4 Real
4 Real is a podcast from Dechert LLP exploring the latest trends and developments in commercial real estate finance. Join co-hosts Jon Gaynor and Sam Gilbert every month as they delve into current issues impacting both the legal and business aspects of real estate finance transactions, including lending, securitization and restructuring. Each episode features market commentary and interviews with industry thought leaders, providing listeners with valuable insights and practical advice, plus a little banter along the way.
© 2026 Dechert LLP. All rights reserved. This information should not be considered as legal opinions on specific facts or as a substitute for legal counsel. It is provided by Dechert LLP as a general informational service and may be considered attorney advertising in some jurisdictions.
Episodes
33 episodes
Shifting Gears: The Forces Driving Insurance Risk in Commercial Real Estate
What if the insurance program you thought was protecting your deal is actually what's putting it at risk? In this episode of our 4 Real podcast, hosts Jon Gaynor, Sam Gilbert and Kate Mylod sit down with Emily Rasmussen, President and COO of Re...
Calling Balls and Strikes: Batting it Around with Moody’s Dan Rubock
In this episode of Dechert 4 Real, hosts Jon Gaynor and Sam Gilbert welcome Moody’s Ratings’ SVP and former Dechert lawyer Dan Rubock to the podcast for an in-depth look at his career shaping how the agency evaluates the legal architecture of C...
More Than Data Centers: AI Governance, Liability and the Future of CRE
Artificial intelligence is everywhere, but aren’t the implications for commercial real estate limited to data centers? In this episode, 4 Real hosts Jon Gaynor and Sam Gilbert sit down with Dechert litigation counsel Wilfred T. Beaye, Jr. for t...
Five Key Themes From CREFC Miami 2026
Which CRE discussions energized the record-breaking and decidedly optimistic attendees at this year’s CREFC Conference in Miami? In this special edition of Dechert’s 4 Real podcast, Matt Armstrong, Jon Gaynor, Sam Gilbert, Stewart McQueen and K...
'Tis the Season for Rated Funds
In our final episode for 2025, Dechert 4 Real hosts Jon Gaynor and Sam Gilbert are joined by corporate partner Ross MacConnell for an inside look on rated funds and their intersection with commercial real estate. Plus, we get into the 411 on th...
Giving Thanks for Transitional Lending
In our 28th episode, Dechert 4 Real hosts Jon Gaynor and Kate Mylod sit down with Richard Flohr of CrossHarbor Capital Partners for a discussion on all things transitional lending, including construction financing and Richard’s passion for indu...
Multifamily Bridge Loans, CRE CLOs and Pancake REMICs
What’s driving the robust and very competitive transitional multifamily real estate market? In this episode of 4 Real, hosts Jon Gaynor and Matt Armstrong highlight changes and emerging opportunities in this market with Russell Avery, Managing ...
Parsing Private Credit in Commercial Real Estate With Missy Dolski and Jim Dunbar of Värde Partners
How does fund finance fit into leading investment firms’ broader lending strategies? In this edition of Dechert’s 4 Real podcast, hosts Jon Gaynor and Stewart McQueen sit down with Missy Dolski and Jim Dunbar of Värde Partners to discuss the la...
The Return of Real Estate M&A and Upcoming EDGAR Next Changes
What is driving the uptick in real estate M&A activity? Dechert 4 Real hosts Jon Gaynor and Sam Gilbert sit down with global finance partner Justin Gdula to discuss the mechanics of real estate-backed M&A transactions, the factors that ...
CREFC Countdown: Five Biggest Takeaways From the New York Conference
Has a “bullishly measured” commercial real estate outlook for 2025 become “cautiously fatigued”? Dechert 4 Real’s Matt Armstrong, Jon Gaynor, Stewart McQueen and Kate Mylod rank the 5 biggest takeaways from this year’s CREFC Annual...
Financial Restructuring “Hot Takes” and Legal Practice Origin Stories
Looking for a primer on the top-of-mind terms and topics in bankruptcy matters today? Dechert 4 Real has you covered as hosts Jon Gaynor and Kate Mylod sit down with David Herman, partner in Dechert’s financial restructuring group, to highlight...
CMBS Servicing Sitdown With Trimont’s Cindy Barreda and Leslie Hayton
Recording for the first time in Dechert’s Charlotte office, 4 Real’s Jon Gaynor, Sam Gilbert and Ella Smith invite Trimont Chief of Staff Cindy Barreda and Senior Managing Director Leslie Hayton to the pod to discuss Trimont’s recent acquisitio...
