Imperfect Marketing
Imperfect Marketing
Where Are Your Best Clients Actually Making Buying Decisions?
Use Left/Right to seek, Home/End to jump to start or end. Hold shift to jump forward or backward.
Trying to keep up with every social media platform can feel like a full-time job. The truth is, your best marketing strategy may not be posting more. It may simply be showing up in the right place.
In this episode of Imperfect Marketing, Kendra Corman talks with travel advisor Ali Raymer about how she rebuilt her marketing strategy after COVID by asking one simple question:
Where are my best clients making buying decisions?
Instead of chasing every new platform, Ali focused on understanding her ideal clients, choosing platforms that aligned with both her audience and her own strengths, and creating a marketing system she could actually sustain.
Whether you're a business owner, marketer, or entrepreneur feeling overwhelmed by social media, this conversation will help you simplify your approach and build a strategy that attracts the right customers without burning you out.
In this episode, you'll learn:
- Why you don't need to be on every social media platform
- How to determine where your ideal clients actually make purchasing decisions
- The importance of consistency over constant expansion
- How to know when a platform is worth investing your time in
- Why your current clients are your best source of marketing research
- Practical ways to build a marketing routine that supports your business instead of taking it over
Ali also shares the story of how one missed client opportunity completely changed the way she approached branding and marketing, ultimately helping her attract the exact type of clients she wanted.
If you've ever wondered whether you're spending time on the wrong platforms, this episode will give you a fresh perspective and actionable ideas you can put into practice immediately.
Connect with Ali Raymer
LinkedIn: linkedin.com/in/alipicturethistravel
Website: www.peaceandpearltravel.com
If you enjoyed this episode, be sure to subscribe to Imperfect Marketing and leave a review. It helps more business owners discover practical, honest marketing conversations that actually make a difference.
Looking to leverage AI? Want better results? Want to think about what you want to leverage?
Check and see how I am using it for FREE on YouTube.
From "Holy cow, it can do that?" to "Wait, how does this work again?" – I've got all your AI curiosities covered. It's the perfect after-podcast snack for your tech-hungry brain.
Watch here
Hi, I'm Kendra Corman. If you're a coach, consultant, or marketer, you know marketing is far from a perfect science. And that's why this show is called Imperfect Marketing. Join me and my guests as we explore how to grow your business with marketing tips and, of course, lessons learned along the way. Hello and welcome back to another episode of
Welcome To Imperfect Marketing
SPEAKER_00Imperfect Marketing. I'm your host, Kendra Corman, and I'm very excited to be interviewing Allie Raymer from our new studio. So this kicks off our interview episodes that will be hosted now moving forward in the click, which is the digital marketing studio presented by Chief Financial Credit Union at Rochester Christian University. Thank you so much for joining me today, Allie. I'm really excited to have you, especially because we're going to be talking about something that I feel that I talk about all the time, which is that you don't have to be everywhere all the time. So welcome. Thank you so much for joining. I would love to hear more about how did you get into what it is you do and specifically what is it that you do?
SPEAKER_01Yeah, absolutely. Thanks, Kendra. This is super exciting to get to chat with you today about this. So I am Allie Raymer with Picture This Travel. I'm a senior travel advisor for a boutique agency. I'm going on year nine of this business and uh really just working, you know, in my in my own business.
Allie’s Path Into Travel Advising
SPEAKER_01And I got started with this business because I used to be a high school English teacher and I was selling travel to high school students who had no money, but I was actually doing a great job of it and selling big trips and taking them all over the world. My husband's aunt kind of tapped me on the shoulder. She owned her own agency and she said, you know, you can sell travel to people with money, right? And I was like, oh, I'd never really thought about that before. And um, she kind of brought me into the fold, mentored me. And then I just kind of took off from there. I decided to quit my teaching job and do this full time. And I come from, you know, an education background, a journalism background. I do not come from a, you know, I did not get a marketing degree or anything like that. I feel like all the lessons that I've learned have just been real world um over the years. And yeah, I plan people's amazing vacations. I I absolutely love what I do. I have a dream job.
