White Fox Talking
Talk About Mental Health & Well-Being… Why Not? Mark ‘Charlie’ Valentine suffered life changing mental illness, before beginning a journey to recovery and wellness; the darkness of PTSD transformed by the light atop mountains and beyond. Mark is now joining forces with Seb Budniak, to make up the ‘White Fox Talking’ team. Through a series of Podcasts and Vlogs, ‘White Fox Talking’ will be bringing you a variety of guests, topics, and inspirational stories relating to improving mental well-being. Find your way back to you! Expect conversation, information, serious discussion and a healthy dose of Yorkshire humour!
White Fox Talking
E63: Nicky Chisholm - Pink Nicky's Journey of Empowerment and Community Connection
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What if the secret to true wellness lies just beyond our comfort zones, in the embrace of nature's vast landscapes? Join us as we explore the adventurous world of Nicky Chisholm, affectionately known as Pink Nicky, whose journey from organising vibrant networking events for female entrepreneurs to thriving as a freelance project manager in the adventure industry is nothing short of inspiring. Nicky's love for the outdoors is infectious—whether she's running a half-marathon in the icy terrains of Greenland or hitting the road in her trusty camper van, Daisy. Through her stories, we uncover the profound impact of outdoor activities on mental well-being and the transformative power of building communities rooted in shared interests.
Family adventures have a unique way of shaping our relationship with the outdoors, and we delve into these legacies as we share personal stories of childhood camping trips and introducing the wonders of nature to the next generation. As life's chapters evolve, solo adventures beckon, offering new ways to connect with the world around us. From skiing in the Arctic to trekking through Peru, the bonds forged during these journeys remind us of the irreplaceable value of community and connection. Through these narratives, we emphasise the accountability and joy that come from shared experiences, reinforcing the idea that community is an essential part of our outdoor pursuits.
Celebrate International Women's Day with us through an ambitious swim event that unites 1,000 women across Brighton and Dorset. This initiative is all about stepping out of comfort zones, fostering empowerment, and celebrating the incredible bonds formed through shared adventures. We highlight stories of unexpected friendships from off-grid living in Sweden and discuss the healing power of water, which not only connects us with nature but also advocates for environmental change. We invite listeners to embrace their unique paths and find courage in community, while reflecting on the power of consistent outdoor practices for holistic well-being.
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Hello and welcome to the White Fox Talking Podcast. I'm Mark Jolly-Valentine, and at the controls is Mr Budniak.
Speaker 2:Why are you introducing me? That's my surname.
Speaker 1:He's Sebastian Budniak.
Speaker 2:Yes, yes, how am I here?
Speaker 1:Well, we have just recorded one podcast. We're on the second one of the evening. I'm trying to, you know, change it up a bit. Change it up a bit, mate. You know what I mean. We don't want to get barred. We need to stop looking at each other here because we've got a screen there. Yeah, but through the appliance of science, we're actually sat next to each other. There you go, get off. So how's things? Yeah, okay. In the hour since I asked you last.
Speaker 2:Still okay.
Speaker 1:Really good podcast, though, mate Really good podcast, and we've got another one coming up. Another good one, another good one.
Speaker 2:Well, do an introduction then For the guest, yes, not for yourself.
Speaker 1:So are you ready for this public? Because here is a lady that I met a couple of years ago at the Adventure Mind conference and she's a bit of a force. So welcome, nicky Chisholmm. The white fox talking podcast is sponsored by energy impact.
Speaker 3:How are you, hello boys? Thank you so much for having me on the podcast. I really appreciate it you are welcome.
Speaker 1:So pinky, nikki or nikki, or how do you want us to call you in the adventure world as pink nikki pink nikki. Yeah, yeah. So yeah, like I said, I met you at the Adventure Mind and then we met you this year, where you are now Ambassador for Adventure Mind.
Speaker 3:Yes, adventure Mind is something that I love. Adventure's been, it's been my sort of like, the way I navigate through life, the way of navigating the ups and downs. So when Adventure Mind came across my path, I thought these are going to be my crew, my tribe, the people that I just know that are going to get it, that love being out on the hills, um, and yeah, hence where I met you and this is where sort of our you know friendship or relationship has developed and hence why I'm here. So, yeah, that it was. It was where networking begins. It begins for all of us, and then you take it forward with all the network, the contacts and the friends, friends that you meet there.
Speaker 1:Cool. So could you give the listeners, viewers, a brief introduction about yourself? So a little bit about your background. We'll probably go into that again anyway, but a little bit of a foreword.
Speaker 3:Oh my God, this is a tough one because I don't know where to start, so I'm going to keep it really simple. So I live in Brighton with my husband and my two teenage boys and my cat and my camper, van Daisy, who I absolutely love. She's my pride and joy, um, I take her everywhere very slowly. I drove down to Cornwall took me 10 hours and I didn't overtake a single person in 10 hours. That's how slow she is. But everyone loves her. She's like the queen, you know. People wave and say hello and they absolutely love her. So she's my pride and joy. So I live in brighton, um, and my job is I am a freelance project manager specializing in projects, um, and campaigns and fundraisers and businesses in the adventure industry. Um, that is what I'm doing now.
Speaker 3:Pre pre that, I ran my own business, uh, running networking events for female entrepreneurs. I I did that for 10 years and we got to post-COVID and it kind of annihilated it because it was in-life networking and I got it through COVID online on Zoom, and then it was my moment of like I've got everyone through it. We hit 50,000 visits to our meetings and I thought, nikki, you've done your time here. Covid's kind of blown its piece. Now Time to sort of move on. That's where I hit 50. 50 years old, my birthday, and I decided to go to Greenland to run a half marathon. And then I decided to set myself up as a freelance project manager in the outdoor adventure space. So I blog and run campaigns for businesses, websites and blogs in that space.
