Don't Forget Your Tickets
Don' Forget Your Tickets is a podcast devoted to the unsung heroes of the spectator sports and events industries, the Ticketing Managers. We explore who they are, their well-guarded industry secrets, and how they entered the field. Beyond that, we delve into a broader ticketing realm, inviting experts from various fields to share their insights and stories. Our primary aim is to add value and highlight deserving individuals.
(The podcast was originally named TicketingPodcast.com)
Don't Forget Your Tickets
From Local Fans to Global Engagement: Exploring Football’s Digital Future with Curt Baker from FotMob
Fan engagement for modern football clubs has evolved beyond simply connecting with local supporters—it’s now about reaching and resonating with a global fan base. In this episode of Don’t Forget Your Tickets, we’re joined by Curt Baker, Product Lead at FotMob, to explore how innovative digital tools are redefining the matchday experience for fans everywhere. With over 17 million monthly users, FotMob delivers live scores, personalised updates, and insights from over 500 football leagues worldwide.
Curt shares how football stats apps can enhance stadium engagement, unlock new revenue streams, and even transform into marketplaces for tickets and merchandise. From the challenges of catering to diverse fan behaviors across different cultures to creating targeted campaigns that fans actually appreciate, this episode is packed with practical insights for clubs, marketers, and football enthusiasts alike.
Whether you’re looking to stay ahead of the curve in fan engagement or simply curious about the future of football innovation, don’t miss this 30-minute conversation full of fresh ideas and expert perspectives.
Don't Forget Your Tickets is powered by TicketCo and hosted by TicketCo’s CEO, Carl-Erik Michalsen Moberg. The podcast was originally named TicketingPodcast.com
Thank you and unlocking new revenue streams. We're also exploring how FootballStats apps could become a market page for ticketing. Today, they have 17 million users. Why don't tap into that market? Don't miss this insightful 30-minute discussion. Hello and welcome to Don't Forget your Tickets, a podcast where experts within ticketing and fan engagement share their stories and insights. In today's episode, we will be discussing fan engagement with Kurt Baker. He is product lead at FUTMOB. This is a matchday app where football fans get live scores, fixtures, tables, match stats and personalized news from over 500 football leagues around the world yeah, 500. That's quite a lot, and imagine how many clubs we're talking about. So it's great to have you on the show here, kurt. Yeah, it's great to be here. So we're obviously going to talk more about Footmob, right? A super exciting company, kurt. But first let's get to know you, because you don't have a Norwegian English accent, do you?
Speaker 2:No, so I live here in Bergen. I'm originally from the US, my wife is Norwegian and we had decided to try it out, and seven years later, we're still here. My background is with design agencies and working on brand and design strategy and, most importantly, I'm a season ticket holder for the local club, both men's and women's teams of Escobron.
Speaker 1:It's very, very good You've chosen the right team, for sure. Just before we crack on, you're now product lead in a tech company. Did you work in tech before?
Speaker 2:Yeah, so, as I mentioned, I worked at a design firm and you know we worked on a number of different types of design projects that cross both physical and digital, and I worked with one designer who was also into football or soccer as I called it at the time and we kind of started a side project where we really wanted to make following football simpler, starting with the 2014 World Cup.
Speaker 2:And that was kind of back when the internet was a little bit different and side projects would go viral and we created this kind of really simple tool for following the World Cup that suddenly had half a million people looking at it and sharing it on Twitter and that kind of evolved into a consultancy where we worked on other football projects and businesses. So then when I originally reached out to FopMob, it was an easy intro, having created football products myself. Yeah, we ended up making the move here, and when I joined, I think I was employee six or seven. So I was the first non-developer here and I began as a potato as they say in Norway can do a little bit of everything flexible and then, as we've grown, I've focused more on the product side of things.
Speaker 1:Amazing. So I mean you started quite a long time ago. Can you tell us a little bit about how it all started and about your first years? You mentioned the potato. I agree. I understand that's needed. We did the same here in our company. So how did it evolve and how did the company evolve with you?
Speaker 2:Yeah, so the company itself started in 2004 when one of the founders was on his honeymoon in Thailand and he wanted to follow Braun while he was abroad. So he came back and got his brother on board and they created the first version of FlopMob, which existed pre-app stores and you could subscribe to it via SMS, and then it was one of the first 20 apps on the Google Play Store. So we have a relatively long history. When I joined seven years ago, like I said, I was the first non-developer. We also worked with the designer and the app kind of had the same functionality, the same mission that it has today, where you could follow football matches from around the world.
Speaker 2:But obviously the capabilities of it have just grown and grown and grown since then, you know. So now you can follow over 500 different leagues, 1000s upon 1000s of teams. We've grown from a couple million users to over 17 million users monthly now. But we're still small. We're still independent. You know there's 30 of us here and a couple people in the UK, so we like to think of ourselves as small but mighty.
