Imperfect Marketing
Imperfect Marketing
329: How Do You Turn Podcast Listeners Into Paying Clients?
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In this episode of Imperfect Marketing, I sit down with Virginia Elder, podcast strategist and founder of a podcasting-for-business agency. We talk about how podcasting builds trust, drives leads, and becomes a powerful growth tool—without chasing perfection.
We cover:
Why Imperfection Builds Trust
- How over-editing hurts connection
- Why pauses, breaths, and authenticity matter
- The danger of sounding “too polished”
Podcasting for Business (Not Just Downloads)
- Why podcasts should support your core business
- How podcasting turns listeners into leads
- Why sponsorships aren’t the best fit for most service businesses
The C.R.A.F.T. Framework
- Content: Speak directly to your ideal client’s real concerns
- Repurpose: Turn episodes into video clips, emails, blogs, and posts
- Ask: One clear call to action—every time
- Feature: Guests who serve your audience and business goals
- Track: Measure leads, referrals, speaking gigs, and opportunities
Practical Podcasting Advice
- Start monthly if weekly feels overwhelming
- Use tools like Riverside or Descript to simplify production
- Choose a podcast name people actually search for
If you’re using (or considering) a podcast as part of your marketing strategy, this episode will help you stop overthinking and start using it intentionally.
Connect with Virginia Elder:
Website: https://podcastabundance.com/
LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/virginiaelder/
Facebook: https://www.facebook.com/podcastabundance
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Welcome And Why Podcasting Matters
SPEAKER_00Hi, I'm Kendra Corman. If you're a coach, consultant, or marketer, you know marketing is far from a perfect science. And that's why this show is called Imperfect Marketing. Join me and my guests as we explore how to grow your business with marketing tips and, of course, lessons learned along the way. Hello and welcome back to another episode of Imperfect Marketing. I'm your host, Kendra Corman, and today I'm excited to be talking about one of my favorite topics, which is podcasting, especially for business. Welcome, Virginia. Thank you so much for joining me today. Thanks for having me, Kendra. And just so you guys know, we did chat before this and we could have kept going on and on and on. But at some point we had to hit record because um, so loving chatting with her so much. And I think you're gonna love what she has to share too. So um tell us, how did you get into podcasting?
SPEAKER_02When my kids were teeny tiny, so don't get scared here because I'm not gonna go back to like when I was in high school or anything. But when my kids were young, which is now 13-ish years ago, which is shocking to say, we had actually just recently helped my mom through a massive financial situation, and it really took a toll on our situation. So all the moms out there just like put yourself in my shoes for a sec, a pile of debt because you did like a heart-led decision to help your own mother. And you have two little bitty babies, a two-year-old and a newborn, and a pile of debt, and you have 20 bucks in your bank account, and you don't get paid for two weeks. And you and your husband both have full-time jobs doing well, you know, right? Like the the corner office that people dream of, and it just wasn't working because of the commitment I'd made. So, where did I turn? Podcasts. Believe it or not, uh, binge listening financial podcasts taught me everything uh that I wasn't taught as a kid. That um, you know, I've learned how to pay off this debt. We got out of debt within three and a half years. Um, we started investing. I learned everything from these podcasters that I had no idea what they looked like, but that were just there for me consistently. And at that point, of course, I fell in love with podcasting and I was still in the corporate world. I didn't quite have this path figured out, but I felt like, you know what? Like a lot of the folks that I listen to, I love them, but they were all dudes. It's like all these, you know, the financial and these guys were great. They're not like the financial bros. But I started to think about like, where are the women, where are the moms that can speak to daycare and diapers and debt, right? Maybe that should have been the title to that first show.
SPEAKER_01There you go. Perfect.
SPEAKER_02But that was the step that led me in. I started my own show, um, went to a financial podcasting conference shortly after that, and met other young women there. And they asked me to launch their show since I had just done mine. And that wasn't expected. Like that was not part of the plan, but that was obviously the push from the universe saying, like, well, this is your new direction. So um, that was when I started this business in 2019 and been working podcasts for business ever since.
