The Controversy of Reclaiming: Hot Ritual or Problematic Possession in Swinging

Is "reclaiming" in the swinging lifestyle sexy ritual or possessive play? Ed and Phoebe unpack this controversial term, sharing their real experiences and perspectives from within the community.

In this episode, we cover:

• The origins and controversy around the term "reclaiming"
• How language like "reclaiming" vs "reconnecting" shapes our swinging experiences
• The historical and possessive undertones in lifestyle terminology
• The passionate side of reconnecting after play, including personal rituals and preferences
• Why communication and finding what works for your relationship is what really matters

00:00 Public Sex and Prima Nocte

04:24 Observing Kink From Afar

06:35 History of Marriage Conventions

11:07 Misunderstood Acronyms in Play Situations

16:08 "Rekindling Romance Through Separation"

17:40 Understanding No Kissing Rules

21:44 Longtime Relationship Disconnection

23:20 "Communication and Relationship Balance"

28:47 "Reconnecting: Balancing Desire"

29:35 Fluidity in Emotional Reconnection

34:03 "Planning Remote Setup Fun"

Transcript

0:00

Some say it's the sexiest part of swinging. Others say it's possessive, even toxic. So which is it? Tonight we're diving into one of the most controversial words in the lifestyle, and trust us, it's going to get hot. We're going to get right into this episode, which kind of came up because we were listening to a different podcast. And I'll let you kind of break down. Yes. What was talked about and kind of how. How it inspired this topic. Right. So I. I'll give them credit because I. I love them. If none of you have ever been to a libertine events, you really ought to try it. Kate and Daryl, mostly Kate puts on an amazing event all over the United States several times a year, probably three or four times a year, and it's only growing. So I was listening to their podcast and her. Her husband is hilarious, and he's always trying to. To derail her. Her from. From the. The topic that they're on. And so I was joking. I was laughing hysterically. Anyway, he went off on a. On a tangent and was talking about reclaiming and how he never liked that term and he thought of it as. As property. And so for him, it. It didn't stick that. That wasn't a terminology that worked for him. And I was like, oh, you know what? I've never used that term either. And I never really knew why, but when he put it out there I was. It gave me pause and I thought, yeah, you know what? That's probably why I didn't, like, didn't fit for me either. So then I started kind of ruminating on that and I mentioned it to Ed, and Ed and I started to have a brain session over it, and then we were like, oh, wow, this. This could be a podcast. This is pretty interesting. Yeah. So this is. That's how. How it all sparked. Thank you for Wanderlust Swingers. There's another piece to this too, which was we're always brainstorming topic ideas, and one of the topic ideas that we were talking about was public sex and how it's changed over the centuries. Well, one of the things that we were talking about during that was this whole concept of prima nocte, which I won't get into now. We're going to save it for that episode. But this concept of property and women being property, et cetera, et cetera, which kind of plays into that whole reclaiming thing and why it probably gives us a little bit of an icky feeling about the term. Right, right. So we use the term Reconnecting. Right. We've always used that. And honestly, I'd never. I probably only five years in or after five years in, did we. Or eight years in, did we start to hear people using this reclaiming terminology. Right. So we use the word reconnecting, and when you compare it to other spaces like BDSM or that, you know, in the kink area, it's. It's really more like aftercare, and it's. It can be ownership language, if that's how you've negotiated your dynamic. Right. So it makes sense in those regards where you've got that type of consent, where your dom has, quote, possession over you. Right. But you've consented to. To. To that. So I get it that. That makes sense to me. I'm not shaming the kink community if that's the language that they use. But we're not talking about that context. We're talking about the swinger community. Yeah, for sure. And. And to. To be clear, like, if you've got language that you use and you are in a kink or BDSM situation. Yeah. What is kind of comment below? Tell us more about how you use the term and how it, you know, what the implications are for you. We. We're not in that space. We're. We're kind of kink adjacent. And while we've attended events and we absolutely adore their consent model and how all of that works, and we certainly enjoyed watching kink play sessions, for sure, but we're really like outside observers from that level and that perspective. And so we. We won't speak a whole lot about kink. So as you said, this is the umbrella of swinging and swinging terminology and kind of how it works there. Well said. Well said. You want to talk about the property angle and kind of dive in. Let's dive into that. That controversial side. Yeah, yeah. And it's interesting because if you look back historically at what marriage traditionally was, marriage traditionally was a joining of two households. It was political sometimes. It was resource driven. It was resource driven. Your house was poor, their house was rich. So you'd sell your daughter off and she would become, you know, the queen of some other country, et cetera, et cetera, et cetera, and land. And that person came with land