Speaker 1:Small but mighty. That's a nice statement for sure, but I mean, as you mentioned, you act globally right, which means you're all over the world. What's your biggest?
Speaker 2:market. So our biggest market is the US, closely followed, closely followed by the UK and Germany. Those are our top three, but then, if you look at our top 10, they also include a lot of emerging markets like Thailand, nigeria, indonesia. So you know, as you said, we are truly global. I believe the app is available in over 25 languages now. So there's lots and lots of considerations all the time about cultural considerations, language considerations, how do people follow football in different corners of the globe? It's very exciting.
Speaker 1:Yeah, I can imagine, and I mean adapting to that global mindset is a challenge in itself. Speaking of adoption, you're called FootMob. You mentioned soccer. Obviously you're from the US. It's football only right, it is.
Speaker 2:Yeah, we're football only for now and probably for the foreseeable future, kind of. As I mentioned, we're still a relatively small team and we're mindful about getting stretched too thin and not maintaining our focus, and we really want to perfect the product we have today. But you never know, our inbox is full of people asking for basketball and tennis and every sport you can imagine.
Speaker 1:So I mean 17 million users a month. How many football fans do you think there is in the world?
Speaker 2:I mean there's got to be billions right, there's lots of potential exactly.
Speaker 1:So I think focus is key. I mean, speaking of 17 million users, a lot of questions around the revenue side of things. Right, that pops up. Lots of users because the app is free to download. Right, it's free to follow your team. How do you make money?
Speaker 2:Yeah, so it's primarily through advertising and sponsorships. We do have a subscription, thoughtm, that makes it ad free. It gives you kind of early access to new features and some additional customization options and that's really kind of for the super users you know, our biggest fans but primarily it's advertising and sponsorships. So there's programmatic advertising in the app and on the web, and then we also have kind of larger brand sponsorships that are a bit more customized, a bit more involved and a bit more impactful. So those include a lot of rights holders recently, so Apple in the US, sky and TNT in the UK. And then we recently worked with Liverpool and their online shop. So we have capabilities for team targeting in the app based on a user's favorite club. So when we ran that campaign for them, it was only Liverpool fans who actually saw that advertisement.
Speaker 1:Hmm, Because I mean the data you have on your followers is just extensive. Yeah right, Then you can be super targeted, I suppose.
Speaker 2:Yeah, absolutely so. People use FATMAP as kind of their personal football world. They've really mapped out the clubs they care about, the leagues they care about, the players they care about, and through that we can create really targeted campaigns that don't have any privacy issues, which I think is really nice, so we can target you as a Liverpool fan without having to know your entire history. Right, you've just said you follow a club in an app, which is great, because then you're also receiving advertisements that you care about and are interesting to you. You know, if you think, if you got a Black Friday ad from Liverpool and you're a Liverpool fan, that's actually kind of a nice service that you're receiving when it comes to ads.
Speaker 1:Yeah, so I mean speaking of focus, there's a lot of different sources out there to follow sports right. Who are your main competitors in this market?
Speaker 2:Yeah, so, as you said, it's really broad. You know it can be anywhere you can get updates on football. I was doing some research recently in the UK and ran into a decent amount of people that just Google it. Google is obviously, you know, embedded essentially a live score app into search results. You know, I think we benchmark ourselves against kind of more direct competitors like LiveScore, flashscore, more direct competitors like LiveScore, flashscore, sofascore, you know, really focused on providing live sports data. But then there's also things like BBC Sky. You know any rights holder is also a place where people are kind of getting updates on matches and it's interesting for us to learn from people's behaviors with those types of competitors as well.
Speaker 1:So just a question. I mean, we're talking ticketing very often here right on this podcast, and if I follow a club, is it natural to use FootMob as a channel to reach fans? I mean, if you follow Liverpool and when Liverpool has a match, isn't football a natural marketplace to buy tickets for that and not only merchandise?
Speaker 2:Yeah, absolutely, and I think there's a lot of possibilities around that. You know, especially when we have essentially portals to different teams within the app where you're visiting team pages. There's a lot of opportunities there to target people who are fans of that club and who've favorited that club. So, yeah, I think it is a really natural place for people to go and kind of dive deeper and get more info on their team. I mean, directly from us. It's going to be news and statistics and data, but obviously there's a ton of possibilities there, amazing.
Speaker 1:Obviously, there's a ton of possibilities there, amazing. So, speaking of competitors out there, I mean, why should we use FootMob instead of LiveScore or FlashScore that you mentioned?