Imperfection, Humanity, And Light Editing
SPEAKER_00Very cool. Congratulations. And thank you so much for sharing that story. It's uh, I know there's a lot of people that find themselves in different situations, right? And a lot of us turn to podcasts for lessons and learning. And some people are like, oh my gosh, like, where did I get that from? And I'm like, I got that from TikTok. Um, we're podcasts, right? Um, but yeah, you build a relationship with the people on the podcast, even though you don't necessarily know them, right? You hear them, you listen to them on a consistent basis, and they're sharing real practical information that helps you as you go. So that's fantastic. So we want to talk about imperfect podcasting, which I'm a huge fan of, right? I just sort of some days I sort of wing it. I plan it to an extent, right? But there's some imperfection here. But why does that build more trust? Do you see, and more stronger relationships than being perfect?
SPEAKER_02Yeah. Well, in most marketing, we're looking at models. And even these days, we could be looking at AI and not even realize that's not a real person we're looking at. It's so creepy. But that's what folks are looking for is the human and to know that this is like a real person that if I had, you know, if I had their phone number, I could call them, we could talk, we could actually interact. And that's what folks are looking for these days. So I'm not gonna say don't edit your show because we all make mistakes or hate the way we breathe too heavily or something like that, right? But uh some light editing is always necessary. Take a break to just really listen to yourself and find the humanity and the connection in your voice. Maybe the pause is necessary, maybe that deep breath or sigh is necessary to convey emotion. So there are imperfections that we do all the time that create trust because they're a human reaction to whatever was just said or the topic that you're discussing. So the caution there is definitely not to over-edit. And with the video these days and um, you know, video world and podcasting world are getting married very quickly. So, you know, don't be afraid to get on video. Um, people really do want to see your face. I don't care how many wrinkles you have. Maybe, maybe they're looking for someone with some maturity to their face, right? Like, don't be afraid of what you look like or what your background is. That imperfection and that realistic uh view that people are um really craving these days might be exactly what you're able to provide.
SPEAKER_00I really like that because I do not want to listen to any of my first, I don't know, 100 episodes and then a sprinkling of episodes here and there because I'm not happy with them, right? Some of them are over-edited. I have I edit out every a so and um and everything that went with it. And now, and then they actually sounded stiff at times because there were like it just wasn't natural speech. And so that over-editing is really not ideal because you lose that flow and that connection and it does, it feels over-edited. If you want to get rid of your ums, go to Toastmasters and practice getting rid of your ums. Yes.
Video, Over‑Editing Pitfalls, And Style
SPEAKER_02Well, and there's um different styles these days, right? So we have to be cautious about like what is my business's style. Of course, there's the highly edited like TikToks and Instagrams where it's like the person never even takes a breath in 90 seconds and they are just going, right? And clearly, um, you can see there's cut, cut, cut, cut, cut, cut. I mean, they must have spent hours on that one clip. That is a style these days. I can watch those. I've learned to digest that type of fast content. My husband is like, I don't even know what the guy said. All I could see was just like flashing before my eyes with all the cuts. So keep in mind your audience as well when you're thinking about your editing style, your business style. I mean, that's very much like a visual example, but for sure in podcasts as well. You may be able to listen to a show and hear like a like a bump or a breath cut off. There's little things that maybe everyone doesn't hear, but I hear them so loudly. So yeah, I'm specific to it now as a mature editor, but that's the kind of stuff that bothers me. I'm like, I would have so much preferred you to take your full breath, then if there was an excess pause, maybe cut that. Or there's different techniques that you can do, but think about what is your style and how you can convey the authenticity of your show, but also be able to clean it up a little bit. There's there is a happy medium.