SPEAKER_00So I love to vacation. And I tell people regularly that when I grow up, I want to be a travel agent. So you are my hero. And so I love that we're talking about this. What is the okay? So I do have to ask you, what's the most favorite place that you've been or your most favorite trip that you've planned?
SPEAKER_01Okay, so I would say my heart is Italy always. And so I end up planning a lot of Italy. It's probably my bread and butter. We've been back many times. Uh, we went back last summer. Actually, we're working on trying to buy a home there as well. So Italy definitely has my heart. I know that might be a common answer, basic answer, but it just, it's just the best. The food, the people, everything's amazing there. And I would say favorite trips that I plan, really anything in Europe where people take their time and they're able to have that slower pace. So I do a lot of like three-week, month-long trips for clients. And that's probably my favorite because I know that they're gonna get that lived-in experience. And I know not everybody can afford that time away, but when people do, it's such a rewarding experience to get to plan that for them.
SPEAKER_00Oh, that's so much fun. Thank you so much for sharing that. I do love Tuscany. Um, so I've been there and I love it. And that is one place I would like to go back.
SPEAKER_01So that's awesome. It calls you back often.
SPEAKER_00You used to look at things like where should you post, right? And you started to change your perspective and made it to where are my best clients making decisions? Which I think is a very interesting way of asking it, right? A lot of people say, Where are my best clients? So, how did you approach this? How can others take what you've learned and figure out where their best clients are making decisions?
SPEAKER_01I think for me, this
Choosing Platforms Where Clients Decide
SPEAKER_01really came after COVID. You know, I was a travel advisor before COVID. I survived that. Um, and then I came out after COVID. The whole business had burned to the ground, really. I was forming up out of the ashes. And so I was, it was a nice experience in a way, because I got to really dig into why I'm doing what I'm doing, who am I speaking to, who is going to respond to the message that I'm putting out there and you know, the ROI that we're gonna get because I love social media and these platforms. One, I mean, they're free. Like we can't pass up on that. Like it's such a great opportunity just to put things out there for free and see that's where people are spending time. So it just makes the most sense for my business with the ROI. But yeah, I think after COVID, um, I really started to reflect on I can't just be posting for posting's sake. You know, everything has to have a purpose and a reason. And so I started to think about the type of people who are spending time on each platform and the types of clients that I really enjoyed working with and the people where I was making a good ROI. You know, I think it kind of has to fall under all that. Like obviously, we love those luxury clients who can spend a lot of money and we can make a good ROI. That's great, you know, but that's not gonna be every single client that we interact with. So for me, yeah, it was kind of figuring out where my ideal clients are living. So the first decision that I made was Instagram. I mean, I love Instagram personally. I'm so basic and millennial and it just, I'm not gonna try to fight it. Okay. I love it. I spend a lot of time there and things just resonate with me there. Like I make decisions on Instagram, you know, my with my dollars. So I'm like, okay, what am I doing there that I can also kind of reflect in my business for people like me? And that's really where I speak to a lot of those moms, mom preneurs, busy moms who don't have time to make these decisions, but they do want to go spend time with their families on vacation and unplug.
