EnneagramU
Unlock your true you! Dive into the Enneagram with Damon & Kelly. Personalities, relationships, work - it's all here, every Wednesday. #EnneagramU #WorkplaceDynamics #EmotionalHealth
EnneagramU
THE FOUR
Ever wondered what it's like to be an Enneagram four, the Individualist, the creator with a heart full of passion? We'll take you on an immersive exploration of the world of fours, their spontaneity, creativity, and the unique emotional challenges they face.
In the second half, we'll discuss the uniqueness of fours. We dive into the depths of their creative expression and how they bring their distinct flavor to the team dynamics. We'll delve into the lives of famous fours like Taylor Swift and Anne Frank, their struggles, and how they embraced their unique gifts.
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Hey Damon, I wanted to start today a little bit originally. Since we're talking about the four today, I want to start with asking you how you're feeling.
Speaker 2:It's interesting that you would ask me that today of all days because this is a wonderful day for me. I feel wonderful.
Speaker 1:Okay.
Speaker 2:Because I have discovered. I've discovered that I am a four. This is a song dedicated to all of us fours out there. Oh, that's really beautiful. Well, I mean, it's not unusual for a four to be sporadically creative like that.
Speaker 1:That is very true.
Speaker 2:Welcome to Enneagram U with Damon and Kelly, where we explore the mysteries of human personality and help you learn more about you. Whether you're a skeptic or an enthusiast, together we'll take you on a journey of self-discovery using ancient wisdom of the Enneagram. This is Enneagram U.
Speaker 1:Well and very much for you as a nine that is able to lean into the other numbers. So this I would say that you're really beautifully expressing the piece of a nine that is expressing through the four.
Speaker 2:Kelly, I told you I was going to break the Enneagram Today. You cannot take this away from me. I have broken the Enneagram. I am now a four and all you fours out there. You know how we are. We're not self-absorbed or anything.
Speaker 1:Oh, that was fun. Yes, well, thank you, because that is very beautiful.
Speaker 2:I was just messing with us, but yeah, it was fun. It was fun to put it all together and think about that a little bit and how fours are so creative. And I do know some fours and they're amazing people and they're way beyond what I just attempted to do.
Speaker 1:And friends, I want you to know that Damon actually played Like. This was not music that we just streamed in.
Speaker 2:Well, thank you, tell, I promise you. So I'm feeling really good. I was finding out that I was a four. I am excited that I am learning more about the Enneagram and the different numbers, and I do have some, and you're finding yourself in all of them. I'm proving your point.
Speaker 1:Friends, it is like we're having an Enneagram arm wrestle each week and once again you won eight.
Speaker 2:They always win. Oh, kelly, hey, how are you feeling today?
Speaker 1:Well, I mean, after that beautiful little musical piece I'm feeling a little more peaceful. Oh, that's good Thank you for the nine sharing piece with me with your music yeah, musical ability. I have to say I also feel tense.
Speaker 2:You do yes, so I'm so sorry.
Speaker 1:We're getting ready to go on our family vacation and I'm feeling the weight of traveling. And just this is the first vacation that our family has taken where I'm not packing for everybody and my control issues are raring their ugly head, that's awesome. But I've given everybody a packing list, and God be with us all.
Speaker 2:Yeah, oh, so you're doing a lot of packing.
Speaker 1:Yeah Well, and we're going to Alaska, so this isn't like the beach where we can take t-shirt and shorts and a swimsuit, but this is where we're going to need like clothes for summer and winter and all the things in between.
Speaker 2:Wow, that sounds like an amazing trip. Actually, I think it will be. You guys are going to have a blast.
Speaker 1:And.
Speaker 2:I know anybody that's ever done that or that. I've heard they come back and just say yeah well worth it.
Speaker 1:Yes.
Speaker 2:It's going to be great and it's going to be, you know, really healthy for you to let people just be on their own.
Speaker 1:Just let it go. Don't control everything, that's right. How are you going to?
Speaker 2:control the polar bears and the grizzly bears you're going to meet.
Speaker 1:Yeah, you're not. Or the whales. I will have met my match.
Speaker 2:So what do you do when that? How do you handle that tension?
Speaker 1:Well, talking with my family and so just making sure that everybody knows what to pack and have has space to pack. So we're going to do a little packing party tonight, so that'll be. That'll help after tonight.
Speaker 2:So I have. I have some travel secrets.
Speaker 1:So what would you like?
Speaker 2:one Sure For us, us fours, this is how we're kind of just, we kind of go with the flow.
