Understanding Freeze— The “Wired-But-Tired” State (Part 3)

"Freeze" is arguably the most confusing, nuanced, and self-blame-inducing state for people to understand. We often mistake it for laziness, depression, or some character flaw — it’s not.  It's a protective state that your nervous system creates when it's had too much for too long and doesn't know what to do next. This episode takes a compassionate deep dive into this common but misunderstood experience. We untangle what's happening when your body's gas and brake pedals are pressed at the same time and offer gentle, practical ways to find movement again when you feel trapped.

*This episode serves as Part 3 in our "Different States Series"

In this episode, you’ll learn:

• The key differences between freeze, activation (anxiety), and shutdown (depression).
• Why you get stuck in freeze, from current overwhelm to past experiences of powerlessness.
• How conflicting internal "parts" can create the gridlock that keeps you feeling paralyzed.
• A toolkit of "micro-mobilization" strategies designed to gently thaw the freeze response without causing more stress.
• Why gentleness, not force, is the most effective approach to healing a stuck system.

3 Takeaways:

1. Freeze is protection, not procrastination.
2. Start micro, stay gentle.
3. The deeper work: Address the internal conflict, not just the symptoms. 

Categories of Tools for Freeze mentioned in this episode:

• Small-Movement: Sway gently side-to-side, rock back and forth, walk slowly barefoot, gently shake out your hands, stand up and stretch.
• Gentle Breath & Sound: Notice your natural breath with slightly longer exhales (don't force deep breathing), make soft humming sounds or audible sighs, listen to rhythmic, lo-fi music. Whisper comforting phrases to yourself like "I'm here," or "I'm safe," or "It's okay to move slowly."
• Orienting & Vision Resets: Slowly scan the room and name 5 neutral things, gently turn your head from side to side, let your eyes rest on something calm like a plant or a photo.
• Sensory Grounding & Pressure: Wrap yourself in a blanket, place your hands on your chest and belly, press your feet into the floor, head containment practice, sip some water, feel a soft texture, put on socks.
• Gentle Action & Connection (1% or Micro): Put one cup in the sink, text one person back, sit outside for three minutes, pet an animal. Remember: small = safe = enough.
• Parts Work: Get curious about which parts are in conflict (e.g., the part that's exhausted vs. the part that's scared of being lazy). Acknowledge both parts and offer them compassion, reassuring them that it's safe to move slowly now.

—

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Transcript

0:00  
Welcome back to this episode in our series and anxiety, detailing the nervous system states and how to best support yourself healing journey in them. I'm your host, and today we're talking to I'll be sharing my steps, my missteps, and I think that the free stage to help using healing system and self inducing state for people to understand. Thanks for being here. 

0:24  
We often mistake it for laziness, depression, some kind of lack of motivation or willpower as a character flaw. And I cannot emphasize enough right from the beginning that it is not. It is a protective state that your nervous system creates when it has had too much for too long, and it doesn't know what to do next, or when something is or feels familiar to a time in your past when inaction was safer than action, when the fight or flight response is not a viable option, We usually freeze. And my hope with this episode is to take a compassionate, deep dive into this really common, but I think, often missed or misunderstood nervous system experience. 

1:13  
And let me start by helping you get a better snapshot of the Freeze State so you can really quickly identify does this feel familiar to me? Have you ever felt this like wired but tired feeling where you're exhausted but you can't rest? Your mind is racing, but your body feels stuck. You have a million things to do, but you cannot seem to make yourself do any of them, and instead, maybe you find yourself scrolling, mindlessly, sitting on the couch knowing that you should be doing something, but feeling absolutely unable to do it, to get up, to move, to get started. It is often experienced as this really frustrating mental loop of, I have to, but I can't, I have to, but I can't, I have to, but I can't. That falls into the Freeze State. And if that sounds familiar, I want you to know that you are not alone. This is becoming a more frequently identified default state for so many of our clients, and hopefully it becomes more and more clear in this episode as to why so freeze is what happens when your nervous system it gets caught between activation and shutdown. It's what we call a mixed state. So there are elements of activation and elements of shutdown. You can think about the Freeze State. It's like having your foot on the gas and the brake pedal at the exact same time. Now, I've never tried this in my car. I don't know what would actually happen? I do not advise you to do an experiment, but I can imagine that it is not good, and it's probably not good for the car, for the mechanics of it, it is equally frustrating and agitating to our internal systems as well. 

