The Sterling Family Law Show
The Sterling Family Law Show is where successful family law attorneys share the exact systems they used to build million-dollar practices.
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Co-host Tyler Dolph runs Rocket Clicks, the agency in charge of supercharging Sterling and other family law practices to success using revenue-first marketing strategies.
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The Sterling Family Law Show
20+ Year Partner Attorney Shares Law Firm Mentorship Secrets - #151
Law firm mentorship isn't what you think it is – a 35-year veteran shares why most firms get it wrong and associates leave anyway.
Here's what's wild: Lori made partner in 3 years while most associates struggle for a decade. She breaks down attorney career development mistakes and law firm succession planning realities.
Discover how she uses her 20+ years of experience as a law firm partner to scale from overwhelmed attorney to legacy firm builder.
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📄 CHAPTERS
0:00 - Law Firm Mentorship Reality: 35 Years of Legal Career Insights
1:45 - Attorney Career Development: From Overwhelmed to Specialized
2:49 - Legal Mentoring Strategies: Learning from Bar Leaders
5:43 - Partnership Track Secrets: Promoted in 3 Years
7:08 - Law Firm Culture Building: What Partners Really Want
9:47 - Associate Retention Programs: The Generation Gap Problem
11:22 - Attorney Professional Development: Recognition and Growth
12:13 - Law Firm Succession Planning: Building a Legacy Practice
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Lori Bootwig has been a partner at her firm for over 20 years. Her insights were invaluable. She is continuing to be excited about the work that she's doing and now thinking about what is the future of her firm going to be. I am your host, tyler Dolph. I am also the CEO of our digital marketing agency called RocketClicks. We also own and operate a very large law firm called Sterling Lawyers that has grown to over 30 attorneys across 25 offices. We are here today interviewing Loi. Loi has been a longtime attorney. She's been a partner at her firm for over 20 years and she shares her experience of what it was like being an early partner at the firm and building a legacy over time. I really hope you enjoy it, lori. Thank you so much for being with us today. We're so excited to hear about you and your firm and your journey. Can you give us a little introduction on kind of who you are and how you came to be sitting with us today?
Speaker 2:Sure, well, thank you for having me, tyler. I really appreciate it. I'm glad to be here. Well, let's see, I've been an attorney, for it'll be 35 years this September.
Speaker 1:Amazing.
Speaker 2:I've been doing nothing but family law since 2001. Before that I did a more varied practice. So I've been with Nichols Sachs, lank, sondelbach, budewig and Solomon for 21 years. That is amazing. Yeah, pretty kind of a one-trick pony at this point with the family law stuff.
Speaker 1:You've been at the firm for 21 years. How did you get there?
Speaker 2:Oh well, that's a good question. So when I was doing the varied practice areas it was a little bit overwhelming to keep up with construction lien law and debt collection law and insurance defense law and no fault in a lot of different areas and so I decided I wanted to just focus on one practice area and my firm that I'm at now has some incredible pioneers, some of whom have retired, and it was really their contributions to the profession that drew me to the firm kind of more than anything. But we have past family law section, state bar family law section chair people. We have past county bar association chair people in our firm, past members of fellows of the American Academy of Matrimonial Lawyers. So you know it was just a real draw for me to come and join this firm that had so many bar leaders, you know, in it.
Speaker 1:It's just an opportunity to learn right and level up.
Speaker 2:Yeah, yeah, yeah.
Speaker 1:And what's caused you to stay for for over 20 years. I mean, I've got to believe that the culture is great and you're still learning along the way.
Speaker 2:Yeah, it's, it is, it's a great culture. I mean the substance of what we do. As you know, we help people right, so sometimes they don't really want to be helped, but they need to be helped anyway. And then eventually, you know, they sort of begin to sit with their new normal and appreciate what we do for them, kind of their lowest point in their life or close to it, to turning the page and starting the next chapter in their lives with some optimism.
Speaker 1:Yes, I love that you have such an amazing career and you've been practicing law for a long time. Give us and our audience, some perspective on how things have changed over the years. What have you had to do to change and adapt in this industry to continue to serve your clients?
Speaker 2:I like to think that I kind of have evolved with changes as they occur.