Speaker 2:Yeah, we really, really strive to have a world-class user experience. It's the balance between the user experience and the deep capabilities that we have that, I think, makes us really unique, and that's kind of that constant challenge that we're facing. That constant balance that we want to hit is how do we offer a really sophisticated and deep feature set that, if you want to go deeper, you can without overwhelming people? So we need to serve both the person who only wants to get the bronze score in the Manchester United score on the weekend, but then we also need to serve those types of people that really really want to dive deep and spend time analyzing players and teams and really diving deep into statistics.
Speaker 1:It's a great source for many reasons Complete buy-in in terms of your focus and not stretching too much, which is important. One thing I do find exciting, though, is that you have obviously built a great product out of norway, which is super cool, but you've also done it by working together with the local team, and the local team is called sk brand for our listeners who don't recognize that. They've been a guest on our podcast. We've done a video podcast with them. Super innovative club, one of the biggest clubs in Norway, if not the biggest. Tell us about that partnership and how have you been working with them?
Speaker 2:Yeah, it's a really nice story for us, kind of coming full circle back to our origins, of wanting to follow Braun. So we became a back of the shirt sponsor this year, which was great. You know, braun finished second into Champions League qualifying next year. So very, very good timing on our part, and it's done a lot to raise our profile locally in Bergen, knowing that we're a local company and you know greater Norway, understanding that we're based here as well. And then we've also done a number of activations with the club as part of that, including ticketing offers in the app, again targeted directly to Braun fans.
Speaker 1:Great, and when you're building new functionality, is SK Brand a part of that journey?
Speaker 2:Yeah. So we've been able to use them as a little bit of a test lab. So we've always kind of had dreams of how could FopMob exist on larger screens in physical environments. You know, kind of get out of your pocket or away from your browser window and out into the physical world, braun to integrate it into their stadium experience, and they were great partners on that.
Speaker 2:We came to them with the idea and they were immediately on board. So what we've done is we created a solution to display live FODMAP match data throughout the stadium on screens they have around the concourse next to concessions or as you walk in to the stadium, so that'll display match stats, the top performing players, scores from around the rest of the grounds and also for the club. Not only was it a nice fan experience for them to provide, but it also gave them a compelling reason to place more screens throughout the concourse because it opened up additional sponsorship opportunities for them. So, if you imagine, you could have essentially what is a slide of live match data and that can shift out with a sponsor message and then shift in again with additional data.
Speaker 1:There's a new way of attracting fans, which I mean clubs are looking for all the time right New revenue streams, revenue streams, new opportunities. And one thing that struck me a little bit as well the last time I was at a match, I was looking around at the audience and some of them were holding their phones right and I was thinking are they watching the game or what are they doing? Why are they even here? But then I saw they were actually using footmob. So can you tell us a little bit about that? Because you are at the game but you're still having your phone in your hand. I mean, what's the logic behind that? What are people actually doing?
Speaker 2:yeah, that's funny, it's. It's a habit of mine to always peek over shoulders to see which app people are using. Uh, yeah, sneaky, and it's been nice as we've been sponsored. There's been more and more converting to fat mom. But yeah, I mean, I think a lot of people are using it.
Speaker 2:A really simple use case is keeping tabs on the other ongoing matches around the league. You know, especially as we went into the final day with a slim chance of winning the title, people were glued to that other ongoing match and then, as well, kind of analyzing the play match and then, as well, kind of analyzing the play. So I think you know a lot of people are now used to the insights that you can get from a TV broadcast and kind of the statistics that pop up as the match is ongoing. And I think people are using apps much in the same way. So you're watching the match, but then you also want a little bit of analysis on which players are statistically performing well, well, how many chances have we been creating? You want to make a point to your friend that we need to get the ball more onto the right side because of this and that, and you know the apps are there to kind of help give you that insight I mean looking at the key trends in 2025, especially in the ticketing world, right?
Speaker 1:One of the things and we briefly touched on it is what we call the headless ticketing part, where, instead of having a ticketing system where you go through stages of select your seat, buy the ticket, add your name or your user account login password. It's a very structured roadmap or a customer journey that's been there for ages, right, and it's about time someone changes that, like the rest of the e-commerce world. But how do you see ticketing in terms of Footmob If you can go a little bit deeper into that? How can that become a new channel for the club and for the ticketing manager to make it easier and build more value in the fan journey?
Speaker 2:Yeah, and I think what's important about that is going to where fans are. So how do ticketing managers reach fans that aren't already on a mailing list because they've had a prior purchase? How do you get people into the stadium for the first time and how do you do it in a way that feels really natural and in the right environment? So you know, instead of showing up as a programmatic ad while you're shopping for pants, you can show up alongside, you know, your club's next fixture, next fixture. And I think there's some really interesting possibilities on how that journey could become really seamless and really natural. Where you're, you're kind of meeting the fans at exactly that point where they're looking at your club, thinking about your club, seeing what's coming next, seeing when the next home matches, and then they could get a ticketing offer alongside that. And again, I think what's great about that is it doesn't feel like an advertisement, it doesn't feel intrusive, it's a really natural partnership there.