2:57  
So in this freeze state, your system wants to move. There's energy there, but it also feels trapped, stuck, overwhelmed. So today, we're going to unpack in more detail what freeze actually is why it happens, and how you might be able to support yourself when you find yourself in that state. So we're like we did last week. We're going to look at this through both a nervous system lens as well as a ifs or parts work perspective, because that is where the breakthrough happens for so many of the clients we work with, is understanding the different parts of you that might be contributing to freeze. 

3:36  
So diving in, let's start with what freeze actually is from a more nervous system perspective. So like I said, freeze is what we call a mixed state in your nervous system. So it is when you're experiencing a blend of sympathetic activation that is mobilization, that fight or flight energy and dorsal vagal shutdown. So this is where we experience complete immobilization or collapse. It's like your body is simultaneously saying I need to do something and I can't do anything. It's often a result of too much for too long, I don't know what to do, right? We're paralyzed here, there's this urgency, but we're paralyzed, gas pedal, brake pedal, same time, you might experience this as restlessness in your body, but maybe feeling emotionally numb or anxious thoughts, but having just a heavy, heavy limbs, feeling like you're the couch is just eating you. You feel urgent and unable. So physiologically in your body, some common things that we see in this freeze state is you might notice that there is some restricted breath. Maybe you're holding your breath here, you might have tense muscles, so there's that activation in your muscles, but they're. Frozen. They're stuck. You have an elevated heart rate, and yet this overall feeling of exhaustion. So a lot of contradiction here. Same thing psychologically, we often explain or describe this as overthinking and under functioning. So your mind is spinning, but action feels impossible, and because I think it can be helpful to minimize shame, increase understanding, is when we can take these nervous system states and put them into an animal context in the wild. 

5:32  
I want you to think about a squirrel for a moment. So this is a squirrel that's just going about their business, collecting nuts, gathering leaves, I don't know, whatever squirrels do, and it looks up and it sees a dog, and then we watch the squirrel just freeze. And I go on a morning daily walk, and I see this happen multiple times every single day. Sometimes the squirrel looks up, sees us get too close, or the dog get too close and it runs. But a lot of times, the squirrel looks up and it just freezes. It's almost like the squirrel isn't sure if the dog has seen them yet what the dog is going to do. But it's not a relaxed stillness. The squirrel's not playing dead like a possum might. It is physically still, but I can imagine that if we were able to open up their skull and hear the thoughts It might sound like, do I keep collecting nuts? Is he gonna eat me? Will he just walk away? Am I gonna be able to get away if he does decide to chase me? I'm afraid that if I move, it'll provoke him to chase me. Right? It's this, like, overwhelming spiraling thoughts inside, I'm just going to freeze. And a lot of times that freeze is advantageous, because in the wild running, could potentially provoke an attack from an animal that maybe was just curiously looking your way, and could walk on. 

7:00  
So we can see in this everyday experience that I witness external immobility with internal activation, racing thoughts. So when this pattern of overthinking and under functioning becomes chronic for us, what As humans, we often experience is also a really harsh inner critic. Why can't I just get it together? What's wrong with me? Why is it so hard for me to just do the dishes? I remember at one point in my journey with anxiety and depression and all of this, I had responded to, like, two emails, done two dishes. And then I found myself just like in my room, sitting on my bed, scrolling, I don't even know what I was doing, and I remember sitting there thinking, like, why can't I just be a responsible adult? What is wrong with me? Just go reply to all your emails. Like, just sit long enough to get it done. Just do all of the dishes so that it's done, and instead, what I often found myself doing was either task jumping or just being so overwhelmed, I avoided tasks altogether. And then that shame adds another layer of stress and pressure to an already overwhelmed nervous system, and so my hope is that our conversation today can help settle some of that shame. 

8:23  
Now, because freeze is a mixed state, I want to spend a few minutes briefly distinguishing freeze from the maybe purely activation versus purely shutdown state, just so that we're walking away from this episode really fully contextualized around what freeze is what it isn't, so that hopefully you can identify when you're here with a little bit more accuracy, so that you can then know how to support yourself better here. So let's talk about freeze versus activation. In pure activation, there is clear mobilized energy. You feel like you need to move, and movement generally feels good or helpful, whether that is fight, which is movement towards the stressor or flight, movement away from the stressor, versus in freeze, you feel like you need to move, but movement feels impossible or overwhelming. So the energy is there, but it's trapped, and then we have freeze versus shutdown. So shut down that red zone state. This is a collapse. There is immobilization, there is disconnection, mentally and physically. There is no energy or urgency. So if shutdown, if the shutdown state, were to have a voice, it would say, I can't do it. I don't care. It doesn't even matter. Versus freeze, where you might still feel like you can't do something, but you do care. It does matter. You still have that energetic charge that. Tells you that you should be able to. 

