The Retail Journey
Welcome to the Retail Journey where we will cover important topics, interview industry stakeholders, and address emerging trends as we journey through our mission of helping our listeners thrive in retail. Your hosts for this show are CEO James Harris and CGO Charles Greathouse.
The Retail Journey
Traction for Leaders: Mastering the 6 Key Components
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Work harder, spin faster, end up in the same place. That’s the trap so many leadership teams fall into, and it’s exactly why we brought on Dusty Pruitt, an EOS Implementer who’s helped companies replace stress and guesswork with a clear operating rhythm. Dusty shares the moment he realized his own business needed systems, not more hustle, and how the book Traction became a practical playbook for building a healthier, stronger company.
We dig into the six core components of the Entrepreneurial Operating System: vision, people, data, issues, process, and traction. Dusty explains what “right people, right seats” really looks like (including GWC), how a weekly scorecard brings focus, and why calling problems “issues” matters if you want psychological safety and real truth in the room. We also talk about processes that don’t become a 700-page SOP monster, plus quarterly rocks and 90-day planning that turn effort into forward motion.
Then we connect EOS to real-world decisions in retail and beyond: making capability bets that match your vision, filtering client fit with confidence, and staying ahead of what will be a category issue in four weeks instead of reacting when it’s too late. Dusty also previews his “entrepreneurs as gardeners” idea, a powerful way to think about leadership, growth, and building a place where people can flourish.
Subscribe wherever you listen, share this with a leader who feels stuck, and leave a review so more builders can find the show. What’s the one “issue” your team keeps avoiding right now?
Welcome And Shared History
SPEAKER_01Hello and welcome to the Retail Journey podcast. I'm Charles Greathouse, one of your hosts.
SPEAKER_02And I am James Harris. And today we are talking to Dusty Pruitt. Dusty is an implementer for entrepreneurial operating systems, also known as EOS. Dusty, welcome to the Retail Journey. It's good to be here. It's good to see you here.
SPEAKER_00Yeah. Well, it I was gonna say we are also not just I'm not just a podcast guinness here. No, no, no. James is one of my very best friends in the whole world. Absolutely. And um, special note for your listeners, uh, you helped me pull off my engagement to my wife. I don't know if you remember that. I have a slight. Come on.
SPEAKER_02Uh what was fun was uh my first MC gig was your wedding.
SPEAKER_00MC and DJ, yeah.
SPEAKER_02So MC and DJ.
SPEAKER_00Yeah, well, we were on a budget.
SPEAKER_02So first and only MC gig.
SPEAKER_00Yeah, oh, that was the last one. Yeah, pretty much. I mean, you're good at that. There might be something there. Yeah, James is uh one of the people in my life that uh matters the most. And so I'm I'm so excited to be here. And Charles, we have a little our circles overlap too.
SPEAKER_01Yeah, way back, way back to back in the day, catfuod, bright-eyed early days at Walmart, um, even before then, JBU. JBU, yeah, that's right. All the way back. Yeah, students in free enterprise, sife. Yeah, now formerly known as Syfe. Now uh uh something else, yeah, and and different. But here we are.
SPEAKER_00So this is homecoming for me.
SPEAKER_01Yes, I'm supposed to be here.
SPEAKER_02Plus, we use EOS. We use EOS, and Dusty was our implementer. Uh, and if I'm not mistaken, we were your first client.
SPEAKER_00One of the first.
What EOS Is And Why
SPEAKER_02One of the first. Okay. I've been to saying first, and that's right. Probably keep saying that you're the first. You're the first. You can say that. So for anybody listening here that made EOS, this is the first time they've heard of it. Uh, give us the give us the rundown.
SPEAKER_00Yeah, EOS is the entrepreneur's operating system and popularized by a book probably 20 years ago now called Traction. Uh, and you know, the way I got into all of this was I was running a business. I so I worked at Nestle. That's how Charles and I worked together. He was on the Walmart side. And we grew, I mean, we grew that category. That was fun. That was fun. That was in my whole CPG experience. Cat food. The well, all of cat food, but specifically cat food. Fancy feasts, baby. Fancy feasts, we friskies, come on. Kit and caboodle. Uh, yeah, that was fun. Cat owners out there know what I'm talking about. Yeah. So it and it, it was just that was so much. That was my favorite of anything I did. Jody was DMM at the time. Yep. Yeah. Yeah, it was great. Love Jodie. And then Philip after that. Uh, Phillip. Yeah. So that was so fun. But anyway, I left Nestle and kind of took this entrepreneurial pursuit uh for a really small CPG business here in Northwest Arkansas. And it was a good business, good bones, but we needed help. And I mean, you know this, James. Like with when you get into a small business, it's it's almost addicting. Like it is so fun. It is all consuming, but it is really stressful. And you get into these things, and it's just like that's part of the drug, though. That that's what it is. Yeah. It's like you can't not do it, but you have to, you know. And anyway, uh, we had, I just remember this specific time we had payroll due. And you know, when you have payroll, uh you you pay you pay it out on Friday, but you got to have it to the bank on Wednesday. Yep. And it was Monday, we didn't have the money. Oh wow. I was not not that we didn't have it, but it was like we can't just keep, you know, yeah, what are we gonna do here? And that that was really when I hit this this moment of you know, it was a lot easier in Esslite when uh the the money was coming in. You know, we had whole departments of people doing IT. I was the IT department, I was HR, and I was just like, Well, this is not thriving. I mean, this is barely surviving. We're gonna do that. Yeah, but no bureaucracy. How about that?