Speaker 1:Yes, you know what I mean? We go with the flow. Yeah, that sounds like a real nine. No Ninth go with the flow.
Speaker 2:Fours go with the flow as well. They're creative. They look at a blank canvas and then they paint a beautiful picture. Yes, and so the us fours being individuals like that. You know an idea? I just make sure I have a credit card that's got some space on it.
Speaker 1:It's funny, because it's true, because I have to tell myself Kelly, wherever you go, you're going to be able to get something.
Speaker 2:Hopefully you're in Alaska, though.
Speaker 1:Right? Well, we'll be on a cruise ship, so they'll have everything we need. I mean, it may be several hundred dollars more than what we want to spend but everybody's envious of that.
Speaker 2:By the way, we all want to go.
Speaker 1:Yes, I wish I could take everybody.
Speaker 2:That would be fun to do like a we're doing a podcast.
Speaker 1:Any of you cruise.
Speaker 2:Yeah, oh, my goodness, wow, our listenership just went up by two, two people and told two other people that. Kelly's taking everybody to Alaska. You heard it here first.
Speaker 1:Yes.
Speaker 2:All right, we probably should get to the four.
Speaker 1:Yes, Sorry Fours.
Speaker 2:Fours are like you guys just took this off the rails? Yeah, because we did a creative episode today.
Speaker 1:Yes, that's right. Well, as well we should. This episode should be original and unique, because fours love to be original and unique. They do not like just the same old, same old. So I think the fours would appreciate that this is just a really unique podcast. We've got music, we've got emotion, we've got the depth of how we're feeling.
Speaker 2:Yeah, I have a friend that's a four. They put something on Instagram there there was an empty room and it looked like a living room, like there should be furniture in there, and then in the Instagram story they used a song that was all about gypsies. And I'm like, are they telling me something? I mean, I think they moved, but from point A to point B. I don't know what the two points are.
Speaker 1:Yeah, well, that would definitely be a four, because fours probably aren't gonna send you the we've moved postcard Right. It'll be something a little more creative, little mysterious. I can see how fours would be drawn to like this original gypsy kind of living.
Speaker 2:Yeah, our fours. Generally artists at heart.
Speaker 1:Yes, Now the thing we want to watch for as we don't want to put fours in a box is that there are so many artistic expressions for the four. So they are our songwriters, musicians, artists through painting, but also even like coming into a space and being able to see how the space feels more beautiful, so they really do want to make the world a more beautiful place to live.
Speaker 2:That's good. That's what my song was trying to do. Yeah, Forza will you vote and let us know?
Speaker 1:I'm like boo.
Speaker 2:Yeah Well, and let's see, Damon, if this also rings true.
Speaker 1:A four would be very much about quality and good taste.
Speaker 2:Sure, yeah, well, yes, of course we are, yes, of course we are yes.
Speaker 1:I have a four friend as well. She at one point was a flight attendant for an airlines and so she got to travel all over the world and so she has retired now and her home is like an art gallery. She loves artistic expression and just this quality, this value, like she's not gonna have a picture in her house that maybe anybody else is gonna have. She likes the one of a kind, and so for fours not all fours are gonna have that kind of expression, but there's something about them that they want to be the one of a kind have you been to my house?
Speaker 2:Yes, Is there that type of thing?
Speaker 1:Yeah, and for you, peace is a blank wall. It could be. It could be, yeah.
Speaker 2:There's nothing on our wall. Yes, all right.
Speaker 1:Again with the fours though we are so grateful for the fours, because they really do take just so much time and making the world a better place. Can you imagine for the world if we didn't have music?
Speaker 1:Oh, If we didn't have poetry, if we didn't have authors, if we didn't have people that would make our spaces just more beautiful. So often we can easily take it for granted, but fours just bring a beauty into the world and so we are grateful for just the originality that fours bring. And I think some of the challenges for the four is they are really looking for their authentic, true self all the time. I mean they really value authenticity and so for the four, they are looking for that authenticity within themselves and within others. So their relationships they're not gonna come in and go, let's just have small talk. It's kind of distasteful to them. They like to go to the deep end of the pool in conversations and there are friends that when we're in a dark time they are gonna come alongside us and be with us. In that they have an empathy like a two. But a two wants to do something active and helping. A four is just gonna be with you.
Speaker 2:Fours are not afraid of emotion, are they?
Speaker 1:No, not at all. Okay With that. How does that feel Damon? Does that resonate? I will say it was just fun trying.
Speaker 2:Yes, yeah, so in that sense.
Speaker 1:Well, the great thing about a nine you can try on all the other numbers.