and. The resources, the whole concept of a dowry. So when a girl came of age, there was like a. There was like a bonus package that you got when you married her. And there was. It was almost like an incentive program to actually marry one daughter versus the other. And it hasn't really changed all that much. I mean, you. Even if you look at traditional marriages, arranged marriages, it's usually done for something to better both families. Right. It's a cooperative, it's a mutually beneficial arrangement. And I think where it gets. Where it got a little weird was in the Middle Ages when, and I mentioned this before, where kings kind of took possession of anybody who was getting married and got kind of creepy. I mean, not kind of. It absolutely was creepy for that whole thing. And I think that even if you fast forward to like the traditional definition of marriage in the, like 1950s, it really was that, that trad wife, that traditional wife thing. She stays at home, she takes care of the kids, she's barefoot and pregnant, cooks, cleans, does all that stuff while the husband goes out and earns a living. Now, if you follow that model, great. There's a great many people who do not follow that model. And it's hard to follow that model in this day and age without having dual incomes. You know, having single income is really hard. But, you know, it kind of all plays into that traditional definition of what a marriage is. And that those traditional marriage roles. Did you know they just added trad wife to the dictionary? Oh, I saw that on the news today. That. That and a couple other terms. Kate Baldwin had some. Had to hold herself back. She's a reporter, been a reporter for many, many years. And so the English language and the use of it is very important to her. And so she's like, I'm just gonna bite my tongue on some of these terms. Yeah, but trad wife was one of them. And I didn't know what that was. Yeah, I only recently discovered it because we're not in a traditional. Right. Marriage, so to speak. And I'm not a trad wife and. You are not a trad wife. And so this term of reclaiming is kind of like repossession. You're taking back your property from somebody else. That's the negative connotation to it. That's. And I think that's what kind of bristles some people about it. But there's also kind of a playful side to this. And some people use it as kind of pillow talk as a way of kind of, I guess, using the naughty version of possession as kind of a kink. And so it's kind of a role playing thing where repossessing your wife, taking her back from the other man is very he man kind of. And it can be fun. Now, if you're both in it for that, then great. But if you're doing it by yourself, gentlemen. That's kind of weird, but that's just my opinion. Yeah. So the language in swinging, obviously can mean different things to different people. A lot of, you know, everyone's experienced that. What I find interesting, though, is that even though we have all these different definitions for how we describe things, no one really questions it or asks because it always seems like we don't ever want to just. We don't ever want to appear. Like we don't know what's going on. Oh, right. Even though we. We don't know at all. Oh, absolutely. We're like, oh, well, gosh, it sounds like they're blah, blah, blah. But I didn't understand that terminology. Like. Like the ggg. You know, One of our friend uses the ggg, and he's like, all about the ggg. And I'm like, what the fuck is in gg? And I was like, so what was it? Good. Good girl? No, it's like good giving and something else. And I'm not going to remember it either, because we don't use that term. It's a term coined by Mr. Savage. Savage Lovecast. I love his podcast. And so our kink friend was really into using that terminology. And I'm like, what the heck are you talking about? But when he's telling me, I'm like, huh, huh, huh, huh. And I'm like, I get the concept. But I didn't want to ask him what it was. And then I finally. I had to ask him. I think it's even worse than that because. And everybody comment, if this has ever happened to you, but you go into a play situation and somebody throws out some acronym or some term and you think it means one thing, and it turns out it means something else. And I feel a little bad for the couple that jumps on a bed and goes, hey, so you're down for dvp, right? And they're thinking, oh, dp, yeah, no problem. That is not what DVP means. So if you don't know what it is, look it up. Oh, my God, the acronyms drove me bananas. Drive. Not so much now, but yes, drove me bananas. Because I'm always asking, ed, what the hell is that? Instead of Googling it. But yeah, you always knew what they were. Probably. I don't know why you always knew. I didn't know half of them, 90% of them. I'm not going to say I knew all of them, but I knew a lot. Just the other day, we were chatting with our Virginia friends, and they Were using sil. Like, what the fuck is sil? And they're like, son in law. I'm like, oh, for crying out loud, who uses that? And they're like, well, we use it all the time. It's really big in the military. I'm like, is this a health care terminology that people are like, nah. And I'm like, well, we don't use that on the west coast. I've never heard that. They're like, oh, it's all over in the chat rooms. I'm like, not in our chat rooms. So they can be regional as well. Or just, you know, you don't use them all the time. And so they just don't mean anything to you because you haven't ingrained it into your head. I mean, that's, that's how most of these things kind of pass us over is. I just don't