The Get Healthy Tampa Bay Podcast

E137: Cynthia Citron on Neurofeedback, EMDR, and Healing Trauma at the Root Cause

• Kerry Reller

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Welcome to the Get Healthy Tampa Bay Podcast with Dr. Kerry Reller! This week’s guest is Cynthia Citron, a Licensed Mental Health Counselor and Board-Certified Neurofeedback Practitioner. In this episode, Cynthia explains how neurofeedback and EMDR (Eye Movement Desensitization and Reprocessing) can rewire the brain, heal trauma, and improve mental health at the root cause.

Cynthia Citron is a Licensed Mental Health Counselor, EMDR trained and Board Certified in Neurofeeback, with 15 years experience helping clients with brain and mental health. Her company, Reboot, uses EMDR and neurofeedback to get to the bullseye of biology and conditioned beliefs, to resolve issues at the root cause level, improving on the current standards of "talking" and getting on medications as the solution.

0:28 – Introduction & Guest Welcome
0:45 – Cynthia’s Background and Reboot Practice
1:41 – What Is Neurofeedback?
3:21 – Clinical Applications vs. Research Applications
5:56 – Treating Anxiety and the Role of Childhood Beliefs
7:59 – Frontal Lobe Development Explained
10:11 – How Trauma Alters Brain Patterns
11:48 – Success Story: Rebooting a Young Adult’s Life
14:57 – EMDR Explained and How It Differs from Talk Therapy
20:52 – Combining Neurofeedback and EMDR for Deeper Healing

Connect with Cynthia Citron
Facebook: Reboot
Instagram: Rebootbreakthroughs
LinkedIn: Cynthia Citron

Connect with Dr. Reller
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Kerry:

All right. Hi everybody. Welcome back to the Get Healthy Tampa Bay podcast. I'm your host, Dr. Kerry Reller, and today we have a very special guest, miss Cynthia Citron. Welcome to the podcast.

Cynthia:

Thank you for having me.

Kerry:

Why don't you, share a little about who you are and what you do.

Cynthia:

I am a licensed mental health counselor. I am board certified in neurofeedback, and I have a business called Reboot that's been in business for about 15 years now. we do trauma therapy to work on the belief system. You know, your core programming and how that affects your body, your illnesses, your choices, everything. And then we also work on the brain patterns that change over time because of what happens to you and stress and all of those things. So we're really getting to the root cause of a lot of mental health and physical issues.

Kerry:

I feel like August is a big stress. Month. So this is, you know, coming at a good time to discuss how we can make these things better. So so you, you already mentioned, you know, neurofeedback and you, you know, licensed and board certified in that. What, can you tell us a little bit about like what that is?

Cynthia:

So the neurofeedback side of things what we do is we start with A-Q-E-E-G. That's a quantitative electroencephalogram and that measures your brain activity. We're looking for the communication, how things communicate with each other. Throughout the brain, we can look at your electrical activity, whether it's too high or too low in any given area compared to the norm. And then we can also look at your processing speeds. And when we look at your brain maps, we get a really good idea of where your symptoms are coming from. And anything brain-based can be trained. Anything from attention issues, A DHD, depression, anxiety, trauma. The default mode network, which is, you know, kind of biohacking for meditative states to just really bring you into the self more. Really there's about a hundred protocols and anything that's are originates in the brain can be improved through neurofeedback and it's non-invasive safe.

Kerry:

Is the EEG that you're hooked up to? Are you like assigning activities? Are they at rest or is there something going on during that time?

Cynthia:

There's one eyes closed recording that gives us an indication about how the sleep is and how the person's performing in the resting state. And then there's eyes open, which tells us how your brain is functioning in the day. So we do both conditions at rest.