Picking A Primary Lane That Fits
SPEAKER_01Um, so that's like such an easy one for me because I just feel like I'm speaking to other people like myself. And I mean, I enjoy selling to other people like myself. It's fun, you know, it's fun to get to resonate with them and become friends with them as well. So that was kind of step number one is choosing a lane I felt super comfortable in and just keep on tracking and really refining there and just being super consistent there. I'm not outsourcing that. You know, don't outsource the things that you enjoy doing and and are really resonating with you. And then it was like, okay, where am I going to push myself? For me, it's really been two places. And I sat down and was like, okay, I do not feel comfortable in these two realms, but LinkedIn and YouTube and both of those were serious stretches for me. But um, LinkedIn, I thought, you know, this is really where I can connect with industry. Um, I can connect with other BDMs and reps and the in the travel industry, other travel advisors, and kind of have a different kind of platform there, but also reach people that
Stretch Platforms Like LinkedIn And YouTube
SPEAKER_01are just in the business world. I mean, let's be honest, like people who are on LinkedIn, they're, you know, CEOs all the way down to assistants, and they're all making travel decisions. Um, and then yeah, YouTube was another one I had to make a little stretch on, but that was actually from some encouragement from some of my boomer clients. Uh, they often YouTube things and they kept telling me, Allie, you should get on YouTube and post some videos. And I was like, you know, maybe I should.
SPEAKER_00One of the things that you said is that you were making decisions on Instagram with your dollars in your pocketbook. And so people that have similar interests to you are most likely there. And I love how you're branching out. My preferred platform is definitely not Instagram. If anybody has been watching or listening for a long time, you've heard me say that I really don't like Instagram for whatever reason. I'm hardcore Gen X. So my favorite platforms. You have to choose it. Yeah. My favorite platforms are LinkedIn, uh, TikTok, actually, for mostly for viewing. And I actually do make buying decisions on TikTok, which is very interesting. I don't purchase on TikTok, I purchase off of TikTok, but the stuff that I see on TikTok actually drives quite a bit of purchase decisions now that I'm actually thinking about it, which is interesting. So I guess my question for you is okay, so I don't, I don't like Instagram. Do I think a lot of my people are there? They are. I know this because they've told me that. How bad is it that I'm not picking it? I mean, I'm there. I just don't interact or engage.
SPEAKER_01You have to choose your lane. Because if you're going to be inconsistent in a platform, to me, then it's like just don't, just
When Not Being On Instagram Is Fine
SPEAKER_01don't show up. I mean, honestly, because so many people are inundated with so many images and different things, especially on Instagram with like the algorithm that's constantly changing, whatever you're trying to play. But if you're not consistently putting the message out there, people probably aren't gonna see it anyways. So I say it's okay. Like if it doesn't speak to you, I honestly wouldn't try to be consistent there. I would be consistent in the places that you know. We all know ourselves, you know, and we know, okay, I'm gonna water that plant. Do you know what I mean? Like, I will be the first to admit I never water plants. My parents literally just got me a fake fern to hang up on my front porch because they know I'm not gonna water that plant. So I'm like, if you know yourself well enough to know you're not gonna water the plant, just don't even go down that road because I think that's better than having it outsourced or, you know, it being fake, honestly.
SPEAKER_00So that's hilarious because actually I do have a big plant and it started to wilt yes, um, a couple days ago. And one of the other faculty members walked into my office and she's like, feed me seymour. I'm like, no, it's gonna bounce right back because I just needed water. It's a picky plant, it needs just the right amount of water. And if you overwater it, you're done. And if you yeah, so I told my husband it needs to come home, and he's like, What do you want me to do with it? I'm like, I don't know, take care of it so it doesn't die. Okay, so that was just a funny analogy that you had. And I was like, oh, that's very, very relevant. Resonates on more than just social media for me. So speaking of Instagram and TikTok and LinkedIn and YouTube and Facebook and X and Threads and Blue Sky, and I'm missing somebody in there. Okay. Anyway. See, that's even new to me. I don't even know what blue sky is. Now I have to Google it. Yeah, I don't know. I've got a client that's on Blue Sky, so it's like it's it's like X. So there's all the things, right? There's all the places. And you're saying that don't go into places, right? If
Warning Signs You’re Overextended
SPEAKER_00you're not going to take care of it and not be engaged and not be you, right? So what are the warning signs that being on too many platforms could be hurting your business?
