EnneagramU
Unlock your true you! Dive into the Enneagram with Damon & Kelly. Personalities, relationships, work - it's all here, every Wednesday. #EnneagramU #WorkplaceDynamics #EmotionalHealth
EnneagramU
THE EIGHT
Part 1: Ever wondered how your favorite Ted Lasso characters could be dissected through the lens of the Enneagram?
The second part of our discussion takes you on an insightful journey into the world of Enneagram 8 type, known for its powerful and protective nature. We dissect how this type influences our leadership styles, personal relationships, and even our passions. Diving into the dynamic intensity 8s bring to their dialogues, we also shed light on the unique relationship between 8s and 9s. Learn how this intensity can be channeled positively to enrich those around us, and the significance of setting boundaries when necessary. Join us in this enlightening discourse and discover how the Enneagram can be a transformative tool in your personal and professional growth.
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Welcome to Enneagram U, damon and Kelly, where we explore the mysteries of human personality and help you learn more about you. With your skeptic or an enthusiast, together, we'll take you on a journey of self-discovery using the ancient wisdom of the Enneagram. This is Enneagram U. Hey, everyone, welcome to Enneagram U. My name is Damon and I'm here with my friend Kelly. Hi Kelly, hello Damon, hey Kelly. Kelly brought me this very interesting thing about the Enneagram as it relates to Ted Lasso, and I want to read it to everybody. Love it.
Speaker 2:I love Ted Lasso.
Speaker 1:Okay, so this is. We've done this a little bit with the office, but this is what Enneagram numbers each character have potentially, and we'll just start at the top. A lot of you have probably seen the show Ted Lasso. For those of you that haven't, you'll just skip forward, okay, and watch the show.
Speaker 2:It is so good. It's a good show, it is good.
Speaker 1:I think season one was fabulous, season two was okay and season three was pretty darn good.
Speaker 2:Yeah.
Speaker 1:You know, the ending was good. That's how I take it.
Speaker 2:Yeah, do you agree with that? I do, I loved it. Yeah, I think every series has those kind of pits you know, and then, really they had to kind of rediscover themselves.
Speaker 1:Yes, and you know, the first series was so strong or the first yeah, first series was first episodes Season, that is the word I'm looking for. First season was so strong.
Speaker 2:Yes, Agreed, that's tough, great characters. That's where I love, where the Enneagram just gets kind of brought into these different storylines, because that can be helpful too. I've heard that writers use the Enneagram to help develop the wide range of characters that they need.
Speaker 1:That would be helpful.
Speaker 2:It would make sense to me.
Speaker 1:Okay, so we'll start. We'll go one through nine. Number one Dr Sharon Fieldstone. Yeah, Dr Sharon, that one took me a little bit. I'd think like why was she a one? And some people that know the character really well will probably say well, duh, but I thought there was another character and that was Keely's administrative assistant.
Speaker 2:Yes.
Speaker 1:I don't recall her name, but she seemed like she was a one.
Speaker 2:Well, yes, definitely a. This is what you do. This is what you don't do, I think, dr Sharon, yeah, I could kind of see that with she most likely has a two-wing for how much she cares. But, yeah, created that safe space for the players. But also, yeah, just definitely think with Ted being able to see where some of his challenges were.
Speaker 1:in naming those, yeah, okay, that was number one. Number two was one of the players, sam.
Speaker 2:That everybody knows Sam, oh, I love Sam.
Speaker 1:Yep, that one makes 100%. Yeah, since a number three, rebecca, the owner, yeah, yeah, the entrepreneur.
Speaker 2:I could see that, yeah, cause she just very much appeared as a three. She wanted to be the winner. She was very much in competition with her ex.
Speaker 1:She wanted to look successful. She wanted to be successful. She was successful, she was.
Speaker 2:Strong woman.
Speaker 1:Number four is another player on the team, Danny.
Speaker 2:Oh yeah, he seemed to have that sensitive, creative side until that one time when they were playing.
Speaker 1:Yeah, danny went off the rails, he kind of went. Yeah, yeah. During one game he was like who is this guy? Yeah.
Speaker 2:He was a competitor.
Speaker 1:His three-wing was strong, number five, coach Beard.