Kerry:

Okay. Okay. Yeah, it's, I mean, you know how they do like functional MRIs and things like that. I didn't know how this would like, kind of parallel to that. So functional MRIs is, you know, giving them tasks or having them do certain things or think about certain things while they're doing the MRI on the, you know, the person taking the

Cynthia:

Well, they are doing that for research, you know, like they'll have people do math problems or read or do things, but it's more a research application. You know, what I'm more interested in is, is changing the symptomology and really helping people to feel better clinical application. So I focus more on their baseline and getting that to be better in, in all general cognitive functioning.

Kerry:

Mm-hmm. So you mentioned the root cause. So how does this help you kind of tackle and get, get at the. Root cause

Cynthia:

Well on the, you know, the brain is running everything. So a lot of things that people are doing are wonderful. Like yoga, meditation, like those things are all fantastic, but they're really one step away from the action. I mean, you're not going straight to the brain to affect change, right? So, you know, for example, you can meditate. For, you'd have to meditate for a long, long time to change your actual brain and you'd have to have so many repetitions to rewire your brain that you would probably quit before you got there. You know? So neurofeedback is biohacking that, and, and it just bypasses everything and goes straight to that brain. It's based on operating conditioning that, that what gets rewarded gets repeated. So once we determine what your brain maps look like, we have neurofeedback sessions. And what happens during those sessions is you get hooked up again, your brain activity goes through the software program and you're playing a game. So when you're in the right brain pattern to change your condition. The game moves forward, the sound comes on and you're winning and getting dopamine. When you're not in the right brain pattern, everything stops. So we're basically training the brain non-invasively through its love of dopamine to perform better, you know, in your life. It sounds, it, it's really quite amazing what it can do, considering how noninvasive it is, you know, that, that the brain can be trained much like a dog. You know, it's, we think we're so sophisticated, but the brain loves dopamine. So if you can hack that dopamine, you can get yourself to do just about anything. So it's, it's, it is really fascinating. You know, the, the field of neuroscience and brain research has grown so much. All of our software is based on FMRI studies and, and solid brand, you know, brain research. There's nothing woo woo about it.

Kerry:

Can you give me an example of like, how this, how this process would unfold and like what it, I guess some, I get a condition that it would be helping

Cynthia:

Well, one obviously that we do all the time is anxiety. You know, typically when we're talking about anxiety though, it's not only the neurofeedback that's gonna help them, they also need to work on that psychology and the past and the history. You know, I'm sure you've heard of the book, the Body Keeps Score. Well, maybe not. It's a very wide stream book now, thank God. Because it's talking about how trauma gets stored in the body and if we don't get to the body and, and really process it at a body level, you know, we're only band-aiding the issues. So, you know, although talk therapy is extremely helpful in. Situations, it doesn't really touch trauma because trauma's in the body, so you're not gonna, you're not gonna get to it, you know, having a, having a talk. So basically with anxiety, you would do anxiety network training, maybe default mode network, you know, look at those areas of the brain that are too high in electric activity and train those down. And then also take a look at what events have happened in your life. Historically. Typically under the age of seven is when we make massive decisions and beliefs about ourselves before we even have a frontal lobe. So we have all this programming in there that we decided when we were children and all of it is not true because the child doesn't even have a frontal lobe to discern the difference between what's going on. So we look at that and what experiences had to do with not being in control and not feeling safe, right? Because that's gonna inflate the nervous system, drive high electrical activity in the brain, it's gonna, you know, cause everything to, to be an overdrive. So if you fix the belief system and the brain to do with control and safety, you're rebooted. There's really nothing to go back to. Right? But you can't do just one or the other. You, you really have to look at the biology and the beliefs.

Kerry:

When does the frontal lobe develop?

Cynthia:

It slowly comes in over time. It's not fully developed until, for men it's 27, and for women it's 25. So the frontal lobe, it, you know, in teenagers, you know, we always wonder why teenagers have impulsivity and they make bad decisions and all of that. Well, they literally have a half a frontal lobe.

Kerry:

Well, I mean, I guess you should explain to the listeners what the frontal lobe does then.