Speaker 2:I like to think that I kind of have evolved with changes as they occur. I've always been a big proponent of change, not for the sake of change but for the improvement of our processes and our outcomes. So change doesn't bother me. Quite frankly, as devastating as the pandemic was in so many ways, devastating as the pandemic was in so many ways, in my opinion it was a huge benefit to the legal profession to pivot and become more technologically efficient, right the whole. Hey, we can do court on Zoom, we can do mediations on Zoom, collaborative sessions on Zoom, to the kind of the giant shift that we had what 15 years ago when we went paperless. And you know, I'll never forget the day we got rid of these massive binders that we used to break our backs dragging to the courthouse and you could show up with a laptop. You know it was great. So I think those, to me those are kind of the biggest. Two changes I can think of in my career is paperless and just video technology.
Speaker 1:Sure, yeah, love it. I want to touch on a little bit on your success and being a tenured attorney. For as long as you have been, you've had to navigate, you know, a lot of different situations. Did you start out as a partner, or were you promoted into that role, and what was that process like?
Speaker 2:I was promoted to partner after three years at the firm. I think my name didn't get added until four or five years. I mean, there's in a small firm. There's a lot of cost right to adding that. So we finally just came up with this logo signature block and because now we have, like, too many names and the first three names are retired but you know to change to take their names off. They're really iconic lawyers and you hate to take their names off because they're so recognized and they've been kind enough to allow us to leave their names on. But as you add new partners it gets a little unwieldy and I think the thing to do these days is just have one name right, but when you have three partners that's not going to work.
Speaker 1:And so you know, in navigating that process right, I'm thinking, if I'm a young'm a young attorney and I want to make partner, what are the things that they should be thinking about, or things that you learned to really be successful?
Speaker 2:Yeah, good question Boy. Can I rattle off a bunch of things? You probably can too. I would say, ask a lot of questions of your mentors, having in mind, before you ask it, what you think the answer is. Right Like, don't be a lazy asker. Right Like, be like. I'm just double checking. I want to make sure I've got this right. Show that you've thought it through and you've done your best.
Speaker 2:Recognize the various aspects of small firm ownership and show that you understand what those various pieces of being an owner of a law firm consist of. What are they? You've? You've got your marketing piece. You've got your financial piece. You've got your competency piece. You're, you know, you've got your forward facing you. And then you've got the you that works in the business, or rather on the business versus in the business. So are you? Do you have an eye towards working on the business versus in the business? So are you, do you have an eye towards working on the business? Like, hey, I'm thinking it might be more efficient if we made some templates for our paralegals to use. You know stuff like that? Like hey, I was thinking that if I joined this section of the bar and showed up, then maybe I could get some referrals from these attorneys that don't do family law or something. You know what I mean Like. Come up with ideas to improve the firm in the various ways that the firm needs to have success.
Speaker 1:Yeah, it's really like how can you add value above and beyond just being a great attorney? What are you doing to help the firm be successful? Is that kind of what you're saying?
Speaker 2:Yeah, I feel like competency is the minimum right. If you want to be a partner, you've got to be beyond that. And then too, like hey, I see you're going on vacation next week. That. And then too, like hey, I see you're going on vacation next week. What cases can I keep an eye on for you? Hello, like, does that not sound like a dream come true?
Speaker 1:Absolutely, but it's having the wherewithal right you know of, just you know, doing whatever it takes and understanding what the senior partners in your firm are looking for as it relates to like help or value or what you know. What issues are they facing that you can help pick up the slack.
Speaker 2:Yeah, yeah.
Speaker 2:That's awesome I mean I do think too, the question for the partners is what is it the associates want? For the partners is what is it the associates want, and I really honestly have a little trouble wrapping my head around that I don't know what younger attorneys necessarily want or expect from a law firm experience that can be given to them, right. I mean, I just don't know. I don't know if I really feel there's a bit of a generation gap and I need to do a better job of understanding what, like, if I'm going to be attractive to you, what is it you want from me that I could possibly give you knowing I am not made of money with deep pockets and can't give you unlimited, you know, time off.
Speaker 1:What does that look like for you? In the past, have you had to hire some younger paralegals or law clerks or attorneys, and did it work out?