Speaker 1:And I think that's immediately going to affect match day revenue, right, but also, I think, match day experience when you get new fans in, when fans come back the second time and the third time, they are likely to become loyal fans in. When fans come back the second time and the third time, they are likely to become loyal fans in the long term, which is a key priority for all clubs. But we also have a lot of commercial managers and commercial directors listening to this podcast and they are constantly fighting right, I need to reach my budgets. I need more sponsorships and they are constantly fighting right, I need to reach my budgets. I need more sponsorships. I need to reach my KPIs for the month. You mentioned shirt sponsorship. You are a sponsor at Brandt. I mean, it's your local club, but is it an opportunity for other commercial managers and directors to partner with you in any way, should they reach out?
Speaker 2:Yeah, we would absolutely love that. Like I said so, this was kind of our test case with this screen solution of being able to provide live data in the stadium. We began it actually the season prior, so now we've had over a full season in Bronze Stadion and the feedback has been great. And, like I said, what's really nice is it opens up sponsorship opportunities for clubs, but it also is a part of improving the fan experience, so it doesn't just feel like suddenly there's billboards all over the concourse, right, like there's really useful information on these screens. And it's nice about the way we've developed the solution is we want it to be very flexible, very scalable, so it can easily integrate into, you know, existing software or the existing setups in a stadium. And, as long as clubs have TVs that are connected to the internet, we can be set up and testing within minutes. It's all URL based, really. Yeah, we are definitely interested in taking it further.
Speaker 1:Sounds great, and I heard rumors about some really cool dashboards that you've made up at SK Brands, so I'm sure people like to hear more on that. So one thing, kurt you know we are all about traditions in this podcast and one question we always have is the match day rituals, and I've never met someone who has been involved in as many matches as you have, kurt, I have to say 500 leagues across the globe. The term match day I don't know what it means to you, but I'm sure it means something different to you than everyone else on this podcast. But let's talk more about being part of a growth company, a tech company. What's your everyday ritual? Because every day is match day and it's match day 24-7.
Speaker 2:Yeah, it definitely is for us. I strangely know a lot about Australian A-League and W-League because they kick off at the right time for us. So if we're testing a new feature, we can test it live on a match. That's at 10 or 11 am for us, yeah, but as you said, it's around the clock, so we kind of have to be ready for all eventualities, especially when you look at MLS is kind of playing during our nighttime, overnight, and really being prepared to support all the leagues around the clock. But for the most part things run pretty smoothly, despite the insane amounts of data very good.
Speaker 1:So I know who I'm going to call that next time I'm getting invited to a pub quiz about football. It's going to be you, and we need the app installed in our phones and we're ready to win the whole pub quiz for sure. But back to the script here and also back to the traditions, kurt. The way you see the world, the way you see football, and also based on the conversations we have today, how would you sum up two to three key takeaways that you would like our listeners to remember from our conversation?
Speaker 2:Yeah, I think you know, when we look at digitalization within the fan experience at stadiums, it's really important to also keep in mind that fans are there for the sights, the sounds, the smells, hugging people next to them. So the digitalization can be alongside that, but it shouldn't get in the way of that. And I think what we've done, in kind of holding things in the concourse and with that, we're hitting people at moments where you know you can't even see the pitch and making sure that's where it belongs. And I think also, you know, one thing we've learned is that digitalization doesn't necessarily have to be a heavy lift. So you know, lots of clubs don't have their own in-house digital teams or huge budgets allocated to digital. But you know, we've been able to accomplish a lot with Braun, kind of using very little. And I think, lastly, again, it's just always keeping the experience of your fans, your customers, your users top of mind. So if you understand what they want, what they value, what problems they have, then you're always going to be on the right track.
Speaker 1:Definitely understand your fans. I think that's a super important key takeaway. Thank you so much, Kurt. It's been great having you as our guest and I'm 100% sure that our listeners think the same. If any of our listeners would like to contact you, Kurt, how can they reach out?
Speaker 2:Yeah, probably the best would be to find me on LinkedIn and just reach out and send me a message. Sounds great. Thank you again and just reach out and send me a message.
Speaker 1:Sounds great. Thank you again, kurt, and for our listeners you have been listening to, don't Forget your Tickets, where today's guest has been Kurt Baker, product lead at the football stats app, footmob. Thank you so much for listening and thank you to TicketCo for powering this podcast. My name is Carl-Erik Moberg and until next time, have a great day and don't you ever forget your tickets.
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