SPEAKER_01I mean, that's a you get to make all the decisions. Uh yeah, but it it was turns out those systems were there for reasons. Well, that's how they get there's a shadow side of how large and complex you can get, but systems are pretty helpful. Most pretty helpful.
The 2 A.M. Traction Moment
SPEAKER_00Small businesses don't make it, and that's why. Yeah, totally. So anyway, kind of in a fit of I guess panic. I mean, I fall asleep pretty easily, but stress pulls me right out of sleep. You know, so it was 2 a.m. and I was like, well, what are we gonna do here? Like and and actually it was it was it was more vulnerable than that because I thought maybe I was the thing in the way. Right. And and that's low, I mean, you know that that's lonely. When you're when your business is not to I've been because of you. Who else are you gonna blame? Yeah. I mean, it that there's a mirror and it is uh harsh perspective. And so anyway, I a friend had given me this book, Traction, and I was like, Well, I guess that's what I'm doing tonight. So, and you know, from between the hours of 2 30 and 8 30, I was like, and I just I was like, this is what we need. This is it. This it was like I was, you know, you read those books and you're like, that was written about me. Totally. Yeah, it just hit it. And so I was like, Yeah, we we have to figure this out. And so I hired uh what we call an EOS implementer. Um, this is years ago. I mean, we're talking 10 or 12 years ago. Uh, so there weren't many. And he so he was in Iowa and uh made the trip down and taught us EOS. And and in that first, really the first day we were in it, uh, I realized two things. This is what we've been waiting for. And also, I think I would love to do what he threw there.
SPEAKER_03Yeah.
SPEAKER_00And so uh it changed everything about our business. We're having more fun, we were giving our employees better jobs, we were serving our customers better. We were just like we were starting to flourish, and it was that became the new addiction. It's like, how could how healthy can we build this thing? And so that just that unlocked a passion in my heart for not just healthy companies, but also entrepreneurs, because I really think entrepreneurs like out of the abundance of a healthy entrepreneur comes opportunity for everybody else. Yeah, and I'm like, how do I chase that for the rest of my career? And so that was 10 years ago, uh, more than that now, and I'm still hard on that. That's it.
SPEAKER_01I love that. Well, and even like back to when we met 15, 16, 17 years ago, yeah. The the student stand for enterprise, like that was all entrepreneurial pursuits, adding value, creating economic opportunity where there is none, um, while in a corporate, you know, yeah, you're in a corporate job, but also like chasing with extracurricular activity. Yes. How do I help drive entrepreneurship?
SPEAKER_00I think that's like that's probably a big misnomer with in the work that I do that I think people sometimes misassociate or maybe just reduce entrepreneur to startup. Right. Totally. That's just not it. Like it's that is so you can tell it's a French word, entrepreneur. And it means Is it now? It is, yeah, you can tell. How would you say that in French? I don't, I'm not doing that. Oh, I can't even spell it. We'll edit it in post. You can record it for us later. Oh shit, pretty something like that.
SPEAKER_03Yeah.
SPEAKER_00Uh, but it means it's it's it was used, you know, in the early 1800s first, but it's somebody that takes something from lesser value to more value. And so um, you know, it's not just zero to something, it's something that's not great, but it or or is okay, but maximum optimize. And right, and so I think you can be entrepreneurial inside of big structure and organizations. My heart is for that person that they've got it's like what what you did here. It's it's I I'm gonna start this thing and it's getting subtraction, wheels under it, and then you just how do we get through this next ceiling of complexity? We've got the the bones, but let's go through.
SPEAKER_02Yeah, so if you're right, that there, you know, there's there's a few different meanings of the word, right? There's the what is it literally of the way we say it as well, somebody that has a business that yeah, you know, is their source of income, but it's also a spirit, right? And that's the thing you can you can use anywhere. Yeah. As here's where I here's where I am, here's what I've got, here's where I want to go. How do I build the bridge to get there?
SPEAKER_00Yeah, and and so the the passion, as over the year, the decades, and I guess that I've been doing this, the the passion is like finding the people that have that spirit, because that that spirit is, you know, like you do take a risk, you know. You're not you are more scared of the status quo than the prospect of change. Right. And so you you're taking something that's comfortable and it is uncomfortable to grow, but so you have to be growth-oriented. You have to want to to do hard things and and but what it's the hardest thing you could do and the most life-giving thing you can do.
SPEAKER_02I think we might have worked with you for about four years, um, and then we graduated, I suppose, and we we run our own quarterlies. Um, and and so I but I can attest from knowing you, from having worked with you, that that passion that you had when you read the book and were like, we're gonna do this, and now I want, and now I want to do that, yeah, um, is still there. Yeah um, but within that, tell us what you know, what EOS is, what are the what are the principles, the fundamentals.
The Six EOS Components
SPEAKER_00Yeah, yeah. So I mean, there's it's a lot. I'll I'll say um as simply as I can, it's six things. It's it's my my job is to help the leaders of organizations, the entrepreneur and their leadership team be profoundly great at six things. And and that's what I love about it, by the way, because it's only six things. Uh the first one is vision. Like the uh a healthy, high-functioning, profoundly great organization has absolute clarity on vision. And vision, I like we define it as this is where we're going and how we plan to get there. And and we don't have to overcomplicate it. And actually, I tell people, I I hope when I'm done explaining this, that you're like, that sounds really simple because good, I did my job. Yeah, it's not complicated, but it is hard. And so getting really clear on a vision is one thing, but then like you can't just have the bit, you got to get other people to buy into that as well. Winston Churchill uh he said that leadership is the art of getting people to want to do what must get done. And you do that with vision, you don't do that with uh, you know, threats or or give them something to buy.
