Imperfect Marketing
Imperfect Marketing
Why Podcast Guesting Beats Social Media?
Ever wonder how to grow your business without constantly chasing leads?
In this episode of Imperfect Marketing, host Kendra Corman sits down with podcast guesting expert Julie Fry to unpack the power of effortless visibility—and why podcast interviews are the underused goldmine of relationship-based marketing.
Julie shares how one early (and very imperfect) podcast appearance led to $40,000+ in business, and how you can replicate that success—without being salesy or pitching to the wrong shows. From defining your goals to landing on the right podcasts and delivering value that gets remembered, this episode is full of practical wisdom and confidence-building insights.
🎧 Whether you’re a coach, consultant, or service provider trying to stand out, this episode is your guide to getting seen, heard, and hired through podcast guesting.
📨 What We Cover:
🎯 How to Define Your Podcast Guesting Goals
🔍 Finding the Right-Fit Podcasts (and What to Avoid)
📈 What Makes a Pitch Stand Out—and Get Accepted
🎤 How to Be a Guest That Hosts Want to Promote
🔥 Julie’s Key Takeaways:
- Start with your goals. “Why do you want to guest on podcasts? Keep asking yourself ‘why’ until you hit the real answer.”
- It’s not about a massive audience. It’s about the right audience.
- Be respectful of the host. Do your research, offer unique value, and make it easy for them to say yes.
- Don’t treat a guest spot like a sales pitch. Tell stories, share insights, and let your credibility shine through naturally.
- Schedule your marketing! What gets scheduled gets done—and podcasting is no different.
“If you can be a great guest who adds value, builds trust, and actually promotes the episode, you become memorable—and that leads to real results.” – Julie Fry
📣 Ready to show up with confidence and consistency in your marketing? This episode will help you build momentum—one conversation at a time.
🔗 Connect with Julie Fry:
Website: yourexpertguest.com
LinkedIn: Julie Fry
🎧 Listen & Subscribe to Imperfect Marketing for weekly inspiration on connecting with your audience—authentically.
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Hi, I'm Kendra Korman. If you're a coach, consultant or marketer, you know marketing is far from a perfect science and that's why this show is called Imperfect Marketing. Join me and my guests as we explore how to grow your business with marketing tips and, of course, lessons learned along the way. Hello and welcome back to another episode of Imperfect Marketing. I'm your host, Kendra Korman, and today I am really excited to be talking about effortless visibility and really like how that is all about podcast guesting with a very special guest, julie Fry. Thank you so much for joining me, julie Hi Kendra.
Speaker 2:Thank you so much for joining me, julie Hi Kendra. Thank you so much for having me so how did you get into podcast guesting?
Speaker 2:That's the question that I always get when I'm at a networking event or a family function. So how did you start that business? Because it is very niche. It's very specific. Prior to this business, I ran a women's networking organization for women balancing entrepreneurship and motherhood, and I ran that for seven years.
Speaker 2:Early on in the business, I was invited to be a guest on somebody's podcast, and this was in 2013. So podcasts were still a thing, but in a much smaller way than they are now. I appeared on this podcast. I did everything wrong. I didn't listen to an episode before I did the interview, I didn't share it when it went live, I didn't have an external mic, I just you know all the things, but what good thing came out of it is relationship with the host, who I was an early guest, but she went on to have her podcast for 11 years. Over the course of time we became friends, we became referral partners. I can directly track back I don't know $40,000, $50,000 worth of business to my business because of that one podcast episode. That led to other things. So that is really why I started this business in May of 2020, because women needed a way to stay visible, because the world was shut down.
Speaker 1:Otherwise, I love that story first off, because it's just sort of like meant to be right. You find something and then it's like, okay, sure I'll do it. I don't know what I'm doing, and then it still turns into something amazing. So nobody has enough time to do marketing, right? That's the thing I get all the time. That's part of why my yeah right, me too. I'm trying to think. The last time I posted, I'm hoping I'm posting on social media this week. How do you find the right podcasts, let alone pitch to them?
Speaker 2:It is a little bit of art and a little bit of science. We at my company have a framework that we walk through when we're looking at either right fit podcasts for our clients that we do it for. We also build customized lists for our clients if they have the resources to do it themselves. So step number one and you probably do this as well with your clients is what's the goal? What do you want to get out of your marketing? For some clients it's lead generation. For some it's building a referral network. For some they're launching a book. So getting clear on what your goal is then drives the strategy around what podcasts to look for? Okay, before you go any further.
Speaker 1:Did you hear that? What's your goal? Start with the goal, not just like posting on social media or guesting on podcasts because someone else did it or someone else told you to do it. What's the goal? Who are you trying to reach and what are you trying to do with it? I mean, it's so basic, but it's so important because so many of us people forget to.