Speaker 2:Oh, of course, 100%. I was reading, I was reading all the insights, Always having the facts.
Speaker 1:Number six you see it, if you're listening, who do you think? Think for yourself. See if you can guess these ahead of time. Give me a second. Here's one second. Okay, Number six Leslie. Oh, definitely so faithful even in the midst of verbal abuse and bashing, and maybe a bit fearful at times.
Speaker 2:Yes, Well, and just the interactions with this family, with the team. Yeah, love that.
Speaker 1:Number seven, keely, oh, definitely.
Speaker 2:Especially, I think I loved her relationship with Rebecca. They were a good team.
Speaker 1:Yes, balance each other out. Number eight, which is our number today, we're going to get to in a second. Everyone's favorite. Why is the eight everyone's favorite? Roy Kent.
Speaker 2:Yes, oh, I feel like Roy Kent, just there is no filter and you don't have to have a filter.
Speaker 1:No, we can't.
Speaker 2:But to have the freedom just to be like blunt and just real, and yet I loved his relationship with his niece.
Speaker 1:Oh right, that brought out the sweet little girl. Soft side of Roy. Yes.
Speaker 2:Especially the time that she had bad breath. Did you see that episode?
Speaker 1:I probably. Yeah, I saw it all, oh my gosh, it was the cutest.
Speaker 2:But, every eight has a soft side Even.
Speaker 1:Roy Kent, even Roy Kent. Yes, and that's what makes it. That's what makes it more powerful in some ways for the character when they, when they turn to that and you're like whoa, you don't expect that.
Speaker 2:Yeah.
Speaker 1:Oh, and so the last one, number nine, and the star of the show did LASSO, which we all agree that for sure, Yep Well. I, Mr Peace.
Speaker 2:Yeah, he's a little bit of everything like you. Damon, a little bit of all the numbers.
Speaker 1:No, I don't think so.
Speaker 2:But yeah, I mean just being able to encourage the team, you know, with believing it seemed like nothing would get him down on the outside. But then we also got to see the back end of the story too, where you know too much of holding all of that tension and conflict came out for him, you know, in some of those struggles that he met with Dr Sharon about Right, Definitely he was the one that needed counseling.
Speaker 1:Here I am your counselor Full circle.
Speaker 2:I'm signing off the air right now.
Speaker 1:Goodbye, yeah, love that Well today we're going to talk about our feelings first, but today we're going to talk about the eight.
Speaker 2:Yes.
Speaker 1:Um, you know they're okay.
Speaker 2:They're yeah, you're okay. I know I'm okay, You're okay.
Speaker 1:As an eight, you always want to go first, Like when we do feelings like I just want to talk.
Speaker 2:I do find myself just like inserting myself in, like that's good, bolting forward, you go. So you want to go first this time?
Speaker 1:No, I don't have to go first, what was it you said about eights? It was aim what? Ready aim fire? Okay, Ready aim fire.
Speaker 2:Gellie, oh no, no, no, that's how we should be. Oh, Actually, we're ready fire aim.
Speaker 1:So we don't yeah.
Speaker 2:We healthy eight is ready aim fire if we slow ourselves down enough to do that. But I'm a ready fire aim.
Speaker 1:Ready fire, aim Gellie, how are you feeling today?
Speaker 2:I actually I really feel joyful for a couple reasons. One is I had lunch with a good friend today and we've been talking in Iagram for several years now, this friend and I, and it just helps us to go to like the deep end of the pool really quickly, and so she's a nine like you and I don't know. I just feel like when I'm just in a conversation with her, I'm already known, because she'll just be able, as I'm sharing something, not just point out, well, that's because you're an eight, you know, but she'll just be like that totally makes sense because from your lens you know, and then as she's sharing from that nine space, so I don't know it.
Speaker 2:Just I left just feeling really, really joyful.
Speaker 1:That's great. So it's a great tool for conversations and you can talk around the numbers. That and then. That allows you to get to the heart of whatever the issue is or whatever's happening in your life.
Speaker 2:I think, especially with those really close relationships like significant others and friendship, like if you just have that as a tool, yeah, you can just, you can really feel known.
Speaker 1:A tool, but not an excuse.