SPEAKER_02You're gonna lose your job if you don't do this.
SPEAKER_00But but it, yeah, exactly. But it's the leader uh and the leaders that do that. That's the art of leadership is connecting the work to the vision. So that's the first one. The next one is people. Like we have to make sure that the organization is full of great people. And and so we, you know, Jim Collins taught us this right people in the right seats. Like that's the the secret. So, right people, they share, they just fit us, they share the core values, they fit the vibe. They're just they're just us. And you know, I I think most or I tell a lot of the my clients, like the world is full of people, like a lot, a lot of great people. Most of them are not right for you. There is just a precious few group of people that that's who you're supposed to work with. Those are right people, and then right seats, you have to be good at your job. You have to like innately, God's made you to do the work. We call it GWC, get it, want it, and the capacity to do it well.
SPEAKER_02Um Yeah, a good example of that is there's a number of people I've wanted to hire over the years, but we didn't have the spot for it. Yeah, right. So I'm I'm would be acquiring these skills, but we don't need those skills.
SPEAKER_01It's uh I mean it's a beautiful way of just having a conversation with someone. We've talked to several and being able to say, like, I think you're a right person. Yeah. And I don't have the right seat.
SPEAKER_03Yeah.
SPEAKER_01And it's not like I don't want you, I just I don't have a seat. Yeah, yeah. And also having the discipline to not just hire someone, yeah.
SPEAKER_00The right seat. Yeah, and discipline is I think the word. Like if there's one word, it's that because it's not fun. Discipline is not fun, right? It's hard, but but it's good, it's so good, it's so healthy. So uh vision, where we're going, how we plan to get there, people, the right people, right seats. And you can't achieve a great vision without great people. You can achieve a good vision, but not profound. And I'm not interested in anything but profound, you know, and then it's really hard to get great people without a compelling vision. So those things become pretty symbiotic. Like you we gotta have both of those. So those are the first two. The second one, the third one is data. Um, use and and this is probably a little different from the data you know, you guys talk about a lot. Like, there's a lot of data out there. We have to cut through all of that and just what are the most important things that we need to measure to know that our organization is is moving forward? And so we we do that through scorecards, you know, weekly inputs that create the outcomes reports into the month, end of the quarter. Uh, but but really building that discipline of just knowing, like, and I think even giving clarity to your people, when you get in your truck on Friday or car or whatever, and you you take this big deep breath, that was a great week. Why was it great? What did you get done? And then can we quantify that? Because if we can stack 52 weeks or 13 weeks, we're gonna have great quarters and great years and do that through the organization. So the discipline of data, and so when the vision's clear, when the people are right and the data is you know, you're tracking the right things, you're looking at the right things, but it also reveals the fourth thing issues. And I think um, you know, I have I've had groups over the years not want to call them issues, you know, it's like sometimes opportunities were or I had one group that wanted they wanted to call them topics, and I'm like, oh wow, but but sometimes we mask hard truths with soft words, yeah. Uh, and so they're issues, they're just things we got to solve. They are in our way from getting what we want. And I think I tell people uh often no issues is an issue. Yeah, and so if we sit down into a meeting, and this is probably a good like tip for listeners, like if you're sitting down into meetings and you're not getting to issues, there are issues. There's no reason for the meeting. There's no reason for the meeting, and you can send an email if it's an update. Yeah, or I'm just I'm way more worried about the health of your team. Right. Because when the brutal facts aren't coming out, we got issues. You have to invite them. Yeah, mind for them.
SPEAKER_02Yeah.
SPEAKER_00Uh yeah, mind for issues.
SPEAKER_02And it has to be an environment where they can speak up. Yeah. Like I assume we'll get to the C word, the culture word.
Process Discipline And Real Traction
SPEAKER_00I mean, that's where it is. It's like issue, the your ability to extract issues is a function of the culture. Uh, because if we're just dealing with uh table stakes, like, okay, great, so is everybody else. We're trying to be profound and be great. So we've got to deal with the hard stuff. And so that's what issues is. It's okay to have an issue. I used to I used to tell our team, listen, I I'm not gonna fire you because you've been stuck. I will fire you if you've been stuck for six months and you didn't say anything. Right, yeah, right? Because issue they start this big, we can solve them when they're this big, but when they sit there and fester, that's the problem. And so that's what issues is about, and just being really good at getting to the root of the issue. Um, we're not solving symptoms, we're solving root causes. And when we fix the root, the symptoms go away. Otherwise, we're just we built a company on band-aid. So that's where you just keep fixing the same problem. Exactly. Yeah, and and that's not moving forward. That's you know, just spinning your wheels. Process is a big one for us. That's the fifth one uh that we work on. Um there's a right and best way to do what it is that you do. The problem is there's also like 10 other ways to do what you do. And I think efficiency and expertise and uh, you know, atomic habits taught us this too. Like experience, like our clock customer and client experience comes from a good process. Uh he James Clear says we we don't rise to our aspirations, we fall to the quality of our process. Yeah. So it's and and and it's not 700 pages, it's seven pages. And it's not, you know, if I I tell clients a lot of times, if if we have to like write SOPs like we're coding a human being to be like we that just means you have the wrong person working in your company. Yeah. What we're doing for for right people write seats is we're giving them the edges and then we're letting their talents and their gifting shine. So that we're just giving the guards, but they're the ones doing the work. And so uh it doesn't have to be 700 pages, it can be seven, and you can build a really great company. And then the last one is traction. Um, I've are you are you a Peloton guy? Uh kind of ish. Okay, yeah. Like the Nord, the Nordic track.