Speaker 2:They skip that step and go right to that. I want to be on 30 podcasts this year. Well, why? Well, because it'll get me heard by people who don't know about me. Why, and just keep saying why until you get to the real reason of why you really want to be on these podcasts. Another way to look at it is ask yourself the question what does success look like to you if you've been on X number of podcasts at the end of the year? And that kind of can help define what route you're going to take when you're looking for the right fit shows.
Speaker 1:I love that. Okay, so start with your goals, then what's the?
Speaker 2:next, who are your ideal clients or who's your target audience? Who are you trying to reach? Is it business owners that are in the healthcare field? Is it consultants? Is it marketing agency owners? Is it a mix of a lot of different things? Those are always fun because there's a lot of different things. Those are always fun because there's a lot of podcasts out there, and there are podcasts literally for every possible niche. You can imagine. We were just asked to build a list for somebody that helps people with alternative investments, specifically in collectibles, and guess what, there's a podcast for that. I was really that was like I don't know if there's a podcast for that. I was really that was like I don't know if there's a podcast about investing in collectibles, but there is.
Speaker 1:You're definitely like in the lead right now for podcast guest of the year on imperfect marketing. See, I'm not the only one that says this stuff, okay, I'm just saying okay, start with your goals. Who do you want to reach? Let's go from there. You gotta identify your target audience, so perfect, okay.
Speaker 2:You've gotten clear on who you wanna reach, or the buckets of who you wanna reach, and now the fun begins. You get to start looking for the shows. We're lucky because we have some tools at our disposal to make it a little bit faster, but you still have to go through these steps. So, step one you're searching for keywords. You're searching, maybe, in social media. You've noticed some of your competitors showing up on podcasts. Those are great places to start. You want to talk about something different, your unique point of view about whatever the topic is. But since you know somebody who was on that show, chances are they are taking guests and would welcome you on the show too.
Speaker 2:So do some searching in the podcast platforms. You can use Google, you can use AI to start asking questions. What podcasts are marketing agency owners listening to? You'll get a whole list of podcasts. Then you get to do the fun piece of going to their websites and poking around, learning about the hosts, looking to see does the podcast take guests? Is it still active? And once you've answered those two questions, then you want to start to see, like, how long has the podcast been around? Are people actually listening to the podcast? So checking those kind of three basic criteria off. Your checklist is a great place to start. Then you can start narrowing down and doing kind of some finer level details of research.
Speaker 1:Let's talk about, like the podcasts themselves, right? So are people listening? How many people really need to be listening to make it worthwhile?
Speaker 2:That's such a good question. We are a fan of target the right audience, not the size of the audience. Bigger is not better, because where our clients see the biggest ROI meaning they're actually getting leads and new clients from podcast appearances getting leads and new clients from podcast appearances they're typically industry-specific podcasts. So right now I'm on a show that's mostly for coaches, consultants, solopreneurs, business owners. Those are people that really resonate with our services so I like to go on those shows. We have clients that are hiring strategists and she does really well with creative agency owners, architects, interior designers, that sort of thing. So it's not about the size of the audience, it's about who's listening. So I'm a big fan of those industry verticals when you can find shows that are about the business of that particular business, Okay.
Speaker 1:So I love that you said that, because I was in a meeting a couple months ago with a client in a PR firm and the PR firm was like well, we need to see and make sure it's worthwhile. And I'm like, how do you define worthwhile? And they were doing it by audience size and I'm like I'm good if there's 10 people, if those 10 people are the right about impressions, right.
Speaker 2:So it's that mindset shift of it's not about the size of the audience, it's about who's listening. So, yeah, we're totally aligned there.
Speaker 1:All right, so let's talk about what are some best practices when you're pitching your information.
Speaker 2:So after you've gone through that checklist of making sure they take guests still active they have, you know, 20 or 30 episodes then you, before you start pitching, go to their website, look at the about page, learn about the host. What's their business? Are they a competitor? So if they're a competitor, you might want to think twice about pitching them, because unless there's some unique angle that you're offering Unless there's some unique angle that you're offering, maybe you could be I don't know collaboration partners Chances are they're going to say no because you're doing the exact same thing. So you might want to rule out competitors if you look at the about page and you see you do the same thing. But assuming that you don't, the about page can give you really great clues. Like, for example I looked at your about page, I saw that you're in Michigan and went to Michigan State, I think, hopefully for my MBA. Good job, yeah. So my uncle was the basketball coach at Michigan State University.