use those terms. And I can't even recall having any conversation about a son in law or daughter in law or mother in law. Like, I've never referred to your mom as mill. Mill. And that's really close to milf, which is really awkward. Yeah. For that. Right, so. No, I know. Don't use that. I don't need to acronym everything. Right. I do like using words. Yeah, words are good. Which I do think, by the way, is very military. A lot of acronyms. They break everything down into, you know, HQ and. Yes. Yeah, all that. Okay. The passionate side. Yeah, let's talk about that a little bit. The. This is more in support of the, of the terminology for reclaiming. Yeah. And I. And, and I'm going to use the term kind of reconnecting for us, for us, it's. It was always kind of being intimate with each other, reestablishing the trust, checking in with each other, making sure that everything that had happened previously with the other people was okay and that we were in a good place, not only personally, but with each other. Yes. And that was very important to me mentally and to my heart. But I also really liked having sex with you. Because you knew all my buttons. Yes, you do know all my buttons. Wow. So it was always the nice cherry on top at the end of the evening or, you know, next day, depending on how late you were up. Because that's, you know, that's the, that's where the good stuff lives. Yeah. And in partner. In some situations, that was actually the only way that I would. Orgasm. Yeah. At the end of an evening too. Because typically other play partners weren't really good at like having the Same motion that you did, and they're not magic. So, you know, it doesn't work the same for me, but for you too. A lot of times you, you would have partners during play situations, which, you know, too fast, too hard, too something, and it just, you never got there. Yeah. And it wasn't until we got back together and then we both orgasmed and we're like, okay, we can, we can go to bed now. We, we got that taken care of. Yeah, exactly. So, so, you know, so I get it. And then that there's that certain psychology of, of coming back together after being, quote, apart. Right, right. And it, it does feel like this chemical electricity when you come back together. It's almost like you're first dating again and you're like, just can't wait to get your hands on each other. Right, right. And we've talked about that because we work so close together with our office is like a shared space. So we see each other 24 hours a day, seven days a week, most of the time. And so having a little bit of separation helps to kind of rekindle that, that sense of, like, longing, like, I miss you. I didn't get to see you all day. I reconnect with you. And I think that this reconnecting sex is very much like that, where you may have been on the same bed playing together, but you weren't playing together. Right. So you, you kind of miss that. And it kind of, you want to, like, get back together. Yeah, yeah, yeah. It's like magnets wanting to, like, stick back together. Right. I know. I, I, I get it. I get it. And some of the rituals that couples use are special kisses, words, and even their favorite sex act to, you know, reconnect. Right. There are some couples, for example, that won't do certain things with other couples in play situations, but maybe that was the thing that they like to. And so, I mean, an example would be if you had a no kissing rule. Right. Like, you want to get back together with your partner because you finally get to kiss and you had all that longing and build up. Yeah. Which is. Yeah, I get it. Yeah. And so I, when people had a no kissing rule and they said that's only special just for them, you know, I, I didn't ever shame them. I'm like, okay, that's cool. I get it. You know, partially because I had that same perspective for a while. Not that we made it a rule, but I did, I did understand that for me, initially, it felt more intimate. Right, right. Has something to do with the face. Yeah. Faces being together, faces very full of expression. You're breathing on one another. There's a lot of sensory areas to the face. And so to me, that was, I don't know, very intimate. You can look into people's eyes. So. Yeah, I still think that's actually. I still think that's one of the most intimate things you can do as somebody is to kiss them. Yeah. Let's talk about kind of a middle ground somewhere between reclaiming being toxic and the other end of the spectrum. And there's. There's something that's a little bit in the middle, which is really kind of a form of aftercare. And I think everybody can agree that coming back together may not be required in all situations. It's. A lot of times it's. It's optional. And I know that that's what they had discussed kind of in the podcast. And. And I would say for us, it was. It became more optional the longer we were in the lifestyle. Yeah. It wasn't as urgent that we reconnected because we'd. We'd kind of established our connection, our relationship, and I guess the. The magnetic pole was strong enough that even though we weren't exactly together, we could still feel each other and know that we were present and that we were still connected. Even though there were some distance between us and some, you know. Yeah. Play partners in between us. We. We would still have. If we didn't reconnect with sex, we would reconnect our brains. Sure. And we'd have this recap of the evening. Like, wow. How was that for you? Oh, yeah, that was. Oh, how'd you feel about this? Yeah, yeah, yeah. Right. How are you doing? Oh, I feel great. Right. So we would always have that