SPEAKER_02Notice he's like, Yeah, yeah. Notice he didn't even ask me.
SPEAKER_00Yeah. Well, I knew I was gonna ask you. Uh I had this Peloton down in the basement and I would go down in the mornings, you know, 5:30, and and I'd get on that for 30 minutes. I felt like it was blood, sweat, tears. I'm putting all these watts through the pedals, and I, you know, heart rate is max, and I get off that thing 30 minutes later, and where am I? Still in my basement. Yeah, but that's that is the definition of spinning the wheels. And so traction is just the opposite. So now you have a gravel bike and you gravel bike right outside real tires on real pavement or gravel and same blood, sweat, tears, same 50 or 60 hours a week of effort, but I'm going somewhere. And where are we going? We're going to our vision. And so I think actually that's one of the biggest issues people have. And I think that's what really resonates about what how US really resonates with people is they're getting something done.
SPEAKER_03Yeah.
SPEAKER_00And and hopefully it's aligned to their vision, but we're not hamster wheels here.
SPEAKER_02And one thing leads to another. It takes me to that Jim Collins principle and good to great. It might have been built to last two, but it it's the the flywheel. Yeah. That and then and the picture that worked for me was you picture like that uh the price is right spinner, the big one, you know, where a dollar and fifty cents, that sort of thing. And assuming it was heavier, like your first pull isn't going to create that much movement. But then you pull it again while it's moving and it's faster, and then you do it again and again and again, and you start to really build on you know all of those previous actions.
SPEAKER_00Yeah, it's it's so fun to well. I mean, ha have you guys found your flywheel in this business? Yeah. Yeah. And it, you know, it's it's the it takes five, it took five years probably to get it around the first time. And then weirdly, once you knew it and you stayed on it, you spun it once in two years. And then you spun it once in a year. And then you spun it. Now you're now spent it once a quarter or once, you know. Right. And it just and then it becomes really hard to stop. It's because it you've sort of removed all of the stuff that's not you. And now you're just spinning your flywheel. And and that is how you build a profound and and healthy organization. And so that's my passion. I mean, that this is the work God made me to do. I love to do it with the leadership teams, and and I I told you this before, but if if we can build healthy organizations uh that are profound and that create great jobs for great people that have fans, you know, like yeah humans can flourish because of the work we do. And I I think that's that's why I'm here and that's what I'm supposed to do. So EOS is just that great uh expression of that, but that's my heart.
Watching Vision Become Real
SPEAKER_02It's great, great overview, great recap. Yeah. And just as a company that's been in EOS for a while, great benefit. You know, it was fun with you coming in here, um, having been our implementer years ago. Uh how many years have we been to hot work? Four, five, six years, whatever it's been. We started in 18, ended in 22. There it is. So four years now. Um, we're in a different building. Uh, we have two to not two and a half times the people we had when we stopped working with you. Um, you know, it's pretty cool to kind of reflect on, you know, EOS is one of the major components that helped bring us here.
SPEAKER_01100%. Yeah. Oh, yeah, I mean, I came from a different environment. There wasn't EOS. Yeah. Um traction can be difficult across a very, very, very large organization. And like having an issue track. Yeah. I mean, in that world, it's their opportunities. Yeah. Um, they weren't issues, they're opportunities. And so you had there's there's there's a packaging required as opposed to just a frankness of like now to be fair, there are plenty of leaders there's great that are just a hundred percent, and you bring the issue exactly as it is, bad news travels faster than good, and we're solving stuff, and we're yeah, we're moving forward with speed. And there's others where like if you don't have uh a good bow alongside it, like don't be the messenger.
SPEAKER_00You don't want to be that one. Oh, and you know, I think building on that, because you're a product of the vision. Like, we didn't write Charles on the whiteboard when we did this, but I mean you were I'm grateful for for you. Yeah, just thrilled to be here. But but it is like the there's this is it cathartic, maybe there's this unbelievable experience that you have when you see your vision come to life. And and like while you saw it, like you saw it in your mind's eye, and but you had this weird, this weirdly this confidence that you could do it, right? Because you've built it's just built on great quarters, 90 days at a time. And then, like, as you're building the culture and as you're building this business and something profound, and like this moment, the flywheel starts to turn, and then just those it's like it is just starting to attract the stuff that you saw in your vision, and then the people, you know, because cult culture is the way that you attract people, it's the magnet, totally. So they start coming in and then and then it just becomes this thing that I mean, James, I you know, I love you, but this place got bigger than you. And I'm well aware of it. Yeah, but but it wouldn't have started if you didn't do it. And I think that like that right there is why I I I'm obsessed with entrepreneurs. I love it because they like see the future and they create something that was never there. Yeah. And like here we are in this beautiful building.