Speaker 2:Yeah, it happens all the time. Yes, that's great. Well, each number.
Speaker 1:I don't know if we did this for the three?
Speaker 2:Oh yeah, I think we did. We talked about the animal, that's always interesting. So what is the animal that? Goes along with a four. So they say the animal is the morning dove, so it's M-O-U-R in ING.
Speaker 1:So, like this deep cry of the dove, the song Because again, fours are very in touch with the darker emotions, and where a four has to watch moving from being healthy, making the world a more beautiful place, and all their different expressions, is that feeling that they're missing something, and so they can struggle with envy. And looking out into the world to see what you have that they don't have, and so being able to then feel like they're coming up short can move them to that unhealthy space of where they feel, like this envy, that they're missing something important, whether it's a relationship, whether it's something that they're missing as far as their life's calling, and so that leads to that space of deep sorrow and a fours don't have some structure or some ways to step out of that dark place because that's authentically how they feel. They can stay in that for too long, to where it then becomes more of a darker depression for them. Hence the morning dove, just that, even the spelling yes, even the spelling is creative.
Speaker 1:Well, that's cool yeah.
Speaker 2:Yeah, what we talked, that they don't have to be artists. How do we communicate with a four?
Speaker 1:Mm-hmm.
Speaker 2:Well, I think just you kind of said that already. Well, yeah, go ahead.
Speaker 1:Yeah, but I think, just recognizing that the fours we want to invite them into Just for us, appreciating what they do bring into the world, that for them they are original and they are unique and we can communicate to them the special place that they have in our lives, a special role that they play, Interverted or extroverted you know, I think probably more so.
Speaker 1:The Four with a five-wing is probably going to be more introverted, so getting more energized by being alone. I think the four with the three-wing may have a little bit more of that connection. Maybe they're not full-blown extroverts but might have that more Appeal to be with others, to get energized by being with people.
Speaker 2:We can't put people in a box, and that's not ever fair. But I'm just wondering, like with artists, this I maybe this will come to a surprise to some people, but if a lot of artists when they are on the stage, you would consider that person to be a very extroverted because they're a performer, right?
Speaker 2:So, you go to a concert and you see that, oh well, they can communicate with this large crowd and what I find, and I have found with fours, is that they're actually very safe there, because a large number of people is Kind of safe compared to one-on-one. Yes, and I don't know, does that make sense? Absolutely.
Speaker 1:Yeah, it's kind of like that idea of you know for the four they can find safety in numbers Versus if it's one-on-one it may feel a little bit more Uncomfortable or put on the spot, or you know, even for them they're gonna be authentic and so they're probably again not going to be people that just have small talk with a lot of people and so that can create a space where they do feel much more comfortable, maybe on the stage or behind the paintbrush, you know. I mean, you just think about the ways that Four's express themselves artistically. It's not, there's not a lot of group projects for fours, because they really do want to be original or one of a kind.
Speaker 2:Well, the creativity that comes from the fours is I mean we all benefit from that. Yes and we're all enjoying that all the time. We probably don't go to them and say thank you, and maybe they wouldn't even take the thank you. I don't know. Right, they do their thing. That's their outlet and yeah so that would be my encouragement if a four is feeling like they're not enough. They definitely are. We need them. We're all Taking advantage of their gifts.
Speaker 1:Oh well, and you know, I think, for a four, a place of real movement towards health is To really see themselves as one of a kind. You know, and even this may be cliche, I don't know, but you know, just thinking about that, each of us has a unique fingerprint. And so for a four to really embrace that, that they are unique and special because of who they are, not that they're missing something, that they have to find, but that that's already within them.
Speaker 2:If you're unique like that and you're trying also maybe to connect and you can't connect, you would feel less valuable, accidentally, inadvertently right but you are valuable and so understanding that that uniqueness is actually a strength.
Speaker 1:Mm-hmm, that's right, and you know, even being able to have some boundaries on the things that you are drawn to creatively. So you know, it doesn't have to be this $5,000 piece of artwork that I'm buying for my home. It could be I'm gonna go out and just be in nature and just reflect on a flower, reflect on a leaf, or you know Something that just being able to see the beauty and, simple, you know the beauty in the created world and fours tend to find one another in. Art yes, art galleries and gatherings.
Speaker 2:And different things like that. Yeah fours kind of get together.
Speaker 1:Yeah, yeah, they can have those. You know, even like you were saying, if they're in a band together, right, they can have those Connection points. And you know, and I think another thing for the four is Finding those occupations that are life-giving. You know, we work together at BU and I get to talk with a lot of different teams and what has been so just delightful is to see where fours have found a place in our company. That's life-giving. But kind of a funny thing when I do the presentations to teams, if there is a four on a team that I'm presenting to, there's only one.