Springing Into Real Estate Debt Funds, EDGAR Next, Corporate Transparency Act Updates and Surprising Sports
Spring is in the air as Dechert 4 Real’s Jon Gaynor, Ella Smith and Sam Gilbert take a fresh look at the world of real estate debt funds with Dechert financial services partner Gerry Brown, discussing market trends, the benefits of evergreen fu...
Top Five CREFC Takeaways and a “Bullishly Measured” 2025 Outlook
Listen to the top five biggest takeaways from the CREFC annual conference in Miami on our first episode of 2025 with Dechert 4 Real Podcast co-host Jon Gaynor and producers Matt Armstrong, Kate Mylod and Stewart McQueen (who also co-chai...
The Download on Data Centers, U.S. Election Ripple Effects and Disney Vacations
Dechert 4 Real hosts Jon Gaynor, Ella Smith and Sam Gilbert sit down with Dechert finance & real estate partner Justin Gdula to discuss the latest trends in data center deals, real estate M&A activity and Canadian CMBS. Plus, Dechert pa...
How Climate Change, AI and Office Challenges Are Impacting CMBS With Erin Stafford From Morningstar DBRS
What is the current state of commercial mortgage-backed security, or CMBS? Dechert 4 Real hosts Jon Gaynor, Ella Smith and Sam Gilbert invite the managing director and head of North American CMBS ratings activity at Morningstar DBR...
Navigating NAV and National Security in Commercial Real Estate with Ani Ravi and Hrishi Hari
Dechert global finance partner Ani Ravi joins Dechert 4 Real hosts Jon Gaynor, Ella Smith and Sam Gilbert for an informative discussion about the relationship between NAV facilities, subscription lines and repo financing, the evolving nature an...
Forecasting Year-End Commercial Real Estate and Driving Forklifts Through the Office
Dechert 4 Real hosts Jon Gaynor, Ella Smith and Sam Gilbert are joined by Barclays Head of CMBS Research Lea Overby to discuss commercial real estate trends we can expect in the second half of 2024, floating rate debt risk, lessons learned from...
Rolling into Summer with CREFC Roulette and the Biggest Takeaways from the June Conference
Dechert’s Jon Gaynor, Kate Mylod, Stewart McQueen and Matt Armstrong dive into the biggest conversations coming out of the 2024 CREFC Annual Conference in New York, including return-to-office trends, the “acceptance of reality” in the commercia...
Analyzing Agency CMBS with Leah Nivison and Tipping the Scales on Fish Jokes
Hosts Jon Gaynor, Ella Smith and Sam Gilbert welcome BMO Capital Markets Managing Director Leah Nivison to discuss recent trends in the agency commercial mortgage-backed securities (CMBS) market, the importance of mentorship in the commercial r...
Putting the Fun in Fund Formation, Climate Disclosure Rule Developments and Springtime Banter
In this episode of Dechert 4 Real, hosts Jon Gaynor, Ella Smith and Sam Gilbert are joined by partner Lindsay Trapp, who breaks down the intricacies of the structuring and formation of complex credit private funds, rated feeder and parallel fun...
CRE CLO Delinquencies, Unconstitutional CTA, Single-Family Rental (SFR) Financing and What Happens in Vegas...
What impact do high interest rates and appreciating home values have on single-family rentals? In this episode of our 4 Real podcast, our hosts Jon Gaynor, Ella-Marie Smith and Sam Gilbert join Dechert partner Ken Hackman to discuss the popular...
NPLs and Dolphins, the Proposed Basel III Endgame and Introducing Our Pets
In our latest episode, hosts Jon Gaynor, Ella-Marie Smith and Sam Gilbert are joined by Dechert partners Laura Swihart and Matthew Fischer to discuss non-performing loan securitizations (NPLs) and the unexpect...
CREFC Roulette Resolutions, Shaq Quotes and Conference Clichés
In our first episode of 2024, co-host Jon Gaynor and producers Matt Armstrong, Stewart McQueen and Kate Mylod play a round of CREFC Roulette following the Council’s annual January conference in Miami. Topics include ...
4ward Legal Thinking, CRE Industry Updates and Festive Holiday Traditions
In this episode of the Dechert 4 Real podcast, hosts Jon Gaynor, Sam Gilbert and Ella-Marie Smith share their predictions on trends and upcoming regulatory changes expected to drive commercial real estate industry developme...