Speaker 1:And that's yeah, that's what I'm doing now, hence why I was at adventure mind and I met charlie. So I know there's a lot to unpick there, but, um, that's it in a nutshell. No, it's good, isn't it? Because there's so many people, so many people working in different areas but with the same sort of aim in it, and we're sort of all trying to promote something to do with wellness and well-being and mental well-being and positivity, I suppose yeah, it's, it's, it's a natural thing for those like we.
Speaker 3:We know those of us that are in it.
Speaker 3:We know getting outside is good for you. We know going for a walk is good for you. We know getting your rucksack on or having a mini adventure or a mac, you know a huge adventure. It is good for the soul and the spirit and just make your heart sing. But what we need to get that out into, uh, the wider sphere, into, into, um, into policy, into government, into education, um, and that's where the crux of it will be um, we know it's good for you. And who doesn't feel better having gone for a walk, having gone outside? You just feel better. Nobody feels worse from getting off the sofa and putting down their cup of tea, switching off netflix and getting outside? No one does. Everyone feels so much better. And there's a cup of tea. Switching off Netflix and getting outside? No one does. Everyone feels so much better. And there's all sorts of businesses within that industry. Whether it's adventures, whether it's trekking, whether it's navigating, whether it's retreats, whether it's events, we all want the same thing. You know. We want more people outside doing stuff.
Speaker 1:Yeah, I mean, there's a lot there and I could have gone on so many rants on quite a few of them, them agencies that you mentioned, you know, because there seems to have been a step away, doesn't there for the last? I don't know how many years. I've mentioned this a few times. I think I mentioned it with Belinda, belinda Kirkley. We had on about it seems to have been. It's a forgotten art, is going outside and going out in the hills and people think, seem to think it's this big mystical area where you know myths and legends, and it's not, it's just getting out, like you say yeah, I think.
Speaker 3:But also, I think obviously from from a woman's side of it. You know, being adventure since I was sort of 17, 18, 19, a young canoeing instructor, a young sailing instructor, um, I've sailed across the channel on a schooner, one of the um sail training association, massive schooners, when I was really young and it was obviously only sort of girl on them. You know, I've seen how adventure has changed and the sphere has opened up for for more women. So more women instructors, mountain leaders, sailing instructors, all sorts of things. So it's massively opened up and at the adventure conference it's sort of 50 50 and that's how we want it 50, 50.
Speaker 3:So you get a fair voice and a balanced voice, balanced policy, balance, um, input, resources and research. That's what we want. We want that balance and we want those voices coming forward from a diverse background. Um, you know, and that's what is happening, but not quick enough and not big enough and not often enough and not in enough spaces. Um, you know, lots of middle-aged women go sea swimming. That's what, that's what you know. That is a, a demographic that everybody would know. But we want more people of a more diverse background into sea swimming.
Speaker 3:Um, that's kind of I know we're going to come on to that, but that's yeah that's my thing at the minute, because it's open to everyone, you know it's, it's free, it's cheap. You just need a swimming costume or a pair of trunks and get in yeah.
Speaker 1:So if we, just before we get on to the main topic of what we're going to talk about, I'm just looking at things that you've done before, which is wing walking, moon walking, fire, walking sea, swimming, road running absolutely, there's a huge list searching for parrots in the depths of the amazon. Wow, what was the fire that drove you to? What kick-started all this?
Speaker 3:Ah, you know, that's a really good question. I think my legacy from my dad he's not here anymore, but my legacy from dad always, from when we were little, it's always being outside camping, canoeing, boating, sailing, walking, running, you know adventures Really sort of local, not expensive, but it was always just being outside. It was just a way of being, not like we were doing it on purpose as a family. You'd have a picnic and you'd be outside, you'd go for a walk and you're outside, or a barbecue. I mean, I meet people. I met a lady the other day. She doesn't even own a pair of trainers. She was like what know, it's bonkers. You know who doesn't own a pair of trainers? Have you ever met anyone that doesn't own a pair of trainers?
Speaker 1:not myself.
Speaker 3:No, um, no, I think people so it's like, you know, it still happens and I think for me, as I've got older, uh, it's a way of navigating through life, it's a way of I'm feeling sad. So when I lost my dad, I just used to walk and run and just get outside when my kids were little. I've got two boys. They were nutty, they're like crazy monkeys, so I just take them outside. They'll be outside all the time. I just needed to get them out in the air and running. And as they got, they got older, we changed, you know, from camping into things like climbing, um, ben Nevis, you know, going off on the sleeper train and then jumping in the north sea um, um, would you quit jumping off of rocks coast steering.
Speaker 3:So my adventure life has changed as the family has changed and now my boys are sort of 20 and 17. It's changing again where they're moving away, and now I've got a little bit of space and I'm like chomping at the bit, thinking, oh my god, what can I do next? Because the boys don't want to do it with me. Uh, my husband's a serious golfer, so he plays loads of golf and he does his, you know, he, he does his thing now. Now I've come to a new chapter and I'm thinking what can I do?