Speaker 2:No, not an excuse not a hammer, not a hammer kind of tool, but a good tool.
Speaker 1:Well, good, I was joyful today. Yeah, joyful is a good thing. Yes, yes. Also All right.
Speaker 2:Well, and as I bolt through and want to share my feelings, first, what are you feeling, damon?
Speaker 1:Well, today I am a bit exhausted. You had a long weekend, and yeah, so it was my anniversary this past weekend. That I didn't forget, which that's good.
Speaker 2:That is really good.
Speaker 1:Yeah, and. But at the same time we also had another event we had to go to a funeral and so had to celebrate the anniversary and attend a funeral, and that got all crammed into one weekend, so we didn't one. One night we only slept, uh, cause we were driving so far to make all this happen. We only slept an hour, which the last time. I only slept an hour, as I don't even remember, maybe college.
Speaker 2:Yeah, I don't even know if I could manage on an hour.
Speaker 1:It's awful, it's an awful feeling. It's that very punchy feeling. And um yeah, so I'm trying to kind of catch up that sleep.
Speaker 2:but yeah, Well.
Speaker 1:I'm just yeah, a little bit of fatigue.
Speaker 2:Today, a lot to blend Both a joyful yeah, and I'm just trying to get the experience of your anniversary and also a funeral.
Speaker 1:That's right, that's right.
Speaker 2:You guys have been married how long now?
Speaker 1:Um, uh-oh, at least you remembered. This reveals so much about me. Once I say this cause, this puts me no, 35 years.
Speaker 2:Okay, 35 years. Hear that you little whippersnappers out there.
Speaker 1:Congratulations, it can be done.
Speaker 2:It can be done.
Speaker 1:If it can be done, and I'm involved. You all have a lot of hope. This is a miracle. It is a miracle.
Speaker 2:I mean amazing wife that you have. That's where we're just putting the credit.
Speaker 1:Yes, that's where the credit lies, for sure.
Speaker 2:Oh, yes, well, happy anniversary to you guys.
Speaker 1:Well, thank you. Well, you guys have been married 30. 30, I know A couple of pros here I know.
Speaker 2:If you need any marriage advice, go see the counselors that we've worked with. That's right, they're superstars.
Speaker 1:Oh, that's great. Yes, well, today is a special day because it is your number as everyone knows, you are an eight and we're going to talk about the eight, so I guess I'll just say we know you pretty well by this time, so we don't have to talk about it.
Speaker 2:No, I'm kidding. I have shared a lot, so yeah, we can just move on.
Speaker 1:No well, tell us about the eight. What's generally? What's the eight?
Speaker 2:Yes, the eight is known as the powerful person, which always feels really weird, especially as I might share with a group. I'm an eight, and then it's like I'm the powerful person and all five foot two of me is very powerful.
Speaker 1:Watch out, yeah.
Speaker 2:The eights really do represent strength and courage. They're oftentimes leaders that move things forward, especially their passions, and definitely have a protective side to them. They really do value being able to protect those that are their people and their passions and different things that they feel like are values when I've seen that for me, just in doing counseling for 18 years, I would find myself actually feeling protective of clients that I worked with. Really. That was a boundary area because I could easily take them in my mind, home with me, praying for them or thinking about them, but just really for me. That's when I started to nuance that oh, I'm not a two. The story of when a friend of mine said I think you're an eight, I was like what? But just being able to see for me protection has been a part of just my personality makeup. So if you're one of my people, you got somebody that's going to be willing to protect you if you need someone to step in Ate, grab and latch on to a cause really.
Speaker 1:So if you have a cause that you want to fight for, you might be an Ate.
Speaker 2:Yes, for sure, and you know, for me, I think my cause has been, of course, my relationship with God and my faith. I've always felt like that was an area that was my cause, but when I was in counseling, I think my cause really became just emotional health and emotional intelligence, and so I find that's a banner that I carry.