SPEAKER_00Yeah. No, I think that that is really great to think about it, right? You can definitely clean it up, definitely have an editor, you can definitely balance the sound and all that fun stuff because sound quality is really important, especially um on podcasts, but it's not always about perfection. And people want to hear the pauses to an extent. Right. I didn't want any five-minute pauses, but we'll get there. All right. So let's talk a little bit about podcasting and business. When it comes to podcasting for business, there should be a return, is usually my belief. And I've had several guests that have talked about monetizing podcasts and things like that. But you have a formula, right? A craft formula that talks about changing listeners into leads. Can you tell us more about that? Yeah, for sure.
Business Focus: ROI From Podcasting
SPEAKER_02So I work specifically with financial professionals for the most part. I have had like a few medical professionals and business coaches and things like that. But the key is they all talk about money to an extent on their episodes. Even if the show isn't financial focused, I'm considering them a professional because they have a degree, right? Especially like the medical folks, like hello. Um, but then they're talking about, you know, costs or insurance or something like that. So the financial space. So if you think about those people, the primary way that they should be monetizing their podcast is through their own services. I do not want them advertising for a mattress company, has nothing to do with their business and what they provide, and kind of like confuses my brain because I'm over here thinking now about a mattress versus how they can help me with my medical thing, right? So that is the primary focus for my business and my clients is helping other business owners grow their business with their show. So the craft formula that you mentioned, Kendra, is C-R-A-F-T, right? And each letter stands for something. So first we've got content. That seems obvious. You know, you can just interview anyone, and that is content, right? But when we talk about podcasting for business, it needs to be content with a very specific focus so that you're leading the listener down a path that you want for your business, toward a service, preferably, maybe toward, you know, the person that you're interviewing is like a parallel service to yours. Maybe they need you and your interviewees business. So we're talking through concerns that your listeners have that also your ideal clients have. So as we're all a lot of us are facing aging parents and growing kids, there are a multitude of concerns that we're all facing. And some of those relate to finances, and some of those are just stuff that's on our mind. So when we sit down and list some of those concerns, those are great pieces of content for a financial professional to talk about because as we are aging, our parents are aging, we're having different financial issues than a 20-something, right? So I want everyone listening to really think about your business and your clients, maybe the perfect client, your favorite handful of clients that you've ever worked with. What stage of life were they in? What concerns are they feeling right now? Right? Like what are some other topics that you could talk about that would help them and that you could somehow loop into your business and loop into leading toward your services? Okay, so then you have R, which is repurpose. The easy, obvious repurposing right now is record your podcast on video and then chop it into Reels and Shorts for social media and YouTube.
SPEAKER_00Fairly easy. Especially with all the tools out there. Like I use Riverside, it will come up with I don't know, five to eight different clips of this episode between the two of us. And I love that. It makes it so easy. It's not something I did before because I didn't have the time to put into it. There's so many tools out there. So just trust us. At least that's a bare minimum. But there's other ways to repurpose too. And I'm taking it that you have some more of those too.
The CRAFT Framework Overview
SPEAKER_02Yes, absolutely. So, yes, AI, Riverside has some AI built in. There are so many show notes AI platforms out there. My team and I use Cast Magic right now. We have used others before. Some of them repurpose into all kinds of stuff automatically. Some of them you can feed at prompts. You could even, if you needed to, pull a transcript of your show from Riverside, for example, and put that into like ChatGPT or something. And so then what you're gonna ask it to produce would be various written social media posts and carousel ideas and quote cards and things like that, but also blogs, newsletters, various threads. It'll thread out a whole series of things for you to say on threads. There are, I think, many more repurposing opportunities with a written piece of content after you've recorded than really what we can do with video. Um, you can only get so many good clips out of one recording before you're like repeating yourself and mixing stuff like crazy. But repurposing is huge. If you're not repurposing, then some people just are not gonna know or remember that you have a podcast. So, next thing, and this is a big focus, is the A in craft. The A is that I want you to ask your audience to take action. If you are not telling them how they can buy from you or how you can um download the the free thing that you made, or leading them towards the big yellow button on your website or something, all of those listeners are just gonna love you and okay, next. Like it just they are not gonna take action unless you ask them to. So having a single clear call to action is so, so important.