SPEAKER_01I think it really is it's a maintenance thing, you know. Can you in your I I love time blocking personally? I'm a big time blocker. And so every week it's like, okay, let me time block my week because my weeks all look very different, I'm sure, like a lot of people that work for themselves. But it's like, okay, am I able to create the time for this weekly or, you know, however you're gonna map this out monthly? I know people do different things, but are you gonna be able to map it out? And when it comes time, you know, when it is 11 a.m. on a Monday morning, are you going to be kind of rejuvenated and feeling excited? You know, 11 a.m. on Monday morning is my LinkedIn time. And I'm not gonna lie, I used to dread it. Okay. And I struggled. And then I really, it's just like working any muscle. You know, you just keep adding it to your calendar, you keep doing it. And now I like genuinely love my LinkedIn time. I love sitting down and thinking about how I want to inspire other advisors. And I get to be a certain version of myself there that I don't get to be on Instagram. And something about that is super um, yeah, rejuvenating and just kind of gives me a little bit of life. So I think test that, you know, don't give up on it too soon, but test that look at your schedule, map it out in your calendar, make time for it consistently, and then take a step back and reflect on it and go, do I feel like this is giving me life or do I feel like this is draining me and this is really not a good return on investment? Um, but I would give it a little bit of time because LinkedIn, it was my struggle for a long time. So um it just didn't feel natural to me. And it's like the opposite of Instagram, maybe.
SPEAKER_00So yeah. How long would you give it? You you said don't give up on it too quickly. I usually tell people to test things for 90 days because that's but is that too long of a test for finding out if it drains you and like at the end of the quarter, you're just like, I'm done with all the things social.
SPEAKER_01Yeah, 60 to 90 days. I initially was thinking six weeks because six weeks doesn't feel like an eternity, you know. Um, six weeks is like, okay, six Mondays that I'm gonna sit down and map this
How Long To Test A Platform
SPEAKER_01out. I can do six Mondays, you know. Um, and I think, yeah, you do have to give it a little bit of time because you need to have that traction and you need to be able to go back and reflect on what worked and what didn't work. Um, I remember I made my very first LinkedIn post when Southwest was starting to make all their announcements about changes coming and it popped off. And I was like, this is gonna be great. All of my posts on LinkedIn are gonna pop off, you know. And then after that, it was like super stagnant. And you get like no, no likes, no comments. You know, my husband was on there trying to encourage me, you know, and that was it. And um, and then so you do need like enough data, honestly. Um, and now I feel like I've gotten enough data that I know, okay, things like this are gonna pop off. That's why the Southwest, because I kind of made this bold statement about Southwest that was kind of ruffling some feathers, you know. Yeah, I think that you need the data points for sure to be able to go back and look and see what works and what doesn't. So I like 90 days. If you feel like that might be too much for you, like if you're a commitment, you struggle with commitment, maybe just start with six weeks and see at the end of six weeks where you know, where it feeds you.
SPEAKER_00So Okay. I think that's that's great feedback. All right, but inquiring white minds want to know what was what did you say about Southwest when they were making all those changes?
SPEAKER_01Well, I have two littles and um yeah, I have a six-year-old and a two-year-old, and we fly often. So I was thinking in my mind, like you can't see my children when you're picking your seats. Like you can't see that
B2B And B2C Platform Surprises
SPEAKER_01you've chosen seats next to a six-year-old and a two-year-old, or in front of or behind a six-year-old and a two-year-old. But when we make eye contact at Nashville Airport, you can see I have a six and two-year-old and you can choose to avoid me. Do you know what I mean? And I'm okay with that. That's fine. I actually have a great travelers. My six and two-year-old are fabulous travelers. You probably want to travel next to them. They're pretty sweet. But you know, you want to be able to make that decision live. And I think that's something that Southwest has lost a little. Um, so I think that may have ruffled some feathers, but it's okay.