Speaker 2:I mean obviously forcing poor Damon to name his feelings every week. So, yeah, but having that cause, you know, moving things forward. The other thing about the Ate is they do know how to lead and move things forward and you know again, if it's in a healthy way they'll be able to maybe have that servant leadership where they're like delegate, bring people together for a common cause. You know every cause needs an organizer and a person to just like blaze that trail. I think in an unhealthy place you might feel like Ate's just are like dragging you along. Like I've said to people that I've worked with before, just kind of using this illustration, like in my Ate, if I was a car I would drive very fast, you know, and just like let's just break down this barrier and so I will tell people that I've worked with, and even my family. Like, if I'm driving too fast and you feel like you're hanging off the bumper, just let me know, because I won't know, I don't have that ability to see when I need to slow down.
Speaker 1:So you don't have any problems with initiative if you get an idea. You're like I'm going yeah, so that's interesting, because that is not my case right. So, as a nine, it's slow to start. And so if you're a nine, find an eight, and if they're into something you're into or would like to be into, but you're just like. I just can't get this off the ground. I'd like to. They'll do it for you.
Speaker 2:Yes, just hey, let's partner together, because that is a great illustration, because the Ate's as, like an initiator, would want to help take up the cause, because they're really about helping the underdog, you know, or someone that might not be able to fully help themselves. You know, and I think back to our conversation, even about this podcast. I was so excited that you had the idea and that we started to talk about it. But I'm kind of seeing our numbers play out because do you remember when we started talking about it?
Speaker 1:No, why are you like twitching right now?
Speaker 2:No, I remember we were talking about it and you know we were like let's just make a list of maybe different topics, and I think I sent you a list of like a year's worth of topics.
Speaker 1:I was scrolling for a while, an hour.
Speaker 2:Yeah, so it's eight and nine working, working together.
Speaker 1:Right that. I mean it's worked out nicely so far. No one's thrown us off the air, off podcast.
Speaker 2:Right, yeah, yeah we appreciate our listeners and, yeah, just being able to share a dream that we had and that we were able to come up with together, because I definitely would not have been able to do this without you, and so, yeah, it's been a great partnership so far.
Speaker 1:We haven't we're not through your number yet though. Maybe we'll find something else here today. Yeah, you know, it's been a lot of fun. So, eights make great leaders. But I have a caveat here. It says that eights make great leaders of movements, and so, especially so, if you're not an eight, you can still be a leader. So don't make. Don't ever think that you can't be a leader just because you're not an eight but, I, think you would thrive if there was a movement and a cause behind it.
Speaker 2:Definitely. That, I think, sets the eights and other leaders apart, because, like you said, any number from the Enneagram could be a leader. I think eights do really get motivated by moving things forward like a movement, like let's just blaze the trail.
Speaker 1:Which for career-wise, then that just opens the door for so many different things you can lead in. A book I have here says that many attorneys are eights. Yeah, well, you know eights don't mind conflict.
Speaker 2:Do you like to argue, though it depends on what it is. Yeah, being able to spar, you know, I think it's fun. I think, especially if it's more light-hearted, you know, kind of poking fun, not making fun, but, like you know, let's just kind of poke the topic and let's just, yeah, kind of spar on different things. I know, a lot of times, if I have felt disconnected, especially with my husband, that I You'll pick a fight, I will. Oh, no, you won't, I will, yes, yes. So being able to even just say to him like I'm sorry that I'm like nitpicking something, I think it's because I don't feel connected.
Speaker 2:you, know, so let's connect in another area. Yeah, for my seven husband that he's like oh, what is happening? I don't want to fight, let's just have fun.
Speaker 1:Right, yeah, well, that's the opposite of me as well. Like I'm not, I don't like to argue. Necessarily, I will go if I have to, but, boy, it's exhausting for me.
Speaker 2:But yeah, you like to argue and pick a fight when you know. So I know if it's trusted people.
Speaker 1:So if you're really mad at me, it's just because we just haven't chatted for a while, right, we need to just have a conversation.
Speaker 2:Yeah, yeah. Oh, and you're the counselor too, so I'm running most of the time from you, I know well, can you imagine my sweet husband who not only has an eight for a wife but also someone who's a professional counselor? That pretty much has probably made him feel like you just cannot win this. Oh, he's turned out really well.
Speaker 1:He has. Yeah, he's such a good guy.
Speaker 2:But that's the dark side then, as we kind of think about the eight. The dark side of the eight is this refusal to be vulnerable.