SPEAKER_02There is
SPEAKER_00uh I will say there is a moment in an entrepreneur's experience where they have to shift from being primarily entrepreneurial to being primarily a leader otherwise it won't get bigger than you yeah that is existential too for entrepreneurs because there there are people that they are really good at they're the zero to five person and then it's like I'm bored or or often what I see is I don't love this company anymore like I'm doing I did I had to do an expense report last week yeah or I or got too big to be cool or um and so like they need to find and and have the I I I don't think it's humility. I think it's just the understanding themselves the understanding the freedom to say this isn't what I want anymore. So it's here it's in place and then let's put good leaders that are the five to 15 or five to fit and then lay them go and let them flourish and I'm gonna go apply my apply my god god gifting and unique ability innate talents to the next one.
SPEAKER_02Yeah yeah and or to the next thing yeah the next right like I look at do it again I don't have the same job now that I had two years ago and two years ago I didn't have the same job I had two or three years before that. Yeah um you have to you have to evolve along with the company a little bit.
SPEAKER_01Yeah and that's what growth is yeah that that's so fun I could talk about this all day title hasn't changed but the the the the work's evolved and um I mean it was really I I distinctly remember just in the journey from Walmart to choosing to to join James and this team like the discipline to make hard decisions was like a huge part of it. Like it was obvious to me like yeah this is small which feels risky but also we know how to make the hard calls that are the right thing for our clients for our partners um for where the long term vision is going and I believe in it. So let's get after it.
SPEAKER_00Yeah yeah that's I mean that's music to my my heart too just that that's what you made here because it it just you can serve you know what we talk I talk about this all the time you guys know this but we get what this Zig Ziggler taught us this but we get out of life what we want if we help enough other people get what they want right like that's that's the abundant mindset. And so what I love about companies like this uh and this is who I'm supposed to work with like like you guys but you can just serve profoundly well and you can do it quickly. There's not seven layers of just like no what's the right thing for the client that's what we're gonna do. Yeah and and we believe if we help enough clients be wildly successful we're gonna be fine but but our antenna is up on how we're gonna help first. And then it's not a risk. Right. And I and I think that's probably what some of what I mean it's different when you came here but um oftentimes when you come into an environment that's that's healthy like I I you want to be in the garden that you're gonna grow in. Yeah and I would guess you're more Charles than you were back then. Yeah yeah no it's uh that's growth.
Being Entrepreneurial Inside Big Companies
SPEAKER_01I mean it's definitely more more beard uh more hair quality about yeah no it's um it's fun I I think I love your comment on an entrepreneur like this is uh taking something small having clarity of vision and then making it just greater lesser to more small lesser to to more and like I distinctly remember being told Steve Bratsby's former chief merchant um awesome and I just you know if I've got a conviction about something I'm I'm a hunt um and we were selling fish oil and I wanted it to be omega threes because the promise for the customers in omega threes it's not in the fish oil the oil is just a carrier for omega three omega threes but yeah it was commonly called that and whatever. And he just looked at me and he's like you're a glutton for punishment aren't you because like it's an uphill battle to to fight for what the customer really needs that they're not asking for yet. Like those that are informed know exactly what they need. But there are a lot of customers out there that are just buying fish oil thinking they're getting the benefits of omega 3s when they weren't getting as much as I think they thought they were getting and to your credit walk a store today and find a fish oil that doesn't have omega three well yeah it's all over it. But it was an uphill battle and it was uh and it took a lot of creativity to go from a thing that frankly the product was lesser and now it it is better and and the reward is there. Um we were just at Expo West you know natural product trade show in California one of the largest you know it's huge. I remember walking it as a vitamin merchant before we went through all of this and people shunned Walmart. They were like uh uh you guys don't know how to do this and I would have my talk track about the organic groceries we were selling because Walmart was crushing already yeah organic groceries and then I had my other talk track which was like well you're selling on Amazon how's your relationship with that robot you know that and it was never that was always benevolent towards uh towards Walmart because that relationship wasn't good and I knew it wasn't uh you know for them and so they like I'm the actual buyer can we like let's do something yeah because America deserves this and I would start with why you know why are you in this business? Oh I want to help people be healthier I'm like oh that's great 130 million Americans every week shopping in this store can can we give them exposure to your brand well I don't know if we can and now like the last year I was there like for four years later I'm getting physically assaulted by people because they understood it was unlocked a couple brave souls went first and then it was like this space and I've watched Walmart do that in so many spots and I think every time that's happened there's an entrepreneur in there I mean Sam Walton obviously an entrepreneur so many entrepreneurs there's so much in the the the lifeblood of of Walmart and Sam's and frankly a lot of the suppliers that are like looking at how do I take this and expand it into something bigger and greater. I'd love to hear your thoughts when it comes to hey I'm within a much larger hard to call this thing entrepreneurial the company but I am and I'm here inside of this large company how do I get traction how do I you know borrow yeah I'm I mean that's a good question.
SPEAKER_00Yeah it can happen because it's a spirit like James said at the w when we started like the I think that when that I mean the the word you used or the the comment was like the why was big enough the road was not the hill wasn't too steep. Right. And it it was just worth doing. Yeah so to me I I think that there's probably two parts like to to answer that. The the first one is like you you have to have this deep passion to do the work that that you do otherwise the the hill's not worth it.
SPEAKER_02It's just too hard. That's so true because there will be moments where if you didn't have to do it you wouldn't you wouldn't yeah take that to the bank I think I've seen that across every when they just there's not enough passion then like the hills are way bigger.
SPEAKER_00Yeah yeah they're not worth climbing no for an entrepreneur you you do like the hills because it it's a roller coaster and the the highs are really high but the lows are really and if the highs weren't so high the lows would be worth it.
SPEAKER_02Yeah but but you also always have the hope and a low that you can turn it into a high.
