The Retail Journey
Welcome to the Retail Journey where we will cover important topics, interview industry stakeholders, and address emerging trends as we journey through our mission of helping our listeners thrive in retail. Your hosts for this show are CEO James Harris and CGO Charles Greathouse.
The Retail Journey
Pride, Purpose, and Production: How Raj Group Balances Technology with Tradition
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What happens when the keen eye of a museologist meets the ancient craft of rug-making? The answer lies in the remarkable journey of Shailen Smith, CEO of Raj Group, a heritage brand with roots stretching back to 1939 in the historic city of Panipat, India.
"When an archaeologist's job is over, the museologist's job begins," explains Smith, whose unique background brought fresh perspective to a centuries-old craft. Initially arriving to document weaving as an artistic practice, Smith discovered a company at a crossroads – torn between preserving handcrafted traditions and embracing modern technology. Rather than choosing sides, she pioneered a third path: using technology to enhance craftsmanship without replacing it.
This delicate balance between heritage and innovation forms the cornerstone of Raj's identity today. "If we are to stay unique, there must be that perfect balance where handcrafted is aided by technology," Smith reflects. This philosophy extends beyond production to encompass everything from sustainability practices to leadership style. The company demonstrated its commitment to its artisans during COVID by maintaining its entire workforce despite production slowdowns – recognizing that their people aren't just employees but guardians of cultural heritage.
As one of few female CEOs in a deeply patriarchal region, Smith brings a distinctive leadership approach that blends strength with empathy. Raised by her father "as a neutral gender" with focus on inherent strengths rather than societal expectations, she navigates traditional business structures while championing greater opportunities for women throughout the organization.
Smith's observations about today's consumers resonate deeply: we're experiencing a revolution in home goods similar to what happened in beauty – questioning artificial standards and returning to authenticity. "We've been feeding consumers something unnatural," she notes, as more people seek products with meaningful stories, sustainable materials, and ethical production.
Discover how this heritage brand stays rooted in tradition while confidently embracing the future. As Smith puts it, "If you know what your roots are, you will move forward without doubt, and you will thrive and survive."
Hello and welcome to the Retail Journey podcast. I'm one of your hosts, charles Greathouse, and.
Speaker 2I'm one of your hosts as well. I'm James Harris, and today we are talking to Shailen Smith. Shailen is the CEO of Raj Group, and Raj is a heritage brand established in 1939 in Panipat, India, specializing in carpets, rugs and other floor coverings. Thank you so much for joining us, Shailen.
Speaker 3Thank you so much, James and Charles. I think it's both an honor and a pleasure to be part of this podcast, and thank you so much for thinking of me and including me here.
Speaker 1Absolutely yeah. You're our first guest to travel, you know, across an entire ocean just for the podcast here in Bentonville. What a treat. No, but welcome to Bentonville. I know you just arrived for this trip. I hope you get to enjoy, you know, the wonderful place that is Bentonville, arkansas, and get to see some things while you're here, crystal Bridges being one of those. That will be fun, especially given some of your background, which I'd love to share with our listeners, because your journey to retail was a little bit less traditional.
Speaker 3Absolutely, I think I'm really looking forward to exploring this city and seeing a little more of it. Definitely, I think I'm looking forward to the museum walkthrough in particular, because I believe there's a beautiful collection there and it's also pretty close to how I feel about knowing and understanding a culture and a space is really through a museum. It has a lot to do with the background and where I'm coming from. I'm a trained museologist and I specialized in museum sciences. If I were to simply explain it, you know, when an archaeologist's job is over, the museologist's job begins.
From Museology to Manufacturing
Speaker 3Ah, I like that, so the moment the artifact is pulled out of the ground, it's really the job of a museologist to give it both context as well as give it content and give it a new home, so that whoever is then interacting with the artifact really knows where it's coming from. And that's how my journey really started with Raj is because you know, there was something beautiful in Handcrafted that was sitting there in Panipat, but in order to give it context and some content, I think there was a lot of theorization that was missing over there, and I think that's where I really came in to bring in theory into that practical form of craftsmanship, which was weaving, and as I started the journey, it was purely about documenting weaving as a craft and finding a new definition for it for it to go down into posterity, because India was at that turn, at that point, where either it was handcrafted or it was technology infused manufacturing. And I came in at a really interesting time where I think the company at that point was introspecting on what their journey should be Should they continue with the handcrafted journey or should they infuse technology? And if they do, how relevant would either or be in terms of its survival?