Cynthia:

Oh, okay. The frontal lobe is the last part of the brain to come in, and it's responsible for everything. Organization planning, decision making, problem solving motivation. It's the brakes of the brain. It allows you to say, no, you know, I shouldn't do that because X, y, Z is going to happen. Right? Pretty much everything it takes to function as a civilized member of society requires the frontal lobe. So children have very, very small frontal lobes. That's why they can't regulate. And, you know, we become their frontal lobes as parents. And then teenagers have about a half a frontal lobe, so they're. All over the place, driving around making crazy decisions, you know, very impulsive, you know, not the logic isn't super strong. They're really emotional, you know, obviously hormones have to do with that too. And then finally, when we're 25, 27 years old, we have a full brain and that allows us to extrapolate and really look at the consequences and connect dots and look at things from a broader, a broader view.

Kerry:

It's so interesting and I did not realize it was so late that lobe developed. Okay

Cynthia:

Yeah.

Kerry:

got a while to go then.

Cynthia:

Well hang in there. I have three kids in their twenties, so I used to tell my son when he was a wild teenager and he thought he knew everything. I would say, listen, with all due respect, you have a half a frontal lobe. I have a full frontal lobe. And he hated when I would say that,

Kerry:

That's funny.

Cynthia:

I had, I had to trump him when he kept telling me that I don't know what I'm talking about. So yeah, we, we do have an advantage as adults. uh, A big advantage.

Kerry:

So how do brain patterns get altered by trauma and kind of what needs to happen to correct them?

Cynthia:

Well, basically what happens is your, it's connected. Obviously your brain and central nervous system are, are connected, right? So your nervous system is going to. Go into overdrive. The cortisol, the stress hormones, you know, it's all connected, is all gonna go into overdrive. The limbic system is going to be affected because there's no sense of safety. You know, the bear is chasing the child. And even if it doesn't seem like a big deal to an adult, you know, some more sensitive children, if you say you had a father that yells a lot, you know, that can be interpreted by a very immature nervous system as like a real threat. And especially if it's happening over the course of the entire childhood, right? So then that drives up the nervous system, drives up the stress in the body, and then the brain responds and becomes very hyperactive, hypervigilant. You know, we'll either see really high electrical brain patterns, or we'll see a brain that literally turned off. Like some children adapt to trauma by turning down the volume. Like, like, they literally go like this, like, I can't affect change in my environment, so I'm just gonna turn off. And so we'll see these super low, you know, very dissociated, shutdown type of brains. So it's really one direction or the other. But you can't be in the middle balanced when you come from a traumatic childhood.

Kerry:

Mm-hmm. So can you give us any like. Success stories of someone who you've worked with that has had the brain mapping and the, you know, therapy associated with it to help. Mm-hmm.

Cynthia:

Well, one of my favorite, favorite stories is it, it's a, it was a guy in his early twenties and he was not launched at all. He was living at home playing video games, smoking weed. Not a participating member of society. And he came in and I told him, you're gonna have to try to really cut back on the marijuana'cause it's contraindicated. But I had to start him with neurofeedback because he was so dissociated and checked out on life that there was no way he was gonna be able to face his trauma. So we started with nerve anxiety network training. We did executive functioning so that He could function and have clarity and not deliberate on everything, and waffle on everything, you know, so he could have clarity on the goals and the organization, the planning that it takes to achieve the life he wants. So he did heavy neurofeedback on the front, and then we went to the EMDR and you know, it turns out that his mother had a lot of different boyfriends. And they were in and out and the mother was trying to make things work, so she wasn't really available. So he was alone a lot, you know? So he had a lot of like rejection and abandonment in his life, and his nervous system just shut down and checked out, and he, he just didn't wanna participate in the world because he couldn't trust anybody because his primary caregivers were not there for him. So we worked on a lot of the pain and the trauma and, and the loneliness of not being cared for the way he needed. And by the end of our time together, he came up with this idea and, and a plan, which is very much executive functioning. He, he had a plan for, he was gonna buy a bus and he was convert it into a house. And he started working on that project and he wanted to spend a few years just traveling around the country trying to figure out where was his place and what he wanted to do. And he was up out of the house, motivated. his weed was minimal. Minimal if you know, like just maybe on the weekends. And he was literally a different person. He was moving and up and had goals and was gonna become an integrated person in society. And then he circled back around and emailed me about a year later. And just he said he had a girlfriend and, you know, just everything was going well. He had a job and his life was just a lot different than where the trajectory he was on.