SPEAKER_00Yeah there's there's something in you but it's control. But I but I think if if the Y is big enough the road is possible. So I think that's the first part. And then uh the second thing and and this is where I try to keep my antenna up is you we're also like you need to be operating inside of your gifting. And so it's sort of like you're wiring when your your heart and your hand you know here we go with JBU. Yeah JBU come on over over but when your work and your wiring intersect that's I think that's profound work. Yeah that's the sweet spot. Yeah and and so it's it's a lot of self-awareness about what you're good at and and probably more self-awareness about what you're not good at. Yeah and I I I'll just I'll tell everyone this most things you are not good at uh you bigger things yeah but but there is like very there's a precious few things that no one can do but you it's uncompetent and it's good. And I think the more you can move your design into you know your time and your energy into those things and then let that layer over top of that big why yeah that's I think when you get things done. And so it's good self-awareness of what you're good at, what you're not and then the why is just big enough and then just I'd say watch out like go see what could happen. I my experience is most people when you get comfortable those things start to dilute and the the the paycheck is big enough or my you know and and so you you just you you go you're not you you downshift and I'm just kind of running out the clock here and while I mean maybe that's okay I don't know but that's just not the life I want to live. Yeah I that's why I love being around entrepreneurs again because that's not how they live. Yeah they're not downshift. Otherwise why would you sign up for this? Yeah I mean that's what I've yeah I don't understand.
SPEAKER_02If you got a downshift you need to be putting it in park and getting out of the car.
SPEAKER_00I had a Boss in the time that he said you're you're either green and growing or you're ripe and rotting. Yeah. And so I always want to be green and growing.
Why EOS Fails For Some Teams
SPEAKER_02So you you've uh you've kind of taken us through EOS the principles the you know leads to human flourishing I'm sure you've got a hundred examples now haven't done this for eight ish years, nine ish years of companies that have really broken through the mold right and that's probably where you get your energy I don't want to dwell on the ones that didn't but help us contrast yeah you know the type of company um you know that that that really wins and the type that just doesn't quite get there. Cause man I'm sure it happens.
SPEAKER_00Yeah I mean it's the qu the answer is probably not the type of company yeah and it's more the type of leader that that means it it doesn't doesn't happen or doesn't work or work as well as it could. You know, I think if you're if you're I mean with EOS is not complicated but it is exceedingly hard. And we talk about this idea you know you know the idea of like mastering your craft like that's that's work that's never done. You're always doing that. And I think that you know the people that don't get the long-term return from EOS uh are the ones that just don't want to do the work. You know, because it's not it's not doing different work. It's doing your work differently and and with a different set of intents the intention and maybe doing it yeah doing things you hadn't done before doing those things.
SPEAKER_02Yeah like you have to want to grow those are hard habits to break if you're not interested in doing it.
SPEAKER_00So I I love it I love it when um an entrepreneur or a leadership team walks in with gray hair and limping and tired and frustrated I mean they're suffering like it's just so hard and and because it's like I can work with that but but when someone hasn't struggled yet or they just this is a silver bullet or you know if I just do this it's gonna that it's worth 10% to the you know or another point of of equity at the transaction table or whatever that's not who you know so I I actually don't work with a lot of those organizations yeah because their heart's not in it for transformation. But if you're coming and you are willing to grow you're you want to get better and and it's not about you it's about this garden that your people can grow in uh which is that's my current obsession right now this idea of entrepreneurs as gardeners uh but if if that's your if that's you like let's go yeah I I can work I we can work with that all day long but it's it's emotional um it's hard it's sticky a lot of businesses are family businesses and so people have the same last name yeah uh I I've ruined more than one Thanksgiving for people it's it wasn't me I just I just ask questions that's okay but your cousin's a problem yeah that's right or worse your son is and shouldn't be here and does it fit is not the right person in the right seat and you got to deal with that uh and that might be the the founder's vision that I'm gonna hand this off to yeah my kid or kids one day so it it is you know often we another core value we talk about a lot is entering the danger and you you have to roll your sleeves up and swog through the mess yeah like with people but but they're also people and they're worth it and if we can get to the other side it unlocks you know their potential and so I just again you I don't have to sell you I'm I'm doing what I'm supposed to well EOS was uh was a a great fit for my kind of um I don't know assumptions about life is that you're gonna get a lot more from people putting their minds together and being uh what's the word safe be yeah psychological safety but also like I'm content and that I have what I need but I'm driven to like go after the thing that can unlock so much more than you got to hit this number in the next 10 days. Yeah it's or else yeah that that's like what you're speaking to is the principle of abundance yeah which is the belief that there's enough yeah and again if I help enough other people get what they want I'm gonna get what I want the opposite is scarcity I've got to preserve I've got to protect pie's not growing the pie's not growing so if you get something then I don't have it. If Charles gets one I don't get that one or no if Charles gets one and that's we can be three or five yeah right and so uh when you can remove that insecurity and just get like beat it out of your head and just how do I help as many people get what and and I think that's like the premise of what when Gino Wickman he created all of this when he did it that was the going in principle. Yeah how do we help people get what they want from their businesses so yeah uh I love it. I love it and I love what it I'm so glad I I tell people I did not just to be clear with everybody I did not do this for higher this was you guys oh sitting in that room and doing the work I just made you were the guy I managed the whiteboard and asked a couple questions. Yeah and you guys did all the work and I'll I I'm so proud of you.