Speaker 3And as a museologist, I came in and saw it very differently. I wasn't part of the business. I wasn't looking at it as a monetary operation. I was looking at more as an artistic space and I really started bringing the craft forward in unique ways, bringing artists to work on the factory floor. Do an artist in residence really find a new definition for every process that we were doing? And then eventually I stayed on, learned a little more about the business and I'm still there.
Speaker 1Turns out pretty good at understanding the business, figuring out how to grow and, in this kind of space, being able to inspire a customer in a pretty rapid way. And then you know, from afar being inspired is one thing and then as you get closer, the better you know texture, the better depth of artistry within the product really reveals itself. Depth of artistry within the product really reveals itself and that's what I've been most impressed with with Raj.
Speaker 2You know, overall, as we've gotten to know each other, and from some of our first conversations going back almost a year now, you've been very consistent that the work is art and you've been very consistent on the value of the people that are making that art. I believe you shared with us that through COVID, even when production slowed down quite a bit because of demand and the illness that you kept your entire staff on factory floor included. Just that stood out to me as really valuing the people that make the product that you're putting into the marketplace.
Speaker 3You know, james. I think it's very important for any company to understand what their roots are. I think if you know what your roots are, you will move forward into the future without doubt, and you will thrive and survive. And I think this is where we've been a little successful is focusing on our roots, really understanding where we come from and who we are. So where we come from is obviously the region. The region has a great history Historically.
Speaker 3The city of Panipat in ancient and medieval India has played a very pivotal role in shaping the geographical map that we see today of India. Really, india was just the bottom half of the subcontinent. It was really with the invasions and different rulers coming in, and Panipat being that massive battlefield where three very, very foundational wars were fought, that you see the geographical map of India today, the way it is and how it has been formed. Of course, there have been other reasons also why that geographical map has been formed, but the Battles of Panipat were really the three very foundational, I think, time periods in India's history. That really has set that geographical space as it is visible today. But, having said that, it also became a region for a lot of people to find purpose, to move forward back and forth between the north and south of India, and that's where Panipat developed as a region for craftsmen, for herders, and it became a center for both. It became a center for herders to come in and flock their sheep, it became a center for weavers to take all the wool that was coming from there and to find purpose for it, and it became a center for weaving. And when we look at that, it's very easy for us to say that's. One of the key foundations of Raj is the fact that weavers for generations have made this place their home and built a certain expertise that you will not find across any other place in India, but also anywhere across the world. And this is, I think, where the background in museology comes in, when it tries to look at something with a very, very deep and a keen eye to see where that history and that legacy is coming from. I think that's really helped me put, I think, thought to this being one of the very key foundations of the company. I do have to give it to the family, though. The family has been very instrumental in protecting its people, ensuring they give back in whatever way they can to the community, but I think they were coming more from a place of philanthropy.
Speaker 3I think where I'm coming is more a place from protection of artistry, protection of craftsmanship, protection of a legacy, and then, of course, the other part of it is that we are dependent on the craft, for sure, but we're dependent on the people who make that craft. We're dependent on those hands, we're dependent on all those families who put their trust into bringing themselves there, setting up home there, and we must understand that India is an agricultural economy, even till date. Everyone has and owns a piece of land, everyone cultivates that piece of land, and there is a season in India where you'll find very, very less labor on the factory floor, very less workforce on the factory floor, because they've all gone back home to harvest the crop that they've cultivated and we are still so dependent on that entire agricultural aspect of our economy. But at the same time, we're also developing all these other skill sets, and definitely handcrafted artisanal has been one of those key developments that we've seen over the years.
Speaker 3So I think the fact that we were very clear as to what our foundation is and was is what has helped us along the way, james, where I think it was just organic that, given a real crisis, given a time like COVID, we had no choice but to ensure that we protected our people, because they were there for survival. But they were there for a different kind of a survival. They were not there for a survival to be through COVID. They were there for the survival of mankind in general, at a time when none of us knew what the future is going to hold. We didn't know if any of us, any of us, would survive, but we also didn't know if the industry would survive and we just had to hold our head up high and walk through that time. The fact that we had a lot of support from local administration, coming to the factory floor, setting up small little clinics within the factory, administering the vaccine to everyone not once but thrice, I think, was massive support for us to continue with the confidence that we were able to carry through.
Speaker 2That's excellent. We've spoken some about Ponipat. Ponipat. I'm sorry, I'm trying to pronounce it correctly.
Speaker 3Ponipat, that's.
Speaker 2I'm sorry, I'm trying to pronounce it correctly panipat like that. That's correct. Well, india in general. You know there's a lot of discussion around india. There's obviously been um a tremendous amount of manufacturing base being built up across the enormous country. Um what, what kind of sets india as a manufacturing partner, as a country?