Kerry:

Yeah. That's amazing story. A couple questions. So what you mentioned weed is contraindicated. What does that mean?

Cynthia:

It means it's really hard for us to get results if someone's smoking weed every day. It's just one, there's just one of those things we can't train through very easily. So if you're going to do the nerve feedback, you really wanna minimal, minimal amounts, you know, if at all. I mean, it's not good for your brain despite. What all the marketing and the re and the skewed research is saying, it really isn't good for you. So better just not to do it, especially if you already have brain issues and mental health issues. It's not the answer.

Kerry:

Okay. And then I don't know if you really explained EMDR yet, but you said you said

Cynthia:

Not yet.

Kerry:

guys use. Okay. So what is EMDR and how is that different than the talk therapy?

Cynthia:

All right. So EMDR is a lot different because it's an internal process of healing. With talk therapy, you're talking to someone else trying to solve a problem. That's in here. The the problem really with trauma and most people is the relationship with yourself is broken, So if you don't go inside and fix your relationship with yourself, then you're not gonna be able to create external abundance, right? So what EMDR does is it, it makes you go inside and get to know the parts. You know, say your 8-year-old, who had a highly anxious mother and a and a father who abandoned her. Like we meet her and we allow her to go back and reprocess those experiences with your adult self as a loving guide. And, and me too, of course. And we walk through these experiences and we get to really look at how bad it really was. Because what we do is we, we think it's over because we minimize it and we don't think about it anymore, but it isn't over. It's, it's very much stored in your memory network and it's stored in your body. So if you don't get in there and take a look and work with what's in there. You know, you, you can end up with autoimmune disease. You know, there's a, a large amount of research about the link between unresolved trauma in the body and autoimmune disease and, and all disease really. You know, so if you don't do that, you're likely to get sick or you know sick later on, and you're likely to have mental health issues. You know, like anxiety and depression. So we just go back to these targeted experiences and we reprocess them and we change what you believed. So if you believed I'm worthless and will be abandoned when you were a child because your parents weren't available for you, we work with that child to help them to see that now I will be what you need. I am available to you. And the truth is that I have great value. We'll know that when I stop abandoning myself, or my value is not based on the behaviors and opinions of others, right? So we changed the programming to a more adaptive belief that leads you to create the life that you really want and deserve, not the life from this programming that was installed by well-meaning parents who probably weren't that healthy either.

Kerry:

Okay, so I'm sorry. What does EMDR stand for for our listeners?

Cynthia:

Stands for eye movement, desensitization and reprocessing. So your eyes move back and forth. And that mimics the REM phase of sleep, which is where we solve problems. We reconcile memories. It's where we do the most work. So this woman determined if you do that when you're awake, you can get great access to the memory network and then you can really see all that's stored because we don't even know half. We don't know what we don't know. We don't know what's still in there because we're so busy in the world dissociating, disconnecting with all the busy things, right? So we don't always look at what, what we're holding.

Kerry:

Yeah. Okay. So you also said does, it's mostly for past trauma. How about can it be helpful for current or future stressors too?