SPEAKER_02Well until we built the muscle you helped push us to decision.
SPEAKER_00That's what coaches do.
SPEAKER_01Yeah good reps with the right technique but you got it definitely changed the outcome. So grateful for you grateful for the the way EOS has changed the trajectory of this business.
SPEAKER_02Well I feel the same that there's an actual place for me to be yeah yeah that you're here because I'm so grateful um yeah grateful to be here and we're doing something special and I'm excited yeah you know for our clients our partners I get spit excited about next at high end like what's exciting on the on the horizon for you know the our our our vision is that we're not the biggest um you know full service brokerage service provider consultant but that to our clients we're the best and to the people that they interact with you know uh through the work that we do that that we're the best that they could have possibly come to. Yeah um and to bring not just like to your point earlier not 10% growth we want to help inform a transformation yeah in in our companies because I we don't have any clients because we are selective we work with great companies we don't have any company any any clients that don't want to see their business transformed. Yeah so to get to be a a small part of that.
SPEAKER_01Well and what we found is like there's there's a lot I mean there's a lot of suppliers to Walmart and Samps like that's our that's our that's where we're focused but and a lot of them are content you know trying to be good like just not being out of stock yeah not being in trouble yeah um hopefully keeping my items yeah and I we're not real eat up with that vision. Like I I want to take people from good to great. Yeah and sometimes what got you to Walmart was a very compelling item and and you know you solved the customer need that needed to be solved and that's awesome. And two or three years later if you don't understand the category you don't understand the customer you don't know if you're growing the category or frankly if you know that and hold it with conviction but can't articulate it to your merchant like they have to grow the category then that item might not need to be there. It certainly doesn't need more of its you know counterparts and if the customer is not well understood you're not gonna be great. So really deploying what we've got you know here and experts that have years of experience in category fact-based selling really taking data from this cool thing to it's informing decisions it changes decisions it it helps you find an issue that's gonna be big in four weeks yeah that isn't big right now and fixing it um or anticipating it before it happens and that kind of thing isn't gonna happen on accident um and um and what we've like the foundation that was like we crush when it comes to execution because without execution there's no trust there's no long-term prospect there might be an an instant or an initial entry but if your vision is to be long term and sustained growth the execution is the green fee I don't care how good you are at golf yeah yeah but we got to be there. But that's just good. We want to be great and so it's been really fun to see that come to life um for our clients and get to see the fruit of no when you earn trust and you have good solutions you get to solve more problems. And solving problems on behalf of the customer they reward because they want their problems solved and you're okay calling them problems.
SPEAKER_00Totally because that's where they are and that's what you do is solve problems.
SPEAKER_02Yeah I think to your comment Charles about you know understanding the category if you're going to do year two, year three, but um I think of that every time I see a shark tank item on the shelf. Right. Because that item is there now. It met some need it got some investment it got some attention people are buying it but in two or three years some of those brands you see continue to innovate and continue to scrub daddy come on right oh nice well done right but then you know if if you don't see it then that that that item is gone it's out of memory.
SPEAKER_00Yeah I I have a question on this so that I heard two things I heard we're just trying to be the best that we can be. So like be our best that's our you know this passionate pursuit. And then we you know it's in the name we're not here for incremental improvement we're here for money that's all right yeah and and you you spoke to like we we're solving problems that are two months down the road not just you know Monday. Like we're not you're not just making Mondays better. You're making up order of Monday you don't get rid of the moles by by whack and moling.
SPEAKER_02So really where we're going is to set our clients up to have their three year vision with their core with their core customers their joint business planning you know let's get outside of even quarter and annual let's let's build to the vision which is we want to have for each break.
Using Vision To Make Hard Calls
SPEAKER_00Which is different work than if we're just trying to get on the mod, right? Yeah like and I think that's just so like that long that long view like we're we're gonna do the the infrastructure work early so that we can do the fun stuff but you know and and that's the work. Yeah we're we're gonna stack quarters yeah until we get to our vision and I I think that's the power of of the 90 day world I was gonna so knowing that you got this is what you're trying to build it's gonna be profound have this high impact I'm I'm curious and I'm asking this question a lot so I'm really curious how how does that give or not give clarity to like hard decisions we have to hire this role do we have the payroll line is this a client fit or not? Like how how does that become a filter how does the vision that you know come down to those kinds of decisions like does it take the burden of decision making off quite a bit I think yeah to tell me I'm well like you know Nielsen's a great partner to us now and the decision to invest in Nielsen data is a direct result.
SPEAKER_01Like you can't be a great partner without understanding the rest of the market we're going to be the best we have to do this. You have to understand where this is going. Yeah our digital team that focuses on e-commerce like do you need that to stay off the naughty list? Probably not do you need it to grow to plant seeds for future in-store innovation yeah you do. Do you need category centric storytelling in ways that compels a completely different understanding of what drove this uh category forward or is this high growth item you know a contributor or not uh or what's happening outside in the blind spots because you know there's there's a lot of innovation that happens D to C and that starts in some sort of ancillary channels that are harder to get strong visibility to starts a snowball. And then that but if you're not aware of it by the time it's significant you're late you're super late.
SPEAKER_02And in terms of running this business it absolutely informs those decisions right like there's certain clients um let let's just stick with categories there's certain categories that aren't a good fit for us. Like you can't not that many you can't be the best at it. Right. We could do it and we could get you to good on a really huge apparel assortment but we're gonna probably it's not refer you to somebody that could do that better.