Speaker 3That's a very deep question, james, and I'll tell you why. For an economist, it would be on the periphery and everyone would talk about investment and everyone would talk about the way the administration is looking at the growth of the economy. But I understand it very differently. You know, we've been independent as a country only for not even a century, yet a little less than a century, and I think what has been ripped off this country has been pride. Whenever we've had somebody rule us, the first thing they've done is they've ripped the pride off us, and I think that's largely why India could not progress and grow as an economy.
Speaker 3India could not progress and grow in various industries was because we had no sense of pride. We were not proud of what we were doing, and I must give it to the past 15 years, and I'm not pro anyone, I'm pro progress. So anyone who brings progress, I'm on their side and I think for me this government brings progress from a very different perspective. It has brought progress with first instilling a sense of pride. No-transcript, they're willing to invest back in it monetarily and the moment we've done that, the whole world is looking at us today, the whole world is looking at us as unique. The whole world is looking at us as us bringing something completely different to the table.
Speaker 2As a powerhouse.
Speaker 3And as a powerhouse. Now, today, because that's what we've been working on is in reinstilling that sense of pride, and I'm actually I'm a little proud to say that, James, this is also something that, when I joined Raj, and with a very different agenda, I think the first thing that we said was that we want to instill a sense of pride in what our craftspeople do, and the best way to do it was to bring somebody from the outside to come back onto the factory floor and say you do something really unique. So when an artist would interact with a craftsperson and say you are doing something so beautiful and unique, it automatically instilled a sense of pride. And if I were to use that as an example today, I think that's exactly what we are doing as a country is bringing in people from different walks of life, from different industries and showing the best that we have, and when they talk about our uniqueness, it automatically, I think it allows us to introspect, to sort of, to look within and really feel that sense of pride, and I think that's what's reflecting itself as India emerging into this powerhouse.
Speaker 3We've always had these values, james, and we've had these capabilities, but unfortunately, we never looked within. We were always dependent on somebody else telling us what we could do. It comes a lot with being ruled, I think, for centuries and decades, but today, as we independently walk through it's, it's something that we're doing ourselves and because it's something that we're doing ourselves, we're able to open our doors for investment. We're able to open our doors for investment, we're able to open our doors for growth. And the most interesting part, james, is that while we are looking at external sources of investment, we've also become a country that is looking at reinvesting its profits back into our own personal growth. And if I were to equate that, today, raj is a company where our profits are not measured by. Our profits are not measured by a percentage or a margin. Our profits are measured by what are we doing to bring growth back into the organization. Are we adding more technology? Are we expanding category? Are we acquiring new buildings to expand certain manufacturing capabilities?
Speaker 3We run our own processes in-house. So we're a complete vertical organization where just the fiber comes in and we process all that fiber we spin, we dye, we weave, we of course finish and package and dispatch our final product. But we're looking at re. We're re-looking at all the processes to see how can we improve them better? How can we bring in technology to aid all those processes? That's true, yes Is when you can reinvest back in yourself to make yourself more efficient, to, to to, I would say, to improve the way your daily operations are and to aid yourself to. To just go into a space of category expansion, not being just a manufacturer of rugs, but being a manufacturer of pillows, being a manufacturer of throws, being a manufacturer of top of bed, taking a machinery that weaves rugs and re the country at large. That's also one of the reasons why we are emerging into a powerhouse today.
Speaker 2And speaking of your rugs, at least in our wide shot we're using one of them today.
Speaker 3Absolutely. It's a moment of pride to be able to sit here as Charles said, traveling across, you know, an entire sort of a couple of continents, an entire ocean to be here today for this podcast, but also to be able to sit here with the product at our feet at the same time and for it to be featured in the podcast as well. I think that's also a sense of pride that I hold Excellent.
Balancing Heritage and Technology
Speaker 1Excellent. Yeah, a little insider info the pillows are also a Raj product that we've had on set for several of these. When I got to visit the facilities in Potty Pot this past summer, the showroom absolutely blew me away and I felt like that was going to be the most impressive thing. And then I saw a weaver weaving with such expertise, grace, efficiency. It was like wow, this is an incredible feat to be able to accomplish the things that are accomplished in this manufacturing, and I love how you talked about heritage as well as innovation, bringing technology while not losing sight of heritage. I'd love for you to elaborate, as a manufacturer, what it looks like to both protect heritage as well as make the progress that's necessary to compete in an increasingly competitive environment.