SPEAKER_00We're so busy, right? I mean, everybody is busy, and unfortunately, despite the fact that I would love the my the my uh everyone else's world revolved around me, it does not. Um, and because of that, it really comes down to you have to tell people what you want them to do. Don't make them think. Because if they have to think, they're not gonna think. I remember I was um listening to the podcast for um Story Brand. I can't, I think it's Story Brand is their podcast. But anyway, I was listening to the podcast and and they were talking about how people don't want to have to think because we try to preserve brain calories throughout the day. And our prime, like our primal nature or whatever, might think that it might need to run from a lion. And we need brain power for that, and we need calories for that. And so therefore, we don't think that hard and we try to conserve those calories. So if you make people think they're not gonna have enough energy to run from the lion later on today. And they won't do it, they won't take the action, they won't take that that's that next step to think about it.
C: Content That Leads To Services
SPEAKER_02Maybe folks listening, or maybe you will understand. But my husband asks me things like, yo, pulling out a pie out of a freezer, well, how long should this bake? I don't know, honey. Read the box. Like, if I memorized all of the instructions on the back of every food box of every food product we make in our house, I mean, my brain would be full, right? So that's a really dumb example. But he still to this day asks me stuff that he just thinks I know for some reason. But I had just did that the other day.
SPEAKER_00It's like, what about?
SPEAKER_02And I was like, I don't know. Why would I know that? Like, I didn't make a pie last week. So, similar to that, like, think about your listeners' brains being so full that they cannot imagine how they might do business with you or get on your email list. Don't leave the creativity up to them. Like, have a really clear, singular call to action. Don't go into your show asking for um reviews and download this thing and come to my event next week. And also, and also, and also. It has to be one thing. That's it. One thing, really, really clear, easy URL, single button. That's it.
SPEAKER_00So I just want you all to rate and subscribe wherever you're watching or listening. And I'll add that at the end. Yes. Yes.
SPEAKER_02Yeah. So that's the hardest part, actually. Um, and that is one of the most intense conversations that I have with my business owners because they have this tendency to want to ask for multiple. It's like a kid at Christmas. Like they just want to ask for a lot of things instead of one really good thing.
SPEAKER_00I was just working on a website for a client and they're like, can we do this and this? And no, no, nope. That's actually in that page, just got one thing. What's the one thing? You can pick any of those. I'm like, I'm not gonna tell you which one you have to pick, but you have to pick one. And they're like, All right, fine. And then they pick one.
SPEAKER_02And they don't know it, but we're doing them a favor because we are narrowing what their audience can do and where they can take action. And hopefully it's gonna be the way that is the most impactful to the business. I'm sorry, but if people give you a review, how does that help your business? Is that worth any money? Not directly. It's tough. All right. So the F in craft is to feature engaging guests. So whether you are deciding to interview um people that have been clients of yours, or people that you hope to be clients of yours, or if you're interviewing industry experts, or you know, pick your category, whatever type of folks you are interviewing. Make sure that they apply and are helpful toward your ideal client and your listeners. If you're interviewing them because you like them, that may not be the best business strategy for your podcast. So the feature part is really important. And then the last one. Are you ready? It's to track your results. That's the piece that a lot of us miss out on, right? Or skip on purpose.
SPEAKER_00Right. Just not, I don't know anybody that would do that, but I'm just saying.