Cynthia:

Yes, You know, obviously we do a lot of past because that's playing out in the present moment. Like say you had an emotionally unavailable father and you believe i'm not good enough and will be abandoned. Well, chances are you also picked a husband who's not emotionally available, right? So now you're gonna have marital problems, but the marital problems go all the way back to your father, you know? So these dots connect. So we would work on your father, we would work on your marriage. In the future, you can work on, like, say you wanna do a presentation in front of a thousand people and you're nervous about it, we can do EMDR on future. Events that haven't happened yet, and we can process it in advance. So by the time you get there, you already processed the stress, you processed your fears, you process everything. So you can pretty much be assured that you're gonna stay calm and and do the best job. So it's the applications are pretty much, I mean, sometimes people come in in crisis and I'm not gonna go back to your mother and work on that. Right? I mean, so we'll just work on the current crisis. Like I have a client who has rheumatoid arthritis and the diagnosis really shook her, and so we're just working on that. The target is being diagnosed with ra. The belief is i'm not in control, so I'm not safe which is bringing up everything in her life to do with safety. Now she's not in control of her body, you know, and we just process all of the things that she never looked at. And so when you release that from the body. It reduces the stress on the autonomic nervous system, and it just allows your disease to progress better when you don't have all of that pent up energy and stress that you're holding onto. So it's great for people with, you know, who are sick or anything really. You can use it for anything.

Kerry:

Are there any other issues that respond? Best to it.

Cynthia:

I mean, I haven't had anything that doesn't respond because you know, if you're clearing out. It's deeply stored emotions that are over, right, that you don't need to be holding onto. You're freeing up the system to heal. So all disease is gonna respond better if you go back to your original trauma and clear that from the body because it weighs the body down and it uses resources that you could be using for healing.

Kerry:

So how does neurofeedback and EMDR work together for faster or and more lasting change?

Cynthia:

Well, if, if I, if someone came in and I didn't do neurofeedback and say they had like really high levels of anxiety. It would be hard to do EMDR, right? Because you're gonna sit still. You're gonna go within and you have to kind of tune into yourself. So if you have high levels of anxiety, you are trying to tune out as far out as you can up and you're trying to run up into your head. So it's not gonna go very well. So the beauty is we do neurofeedback first and we calm that brain down. And, and you know, even people that are doing talk therapy, if your brain is working better and your anxiety is lower and your, your ability to connect the dots and your executive functioning is working better, well then your therapy's gonna go better because you're gonna be able to. To progress quicker through the process. You know, people that have brain biological blocks are gonna be really slow to change because the brain is kind of in the way. So we kind of get it out of the way so that the, the process goes smoother on the trauma side.

Kerry:

Yeah, that makes sense. What so in your practice, what makes you kind of unique compared to other mental health practices?

Cynthia:

Well, I mean, there are other people doing neurofeedback, but I, there aren't very many that are that have a mental health background. Right. And, and it's really hard to work on the brain without really knowing mental health because they're integrally connected, obviously. So I think it's unique that I have such a strong mental health background and I'm doing neurofeedback because most therapists don't wanna do neurofeedback.'cause it's very technical and scientific. You know, it's almost like I have two. They're very different careers in one. And a lot of neurofeedback people are data-driven scientists and they don't wanna do therapy. So I think the fact that I'm doing them both together and then I can see the whole picture of a person's brain and their biology and their belief system and their psychosomatic or psychosocial history you know, it gives me a better view of everything.'cause I, I get to see the whole picture, not just a part of it.

Kerry:

Yeah, it's pretty cool. It's like a like a nerdy approach to the mental health with like the component right.