Speaker 3I can tell you, charles, it's a very difficult job to balance the two, because heritage demands patronization, and patronization demands funding, and technology cannibalizes on heritage, for certain, because it is so efficient, it is so quick, it's so easy and definitely it's. It definitely produces a product that's less expensive that it it's. It's always a question as to what do you go with. Do you go with heritage or do you go with technology? Like I said in the beginning, the fact that we've invested ourselves in knowing our roots and where our foundation lies has really helped us to circumnavigate times where we've been always challenged for product pricing, always challenged for a more conscious price product, always challenged by retailers to give them a better deal, and we've been able to put our product that is handmade and artisanal in front of them and push them back to select a perfect balance between the two. A product that's aided by technology, but also a product that's truly handcrafted has really been a mantra, so to say, if I were to call it that, because that's the only way to go, that's the only way to stay unique, that's the only way for Raj to not be like every other manufacturer, that's the only way for Raj to ensure that it's part of a heritage and a legacy that cannot be aped by or followed by anyone else. I think if we are to stay unique, there has to be that perfect balance that we create for ourselves where handcrafted is aided by technology. Technology brings in efficiency into the processes that handcrafted has, but never cannibalizes on. It never becomes the center of our agenda.
Speaker 3It obviously is extremely easy for us to move away from artisanal into technology at a time where labor is challenged, at a time where handcrafted is challenged, at a time when everyone's looking um at being uh, at a time when economy in general is challenged, and it's really simple and easy to make a decision in favor of technology and to move away from all the challenges that handcrafted brings and artisanal brings. Because, as as beautiful as it sounds, it's also people management. At the end of the day, you're looking at a migratory community. You're looking at changing times. You're looking at legacy changing. It's not necessarily being passed down from generation to generation. It's now being passed down from who's better at the skill and who's willing to learn the skill to come back onto the factory floor and weave the product and be part of the entire process of handcrafted.
Speaker 3So the real challenge, I think, charles, over here, is to be level-headed and maintain the balance, to keep going back to your roots and keep going back to foundation to say what is it that we truly stand for? Are we going to be that company that is going to allow technology to take over something that's unique? Are we going to go the age-old process and continue being handcrafted, but not improve our processes and bring in technology to help us there? So I think the perfect answer over there is balance and balancing ourselves in a way that we still stay unique even if we bring in technology, and we are not superseded, uh, by being age old, by just depending on handcrafted, and ensuring that we have the two to balance each other yeah, I love that.
Speaker 1Yeah, from a customer point of view, being able to access something that's unique is uh can be a challenge for a lot of customers who can't afford or don't quite understand the value of what they would be able to acquire. You know, walmart tends to serve this need very often. At the same time, the bitterness of poor quality will always outlast the sweetness of a good deal, and so the balance of quality and value is one that every merchant fights aggressively on behalf of the customer to go insert as much value as possible. Some find themselves a bit short-sighted on simple price, but at the end of the day, the customer will vote with the like hey, I bought this thing, it was very cheap and yes, it was very cheap, and I'm not doing that again. You don't make that mistake so many times, I'd love With online reviews you can't afford to.
Speaker 1Yeah, Online reviews are one way that that shows up. The dollars certainly are the thing that last as far as I'm not going to buy this category even and Walmart's on a journey to deepen trust with customers as they expand into categories that they've touched in but are making a bit more of a foothold, especially across the home area, and so I'd love to hear your I don't know counsel to those that are fighting on behalf of the customer, want to bring heritage. You know there's a certain set of customers that understand true heritage and would never want anything that wasn't truly all the way handcrafted. And there's the others that love that sort of inspiration. And I recall across your showroom, you know, here's one that's like a hundred percent, all of the things are artisanal, and then here's how we make that more affordable as well. But, yeah, I'd love to hear your sort of counsel for those across retail that are trying to fight that balance of value as well as uniqueness.
Speaker 3Charles, I think the key word here is understanding. When you put that question out there for me, you said that the customer does not understand the product. I think that's the key word. There is what we fed the customer with. We must understand that advertising, manufacturing all of them play a very key role in customer choices. A customer does not know what's out there until somebody packages that and tells them what's available for them to buy off the shelves, or what's good for their homes, what's good for their personal health needs, what's great for their skin, what's good for their hair.
Speaker 3It's pretty much like the beauty industry went through a revolution where everyone was talking about a perfect body type, everyone was talking about a perfect skin type, everyone was talking about a particular hair type, and suddenly the entire beauty industry was revolutionized when someone said who is making these beauty standards and why are they making these beauty standards? Is it to sell a product or is it what human beings are framed out to be? And if you look at human beings from across the world, we're all so different. We could be from the same home and yet we'd all be so unique looking, the same DNA, but yet so different, right, and I think that's exactly how we're looking at the entire industry for home today. We're looking at what is selling and why have we been selling this? Why have we been feeding our consumers with something that is so unnatural, that is so plastic? In many ways we're talking about conscious manufacturing, we're talking about sustainability, but these are not customer choices. The consumer has never known any better because that's all they've been fed with. So if we are to talk about understanding, we are to talk about education and we are to talk about the right choices. I think it's something collective that we had to do. You know, india today is emerging as an industry, as a manufacturing industry, to support the needs of consumers and brands across.