SPEAKER_00So we're figuring out, you know, where our target audience, where the people we want more business from, make buying decisions, right? That's very important. And I don't I don't know about your thoughts, but I would say business to consumer, business to business, they're very similar platforms because you're being influenced, right? For lack of a better term, wherever you are, whether it's personally or professionally. Do you agree with that? Do you think that they're different platforms if you're selling to businesses versus consumers?
SPEAKER_01I do work with businesses and I feel like that's easier on some platforms to work with them. But I'll say, like, I feel like I've made just as many amazing connections with LinkedIn and Instagram, honestly, like B2B or B2C. Like I had an amazing opportunity to travel with Visit Britain. And that was definitely more like obviously the B2B kind of situation. And I don't really think about Instagram in that way. I'm constantly thinking about Instagram being B2C, but that was a huge opportunity that opened up for me because I was consistently posting on Instagram because of the type of clients that I was reaching there. So I think don't be closed-minded about that. I think you can definitely um reach people you weren't expecting. I mean, if you would have asked me six months ago that YouTube would be a place where I would get a lot of my boomer clients, I just wouldn't have expected that. And maybe that was just me being really, I don't know, just not in tune. But it's really surprised me that I have so many boomer clients that find me on YouTube.
SPEAKER_00And yeah, you just stay open-minded for sure. Well, and I think that that's an excellent acknowledgement, right? You let you asked people, right? And they offered, hey, we'd love to see more YouTube content. That research, that conversation makes a huge difference. And I think that that's that there's a lot there. Um, so you know, asking people where they're at too doesn't hurt.
SPEAKER_01It doesn't. No, it doesn't, especially if they're already your existing clientele, you know, so they've already chosen you, they're already spending their dollars with you. And then they're going to certain platforms to kind of get that reassurance. But they're thinking, gosh, it would be nice if you were on that platform to create that reassurance for people. And having your existing clients, I'm like, especially the ones you love. Like, let's be honest. Like, I just want to copy and paste some of these clients that I have that are great, you know? And if they're the ones, those are the people we should be talking to, you know. Hey, where are you? Why did you decide to reach out to me? Why did you um, you know, choose me from this platform or whatever? Having those conversations with the copy-paste clients are crucial because I want more like you for sure, you know, and repel people away that I don't want. That's just as important.
SPEAKER_00So we've done the research, we've picked the platform, our primary platform, which for me is not Instagram, but what simple system do you or what system do you recommend that they build so that their marketing is driving revenue, not taking over their day?
SPEAKER_01Yeah, I think um it's really easy to kind of get caught in scrolling or looking at what other people are doing. I think that's important to an extent, but I do think, again, I'm love time blocking. I think
Simple Systems That Protect Your Time
SPEAKER_01put a limit on that. Um, so it's important to see what are other people doing in this industry or again, where am I spending uh making my spending dollars, you know, um, and kind of saying, what are they doing that worked for me? But I would definitely put a limit on that, like the consuming side of it. And then from there, um, just really thinking about, you know, it goes back to basics, but like thinking about your audience and their pain points and constantly taking your story and making it solve their pain points. Like we all have a story to tell, you know, and being able to share your story in a way that reaches their pain points, like that's just like the magic, you know? And it's so basic, but um I think that that's super crucial. And again, if you're choosing a platform, let's say you just start with one, like maybe these things overwhelm you completely. Then just choose one and lean into that and get into a rhythm of that to where it just becomes second nature. And then once you've done that for six months, a year even, okay, that's when you start to add in. You know, I was on Instagram for my business 40 years. I was doing it not well for many years, but for the last few years, I've really homed in. And now I like don't even, I don't know, I get ideas all the time. And I will just, you know, I have like a little uh system where I text myself. It's really silly, but you might be anywhere and you get an idea, especially for Instagram, because it's just kind of off the cuff a lot of times. And I will just text myself. So I constantly have, you know, weeks of ideas that I've just texted myself. Um, and I think a a big part of that is I try to limit the consuming as well, because I think that just turns into a comparison game and trying to do all the Trinity stuff. That's probably like the stuff you hate about Instagram, you know? But yeah, I think that's important. And that's kind of how I started to expand in like my other platforms is not trying to do them all at once, but just try to get really good at one and get that rhythm. And then we can start to add another one in. And you know, and you can just start to spin the plates a little bit easier and knowing when to outsource, like Pinterest for me. I love consuming Pinterest. I think it's so fun. But Pinterest is one of those you can like batch and like I can like hire a VA for that. And they can come in and look at all my content and blogs and they can do that. It doesn't have to be straight from me. So I think thinking about how you can outsource things and and batch content too, there are some of these platforms you can definitely do that with.