Cynthia:

it is. Well,'cause when I was in school, I, I was like, there's no way I'm gonna be a talk therapist working for an agency with no resources, make no money and make no real difference because, you know, people are just talking like you could talk to someone for 10 years and maybe nothing changes. You know, like the change doesn't happen through talking. It happens through feeling. And, you know, we have, we have defense mechanisms, so if we don't wanna feel, we're not gonna feel like you could spend a year waiting for somebody to open up to you. Whereas EMDR like bypasses that, like, it goes straight to the, to the bull, to the, you know, the target. And so I wanted to do something that that really worked and I wanted to do something that was measurable. Like I didn't wanna have to hear, you know, how are you doing? Oh, I think I'm better. You know?'cause you nobody knows if they're better in mental health. Like they think they're better and then you might be better now, and then next month you might not be better. You know? So I wanted something that was measurable and. It all just kind of beautifully unfolded that neurofeedback is data, all about the data. So I'm watching the brain maps changing over time and I can show people, look your brain, look how much different your brain is now. Which which is really good for them to see. Um, and then on the EMDR we're also measuring distress. So when we start a target, we say, how disturbing is that on a scale of zero to 10, and it's gonna be an 8, 9, 10, by the time we're done, we're measuring the, the units of distress. And it's down to like, some people are even laughing about it by the time we're done that like, I can't even believe I believed that.

Kerry:

So how quickly do they notice these kind of results?

Cynthia:

Well, it depends on what we're talking about. On, on the EMDR, usually after just a couple of sessions, you're gonna notice a lightness. That's what they, everybody says like, I feel lighter, and it's because trauma stored in the body is heavy. And so when it moves out, you feel, ugh, like you can breathe a little lighter. So that happens pretty quickly. And then neurofeedback I would say between session five and 10, most people are starting to notice the changes. And then it takes a little while for it to become consistent because ob, you know, it's non-invasive. So we have to wait for the brain to learn. These new brain parent, you know, we're rewiring it. So it takes a little while, but they start to notice between five and 10.

Kerry:

Can, can you do it in kids if the, you know, frontal

Cynthia:

Oh, that's the best time to do it. You know, get the brain functioning better so that they don't have a lot of beliefs, like, I'm gonna be rejected, I'm not good enough. You know, get them functioning better and then you're saving them a lot of trauma. Because if a, if a child has ADHD or autism or is different because they're highly anxious. Now they're gonna end up with trauma because you know they're gonna, they're not gonna be adapting with their peers as well. So there, if you can get them early, you know, then you can really prevent a lot of future trauma for them.

Kerry:

That's great. Yeah. What are, are there any long-term consequences of not kind of addressing issues? You know, the root issues that ever

Cynthia:

Not one bit. Well, you know, you could be a little tired as your brain is changing that, you know, that's about the most side effect we hear.

Kerry:

Side effect? Okay. Yeah.

Cynthia:

Oh, you said consequences. I thought you meant like.

Kerry:

Of not like addressing somebody's issues, but Yeah. Negative you know, adverse effects or something is very important too. So there's not really any adverse effects in the other than like, fatigue. Okay. But are there

Cynthia:

I won't do, if you, if I threw you in, if I threw you into trauma therapy and you were not stabilized and you had no resources to do it, you know, that would be terribly unethical. Right. But obviously, you know, I'm not doing that. I set people up for success so when they get started, they feel successful and, and excited and like we do it on a nice tempo that the client is in agreement with and feels comfortable with. You know, the client is in control of, of you know where they go and when they're ready to do things. So I think if you're following your inner guidance and intuition about what's right for you, I don't think you can ever lose.

Kerry:

Okay. you mentioned that you've been doing this for 15 years, right? What is the future of like neurofeedback and EMDR.

Cynthia:

well, I mean, I would love to see it become mainstream, but unfortunately with our current insurance and medical system, it's highly unlikely because it gets to the core problem. It gets to the root cause. And if you look at most of medical and mental health, it's, it's more symptoms and it's more let's focus on, you know, the surface. You know, let's not fix the origin of things. We're seeing more and more modalities going toward origin, but they're not covered by insurance because if it's not drugs or surgery. You know, or traditional talk therapy, then you don't get covered. So I don't think there's a huge drive in the insurance and medical community to to go work on things that actually fix the cause.