SPEAKER_00That's the abundant mindset is if if I can't be the best for you, I don't want to do it. Yeah right I know someone that can do better. And and you're not scared that that person's gonna get this new client.
SPEAKER_02Yeah and it's super critical on hiring right particularly at the leadership level but really at any level. So let back to that earlier comment I made where some Sometimes you you meet a person like man, you would be a rock star at this job, but we have this job, right? Um, and if being really good at what they're good at isn't part of the vision, then it's an easy no.
SPEAKER_00And they're not gonna flourish here, right? Yeah, and again, if we're good gardeners, we're putting the seeds in our garden that are gonna flourish. But if not, there are other gardens. Yeah, let them go be there. I love the gardener analogy, though that about yeah, I'm we're I'm I'm working it.
Lightning Round And Retail Lessons
SPEAKER_01I'm still I'm still the perfect old Donnie Smith, you know, peach tree analogy. He was a good mentor. Yeah. Um, but we're we're towards the end. We'd like to do a lightning round to get some zingers uh out there. You know, I like to hear uh about your your biggest retail.
SPEAKER_02So um one of the things, you know, what are you reading? Also, what are you reading? What are you listening to? What podcast, what what are you consuming right now?
SPEAKER_00A lot of things. Uh the this moment, like last night, I'm reading, uh, I'm doing a big talk on you know the concept of rocks in EOS. Yeah, yeah. And so every quarter. But your quarterly yeah, every quarter we get to yeah, rocks are most important outcomes our organization must achieve in the next 90 days. Uh, we all as EOS implementers get together every 90 days ourselves and eat our own dog food and good dive into deep dive into you know one of the tools that we teach our clients. And so it's rocks this quarter. And so I'm leading our EOS implementer community through this. And so I'm learning a lot about rocks. Uh, I just finished the I mean, I do I'm about I'm about ancient literary, like I like the old stuff. So Peter Drucker has this incredible book called The Uh Effective Executive, and just the snippet of it that's so good is uh he he said, and this speaks specifically to rocks, but he says effective executives are profoundly great at putting first things first and doing second things, not at all. Yeah, and so it's just this this ruthless elimination of anything that's not most important.
SPEAKER_01Yeah.
SPEAKER_00So I just finished that last night, and then I'm I I'm always working through something from Stephen Covey, Jim Collins. I'm a big Patrick Lynchy on it. The classics. Yeah, I mean that if it's not 25 years old, I I'm not sure it's for me. You don't trust it. Yeah. Um, podcast-wise, uh I there's a lot of podcasts. We have a lot of EOS people in our community that do podcasts, and uh what one of them, the retail journey. I listened to that. Let's go. Nice.
SPEAKER_01All right, I'm gonna reward you with that. With uh what was your greatest uh retail blunder in your life journey? As a consumer or as a as a uh you were the CPG world, so I'm sure there was some fun, like, oh whoops, learn from that.
SPEAKER_00Man, um we had, I mean, like one thing I'm thinking of right now, uh, this was in the dog food category, and we had a kind of a cereal box of dog food, and we had a in I don't know if they're still called in caps. We've been out of it so long, but they're still called in caps, you know. And we had an opportunity to go through there and a buyer that was interested in it. And so we did this whole thing, and I don't I think it was all the stores of but it but we were we sold them for a dollar, and so it while it was like a compelling thing to pick off the shelf, we the margin was there for us, it just wasn't a great use of space. And I got called into the principal's office an hour. What did you do? There were a lot of principal's offices. Yeah, uh, but you know what? You it was a great learning, and we learned forward from that. Uh and but it was I would say that was uh yeah, a little box of box of dog food cereal. Yeah, I missed the fairway on that one.
SPEAKER_02Not not so much, and this uh using EOS terms, this is the visionary in me. But what are you looking forward to over the next year, next 12 months? In my life or my work, in your work, yeah.
SPEAKER_00Yeah, I mean I mean, I am in the process of a book uh that I am uh get getting ready to I'm we're I'm in the manuscript right now. Let's go. Uh I'm looking forward, I think so. What I'm looking forward to is it being over. Yeah, I'm not looking forward to it. Like complete. Yeah, it's being complete because uh it is hard to sit there and write.
SPEAKER_02What's the topic? What's the book about?
SPEAKER_00Uh entrepreneurs that are gardeners. All right. Let's go, baby. Uh more to come. Let's cultivate. Yeah, let's cultivate. Ooh, that's good. Yeah. Yeah, yeah, yeah. Let's cultivate TM. Guys, this was awesome. Yeah, thank you so much for joining us. So thanks for letting me come here.
Where To Find Dusty
SPEAKER_02I appreciate it.
SPEAKER_00Where can the uh where can the people find you? Yes, yes, yes. Oh man. Um EOSworldwide.com. You can search my name under EOS implementers. And I would love to if you're an entrepreneur and you're looking for traction in your business, I would love to have a conversation with you. I have a little office down in Fayetteville or a Zoom meeting, but um Yeah, email address. Yeah, Dustin.pruitt at Eosworldwide.com. Awesome. And Cassandra will get the she'll answer it and we'll get it set up. And I don't I don't, I'm not good at email, so she'll take it and get us get us set up. But I appreciate you guys. I'm grateful. Yeah, appreciate you. Good work. I'm proud of you too.
SPEAKER_02Thank you all for listening. Uh, as always, you can find all of our episodes on our website at high impactanalytics.com or wherever you get your podcast. Thank you.
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