SPEAKER_00Very cool. I love batching. So I think the key takeaway here is you do not have to be all the places. You shouldn't be all the places because it's going to drain you and kill you. Um, and you will be done. So definitely um take a look and see where people are making decisions, the ones that you want more of, right? Because you want to attract more of them and then create a system that works for you. And I'm a huge fan of time blocking and batching. So um you've won me over with that. Before I let you go, I do want to wrap up and ask you the question that I ask all of my guests. And that is that this show is called Imperfect Marketing because marketing is anything but a perfect science. What has been your biggest marketing lesson learned?
SPEAKER_01It was right after COVID, and we were traveling, we were going on fams. Fams are like familiarization trips. And um, a lot of companies and countries, honestly, tourism boards, they were wanting travel agents to travel, get out there, show people
The Marketing Lesson From A “No”
SPEAKER_01it's safe, you know. We yeah, we had to do the testing and all that kind of stuff, but it's safe and we're going. And so we got invited by a company to go to Cabo. Um, I just had never been to Cabo. It just wasn't something that was on my radar. This was so fun. And I remember while I was there, um, there was a big fish in our town, and she is very influential, has way more followers than myself on Instagram. We kind of had some overlap and I thought, gosh, I want to, I want to get her business. And she was looking at the time for a travel advisor for a cabo trip. And I was like, this is perfect. Like I'm here, I'm posting, like this is great. And I remember reaching out to a couple connections that we had and and kind of putting my feelers out there with her. And she ended up going with someone else. And I remember thinking, I want to create a marketing platform, a vision, you know, that is going to attract that client. Like I want to win her. Even though she said no to me this time, I really want to win her or people like her. And so I really just had to get honest with myself and look at why did she not choose me? Um, what marketing mistakes am I making that would have made us not align? And that's when I remember going home and just like deep diving and really rebranding and refreshing everything and aligning myself with people like her. Um, so that maybe in the future she would choose me. And the coolest part of this is maybe like a year later, her assistant called me and wanted me to book their family's Europe trip. And I was like, okay, that doesn't always happen, but it's such a neat thing when you are like, I want to speak to people like this. And then those people end up calling you. And that took a while, you know, it took a while to refresh that and really stick true to that branding and messaging. But I think sometimes your biggest no's are just, I'm always the person that gets inspired by that. I'm like, oh, I'm gonna show them, you know, that's my personality. I think that that was a huge marketing lesson for myself, just staying humble and and being okay with refreshing things and and sending out a new branding and marketing to reach the people you want to reach.
SPEAKER_00Well, and I love how you took it as a challenge. You didn't just give up and say, Oh, I guess I'm just not the right fit, right? And you're like, nope, I can do this. This is what I want, and I'm gonna go after and get it. And so I think that that is just so exciting and so fantastic. Thank you so much for joining me today, Allie. I really appreciate it. I appreciate all that you've shared. Um, you have my dream job, which is to be a travel agent. So, and you get to travel, which is amazing. So I love it. And thank you so much for sharing all of the lessons that you've learned. I am confident that uh other people, including myself, have gotten something out of it. If you have, wherever you're listening or watching, it would really help us out if you would rate and subscribe wherever
Wrap Up And Listener Call To Act
SPEAKER_00you're listening or watching. Until next time, have a great rest of your day.