Speaker 2:Is that right? Yes, you know why? Because they can't work together. Just kidding.
Speaker 1:There can only be one.
Speaker 2:Four on the team. The artist is the artist. You can't have another artist in the room. That's right.
Speaker 1:Yeah, but they bring that special piece. That's why bands break up. Well, I mean, fours find themselves like you were saying, but probably fours can't be in like intimate relationships with other fours. I mean, you think about the, through history, the couples that have done duos together, and I mean, when it's good it's good, but when it's bad it blows up.
Speaker 2:I have the most obvious famous four of all time currently in pop culture right now.
Speaker 1:Okay.
Speaker 2:And it's a guess that this person is a four, but I bet all of us, if we voted, I bet it'd be 9010 that this person is a four and that is Taylor Swift.
Speaker 1:That's exactly who I was thinking. You were going to say, yeah, Well, and look at the beauty that she brings into the world with her music, but also like it is raw and vulnerable and authentic. I mean we could tell. I mean none of us would have to even tell because we all know like her love life, Right, Because she's just putting it out there.
Speaker 2:Right yeah. Yeah, I shouldn't say no one wants to date this girl, but you know there's some risk that comes with that. Yes, yes, For sure.
Speaker 1:But you can tell she's looking for her true love, you know, and she's finding that challenge of being able to find the one that is really going to complete her, you know, and and that's the challenge to, I think, for the four, not looking for someone who is going to fill that gap in their life, but seeing that they are already complete in and of themselves.
Speaker 2:Yeah, so here's some other names just for fun, since I got a list up now is Janice Joplin. Okay, it's probably a four. Dakota Fanning is probably a four.
Speaker 1:Or Kate Winslet is probably a four. So artists, as you can see. Yeah, actors, writers.
Speaker 2:Oh, interesting, anne Frank might have been a four. Okay.
Speaker 1:Potentially so that's, yeah, very cool You're in some good company force, yes, and as we think about even Anne Frank and I know we're just guessing, you know, because, as we've talked about in an earlier podcast, about we don't know each other's motivations but you think about a young girl who is hiding and yet has the wherewithal to start a journal, you know, or a diary where she is just, I mean, beautifully, darkly, expressing what her and her family are going through and that just, I think, really reflects that four that would even think about that, you know, and just have that creative outlet that was needed.
Speaker 1:I will say this, too, about fours. You know, as I work with people and give them just ways to process their emotions in a healthy way, I remember working with a four years ago when I was a counselor and I have my feeling words, as you know quite well, damon my feeling word list and so I just gave that to her and I said you know, I encourage people to journal their feelings. I said, but I just don't want to put you in a box, I want you to find a way to express your emotions. And so when she came back in a couple of weeks later, she brought a sketch pad. Okay, yeah, it was amazing. And so she just went through and she said you know, on this day I was feeling this and this, so this is the expression of that. And I was like, oh my gosh, this is amazing.
Speaker 1:And the reason that that's important is for fours having some way to get those feelings out so that they don't bottle up, because I think that's then what causes them to just feel like overwhelmed with just this dark cloud of emotions, but having ways to process it. And again, I'm not going to ever encourage a four to like okay, journal your three feeling words. And you know, here's how we do it. You know all the other numbers. I think we're like, hey, give me some formula. But a four is like, don't box me in. You know, this is my, this is my, you know I've got this. But having a way to just name and get those feelings out, yeah, not all of us can express our feelings easily.
Speaker 2:I tell you what I think. I think fours are awesome.
Speaker 1:All of us are.
Speaker 2:And me, Billie Eilish, Joni Mitchell, Bob Dylan and me.
Speaker 1:Maybe that could be your next song.
Speaker 2:We're going to write a song for you, Kelly. Any encouraging words for the fours before we sign off?
Speaker 1:Yeah, I think, just again the appreciation that often the fours go unappreciated. You know we just like when you picked up your guitar and you were playing, I'm like I wish I had some little bit of being able to play a musical instrument, not a lot, you know, of talent. I had piano lessons for 12 years. You could do it. I could barely like sight read something. But a four just I mean. And again, musical instruments or whatever ways, I just want to say we appreciate fours because, again, if we had a world without them, the world would just be gray, it would.
Speaker 2:Yeah, they bring color to our world. Yes, that's awesome yes. All right. Well, next week it'll be the five, so thanks for joining us everyone, and see you next time, kelly. Bye Damon.