Speaker 3:Um, last year I went to Peru, um did Greenland for my 50th, you know, and it's like there's a, there's a space now for me, navigating the emptiness. You know, it's adventure is a journey for me. It's been a journey and it's changed as I've gone along, but it's always been outside and it's always been a way me saying, and my boys, busy and active and just embracing being outside, just by being with me and my husband, it's like. It's like a legacy, isn't it, that you pass on. I'm not making them do it, it's just of who we are and it's a way for them, when they get older, to navigate different times. I've shown them how to do it and they can navigate different times.
Speaker 2:So have you definitely sparked your children's passion for adventure.
Speaker 3:When they were younger. Definitely. Now they're teenagers and they're kind of like, you know, typical teenagers. They just want to. You know they just want to like play. You know computer games and they go down the gym. So they're they're really into that. So I think that will come sort of later. But you know, we've been out and been camping since they were like even sort of you know two and three that they've had a whole life of experiencing it and I might have taken on too many camping trips where they've gone one month please, no more. But, um, you know more. But you know we've stayed in like helicopters and we've stayed in dens and we've stayed in huts. You know, I think it will be in them and it's showing them what they can do and I think when they get past the whole teenage stage it will be there.
Speaker 3:My dad taught me, my mum taught me, and I think I will pass that legacy on to my kids. And what a lovely legacy to pass on. You know, you don't need millions of pounds. You can get outside, do simple things, have picnics on the beach, put a rucksack on and get outside. I think for me it was really important that I pass that on. It wasn't I thought I'm going to do it. It was just part of who I am and who my husband is, so it's a good thing.
Speaker 1:Can I ask? So the things you've organised in the past and the adventures you've been on, have they been group rather than solo? Because I know I did a lot of solo, but there again I was in quite a bad space when I first picked up my boots again and went out. So what I'm getting from what you're saying there is there's a lot of adventure, but also community.
Speaker 3:Yeah, I really, really, really love being with people, because when I did a cross-country ski marathon in the Arctic Circle and I went with one girlfriend and then we met a group of women out there and it was really important for the year. I came back afterwards I probably thought about that experience every single day and I chatted to my friend at least once or twice a week, saying do you remember this and do you remember that, and what about this and what about that? My friend at least once or twice a week saying do you remember this and do you remember that, and what about this and what about that. So for me it's always important to have, like a buddy or a wing woman or a wingman or a group. And yeah, it is important because then you've got the somebody with you. So if people are, you know, worried about getting outside or doing something, if you've got a wing woman or a wingman, you've got accountability. You've got you know you're responsible for someone. You're, you've got shared action, shared risk. Um, I think that's a really good thing to have, um, that community.
Speaker 3:Last february I went out to sweden. I met eight women at stockholm airport but I didn't know, and we went to live off grid for a week, so we had no electricity, no running water, and my biggest fear was that it wasn't the expedition that I couldn't do. I knew I could do that, but what I was worried about was meeting eight strangers in an airport and then thinking shit, I've got to spend the whole week with these nutters. Imagine if they're all awful or if they're all um mad or if they're all I don't know neurodiverse. How about that, charlie?
Speaker 1:yes, well, I imagine they were thinking the same I imagine they were very much so.
Speaker 3:But the good, you know what it was the best thing. It turns out to be brilliant. And those girls I'm going away with this february and it just shows there was uh, you stepped outside your comfort zone, you gave it your best shot and that was the most brilliant thing. So we lived off grid, we collected our own water, we collected our own wood and those girls were a community that I met and we stayed friends and it was just you couldn't say it was luck, but also you put yourself in that situation and you've met eight strange people at an airport. I mean, who? It's never going to be a good thing.
Speaker 1:Most people would say that's never going to be a good thing, but it was a good thing yeah, I've met people on expeditions going away to the mountains that have then become regular climbing partners and regular expedition partners. You know friends for life and you know, even to to the extent of going out, socializing, uh, but we don't want to talk about them. Adventures there, they were a different level. But so we get around to what we're, what we're actually organizing now with you. You know, talking about this community and making friends through these adventures and just that stepping out there. So the idea is you are organizing an event to celebrate internationals women's day, and it's a big one.
Speaker 3:Yes, indeed, it's a big event yeah, international women's day is a global day, um, and it's's to celebrate women, and that could be in education, health policy, criminal justice system, it could be young, old, whatever. So it's across the world and lots of events put on and what I wanted to do was combine all the things that I love. So I love getting people together, I love getting the community together, I love getting women together and I love supporting the environment. So I'll tell you about that afterwards. So, basically, it's what we call the big swim and we are getting 1,000 women together on International Women's Day, 500 in Brighton and 500 in Dorset.
Speaker 3:We say swim, but it's not Obviously, it's March. So you literally run in the sea, you scream and you holler and you shout and you woo. We say swim, but it's not Obviously, it's March. So you literally run in the sea, you scream and you holler and you shout and you whoop and you splash around and you make a noise and they all come out again. So the idea is it's that sense of fun, it's that sense of feral, it's that sense of bonkersness. Everyone dresses up and they look ridiculous and it's a way of celebrating women and it's getting women together. Some of the women I've met in previous years, they've said, especially because it was post-covid, the early one it's like.
Speaker 3:This is the first event I've been to. I've been too scared to go to things. Um, I felt like I'm not good enough or I didn't want, I wasn't welcome, um. So that the whole idea is, we get all these women together and it is. I'll tell you what it is. If I could bottle it, I would be a multi-millionaire, because the noise of all these nutty, beautiful women going in the water is just brilliant. We've got video footage and drone footage. Um, we had the bb on there and they were like my god, what is going on? Um, it was just really good. So this is the third year we've done it. We had 250 the first year, we had 500 last year and I kind of like to make a noise. So I kind of like right, I'm going to go for a thousand and let's see what happens. So that's it in a nutshell well, I'll be honest.