Speaker 2:And so then, if eights are refusing to be vulnerable and only just really present this hard shell of, maybe, their personality, there is then this lust for power and lust for more control, because if I have all the power and if I have all the control, I don't have to be vulnerable. And so, eight, if they continue in that, they really live out of this it's my way or the highway kind of mentality, which of course does not help relationships or even moving their things forward, their causes forward. No one wants to be behind a leader who it's my way or the highway. Sadly, we've probably all experienced leaders like that.
Speaker 1:So eights aren't necessarily bullies, but it could be.
Speaker 2:Oh, I would say definitely. If eights are in the unhealthy space, they are bullies.
Speaker 1:That's interesting right there. Let's all just think about that for a second.
Speaker 2:Yes.
Speaker 1:No, You're not that Well. I've always said you're the healthiest eight, that I know. Thank you, I've said that many, many, many times.
Speaker 2:I think again me being a condition to really growing into having to have empathy and trying to take care of others. I think that's helped kind of tame down that underlying beast of the eight that it's my way or the highway, or everybody just needs to do what I think they should do.
Speaker 1:So an unhealthy eight would be accused of controlling others, possibly, but I've also heard that eights really it's not controlling others. That's the most important thing. If you're unhealthy, you don't want to be controlled. Exactly OK.
Speaker 2:Yeah, I think for eights it's not about oh, I need to just take responsibility for everyone else. I think for eights it's don't take responsibility for me. And even I was looking at just a little meme on eights the other day and it was Chucky the little doll, Uh-oh, and yeah, it was like his angry face. I guess he may not have any other face but anger, but it was tell an eight what to do and this will be their response. And I find that for me, Don't tell me what to do, or having to just kind of tame that down, Like if I do feel myself bristle up of like, OK, just take a breath, this person has good intentions. It's not that they have ill intentions. But yeah, I find myself resisting people telling me. I remember growing up that hearing a significant difference, at least in my mind, it's better to ask someone than to tell someone. And I thought, oh, I feel that because if someone is telling me that can feel put off fish to me.
Speaker 1:Do eights notice being a bully, do they? Notice that or that. They're maybe like eights, can be a little bit off-putting if they're too aggressive and a little bit unhealthy. The healthy side of eight is not this. But they don't even know.
Speaker 2:Right, I would say even, yeah, moving from that average to unhealthy space to have people in your life that can really be that person that could speak in to your life. You know, I know for me close friends and definitely my husband and my kids too. I just wanna ask them like what is your perspective on that? Hey, how did you sense me in that interaction? A question a friend shared with me years ago was to ask yourself what is it like to be on the other side of me?
Speaker 1:I hate that question.
Speaker 2:I know but that has been so helpful, because I can just go to the extremes where I hold back so much, and again, I think this is where I was conditioned to be a two. So I find myself just always feeling like I have to hold back or trying for some balance, to where I think a lot of times I've really just silenced my voice and so being able to ask that question when I feel like I need to speak up. Okay, what would it be like to be on the other side of me? How can I share what I'm seeing in a way that's respectful?
Speaker 2:But, then also if I'm feeling more emotionally charged up. Okay, what is it like on the other side of me as I might be confronting?
Speaker 1:this person. When you have to tell somebody like a hard truth, is that easier for you? Do you know what I'm? Saying it's like do you know what you just? Did yeah Even if it is, I mean it can be a very positive thing you like because you have that strength, do you all say, hey, damon XYZ, if I asked that question or made that statement and it felt aggressive towards somebody else, I might have some remorse later? Oh, definitely. Do you still feel that?
Speaker 2:Well, and I really get energized. Even if I was right, I mean yeah, yes, I get energized when it's about a conversation and someone's exploring things for themselves, like I think that's where in counseling, it was very life giving for me, as someone was really exploring some things, to be able to share insights with them, because it felt like there was an open invitation. If it's something that has to be more confrontive and this person has no awareness, that's where it can be really exhausting to me to not wanna hurt them.
Speaker 2:And so I have to ask myself the good boundaries question is this going to hurt or is this going to harm them? If I don't share and so being able to nuance that of hey, I've got some feedback to give when would be a good time for us to discuss this, cause you never know? But also not saying yeah, a year from now isn't an option Like when would be a time this week for us to discuss this?