Speaker 2:So if I were pitching you, I would include that little detail just to create rapport. That's why you want to look at that about page, because it can give you all sorts of great clues. That warms up your pitch so you don't sound like everybody else that is using the same old tired template from five years ago. It says I love your podcast and I love that episode with Susie Q and you're just like nope, delete. And now, with AI, there are some tells when people are using AI to write the pitches. So, anyway, look for unique ways that you can differentiate yourself, because if you can get their attention in that first couple of lines, chances are they'll keep reading.
Speaker 1:So when you're pitching and you're talking about your angle or whatever it is that you talk about, I get people that are like oh yeah, I specialize in marketing, I'd love to be on your show. I'm like delete, I'm like I don't have the capacity to research you, right, right. So you want to make it easy. When I'm trying to determine who's going to be a guest, I don't want to be trying to figure out who you are and what you do and what value you can add to my audience. I want you to do that for me.
Speaker 2:Yes, that's the idea. So the other thing too. So you've looked at the about page. You've poked around on the website. You also want to look to see does the host have an application? Because if they do, they've created a workflow that works for them and you want to honor that. So they have an application, apply via the application. Don't follow up right away, because they're probably only going to review it once a month maybe. So that would be the piece around looking at their website. What do they do? Who do they do it for? What's your angle of how you're going to connect with them? Then, real short what do you do? Who do you do it for? It does not. It should not be 500 words, you know.
Speaker 2:Short paragraph, maybe one or two sentences. Then suggest what you want to talk about. What do you want to have a conversation about? Be specific. Look at previous episodes. What haven't they talked about that you would align with? That would make sense for their audience. Give a few takeaways. What are the listeners going to learn? Show them that you understand their audience. Say something specific about their audience, what they might struggle with and how you can help. Then tell them how they can check you out.
Speaker 2:Share some previous episodes that you've done. If you haven't done anything, then some sort of media credibility places you've spoken that sort've done. If you haven't done anything, then some sort of media credibility places you've spoken that sort of thing your website, wherever they can find you on social media. And if you have a one sheet, that's a great place to share it too and then tell them how you're going to share the episode. That's the number one pet peeve for most podcasters is. I had this guest on. They were great. They just ghost me when the episode comes out. What's up with that? So share it. Let them know how you're gonna share the episode. Will you share it with your social media followers? Put it on your website what you're gonna do, because that will go a long way in helping you stand out among everybody else, as long as you actually do it, don't just say you're going to do it and not do it.
Speaker 1:And don't get me wrong, it's work, I get it.
Speaker 1:It's work to promote my podcast every week right so, it is work, and they'll understand if you don't do it on the day the episode releases right so, but just work it into your plan so that you do share it, because that's one of the reasons that they have guests is to grow their audience too, and it's a nice way to say thank you, which I love.
Speaker 1:Okay, so one of the things that you said is what their audience is going to learn, and I feel like that is so important. I didn't screen a guest a long time ago and they basically made it into a sales pitch and I'm like I don't even know if I want to release this and unfortunately I was behind, so I had to release it because I was getting it too close back in the day and I mean it was horrible. There was no value for my audience. It was literally a 20-minute commercial of them selling themselves. So what kind of advice are you giving people, your clients and those people looking to do podcast guesting when it comes to how do they sell, like, how are they taking it to the next level without selling?
Speaker 2:Good question. So nobody wants to listen to a 30-minute sales pitch. The key to having successful podcast interviews is you just want to create that connection right. It's going to accelerate the know like trust factor. You need to be prepared with a next step. So at the end of the interview, share a resource they can download. Or if you help people with a free consultation, share that, but something to get them to connect with you if it's something that's of interest to them to take that next step with you. And you can also, throughout the interview, you know you something that's of interest to them to take that next step with you. And you can also, throughout the interview you know you can share stories of how you work with your clients. You can share what you do Like you can share the different ways you work with people so that you're planting that seed along the way, so that when you get to the end, people kind of have a sense of like, oh okay, julie Fry, like her company helps book people on podcasts and they do lists and okay, I kind of get it.
Speaker 2:Those are the ways and you just want to be. It's funny. I say this to my kids all the time like be interesting, but you don't need to be like the most inspiring person around. Just be a good conversationalist. And it's a two way street. You don't want to hog the dance floor because people are here for Kendra. They're not here for me. They're following you because of you, so we want to be respectful of that too.
Speaker 1:They're following me because of my amazing guests, so give them good value, week after week after week, because it's really about figuring out how to do what we do better. Right, no matter what your specialty is, we're always out there marketing and selling, and so how we can do that better, more effectively and efficiently. Everybody wants that, so that's good, okay. So the next question I have is so you're going to teach something, right? But a lot of people struggle with how they're different, how they're special. Oh, there's so many other people that are better than me. Like, how can I really add value? Because everybody talks about X, y or Z?