Speaker 1:I'll be honest, nikki, I know you, so nothing surprises me with you. I'll be honest about you before, so, but what a brilliant idea. There's a lot going on there, though. It's like you say, with a community. Will there be women that have never done this before?
Speaker 3:it's a when I did it the first year, I literally all my ideas come to me in the middle of the night and I just wake up and I think, oh, this is a great idea. I'm gonna just put a note up on facebook and say we're gonna run a swim. Who wants to come? So I didn't really put. I'm supposed to say I'm all sophisticated strategic planning and it was beautifully made up, but it wasn't the first year. I just thought I'm going to see what happens and it sold out really quickly. And then the next year, um, it was much more strategic because I needed first aid, I needed lifeguards, I needed insurance. So it's much more logistics planning. It's what I'm good at, logistics planning. But I'm pulling it all together now. I've forgotten what you said because I was so excited about talking about it. Charlie's forgotten as well.
Speaker 1:No, what was it? It was this thing about. You know, is it the first time somebody, some of these women, have joined the group? Well, obviously you've grown from 250 now you're up to 500 in one location and then 500 in another location. Are these women that are coming down for the first time, etc.
Speaker 3:So this year I'm trying to make it more diverse because I know there are communities that with adventure it's quite self-filtering. The same people step forward. Yes, I want to climb a mountain. Yes, I want to go on a. Yes, I want to go on a trek. Yes, I've got boots. Yes, I've got a rucksack. Yes, I want to get involved. What I'm trying to do with the social media and and the the branding behind it is to show you know somebody, um, different body shapes, different skin color, different sizes, so it's kind of like people can visually see and be cued of what in the imaging, um, so everybody be welcome.
Speaker 3:We do say everyone's welcome, but you, you don't want to step in the scene for the first time in march after a cold winter because you probably give yourself a heart attack. So we do say come along, be part of it, but just dip your feet and fap about and wear your sparkles and your headdress, join in the whole, suck in all the energy and yeah, so we, so they are welcome. But we do sort of say, if you're new to it, you could probably scare yourself off rather than opening the door to amazing opportunity to swim going forward. So we do say that in the safety briefing and all the emails beforehand.
Speaker 1:So there's more to it than just getting in the water, turning up, getting the water clear off. There's a lot more to it, yeah.
Speaker 3:Yeah, well it's, I don't know. Charlie, do you know what? You need to come down. You need to come down and experience. You'll sit with your head in your hands going oh my God, what have I got myself into? And you, seb, you can come down and join in.
Speaker 1:Well, I think, cursing my wife would love to do it, but what dates? That is, aren't they? But I'm not like I say, I'm not a woman.
Speaker 3:Everybody's welcome. No.
Speaker 1:I heard that. I heard that I was just trying to put. I was hoping you'd forgot. Do you know what I'm going to say? We'll see, we will see. It's a possibility. It's a possibility, you know. Oh, what have I?
Speaker 3:said, it's just a good way of, you know, getting everyone together. And the other sort of part of it is obviously we support the event, supports Surfers Against Sewage. Now, it's an obvious partnership, isn't it? Because down in Brighton, you know, we check our app and it says you can't swim today. There's basically too much sewage, you know, and there's loads of plastic on the beach, so if we get a poo sign, you can't swim. I mean, it's just beyond ridiculous that we have to look for a shit on our app and then we can't swim. It's so ridiculous, but we can't.
Speaker 1:So it's an obvious charity partnership yeah, um well, what a great charity, charity so what happens if, if you can't swim?
Speaker 3:well, I thought about this. There's two problems. If we see, if we get like a storm, we have to cancel it. But if we get sewage problem, can you imagine the noise and the posters and the social media and the complete snack are. Is that the word theigans?
Speaker 1:We've got all the words for it.
Speaker 3:Yeah, we will make. Don't get me wrong. I can get my self hold of a six foot poo no, six foot poo on the beach. It's incredible. Just so you know. We could make a real what's the word PR fabulousness.
Speaker 1:I'd say we could make a real big shit storm about it. So if we were to just look at the health and mental health benefits that people can gain through sea swimming, wild swimming, cold water swimming because these are now proven we just used to call it swimming, I'll be honest, when I was a kid. But again, since covid passed, everyone's out and everyone's trying to swim, but then we've got this poo problem and this plastic problem and pollution problem and it's just, it's just draining it without getting too far. I don't want to get away from the mental health side, because we'll go through, uh, the benefits. We'll go through the benefits, we'll go through the benefits. But it is ridiculous, isn't it? And you've got people saying that they can heal themselves through using cold water. They can heal themselves or they're taking better self-care and getting purpose from taking cold water dips, and this is free, but we can't because someone's polluting the water further up.
Speaker 3:It's a huge problem and it's something that the what I want from the swim in 2025 is the thousand women. I want them to take a my, my take is going to be take a thousand action. So I want to see ripple effects. So those thousand women I'm going to say join. Surface against sewage. You know, go along to a beach, clean, become an advocate for surface against sewage. Become an advocate for elevate or amplify or help women in your community. If I can spark all the women to take action that come along, imagine those potential changes that can filter down. Maybe surface against sewage gets poor descriptions, donations. Maybe people can write white papers. Maybe people can write to their mps. There's lots of actions that can come from that.