10:01  
and something that I want to call out here not that one is right or wrong necessarily, because a lot of this is still theoretical, and probably will be for the foreseeable future. A little bit tricky in research to prove all of these nuances, but something that's really common that I have heard other practitioners in the somatic and nervous system space do is that they use the Free State and the shutdown state interchangeably. I do not. I do not, and I want to tell you why more and more of our clients are having it become really clear to them that what they are experiencing is this middle experience between activation and shutdown, and they, for a long time, have tried to fit themselves into the box of anxiety and activation, or they've tried to fit themselves into this box of well, then it must be depression and shut down. But neither shoe fits really well, and where I think a lot of the shame can drain out is that understanding that this like urgent but stuck makes sense in a world that is overwhelmingly fast paced, over stimulating, over conflict, driven under connected, that creates sensory inputs to the degree that we were never meant to consume them. That puts us into this place of contradiction, if I have to, but I can't. And so again, this state of freeze is pesky and nuanced and very, very real, and in my opinion, very, very different from a truly red zone shutdown state, and we're going to talk more about that next week. So hopefully, in contrast of this episode and next week's episode, that becomes really clear. 

11:57  
Now, let's talk about why, why we or why some people get stuck in this chronic state of freeze, and what we see pretty often is that it is a natural result of unresolved activation or overwhelming circumstances where fight and flight wasn't Safe or possible, and that there is usually a mix of current and past contributors. So it could be current overwhelm. There's too many responsibilities, decisions, chronic stressors, they've maxed out your system. So this can happen when you are operating beyond your capacity for too long. Freeze is a likely result. It might be that there are currently conflicting demands. Right? Contradiction is at the heart of freeze. You might be torn between priorities, like I need to rest, but I feel guilty for it. You might have to set a boundary with somebody that you love. Choose between what you want versus what others expect of you. We can get stuck in this paralyzed state when there is a lot of contradiction or conflicting demands on our internal and external systems. It could also be due to past powerlessness. 

13:11  
So if you are somebody who experienced situations in the past where you needed to act but you couldn't, maybe it was childhood trauma abuse, a situation where your voice wasn't heard, your nervous system might have learned to go into freeze because action felt or wasn't safe or effective. Right? Think about it. When we are a child, oftentimes we can't run from our caretakers because we need them to stay alive, and we can't fight them because they are bigger, stronger, more dominant than we are. And so if you have experienced situations in your past, whether as a child or more recent past, where there was a sense of powerlessness, your system might be trained or developed in or hypersensitive to, oh, well, action isn't safe, therefore it defaults to freeze. 

14:11  
And then, from a parts work perspective, freeze often reflects inner conflict. So because of past lived experiences that you've had because of the messages that you've received from your family systems or from society. We often have conflicting parts in us, a part that wants to rest, versus a part that fears judgment, a part that wants to speak up, versus one that fears rejection or learned that speaking up wasn't wasn't heard. What was the point, or it wasn't safe inside, you might have a perfectionist part that is setting impossible standards, that causes another part of you to shut down, or a part of you that keeps trying to please everyone else, and another part of you that is exhausted from trying for so long, or one that hits. Really close to home. For me, is a part that learned early that being too much, too loud, too emotional, too needy, resulted in rejection or punishment or abandonment, and so when I start to feel activated, there is a part that steps in to immobilize me, believing that it's keeping me safe from being too much. It's keeping me safe from being rejected or punished or abandoned, and the freeze response often develops in childhood again, when there are situations that feel threatening, but we can't fight because we're too small. We can't flee because we depend on that other person. So we learn to freeze. We become very still, very quiet, very small, very self, abandoning for the sake of survival. And that wiring can remain the default into adulthood, or that wiring, we can see it just re emerge under stress in adulthood as the default. And I think understanding this can bring so much so so much compassion to your experience. Freeze is not something you're doing wrong, it is something that your system learned to do to keep you safe. 