Speaker 1:What is it like when two eights have a conversation, Cause I know what it's like when two nines talk. It's just the best, cause it's chill will yes, well for eights.
Speaker 2:I know at the transforming center retreats that I would go to in Chicago, one on the Enneagram was when we then put all the numbers in groups together and I was leading the eights conversation. And so the night before I felt so vulnerable and I was even questioning am I an eight, am I an eight? And I was like I'm just feeling vulnerable.
Speaker 1:Is it because also, other folks were just very strong willed people. I had no idea how they were gonna be. Yeah, right.
Speaker 2:Yeah, cause that's what I find. I typically feel most vulnerable when I don't know the situation I'm going in. That's really one of the only times I feel vulnerable, and so I went into that conversation, you know, having some questions ready, and I felt so known in that group. It was just like I was with my people.
Speaker 1:Wow.
Speaker 2:And especially, you know, we had male and female eights in the room and I think you know one commonality and I think too, because we were all around the same age, most of the eights really had to come to a place of really peeling back layers to even get to the fact that they were eights like me, yeah, yeah, you know, and I think for me, in the eight space and where it was such a question mark, was because my intensity and that would be a great word to remember for eights eights are just intense, they can be externally intense, where you can feel this energy coming at you. The animal for the eight is the bull.
Speaker 2:So, if you can, imagine a bull coming at me, charging at me, you're probably dealing with an eight, but for me the intensity was always on the inside. There's times it comes out on the external, but from the time I was little just hit the ground running. So, yeah, that intensity was more on the inside. So which brings up a story I wanted to share with you about the eights. So when my son was probably a year or so old, you know, as moms of young children, you're on the floor a lot playing with your kids, and so I just was having horrible issues with my knees and so went to the doctor, had an MRI. The doctor asked me he was like Kelly, what sports have you done? You've got like sports injury knees. And I was like well, I did intramurals I don't know how to count as like a sports injury, and so Parenting.
Speaker 2:Yes, I've been on the floor playing with my kids, but anyway, after just trying some different medicines and things, still horrible, horrible pain. And so my doctor referred me to a physical therapist, and so she had me get on a treadmill and walk for just a couple of minutes. And so she stopped the treadmill and she said okay, I know what's wrong with your knees. And she said you walk with such intensity that you are damaging your knees.
Speaker 1:Really.
Speaker 2:So you may be an eight.
Speaker 1:Wow.
Speaker 2:If your normal gait is creating damage to your knees.
Speaker 1:So when you're walking at home across the floor, everyone can hear you coming, like your mom.
Speaker 2:Yeah, well, my husband will say he can tell my my mood of how I'm walking upstairs. But so I say to the physical therapist well, I can't continue on like this. I said how do we, how do we fix this? And she said it's. It's really an easy fix, which I was so grateful. She put tape on the back of my leg, so cloth tape, and within three days my brain had corrected because I was walking not stiff-legged but like just with intensity, with no bend in my knee, and so that three days of wearing that tape helped my brain to bend.
Speaker 1:Like a military march, I know. So yeah, yeah, which?
Speaker 2:would fit for the eight. So the other thing that the body has let me know that I am an eight is when I've gone to the dentist. I floss too aggressively. That's great, yeah. So you know, if I ever question, if I ever say, damon, I don't know If we have the opposite, where you're like I'm all the numbers and I'm like I don't know if I am Just say, remember your knees.
Speaker 1:And the dentist and the dentist yes.
Speaker 2:Fossing, yeah, I'm sure there's others, but Wow.
Speaker 1:Kelly, this has been extremely informative and I feel like I know you even better now Wow, thank you. And thank you so much for sharing so much about your life and starting this podcast and helping so many people do it. Oh, it's been so fun, I think it took an eight to get it going, that's for sure.
Speaker 2:Yeah Well, the Enneagram has been one of those movements that I've just loved to be a part of, helping people learn more about themselves and others.
Speaker 1:All right. Well, I guess we'll keep going. I guess we'll come back next week. But if you want to tune out next week, it's okay.
Speaker 2:Oh, I cannot wait.
Speaker 1:I can't either. All right everybody. Thanks for joining us on Enneagram. You will see you next time. Bye Kelly, bye Damon.