have to reverse that, or at least I have to bring a new energy to this part of our marriage so that he feels cared for. That's probably not going to just happen over dinner tonight, you know. So I think that's probably not going to just happen over dinner tonight. So I think that's just a good thing to be aware of.
Speaker 1:Sometimes you can't just fix it. Yeah Well, acknowledging it and making some real steps forward is the key in setting yourself up for success. I did so much when we first got married. The way that I'm wired, I would you know. I would just assume hug you, rub your shoulders as, take out the trash and pick up stuff, and so that was a life shift for me. For me, that setting the alarm on my phone the house has needs was my way of like.
Speaker 1:I have to remember every single day to teach myself, to do something that I don't do naturally and normally and my home life was different, what clean was at home and what clean is for you and what's normal. You know, and my upbringing is so different and so I think it's part of part of maturity is going through these areas and even though it was a part of your normal or it was a part of my normal, it's part of my wiring. Well, our brain is a neuroplastic is a neuroplastic so you can remold and reshape and relearn and retool, and that's part of loving somebody.
Speaker 1:Part of loving someone is I don't do what's good for me, right? I do what's best for us, and so, anyways, we love to share some of our challenging places and how we walk through them Because, honestly, we're in the same boat as everybody else, right, we have challenges and we have highs and we have lows, and the biggest thing is how you have the conversation, how you move towards one another, being a great listener, really understanding, and then, you know, making some, taking some action.
Speaker 2:And ownership, and ownership. Yeah, it's big yeah.
Speaker 1:Hopefully you guys enjoy this week yeah, you're welcome folks. We're learning, we're growing, we're doing it we are, and if you're in the middle of you know one of those big pain points, maybe stop and think through how I start this conversation.
Speaker 1:We'll decide how it ends with 80% accuracy, talked about that a lot. You can only solve one person's emotions at a time. You can only handle them one at a time. There has to be a listener and there has to be a talker, and make sure that that your goal is connection, not to be right and not to win, and if you do those things, these kinds of conversations will go really great. That's right. So y'all have an incredible week. We'll see you next week. Bye you.