R: Repurpose With Tools And AI
SPEAKER_02Just not another spreadsheet, right? But yeah, tracking. So anytime you're placing a link or one of those calls to action, like we were talking about, have it be a trackable link so that you can tell how many people just randomly visited your website versus went to the link that you said and put in your show notes, right? So that way you have an idea about your listener engagement, um, how long they spent on that page, because they came from your podcast, like maybe your listeners spend longer on your website than randos that found you on the internet. So there's a lot that you can do as far as tracking. Um, and I want you to even think beyond that, not just like how many sales did I make? Because that's that's how people think of monetizing their podcast a lot. But think about did anyone that you interview turn around and like book a call for your services? Did you get a speaking engagement because of your podcast? Did you get a referral from someone who either heard your show or someone you interviewed or someone whose show you were on? So there's a lot of like, I don't know, my my brain thinks of like a spider web, how it just spreads out like from the center is your podcast. And then boom, boom, boom, boom, boom, you have all of this web around it that you've created. And it's so many opportunities. So track those opportunities. Don't get mistaken and think that you're on stage at Podfest, not because you had a podcast. You're on there because of the show, because you're sharing lessons learned, right? So track that.
SPEAKER_00I think that that's so important. So back when I was tracking, no. Um I still couldn't have a spreadsheet. Just kidding. Right. No, so um, it was by far my number one um email list growth tool. So my podcast gave me the most number of people joining my email list than any other tactic I was using. And that's how I get clients, is off my email list because then I contact them on a regular basis and I don't have to worry about when they're gonna go walk their dog or, you know, am I gonna make their rotation this week or, you know, whatever that happens to be. And that way they're actually able to take even faster action. Because my podcast is was all about getting people on my email list. I've been at capacity for a little while in my business. So now it's just about educating people for now. Um, but I love it. And it gives me that base content for all that repurposing, uh, which saves me a ton of time. And for me, that's a big return um in the world of business. So is that I have to I can save time when I'm creating my emails and my social posts and all the fun things. So, um, which I think is huge.
SPEAKER_02I have a question. Can I flip this on you? So for the folks listening, obviously that worked from podcasts to getting folks listen to join your email list. So, was there a specific like freebie that you did? Were you telling them to join off of a lead magnet? Was it video? What, like, what's the secret? It was all off of lead magnets. Okay, like PDFs.
SPEAKER_00The the episode, yeah. So the episode would tie to some sort of checklist that I would have or something that would make it easy for them to get more information and to learn more things. And then they would click on that, join my email list, and we'd go from there. And I still have those links, and I still actually get probably I don't know, two to five people a week joining just off the links from the podcast, um, which is good because I'm not actually out there doing it actively. Yeah.
SPEAKER_01Well, that's every business owner's dream. So I hope folks are listening. There's massive clue there.
A: One Clear Call To Action
SPEAKER_00It's so amazing. I love it. I love I love podcasting. And podcasting has helped me with my speaking, which actually is now my speaking is actually my largest lead generator for closed business. So people that actually book and pay. And um I'm getting a lot more of that outside of my email list, because my email list is still number one by far. But my speaking engagements take ratchet everything up. So and the only reason I'm any good at it is because of podcasting. Because if you go back and listen to episode one, which I do not recommend, I would not go past episode like 110. Um, but if you if you go back to episode one, you'll see how horrible I was and how scripted I was and how I had the notes, and I I couldn't flow and I couldn't have these conversations. And it's taught me so much just through the practice. And I, yeah, I love I owe so much to podcasting. So I love it. We're almost done. We do have to wrap up. But before I ask you my last question, I'm gonna ask you one more question. And that is if you had one practical tip that you could offer to people about integrating podcasting into their business, what would that be?
SPEAKER_02Okay, so much like you got started not realizing like you would hate them hundreds of episodes later, you can't skip that learning curve. I'm so sorry, people, but you just can't. You have to go through that and try and struggle and get frustrated and think you sound bad and think your background looks stupid and whatever, right? Like you can't skip that step. Try to make it the best you can at the moment, but get started. The other thing is you don't have to start a weekly show. That's kind of the podcasting norm. But I have folks that start with once a month. We move to twice a month, then we move a little further. We you know, we work up to it, especially as a solo printer. It can be a lot on your plate. Um, and the last thing you need is like another job, right? So, with that, there are great tools out there. We already mentioned Riverside. A great DIY editing tool that I recommend is Descript. It's it's really cool because not only can you see your video and hear yourself, but you've got your transcript on the screen, which a lot of us are really more comfortable with editing like a Word document. And so it gives you that capability. But when you cut something out, it cuts it out of your video as well. So it's like this.