Kerry:

So this is not covered by insurance, is what you're

Cynthia:

Sometimes, but no, they tried to get a CPT code for it. But there's a lot of discord in our field and there's all neurofeedback is not the same. So they're in, there's a lot of infighting unfortunately, in the field and it's not unified. And one practitioner to the next could be totally different. So you never know what you're gonna get. So the field doesn't always have a lot of credibility, unfortunately. You have to really. Make sure you're going to someone who's, you know, got the credentials and experience and you know you have to do your homework. So, because of that lack of uniformity, the insurance companies are not, you know, they're not buying, they're not doing, we have to get it together before they're gonna ever give us a chance to have a code. But it, they were close to getting it. It fell apart because of two big egos started fighting and threw each other under the bus, and then the whole thing just fell apart.

Kerry:

Lovely. Yeah, we definitely have issues with the medical system, but hopefully they can, you know, do whatever needs to be done to help get that covered so all patients can access it. Yeah. What,

Cynthia:

can, EMDR can get covered under counseling, right? If you get covered for counseling. But a lot of insurance companies don't even cover for counseling. And then the neurofeedback can get covered. It just really depends on the insurance company. It gets billed as biofeedback.'Cause it is a biofeedback. It's, it's EEG, biofeedback, so, you know, if biofeedback gets covered then it, you know, there's a chance. But it's definitely not, it's, it's more rare that it gets covered.

Kerry:

Hmm, that's definitely too bad. What practical tips can listeners start kind of use today to begin that inward connection that you've been talking about?

Cynthia:

Well, I mean, just anything that brings you into the body. You know, I love writing as a way of connecting with yourself, you know, so if you have a bad day, write it all out to exhaustion. Just get it out of you just so you're not holding, and then read it over and understand that you can give yourself some advice and some help, and you can show up for yourself because most of us are so disconnected from ourselves and so dissociated and running into the world and our phones and our jobs, and our kids, and we don't even know how we feel on any given day, and we're completely abandoning ourselves. So step one is to stop running away from yourself and check in like, how am I feeling right now? What do I need? And to start to show up for yourself and, and, you know, get more grounded in the body. I mean, that would definitely be a first step.

Kerry:

I like that. I think sometimes I use that idea as like a thought dump, like getting it all out on paper. So I mean, it helps people with sleeping. Issues and things like that too, which obviously stems from anxiety and other things. So I think that's kind of similar. That's a really good recommendation for

Cynthia:

Yeah.

Kerry:

Yeah. Is there anything else that you'd like to share before I ask where people can find you?

Cynthia:

I don't think so.

Kerry:

Okay. So where can they find you? How can they work with you?

Cynthia:

My website is reboot live better.com. And you can learn all about what we do. There's a page with some research on it. There's a results page. If you wanted to set up a 15 minute consultation, that's free just to like, see if it, if it's something that would be compatible with you and just reach out and we'll connect and see if it works for you.

Kerry:

And you are in the area obviously, so, and this is something that is done in person. Obviously if you need to be connected to electrodes and.

Cynthia:

Yeah, yeah. We're right near International Plaza in Corporate Center one. Those big corporate buildings there in South Tampa. But yeah, just reach out and we'll get the conversation started and see how we can help.

Kerry:

Awesome. Well, thank you so much for being on the podcast today and teaching me all and all the listeners about all of these things. This is super cool. I hope that, you know, it gets, I guess, I don't know, covered and figured out so

Cynthia:

Yeah.

Kerry:

so more people

Cynthia:

for the kids. Like I would be so excited if, if the kids could have it covered, right? Because it would change their lives if, if, if they can get that advantage, you know?

Kerry:

Yeah. Well keep advocacy, advocacy work, right?

Cynthia:

I'm working on it.

Kerry:

Yeah. All right. Thank you so much. Thank you for being on the podcast and everybody, let's tune in next week for next week's episode.

Cynthia:

All right. Thanks a lot. Have a great day.

Kerry:

you too.

Cynthia:

Bye-Bye.

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Dr. Kerry Reller

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