Speaker 2:I mean we're really blessed with really low turnover in our paralegal staff Associates. I mean we've had a few and I can't really tell you exactly why they haven't stuck around, and that's probably why I said that.
Speaker 1:I mean I've been to seminars, tyler, where they've told me you know what associates want and I think that our firm offers that, but I guess I'm not sure I of the day. We're all humans, right. We want to be valued, we want to pursue goals, we want to make sure that we're recognized for our hard work and as your firm grows and as your attorneys continue to be valuable assets to the community, sometimes it could be hard to. Oh yeah, I have to make sure I take XYZ associate out to lunch and I have to make sure that you know I'm recognizing the work that they're doing. So those little things matter when you're young and and trying to make it.
Speaker 2:See, thank you, that's helpful to me, that's great.
Speaker 1:Lori, tell me about the future of your firm. You know, as we're concluding here, and I appreciate your insight and opportunity when do you see the firm going in the future of your firm? You know, as we're concluding here, and I appreciate your insight and opportunity when do you see the firm going in the future? And?
Speaker 2:how do you expect to play a part in that? Well, our firm has been around for, I think, over 30 years, and so it's my hope that it will still be around long after I'm gone, like, gone, gone. So you know, clearly we need to at this point in our in our trajectory, we need to bring on some younger people and I think after this podcast we'll be getting lots of phone calls right and hopefully associates will be clear about this is really what I want, right, like it almost needs to be the associate interviewing the firm and saying you know, can you give me what I want? Because if we can, then it's going to be, you know, a longstanding, I think, relationship.
Speaker 1:It might be important, though, for you and the other partners to go through that exercise, to say, well, what can we offer Like what, what benefits and what culture do we want to communicate that we have here to attract you know?
Speaker 2:young associates. Well, we do, we do, and then associates come and work for us because apparently it's attractive. But you know, I don't know, I think the pandemic made it very hard to mentor because you know, you didn't know when you could call somebody, because you didn't know if they were in the middle of zoom court or whatever. So you know, it was very hard to mentor and develop relationships for three years.
Speaker 1:Right.
Speaker 2:Um. So now that we're on the other side of that, I really hope that, um, that we can bring in some some new talent, some younger talent, and make some new partners and just keep our firm going indefinitely. It's a legacy firm, I mean. I do think you know, I'll just say it. I think we're very well respected in our community, we have some really great talent, we offer some great services to our clients and we work well with other attorneys in our community, and so I would like to see our firm just kind of keep going indefinitely.
Speaker 1:I love it. Well, if you're a young, young attorney and looking for a great firm to join, you know Lori's here. How can they get in touch with you, lori?
Speaker 2:Well, if they go to there's a, the state bar has a tab called rely a guide. I don't know if you guys ever got rely a guide in Illinois or Wisconsin. There's about six or seven States that use it. Um, but if they go to the state bar Michigan website, there's an attorney search button right on the homepage. They can plug my name in it's Butte-like suit B-U-I-T. They start with that. It should pop up, hopefully. E-w-e-g Butteweg.
Speaker 1:I love it.
Speaker 2:Make sure not to get my husband, because he's also a lawyer with the same last name.
Speaker 1:Same firm or different firm?
Speaker 2:My son is a lawyer too, but he's in Texas, he's not barred in Michigan.
Speaker 1:Oh, family of attorneys, I love it.
Speaker 2:Three out of four. I also have a computer engineer.
Speaker 1:Very successful.
Speaker 2:He's the star of the family.
Speaker 1:Oh, lori, I'm so appreciative of your time, the opportunity to learn from you, and I would love to stay in touch and continue to build a relationship here, but we appreciate the opportunity to learn and share your insights with our audience.
Speaker 2:It's been great chatting with you, tyler. All right, all best wishes to you and your firm.
Speaker 1:Thank you so much, you too.
Speaker 2:OK, take care and go blue.
Speaker 1:If you enjoyed this episode, make sure to continue to check out our Law Firm Owner series. We try to release a few of these every single month, where we interview successful law firm owners. We hear their story and we learn from everything that they've learned as they've grown and built their firm. I really hope you enjoy it. Make sure to check out the next one right here.