Speaker 3But we weren't ready about a decade plus back. We weren also ill-equipped back then to participate in this whole requirement and the need that home had in general. And there were other regions who were willing and participative and out there they were not able to give a handcrafted product, but they were able to give a beautiful, cheap, machine-made product that serviced the needs back then. True that the consumer has had enough of that. True that the consumer is questioning everything. But the consumer is questioning everything because brands are questioning everything. Manufacturers are questioning everything. Manufacturers are there to say that there's something else for you. You don't have to necessarily rely on this. So I think we're at that place of of I think a revolution as far as home is concerned, exactly how we were at a place of revolution where beauty standards and the fashion industry was concerned. And I think, uh, charles, when we put a product out there, that's better, not in terms of value for money, but better because it is better to the environment, it's better to the process and it's better to the storyline, then automatically the consumer will get used to it and will want to have it.
Values and Sustainability at Raj
Speaker 3You know, everyone is looking at an experience today because we've had everything else other than an experience. I think, as a human race, we've focused on everything other than the experience itself. So people are turning towards spirituality. People are turning towards finding new purpose in life. People are turning towards better relationships. People are questioning anything that does not make them happy or comfortable, creates a sense of anxiety in them. People are questioning that in general and they're looking for a better experience. And that People are questioning that in general and they're looking for a better experience.
Speaker 3And that's where home's coming in. We're looking at something that has a story behind it. We're looking at a softer hand feel, we're looking at material that is conscious, that is not polluting the environment, and I think as we pivot and move towards there, charles and I think as we pivot and move towards there, charles we have half the battle won for us already. The other half has to be. I think the other half has to be won with understanding. The other half has to be won with education. The other half has to be won with a storyline, and a storyline that's not just made for advertising, a storyline that has true meaning to it.
Speaker 3So I think that's where you know, charles, I think it is our responsibility as a manufacturer to really shed light on the story behind the product and what it brings to the table, when it's not just made, but even in terms of its life and how that life ends as a cycle and how that life ends as a cycle.
Speaker 3If that life ends as a cycle with polluting the environment and causing harm to everything around us, we all don't want that product as well, even if it's beautifully handcrafted, it should have a meaningful purpose to it in its end journey, as it should have a meaningful purpose to it in the beginning of its journey.
Speaker 3So I think that other responsibility lies on the manufacturer to bring something unique to the brand, to give that perfect balance. Like I said, if you use technology to aid the process of handcrafted, you've already brought some sense of efficiency to it, which automatically, I think, supports the challenges that price have today. But I feel even this is part of that whole cycle. The economy will go up and the economy will go down, there will be supply, there will be demand, and I think you just have to wade through every challenge that comes along your way to ensure that you stand your ground. Keep portraying what you bring to the table. In the case of Raj, we'll keep working on the story of Handcrafted. We'll keep trying to make the product more efficient so that it meets certain price challenges not all price challenges. It cannot ape another region. We cannot be as efficient as a machine made, but we can definitely be the best version of ourselves.
Speaker 1Yeah Well, and the authenticity of a product that was good for the environment, good for the people that made it, as well as good for those that are going to put it in their home for, you know, hopefully, decades. I believe that the transparency of the reality of cheap goods, that bitterness of something that doesn't last, is far more known today than it was, you know, 15, 10 years ago, and I see the customer moving in the direction of I don't actually want, you know, as a pillow, a pillow that's going to last six months in fine condition, nine inadequate, and then from there sort of uh level of quality in my home. I'd rather have something that I know I'll be able to stand behind.
Speaker 2yeah, something of value yeah, so you've spoken, uh, about some of the, I would say, values of raj and undoubtedly yourself of sustainability, really valuing the craft and the art and the people and the hands that make it. What other values really drive you personally and Raj as an organization?
Speaker 3Personally, you know, james, I think the value that drives me every day and that keeps me grounded is that, you know, I always I'm a believer. I believe that there is a higher power that drives all of us. I think submitting yourself to the higher power and ensuring that you're open to the right energy every single day, I think is extremely important. It's something that keeps you grounded, it's something that keeps you level-headed and it's something that really circumnavigates through all the anxieties that one can have through the entire day, personal or professional. So I think, for me, that's what drives me is definitely the belief in the presence of a higher power, something that I can submit to and ensure that I'm the best version of myself every single day.