Speaker 3:Because just the wild swimmers unnatural environmental advocates. Advocacy for the environment is not something that they probably make decisions to do, but the fact is, if they can't swim because of the pollution and then they're writing to their MP or they're reporting it on an app or they're picking up rubbish, they feel and see the damage to the environment and they are the people that you know. They're picking up rubbish, they feel and see the damage to the environment and they are the people that you know that. You know they're the front line that's feeling it. They're more likely to post a picture of the sewage, talk about the sewage hashtag sewage right to the local mp. Those people become the advocates. And I think with the big swim I am going to be asking people you know there's a thousand women here. I don't want to lose that energy and that passion and that drive. As well as the celebration and the nuttiness and the feralness. I kind of want to have some core messaging and action from it.
Speaker 1:Yeah, Absolutely. I was thinking that core anger. You know what I mean. There will be a nucleus of people that are if I come down I'll probably get the scent of it that are quite angry about this, isn't?
Speaker 2:there, you know what I mean. Well, you should be angry about it, right? We're in 2025 nearly. Oh yeah, we are now sorry, we're in 2025 oh, yes, yes, yes well done and this is happening. How, how is this? Even? Capitalism the people who are doing it are also harming themselves, so it doesn't even make sense.
Speaker 3:It doesn't. And I know Service Against Sewage have got a manifesto which they took to government before the election, trying to get people to take the manifesto and make it policy, because unless those suggestions are turned into policy, nothing will ever change. So you know, they are pushing, there are plenty of charities that are pushing, and Surfers Against Serious is at the forefront of that, and they will push. They're pushing and pushing and pushing all the time. But unless it becomes policy and central government, then you know. But if we do get shitstormed, as Charlie so delicately puts it, um, I would actually be delighted, do you know? I know it's awful, but I would be delighted because we can make a lot of noise 500 women on the beach at one time and I will ask them to bring placards and all sorts of shenanigans. Um, it can only be. It can only help get to place the spotlight and shine the light on things actually.
Speaker 1:So you know, environmental advocacy is a natural part of wild swimming well, it's got to be this thing that hopefully I'm qualified by now it's 2025. I should have finished that last year. That is my nature therapy and this, this connection with this connection with the landscape, and this concept of yugan, which is a it's linked to buddhism, where we're not actually, you know, we're not controllers of nature. We are part of nature and while we destroy nature, we're also destroying ourselves, like you said to Seb, and I believe there's been studies that where the sight of non-natural scenes, as in litter everywhere, can cause is stress deep in our subconscious, which I don't I'd have to find the, I'd have to find the study for you.
Speaker 1:But so it's all about this mental well-being for ourselves. So, getting back to the mental well-being before we start, before we start running down brighton with placards. So should we, should we talk about some of the benefits of, like, a cold water dip or just being in water, or just be near water, because there there's, you know, there's there's proven benefits of just being near water, the sound of water I think who doesn't love sit on the beat or by a lake or just by a body of water?
Speaker 3:it, first of all it gets you out of the environment that you're in, whether it's home or work or whatever it's. So it's um changing the cycle of where you're at. And I'm quite visual, so it's a visual cue. So you're looking out so you can see the calm, can feel here, so all your senses are sort of sucking in what you can see around and it's the calmness, isn't it? It's the space around you and then hopefully you haven't got your phone with. So it's space and the calm.
Speaker 3:And if you get in the water, it's the feel and then it's the mental reaction, physical reaction that your body has as it gets in that body of water. So it's it, um, yeah it, but people, you know people have known this forever. It's not, it's not a new thing. I mean, covid has basically made the world swimming go completely bonkers, um, but it's not a new concept. Being near the sea or being outside, or being always going to be good for all of us, um, and you know, I'm just thinking about it now I can feel myself, you know it does, and it all your senses are taken in, and then it's um, it's, it's just fed into your mind and it's sort of like visually cued to your cortisol, your adrenaline.
Speaker 1:Yeah, there's a theory that the sound of water actually resonates deep in your reptilian brain and it's a comfort because it means that there's water nearby. It's a survival mechanism so we can relax and, you know, trigger stimulates the parasympathetic system, which parasympathetic I always trying to relate that to paradise sympathetic and parasympathetic well, parasympathetic paradise. This is where I'm relaxed and I can chill out and hopefully my mind can either try and gain some presence and not be you know, not be twitching from one thing or other and, like you say, get rid of the phone. What else have we got going on with this swim? We've got community. We've mentioned that.
Speaker 3:I think lots of the women that I swim with it's known it helps reduce inflammation. So inflammation virus or stress, and if that's not dealt with, obviously quickly it develops into other things. So people say I've got headache've got migraine, I've got um, uh, perimenopause, I've got menopause at my joints ache. It seems to be something that can help um, lots of people with lots of different symptoms, because obviously you're physically hurting, um, and then you're not getting out of the house and then your mental health then begins to suffer and it's all a big sort of combined mess. Um, so just by swimming now obviously you're not swimming once a month to have any kind of physiological, mental response, like anything in life consistency um, you're up and you're making a commitment and then the more regularly you do it, the more people begin to feel that stressing um, so many people say, oh, I feel better, this doesn't ache anymore. And I was this to one of your podcasts the other day about sleep, because I'm a terrible sleeper and one of the um, one of your guests, he's a sleep specialist.
Speaker 3:Yeah, james yeah yeah, and he was saying, and he was, and some people when they do their sea swimming, they also sleep better. Yeah, so then that's going to help you, it's going to help your joints fix, it's going to help you feel better from having swim and get out of sleep better. I mean, that's like a triple whammy, isn't it? Yeah, where?