16:21  
So we've talked a lot about what freeze is, how it happens, why we get stuck in these patterns of, you know, overthinking, under functioning, feeling stuck. Now let's talk about some different tools or practices for working with Freeze different tools or practices that work with the common patterns we see in both the physiology and the psychology that accompany this state. And what I need you to know upfront is that what doesn't work is trying to force yourself into action, adding more pressure, adding more stimulation. What helps in freeze is creating more safety, safety inside outside, relationally, right? Because we enter freeze when we don't have enough resources or cues of safety to think that action is possible. So when we find ourselves here, what we actually need to do is to help our system remember that it has choices to help our system feel like it's safe enough to move. Because the way out, if you think about this nervous system ladder we've talked about so often here on the podcast, at the top is green, then that yellow activation zone, then the red zone of shutdown. If we want to get up to green, if we want to move ourself up that nervous system ladder, right now, we're in the middle. We're in the middle of yellow and red, that orange zone, we have to move through a more mobilized, activated state to get to regulation. 

17:57  
And so what can we do to convince our system that it's safe enough to move that doing the dishes won't entirely be too overwhelming, because freeze, what freeze is trying to do is it's trying to protect us from falling completely into that collapsed state of shutdown. So it's trying to make our world have less be less so that we aren't overwhelmed to the point of shutdown, because right now, we're just overwhelmed to the point of freeze. So in working with this state, we want to remind ourselves that we have choices, because again, freeze is often a result of feeling a lack of choice, especially in childhood, and that it's safe enough to move at least a little. And before I get into the specific tools and practices that help here, I want to remind you that freeze is a deeply, deeply personalized and nuanced experience. So what I am going to share are five generalized categories of things that can be helpful in freeze, but part of the work, part of the work that we support our clients in every single day, is discovering what the unique best fits are for your system in this state. 

19:05  
So the first category I'll mention is small mobilization, and I'm going to put the best I can a list of these categories and some of the suggested practices in the show notes for you to be able to come back to and reference. So category number one, small mobilization. And the word small is really important here, because when you're in freeze, big movements, dramatic change can feel overwhelming and deepen that free state. So instead, small movements to break up the immobilization that we find here. So a somatic practice, like swaying side to side, slowly pacing. Maybe you want to shake out your hands. Just think anything that gets you off the couch, maybe not quite to doing the task you need to do yet. But can I sit on the couch and just sway side to side? Can I get up and I slowly walk? Can I shake out my hands and. Get into movement in as small and safe a way as possible, because that sends a gentle cue to your nervous system, to your mind, that we're not trapped. We're not trapped, and we we can move. 

20:12  
The second category I want to talk about is containment and pressure. So when we are in freeze, we often feel like we are scattered or fragmented, and so creating a sense of containment can be incredibly helpful. You might do this by wrapping yourself up in a blanket. You can place your hands on your chest, press your feet into the floor, really trying to take note of that pressure and that somatic and proprioceptive feed back into your system. You might wrap your arms around you for a self hug. So just creating again this sense of containment we are here, it is safe to be here with containment or pressure practices, one specific one that I know resonates a lot with clients, because there is often such a spiraling thought component to freeze is what I call head containment. So it's where you take one hand and put it across your forehead. Maybe you want to try this now, and you take your other hand and cup the back of your skull. So you're just kind of holding your head here, noticing temperature of your hands and pressure. And what is often experienced here is a sense of settling the thoughts gently slow we are containing the place in which our thoughts feel a little out of control. 

21:29  
The third is orienting to safety. So when we are in freeze, our nervous system often feels like there's danger everywhere, even if there isn't. And so orienting practices using your senses. But the one I'm going to offer is a visual orienting practice today. It can help remind your brain that you are actually safe here in this place, here in this moment. So what this might look like is slowly scanning the space around you and just naming five neutral things that you can see. I see a blue cup, I see a white wall, I see a brown table. What this can do is it can help your system register that there's no immediate threat, and like we talked about last week, it's also physiologically shifting how your eyes, how your visual system is operating in a way that cues your parasympathetic nervous system state to come online a little bit more so visual orienting you could also do, what can I hear? What can I see, what can I smell? What can I feel? Bringing in some sensory components, because that's always going to bring you to the here and now, where you are likely more safe than your system, thanks. 