and we'd talk about that, and that was fun. So to me, the mental part of it was. Was also very. A critical part of it. Yeah. And we've always done that part. Yeah. And I. I definitely go through phases, periods of time where I. I need to reconnect with you. Like, I desire you in. In a very strong and compelling way. And those are the times where it. It's. I guess it's important to me to. To reconnect and. And kind of have that. That bond again. Like, there's something deep that I need to, like, satisfy and. Yeah. Soothe. Yeah, I know. I. I remember. I remember all those moments. Yeah, I know. I know that voice. I know that phrase. I need you. Yeah. So sometimes let's. Let's. Let's talk about why sometimes it doesn't happen. Could be you're up till five in the morning maybe, and you're just dead tired. Right. And you need to get up and go to breakfast with another couple that you said you're gonna go to breakfast. With or catch a flight because you're heading out of town and it was the last night at Hedo. Yep. All that. All of that. Maybe it's just, you know, the example that you. You said before where you've been a couple for a long, long time, or you've been in the lifestyle for a long, long time, and you don't really need that. We've had situations where we didn't have to be anywhere. We were in home in our own beds, but we didn't feel the need to reconnect. And I remember thinking about that and kind of shaming myself thinking, oh, man, there's something wrong with me. I don't feel the need to reconnect with Ed. I'm. I'm like, good. Then I'm like, you know, we talk about it, and you're like, well, I always want you, but I don't. Like, you know, you're like, I'm down. I'm like, I'm good. So. So it. It's changed for sure. And then I. Then I was kinder and gentler to my. To myself and didn't shame myself because I was comparing myself to others. Right. Because everyone was like. And the standard, oh, the reconnection sex is so good. Like, and you get lost in everybody else's narrative and you go, well, you know what? That's not me, and that's not what I did. And you know what? That's fine. Yeah. Yeah. Because it's all. When it comes to. At the end of the day, it's down to you and your partner and where you're at and in your relationship and how you function and, you know, how you are as a team. Yeah. And it all comes down to communication and how the mood is swaying both of you at that particular moment. And as long as you're good, as you're both good and on the same page, then it doesn't really matter what anybody else is doing. And I think that's the balance is, you know, you. You have to do what feels right for you and your partner and. And nobody else can decide that for you. And we'll kind of talk about some of the hot stories and examples of how that didn't work for us or how it did work for us and maybe wasn't such a good Idea. Yeah. And I do want to interject one more thing that some couples do. They will. Part of that reconnection is they'll maybe take a whole day by themselves. Oh, yeah. So if you're at a retreat or some type of an event, they'll. They'll. They'll go have breakfast just by themselves, or they'll go do some. Some. Some excursion or something just by themselves because they need the time to be together. And we've had couples that we were gonna go, like I said, to breakfast with or go do and a thing with. Right. And they'd cancel on us. And, like, we just need it to be between us. We need their time by ourselves. And I totally respect that. And I get it. So sometimes it's not just physical. It's time. It's like hours doing an activity together. Yeah. Just. Just spending quality time together. Maybe you're. Maybe it's a long walk on the beach. You know, maybe it's just sitting and reading and holding hands or cuddling and watching a movie. Like, it doesn't. It doesn't matter how you do it. It's just that kind of aftercare piece of reestablishing where you're good. Exactly. Exactly. So I promised a sexy story here, so we'll talk about. We've run into situations where either the sex was so hot and we had such a good time that we had to reconnect afterwards to kind of. Just. Just because it was like, momentum. Yes. Like, we couldn't stop if we wanted to. We were both so turned on. We get back to the room and you're like, I'm good to go again. How about you? Oh, yeah, let's do it. Yeah. I can remember almost all of the New Year's and Halloween parties with the hotel takeovers were like that, where we'd go to a couple different room. There was. After parties, crazy things happened. Big group orgy stuff. Super hot people were making great noises. It was fun to watch. And then we'd go back to the room and be like, I can't go to bed yet. I'm. I'm a little. I'm a little too turned on. Supercharged. We got to keep going. Yep. The converse to that was we've also had situations where we were just fucked out at the end of the night. Like, there was no way it was going to happen again. We were exhausted. It was either 4am like the sun was coming up, and we're like, oh, my God, we absolutely have to just get some sleep or. Which has happened A number of times you were so sore that you were like, if you touch me, I will kill you. I know. And it was sad because in those moments I really wanted you, but it was too painful. Because the. Because the condoms are. Can be pretty abrasive. Yeah. Especially if you're not used to them. So. Yeah. And you know, there's a point at which there's no amount of lube that is enough to overcome all of the micro abrasions that are going on down there. So no matter how soft and smooth and then the quality of the