Speaker 1:you're calming all these, getting rid of all these stress hormones aren't you that are flowing around your system. It's something that I took up a long time well, not a couple of years ago with the cold shower every morning, and I still maintain it. I know I'll breaths Well done Every day. I do it every day and I'll get in. And I do you know what?
Speaker 1:For the first I've spoken about it a couple of times, but for the first, going up to the first two minutes that I was doing, I'd be screaming. You know, when I first started doing it, I'd be doing 10, 15 seconds a time more. And then I'm like well, I'm actually here to release stress, and you know it's going to be cold, and I stand there, I've got my hands in front of me and I do my three deep breaths, last breath, fully out and then boom straight into the cold shower. But I've stopped putting my head under first across that part and that's not good. That's your mammalian response which causes stress. But yeah, I've achieved something in the day straight away and also I do feel better for it. Obviously it's individual.
Speaker 3:Charlie, I would like a photograph of you in your bath in the morning. No, no, in your bath. Yeah, you're so, you're so, you're doing your. I want to see you doing your full-on.
Speaker 1:Well, fully enough. We're in the process of we're running a, a whim off workshop with uh, we've got an instructor to come down and we're having we're doing this in leeds which will be going out as a vlog. Hopefully it all comes together now. I've said it, yeah, no pressure, but we're going to be doing that and we're going to run that as a podcast with jack. So jack's going to do the podcast about the benefits of the cold water and the breath work. So that might be something there. Yeah, because I mean, the ice baths have been a big thing, haven't they? And I think some. When some people look at these, you know everyone's getting an ice bath and dunking into it. That can be a little step too far for some people. But, like you say, just going down even if you're just going down to the beach, where you're on the 8th of March, and going in up to the knees or up to the waist, that is a personal achievement for some, is it not?
Speaker 3:Yeah, absolutely One of the. I met a family. It was grandma, daughter and granddaughter, so sort of like you know, 80, then 50, then sort of 10. They came down together and the grandma, she said I haven't done anything, covid, this is a few years ago now and this is my first time out, so for her it was. She said this is a big moment for my family, for me, my daughter and my granddaughter, and I always remember her telling me that. She said I'm just so chuffed that I'm here and I'm so chuffed that I'm part of it. Yes, she didn't get in and she didn't sort of like, you know, go up to here or put her head under, but she was there and she was dipping her feet. I am part of this community and she, because of the, the natural energy of it, she's, I can feel it and I want to just thank you so much and I just remember that little story.
Speaker 3:Um, so she didn't go all the way in, she was part of it, she was part of community and the sisterhood on that day yeah, I mean the happy hormones that are released just because of community and being and that sense of belonging you find your tribe, you find, you find your people and you feel, you feel happy because I think one of the things that you, when you come for a swim, you know you no one looks good in neoprene wetsuit, boots, neoprene gloves, a swimming coat and a neoprene hat. I mean it's just not possible. So you're down to your bare bones of your body and you do look a bit mad, but it all you know the gloves and the booties and everything do really work and so you're down to sort of like the bare bones of of your being and that's quite refreshing and makes your heart feel good, because you're with your tribe and they all look the same and no one really gives a shit and it's just brilliant.
Speaker 1:You know they're all together is it this pressure from society, societal opinions that we're worried about? And then once you get, like you say, when you get with that tribe, then it's, it's all good, you know it's. You know, actually, their preconceptions that I had in my mind are actually wrong. You know everyone's down here doing the same thing, with the same focus you can feel a bit braver, can't you?
Speaker 3:when you're with other people, you feel brave. If you're surrounded by people and you're in the middle of that group, you can feel braver and you can take a little baby step. You know, I'm all in um, all for that. You know, baby step, baby step, step outside your comfort zone. One, one little foot, two little feet. Then you know you're stepping outside and being with your tribe, whatever the medium or the sport that it is is going to help you. It's just you've got to be brave enough to. You know, buy a ticket, come along, turn up and be part of it, and if you find your wingman or your wingwoman, then again that makes it go along, because somebody says oh, I don't want to go and get your ass off the table, we're going. You know, I'm getting the cars outside.
Speaker 2:Come on, let's go I feel like a lot of people who work better as well in a group where they give each other confidence. A lot of people a bit of fear or a bit of anxiety, but when you're in a group, you, you know safety in numbers. It always makes you feel a little bit safer.
Speaker 3:Yeah, yeah, and if I, if I can get a thousand women doing it and that, can you imagine the post swim high after that and all the happy hormones again. If us three could bottle that, we could do a lot of podcasts yeah, well, we are, we are some bottles down, charlie, when you so I'm like, oh, it looks like I've been volunteered, um.
Speaker 1:So I mean, we are, at the end of the day, we are a social species, aren't we? And um, a lot came out during covid and gabon matter is a massive advocate of community for not just improving mental well-being but maintaining mental well-being, and we've mentioned before about studies saying loneliness is as as damaging to the body as 15 cigarettes a day oh, I know, and that's just horrible, horrible statistic and don't, and I think, think more so.
Speaker 3:Now there are events that you if being brave enough to sign up for parkrun, you know, if you can't run, but you can parkwalk, parkwalk, find, just if you could put on. For some people, just putting on your trainers and walking around the block is a massive thing, you know, it's huge. You know, for some people, they want to get to base camp Everest your adventure people. They want to get to base camp everest your adventure, your thing. You know, comparison is a dangerous thing. Copying other people is a dangerous thing. Just ignore everyone else's things. If you can put on your trains and walk around the block, that's for something.