SPEAKER_00You can actually do that on Riverside, it's built in.
SPEAKER_02Yeah, they just launched that. It's so cool.
SPEAKER_00Yeah, they've been doing it for a little while now, I think. But yeah, I was in one of I was using it before they had that, and I was moving it into Descript and now it's all built in over here. But I know people that use Descript because they record in other um softwares. So if you already have Zoom and get Descript, like have at it, right? There's a million different ways you can combine all those different tools.
SPEAKER_02Like as a DIYer, and that will help it not feel so heavy.
SPEAKER_00So I've loved our conversation. I loved your craft formula. I think it's really important. I especially like the reminders of repurposing, asking, tracking very important things that I think a lot of people leave out when they're doing it because sort of the content is sort of like, oh, that's what I'm doing, right? But the rest of it, I think, is just so important and such a key reminder that so many of us need. So thank you so much for that. But before I let you go, I do need to ask you a question that I ask all of my guests. And that is that this show is called Imperfect Marketing because marketing is anything but a perfect science. What has been your biggest marketing lesson learned along the way?
SPEAKER_02So this is something that I now teach clients because I also made this mistake. But if you are new and starting a podcast, or I guess you could even rebrand, but your podcast name should be intentionally something that your ideal client will search for. So if you're in the marketing space, right, like your name should have something about marketing. So I started out with a show called Reaching Abundance because I love that concept. I love that we're all working toward this more abundant life. But let's be real, nobody's searching for that. Nobody's searching like reaching abundance. Um, so I renamed my show just recently, even though I had niched down in my business years ago. But now the show is called Podcasting for Financial Professionals. So if you can get a phrase that's like that clear of what you do for who, great. That's the name of your show. Run with it, even if it's not your favorite phrasing. What you've done there is allow people to find you instead of being like crafty or clever or whatever, because your show name is the number one podcast SEO piece. After that, then you have episode names and things like that. But if your show name is not something people will type in, you're already kind of handicapping yourself a little bit there.
F: Feature Guests Your Clients Need
SPEAKER_00So let me ask a quick follow-up on that because a lot of people that I talk to and work with and help like that are my retainer clients that I help them with their podcast. We go through like 50, 60 different names because they're all taken. What is your thought on duplication if you're in a really competitive space? Yeah.
T: Track Results Beyond Sales
SPEAKER_02I would really be cautious there if you search the name and you find that it's pretty much seems like it's an abandoned show. Like maybe, you know, it's 2026 when this airs. So maybe they haven't produced an episode since 2022. Typically, you can do some digging and find their email, reach out to them, try to do your due diligence to say, like, is this still a thing? Um, also Google it. If that show is their business's name, it's probably not a good name for you to then take on. Sometimes you won't get a response. I would say, you know, fair game at that point. There is a little more you could do with an attorney and things like that, just to file to actually like secure the name and show that, okay, now this is mine. But yeah, it is tough. I would continue to play with keywords and try to your far your hardest to find something unique. Um, but if you do feel like it's abandoned or it's totally not maybe the maybe the name is the same, but your topic is totally different. I mean, there's some space there. I I might consider going for it if I found something totally not the same as what I was planning to do.
SPEAKER_00Okay, very cool. Well, thank you again so much for joining us today. I do appreciate all of what you shared. And I hope that all of you listening and watching learned the same. If you want to connect with Virginia, we have all of her information down in the video description or in the show notes, depending on where you're listening or watching. But I hope that you got a lot out of this just like I did. And if you did, it would really help me out if you would rate and subscribe wherever you're listening and watching. Until next time, have a great rest of your day.