Speaker 3Um and for Raj, I think it's the same Raj submits itself to the process, uh to the people, and definitely uh submits itself to whatever it's done to the environment, for decades of manufacturing is trying to undo it in whatever way possible.
Speaker 3So, if it means investing in better sources of energy, if it means cleaning the water that we consume for all our wet processes, if it means repurposing water bodies in and around Panipat that have dried up at their source, if it means tree plantation, if it means investment in sustainable material and a sustainable supply chain, no matter how much that burdens us every single day and it's such a difficult journey to walk the path of sustainability.
Speaker 3I always say sustainability requires one investment and that investment is not resources, that investment is intent, because only if you have the intent can you circumnavigate all the challenges that you'll have with walking the line of sustainability. Because it is such a resource investment process it is absolutely every single day. It is a true challenge to be able to walk that path. So I think Raj, as a company, submits itself every single day to the process, to the people and to the planet, and through that submission, I think that's what takes us forward, that's also our future vision, that's what we also speak about continuously as far as our goals and our vision is and as far as our foundation is. So really, that submission, I think, on a personal level and that submission as far as the company is concerned, I think submission is very important in today's time because I think that's what leaves you open to everything that happens and everything that is a challenge every single day.
Speaker 2That's well said. So you talk about your business and the industry as a whole in really a unique way, and I feel like you're coming at your CEO role from your femaleness in a way that is very unique, and I'm sorry if I'm not saying that well, but as a woman, how important is that in India, on the factory floor, for the CEO to be you?
Speaker 3You know, it's a really funny anecdote. Just the other day Sumit, the managing partner of Raj, turned around and told somebody she's much more of a man than any of us. So the fact that you say my being a woman and my being a woman, CEO, just the thoughtfulness with which you've approached.
Speaker 2this is what I mean.
Speaker 3Well, you know honestly, james, it is an extremely difficult place to be at and it's been a challenge every single day because the region that we are a part of is a deep-rooted patriarchal region. For a man to take instructions from a woman is unheard of and unthought of, because they've really that part of the country. The man is really the bread earner, the decision maker, the be all and the end all of an entire family unit. And families in India are not nuclear four or five member families. Families in India are 10, 15, 20, 25 member families, extended families that literally report to one patriarch who's the decision maker. So for that region really to respond to female leadership, to a woman and, I think, to be able to follow up, follow the path set by a woman, is only met with resilience, because that's not something that they've been brought up with or they understand.
Speaker 3I think for me what's been really helpful is that my father really brought me up as a neutral gender. My father never really brought me up as a woman, but never really brought me up as a boy. He always brought me up as somebody who had inherently certain strengths, and I think I was always. That's something that I always recognize myself with is strengths, not as a gender, to be honest, and I think that's really what helped me in this role is also for me to really blend in with this group of very strong Indian patriarchs. Find my path and find my way was only a journey that I think I was able to undertake Because all my life I had an upbringing of being a very neutral individual in terms of skill sets are concerned and skill strengths are concerned. And if I were to look at it any other way, james, it was also easier for me. It was easier for me because I was able to see both sides. I was able to read them for what they are and who they are, maybe because of the little background of history, uh, geopolitics that I understood from you know, my background, education uh, I was able to understand where the men were coming from and where that patriarchy was so deep-rooted and coming from. And then I was able to obviously use the feminine part of my gender to kind of probably soften certain aspects of how we operate, how we run the organization, how we look at ourselves. I was also able to use that part, I think, to rebrand ourselves in many ways For years, I think that company was being run by only men, and here I must give credit to Sumit, because I think Sumit has been very instrumental in allowing me to have my own path, allowing me to, I think, see things in a different way, allowing me to redefine a lot of things that were essentially set in tone by his family.
Speaker 3It's a family-owned business and I think that uniqueness of flexibility that he has as an individual has paid well off for him, because it's allowed me to really create a new path, a path that's less resilient, a path that's more open, but a path that's also modern and has its own definition. Because if I were to look at family-owned businesses and legacy in general in India, they're very, very typical and set in their own ways and rigid in many ways rigid to change, rigid to evolution, rigid to new ways of thinking. I would say and I think that's those are the areas that I feel James have able to been able to bring in is a sense of difference because, um, because the company has been open to it, uh, the managing partner and sumit have been open to it I've been able to bring that, that difference, in. I've been able to bring a different, uh, way of running the organization, new definition for how we see handcrafted and the journey at large. So I think less to do with the fact that I was, that I am a woman, not was.