22:45  
The fourth category of kind of tools or practices that you can try is pairing sound and breath. So in this free state, you might want to try humming softly, an audible sigh, something like maybe even just whispering comforting phrases, like, I'm here, we're okay. We can do this. Maybe you use gentle music. Most of these things will also stimulate your vagus nerve, which can help facilitate regulation of your nervous system. And it also responds beautifully, your vagus nerve to certain sounds that we make, breathing patterns so sound and breath, sound and breath here because they don't demand a lot from you. I'm not saying get up and go for a 30 minute walk, humming, whispering, singing, singing, sighing, can shift our physiology. 

23:43  
And then the fifth and final category I want to talk about here is the 1% think. Go micro, really, really micro. And I usually say, hey, what's the 1% many of our clients, after working with me for a long time or being in the membership for a while, will share that they that's what they hear in their voice. A lot is like, what's the 1% What's the 1% here? So when we're in freeze the tiniest tasks, count, put one cup away, text, one person back, stand up and stretch. The goal is to remind your system again, that you have choice, that you have agency. The goal is not productivity right now, I know it feels like it should be, because you have that internal urgency, but for right now, it's just about proving to your nervous system that you are not actually trapped. You are not actually powerless. And reminder, I'm going to put a reference list of some of these tools and practices in the show notes so that you can have a quick snapshot and begin to explore and practice and think about which ones might be the best fit for you. And I want to spend the next few minutes now talking about how you might work with Freeze through a parts work lens. So when you're in freeze, try to get curious, either in the moment or potentially retroactively. You. In a coaching session, in therapy, in your journal, can you ask yourself, which parts in that situation were in conflict? Can you acknowledge both parts and find maybe a small step forward that honors each of them, the perfectionist part and the really tired part, you might say to both parts, I see you. I see both of you. I see how both of you are trying to take care of me. What if there was a middle ground? What could that look like? You could look at both of these parts and also acknowledge it makes sense that you're both here, given our past lived experience or current life circumstances, can we slow down and see what feels true for both of you, what feels possible for both of you, again, often there's a part that learned to freeze to avoid punishment or rejection, and so you might turn to that part and lovingly say that was such a smart way to stay safe back then. Truly, thank you for keeping us safe, for helping us to avoid punishment and rejection, and right now is different. Right now it is safe to move slowly. And what if we just together see what happens this time when working through freeze in a parts work lens, the key is not trying to override or push through the freeze, but to get curious about what your different parts need. 

26:21  
Now, one final part of this conversation that I want to have around freeze is about the deeper work, the proactive work, or the lifestyle changes that are necessary or that can help prevent chronic freeze. These are also things that can build your capacity to move through these stuck states more easily. And in presenting this, I'm again going to share five things or themes to consider as part of this deeper work, things that have supported many of our clients, and moving from freeze as a default state to a place that they visit, sometimes they recognize quickly and they know how to support themselves when they find themselves there. 

27:00  
The first thing I'll talk about is addressing overwhelm, being honest about where there is an imbalance between load and capacity. So again, freezes your body saying this is too much. Oftentimes, what we have to do is take a really honest look at our daily life. Are we trying to do too much? Are there chronic stressors that are keeping your system on edge. Sometimes the most radical and most impactful thing that we can do when we find ourselves stuck in a baseline of a free state is to reduce our load where and when possible, not just to add more tools or strategies for managing or navigating the freeze response, but what can we do so that there is less too muchness on our system. This might mean saying no to things. This might mean saying no to things that you actually really want to be part of your life, but just don't have the space or capacity for right now. What are those things for you? This could look like asking for help, restructuring parts of your life to be more sustainable for your nervous system. 

27:59  
The second thing is to build tolerance for conflict and uncertainty. And this is a deep skill. This is a skill that oftentimes is best worked on, or a capacity that's created through therapeutic interventions, through therapy, through coaching. Freeze often happens when we are caught between these competing demands, or when we are facing uncertainty. And so a long term strategy for not being in a free state, so often for getting out of it more quickly, is to build up your tolerance for these uncomfortable emotions, the possibility of rejection, the possibility of being misunderstood, the self trust necessary to face uncertainty more confidently and less from a paralyzed place. And so what does it look like to practice staying present with discomfort? What are your current beliefs around some of that discomfort? Can you begin to set small boundaries, these little baby steps build resilience and help you face future challenges without freezing. 