Speaker 2:That's a tough one because it's a mindset thing, right, and I struggle with it too sometimes. I mean, I'm not the only person who has an agency that does this. And so, thinking about what does make you unique, what's your USP, unique selling proposition, what does differentiate you? So I think that's a good time to take a step back and think about. In your business there are most likely people that do the same thing that you do. So what's the one thing that makes you different? And if you can't figure that out, that is okay.
Speaker 2:Because, like, back to this imperfect marketing, to practice doing this, having a conversation. Sometimes I say things I'm like, oh, I did not say that, right, but it's okay. Like nobody's gonna email me after the episode and say, julie, I can't believe you said that that way. It sounded so stupid. Nobody's going to say that. So I think the key is to show up, do it anyway, kind of push through that feeling of imposter syndrome. And while you're having these conversations this is the great benefit of being a guest is you start to realize what your unique messaging is, and it's a great tool. Honestly, if you're thinking about starting a podcast I know you help people with that is to guest first, because you get that practice in about figuring out what is my thought leadership, what am I gonna talk about? So those are just some pieces of advice and also recognizing that sometimes you're gonna feel like am I really qualified to talk on this podcast? But you are.
Speaker 1:Yeah, definitely, and I think I love using podcast guesting to determine whether or not you want to have a podcast, because it's a great way to expand your network, to start building a network and also to see how people run their shows. I learn so much for my podcast guesting on other people's pod I'm like, oh, that's cool, I'm totally stealing that. You know, I was actually listening to podcasts and they had their guests introduce themselves with stories and I'm like, oh my gosh, I'm starting that. So you know, this year I started having my guests introduce themselves because it's way better than some bio that I could read off of a screen. You know that is anywhere from 30 seconds to five minutes. Usually I'm the one that accidentally sends the five minute one.
Speaker 2:Yeah, to experience it and see what you like and what you don't like, and then you can borrow that to create your own great podcast.
Speaker 1:Yeah, so this is amazing. I hope that you guys all are learning something out of this, because it really is about those fundamentals why do you wanna do it, what's your goal, who's your audience? And then, where are they hanging out, who are they listening to? Right and finding those and then identifying the value you can add to that podcast for their audience is just so important, and know that you can add value. Everybody has a different story and a different example and a different twist on everything, so you can still talk about the same things.
Speaker 1:Again, I talk all the time about start with your goals. Do your target audience. You know, again, that's important stuff in the basics, but we talked about it in a different way today and I think that that makes it really easy for people to apply that. So hopefully this will get you guys confident in wanting to do podcast guesting. So before I let you go, julie, I do want to hear from you. The show is called Imperfect Marketing. As we said, this marketing is anything but a perfect science. It's definitely part art and part science. What has been your biggest marketing lesson learned along the way?
Speaker 2:My biggest lesson is probably marketing doesn't just happen, you have to schedule it. I was really struggling with doing anything to market the business up until a year ago and then I sort of had this epiphany like, oh yeah, we book people on podcasts. I should probably schedule time in my month to pitch myself for speaking and podcast guesting, and so I think it was last April I started doing that and I block 90 minutes once a month with a goal of getting out two or three pitches, and it's been great because it has kept my calendar full. And then the fun part of once you start guesting on more podcasts, you start getting invited onto other people's podcasts because people hear you or people make an introduction. So that's been my biggest mistake and lesson is you have to block the time to do it.
Speaker 1:Oh, I love that because I'm a big fan of time blocking. It doesn't happen if it's not on the schedule. I actually have a friend of mine who he said that his wife doesn't actually have access to book anything on his calendar his work calendar and the reason why is because she'd mess with him and he does whatever is on his calendar. So if, like, she could send him to another state and he'd be there.
Speaker 2:Yeah, go buy flowers and make a reservation at our favorite restaurant.
Speaker 1:He'd have a meeting at a restaurant, yeah, and he'd be like, oh, oh, this is, this is us for lunch, ok, so it's funny. But, yes, what gets scheduled gets done right, and I think that that's really important to keep in mind. So that's such a great lesson to keep in mind. So, julie, we'll have your contact information and ways to get in touch with you in the show notes, but if people are listening and want to connect with you, oh, your favorite social media platform.
Speaker 2:It's LinkedIn and it's Julie Fry Fry like French fry, not like the boot.
Speaker 1:If they want to connect with you and learn more about podcast guesting and how you can help them, where should they go?
Speaker 2:Go to yourexpertguestcom.
Speaker 1:Perfect. Well, I hope you got a lot out of this episode. I know I did. I love podcasting and I love hosting guests that add value, and so a thing to keep in mind is that you're adding value for the host. Right, they wanna have guests, they need you, so hopefully you will take this opportunity to go ahead and see how podcasting might fit in your business. Thanks again, so much for tuning in to another episode of Imperfect Marketing. Until next time, have a great rest of your day.