Speaker 3:That, coming along to the international women's day, swim some people they're, you know, weekly, daily, advocate swimming. For others, it's a big, it's a big day. Celebrate being a woman, um, being um part of something bigger. You, and I think if you can be part of something bigger than you, and I think if you can be part of something bigger than you, it just makes your soul sing. You can't help but feel that community, feel the love and the fun, and who's not going to walk away from that feeling so much better and feeling inspired to do something else. I mean that's what I want them to do is go away and take part in something come to see swimming or walking or running. Just do something else. I mean that's what I want them to do is weigh and take part in something to come to see swimming or walking or running. Just do something. I'm hoping it's a catalyst, you know, for change.
Speaker 1:I've just noticed, on the information that you sent us about swimming, blue spaces for social prescribing. Do you think this might be a Ooh?
Speaker 3:I had some, would you? I first heard the concept of social.
Speaker 1:Social prescribing.
Speaker 3:So would you. I first heard the concept of social prescribing, um, so it's kind of like, basically, your doctor saying and this is not, you know, this isn't. It's very basic. You know, I'm not going to give you pills but I am going to say 20 minutes a day for six weeks and they sign you up somebody to walk with. That's an it's basic form. Um, and I was looking at um a lady, catherine Kelly. She's at the University of Brighton and she's released lots of research into the blue space and its sense of well-being and she's taken that into government through a committee and they're trying to get social prescribing as a thing for the future. I think it's slowly coming. I mean, it's so slowly it's almost pathetic, but it's a concept. The concept is now being tested in very small areas and then I think, when my kids are older, I think the social prescribing will be, it will be a thing, and then it won't even be a thing. It will just be what happens when you go to the doctors.
Speaker 1:They'll say, well, you do six weeks of walking every day, um, and then and then describing so it's really powerful and it could change way, massive change so, without getting off topic, because you're, you're just, you're a little bit younger than me, but are you, do you think you're noticing I'm just wondering if it's the world that we work in that way. You're noticing sort of a full circle, as in when I was a kid and when you were, when you were younger. You're out doing all these adventures. When I a kid, I was thrown out of the house at 8 o'clock in the morning. I didn't come back until the streetlights went on.
Speaker 1:We have spoke about this a few times as well, haven't we, sir? But you know this thing about being outdoors all the time, and now there's so much evidence of distractions and the damage it does to you not being outdoors, not partaking in sport or exercise or even activity. Do you know what I mean? Do you think we you know? You just said there about social prescribing. Well, social prescribing to me would be it's an intervention that's prescribed to somebody whereas hopefully in the future people don't actually need these interventions because they're actually practising self-care. We seem to have a generation, full, full generation that's ignoring what's actually good for them and just reaching for the quick, fixed dopamine hit that's a huge topic.
Speaker 3:I don't even know where to start well, you just say yes or no. It's coming out way around charlie, it is coming all the way around I think it's something that everyone's known. We all know it. It's just practicing um around?
Speaker 3:I think it is. It's something that everyone's known. We all know it. It's just practicing, you know. I think there is such power for the addictive nature of technology. Do you remember your first phone? I mean, my kids would be like mortified if they saw my first phone. It was flicky, massive. Think of Del Boy. Do you remember Del Boy? Yeah, you know, yeah.
Speaker 3:You know, so I mean, that was maybe I don't know 30 years ago and they weren't addictive. It was literally a call. And then think of the way I just think of the way my kids use them and their friends. They're made and the gaming is to be really addictive. And so, until you know, we know it's bad for us, but why don't we stop? I don't know what the answer is. I don't know what the answer is, but you put your bloody phone down and get outside. That's the secret to that, isn't it?
Speaker 1:Turn the internet off. Turn the internet off? Well, we can't turn the internet off because people like us are broadcasting down people's phones.
Speaker 3:Yeah, catch too. Pink bicky. How did that name come about? Yeah, that's a good one. I have always worn pink. Um, my wedding dress was pink and I've got a lovely photograph. Of course I've got a lovely photograph of me, my mom and my dad and my husband and it's such a lovely photo and it's really precious and I have worn it lots of times. We've been married like 20 odd years so I I have worn it quite a few times since. And then in my dippers group, my swimming group, there was several nickies and so we had to sort of say, no, that's dr nicky and that's our pink nicky. So that it kind of then, sort of because I always wore pink as well, so it sort of just naturally evolved from there, and I do love a bit of pink how often do you go swimming yourself cold water or sea swim?
Speaker 3:I own. I swim once a week yeah um, I haven't done. We've got stuff going on in the house a minute, um, so I haven't really done much. We've got like a big blow up, um like ice donkey thing oh yeah I don't know what you dip in like a blow up.
Speaker 1:I can't is it a loomy?
Speaker 3:yeah, yeah like a blow up thing. You put your water in there, we dunk in there.
Speaker 1:Yeah.
Speaker 3:But I think what I got into the world because I just like going and meeting the girls, I've got a house full of them, I've got my teenage boys, the cat's man and my husband and I just think I just need the girl. Give me the girl, give me my sisters. That's kind of how.
Speaker 1:I got into it and then I grew to love it and then love it more and more and more and more. Yeah, I think Belinda said that on her podcast because of where she's living out on is it Exmo? They have an arranged meeting, her and her girlfriends, and they have to go because they've no signal. So they go down and have a dip in a local dipping spot. But again we go back to that community side, don't we? And the benefits of maybe a bit of routine and meeting and having a chat.