Speaker 3I almost forgot that yeah, that I am a woman, but I think more to do with James. The way I was brought up as a child by my father, that has really, I think, aided me in this leadership role that I have as the CEO of the company.
Speaker 2That's a really beautiful story. I can only hope that I'm bringing up my daughter in a similar manner.
Speaker 3Well, I think all fathers and daughters have a really unique relationship where the father brings in, I think, the male gender of understanding life and the daughter brings in the female gender of understanding life, and when both the father and daughter share a beautiful relationship, this understanding crosses over and really leads to the evolution of a very strong woman.
Speaker 3So I feel blessed that I have a father who is participative in my upbringing, who's participative in my upbringing, and I'm sure every father who's participative in the upbringing of his daughter is doing something so unique and beautiful for a future generation.
Speaker 3And here is where I would want to plug in a little bit more is our agenda at Raj?
Speaker 3Number one, of course, that the company is led by a woman, but also for us to have more women being part of the factory, more women being part of operations factory, more women being part of operations, not at the administrative level, but really on the shop floor, on the factory floor, walking shoulder to shoulder with men on a lot of male driven processes is a really important part of our journey, james, because the woman is the heart of the family and if the heart turns and changes, it sets trend for the next generation to be very, very open and unique in their way of thinking.
Speaker 3And if we are to break barriers in general, the women have to be stronger in their approach, have to be stronger in their approach. So you know, while we're talking about the whole beautiful father-daughter relationship and bringing women, bringing up girls to be these wonderful independent women, I think, at the same time, the existing group of women that we have, if there's a little bit of a push, and especially at the region that we come from in Panipat, if there's a little push to aid them in their sense of independent thinking and belief, little push to aid them in their sense of independent thinking and belief, it automatically changes the entire family structure that currently exists for us to be able to help a generation, a new generation of individual thinkers expectations and how they respond to this whole understanding of patriarchy at large.
Speaker 1on to this whole understanding of patriarchy at large. It's beautiful and, having been and seen your leadership as well as the team at large operate the beauty of this sort of diversity of thought and execution is a very holistic team, very intentional movement across everyone and a tremendous amount of respect across the team Really enjoyed seeing it and have incredibly high hopes for how Raj will continue to innovate and bring depth to every product that you guys create.
Speaker 3I appreciate that, charles.
Speaker 3You know, we're only as good as the partnership that supports us, only as good as the partnership that supports us.
Speaker 3Here I'd like to give a little bit of a pivot and say that you know, when we have a partnership like High Impact, who is willing to invest in our belief and support us, I think those partnerships really matter because that's the symbiotic relationship that can really make a manufacturer who's sitting in some part of India successful in a totally different part of the world where they would be completely unknown, their process would be completely unknown.
Speaker 3I think to be able to carry that story and that journey forward, charles, to be able to recognize it you've made just one trip to Panipat but to be able to have the good sense and understanding to absorb all of that on the factory floor, I think is unique in itself. So I think the organization here, the fact that you're able to look at manufacturers as unique as they are, to be able to literally cherry pick them, I would say, in so many ways and represent them, I think is also unique and very interesting. And to give a platform like that for us to express ourselves, for example, to have me today on a podcast and really talk in depth about who we are, what we do, why we are here and what makes us so relevant is also very unique, james.
Speaker 2We're honored that you've entrusted us with a portion of your business here in Bentonville, Arkansas, and definitely honored that you joined us today.
Speaker 3I think it's both ways likewise.
Speaker 1We have a lightning round which is how we tend to wrap it up which gets into a couple of questions in somewhat rapid succession. So first one is kind of it's not meant to be a zinger, but we love talking about failure. We love talking about where and how we failed in big, perhaps fun stories to tell ways and how we learn. So what's some of the biggest failure story that you've experienced in this journey of retail?
Failures, Lessons, and Future Vision
Speaker 3Well, charles, every time I think it's the biggest failure. There's something right around the corner. That's a bigger failure. That's waiting to define itself and prove that it's bigger than the other An expanding pie. We are faced with failure every single day.
Speaker 3And in my initial journey, I always thought that there could be no bigger failure than the current situation that I was in, and then there would be something else, but it would always have a learning curve to it.
Speaker 3We would always get better at what we were and where we stood.