29:04  
The third part of deeper work is that parts work this internal negotiation. It often involves getting to know your parts better and then helping them to work together instead of against each other. So the more formal label for parts work is internal family systems. We can think about our psyche, each and every one of us, we have this internal system, these different parts within us who oftentimes developed different strategies for being safe, getting our needs met. They have different priorities. How can we within ourselves recognize the positive intent of these different parts and to create an inner system that can collaborate more easily. And again, this might look like therapy coaching or even just regular check ins with yourself about what your different parts need. So learning to you. To facilitate negotiations, presence, open communication, without letting these different parts of yourself get stuck in really rigid states of conflict. 

30:11  
A fourth category of deeper work for freeze is to build nervous system capacity so engaging regularly in regulation practices that just poke holes in your stress bucket. This could be gentle movement, nature, safe connection, play. If your life is void, if it is too busy for you to take care of your physical body, if your life is too busy to step outside in nature, if your life is too busy to get coffee with a friend or to do something playful or creative, then your life is too busy and your freeze makes sense. Those things are biological imperatives for our nervous system to feel safe enough to operate from a more regulated place, also when we do movement, especially when we do challenging movement, this can increase your baseline capacity to handle stress, taking care of yourself, safe connection, all of those things improve your vagal tone. We know that higher vagal tone or higher heart rate variability means that we're more resilient to stress. We can bounce back from it more quickly. And so what are just from a physiological and social standpoint, what are the things that we need to do to create conditions where regulation is more possible. What are those foundations so that when stress hits, you have more resources to draw from? 

31:29  
And then the fifth category of deeper work I'll mention here is specifically addressing perfectionism and control patterns. These are things that we see so often show up in freeze. Perfectionism can be paralyzing. Oftentimes we have patterns of like wanting to control, needing to control, because there were so many times in our past where we didn't feel in control. So freeze is often fueled by this need to get it right, and when we can work with these patterns, and we can create some more flexibility here. It gives us more gentle forward momentum. 

32:08  
All right, as we wrap up, please, please, please, remember, remember, remember, freeze isn't failure. It is feedback. Your body is asking for less pressure, more safety, more space to figure things out and move at a different pace. When you are in freeze, you are not lazy, you are not broken. Your nervous system is doing exactly what it learned to do to keep you safe in overwhelming situations. And the path out of freeze is not through force or pressure, it is oftentimes through gentleness, micro movements, 1% things that show your system that you have choice. And this all gets wrapped up in our three takeaways from today. 

32:53  
Number one, freezes, protection. It's not just procrastination when you feel this wired but tired when you are stuck between this place of I have to and I can't your nervous system is trying to keep you safe from overwhelm, and instead of fighting it, can you get curious about what it is trying to tell you, or what is contributing to that sense of stuckness? 

33:15  
Number two is to start micro and to stay gentle, tiny actions send really, really powerful cues to your system that it is safe enough to start moving, and then that start moving can build momentum to get us into motion, get the things that we need to done, check the things off our to do list, all of that Has this ripple effect in our lives. 

33:42  
And number three, address the deeper conflict, or the deeper patterns, not just the symptoms. So freeze is often this tug of war between your parts. It is often the reality of a life load that is too heavy. What does it look like to honor the parts, hear them out, do this honest assessment of your life, and make some hard decisions on where you can cut so that there is less load. 

34:12  
And there's no perfect way to work with Freeze, like all of these episodes, I wish I could hand you the specific tools or the seven steps to getting out of freeze, but the tools and the things that I've offered in this episode are invitations to experiment with what feels supportive for your unique nervous system. And the goal is not to never experience freeze again. It is instead to develop more flexibility and to have these gentle tools to support you when life inevitably feels a little bit sticky, a little bit too heavy, and next week, just a reminder. We are diving into the shutdown state, and until then, I am sending so much hope and healing your way. 

34:55  
Thanks for listening to another episode of the regular. Update and rewire podcast. If you enjoyed what you heard today, please subscribe and leave a five star review to help us get these powerful tools out to even more people who need them. And if you yourself are looking for more personalized support and applying what you've learned today, consider joining me inside rise my monthly mental health membership and nervous system healing space, or apply for our one on one anxiety and depression coaching program, restore. I've shared a link for more information to both in the show notes. Again, thanks so much for being here, and I'll see you next time you.

Transcribed by https://otter.ai