Speaker 3:Yeah, I think, and also because I sometimes ask the girls what do you think of this, what do you think of that? And when you know it's not just you or your family going through that bonkers or madness or ridiculous situation, you go, oh, it's kind of normal, and then you kind of feel a bit better and also it's sharing the words. I always feel better, having sort of shared something. And I wanted to say for you guys, I've got two teenage boys, so listening to you on the podcast and the things that you talk about, I think it's just brilliant because it's inspiring men to talk. It's inspiring men to listen and they men to talk. It's inspiring men to listen and they're thinking there are other people out there doing what I'm doing or going through. What I'm going through could make a massive difference to someone's day. Imagine people are listening, thinking I've been through that, I've had these health, and they're listening. And so brilliant the power of talking to someone with a cup of tea, God, that's worth its weight in gold.
Speaker 1:We were on the verge of bidding the podcast a couple of times, weren't we? And we've got a couple, yeah, in the in the early days, because it's a lot of work and and and obviously I'm terrible with technology and I'm get forcing said to have a nervous breakdown just having to work with me but just at specific times we got a couple of emails from people saying thank you for talking about what you're doing, or doing what you're doing, talking about subjects that were not so. You know, it's good that people are out there. It's good that people are out there listening, to be fair. So thank you.
Speaker 2:Well spreading the word, really.
Speaker 3:Yeah, I want to congratulate you because I think Santa's listening.
Speaker 1:Really.
Speaker 3:Isn't Santa listening from Lapland? Oh, yeah, yeah, oh yes, yeah, so.
Speaker 1:Yeah. So we did have a list in Lapland, we had another one. Where was that? There was a little spate of in like northern Scandinavia. I can't take thanks. I can't take pats on the back. Unfortunately, I struggle with it. I don't know why, but anyway you look pretty comfortable on that catwalk yes, I agree yeah, I nearly put my back out climbing onto that catwalk. So that was down at the Favour World recently where we got a community champion.
Speaker 3:You did well, boys, well done, thank you.
Speaker 1:Thank you.
Speaker 3:From me as a mum thank you for doing what you're doing.
Speaker 1:Cool, thank you. I've gone right shy now. Oh my God, Charlie's lost the words there For once. You usually fill in for me, so how are people gonna sign up for this event?
Speaker 3:um.
Speaker 3:So we have a seven week lead-in and it goes live on january the 20th so it might be live and it runs, might be live by them, uh, january the 20th um, and then it runs through to march the 8th. We've got seven weeks. In that seven weeks we introduce, uh, our partners. Like lands and waves are the crew that are running the, the dorset 500, then sea lanes and beach box are my partners for brighton, helping us run the brighton one um. So we'll introduce the partners, we'll introduce the people. We've got a book launch with emma simpson, an author. That's part of the event. So they can just look out for january, january the 20th.
Speaker 3:I would just say the tickets just go super, super quick. Within sort of about a week they're all gone. So you know, just sign up it's at wwwpinknickycouk and then look for the blogs that come out on those um saturdays and it's about what to wear, what to do, how to take part, how to be part of it. All the podcasts will go out. You know where to listen, how to listen, show notes, that kind of thing. So it's super organized. We've got big branding and working with a professional branding company this year, whereas before I sort of made it all up, this year was sort of going big, bigger and bolder, yeah. So you know, come along. It's open to everybody. It's a big event. We want to raise awareness for International Women's Day, we want to raise awareness for surface sewage and I want to get 1,000 women celebrating, being fabulous, being colourful, being bright, together and united.
Speaker 1:And we're using Sea Swimming to do that. I only asked how people could. Uh, I asked how people could join. You seem to have wrapped it up there for us. Well, thank you for that, pink nikki. Yeah, I'm gonna have to have a look at this date, this march 8th now now seb's volunteer, we'll see. We'll see.
Speaker 1:Thank you for wrapping that up and also, you know, explaining how much this can do, I think it you know the water's there, but it is a massive community event in it's brilliant sounds sounds ass, to be fair it's good fun.
Speaker 3:it's good fun and my a, my mission is, as I say, to get a thousand women along and taking part in in both um locations, but getting those thousand women to do take one action so that there is a ripple effect from that unity, from that power and from that day, and then you know the power of a ripple effect from that unity, from that power and from that day, and then you know the power of a ripple effect. Let's see what happens.
Speaker 3:You know, a thousand women make a lot of noise and I want them to make a noise on the day, but I want them to make a noise online and in their communities and elevating and amplifying the people and the campaigns that they can help.
Speaker 1:Brilliant, everyone's a winner, as they say. We'll see If I can get down. I'll come down, he says, because then I'll be able to bring the coveted White Fox Talking coffee mug. Yay, I was hoping you'd mention that.
Speaker 3:Yeah, most people have got them. Now I'll bring it to the booth.
Speaker 1:Yeah well, we'll have to try and catch up then. Okay, Nicky, thank you for that. We'll put all your information on the podcast information yeah, that's the word and your links and things like that. So brilliant. Good luck with the projects and the big day.
Speaker 3:Thank you very much, boys, and thank you for your podcast. We love it, thank you.
Speaker 1:Cheers, bye-bye, bye-bye. And if you'd like to support us and help us keep the podcast going, then you can go to BuysACoffee or you can click that on our website, whitefoxtalkingcom, and look for the little cup. Thank you.