condom, there's. They're still creating micro abrasions. And it's. Can make you sore. Yeah. I mean, they are kind of stick shaped squeegees. I mean, they kind of rubber squeegee things out. So I mean, it's. Yeah, it's. It's a bit much. Oh, let's see. Speaking of momentum. Speaking of momentum. Lost it. Yeah. Well, let's get into the takeaways from this because I think that wasn't a. Really sexy story, by the way. It wasn't a really sexy story. Do we have another sexy story we can talk about? Can we? I mean, limited, because, you know, the YouTube police and all. Yeah. We can't get words I've already used detailed with stuff. But that's why we have a Patreon, so we can get into the details there. Oh, okay. Maybe we just do it there because then I don't have to edit myself. Yeah. Because there's certainly a lot of detail we can go into, but. Oh yeah, not. Not on this particular channel and probably not on Twitch either. Yeah. So these are some takeaways from this whole kind of controversy slash terminology. Kerfuffle. I love that word. Kerfuffle is such a good word for the most part. Think of it. Think of reclaiming or reconnecting as kind of a sexy ritual. It's a way to reconnect or to amplify desire. So it's that moment where you and your partner are back in the same place and kind of realigning your feelings for each other and your emotional state so that everybody's kind of on the same page. It's problematic if it becomes possessive or controlling. And this kind of goes down to. If it's a one way thing, it's probably not a good thing. Yeah. But if you're both into it, if you're both into reconnecting, then it is. It's that joining, that melding, that re. Synchronizing of everybody's Feelings, which is good. And most important, don't feel bad if you don't feel like reconnecting doesn't happen all the time. It doesn't have to happen all the time. Like, everything around sexuality, it's fluid. So sometimes it works and sometimes it doesn't. But don't beat yourself up if it doesn't happen. As long as you both feel good about it, it's okay. Doesn't matter. Some couples like a hot wife situation. They. They won't reconnect after. They may reconnect. Maybe they do, but maybe they don't. Maybe they reconnect, you know, three or four days later after this. That build, that build up, that meant it's that mental processing of what he saw. Right. And what it meant to him. And he keeps thinking about it, and he keeps thinking about it, and he's thinking about it. And then, like by day four. All right. And then. Super hot. Yeah. So it. Once again, like you said, very individual to each person and their dynamic and their situation and how. And their kink. Right, right. People are more mental. Some people aren't. So. Yeah, it's fascinating. I'm just fascinated by the differences. This is. This is actually a little bit of a bonus, and that is the. That storytelling aspect that we've talked about with separate play and the kind of the hot wife lifestyle. And in, in many respects, that storytelling that happens afterwards is kind of a form of reconnecting. Yeah. Where they catch you up, they do a little debrief. You kind of share those feelings and, and those sensations with your partner. And then, of course, that kind of brings them up to where you were and then you're together. Yeah. So, you know, it's. It's different. And, like, every dynamic is going to be different, as you said. Yeah. All right, so I would encourage you all to talk with your partner about what they want with reconnecting and what do they like the term reclaiming? Do they like the term reconnecting? And let us know in the comments. We love to hear what you guys think and how you feel about the whole thing. Yeah. And maybe you've got a new term that works for you. I love terminology, so throw something out there. We threw out aftercare, so I only know those three. Reclaim, reconnect, and after care. But I'm, I'm. I know there's got to be another one, at least another one. So please let us know for sure. We appreciate you guys passing on the good word. If you like our episodes, if you like what we're producing what our show's all about. Tell a friend. And if you've got a new couple that you just run into. Absolutely. Share swingeruniversity.com Let them know that if they have questions or they need a resource to kind of figure stuff out. We're, we're one of the best ways to get information about the lifestyle. And we started up a discord channel in Patreon. Yeah, yeah. So you can reconnect with other patrons there, Other like minded individuals. Yeah. And it's a private space, so it's only for those people who are patrons. You won't have public people in there, so you don't have to worry about what you say or how you say it. Everybody's in there. They're all friends of the podcast and they're all friends with each other. The theoretically or at least soon to be friends. And we've, we've had people trickling in. So if you're interested in and you are one of our patrons, sign up. And what is our next episode? Is it this, this Latin word that you threw out earlier? I don't, I don't know if we're going to do that one. We've got a couple topics that are coming up and we're going to be doing it remote. Yeah, we're going to do it remote. We're trying to figure out, I'm trying to figure out all the technical setup for what we're going to do. It may just be a single camera setup and low key, but we'll have fun. Okay, we'll have fun. It'll be in a, in a new space. Whatever reclaiming means to you, make sure it brings you closer. That closing line. Yeah. Thanks for watching and we'll see you all next time. Sa.