Speaker 3I think the recent and the biggest failure that I would attribute to the company and to the organization it's actually a really funny story is, while others would look at it as an opportunity, I looked at it as a failure when we actually were approached by a certain business to support them and to manufacture for them, because I felt that we could have done better and because we were at a position where, you know, we were pressed against certain financial conditions, we were pressed against manufacturing not being adequate and we had to sustain and support the entire team on ground is we had to accept that brand and we had to accept the manufacturing for them and in some ways, go down a little on our values, on our set values, and that, for me, is a big failure is that you had to compromise a bit of your values to take on a manufacturer, to take on a brand, to manufacture for them, because you had to keep yourself, sustain yourself every single day to move forward.
Speaker 3I think those for me, unfortunately, charles are bigger failures than failing at a production delivery, failing at a quality standard, failing at um commitments made, um in terms of sampling, failing on you know a what do you say? One of our factories shutting down, failing on purchase of machinery that didn't work in our favor, and we've lost some financials over there. So I think those failures really are lesser failures. The failures for me are when you have to let go of your values and bring in someone because there isn't anything better that you could think of.
Speaker 1And interesting, as all of them learn to pretty rapid learning and then progress as we learn from them and realize, yep, not going to do that again.
Speaker 3So I'm pretty sure that in the next couple of years we're going to say goodbye to that brand and move forward.
Speaker 1Yeah, yeah, I think we've all, we've all been there in different ways and shapes and forms in the last year.
Speaker 2What's, uh, what's been?
Speaker 3just one thing that stood out to you as like a revelation or learning um that you've incorporated you know, james, we went through a little bit of a curve last year and I really thought that we couldn't overcome it and this was a personal challenge that the company had Unfortunately, I'm not privy to detail it over here on this podcast and I really felt that we couldn't come through and I felt that that would break us. But actually it actually strengthened us and made us introspect, look at our own processes and find a new way of reinventing and running ourselves, and that, honestly, has given me so much strength as a leadership, as a leader after that, it's added so much to my leadership role. It's added so much to my leadership role, it's added so much to Sumit's leadership role that it's literally put us on a path of growth and at an express rate, what we would have thought would be our vision for the next five years has actually been our vision over a year.
Speaker 3So, that has been a really interesting event that happened to the company, which brought us all down, personally and as a company, but also pushed us all right back on our feet.
Speaker 2Amazing how that works.
Speaker 1Yeah, I love that. All right, and last one what's something you're reading lately and if it's reading or podcasts, what's some content you're consuming that you'd like to share?
Speaker 3So there's this book that I'm reading called Hidden Forces. All right, it's a book on spirituality. It's a book that really talks about things that drive us every single day, energies that drive us every single day. Energies that drive us every single day and forces that drive us every single day, and how do you recognize those forces and how do you enable them to aid you and not bring you down. So that's the book that I'm reading right now.
Speaker 1Hidden Forces. Do you know the author's name?
Speaker 3I don't remember the author's name offhand Charles. It is an Indian author and he's a spiritual master and he's written the book. But it's derived from the mother and Aurobindo. I don't know if many people are familiar with the Aurobindo ashram, but there was a living master, aurobindo andam. But there was a living master, aurobindo, and he was inspired by the mother. Everyone most people, would know who the mother is and she was called the mother, who's also a living master. So the book is basically written by another living master who's derived all the philosophy and the teachings from Aurobindo and the mother and basically conversations with them like a podcast. Back then the podcast was mostly detailed and written and put into as excerpts into a book and this is really that book that has all these excerpts on hidden forces, hidden energies, how do you see them and how do you help them, aid you versus bring you down.
Speaker 1Awesome. Well, shailen, thank you so much for joining us as we sort of wrap the podcast. Anything you'd like to share on behalf of Raj.
Speaker 3Not share, I think just add on to everything that I've said. I think I've. I hope I'm not overshared today. No, not at all.
Speaker 3But just in interest of everything that I said and to quickly wrap it up as well, charles and James's, you know, I think every organization and every human being has a time and when that time's there, if you don't shine, you've lost that opportunity. I think this is the time for Raj to shine. Opportunity. I think this is the time for Raj to shine. This is the opportunity for leadership to really come through and pull this organization, I think, into its peak. And we're at that curve, we're right there and I'm only looking forward to the most fundamental but most beautiful next five years. I hope I'm still there to lead them into the next five years. If I'm not, I think I've done enough to lay a good foundation. But if I'm there, I'm more than excited to ride that wave.
Speaker 2That's beautiful.
Speaker 3Thank you for joining us today, thank you, thank you so much, and to anybody listening watching thank you for joining us as well.
Speaker 2You can find all of our podcasts. Anybody listening watching. Thank you for joining us as well. You can find all of our podcasts, videos and audios on our website, at highimpactanalyticscom, youtube or wherever you get your podcasts. Thank you.
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